Guild Wars 2

Spamming high damage abilities to put out as much DPS as possible is pretty much exactly what the class was designed around, which is why they use initiative with no CDs while everyone else deals with cooldowns. Only issue I see with it is I believe the initiative system was designed to make Thieves severely handicapped in protracted fights against other classes(like say, a battle of attrition with a necro), but since most fights with glass cannon classes only last at most 5-10 seconds anyway, this doesn’t affect the profession at all.

Oh, and Deniara, Backstab doesn’t require a thief to be behind the target, but using it without being behind the target makes it hit just as strong as the final attack in the autoattack chain. In other words, you might as well spam #1 if u dont stand behind your target for the double damage backstab. Also, C&D doesn’t give you invulnerability so I have no idea where you got that from. Those 2 things made me question your credibility.

Funny that everyone sees it at a dirt cloud but on my screen it looks like embers emanating from a fire… you know, like the raging flames burning inside a furious warrior?

MarkedOne.1309:

Ya, I want full flame legion set in PvE too, since I have it on every character in PvP. Do it vice versa, or dont do it at all.

I’m sorry but did you just compare a generic set of armor to a Legendary which takes months to aquire? I don’t have one but with the sheer amount of time and resources it takes to produce one(of 2 possible on each character in pve) I think they should definitely be allowed to carry over the skin.

I played for maybe a total of 15 minutes in spvp with an engineer and for someone who doesn’t know jack squat about the class, I survived for a REALLY long time with all the regen and support from turrets and whatnot, so Engies imo aren’t hurting as bad as you seem to believe.

Also thieves are advertised as being THE best in 1v1 encounters. In open environments, if you don’t screw yourself over, you will either win the fight or just simply walk away if you feel like it. You even said we are known for burst, meaning we are so good at it, we are labeled as the bursters, therefore the “best”, no? You also describe Warriors as meat shields, implying they can take loads of damage due to armor, and this is completely untrue. A Warrior who goes for survivability sacrifices a lot of damage output(as it should be i suppose) to be as tough as any other class who does the same without equal repurcussions.
—-
Just saying by the way, I play both thief and warrior with my thief being my first class, never tried anything else during the BWEs, and my first 80, love the profession, and even I believe its a much easier class to play than most of the others, with many mechanics which I myself consider “cheap”. Maybe I’m just a self-loathing thief, idk.
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Also, direct answer to thread title,

We da best meng, we deed it.

I’m not an expert on making games. Heck not even a novice. I have 0 knowledge other than maybe making simple 3D models using C4D. But technically for something to be truly dynamic must it not also, by nature, be complex? How do you build a “dynamic, simple” combat system in the first place? Press 1 for attack and 2 for defense is simple, but not dynamic, and Press “X+A+1+Q+5+22+J” if enemy does action “Y” or just “I+U+9+2” if he does action “X” seems more dynamic but definitely not simple.

The way I see it, a dynamic system has multiple variables and even more solutions to account for any combination of those variables, becoming more complex rather than “simple”. If this is true, then wouldn’t their whole premise for a simple and dynamic combat system be false or just a simply unattainable goal? Am I completely wrong?

It’s happened to me before as well a few weeks ago. I hit Sword2 on Warrior for the leap and it just flashed. I then hit literally every other button and all my skills began flashing as if they were queued but not firing. I would type in chat ask around and see if it was just me and the messages wouldn’t come up either. Suddenly my skills 1 by 1 activate and the message pops up, again all like it was just in some sort of queue.

If I had to take a guess, I would say it is server lag.
——
Other games I’ve seen similar delays that were attributed to server lag, for example, is a FPS where you would empty a magazine on your screen and repeatedly reload and the game doesn’t register it but suddenly refills your weapon and returns your ammo, or open world games where people run around smacking each other but everyone seems invincible then suddenly dies. (Note, these are just examples of other game’s shortcomings, I haven’t seen these happen here, yet)

zone.1073:

Have PvP gear be displayable in PvE towns (town clothes).

Random passerby asks “where did you get such awesome looking gear????”

“Oh I just did some PvP” the rank 50 dude replies.

Passerby joins PvP.

Passerby realizes attaining the same level and gear as the rank 50 will take months.

