Guild Wars 2

I based my build with the things I learned from Nemesis’s hybrid, however I left the Celestial trinket alone for better survivability. Ascended Cavalier Trinker gives you 10% more damage reduction, while focusing on the damage stats that are important for your primary source of damage, Power and Crit %.

You need giver’s weapon for the 100% condition duration, you don’t take Hemophilia and can get another trait instead (and it’s 100% to ALL conditions, so you benefit more longer from Target the weak)

I use it in WvW a lot, and the duration does help you get kills. Normally in WvW you won’t get to 25 stacks anyway, except for a well placed epidemic to double them up on someone. Duration is even more useful for poison, chill, weakness, fear, etc.

Here’s my build if you want to compare. I use a dagger/focus and staff instead in WvW, in dungeon scepter/dagger can replace staff, and if you prefer axe to dagger or need a little range, keep them all in your bag anyway you’ll need them.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|8.1m.h16.d.1o.h4|6.1m.h16|1o.7i.1o.7i.1o.7g.1o.7g.1o.a7.1o.a7|21n.0.3v.0.2v.0.2v.0.3v.0.2s.0|u67c.u65c.a2.0.0|30.1|3r.4d.3x.3u.4f|e

I switch weapons and utilities a lot, in WvW I prefer SWalk, Epi and Corrupt Boon. Same for elites, depending on what you need.

This PvE builder is a lot of fun to compare and try different combination to attain the numbers you’re aiming for.

Make cast time like in water combat and problem’s solved

The only good thing I find with long cast time is people normally dodge too quickly and still get hit after the dodge, like focus #5. My mesmer can cripple and immobilise quickly, instant cast and a double leap, while my necro takes a second to land ir. Our brain may be rotting and we don’t know it yet hence the slower cast.

You kind of learn to deal with it as time goes by, but it makes for a slower, easy to interrupt type of play.

Power/vit/toughness can be a good choice for karma gear for starter. The other Temple set aren’t that great for a MM. Cavalier trinkets from Balthazar temple are good too if you want more burst, and can be used too in others builds.

Later on you’ll be able to upgrade to whatever suits you, and still keep the PVT to try some “tanky” build like the juggermancer.

If you don’t bother with rare and exotic difference, there’s berserker gear in WvW for more than half the price of the Temple Exotic ones.

I wouldn’t say the weakest, Engineer, warrior and ranger are in the same boat as us, a single target “CC” that doesn’t affect people with stability. Guardian have it AoE, but Stability still wont stop them from stomping. Ele, thief and mesmer are in top, just because they can target drop the stomper, so they can evade Tiny Stomp, Mist stomp, Stealth stomp and any Stability stomp all together.

Our death nova should act as a Well of corruption, no more stability stomp for you sir!

I got some movies going, and I’ll try to show how dying before been able to even cast #2 sometimes is not helping my group, while on my other professions a single killshot will only remove a small chunk of my downed health and I’ll still be able to be rezzed.

If you have WvW badges, you can also buy a exotic rabid staff for 1g + badges. Go check the Badge Weapon Vendor in any Borderland.

You can also buy a rare one for karma if you can’t find a exotic one in the meantime. The stats are still close until you can upgrade.

The bug is still there, that when you get CC, you get kicked out of DS even with full lifeforce, DS is on cooldown, and your skills are lock for 1 sec.

Stability may work, I’ll give it a try. A real fix would be better though.

You normally can’t rally with life leech alone in WvW, even if you down someone exactly at the same time, they will kill you because of health difference. Now 1-2 more sec don’t seems to make more difference, but I can’t tell you the numbers of time I was that close to rally because of someone dying, and instead of been stomped I’m pummeled to death in seconds. A warrior using his Vengeance skill can literally down you, and finish you with a couple hits and rally, no stomping needed.

I would love to see this fix sooner than later.

In WvW it’s even more of an issue, I’m never getting stomped, 3+ peoples hitting me means death in 1-2 seconds, sometimes instantly, when I play on my other professions my friends can help and even rez me.

