Guild Wars 2

It’s like speed signets that necro/ele/ranger got. You move 25% faster in combat, so 8% less than swiftness. Swiftness is 33% increase from your base speed, it’s just the base speed that change, when in combat or not.

Although the change sucks for 100% condition duration, you now properly see the amount of Cond duration you have in the hero panel, be it from food, gear or trait. Tooltips seems ok too, but I haven’t look at them all.

So a nice change overall.

Seriously last night was a blast, I don’t know how many commanders there was in Northern borderlands trying to protect Greenlake, but each time I would mark a target for my group, there was that Pink Dorito under it. My commander’ kill count went from 8 to 13 in under 5 min, and they were all different. Wish we could have dog tags with their name when spiking one, just for the laugh

Also on a more positive note, I was hunting them thieves yesterday in WvW. Been able to see them/target them correctly, they were like deers staring at spotlight. Most seemed to not know what to do and just panicked to have that much pressure. I feel for them (a bit… hum, well not at all)

About the healing in DS, be it OP or not:

It’s still a bad design choice, having a entire trait line negated by using your class ability.

One of the only boon we can have permanently on us (regen) is also negated by our class mechanic.

I can’t see any other class that wouldn’t want/can’t use their class abilities when they want depending on the boons they have. And sometimes we don’t have a choice to use DS, even when we’re sitting in our (45 second cooldown) wells that heals us while ticking on 5 enemies or more, so all that big heal is wasted because of our class ability.

I really hope they can find a way to make it affect us in some way (even if it would be healing our lifeforce instead of our health) so that using DS wouldn’t hinder my gameplay.

I find rampager build with scepter/dagger-dagger(or axe)/focus to be the best dps/pressure setup. I feel like necro is made to be hybrid (DS scaling mostly with power). It’s also the fastest build to take down camp/vet solo that I’ve tested.

Then it’s all about how long you want/can survive. So you can choose to add some knight for more power or rabid for more condition damage depending on what you like more.

You switch to staff when against big groups or defending/attacking keep.

30/30/10 (greater mark when with staff and Shrouded removal when using scepter/axe) is by far our best hybrid build.

Even with max toughness, once you’re caught with your necro, you won’t survive if you didn’t plan ahead.

Good luck with your build!

I may be stretching here, but I think that when people talk about balance, it’s more about what we get with the same money. (Cooldown wise, trait wise, power scaling etc)

They (Anet) seems to think that life generation is so OP, that they need to put it on high cooldown stapled with another boon/effect. Protection for 6 sec doesn’t support the 90 sec cooldown, the 15 points Soul Reaping trait is the same thing and yet get 60 sec cooldown (which I still find too long for a protection boon).

On my engi, with a 10 point major trait (Protection injection) I can get 3 sec of protection every 5 sec when dazed stun etc. What do I get with a 20 point on my necro? 2 sec fear every 90 sec. We all know engineer are far from the top classes, yet they can get this very easily to have perma protection (which really helps and is fitting for an attrition style). My Guardian can have protection and regen for 4/6 sec with a 35 sec cooldown (28 traited) and gives it to everyone around. Most classes I play have increased damage/stats and a cooldown reduction combined in the same trait, on a Adept/Master tier instead of Grand master. And the list of differences could go on. (Just think what cool traits we could have if Staff cooldown and Greater mark were combined, Well cooldown + longer effect etc)

The same orange is not valued equal across all classes, for reasons that sometimes makes sense, but in our case, I think it doesn’t. Lifeforce generation is not the Plus Value they want it to be, and I hope some day we’ll get our fair share of it.

In a fast paced game, short duration effect with short cooldown is normally always better. The ratio could be the same (50% uptime on swiftness for example) but if I only have access to it every 60 second instead of 30, I can’t make a good use of it. It’s less tactical choice for the user.

A big patch is coming, the game is still in his infancy state, I still love my necro over my others 80, and I really hope some new changes are coming for us. But right now, I know that when I choose him in WvW over my mesmer/guardian/thief/engi, I shoot myself twice in the foot and get less for my money.

One day my minions , one day!

