Guild Wars 2

Rama.6439:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Thanks for the feedback over night and this morning.

Please note i am going to be afk for most of the day but will catch up as frequently as possible.

What i will do is create a thread on the PVE, WvW and PvP forums asking for the community to name 1 area of the said area that they would like to discuss first and then we will start the discussions on Monday.

Overnight there have been a lot of questions as to why we are trying to reconnect. The answer is simple: I want us to get back to a better state of collaborative development as i feel this is in the best interests of everyone. Like i said in the thread we read all posts both positive and negative, we just want the forums to be a more constructive environment for everyone to post in.

Speak to you all soon,

Chris

Actually the negative posts get deleted and we get infractions for them, and eventually we get banned for them. NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ON THE FORUMS IS NOT ALOUD! I have been banned for it numerous times, moderators saying that negative postings is not aloud.

Hi Rama,

Sorry to hear you had posts deleted Rama. I will look into the said posts and try to provide more clarity to you. Note that feedback that is both positive and negative is absolutely admissible as long as it is constructive. If their is a moderation issue here then i will be really happy to get it fixed.

Chris

Thanks for the feedback over night and this morning.

Please note i am going to be afk for most of the day but will catch up as frequently as possible.

What i will do is create a thread on the PVE, WvW and PvP forums asking for the community to name 1 area of the said area that they would like to discuss first and then we will start the discussions on Monday.

Overnight there have been a lot of questions as to why we are trying to reconnect. The answer is simple: I want us to get back to a better state of collaborative development as i feel this is in the best interests of everyone. Like i said in the thread we read all posts both positive and negative, we just want the forums to be a more constructive environment for everyone to post in.

Speak to you all soon,

Chris

Makovorn.1706:

This is such a rare and wonderful opportunity, so I have to ask: Will there be a way for us to pass on suggestions and receive feedback on more quality-of-life type enhancements, specifically to do with i.e. UI improvements, mouse/keyboard input and ideas surrounding a fixes for things like the camera collision issues (the jumpyness), extra menu options for FoV and even vertical camera offset adjustments?

It would be really great to get some dialog going surrounding these things, since they really affect gameplay at the most basic level … and some of these unresolved issues are quite old now. It would really make my day getting some info about these things, and I’m sure others share my eagerness as well.

Also, thank you for being so proactive Chris. It’s really great to have this type of interaction with the people behind this great game. I hope it will continue.

Hi,

We will do everything we can to make this work (-: . It is very exciting. In answer to your question:

Following the deployment of the first three threads and discussion with the community about what worked and what didn’t, we can then look at rolling out more global threads such as Quality of Life.

Chris

Theftwind.8976:

Something strange, I no longer feel like a mushroom! That is all we can ask for Chris is open dialogue and the fact that we are being listened to. Thank you. Am I ever going to pick your brain on RNG!

Elric.6971:

So, can you give a hint about what the general intentions/plans/things to be looked at are for next year?

Maybe to get some early feedback? I mean I assume part of why this first year’s had so many rough patches has been because of the need to have this stuff all planned ahead before launch. But year two should mean things start to see light and get smoothed over, right?

This would be a question for Colin.

That said though, the thread is about Collaborative Development (-:

Chris

Chessrook.8643:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Zacchary.6183:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Zacchary.6183:

Are there going to be devs for each profession that frequently visit the profession forums so that those players may collaborate with them to hopefully make their professions more enjoyable?

Please….?

Absolutely .I hope we can role this initiative out to all the separate forums and perhaps even create new forums with the intention being that specialist devs in each area will be attached to a particular forum on an ongoing basis (-:

The initial plan is essentially a test to see how the process works, which we will evolve based on discussion with each other.

Hope that makes sense? I am in between meetings and running around (-:

I love the pic by the way. Dogs Rock!

Chris

W00!!!!

I dance like this in rl!!!

Ah, so you play a Norn, do you? That explains so much…

I do play a Norn.

Chris

Gibson.4036:

Hello, again, Chris. Thanks for continuing to visit the thread. I’m excited to see where this goes.

I posted a request last night that may have got missed, but very much fits this topic of collaborative development involving the players. I’ve seen many requests for a public test server on the forums over the last year, but I’ve never run across you or another ArenaNet staff member explaining the choice not to have one.

I’m not advocating adding one, but I’d really like to hear the thought process behind choosing not to have one. I know you have an internal testing team. I assume every MMORPG has one, and yet many choose to also have a public test server to get broader player feedback and bug hunting. What are the reasons behind choosing not to have one for Guild Wars 2?

EDIT: As for closing this thread, I think there is more room to discuss player/developer communication. There’s no reason future posts here have to “look back” any more than the large number of forward looking posts that have already been written.

I did read your post. Sorry for not replying. I think PTR should definitely be a topic we discuss. It is something that has had a lot of discussion at work.

I don’t want to derail the thread by jumping into a specific area just yet as that would be unfair to everyone else who also have their priority areas that they want to discuss moving forward.

I hope that makes sense?

Chris

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Good Morning Chris,

It may be worth creating a separate thread (for each game mode) for people simply to list (no discussion) what they think are the issues atm or the aspects of the game they would appreciate develper feedback on. This one is all over the place.

I think that’s a good idea. Should we close this thread? And then i will create a new one in each forum area asking for folks to list the area they would most like to discuss?

I can then open a new thread about Polls on Monday on the main forum?

Chris

There’s no harm in leaving this open through right? The thread is meant to be about open communication, which went a little off topic, but still serves a purpose.

Good point Asuka. I am sold!

We will leave this open and tomorrow (if i have time, otherwise over the weekend) i will create the 3 threads asking for input on topics to discuss.

Sound good?

Chris

P.S: I am likely to be in game tonight so please forgive me if i don’t post (to much).

Neural.1824:

Chris, I’ll state this under a flag of truce, as I’m considered a troll by many.
I do not feel the need to explain my emotions/outbursts/commentary, because I am not going to research all my own posts and write a book on why I feel as I do. I think overall it should be obvious to most that I am primarily unhappy about two things. Primarily the monetization of the game, secondly, the crafting process (from gathering to finished product).

For now though, I will set aside my opinions of the Arenanet staff, and take your words at face value, giving you the benefit of the doubt.

If you asked me what I want out of GW2, and if you gave me just one thing to choose out of the many I could come up with. What one thing would I change?