Passerby goes back to PvE and just buys the gear off TP

=P

Bunzy.8674:

Nowadays term zerg is used in mmo games to describe a force consisted of a large group of players who use numbers rather then strategy to defeat the enemy, therefore requiring no skill. This tactics is commonly known as zerging.

Using numbers as a way to win, that’s why people have a problem with it.

Nowadays? Zerging has ALWAYS had the same meaning. If anyone doesn’t know, its from a popular StarCraft tactic used with the Zerg race, which was centered around building as many of the cheapest units available(zerglings) as possible as quickly as possible. You would then take all of your units and attack a single point hoping to win by simply overwhelming your opponent through sheer numbers, even if he technically had stronger(but fewer) units. 1 zergling would definitely lose to 1 marine, but 50 zerglings will faceroll 5 marines then proceed to eating his homebase.

This is why its so easy to transfer to other games. It doesn’t matter if the enemy team has 10 of the absolute best players on their team if you hit them with 100 people simply mashing 1-9 on their keyboard at random. My bet would be on the 100 mediocre people beating the elites(albiet with heavy losses lol)

Why does swiftness seem to be such a big deal to some people as if they were meant to be as fast as everyone else in the first place? Thieves, Elementalists, etc are SUPPOSED to be faster than, for example, a guardian.

So IMO if your argument is based entirely on losing your swiftness and therefore being slower than those who are supposed to be naturally fast, it’s an invalid argument. It’s like trying to justify roids in sports because all the other guys are naturally bigger than you so you want the boost.

I really have no opinion on the rest though since I’m not a avid tourney player and this doesn’t affect me at all, but thats my 2c on the swiftness thing.

Shukran.4851:

agree op…but honestly..what can they do to fix this kitten?
i should roll an asura too, but i hate that race.

Racist…

Was this a recent change? Because afiak there have always been + in the trait lines. Reason for not have a minus is obvious, retraiting resets all the traits anyway.

I would like to see a “finalization” kind of thing though. As in, when you retrait, it doesn’t lock in your traits until you hit a “complete traiting” button. Its annoying when I try to spec a certain way, put in 1 too many into a tree, and then have to completely respec to undo that small mistake. This is when a [-] symbol being added would work as well since in the current system theres no way to take points out of a tree without total respec.

My Charr has a pistol.. not a main weapon but its there.

Oh and are soldiers today(of all nations) not warriors because they use guns? You should read up on some of the insane kitten some people did in WW2, like Yogendra Singh Yadav in particular charged a machine gun nest out in the open by himself, chucked a grenade inside, and beat the ever-loving-crap out of the machine gunners, then repeated it 2 more times right afterward, taking a couple hits from his enemy as he moved from nest to nest.

I think banners are pretty strong in WvW. I’ve placed all my banners(3 utility slotted and 1 elite) in a zerg vs zerg stalemate and it felt like its exactly what my team needed to push back the enemy. Increase power and condition damage from Strength, 10% increase in crit damage when many are already maxed out, and more healing power is great for a group IMO. Especially when I dropped the Battle Standard and everyone gained fury, might, swiftness, stability and it picked up any downed allies. Or maybe that was just me imagining I was more influential than i thought :P

I would like to see the banner “sharing” reworked though. It’s kind of annoying when u set a banner somewhere intentionally because it affects the most people or something, and some guy comes along “ooh whats this do” and runs off with it.

It gives you full adrenaline. Not like it makes a difference though. I’ve traited my warrior for adrenaline gain and even with a reduced cooldown, i was still waiting for my Burst skill to come off its 8 second cooldown

By the way, notice how he included “(with their pet)”. Meaning its the pet that really makes the difference not the rangers own abilities.

I took it as, “hey you don’t have fancy moves, but you’re pretty damn good at jamming your fist down someones throat and thats good enough to end most confrontations.”

IE, warriors are designed(or supposed to be) tough rampagers who plow through everything without concern for life or limb. Personally I wish warriors playstyle looked something like a scene from a Hulk movie/cartoon/comic.

Pure, unadulterated, destructive, and savage fury.

BlueprintLFE.2358:

Lol no other classes auto attacks don’t hit for 4k each of even near that which the warriors seem to think is no big deal, but to other classes that’s insane.