On thief vs necro, it’s more an issue about our output vs their output (and condition vs power across all classes). And also the point where 1 point in attack >1 point in defense. If you value attack more, the class which scales better with it will normally be on top of the food chain. Now give me some Resilience

This was the point in WoW where they introduced Resilience. Big numbers are so important, that even with max toughness, you can’t absorb a burst class. When burst can beat a “tank” in 2-3 steps (that are normally hard to react to in the current WvW setup), you would need something more than toughness/vit to survive, or choose the path of less (boring) resistance, dps first in first out and pray you’re the winner.

Resilience (less crit chance and less crit damage for attackers) at that time was the answer, let see what Anet will do to try and bring balance to both side.

For Knight/Rabid, it truly depends how much you need that toughness stat.

I currently run Rabid armor, Rampager trinkets and weapons, but I use Scepter/dagger- Axe/focus.

It’s one of the best dps setup I’ve done for taking out camps/dolyaks solo, things melt and you got the burst on demand with the axe, DS also hits for a lot more and it feels more useful than just a buffer.

If you feel too squishy, then Knight coud replace rampager, but you would lose out a lot of condition damage.

You can mix/match different gears easily on that site : http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/ and see for yourself what stats you could achieve with that setup.

I was wondering why it was hitting for not that much even with 3 boons. Thanks for the find, I’m gonna replace that trait for something else for now.

Nothing against Yishis(thief in that video), he seems like a very good player that knows a lot about others classes too.

But I can’t get the smile off my face when you hear him say in a calm tone: I got a lot of pressure (4v1) so I have to shadowstep, I managed to down one thief, 2 thief, warrior, my stealth regen heals more than 6 stacks of bleed (granted it’s not by a heavy condition player) and it goes on. It’s world apart vs our ability to even react to those threats.

I mean come on, while not all thiefs plays like him, we can’t manage to win fights as an Attrition class against four peoples. The fight would be: I encountered 4 guys so I waypoint.. Oh wait, in combat already… I have a lot of pressure so I DS… DS down, still a lot of pressure I try to use my fear(s).. Autostability from warrior or Interrupt or you name it… Knockdown, Feared from thiefs twice for thrice as long, Knockdown, Downed.. Gonna fear, oh wait they have Stability…

There is no attrition right now in WvW with our class. I still play it and love it under certains circumstances, but it’s in no way an attrition class. On my mesmer if my first burst doesn’t down the target, I can still survive vs many opponents long enough to try it again two or three times (12-15 seconds cooldowns between each tries) while still applying a lot of pressure with good DD. And if the task seems too big, I can even try to run away and I normally am able to.

In tPvp I can understand the settings are different, but they could up the bar a bit in the WvW world to ensure we have more ways to react/survive to those type of encounters.

And anyone knows right now that true speed/mobility is not swiftness, it’s the leap/charge/teleport that lots of classes are having, on low cooldown. Swiftness is the bare minimum if you want to even start to compete.

Keeping access to our spells/utilities/weapons skills could be interesting, now DS would give you a “real” second hp bar. Even without buffing anything it would be cool

They’re working on DS UI, just been able to use/see our utilities would be a nice welcomed change.

I’ve tested it in my lunch break, definitely 50 sec, on summoning and on charge. Did exactly as Bellamy suggested, switching elite to bring him on cooldown and cast it again after cooldown was down.

I’ve just gained 10 sec on something that I love, thanks Phoebe to made me test it again with more depth

The only info I trust is info I’ve tested I play with Lyssa for 2+ months now, been testing it myself and I always have my Fleshy with me. Wiki is unfortunately not a precise source of real game value. (Just watch how many debates over Cast time/DPS and such, taken from the Wiki, while in-game value is much different.)

Golem doesn’t trigger it with 48 sec cooldown, nor by charging right after summoning, that’s for sure (and it would be OP hehe). I’ll try at the 50-51 sec mark, but from my tests in WvW/PvE, it was 60 (same as untraited elite).

If he dies too quickly after been summoned (we’re talking 1-5 sec), you won’t receive the buffs when summoning him again after a 48 sec recharge, so I doubt 50 seconds applies for the golem. Gonna test it at lunch break and bring back numbers for PvE/WvW.

Offtopic a lot, but for all those non believers of the DS bug (skill lock and DS not on cooldown), you can see it happening at 3:00 in Bas’s video.

He falls to 0 Lifeforce, skill appears lock for ,25 sec, and at 3:06 or :08, he could have jumped back in DS if he had more lifeforce while normally he should only be able to at 3:10.