I’d like to play GW2 and not feel like I was in a rat maze where every dead end was the gem store.
I want to log in and play the game, and not feel like I’m constantly under the shadow of ulterior motives to drive me to spend RL money. I’ve spent plenty of money on vanity items and perma-gathering tools, etc. But (I can hear them now, Vayne and everyone are going “oh god, here he goes again”), when I step out of Lion’s Arch to focus on crafting something, I want to move towards it with confidence. Confidence that I can gather those materials I need, that I can seek out their sources and if necessary farm those sources until I have what I need. I don’t want to feel like getting 250 Armored Scales is impossible compared to farming gold to buy them. In the long run, that is what I wound up doing. I farmed scarlet invasions and before that the Crown Pavillion until I had 300gold with which I simply bought the remaining T6 mats that I needed for my legendary gifts, simply because it is unrealistic to play casually and gather 250 of each material the traditional way. I’d like to gather the materials without feeling like I’m taxed 15% to do so. I’d like to adventure my way to a legendary. Not buy my way. Not gamble my way. I’m probably the only person on Yak’s Bend that thinks Ascended Weapons crafting is the best thing to happen to crafting ever in this game. You can gather materials reliably, without Diminishing Returns limiting you. If I want to take my characters and run through all the zones in the game 8 times to gather all the soft wood logs that I can get, I can do that.
The time gating is perfect, because it regulates the overal time it takes to get a weapon, but it’s set. There is no mystical number attached to it that says I can’t make them at normal pace because I’ve made to many recently. I can sit down, open an excell spreadsheet, plug in numbers, and know exactly what I have to do and how long it will take. It’s a set path, and unlike Legendaries, there is very little gimmicky RNG stuff involved with it. I’m not even to 500 yet on my first profession (because T6 mats are hard to get, thus I am not crafting exotics very fast), but I feel like I am progressing as I see the Empyrial stars piling up, and the Bloodstone Bricks, and so on.
With Legendary crafting, it took me several months to get a couple of the main components, and I really really enjoyed it, because the parts I was working on involved world completion, and other aspects of the game that I’d not tried. I still don’t like PvP and WvW, but I did it. that Gift of Battle is a major milestone for me.
But then I got to the Gift of Fortune. Suddenly I found my locations limited for options, most of them chained by diminishing returns. I saw my normal playstyle bringing in approximately two T6 material items per hour, sometimes 4 if I was lucky. For a casual player such as myself, finishing my legendary suddenly stretched out to a years worth of time if I didn’t start farming specifically for gold to buy materials.
Which brings us back to gold. So much of the game seems focused on getting players to obtain gold one way or another, with the gem-store looming in the background like a steroids dealer in the shadows beckoning to the dejected athlete that just wants to finish a race.

I know this rambles, and may not get read, but it is here. If I whittle all my wishes down to just one thing, I want to feel like the gem-store is a place I go to because I want to look better or buy neat things. Not like it’s hiding around every corner trying to convince me that if I just take a pill, my life will be better.

Hi Neural,

This is definitely an area we should discuss as one of the topics, specifically the perception around goal completion in regard to the gem store. This is certainly an area of the game that i think about a lot.

I am looking forward to collaborating with you moving forward and thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Chris

Zacchary.6183:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Zacchary.6183:

Are there going to be devs for each profession that frequently visit the profession forums so that those players may collaborate with them to hopefully make their professions more enjoyable?

Please….?

Absolutely .I hope we can role this initiative out to all the separate forums and perhaps even create new forums with the intention being that specialist devs in each area will be attached to a particular forum on an ongoing basis (-:

The initial plan is essentially a test to see how the process works, which we will evolve based on discussion with each other.

Hope that makes sense? I am in between meetings and running around (-:

I love the pic by the way. Dogs Rock!

Chris

W00!!!!

I dance like this in rl!!!

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Good Morning Chris,

It may be worth creating a separate thread (for each game mode) for people simply to list (no discussion) what they think are the issues atm or the aspects of the game they would appreciate develper feedback on. This one is all over the place.

I think that’s a good idea. Should we close this thread? And then i will create a new one in each forum area asking for folks to list the area they would most like to discuss?

I can then open a new thread about Polls on Monday on the main forum?

Chris

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Zacchary.6183:

Are there going to be devs for each profession that frequently visit the profession forums so that those players may collaborate with them to hopefully make their professions more enjoyable?

Please….?

Absolutely .I hope we can role this initiative out to all the separate forums and perhaps even create new forums with the intention being that specialist devs in each area will be attached to a particular forum on an ongoing basis (-:

Funny thing is… I thought this was the case already. I actually feel weird every time I post something in the suggestions forum without having any reply from a developer in months(?) (the "latest one here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Game-Improvement-Suggestions/page/33). Is it because no one of the devs feel responsible for the suggestions forum? It would be nice to see replies from anyone responsible to get the direction you want to go with certain issues.

I appreciate this new discussion approach.

We absolutely do read the forums and it is the respective specialists in the fields that will be collaborating with you all once we are happy with the process.

Chris

Zacchary.6183:

Are there going to be devs for each profession that frequently visit the profession forums so that those players may collaborate with them to hopefully make their professions more enjoyable?

Please….?

Absolutely .I hope we can role this initiative out to all the separate forums and perhaps even create new forums with the intention being that specialist devs in each area will be attached to a particular forum on an ongoing basis (-:

The initial plan is essentially a test to see how the process works, which we will evolve based on discussion with each other.

Hope that makes sense? I am in between meetings and running around (-:

I love the pic by the way. Dogs Rock!

Chris

minbariguy.7504:

StarbornStriker.6493:

[SNIP]
I understand that you want to create a living breathing world. What writer, what creator, doesn’t? BUT, you’re trying to create that world within a game, which people have to schedule time for around their real lives (not the opposite way). I hate to say it, but I feel punished for having to make a major life-changing move because there’s no way for me to catch up on the story I missed.

I agree with you so much it hurts, StarbornStriker. Which leads me to my main point, which is — since we are discussing the prioritizing of topics — that the pace, story, quality, temporary nature, and even the underlying philosophy of Living Story needs to be openly discussed, with responses by the dev team. I really feel that they are completely out of touch with how many of us feel about it and I really need them to listen and respond to our concerns.

This is absolutely my top priority, since it is the thing that is keeping me from logging in to the game.

After that, I think our sole focus should be discussing ways to add more types of currencies into the game, because there are simply not enough of them.

I kid, I kid!!! ;-)

Currencies is definitely an area we could refine (-:

Chris

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

So what i am asking you guys and gals to think about is how do you want to go about choosing the list for WvW, PVE, and PVP

So the first topics from this list will be on, on Monday? I guess an ingame poll is out of question then. Maybe a reddit thread would be a wise choice, people can explain and argue what is on their mind and you’ll see quite easily what’s on the top 5.

A poll is absolutely not out of the question. I just think it is something we should discuss more and something i am going to discuss with the team.

Tomorrow I am meeting with the team to go over the plan for the Topic threads in WvW, PvP and PVE which i will follow up with everyone about after the meeting.

Meanwhile we are still discussing how to prioritise the topics of the 3 threads here.

Chris

Chris Whiteside.6102:

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

I believe this response demonstrates – at a very fundamental level – where some of the issues lie.

Without knowing you personally, Mr. Whiteside, and only having your forum response to judge by, the reply above exemplifies a very rigid thought process. This may be completely opposite of the truth, but I can only go by what’s available to me.