Either you need to play more classes or you’ve never tried going glass cannon yourself. I made a ranger just to mess around in spvp and with the default set up, I or my pet was hitting for 2k regularly on glass cannon thieves, ele’s, mesmers, warriors, etc.

Even on my thief earlier today I went D/D glass and ran into a guardian whose spirit weapon actually dropped me from 14k to downedstate in about 4 seconds. Not his attacks or anything. His “pet” that floats around swinging randomly at things.

Point is, autoattacking someone who is glass and seeing 2-4k damage each is not as amazing as you seem to think it is. If it was on a balanced character, thats different but its not the case here.

Mammoth.1975:

Jonny.9370:

Which brings us to the real issue, imo. Frenzy.

If frenzy was the issue, QZ would be too. Frenzy+HB does nothing without bulls. Bulls+HB does pretty good damage without frenzy. If there was even an ‘issue’ here, it would be CC. All these quickness complaints are misdirected, unless you’re talking about time warp.

You honestly don’t think a 100% effective DPS increase isn’t an issue? This isn’t solely about 100 blades, either.

Jason Segel.2908:

Necro can give itself 10 stacks of might with blood is power. And I still don’t hit that high, invalid point.

I guess you didn’t read all of the post? 10 stacks of might is great and all but the point is that isn’t all warriors bring unlike the necro build you seem to be using. Warriors can build over 15. +12% damage from berserker rage, then add the vulnerability inflicted by the greatsword, and you are looking at around 400-500 extra power coming from might and about 15% extra total damage from traits and your debuff(not counting greatsword specialization trait).

And warriors only SEEM to hit super high since it occurs very quickly. They aren’t chunking 20k from people with a single weapon strike. What does your autoattack hit glasscannon fighters for? 2-4k each? So does the warrior, except he can do it faster through 100b. Which brings us to the real issue, imo. Frenzy.

Jason Segel.2908:

xiv.7136:

Jason Segel.2908:

xiv.7136:

Jason Segel.2908:

Look, if it was the warrior misses his 100b and is completely useless this whole 100b issue for the spvp(casual players) would be a non-issue. As it stands you can miss 100b and still easily down someone because the cooldown is so low and you can survive long enough as a good warrior to use it multiple times in one life. Where as other classes might be able to kill you in less than 10 seconds if you are a completly bad warrior, and you can kill them in under 2 seconds. I don’t see any place for a skill like that except for killing bunkers. Thieves in spvp usually suck and sometimes really good people use thieves/warriors to glory boost. It’s a press 2 buttons free kill in spvp and it makes casual players quit. I want casual players so we can have paid tournies pop which take forever now. Too many people are quitting because you want the game balanced on the top 10% which alienates the other 90% which isn’t right. You are the minority and like I said, most of the time a warrior can be the best warrior and I will beat them. Well of darkness, and 3 necromancer teleports + 2 fears can beat almost any warrior and I am at 88% games played as necromancer out of 700 ish games. I am not bad and have a 80% win ratio in free tpvp, saving up tickets for awhile.

Next time think out the whole scenario, and don’t limit it to simple things. Get better at macro logic.

I’ve seen a lot of players like you.

In SWTOR, you were the guys asking to nerf operatives. In WoW you were the guys asking to nerf mages. In TSW, you were the guys asking to nerf assault rifles.

You put a lot of hours of gametime in and think that should make you automatically win with whatever squishy spec you play (100blades one-shots you as a necro? are you serious), but you lack twitch ability and assume the game is at fault.

It isn’t.

Actually… Operatives are very weak. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2PVrCJI7dRU
here is me showing off my insane healing. Here is me getting 72% dmg reduction?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgMeyDVI37E
I rock all operatives, except “Agust” he is the only one I could never beat. stalemate everytime.

""Well of darkness, and 3 necromancer teleports + 2 fears can beat almost any warrior and I am at 88% games played as necromancer out of 700 ish games. I am not bad and have a 80% win ratio in free tpvp, saving up tickets for awhile.""

gg

In all those cases the class was neutered (operatives got gutted, for example – and warriors in wow ironically were gutted for the same reason, burst which the class needed to be viable but caused bad players to cry) because of mistaken nerf cries from people who blamed the game for their own inadequacies.

Don’t be that guy.

