Guild Wars 2

Pandaman.4758:

This could be an argument for not trying GW2 if you have no prior MMO experience: it’s going to ruin your expectations of other MMOs.

Sure, GW2 is pretty grindy, but as far as MMO grinds go it’s on the lower end of the spectrum. If you come to dislike GW2 because of the grind, you’re not going to have a better time anywhere else.

It’s not so much that it’s grindy, but it’s unrewarding.
There is zero incentive to craft or gather materials when I can just buy everything for dirt cheap at the TP and if I want to sell the stuff I crafted for profit then I have to undercut and even then you won’t actually make a profit.
Crafting is a lose lose situation, always.
At least games like FFXIV have players develop a healthy relationship with people that craft since they’re a necessity, not just a gold sink.

Basically, crafting being grindy in an MMO isn’t bad, it adds value to the final product produced by the artisan because regular players aren’t willing to invest themselves in something that’s difficult. Here in GW2 I can produce exotic gear like nobody’s business and if you check the TP, anything that’s crafted is extremely devalued.

All I want for christmas is an expansion pack, or content that’s actually worth my time or new dungeons, anything.
Please Santa, I’ll even give you 49 bucks!

Only if you buy more gems and gem-store items!
ANet needs your cash for… something probably, who knows.

bolam.6294:

Wow, I’m sorry for how many people I’ve offended with my crafting comment XP was nothing personal.. really..

Welcome to the forums.
When the devs said the community was toxic, they weren’t kidding.

Tao.5096:

If OP dislikes game then should stop playing it.

Also, take this guy’s advise.

I’d be willing to pay a sub fee, if ANet updated and released content more often and changed their communication policies, but that won’t happen.

Vayne.8563:

Wolfey.3407:

The only thing that really annoys me with this note….
Veteran players are stuck for a few weeks with nothing to do but re-re-play wintersday content with the added bonus of most likely not being able to unlock anything from season one, unless it’s stuck behind another lottery. And the possible chance of some super adorable mini being locked behind wintersday gifts at a drop rate equivalent to precursors with the added insult of not being able to be sold or traded to other players.

Whereas veteran players in World of Warcraft waited a year while paying a subscription with no new content and just repeating stuff.

And I know people who’ve already beaten the new WoW and returned to Guild Wars 2. There’s no game alive that can keep people in content as much as they want.

FF14.
“Baaah, I don’t like THAT game, it sucks! therefore, the fact that they produce more content is irrelevant!”

Did I get that right?

Vayne.8563:

You’re trying to convince me because you don’t like the game the game is somehow in trouble. I’d almost wager at this point that Guild Wars 2 is still the second more successful MMORPG next to WoW, which no one has come close to.

lmao
WoW has 10 million players, son, GW2 isn’t and will never be anywhere near WoW and if FF14 is doing better than GW2 in terms of players and money, then chances are GW2 doesn’t have more than 200,000/100,000 players. No small amount, but like I said ArenaNet isn’t exactly rolling in cash, otherwise they wouldn’t be so cautious with their communication policy.
But hey, whatever, we can dismiss any argument with “lol opinions”, because discussion if for losers, right?

Vayne.8563:

Just looked it up. As of February this year 1.8 million people have created accounts on FFXIV. I’m sure not everyone that’s started that game is still there. When I started it only recently, the server seemed quite underpopulated. At one point I died and waited for someone to come by for a rez, just to see how long it would take. Eventually I gave up after about half an hour.

So people touting this game as some great thing don’t even really know if it has as many players as Guild Wars 2. Of course if there are a million players still playing that’s still 15 million dollars a month income. That’s a fact. I don’t think there are likely a million people still playing but it’s possible. Subscription games do have more income.

However I’m not sure those updates aren’t far easier to create being how primitive the system actually is (and it is primitive).

If I wanted to go backwards, I could go play AoC.

As for NcSoft taking all the money and giving Anet an allowance, I’m pretty sure that’s now how businesses owned by other businesses work.

You really are adamant about defending GW2, huh.