What I mean by “rigid” is there’s an immediate assumption an in-game poll would break immersion with no attempt made to see any other alternative. Why would this be the case? Could a poll not be crafted in such a way that it could be made optional and/or non-immersion breaking? Perhaps a small button is added just below where we’re informed about the success or failure of an event in PvE or on the dungeon completion screen or any one of a number of other, unobtrusive places for the various game modes. It’s then up to the individual player to click the button if they wish to participate in the poll/feedback tool. Can the players not be trusted to decide for themselves what is and what isn’t immersion breaking?

The issue of an in-game poll aside, I want to use this as a launching point to discuss my real concern. I had considered different analogies such as sandboxes, over-protective parents, etc. I’ve settled on Legos. Yes, Legos; those multi-colored, plastic building blocks that come in all shapes and sizes.

Why are Legos one of the most wildly successful toy lines ever created? Because they are not a toy. Rather, they are the infrastructure that permit children to build their own toys. Legos facilitate and support a child’s creativity rather than dictate to that child what they can create (at least the older generation of Legos did; let’s leave aside for the moment all the themed, market-driven, movie-tie-in, rigid sets that have come out in recent years).

Granted, there are some restrictions on what you can make with Legos; rectilinear blocks can only be built into so many configurations. Regardless, they succeed where other toys fail. A child plays with a traditional toy and becomes bored with it in pretty short order. With Legos, however, the possibilities are endless. You’re bored with what you recently built? Tear it apart and build something new! When the emphasis is on the child’s creativity rather than on the physical toy itself, the only limit is the child’s imagination.

It’s the process of building that’s fun more so than the finished product. Oh, sure, the finished construct is admired and played with for awhile. It won’t be long, though, before it’s torn apart in order to build something new. It’s all about the act of creation; not the individual Lego pieces.

Now to GW2. If ArenaNet wants to maintain rigid control over their game, keeping it a static theme park with inflexible rules, that’s their perogative. However, if ArenaNet is sincere in their desire to build a collaborative development relationship with their community and a flexible, organic, changing, living world, then they will have to consider relaxing some of the rigid thought processes which appear to drive development decisions.

I’m not suggesting GW2 be turned into a sandbox game and only a sandbox game. However, there’s much that could be done to improve upon this far-from-Living-World. A concrete example is housing; giving players the option for that Lego-like creative outlet. That’s a very superficial example, though, and only scratches the surface to which I’m referring.

At the most fundamental level, it comes down to the actual philosophy of game design. Is this a game which will facilitate and support players’ desire for fun and creativity or will this be a game of very rigid rules, proscribed behavior, and set paths dictated by the developer? Yes, there must be some rules. But are the rules there for the benefit of the players or the need on the part of ArenaNet to maintain control?

Does ArenaNet want GW2 to be the injection-molded plastic toy that’s shiny while in its package but discarded and left to gather dust under the bed after a few months? Or do they want it to be the Legos that are infinitely built, broken down, and rebuilt into something new for years to come, driven by the community’s creativity and passion for the game? Have a little faith in your player base, ease up on the control a bit, give us the tools, be supportive of our efforts, and watch as your community puts the “Living” into your “Living World”.[/quote]

And hence it being a question to provoke creative brainstorming. We don’t believe in any problem being unsolvable.

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Thanks for your feedback,

Chris[/quote]

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris
[/quote]

I believe this response demonstrates – at a very fundamental level – where some of the issues lie.

Without knowing you personally, Mr. Whiteside, and only having your forum response to judge by, the reply above exemplifies a very rigid thought process. This may be completely opposite of the truth, but I can only go by what’s available to me.

What I mean by “rigid” is there’s an immediate assumption an in-game poll would break immersion with no attempt made to see any other alternative. Why would this be the case? Could a poll not be crafted in such a way that it could be made optional and/or non-immersion breaking? Perhaps a small button is added just below where we’re informed about the success or failure of an event in PvE or on the dungeon completion screen or any one of a number of other, unobtrusive places for the various game modes. It’s then up to the individual player to click the button if they wish to participate in the poll/feedback tool. Can the players not be trusted to decide for themselves what is and what isn’t immersion breaking?

The issue of an in-game poll aside, I want to use this as a launching point to discuss my real concern. I had considered different analogies such as sandboxes, over-protective parents, etc. I’ve settled on Legos. Yes, Legos; those multi-colored, plastic building blocks that come in all shapes and sizes.

Why are Legos one of the most wildly successful toy lines ever created? Because they are not a toy. Rather, they are the infrastructure that permit children to build their own toys. Legos facilitate and support a child’s creativity rather than dictate to that child what they can create (at least the older generation of Legos did; let’s leave aside for the moment all the themed, market-driven, movie-tie-in, rigid sets that have come out in recent years).

Granted, there are some restrictions on what you can make with Legos; rectilinear blocks can only be built into so many configurations. Regardless, they succeed where other toys fail. A child plays with a traditional toy and becomes bored with it in pretty short order. With Legos, however, the possibilities are endless. You’re bored with what you recently built? Tear it apart and build something new! When the emphasis is on the child’s creativity rather than on the physical toy itself, the only limit is the child’s imagination.

It’s the process of building that’s fun more so than the finished product. Oh, sure, the finished construct is admired and played with for awhile. It won’t be long, though, before it’s torn apart in order to build something new. It’s all about the act of creation; not the individual Lego pieces.

Now to GW2. If ArenaNet wants to maintain rigid control over their game, keeping it a static theme park with inflexible rules, that’s their perogative. However, if ArenaNet is sincere in their desire to build a collaborative development relationship with their community and a flexible, organic, changing, living world, then they will have to consider relaxing some of the rigid thought processes which appear to drive development decisions.

I’m not suggesting GW2 be turned into a sandbox game and only a sandbox game. However, there’s much that could be done to improve upon this far-from-Living-World. A concrete example is housing; giving players the option for that Lego-like creative outlet. That’s a very superficial example, though, and only scratches the surface to which I’m referring.

At the most fundamental level, it comes down to the actual philosophy of game design. Is this a game which will facilitate and support players’ desire for fun and creativity or will this be a game of very rigid rules, proscribed behavior, and set paths dictated by the developer? Yes, there must be some rules. But are the rules there for the benefit of the players or the need on the part of ArenaNet to maintain control?

Does ArenaNet want GW2 to be the injection-molded plastic toy that’s shiny while in its package but discarded and left to gather dust under the bed after a few months? Or do they want it to be the Legos that are infinitely built, broken down, and rebuilt into something new for years to come, driven by the community’s creativity and passion for the game? Have a little faith in your player base, ease up on the control a bit, give us the tools, be supportive of our efforts, and watch as your community puts the “Living” into your “Living World”.[/quote]

And hence it being a question to provoke creative brainstorming. We don’t believe in any problem being unsolvable.

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Thanks for you feedback,

Chris

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Taking a few ideas mentioned here, and some of my own, I have mocked up an idea of how in-game surveys could work.

1. Login Screen

(See first and second image below)

- When players log in for the first time after the survey goes live, they are presented with a prompt that asks them to choose whether they would like to participate in the survey or not.

- If players choose not to participate, they are shown a prompt that explains that they can turn on the survey in settings.