Only guy I am being is for the correct decision of toning it down or buffing other classes.

As it stands a rifle warrior deals more damage than ANY power/crit/critchance ranger spec can at a ranger. Rangers are rangers, yet a rifle warrior can legit deal 3 times their DPS easily.

And what about a Ranger means they should automatically be the best ranged class? Ever think that the title “ranger” refers to the profession(gasp) and not the playstyle? A ranger is a protector of wildlife(forest ranger for example), which is why they have pets and control animal spirits. That’s it. Thats all they get for being called “Rangers”. Notice how they also get swords and horns and whatnot. GW2 Ranger =/= WoW Hunter

Also I saw one of your posts picking apart 100b saying why is it warriors can deal 26k damage with 1 attack but you can only do 13k with similar attack stats. It may seem at resting state that you are both the same but you are sorely mistaken lmao.

Did you know that a warrior spec’d for 100b gains might every time he hits you with a GS crit? SoR gives a warrior +30%(40?) crit rating making crits almost guaranteed on berserker sets. It also gives 5 stacks of might. A warrior could also forgo endure pain for FGJ for even more might before he even starts swinging. Plus, when traited GS crits have a chance to cause vuln. Every hit gives more adrenaline which can give even more power(max of like 12% i think) or crit, or both. And this is all from the warrior alone. Not accounting for outside buffs from, say, a staff guardian, a warrior can go into a fight with similar power and crit as you, but soon he will have ~15 stacks of might, fury, you with vulnerability, and he will only get stronger if the fight draws out longer lol.

TL;DR with all the buffs that come along with the setup, OF COURSE I’m gonna smack you for 15-20k if you come at me as glass.

MistyMountains.3751:

I thought this was going to be a backstab theif thread O.O, 100b as a skill is fine and doesnt 1 shot you…Quickness/Haste/Zeph abilities are generally the issue that most players have hence why I suggested they be removed…Honestly though if ur being killed by a 100b without Quickness instantly ur build is pretty horrible =/ at most a full 100b does about 10-15k on a 2k Armor char, while even on ele i can get 2k armor and 20k hp…thief u can get 18-20k pretty easily as well…Maybe invest a bit more in vit…specially seeing how warriors are 1 of the least wanted classes in Tpvp

Why would this be about Backstab if he’s a thief himself? Notice his quick addition of “buff thieves” in there.(not the only evidence)

Anyway 100 blades will not one shot you if you are not glass cannon. It can still deal enough damage to quick finish you off or leave you near death, but there are many abilities to mitigate damage.

And before some one says it, if this is about 1 shot abilities in general, then why is 100 blades the only skill mentioned instead of thieves HS spam, mesmer blurred frenzy, ele flame dash combo, etc which cause similar damage in a similar amount of time?

Matchmaking option for hotjoin possible at all? If the issue with matchmaking is groups who want to stay together, then queue them with groups of similar skill and # of players. New solo players who join these “group sessions” get factored in when they join and get assigned to the statistically weakest team? Works for consoles and any other game that forgoes the server browser system, right?

ilJumperMT.4871:

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/5160/gw001ey.jpg
http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/1079/gw017l.jpg
http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/2650/gw018j.jpg
Best: 28k 100b
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9046/gw019n.jpg

I noticed you hit him for 1.3k with bullrush and your autoattack for 2-3k. In other words, that guy is a HORRIBLE example if you are tryin to “prove” 100b is OP. He’s as weak as he can possibly be. I hit a rabbit in WvW for 1mil with stomp, should that be nerfed too? Its like a grown man in his prime punching a small child and people exclaiming that he is the most powerful man alive. Find builds that AREN’T glasscannons. I have actually taken 3 full 100b on my full toughness warrior. I was barely below 25% lol.

[Edited by a moderator with the reason: Accusing other users as “trolls” violates our forum code of conduct]

Pyrial.2917:

Here’s your answer. They are working on some GREAT stuff, but it’s too good to tell you. Just wait and see…

I recall seeing this some few months ago for another game. This certain FPS had devs who promised players the next release they had was going to be “worth the wait”. This led to rampant rumors among the players, everything from new weapons and maps to new game modes.