I’ll bump the bug thread each day to make sure it’s visible.

So if we must just ignore these “SUPER” build, what happens when every player on the server will play those?

If one ranger, thief or ele is not worth the time, imagine a group of them, hell a zerg of them. The answer will still be to run away from it? Builds like these becomes popular quickly in WvW, and for a reason: They’re borderline OP (Most peoples love the feeling of been OP, even more in a game, while necro are the opposite, we’re masochist). If there’s no answer to it, a fix is needed.

I think that every class should have a least a chance to beat them, equal skill and all that.

Monday morning’ bump to first page, I love showing off my Tier 3 Asura Robotic Arm in WvW , but hate been a liability to my group when downed!!!

Truth is, I sometime wonders if our spell weren’t tone down in animation and execution at some point.

Just look at those Orr Necro, with multiple Bites animation, TA with those killer scepter moves, Traeherne with his multiple summoning and greatsword wielding skills, Fractal boss with hammer and marks

I wouldn’t even mind a damage nerf to compensate for cool animation that brings fear into the heart of our enemies, even if it’s mostly psychological damage hehe. Wasting a dodge because it looks threatening would be great!

Yeah Mark of blood as is I can deal with it, non damaging effect could reapply though, like Regen. Just the chill of Chillblain etc. Reaper’s Mark would maybe be a little too OP if it reapplies constant fear, although peoples would need those stun breaker and evade at the right time, which frankly right now I dont think anyone need stunbreaker against us, it doesn’t do anything against our Immobilize/well bomb combo anyway.

Scepter #2 could be like the one in TA though, where it reapplies one bleed/cripple each sec. Peoples would actually need to get out of the zone. If I cast it at my feet, it would be acting as an offensive/defensive zone.

Limitations would be needed I can’t argue, it would be easy to go over the top.

Have you noticed if your level was way lower than the jellyfish? I’ve encountered some zones where, for example, I was 17, and a wurm was 25. It was literally a raid boss against 6 of us. Just 600 yard to the east and we were back up to lvl 27 and it was a piece of cake.

Do any of you think it would be a good idea if certain triggered marks/scepter effect would stay longer on the ground, even if a trait choice is needed?

If the first runner of a zerg triggers your mark of blood/Chillbains, he’s the only one getting the effect. Instead of chilling 5 peoples, you only get the first one. So instead of using it as trap to be effective, you gotta stay in range and drop it on top for maximum effectivness.

A spell like those necro in TA, where Scepter #2 sticks on the ground for 5 sec, reapplying bleed and cripple to anyone in the area, is a fun ability and is devastating if you stay in it. Chillbain, instead of just a poison field, could stay 3-5 sec as a Ice field to chill people going through it. People would need to actually evade marks, right now they just trigger them( or even evade-trigger them, which waste all the mark’ AoE potential), run through and cleanse.

Been watching the ele video, and IMO what makes them better for AoE against zerg is the fact that it sticks for a while, really denying a place.

It is not to replace Wells, but to add even more Area Denial in a spec where wells are not really used.

I think the staff/scepter as a whole would bring more meaningful area denial.

Food for thoughts?

I don’t really like this, but you can invite peoples from other servers to your party even in WvW, so emotes aren’t even needed anymore. You can just type “Ready?” in party chat now, I would prefer the Dark Souls style too

Somebody tested it a while ago, and it’s seemed to work FIFO, First In First Out. They tested it with Blood is Power (2x 30 sec bleed) and 3 Ele doing Churning Earth to add 24 bleed, then one auto attack to bring it to 25. The 2x 30 sec bleed got overwriten as the 25 stacks only lasted Churning earth duration.

Normally you won’t be able to maintain 25 stacks by yourself (except with scepter and condition duration) so you shouldn’t worry. But the biggest problem lies in a group, where others smaller bleed like warrior’s crit can overwrite a full one minute bleed like Blood is Power.

Bump because I love playing my necro in WvW, but hate when I get almost instagibbed when downed.