2. In-game survey

(See last two images)

- Once a player has opted into the online survey a new icon shows up on the menu bar.

- When a player completes an event that has a survey attached to it, they will be prompted with an alert icon (similar to when new mail comes), so they can see they have a new survey to fill out.

This could also be accompanied by a carrier pigeon, or some other animal.

- When players have time, they can open the survey panel and fill out the surveys they’re interested in (or skip the ones they’re not).

- Surveys are only displayed once, and once they’ve been submitted they disappear from the list, unless they’re updated and require a new survey (Eg. Tequatl)

*See images below for more

Wow Murphy thanks for taking the time to mock those up, they really explain your design and are definitely something i will discuss with the team.

Thank you,

Chris

Valanga.5942:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

2: Chris to write the rules of engagement (-: Just laying out what we can and can’t talk about.

Why i got the feeling that this will end in a boatload of “we are working on it”, “we want to do that” and “nothing is off the table”?

That’s the spirit!

Chris

Anthony.7219:

Chris, can someone explain (and maybe sticky) the intent behind these living story updates that have content disappearing so rapidly? When is the next content update like Nov 2012 happening that introduces a new area, map, dungeon, etc.? I hope some of this content is being re-used (it seems to be 99% festivals so I don’t see why it couldn’t be tweaked and re-used annually, in which case a timeline could be posted in advance!)

Sorry, not really the spot, but I’m just trying to get back into the game (haven’t had much time lately due to a new baby) and this has been frustrating me today.

Thanks,

Non/Persistent Content is absolutely a topic we can discuss.

Chris

skullmount.1758:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Absolutely! The rules will be published at the top of each thread and are open to discussion and explanation. But please don’t be understanding with me if i don’t budge on some of them.

Chris

Thanks for the reply.
Are you telling us to get angry with you with that last sentence?

;)

.

DoctorOverlord.8620:

I just came across this post and I find this an interesting direction for ArenaNet to be taking. I hope they can find a way to work out this approach to communicating with the community. I’ve always been struck by the balance game developers need to manage between listening to the often contradictory community and presenting the game design envisioned by the company.

On the subject of prioritizing topics polls seem like a good way to determine which topics shoudl get the highest priority as well as finding the real topics of interest of the GW2 community rather than just the ones that occupy the attention of forum-posters.

Chris Whiteside.6102:

\
So to start with what i am suggesting we do is that we have a list of topics for each category, so for example:

PVE
1:Ascended Gear
2:Raiding
3: RNG
4: Roleplaying

For global issues such as bugs, balance etc we can open up more threads but lets just start with 3. Note my list above is just an example. So what i am asking you guys and gals to think about is how do you want to go about choosing the list for WvW, PVE, and PVP

Chris

Would a topic on the UI need a place? I was thinking about subjects like build-loading or ability bar schemes that might be of interest.

Good point. We could discuss global topics such as bugs and UI on separate threads once we get our collaborative process down after we have tried 1 round of PVE, WvW and PVP threads?

Chris

Chris Whiteside.6102:

skullmount.1758:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Hi All,

Sorry for not getting back sooner, i have been rather busy this morning. Also thanks for continuing the brainstorm, so really good ideas.

So here are the current actions:

1: Chris to chat with the team about creating 3 threads in each main part of the forums. We should be able to start this of on Monday.
2: Chris to write the rules of engagement (-: Just laying out what we can and can’t talk about.
3: Peeps on this thread to continue to discuss the best way to prioritize the topics for each main area that will run for 2 days each cycle and then rotate.
4: Polls: I am going to raise this as a separate thread early next week to continue discussion as it is a complex topic.

I will try to respond as much as i can today and will update on my actions later today or tomorrow. Meanwhile let’s discuss how best to prioritize topics?

Chris

For #2, are we going to see some of those rules? That way we can try to avoid somethings that won’t/can’t be answered?

Absolutely! The rules will be published at the top of each thread and are open to discussion and explanation. But please DO be understanding with me if i don’t budge on some of them.

Chris

Oops edit above to save myself from lack of understanding (-: !

Chris

Atlas.9704:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

I will try to respond as much as i can today and will update on my actions later today or tomorrow. Meanwhile let’s discuss how best to prioritize topics?

Topics should be broken down into levels of importance based on how they affect the game and the enjoyment of such game.

-Topics dealing with stuff that literally breaks the game should be top priority. Connection/Disconnects/Server discussions/constant bugs that haven’t been tackled yet.

-Topics dealing with the direction of the game such as Living Story and such. After all if the game is stable, the next question for some would be “where are we going?” in the near future.

-Topics dealing with current gameplay situations should be afterwards. Zerk versus everyone else, why no Carrion or Valk items for whatever situations the more knowledgeable forumites can illuminate. That sort of thing, because once the game is stable and we know a rough map of where to go we need to know how the vehicle is handling now.

-From there I’d suggest topics based on the far future. Hopes and dreams you (ANet) have but can’t necessarily confirm yet. Hopes that you have dealing with us the players. This group is separated from the Living Story and near future stuff because its all theory.

That’s how I would hope the priority would go.

So to start with what i am suggesting we do is that we have a list of topics for each category, so for example:

PVE
1:Ascended Gear
2:Raiding
3: RNG
4: Roleplaying

For global issues such as bugs, balance etc we can open up more threads but lets just start with 3. Note my list above is just an example. So what i am asking you guys and gals to think about is how do you want to go about choosing the list for WvW, PVE, and PVP

Chris

skullmount.1758:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Hi All,

Sorry for not getting back sooner, i have been rather busy this morning. Also thanks for continuing the brainstorm, so really good ideas.

So here are the current actions:

1: Chris to chat with the team about creating 3 threads in each main part of the forums. We should be able to start this of on Monday.
2: Chris to write the rules of engagement (-: Just laying out what we can and can’t talk about.
3: Peeps on this thread to continue to discuss the best way to prioritize the topics for each main area that will run for 2 days each cycle and then rotate.
4: Polls: I am going to raise this as a separate thread early next week to continue discussion as it is a complex topic.

I will try to respond as much as i can today and will update on my actions later today or tomorrow. Meanwhile let’s discuss how best to prioritize topics?

Chris

For #2, are we going to see some of those rules? That way we can try to avoid somethings that won’t/can’t be answered?

Absolutely! The rules will be published at the top of each thread and are open to discussion and explanation. But please don’t be understanding with me if i don’t budge on some of them.

Chris

Hi All,

Sorry for not getting back sooner, i have been rather busy this morning. Also thanks for continuing the brainstorm, so really good ideas.

So here are the current actions:

1: Chris to chat with the team about creating 3 threads in each main part of the forums. We should be able to start this of on Monday.
2: Chris to write the rules of engagement (-: Just laying out what we can and can’t talk about.
3: Peeps on this thread to continue to discuss the best way to prioritize the topics for each main area that will run for 2 days each cycle and then rotate.
4: Polls: I am going to raise this as a separate thread early next week to continue discussion as it is a complex topic.