They labeled a month as the release timeframe in advance so everyone knew something was coming, but days turned to weeks in that month and nothing came. That is, until about 5 days remained in said month. And I’ll just say the community didn’t feel the same way as the devs did, and the content came no where near the expectations.

To put it simply, they did something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am-Qdx6vky0&feature=player_detailpage#t=31s

..except in the videogame world..

TL;DR … When a developer makes a comment that general and open for false rumors and hype, they just shot themselves in the foot IMO.

earendil.1290:

They should introduce some sort of guild vs guild PvP (the game is named Guildwars after all).

Isn’t Guild Wars named so because guilds fighting nearly ended the world or something? I don’t fully know the lore, but that sounds bad. =P

Setsunayaki.4907:

As far as Warrior Goes…Vengeance is great! I nearly died and I used Vengeance to kill a player and revive 2 – 3 players before it wore off and I died. However I am unclear when Vengeance kills me and when it doesn’t kill me.

Sometimes I rally through it, sometimes I don’t even when I kill the player who downed me.

Normally Vengeance rallying a warrior is based on chance. What the % exactly is, I don’t know. But if you are traited with Sweet Vengeance it will rally you 100% of the time if you kill a player.

PVE however, is different. The trick to it in PVE afaik is that you must END combat to fully rally from vengeance otherwise you will still die even if you kill 3 different npcs during vengeance. In other words, using it to try and burst down 1 enemy in a group won’t save you. You will need to kill all the enemy NPCs attacking you resulting in you exiting combat for the save.

Wasn’t the ability to play with friends, regardless of what server you were on, through the “visiting” feature(don’t remember what it was called) a selling point for GW2? Whats the point of that now since I can actually freely transfer to a friends server instead of simply visiting?

This whole thing seems to only apply to WvW and, imo, if someone wants to hop from server to server because it the flavor of the month, let them pay out the puppies for it..

.. I hate cats.

Not trying to sound douchy or anything but uh… you had 0 points into Defense, the toughness tree.. I’m not tourney material, but just saying, my hammer warrior has 1960 toughness, 3k armor and my gear isn’t even set up with toughness/vit sigils. I never get hit for more than 10k and thats probably only against a crit with multiple might boons backing it. Final tier of Defense also gives you 5 secs of retal when receiving a crit every 15 seconds.

All I’m trying to say is that you could still do much more to reduce incoming damage. Currently my novice eyes see you as a glass cannon with no cannon.

ilovemagdab.9724:

@mishi
thank you for the input I do put down a aoe when the player goes down sadly that won’t kill them in a blink of an eye and I won’t get another chance to kill them if I’m getting mauled by invaders. And it is no fun to bring someone back from down state when your in a heat of battle or a dead person yelling at you to bring them back to life while you have everyone attacking you it’s a mark of death to try to bring someone back up taking aoe damage melee damage range damage by everyone at the same time. And also people will not care how they fight in a battle because they will depend on you to revive/heal them back up and depending on that too much just makes people lazy in fights they don’t run away they stand there go down and QQ to people why they don’t get pick up that makes everyone drop everything and rush in to try to save a dead person getting there own neck in danger too and most time end up dead for no reason lol.

The example you gave was your group, a group of 4, came up against another group, a group of 10. The end result was you lost. In a 4v10. And theres some sort of issue there? I’m not seeing it. That sounds like exactly what should’ve happened.

I’d bet you had atleast 1 thief in your group of 4. Why didn’t he stealth(c/d, blinding powder, HS through smoke field) to finish off any of the downed enemies? Or maybe an engineer who can invul himself to finish a player? Or a warrior with stability? Necro with conditions? Or maybe a… well IDK… any other profession in the game, with a frenzy that turns the finisher into a ~0.5sec cast?

Its not like the other group used downed state as their ace-up-the-sleeve. I think you just have a problem with anything that isn’t pewpewpew done. And anyone who has an issue with you not reviving them when its clearly not the best action is an idiot, you should ignore their cries and tell them as such. And those who foolishly try to “help” pick up others when the situation doesn’t allow for it deserve to get downed imo.

I dont agree with your proposed Warrior Vengeance change. My thief can dodge full groups trying to finish me while down, as can some other classes(mesmers have similar teleport, guardian/ranger AoE, ele can stand up and run away, i think necros can leech enemy hp, etc). Warriors, however, can only counter 1 attempt at a finisher and if he manages to survive long enough for Vengeance to activate he deserves that second chance. Also its not guaranteed to save him unless of course he’s spec’d into it and manages to kill you in time.