On topic, nice build and nice numbers

Make him destroy anything in his path, literally. See that hill? Boom! See that bush? Boom! See that obscuring invisible bump on the road that shouldn’t prevent your hulking charging body to reach his target? BOOOOM!

Now that would be a golem’s charge

Nice idea all around though, it’s one of my favourite elite, just wish he was more sensitive to me been beaten to death while he watches a butterfly or kills a kitten.

If you trait for shorter minions cooldown, and your golem dies right away, you wont receives the buff after 48 sec, only after 60.

Same for charge, it seems there’s a 60 sec cooldown on the rune’s ability. Pretty easy to test, charge right after summoning, cooldown is 40 sec for charge, it won’t trigger if you charge after 40, nor 48, but it will trigger after 60.

It’s still a nice ability, our healing minion is 16 sec cooldown traited, and it also proc on each application (summoning and sacrifice, 10 sec between each) and with the elite, one of our free stomp/rez with stability if you time it right.

I normally keep my golem away until I need the stability and/or charge.

Wouldn’t it be the jagged horror dying under your weight?

Edit: NVM I posted it at the same time as your video.

(TLDR: I can kill with my MELEE necro in WvW, but I can do it better, faster, with less trouble on other classes)

To further add to Rennoko’s issues, you take a look at that thief’s stats at the end (3k attack, 44% crit, XX+ crit damage) and copy-paste them on your necro (which is pretty easy to achieve).

You’ll never see those numbers on a target, even with dagger, much less without cleave. Part of it is, you dont have gapcloser, or you’re knockdown/CC to hell and can’t follow your target to deal it . It seems we CAN be melee (and deal good damage on an AFK/PVE target), but we lack melee options to stick to it.

It seems we pay a large price in power scaling for the “utility” our weapons brings (aka Lifeforce building or Vulnerability stacking) where others classes does not.

I just wish they could put the finger on what’s the reason that makes us lose that much scaling, so that we can start competing in the power department.(I know, I know, we got Deathshroud )

Right now in WvW, my fresh berserker mesmer and my cleric guardian can both melee everything around their targets for thousands and still get away with it pretty much unscathed, on pretty low cooldown to boot.

I solo camps with all 3, but if the NPC gets some help from players, the only one staying and dying is my necro, which is a shame because I’m in love with the little ugly guy, I really am.

About the hardware issue for locking bars after exiting DS, just go in WvW, get slammed by a veteran guarding a flag while in DS, and watch yourself get kicked out of the form, bars locked for 1 seconds, and DS NOT on cooldown.

This is easy to reproduce, and is definitely not hardware related. Doesn’t happen every times I get CC, but enough to notice it and it’s an annoyance.

I can still rez in DS (in WvW, not tested in sPVP), didn’t notice I couldn’t change weapons though. I do remember the icons “switching”, but can’t remember if the weapon switch really occured.

If only they could normalize damage in DS without needing a staff to max it, it would at least remove one problem with needing to swap in the first place (and would promote others weapons combos for DS) . For sigils, it’s another matter.

While I agree that it wasn’t the best showcase of this interpretation, an undocumented change (even if I’m only finding this “change” after 800 hours and it only exists in my head ) can still be considered a Easter Egg (again, for me only), per a link in the same wiki you linked:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Undocumented_feature

But thanks for the read, there was some easter egg that I didn’t know about in there!

Hahaha sorry then, I’ve never noticed it hitting all targets with Direct damage and Bleeding around mine and I’m 800 hours into this character… Daily aquatic forces me to go underwater more than I ever had to i guess !

Ah well at least it’s my Easter egg I’ll cherish it a little more!

Hey all!

New patch notes are once again incomplete for us, but it’s good news I bring!

I was able to test Trident between 2 server crashes, and it’s now noted:

“Bleed foes around your target” and it’s working Hope to find some other Easter egg, post them here if you find them!

Happy water hunting! Kraits here I come!

Some traits for others classes (engi/mesmer comes to mind) boosts range/reduces cooldown of both water and underwater weapons at the same time.

Some minor and major traits even reduces cooldown and gives a freebie, while we pay premium just to reduces cooldown. We certainly could get a bit more love on the “fancy and attractive” trait department, and even more kudos if that would make water combat more exciting!