I will try to respond as much as i can today and will update on my actions later today or tomorrow. Meanwhile let’s discuss how best to prioritize topics?

Chris

Enikuo.9205:

I’m shocked, but impressed and glad to come back and see all the responses from you Chris.

I think in-game polls could be good, but I think they would need more sophisticated choices than what you had in beta. I seem to remember answering how much I liked an event on a scale of 1-5, or something to that effect, which isn’t going to give you the depth of feedback that I think you need in most cases. I also don’t think they can replace actual interaction.

It’s really important for you to understand why players do or don’t like something. Plus, I think it’s important for us to be able to tell you “why” and feel that we’ve been heard. Your idea to have focused threads in appropriate forums is great. It bothers me when you (dev) start a feedback thread, only to lock or delete it without giving substantive feedback. You get pages and pages of responses and then, poof, it’s gone. Any response that shows you’re engaged, like asking questions or sharing your thought process is so much better. So, I’m really glad to see that you’re on board with more back-and-forth conversations.

Also, when you started “shooting from the hip,” I began to feel a lot better about what you have to say. The carefully-worded market-ese just sets off alarms. And, maybe it’s just me, but it seems that the cross-talk between players calmed down a lot when you started responding, which I think is really good. Your very presence seems to help the tone of the forums.

If you’re looking for suggestions for what to talk about, I’d like to see vertical/horizontal progression covered. The reason that I’m interested in that topic is because I liked playing alternate characters and the changes around progression really impacted that play style for me. I’ll explain more if that ever gets covered, but regardless of what happens, I’m looking forward to this new initiative and am hopeful it will work out. So, thanks!

Thanks to you all! Like i was saying it is a really enjoyable conversation and I hope it works out to.

And i am sure we will discuss horizontal/vertical progression (-:

Catch you all tomorrow.

Chris

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Go home Chris or you’ll be here all night… we’re a demanding bunch remember.

Just got home. If it’s ok with everyone i am going to relax a bit with the family and get back to chatting tomorrow morning?

Meanwhile this is what i think the current status of the discussion is:

1: Yes to a forum on each of our core pages (WvW, PVE and PvP). One topic at a time. Each topic stays up for two days and then cycles and rotates? Ordering of priority of topics to be discussed.
2: Polls are generally a good idea. Discussion to continue about how they would work?

Thanks for conversation i am really enjoying it. See you tomorrow,

Chris

Erick Alastor.3917:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

Simple enough, let the pigeons do the dirty work.
You can advertise a new function via an e-mail and dedicate it a separate section.
The new icon may change color once a new survey is available.
No one will be forced to respond, and invasiveness will be minimal.

The iconography is cool to!

Seriously afk now

Erick Alastor.3917:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

Simple enough, let the pigeons do the dirty work.
You can advertise a new function via an e-mail and dedicate it a separate section.
The new icon may change color once a new survey is available.
No one will be forced to respond, and invasiveness will be minimal.

Personally i really like this idea.

Chris

Right AFK short….

Right i am going to drive home. I will be back on the thread in a bit,and then i am going in game.

Please remember that in no way am i going to have time to post as much as i have today moving forward, but i hope we can set up these two systems to allow for the collaboration we all want. And then we can put them into practise.

Brb

Chris

Chris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

2996kittenris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

But what constitutes as “Immersion”?

…you guys had said you didn’t want to do things like fight with town clothes because it “broke immersion”, but, like…can we say that the LFG tool breaks immersion? Not too sure we can if you were keen to add it

Good point. So for me immersion breaking would be a pop up appearing after an event completes or following beating a dungeon. But you raise an interesting point with LFG. Perhaps (and i am just brainstorming here) it could be a tab that you can open up to give feedback.

I will think about it some more. Keep the ideas coming.

Chris

Pssst!!! You might want to tell some of the devs to stop breaking immersion. Every time we get a daily chest, kill a dragon/major boss once a day, finish a dungeon….

Also! before i forget. Thanks…for just being here…now…doing this. Really. It helps a ton.

No worries thanks for being so collaborative with the discussion.By the way i have to disagree though. I personally feel that a poll is less immersive then the bouncy chest. Mainly because the chest is still in the theme of the game world and more connected to the gamestate. Where as the Poll is more abstract in terms of goal and gamestate.

This said we are having a discussion and i am just giving my opinion.

Chris

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.
(Specifically, I’m Talking more about this)

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Long post.

Hi Asuka,

So how about 1 topic at a time in each forum with a dev or devs on each? Over a series of say 3 days then we move on and repeat?

By the way i am starting to run out of steam a bit and need to drive home soon. When i get home i will carry on discussing with everyone but at some point i NEED to get in game and have me some WvW action!

Chris

Hi Chris,

Pretty much – the problem with threads like this is you get 1000 different issues raised, and what was discussed on page 2 may not exist on page 10, so it easily to a different topic. Having a different thread, for each ‘major’ issue, would help to sort things out.

It may seem like a lot more work for you guys, but may give a better appraisal of the communities stance, and there are some things which really need to be looked into – like the bloodlust buff in wvw or condi cap in pve. Also the morale on the forums would really go up. Even if it is just one topic a week, maybe split (so one pve topic, one pvp topic, one wvw topic etc).

Also, nice job on this thread and the real effort to improve communication. With the number of points which always seemed ignored and how long it has taken for a balence patch I was starting to loose faith, but between the communication surge recently and being able to discuss WVW tactics with a developer in game, it has been a great change. Keep it up!

Thanks Asuka i really appreciate YOUR communication to. How about this then:

1 thread at a time in each main forum that runs for a few days. Then we move onto the next topic and rinse and repeat?

Not perfect but hey it’s a start! (-:

Chris

<3

Try it out and see how it goes! Then you can have a poll to determine if your way of polling the community is working (yo dawg, getting meta here :P). I think you’ll be surprised how much effort people will put into explaining problems and solutions instead of complaining, if they are given a real chance to do so.

Agreed and Lol regarding ‘Poll in a Poll’

Chris

Reesha.7901:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

1 thread at a time in each main forum that runs for a few days. Then we move onto the next topic and rinse and repeat?

Not perfect but hey it’s a start! (-:

Chris

I personally think this would be a good start, but I am curious on how you would decide on the topics?
(Maybe we should make a poll regarding that lol).

That’s the next question we have to resolve is folks like the basic idea.

Chris

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

2996kittenris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

But what constitutes as “Immersion”?

…you guys had said you didn’t want to do things like fight with town clothes because it “broke immersion”, but, like…can we say that the LFG tool breaks immersion? Not too sure we can if you were keen to add it

Good point. So for me immersion breaking would be a pop up appearing after an event completes or following beating a dungeon. But you raise an interesting point with LFG. Perhaps (and i am just brainstorming here) it could be a tab that you can open up to give feedback.

I will think about it some more. Keep the ideas coming.

Chris

Pssst!!! You might want to tell some of the devs to stop breaking immersion. Every time we get a daily chest, kill a dragon/major boss once a day, finish a dungeon….