Zatria.5783:

Sharpclaw.7510:

cyrealkylla.7145:

lol fine sharp tell me what other class gets that much burst from one button…still waiting

Nothing about the way you died was one button.

Hmmm. Too bad you don’t know about the youtube video going around that shows a thief dominating everyone and never needing to use 2, 3, 4, and sometimes the 5 skill on his bar.

So yeah, 1 button is all it really takes.

I’ll admit I’ve never seen this video, but how is he going to stealth if he’s only using 1 button? What other part of the set up are you missing? The default thief(the build u r given when you first enter spvp) barely breaks 4k with a plain backstab on the heavy target dummies and 5k on the light so this guy obviously isnt Joe Schmoe, just picked up the game 5 minutes ago. He’s researched it(google or otherwise lol), and practiced the profession. And who is he playing against? I creamed a ranger who stood completely still as I tore into him while he attacked with a bow. Didn’t even bother to get out of melee range. That doesn’t make me a pro though :P

I bet there will be warrior, mesmer, necro, etc. videos of people doing the same thing some time in the future and those will rally cries of OP and petitions for nerfs.

Lewk.8359:

We don’t need an explanation of how to fight a thief. We are just fine at that. What i want an explanation of us is WHY do thieves have HIGHER DAMAGE OUTPUT that not only hits harder HIT FOR HIT, but is also SPAMMABLE, LEAPS TO TARGET, and gives BONUS DAMAGE when the target’s health gets lower.

What I am seeing in the pics here is Back Stab, which does nothing that you stated… Backstab and the other stealth attacks actually the only thief weapon attack that can be said to have a “cooldown”.(u cant restealth for 3 seconds after breaking stealth)

Another thing, the guy who got 1 shotted for 13k? Supposedly the glass cannon spec? Idk for sure but if this is true, then I’d say its working as intended. You give up all toughness for damage and got rolled on… try another tactic. I’ve played against an Ele who stood in a rock shield as 4 people pounded on him.. He nearly killed me and nearly got away.

Don’t get me wrong, Thief does feel OP 1v1 which is what the description SAYS IT SHOULD. If I can get my Spider Venom, Devour, and Haste up I can burst most pubs down to death 1v1. But now my combo is on a 30 second CD(60 if i want haste again) and im all out of initiative, meaning anyone who gets to me right then is going to have a much easier time killing me.

Something else I am seeing is that most of the people complaining about thieves seem to be using caster/light armor professions… coincidence? Or do they just want the WoW mage that can 1v2 people with 1 button?

I think petitions are actually against forum policies or something.. unless this forum is different?

I play on a 48" HDTV… Idk what ur talking about.. :P

Bottom line is something needs to be done about the autobalance penalizing players for something others did(on the opposite team, no less). I’ve been in multiple pubs where the top player on our team(the one who presumably contributed the most I suppose) gets “autobalanced” to the losing team about 10-15 seconds before the win.

Everytime I play with the intent to earn glory points I actually think to myself as we close in on a win “Those <expletive> better not quit.” And sometimes its not totally about the glory.. What if I am consistantly switched to a losing team when I contributed greatly to the winning team? That pie chart showing “Wins by profession” would be pretty inaccurate, no?

Once the market starts going along and people start getting tons of gold, obtaining cultural armor might actually be a realistic goal, but I thought it was funny how at current rates it would actually cost a level 80 who pays for the whole set with gems converted to gold around $900.. and the set is only 120g. GW2 economy seems to be better than most countries lol.

I got bored and started looking towards my characters “future” so I went to the cultural armor vendors to see what it would look like on my character.. I then saw the gold pricing.. wtf?

Is gold really that easy to get for 80s? Or is this the biggest money-sink in the history of MMOs? The reason I say this is because at current market prices(if my math is correct), if I was to buy gems to transfer to gold with ~600 gems equalling 1 gold, I would need around 72000 gems. This translates to around $900 USD…

TL;DR, Cultural Armor Tier 3, is currently worth about 900 real world American dollars.

I’d say thats a little much? Discuss?