The 26 second of stability comes from 30% boon duration ou your character (be it from traits or rune etc). The transformation grants you stability, and the transformation is supposed to last 20 sec. When it wears off, you lose the stability, no matter how many time was left on the buff.

It’s the same for all the others tranform skills that grant stability, like ele tornado, necro lich/plague form, engi Elixir.

This is his build:

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|7.1g.0.d.1g.0|b.1m.0.8.1o.0|1o.7i.1o.7i.1o.7g.1o.7g.1o.a3.1o.a3|211.0.211.0.311.0.211.0.311.0.2s.0|u000.u000.0.0.a0|30.1|3r.4a.3x.3w.4f|e

I’ve added food buff and modify runes so that you have 100% condition duration.

Maybe necro could learn to master Genki Dama, using the lifeforce in all living things instead of stealing only from the deads around them. Staying Immobile could make you gain some at a fixed rate.

Look at Nemesis’s Hybrid Build in the tutorials, pretty much one of the best hybrid build.

I’ve tweaked it a bit for WvW, gained more toughness (10% more damage reduction) and keeping almost the same stats.

I agree with you that Hybrid is pretty much the way to go, it’s one of the playstyle I always come back to.

Our Signet of Undeath passive could instead replace the jagged horror trait. Wouldn’t be lifechanger, but gaining 1% Lifeforce/sec in combat would still be something good and we would get rid of that mandatory useless trait.

I dont think he’s having problem with the Necro trainer in itself, just that the raw damage he puts out is godly and that even with Berserker gear Necros can’t achieve those in the mist

Let’s ask around to see the necro’ trainer build and reproduce his behavior/stats to see if it feasible!

I don’t see anywhere where he talks about burst. If you know the guy, he prefers a substain damage playstyle with high power build, not crit oriented. He made lots of testing for the community with his Juggermancer build, so I trust he knows what he is missing by not picking Furious Demise. Just look at his utilities, this build seems more to annoy than destroy the opposition in 3 crits.

By the way, welcome back Sheobix, hope you’re not too rusty

Gear Progression: It’s almost like an addiction, you dont know why you’re doing it, but it feels fun when you do it. When you understand that it’s only a carrot on a stick, to normally make you pay a sub too and keep you addict to that feeling a bit longer, you try to get over it and find the real reason you’re playing the game.

In all those other games, they could have kept the same stats, just add more challenges/dungeons/raids. They didn’t, to make you feel more powerful (and keep you paying), yet they boost the enemy too so it’s all the same in the end.

Now I’m playing this game, no sub fee, no pressure, just for the Fun of it. Real Fun, not an addictive type. Now my fun may not be the fun of all, but make sure you really have fun playing and not chasing a carrot that surely doesn’t even taste that good.

Just my 2 cents

They’re smaller, LoS is feet to feet, they can’t see the feet of their target so they panic. Guess sometimes they can’t see their own feet too, so they double panic.

A small bandaid that I would take, if not for the laugh: When they enter Panic mode, they jump to see if there’s a feet near, if they see one, they charge it and explode. We could all have small bouncing undead kangourous instead of squirrels!!

If they could just normalise the damage done in DS regardless of the weapon you have in hand, I would be happy.

I hate dealing less damage because I don’t have a staff in hand when I use DS, and depending on the weapon it can be way less damage.

I didnt want to feed the thief troll, until I saw the loot bags thingy … On my 4 80’s, the lowest ratio of bag per kills was on my condition necro. Something to do with no doing enough damage to tag or conditions didn’t register the kill as mine, who knows.

I have 800 hours on my necro, took me months to gather 500 for the Legendary gift (and I’ve leveled from 40 to 80 in WvW). On my mesmer, engi and guardian, each with less than 100 hours play, they drop like crazy and I’m now at 1500 without even trying.

I gather so much stuff on my fresh 80 engi it’s not even funny to compare.