Also! before i forget. Thanks…for just being here…now…doing this. Really. It helps a ton.

No worries thanks for being so collaborative with the discussion.By the way i have to disagree though. I personally feel that a poll is less immersive then the bouncy chest. Mainly because the chest is still in the theme of the game world and more connected to the gamestate. Where as the Poll is more abstract in terms of goal and gamestate.

This said we are having a discussion and i am just giving my opinion.

Chris

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.
(Specifically, I’m Talking more about this)

Reesha.7901:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

I think feedback can be commented on, without giving the whole game away. I think questions can be asked and answered without giving the game away to. The problem is it just isn’t good for us to talk about specific work in progress before we are confident about it. So i suggest we ask questions and feedback on any areas of the game but don’t go into specifics regarding development of said items?

This is something we should discuss more in this thread.

Chris

I think sometimes the most important thing is being heard.
I don’t expect you to go into specifics, but I think it is important to know that the feeback provided at least is being considered.
If you made a topic asking for feedback regarding.. well what ever topic really, and as an example simply asked people something along the lines of:

“What would in your opinion be the biggest quality of life improvement on xxxx (ability/encounter/mechanic) and why?”

I am pretty sure you would get a lot of interesting suggestions, and if you replied as you do here in this topic (which is not game revealing either) I think you would have entered a constructive dialog with the community.

Agreed.

Chris

Gibson.4036:

Hi, Chris!

This thread (specifically your recent replies) gives me renewed hope! It felt like before launch there was a good dialogue going between all of you and the players, but that it became more and more sparse the farther we got from launch.

The number one thing that first got me hooked on GW2, two years before the game went live, was the passion with which you all spoke about the game. It truly felt like a team of people working to make the game you want to play yourselves.

I’d like to echo a few things that have been said previously in this thread, but stand out as the most important to re-establishing that communication and excitement.

1. We need more statements of the vision for the game. You’ve seen the “manifesto” posts on these forums. Part of the player base feels that your original vision for the game that you expressed so passionately early on (not just in the manifesto video, but in other statements frequently quoted) no longer apply. Some people are unhappy about that. Some people defend it as evolution of the game. But no one seems to be able to point to anything significant post launch that either upholds those original vision statements or replaces them.

It seems like recent “here’s where the game is going” statements focus on lists of things you are working on or would like to implement in the future. Specific features, bug fixes, and the the like.

Possibly the movement to the “living world” concept works as one of those vision statements post-launch, but I think we need something more. This is the touch-stone by which we can come back to you with feedback. We can all argue over whether any given change in the game is good or bad, but that just comes down to personal preference. If there is a clear mission, vision and value statement, so to speak, we have something to hold changes up against so we can let you know whether the change is serving that vision or not.

2. More “why” along with the “what”. When you make changes, it helps a lot to know what though process went into it. Again, this will help us then give feedback that makes sense. If I don’t know why a certain change was made, all I can do is tell you if I liked the change or not. If I do have an idea why the change was made, I can give very specific feedback as to whether or not it’s have the intended effect, regardless of whether I personally like it.

Finally, before answering one of your specific questions below, I’m not sure a “what is your number one concern” thread would be terribly useful. Especially if there’s no way to restrict everyone to answering only once. You’re going to be inundated with everyone’s personal pet peeves, like many of the posts sprinkled throughout this thread.

Could I, instead, suggest you or others on your team simply comb back through the last few pages of each subforum? If you look for the posts with a large number of views, responses, or even (if possible) those that stayed on the first page for a significant amount of time, you’ll find the really issues people are most passionate about, and are probably in need of a developer response. It’d be fairly easy to create a punch-list of top forum community concerns to address.

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Yes, very much so. I tried to dutifully fill them out during the BWEs when they popped up, but I found them very disruptive.

Unless, maybe, they could pop up during loading screens, when play has been interrupted anway? Or perhaps just one that shows up upon opening the client?

The other problem with polls is that it’s really hard to create them without steering the replies. I often find myself thinking, “That’s not really the question they should be asking” in order to get meaningful feedback on how I felt about whatever aspect of the game.

Thanks again for this thread, and taking your time this evening to dig into it! Like many, I have been a passionate fan of this game for several years now (long before even setting foot in Tyria 2.0). Lately, I have been a bit snarky at times on the forums, and for that I apologize to you and the rest of your co-workers.

I appreciate your team’s passion and talent.

Hey Hey,

Colin popped in earlier i think and said there would be a bigger cadence of updates. In regard to 2 i think that is also key and will be a natural part of discussing aspects of the game i think.

Thanks for taking the time to post and putting forward your suggestions.

Chris

brick.2708:

On the topic of breaking immersion. I’m someone who really values it, and constantly talk about it, even did several videos about the immersion in GW2. That said, having a pop up wouldn’t break the immersion anymore then the already constant pop ups on the side that show the living story, daily progress, zone events, etc.

You can have immersion if the UI blends in well in the world. That said, it’s getting close to 2:19 am here and I got work in the morning. I’d love to discuss this again at a later date. :P

NN

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

To me, it’s simple.

1. Create / reintroduce an in-game feedback system similar to the one created for beta.
2. At the bottoms have a space for buttons.
– if player inputs any data, change button to “submit”
– else, buttons show “skip” and “stop bugging me”
3. Until player chooses to opt out, the game will prompt users
4. Allow users to “opt-in” through setting menu

That said, I’m not sure we need this much micro data. I think it could be valuable to have a survey pop up at login, and ask a series of questions relating to the game in general. While it would be nice to have feedback for each battle, I don’t think it’s needed.

You just need to get some data to see if certain things are working or not.

EDIT: Someone mentioned above an NPC for surveys. I think this has a lot of merit. There are a bunch of clever, fun, not immersion breaking ways to integrate these into the world. If desired.

In the end, it think whatever method used it needs to be easy to find, use, and understand. The questions need to be fair, and honest.

Some good ideas there for sure!

Chris

Erick Alastor.3917:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

[…]
So back to the matter at hand. Through reading the posts i think it would be really useful for me to start a thread like ‘name one thing you would like to see improved in Guild Wars 2’ and then start riffing with you all on these subjects matters and try to make a more meaningful connection with you all that way by which we can define a process together for Collaborative Development?

I am also going to ask that we build out more time for team members to post and i will follow up with you all on that.

What do you think, does this sound like a good way to move forward?

Chris

In my opinion a really good way.

Cool! Looks like we are on the road to ‘Great Success’ (-:

Chris

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

But what constitutes as “Immersion”?

…you guys had said you didn’t want to do things like fight with town clothes because it “broke immersion”, but, like…can we say that the LFG tool breaks immersion? Not too sure we can if you were keen to add it

Good point. So for me immersion breaking would be a pop up appearing after an event completes or following beating a dungeon. But you raise an interesting point with LFG. Perhaps (and i am just brainstorming here) it could be a tab that you can open up to give feedback.

I will think about it some more. Keep the ideas coming.