This option still shouldn’t exist in my opinion on most WvW borderlands/EB. So many times I’ve been asked to stop killing “friends”, while servers transfers were still free… Please hop on the same server if you want to play together.

It’s also easy to play the spy game, of course you can do the same on any voice chat outside the game, but the game shouldn’t be promoting this kind of behavior.

I just hope they will include a Arena/BG style that will promote duelling from same/different servers, so that WvW stays a WvW place where peoples hop on to fight others servers.

I understand right now that this “option” or bug gives some peoples a way to chill out together in some nice duels between servers, and that there’s no other substitute right now for this kind of entertainment, but I hope it’s not gonna stay that way forever.

Yeah the cliff doesn’t always follow you though I would love to have an elite that creates one on demand.

@Rennoko: Gotta say I agree with a lot of your posts on the forum, pretty similar ideas, maybe you’re me when I’m sleeping!!!

800 hours on my necro, still loves the class, kick kitten in PvE, dungeons and WvW and solo camps/any vets i come across. I feel like a boss when trying to defend or take tower/keep, staff is a nice weapon to have to reach peoples on siege. I still find a lack of options with escape plans though.

Started a mesmer for the heck of it, powerleveled it with crafting, started WvW with low gear, no real combat experience and a shatter spec (Osicat) that I found in their forum. I’m wrecking anything I see, and if it seems too hard to chew, I got a plethora of evasive options and I’m long gone. And this is in berserker gear. My necro must be PVT or Rabid to even compete with her survivability.

The mostly instant cast portion of a mesmer is crazy compared to the slow paced fighting of the necro.

I still love the tankiness of my necro in 1v3 and dungeons, and his 25% movement speed with the signet, but in combat, my mesmer mobility and options are monsters compared to him. You can use the same skill to chase down, or escape.

I feel I can better improve as a player with my mesmer, just because of the quick thinking (and actions) involved in her survival and burst. You really push it to the limit.

Still loves my necro in groups or if I feel brave enough to roam alone, but right now other classes seems to perform better with easier learning curves and much more forgiving abilities.

I presume you were in World vs World. If so, just run to a friendly encampment while evading him the best you can by crippling/chilling him with AoE. Use plague to run away.

Because of rendering/culling issue, you won’t see him coming even with all that camera panning, and you will only see him ,5 second at a time, and Tabbing will not work because your system doesn’t know he’s there yet. I wish I could Fraps my 2v1 against a almost perma-stealth thief, it’s not even funny and the trend’s growing.

AoE without targets are key against this, Axe 3, Staff marks, Pain inverter. If you manage to target him in that .5 second, channeling skills (axe 2 dagger 2) continues to hit while stealthed.

It is right now the most annoying class to play against in WvW when roaming, but not because the class is OP (when you can see him he normally goes down), just because of visual and targeting issues that WvW brings with stealth mechanics.

In normal PvP with no issue those guys wouldn’t even get past us, yet in WvW they’re clearly exploiting a well know issue with stealth. Only luck at this point can help you, not really a skill issue so stay near towers/camp

Good luck on your travels!

0/0/25/15/0 is the base of his build. After that, you can compensate on whatever you want. If you feel like the 150 power from Spite would be better invested in Curses for the Crit + DS Fury, go ahead.

It’s all a matter of choice. I prefer the 30 spite for 20% more damage under 50%, some will prefer the free protection at 50% from Soul Reaping.

Your full PVT gear will make you very hard to take down even with 0 traits invested. At only 3s the trait’ change, test it to your heart’ content!

As for Retaliation build, the best way, without Asura racial, would be to use Well of blood, Axe #3, Putrid Explosion x2 and Putrid mark, then DS (heal and DS traited for Retal, wells for cooldowns). If you have more than 1 target, you’ll be perma-retaliation for 30+ sec, until your heal comes back up.

I also use them in WvW when going solo for camp/dolyak, along with 6x Rune of Lyssa, PVT gear, trinket with Emerald and berzerker weapons. Using Locust signet, I switch it for Wurm near camp, and if i dont need the teleport, I switch back to signet after combat so I dont suffer the cooldown.

We have a 16 sec heal that gives us a random boon for 10 sec, and a 48 sec elite that remove all condition and gives us all boons (still has a 60 sec internal cooldown for the charge though). I find that for full usage of Lyssa this is one of the best build.