I’m getting tired of this game, in which you always fail to address my argument and I have to state it once again.
Just so you know, having mega-servers isn’t a sign of a bustling player population, it’s a fancy word for server merges aka one nail on the coffin.
FF14 has more players, it’s a fact, whether you joined a low pop server isn’t my issue.
Also, GW2’s combat isn’t exactly the innovation of the decade, it’s still a tab-targetting MMO with a dodge mechanic, that’s it, really. FF14’s gameplay isn’t primitive but rather a more traditional approach. However, gameplay being “primitive” has no bearing in the quality or quantity of the updates, WoW is a 2004 game and nowadays it doesn’t get updates that often.

I think at this point you’re just refusing to acknowledge the fact that ArenaNet hasn’t provided the best service, in comparison to its competition. If so, I’d rather not continue this, since it’s obvious you’re biased.

Okay, son, we get it. You think the game sucks, you’ve repeated the same phrase ad nauseam. It sucks and no amount of content will make YOU want to play it. Sounds like a totally unbiased statement.

Sadly, thinking the game sucks won’t make it any less successful, and their success means they took steps in the right direction, namely, not being stubborn as hell, admitting their errors and actually talking to their fanbase.

By the way, the console market for FF14 is pretty darn small, most of their revenue comes from PC. Funny how people are willing to pay a sub fee for a game they enjoy, huh?

IndigoSundown.5419:

Mavis.1463:

Also, way to miss the point. I originally mentioned how FF14’s devs were respectful of their customers, which is true.

So, what does that look like?

I would say that ANet devs are respectful to their customers. To me, that would mean that they respond diplomatically when they respond, and that they make changes to the game based on what people ask for. ANet devs have made a lot of changes to the game in response to things posters asked for. They certainly use diplomatic language when addressing us.

So, since you seem to be implying that ANet is lacking where Square Enix isn’t, how about telling us why? And five times the content? They’ve had four patches since relaunch. A bunch of quests which I would have to buy/sub to actually be able to evaluate, since the patch notes don’t say how involved they are. A few dungeons, a couple or so classes. It might be more than ANet has patched, but five times is nothing but a WKG (Wild Kittened Guess).

My point still stands, they’ve released more content than arenanet, DESPITE a relaunch

And what I meant by respecting their customers is that ArenaNet’s communication policies are a huge insult to players that have invested 2 or more years in this game.
That’s another fact you can’t deny, ArenaNet refuses to communicate and talk about their projects, it’s their policy and they’ve made it clear they’re not interested in dialog.
CDDs or whatever they’re called were a step in the right direction, but we only get those once every 50 years, when a lamb is sacrificed during a full moon and even then, they’re just a nice way of saying “We may or may not ever work on this”.

edit: http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/special/patchnote_log/
Feel free to take a look. There’s a total of 4 expansion-like content updates.

Vayne.8563:

Malkavian.4516:

Vayne.8563:

Mavis.1463:

Vote goes to FF14.
I like developers that respect their customers.

Yes, like the first game they put out had to be completely revamped because it sucked so bad. It’s so funny how people forget stuff.

To be honest, Final Fantasy 14 isn’t too bad of an MMO. It starts out painfully slow but it at least plays well. Though a part of me thinks it’s more like a remake of Final Fantasy 11, than a completely different game just from the races alone. And I will at least commend them for actually going back to the drawing board and do it all over again.

It’s one starting area, isn’kitten With boring linear questing that makes me want to kill myself. If you’re interested in raids it’s probably okay, but I’m all about the living world thing and that linear thing just kills it for me.

lmao, are you implying GW2 isn’t linear?
You can go back and forth in dynamic events, that’s it, and the personal story quests are predetermined, your past choices stop mattering once you join and order, and even that becomes irrelevant as well.

Also, way to miss the point. I originally mentioned how FF14’s devs were respectful of their customers, which is true. If it makes you want to snuff yourself, be my guest.

Vayne.8563:

Mavis.1463:

Vote goes to FF14.
I like developers that respect their customers.

Yes, like the first game they put out had to be completely revamped because it sucked so bad. It’s so funny how people forget stuff.