Chris

- Seiging a T3 keep
- Just broke through outer
- Attacker stacks, fire fields, drops veils
- ‘Hi, how do you feel about guild wars 2 today?’ popup appears
- Guild stop fighting, keep lord takes a tea break while everyone fills in survey. Warriors clean their banners, guardians polish the golems.
- War resumes.

I can see that happening.

;)

.

Reesha.7901:

Uh I have a topic for you as well. It is called RNG

I don’t mind some sort of RNG element in a game. It makes you open chests etc. with some amount of anticipation.

However: I do think gw2 rely too much on the RNG factor.

Let’s take Tequatl as an example. We all know that organizing this event takes effort. We all know that once you are in the right main server or overflow, you cannot leave. You are stuck there for 1 hour +.

We all know we are rewarded differently for this. Some will get the mini pet, some will get ascended gear, I know of some that have successfully killed him more than 60 times by now and got nothing but greens.

Tequatl is obviously just one example. Another would be the mystic forge for precursors or precursors random drop chance, The Black lion claim tickets, the new weapons from Twilight Arbor. Actually, outside dungeon tokens, most seems to be RNG drop chance.

I think this is a problem. I think there should be some way to work towards something outside RNG.

Crafting precursors (which is my understanding are at high risk of not happening this year) would be a step in the right direction.

Another good idea, which someone suggested elsewhere, would be adding some sort of token for killing Tequatl so people that do not win the RNG lottery are still working towards something. Let’s say you could buy an ascended weapon once you had x amount of tokens. That would mean killing him x amount of times and you might get lucky with RNG, but if you don’t, then you are still working towards something. Tequatl does take a lot of time. Time people could have spent gathering mats for their ascended weapons or time they could have spent jumping on the champion farm train and earned the gold to buy the minipet or ascended materials of the TP.

I feel I lack something outside the RNG. I am not a lucky person. I do however play with someone that seems to be blessed by the RNG gods. Or in his words: “I have silly RNG luck, I have always had silly RNG luck in games”.

We do the same events, the same dungeons etc. I have more magic find than he does, I even play more hours a day than he does, but since the greatest rewards come from RNG…. Well, it doesn’t really matter how much I play or don’t play. It is not that I am jealous of him in that regard, we have played together for more that 5 years and we share a bank, materials, recipes etc. anyway, but I do think it shows the flaws in the RNG system.

I have played this game since February and yesterday I got my 6th exotic drop ever (which sells for the impressive amount of 1.20g) In the meantime, he got 20+. One, which sold for nearly 200g.

Thanks to my friend again I do have the Tequatl mini pet, I do have the abyss and celestial dye but outside gathering crafting materials I never have much to offer in return. The dyes I open aren’t the good ones, I am yet to get anything but greens and 2 cheap exotics from Tequatl. When it comes to who has contributed the most to our character progression, it is not even close to being a draw.

I think it adds to the problem that we now have ascended items. Those are not just cosmetic enhancements, those are actually +stats enhancements. Whether you gain those weapons through drops or through earning gold and buying the materials of the TP, it would help if your income to a higher extend was based on your effort. Outside chopping wood and mining materials, it is all about RNG. I would love to discuss how to possibly change that.

RNG would be a great topic to discuss!

Chris

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Long post.

Hi Asuka,

So how about 1 topic at a time in each forum with a dev or devs on each? Over a series of say 3 days then we move on and repeat?

By the way i am starting to run out of steam a bit and need to drive home soon. When i get home i will carry on discussing with everyone but at some point i NEED to get in game and have me some WvW action!

Chris

Hi Chris,

Pretty much – the problem with threads like this is you get 1000 different issues raised, and what was discussed on page 2 may not exist on page 10, so it easily to a different topic. Having a different thread, for each ‘major’ issue, would help to sort things out.

It may seem like a lot more work for you guys, but may give a better appraisal of the communities stance, and there are some things which really need to be looked into – like the bloodlust buff in wvw or condi cap in pve. Also the morale on the forums would really go up. Even if it is just one topic a week, maybe split (so one pve topic, one pvp topic, one wvw topic etc).

Also, nice job on this thread and the real effort to improve communication. With the number of points which always seemed ignored and how long it has taken for a balence patch I was starting to loose faith, but between the communication surge recently and being able to discuss WVW tactics with a developer in game, it has been a great change. Keep it up!

Thanks Asuka i really appreciate YOUR communication to. How about this then:

1 thread at a time in each main forum that runs for a few days. Then we move onto the next topic and rinse and repeat?

Not perfect but hey it’s a start! (-:

Chris

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

nethykins.7986:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

But what constitutes as “Immersion”?

…you guys had said you didn’t want to do things like fight with town clothes because it “broke immersion”, but, like…can we say that the LFG tool breaks immersion? Not too sure we can if you were keen to add it

Good point. So for me immersion breaking would be a pop up appearing after an event completes or following beating a dungeon. But you raise an interesting point with LFG. Perhaps (and i am just brainstorming here) it could be a tab that you can open up to give feedback.

I will think about it some more. Keep the ideas coming.

Chris

Pssst!!! You might want to tell some of the devs to stop breaking immersion. Every time we get a daily chest, kill a dragon/major boss once a day, finish a dungeon….

Also! before i forget. Thanks…for just being here…now…doing this. Really. It helps a ton.

No worries thanks for being so collaborative with the discussion.By the way i have to disagree though. I personally feel that a poll is less immersive then the bouncy chest. Mainly because the chest is still in the theme of the game world and more connected to the gamestate. Where as the Poll is more abstract in terms of goal and gamestate.

This said we are having a discussion and i am just giving my opinion.

Chris

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

I have a question for you.

Do you think it would affect it any more or less than?

- The constant bugs that remain and are introduced each month.
- The artificial time-gated content
- Living World stories that come and go without much change
- Living World remnants that never get removed, solved, or changed
- Purple player models, invisible enemies.
- Fuzzy animal hats
- Zerg farming
- etc

At this point, we can pretty much agree that the level of immersion in is game isn’t exactly super high. The Living World feels more like a scripted episode of “Full House” more than it does a dynamic, living, growing exciting, unpredictable world.

At this point, I would rather you provide an in-game feedback system and use it to effectively improve the game, than continue to “experiment” and hope it works. Neither of us has unlimited time, resources and patience. We meet to optimize all of those thing the best way we can, so we can get this game straitened out before it’s too late.

You’re asking for our patience, but honestly, you’re asking a lot. You’ve not done enough as a company to gain the trust an loyalty of many players to be asking for such things. I feel that you need to put your egos aside, and understand that in the short term, listening, and tpgathering feedback from the players you still have, will to only help solidify our relationship, but hopefully improve the game to the point where this isn’t an issue.

I am sorry you feel this way, personally i feel the team has worked really hard in an extremely challenging and important endeavour. I can also guarantee you that whilst the team is human and makes mistakes they certainly don’t have an inflated ego (-:

But i digress and disagree and look forward to getting back to the productive side of this forum discussion.