They are not the best choice, dont attack/sucks at time (bone minions staying far away from target), but like Bas said, a well user on cooldown is only a necro and his weapons. With low cooldowns, minions will be back up in no time. 2 bones minions each 16 seconds do far more dps (if they connect) that a well of suffering each 36 sec (which they have to stay in full duration to provide similar damage/debuff)

It can also be confusing for the enemy to see all those red names and trying to find exactly how many of your force there is stealing their camp.

I use a 20/0/20/30 build and I can quickly switch to a dungeon well build if needed, less money wasted on respec

Yeah, try the same run in full rabid or full Soldier hehe (Because I think Toughness is a culprit here). It’s not really a “Down” problem for me though, I’m normally the group leader so I prefer having the boss on me all the time while other rez because they missed an evade. I can take a lot of punishment in soldier gear + well protection traits and regen.

Just today, I’ve almost soloed Kholer while playing with 4 new players that couldn’t dodge. For all the fight, he was on me non-stop, the only thing hitting them was the rope and spin. Of course been unable to dodge a lot (and you need to save one for the rope) means you have to take it all in the face, which gratefully we can.

I understand that’s it not for everyone though, and it’s not written in the manual that tanking privileges are granted on this class.

Normally when we try to blind date him with the troll, both need to stomp me first, then they duke it out

As for minimum time for aggro, when peoples (we’re talking more than 10-20 here at Plinx) rally you non-stop and just spam their best attack while shouting: “Run Razdhul Run lol!” while you don’t even attack and just kite him for the whole fight (which lasts forever), something is definitely fishy. I’m even getting whispers to be the bait when event pops up.

Like I said before, business is rough for a necro in Zaithan’s territory. There can be only one!

I’m thinking of setting up my treadmill in my computer room and run at the same time as my necro, I’ll be the most fit guy in the whole gaming community

The champion risen abomination at the end of the Plink chain is a necro killer. Maybe it’s Zaithan ways of dealing with competition.

Retreating, not attacking, backing off, dying, etc does not reset his aggro table. He’ll be back on me as soon as he hears my footsteps. He even does his new nice ramming attack trying to hit me behind the walls when I waypoint after dying.

Not one of my other 80 is an aggro magnet like my necro is. Dungeons feels the same, but normally you can kite all the way while they cripple/dps him, but it’s my role in guild group now. Run Lola Run!

Are their abilities affected by your crit chance though? I remember them critting, just dont know if they crit at 4% (base at 80) or at my crit chance.

As stated before, Reaper’s protection and Shrouded removal helps a lot against this.

15 points in Soul Reaping for the free protection at 50% helps reduce the burst.

While I agree that thieves are a pain for us necro (mostly due to culling though, not for the fact that they’re unkillable) and that’s it silly for them to have a stronger fear than us, you can help your team better by choosing Wurm, Spectral walk or Shrouded removal and make the thief fight you a little longer or waste his cooldowns on you.

Who knows, those 3-4 seconds you’re gaining may means his death instead of yours. And a precast wurm can confuse the thief, you still teleport in it’s direction even if it’s way out of range.

And if you’re lucky and you’re an asura necro, Pain Inverter is a beast against those spamming thieves. Just watch them melt around you without even targeting him.

Good luck in your travels!

Lich hits like a beast in a power setup (you also gain a lot of crit when you transform) Normally you don’t even need to bother with anything except spamming #1 on your target.

However like any transform skill, you lose access to all you utilities/DS (and lose minions if you had any), which can be subpar depending on the situation.

I roam a lot in WvW and I prefer Golem for it’s situational knockdown and get-away option.

Wouldn’t Lyssa be better than Mad king in this scenario? Lyssa gives precision instead of power, and also cost less than Mad king now on the trade post.

Lyssa can also be obtain with karma gear.

I agree with most of Softspoken’s post, very good ideas.

Better UI is a no-brainer, it’s not a downed state anymore.

Vampiric/Regen should affect us even in DS (Health or Lifeforce, let’s not waste core trait choice because I’m in DS)

Remove the life force degen completely, I think it’s an outdated mechanic. Lifeblast could consume it though, which leads to my next point:

Make it so that the weapon I’m holding doesn’t affect the damage output of DS. (Right now you have to use a staff for max Lifeblast hits. If you run any other weapons you’re reducing your damage by a lot.)