Power trumps condition so much in WvW right now that the scenario you describe normally ends with the primary target getting downed before the 1 sec cast time is done. So gratz you just epidemic’ed a downed enemy with 0 condition. With a 30 sec cooldown I think the skill would just disappear from the utility bar. Before the patch, when we could epidemic through walls/dodge/block etc, I agree it was really good, borderline OP in certains scenarios.

You seem to be envious of our AoE supremacy, but hey, we gotta have something too. I would love to have your single target dps and mobility too! (Must… not… dont feed it arrrggghh!!!)

It’s also not about bleed applications, but cast time. Almost everything a necro does seems slow and wonky compared to all the instant cast a mesmer/almost any class got. You almost send a telegraph seeing “Watch this in 3/4-1 seconds!” And then the skill takes another second to land. You will notice you’ll get interrupted a lot more easily on the necro. This will be the biggest difference between those 2 professions.

I think I remember reading somewhere that they were looking into solutions for that problem.

They could just translate a portion of our condition into power when we strike objects
(so no DoTs applied, just boosted Direct Damage), or even better, normalize every hit against said object.

Saying to choose a power build if it doesn’t fit your play style and that this mechanic is fair is a bit… counter-productive to the game’s mentality, where you should be able to play the way you want. Right now I don’t think anybody can deny that the game favor Power over Condition by a large margin. Yet necro is far from the best Power class, just with the lack of a cleave mechanic we quickly fall behind, even more against objects close together.

Yet it still doesn’t work all the time. There are countless videos showing the exact opposite, you spam 1, be it with dagger, axe, etc, and the minions stares at your healthbar while you take a beating (except the ranged ones who normally are right on target and even switch when you do.)

I don’t know how many time my bone minions attack one at a time, and the one I blow up is the one who was by my side in idle mode. It is a issue.

Also careful when testing in HotM, it’s far from the truth about how things works in PvE/WvW. Just look at our other thread about downed health in PvE vs PvP. There does seem to be a lot of differences in coding for both worlds.

LOS does have an effect on it, please just go try it on the arch near Greenwater. You stand near the flag guard, cast it on the top of the arch, and if you dont look at it, you will port directly under it. While you’re not looking at it, the Red Bar for Out of range is active, and when looking at it, the red bar is removed and you teleport on the archway. I’ve tested this numerous time while waiting for dolyaks/roamers to kill.

The spell will still work even if you dont see it, but you won’t move up or down, only in the direction the wurm is.

You also need to have vision (literaly, you need to see it in your screen) for Y-axis teleport.

I’ve tested it a lot on my preferred playground, the archway north of Greenwater Lowlands. You can put it on top, watch your skill bar (if it’s the red indicator for out of range it normally doesn’t work) and look at the wurm. You’ll be teleported up correctly. If you stand at the same spot but look down, you’ll teleport under the archway instead.

Spectral attunement is good for lifeforce regen, but then you’re stuck in a -/20/-/-/30 build just to make sure you always have enough lifeforce for stability, and use spectrals skills x3, which is not that common. So saying that we can use stability every 10 sec under pressure is not really realistic.

We dont really need a 90 sec cooldown on those though. The real problem seems to lie in the cost of gaining lifeforce against other buff. We seem to pay the big price + a tax just for skills that grants us lifeforce. 6 sec of (self) protection can’t justify a 60 sec cooldown, nor a stun break. So the overcosted ability here is our lifeforce gain. Yet our lifeforce doesn’t even compete with a 3 sec block, invulnerability etc, which are also on short cooldown on many professions.

Even spectral walk would be better with a shorter cooldown/shorter swiftness, just to be able to use it special effect more. Every time I hit it only for swiftness, I feel like I lost an opportunity in the next 48 sec(traited) to escape from a bad situation.

I know we can’t ask for a normalised cost (in cooldowns) for all boon on all professions because of synergy (and also keep a unique feel to professions), but the math behind ours could be revised to be lower than it is right now.

You can only use this 3sec/10 sec cooldown with a minimum of lifeforce. Normally when things goes sour and you try to use your Lifeforce to soak bursts, you are out of lifeforce and can’t go back to receive stability even if DS is no longer on cooldown.