Chris

So by the way we have two main topics of conversation now:

1: Polls: Every seems to like them but where do they go?
2: Game Feedback Collaboration: How do we want to do this?

Chris

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Hi Chris,

I still attest this is an odd thread, maybe just the tone of the first post is confusing. Since you guys seem serious about it, I’ll make a constructive suggestion.

It’s definitely true that many issues have been resolved. An example is magic find – the previous implementation was generic and caused a lot of animosity; the newer iteration is well designed, a lot more open to the community and resolves the previous issues. There are a few things however, which are raised time and time again but there is little dev response on these. Even if you guys are working on solutions, how about just creating high level threads acknowledging the problem, what the community thinks about it and peoples ideas for solutions. Even if said ideas raised are not considered, having a place on the forums which shows the developers acknowledge the issue and are showing they want to resolve it, will solve so many conspiracy threads and help resolve so much of the negative feedback on these forums. Examples of higher level topics which are raised over and over again:

Ascended Gear
- Weapons based on crafting or unlikely RNG drops. No skill based achievement patterns.
- Trinkets based on repeating content multiple times which is not ideal for all players due to requirements of content, such as being in a large guild. No crafting or skill based individual content.
- No ascended backpieces or accessories in wvw (accessories have same cost as PVE, no badge cost)

WVW
- Accound bound ranks
- Server imbalance
- T1 > Tarnished Coast > T2 > coverage = main factor in deciding matchups
- Class balance focused around pvp where perma stealth and banner revving not a problem, yet is ignored in terms of wvw balance.
- Bloodlust buff creating unfair and artificial advantages
- Power creep in passive buffs (bloodlust, guard stacks, world health bonus etc)

PVP
- Lack of game modes
- Community dropping off
- Balance issues (Jonathan did a good job highlighting coming changes, but little is discussed to do with toning down over the top elements which are ruining the current meta)
- No rewards or incentive for high level play with current meta/lack of teams

Fractals:
- Fractal level being character bound instead of account bound
- Unable to salvage fractal weapons
- Lower general rewards than open world pve yet higher difficulity
- Artifical scaling in terms of mob health
- Best rewards (unique skins) being RNG based

General PVE
- Too much temporary content
- Bleed cap/generally bad to use condi builds for team play
- Imbalanced rewards/risk/effort. For example, fire ele vs shatterer
- Precursor system totally based on rng

Devon used to do a great job in posting in the WVW forums, usually once a week he would go through and address a number of points. I don’t blame him for stopping this with the animosity caused by Bloodlust, but it was an example and people respected him for it. It’s simply a case okittennowledging there may be a potential issue and putting it out there to see how people respond. Even just creating a single thread, for discussion, once a week, with a dev post every 2 days, would do SO MUCH to help some of the anger on these forums – which again does not come from all users, but is noticeable in pockets of users which then grows larger with more and more negative feedback cycles. Also splitting the suggestion forum into a pvp suggestion forum, wvw suggestion forum, general suggestion etc will make that less of a mess.

By the way, the balance devs have stated multiple times before they only read the sPVP forum section and do not read the class forums – yet a lot to do will balance will show in the class forums as the game isn’t just pvp. The only time we see posts in the class forum seems to be regarding bugs. A ‘State of the Mesmer’ etc thread once a month by a balance dev would be nice… you never know, we may teach them a thing or two about the class in the progress. There is only 8 classes, creating 8 threads explaining the current state of the class, what is too strong/needs work shouldn’t be too much work…

Hi Asuka,

So how about 1 topic at a time in each forum with a dev or devs on each? Over a series of say 3 days then we move on and repeat?

By the way i am starting to run out of steam a bit and need to drive home soon. When i get home i will carry on discussing with everyone but at some point i NEED to get in game and have me some WvW action!

Chris

ozma.3498:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Meanwhile i am hoping with this thread that we can discuss a good process for collaborating moving forward and then once we have that we can put it into action.

Perhaps having yourself (or another dev) opening a topic about a specific part of the game (GW2’s “end-game”, crafting, dungeons, WvW, sPvP, rewards in general, skills, character appearance, world bosses, living story achievements, etc.) and then everybody gives their two cents. I think this would work better than having a free-for-all, since we already have the Suggestions forum for that.

How about this idea then ^^

One topic at a time?

Chris

Xcom.1926:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Chris Whiteside has a team of writers/PR people and Marketeers talking through him!
This is not the case. i just happen to write this way. Everything i say comes from the heart and if it helps i can write in a less passionate manner. Note i am English and this may have some effect on the way i write (People in the studio tend to blame a lot of the mistakes i make on being English so you are all in good company there)

To me it is so much more refreshing to see you post something like this, than your original post. The first one was so PR this one is so much more human. Some other devs do that, and they can, their choice. But you don’t have to use PR on us, you already got us man!

But thanks for your comments, people do appreciate it. As I said earlier, secrecy breeds distrust and uncertainty (I don’t think you were being secretive but some perceived it as such).

I don’t think anyone expects developers to post on the forums a lot. We know how hard your job is in the MMO space, and I personally appreciate it a lot. But the communication needs to be more open. For example, it would have been better if you guys had communicated with us the stats of precursor crafting a little while ago, instead of us asking about it, and then getting the answer it might not come this year.

Another issue that we haven’t gotten any communication on for almost a year is condition damage:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/No-love-for-condition-builds/page/2

There are some examples that I have seen asked about for a year, with little to no updates/response.

Thanks Chris.

Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts. The initial post and other posts i have done have always come from the heart, i am very passionate and really believe in everything i say. I guess the difference between those posts and the ones i am doing now is that i would spend about 15 minutes working on them before posting, whereas on these i just post. To be honest i much prefer shooting from the hip and if this form of communication is acceptable then i am all for it.

Regarding verbiage like ‘Pioneering’ and ‘Building Worlds’ i really mean that. I am a huge cyberpunk fan and the ability to actually be in a space that is making many of that fiction become reality is just awesome. So please forgive me when i speak like that, because that’s why i do what i do and i love it (-:

Regarding Conditions i will get back to you on the thread if that’s ok?

Chris

Luiz Swordbreaker.6547:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

minbariguy.7504:

I want to echo the people who have recently been requesting in-game polls. Since currently there has been no real acknowledgement or response to player dissatisfaction with the pace of Living Story releases, I have chosen to simply not log in at all to avoid being counted as a “satisfied customer” in your concurrency metrics.

An in-game poll where I would have the chance to have my opinions actually be counted would be something worth logging in for.

I think this is an idea worth discussion for sure. But i have a question:

Would in game polls affect the immersion for the player?

Chris

Even if it does “break immersion” (which for me is total bs, but that’s not the point here). Would you:

a) Use early(ish) stages of the game, have a little immersion break, but use that to build a better game for years to come.

b) Be worried about the instant effects that a pool would have on those that feel it breaks their immersion, and waste valuable feedback that could make the game live up to its full potential, resulting in not-so-great experiences which could shorten the life of the game.

I don’t have the answer. I am enjoying reading and contributing to the discussion (-:

Chris