There’s not many professions that are hindered by their special moves. I would love people to fear me when I pop DS, and for it to be useful whatever the build I chose. I support the idea of having acces to our skills while in DS, even if balance/rework on some of them would be needed.

You can get Rabid glove/head/shoulder/leg + Rings/Amulet/Back/Acc from Karma vendors in Orr:

http://dulfy.net/2012/09/08/gw2-templegod-karma-armor-sets/
http://dulfy.net/2013/01/28/gw2-new-orr-temple-exotics/

You can also get all armor + weapons from dungeons: TA, SE, etc

The other choice is from the Trade post. Khilbron armor is equal to Rabid.

If you have the karma, focus on getting your weapons from dungeons first.

Corrosive unfortunately doesn’t provide a good debuff, people normally evades it quickly so the full duration is never reached. Scepter and staff provides better AoE poison and Weakness at shorter cooldown (spreading it to even more people with Epidemic) , so you can slot another utility instead.

For full condition, Rabid is your best choice. I would avoid traits in Spite except if you want full condition duration.

If you want an hybrid, Rampager is a beast (and I think one of the best choice for a necro in PvE) as long as you know what you’re doing, when to dodge, etc. Your trait choice seems more hybrid, so Rampager may suits you better.

Corrosive cloud could be changed too, you can have access to AoE poison and vulnerability with your weapons, so your utility could be changed to something different. Signet of the locust for faster movement instead of Signet of Spite, and Well of suffering instead of Corrosive would be better choices IMO.

You tag them with AoE Staff/ scepter, spread with epidemic, drop Well, DS #4 and normally everyone’s dead.

Good luck with your build!

Yeah sorry about the confusion, english is not my first language so my point doesn’t come across as smoothly I just wish projectile origin were normalized and not different depending on size/race. Lich is effectively the same size for each race, if the projectile could be normalized we would be able to hit anything in front of us instead of having to dodge back to hit.

Thanks for the precision for Rituals, thought Darkness would still heal if no enemies were in it.

I wish it was true, but unfortunately some skills works better on a big norn than on my asura.

For example my norn can hit veteran archer on tower’s wall, but my small necro, on the same spot, get the obstructed message because of the starting point/angle of the projectile.

I think you’re right about hitbox in melee, but projectile have a existence of their own, and if it doesn’t pass through/near you, it doesn’t hit you.

Yeah, Rituals heals you whenever a well pulses, even if no enemies are in it (so Darkness and Power can be used too.)

Vampiric itself heals you anytime your skills (so each well’ ticks) hit someone.

I would trade that DS refilling with a teleport or target break anytime hehe!

I can’t say it’s useless, but unless you’re near a safe spot (keep/legendary guard/friends) you’re one dead necro, DS won’t make it long enough against 3+ opponents, and you’re still vulnerable to cripple, knockback etc. I can run far with 3-4 on my back, but I can’t outrun them by any means. But they can outrun me if things goes wrong for them. I really thinks that’s were it hurt the most.

I have great success with my necro, and I’ve tried many builds, but my success lately mostly come from the fact that I know what I can’t do. Contrary to my others classes (mesmer, guardian, ele, even engi) who can normally run away from a fight they don’t like, or have invulnerability or target break, when on my necro, I accept the fact I’m done for if I overextend.

You can do those exploration mode with a full group of 35, no need to be carried by 80.

Of course you’ll die, wipe, spawn, run back, quit in frustration or kick some noob, but then again that’s what’s fun about dungeons when you do them for the first times. If you can bring good lvl 35 players with you, with voice chat, you’re in even better shape that I was

Swiftness in combat is not the same as getting away hehe. Now almost every class I see in WvW got this little Boot icon printed as a stat with no downtime.

Me and my warrior friend chased a warrior with perma swiftness and condition removal (always removed the cripple/chill with it), with his leap and whirl we couldn’t even catch the bugger until we’ve run half the borderland and he got cornered with his removals on cooldown. I can understand a thief, ele, mesmer having that kind of mobility/escape plan, but a warrior…

Our perma-swiftness tricks only brings us on par with those speed runner, but without leap/ teleport on demand, we can’t compete on the chase/escape department.

Andele did you notice the same effect though: You’re been CC and then kicked out of DS with DS not on cooldown? That seems to trigger the skill lock, since the patch “something” kicks us out of DS.