I agree that block and vigor would be way better, but right now if we dont have another class to grant us stability, we’re the best profession that emulates a ping pong ball on the field. (also the fact that knockdown is way better than a 1-2 sec fear just adds salt to the wound.)

All that testing seems to concur my first thought: We had DS as a buffer between death, so our down state health was lower to compensate for the “double” downed state.

Now that DS is no longer a death effect, our health was not buffed to compensate.

I can only see this as to why our downed health was so low to begin with. Or it’s a very bad typo from a programmer.

Really nice testing by the way! Kudos to you!

In my opinion it’s possible to control a small territory in WvW as a solo necro against small groups, but not while roaming everywhere around the map. You need preparation to survive, and terrains need to be used to your advantage. We need walls and such to be on the same ground vs others professions.

I’m in love with the archway near Lowlands, you can put the wurm on top, hold the bridge/door a bit, teleport up there when there’s too much pressure, fear one/two that followed you down, jump down and come back up with Spectral Walk. Instead of the roof you can also go inside the walls, not everyone knows how to get there so it’s funny sometimes.

But then again, you’re not roaming, you’re holding a spot that you’ve prepared for encounters with small groups that wants to grab camps by themselves. It’s still fun as hell, but when they call reinforcement you need to find a new playground.

I noticed too that I die pretty fast while downed, but it doesnt seem to be always the case.

Just a thought here, our DS was our old down mechanic, could it still be tied one way or another to how many “life” we get while down? My DS bar is normally empty when I’m down, that’s the only explanation I can see vs another class.

If you can stack 100% fear duration in PvP with runes/spite/trait, the second tick should come even without another condition(of course it seems like a bug right now if you dont see it).

The test Rennoko made at that time was that even with 70-90% fear duration, you could make it tick twice if another condition was on it, because fear doesn’t seems to tick each second of his own duration, instead ticking when the game’ timer for conditions as a whole ticks.

Right now in WvW I get a second tick with 100%, so maybe it’s a pvp only problem.

@Myrmidian: In what type of play (pvp/pve) are you trying to get a second tick?

In PvE/WvW, its easily achieved with Master of Terror, Veggie pizza and 2x Lyssa or 2x Mad king.

In PvP, some tests were made (by Rennoko if I’m not mistaken) that proved you could get a second tick if another condition was already on top and you were lucky in the “Check for damage” part of the conditions.

As for converting conditions, am I the only one that wishes for 25 stack of might changed to 25 bleeding instead of Weakness? Might stacking would be less convenient and way more risky that way.

3-4 sec fear are for thiefs and warriors We keep the small ones for us, short and sweet!

Nothing I love more than corrupting/removing Stability (with Focus #5) on spinning thiefs, tornadoes engi/ele, lich/plague necro etc then chain fear them when they thought they were good to go for a while.

There’s not really a dumb setup when leveling up, luckily

I dont know what level you are, but you wont be able to do this setup until 60 anyway.

If you want survivability, I would start with 10 in blood, with Mark on dodge for even more regen on demand.

Once your 80, you’ll change your setup twice a day, so don’t worry too much about it and have fun!

I think Kravick, like many others, loves the necro to the core, and it result in a big love/hate relationship. I can really relate to his feeling though, and I like having both sides of a coin to the forums instead of just one.

I did the same thing he did, leveled a mesmer, guardian and soon, engi to 80. They all have better mechanics and better access to direct damage (and even conditions in some case) WHILE still having easy access to lifesaver abilities (target drop, stealth, stability, invulnerability), which are normally better in WvW/PvP situation, where you’re not fighting veterans and the guy in front of you melt with the right setup while you’re evading all retribution.

On my solo roaming travels in the Borderlands, I love my necro. I play him mostly hybrid, he’s one of the fastest and easiest solo camp taker I have (Epidemic makes them melt away fast). I can’t deny that. I also love the way we manage boons and conditions, and I like him most when dealing with sieges.