Yeah, how dare they swallow their pride as developers, go back to the drawing board and then re-release a game in a much better state.
That takes effort and effort is for losers

Vote goes to FF14.
I like developers that respect their customers.

Mo Mo.1947:

Malediktus.9250:

I would rather pay them 60€ for a proper expansion than getting this for free.

They’ve been expanding the game almost monthly. Why do you need a big dropship dump of an expansion all at once just because it’s how people have done it before? The multiple expansions over a period of time are more digestable.

What would a “legit expansion” even look like? Something like all the expansions they’ve made so far except in a big lump that you have to wait a long time for?

Why wait a long time for new stuff when you can get new stuff in waves all year long?

Have you played any other MMOs at all?
It’s been said over and over in these type of threads, expansions generate hype, and have all kinds of content that these LS updates can’t deliver, like classes, races, new continents, etc…

And there’s empirical evidence to support my claim that expansions are more successful than whatever ANet is doing. See Burning Crusade or the more recent Warlords of Draenor. You can also look at FF14, the developers pump out five times the amount of content ANet does and still has room for expansions.

LS updates only serve to keep a small amount of players hooked to the daily grind, but opening chests in the Silverwastes gets boring after a while.w

Vayne.8563:

Mavis.1463:

Vayne.8563:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Mavis.1463:

saalle.4623:

I do believe that 2015 will be big year for Gw2

Yeah, you don’t get to attend a funeral very often.

While I don’t think GW2 will die, it will porbably stay in a coma.

People said that 2014 would be a great year for GW2 in 2013, but you gotta like getting kicked in the teeth after a falcon punch if you liked the development of GW2 and think 2014 was great for this game.

To each their own. But if it is less that you want, you are probably right with GW2.

It can’t stay in a coma, since it’s not in one now. You know, this is the kind of hyperbole I’m specifically talking about. A coma means no fuctions. You may not like the living story, but it’s still coming out. There’s a PvP update coming in December 2nd.

The state of the game may very well not be to your liking, but it’s not in a coma. And saying so makes me question everything else you have to say.

Metaphors aside.
I’m willing to drop money on games that deliver content, this game is doing the exact opposite, so I will take my money elsewhere.

There’s a game with a far more active community, more players, it delivers content on a steady, constant basis and the developers actually listen to the community.

See that’s my problem. I’d love to find a game that delivers content that I like. This is it. There isn’t another and I’ve tried them all.

I’d love to find a game I like that delivers more content than Anet. But there isn’t one.

Actually, I was referring to FF14.

Vayne.8563:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Mavis.1463:

saalle.4623:

I do believe that 2015 will be big year for Gw2

Yeah, you don’t get to attend a funeral very often.

While I don’t think GW2 will die, it will porbably stay in a coma.

People said that 2014 would be a great year for GW2 in 2013, but you gotta like getting kicked in the teeth after a falcon punch if you liked the development of GW2 and think 2014 was great for this game.

To each their own. But if it is less that you want, you are probably right with GW2.

It can’t stay in a coma, since it’s not in one now. You know, this is the kind of hyperbole I’m specifically talking about. A coma means no fuctions. You may not like the living story, but it’s still coming out. There’s a PvP update coming in December 2nd.

The state of the game may very well not be to your liking, but it’s not in a coma. And saying so makes me question everything else you have to say.

Metaphors aside.
I’m willing to drop money on games that deliver content, this game is doing the exact opposite, so I will take my money elsewhere.

There’s a game with a far more active community, more players, it delivers content on a steady, constant basis and the developers actually listen to the community.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

It is reasonable to bring up the bugged Collections, or the problems with how the Trait Masteries were adjusted, or how you don’t like the NPE. It’s reasonable to say how you don’t like the story, or the characters, or you think asura should blow themselves up in another Thaumanova-like explosion and be gone forever.

It’s not reasonable to request, or demand, the game be altered significantly . . . in less time than it takes a holiday time present to be delivered through FedEx.

FF14 begs to differ.
The game did a relaunch and now it’s one of the best MMOs in the market, with content patches being released every 3 months, and since most of my friends left and started playing that game, might as well.