But against other players, my 3 others classes have better options to deal with small opposition and survive, and it has all to do with meta or whatever direction the game is going.

Right now, in my opinion, Direct Damage trumps condition damage by a large margin. Even more if you stack Vulnerability and Might. When I roam with my brother who’s an Static Discharge full berserker engineer, the only thing I (can) do is fear our target and he litteraly down him in 1-2 seconds because of the burst available in WvW (You can’t even compare the damage of a full berserker in sPvP and WvW, it’s insane). Yet, defensive stats doesn’t scale as much.

All my conditions are wasted, dont even have time to stack them and then I wouldn’t even been able to cast Epidemic.

Small roaming group is almost all about burst right now, and necro is far from the top dog in those scenarios, but those scenarios are what small scale groups encounter the most, hence I can understand the lack of “fun” playing that class vs playing another one.

I still get the most fun out of this class, but I can clearly see that other professions are performing better in our own field (the attrition master described by the dev).

Have you tried Terror with that build? I almost play the same setup (0/30/10/10/20) but I aimed for 100% fear and bleed duration instead, with the low cooldown on fear and your good use of DS you could add a good burst. It almost add a free 2k hit within 2 sec.

Also thanks for some play tips I learned while watching. I tend to stay too long in DS and waste precious lifeforce just Lifeblasting away. Using it bit by bit to have better Fury uptime and a free Enfeebling blood is a way better investment.

Plague signet was a novelty too, I’ve never used it after the bug (and supposely bug fix). Tried it yesterday and I like it a lot. Finally a break stun that removes Immobilize!

IT worker here

Well to be the devil’s advocate, if I read your post, been kick at the end, or near the end, is not the same thing.

I don’t mind been kicked after the final boss and the loot is in my bag when you clearly say so, but if you guys would kick me before the end (so no loot/completion etc) for whatever reason you could think of, your lfg post is misleading and will always end in confusion.

I main a necro, and I can assure you Spectral grasp is a joke of a pull. While the cast time is shorter, it’s a slow projectile that can be seen miles away, won’t hit a moving/strafing target, get obtructed/miss a lot and you can outrun it if you run at normal speed in the opposite direction. They dont even have to evade it in most cases. Oh and of course like most pull abilities the target almost never get pulled the full 1200.

Of course it’s a good point blank interrupt, but by no mean the super pull you think we have. Having played with both, I prefer the Magnet pull by far.

33% from scepter is the only one that can bring you up past 100% to 133%.

Edit: typo

Yeah the real point is: Could you do the same as that engineer while playing on your necro, while we are supposely on the same “tier” as an engineer (rock bottom)?

And I’m strictly talking about WvW builds here. Normally on any of my builds, I tend to stay away from 3-4 peoples when roaming solo. A attrition class should be more close to whatever that engi is.

So all in all, you look at Anet description of the class, start one with one style of play in mind, and then learn that others classes are not only able to do it, but do it better.

In PVP, you just roll another character lvl 2, change your setup and tada! In WvW, we’re talking about leveling up and gearing up another character. While it’s not that hard (I already have 3 fully gear 80s and working on a 4th), it still a bit off from their vision of our class.

I dont mind using my necro as something else than an attrition master, but new peoples starting one should be aware that in WvW this type of play is not viable.

And also about Anet’ vision of a necro and it’s real application in the game: Master of Attrition.

Now while this is one of their (supposed) only good build in WvW after the last patch, I would trade all my builds choice for one build that would be able to deal with 3v1 like this while playing full rabid (attrition at his best).

Easy access to boons and Invulnerable state will trump any debuff you can bring on the table (for now because of meta) for attrition playstyle in my opinion.

Just use those setup, try it for yourself and then make your own conclusion. The wiki does not reflect of how good or bad a class is doing.

My biggest issue with necro is the lack of synergy with our class mechanic and traits/weapons and builds.

After playing a bit I assure you you’ll find some good and bad things about necro.