I’m not sure how to interpret ANet’s silence, so I won’t even bother.

saalle.4623:

I do believe that 2015 will be big year for Gw2

Yeah, you don’t get to attend a funeral very often.

Gele.2048:

Hhaha the funny part is that they are not replaying still nothing official from arena net :P
i dont understand the direction this game is going i really dont can anyone here explain me pls im confused a lot!!!!

There isn’t one, not until ANet decides to open it’s food-hole and talk.
I hope you enjoy Living Story, cause that’s what you’re getting until the game dies.

Ashen.2907:

Mavis.1463:

Ashen.2907:

Mavis.1463:

This is a forum, a forum is a place to express opinions and thought, not circlejerk about how great the game is when there are nasty issues with it.

So people whose thoughts and opinions are that the game is great are not included in the, “this is a place to express,” part of your quote ? Is it only people who agree with your opinions and thoughts that are to be allowed to express themselves without being insulted ?

Don’t put words in my mouth, I never said that.

When you state that forums are for people to express their thoughts and opinions but that those who think the game is great are just sitting around circle-kittening, yes you did say that.

Good job ignoring the rest of my post, point in case.
Saying people are circle-jerking isn’t denying them the right to say whatever they want, like I said, you’re just delusional.

Also, go back and read the post you replied to originally.
I was referring to people that are quick to dismiss any problems with the game and instead praise it endlessly, blaming any problems to the “haters”.
There’s a difference between liking a game and circle-jerking over it.

Hi, I’m a returning player and totally not an old player pretending to be returning just to rip on people complaining about the lack of content.

This game is so great, it has so much content, wow, amazing, thanks for the paycheck.

Harper.4173:

While I don’t usually agree with Vayne I have to say that I too believe there’s some big project being worked on as we speak.

My guess? An expansion.

There’s been too little content these past 2 years to justify all those people working at a decent rate.

I believe they’ve started developing an expansion about a year ago when it became clear the game needed one.

I very much doubt it. They’ve made it clear that they despise the idea of an expansion and the idea of communicating with their community.

At this point the game will be drained of players slowly until the only people playing it are the kind that spit arguments like “Dun liek it dun play it” or “Haters ruined this game”. This kind of people are as much a problem as the lack of communication from ANet.

And if anyone fits that profile, I’ll give you guys a hint: This is a forum, a forum is a place to express opinions and thought, not circlejerk about how great the game is when there are nasty issues with it.

Mo Mo.1947:

You guys want to feel respected? You want to feel like your voice is heard? Dish out!

This game takes money to run, and it’s exploding with content built with the money players have invested in the game. Not the money spent to buy the game; that money paid off ANet’s pre-dev debts. The money spent in the gem store is keeping the game alive.

Yeah, you can play free forever and that’s awesome, but if you play ALL THE TIME and you’re feeling like you have nothing to do, then maybe you DON’T have anything left to do and it’s time to play two games instead of one.

I stopped playing the game for about 6 months. When I came back I was SO behind everyone. So many fractals levels, so much ascended gear, everyone has tons of gold. There is so much in this game I’ve yet to complete I don’t know when I’m going to catch up even though I’m playing obsessively again.

---

If you feel like there is not enough content in the game then WOW! That means either one of two things:

1. You rushed through the game. You brought this upon yourself. Rushing through the game is a fast track to boredom and burnout. Don’t believe me? Go get on a free private Aion server that has speed-leveling enabled and see how anti-climactic and underwhelming your game experience becomes.

2. You play the game way too much to be healthy and it’s time to cool it down. Take break and do something else every once in a while.

---

If you’ve been playing the game since launch you probably have wads of gold and tokens in your wallet and you could feasibly enjoy this game without ever having needed to spend real money on gems. In other words, some of you have been playing this game for over 2 years for the low low price of $60. At the current life of the game that comes out to $2.25 a month. If you’ve burnt out all your time on GW2, it’s time to spend money on a new game to play while you’re waiting for new GW2 content.

This game takes MONEY and TIME to create. If you don’t feel like they’re chugging out content fast enough, first off you’ve gotta be joking me. Second, try and commit to spending a little money on gems as you are able, and encourage others to do the same.

You don’t have to spend any extra money to enjoy this game, but if you want MORE game than you already have, then SOMEBODY is gonna have to open up their wallet.

[/justsaying]

That’s nice, whatever, but Arenanet does not pay me to say nice things about the game or its current state. I’m not going to sugarcoat or go around saying “Guys this game is awesome, come play!” when it’s not, and when the developer has one of the most insulting and aggravating communication policies ever.

If arenanet wants my money, they should release an expansion or start talking more to the community

So, in a nutshell, the issue is Anet’s communication policy.
How does Anet receive feedback? Through the game? Trough the Forums?

It doesn’t seem like Anet pays a lot of attention to the forums and even though I see people kittening about the game’s problems in map chat constantly, I still see no response from Anet.

Agreed, this list is a tad too biased.
No thanks.

Julischka, no.
Stop trying to analyze the behavior of thousands of players and attempt to pass your poor analysis as a fact.
This goes to everyone.
Think for a second, make an effort.
Do you think, do you genuinely believe that the Living Story updates are enough to attract new players?

Do you think that Living Story updates are enough to hook the content “junkies”?

The problem is something a lot more insidious than just “players doing content too fast”. Even though “content” is an abstract amount, in a way, it’s something that can be quantified to a certain extent and whether a player does it fast or slow is irrelevant.

The issue is the very idea behind the Living Story.

As an analogy, imagine a thirsty man in a desert, this guy wants water, and he finds a canteen, however, the canteen only lets out trickles/drops of water.

Get it?
A BIG update/expansion, with lots of things to do will keep players happy and busy for a longer time than an update that adds a few hours of gameplay at best.

Agreed, I wouldn’t want to miss out the bi-weekly grind.

If they’ve seriously wasted 3 years with LS and trying to fix bugs then that’s it.
I’m not even going to bother any more. Anet’s silence is aggravating and insulting and to be honest, I don’t understand how so many people can stand it.
I wouldn’t even mind if anet announced they’re pulling the plug, just announce something.
LS and kittenty trailers hardly count as announcements or content.

Might as well be gemstore items and LS.
I’ve lost hope of anet ever releasing an expansion or any fulfilling content.

Revilrad.1962:

Morsus.5106:

The problem was Anet was able to satisfy them with the original Guild Wars. New classes, new continents, new skills, etc. The original Guild Wars released in 2005, and then we got two expansions in 2006. The problem is less the players demanding too much, and more ArenaNet no longer being able to keep up with demand.

Since ArenaNet opted to make the Living Story in place of an expansion, the Living Story needs to deliver the same quantity and quality content that an expansion would deliver. Unfortunately, the Living Story hasn’t been able to accomplish this, resulting in players demanding more content. To say that the players are just demanding too much is a little naive in my opinion, since there demand is based on what ArenaNet produced in the past.

Seriously but you would wait 2 years for an expansion pack, now sum up all the content delivered through LW Season 1 Season 2 and the feature packs. This amount of stuff and changes comes very close to an expansion size If not exceeding it.

Instead of waiting around without changes ANET delivers us the content slowly. Which I find is a good way to do it.

But the spoiled players dont even see the living world content as a content delivery but as something “extra”.

Anet should add the Living World Season 1 as permanent content and problem is solved.

Adding the missing content from season 1 fixes a problem for new players, which is the lack of context regarding the destruction of lion’s arch. But the stuff added by LS is FAR from being equivalent to an expansion.
It feels more like a personal story arc.

You could not be more wrong.
You mentioned the problem in your post.
The content is “FREE”, low quality, grindy, trite, garbage. I’d much rather pay 50 bucks for an expansion than get this “free” living grind content.
I love this game, but Anet is doing it wrong. Living Story won’t hook players that seek PvE content, it won’t attract new players because a shoddy update doesn’t generate hype, it won’t satisfy ANYONE.
Also, please stop shoving sylvari into everything, it got boring the first time.