Guild Wars 2

^ Blackbeard is correct about the healing capabilities. The healing traits are bonkers. 2 of the traits combined essentially give you 615 hps (with however much healing he had in the video). Almost 2 healing signets in an adept and master trait, yes please.

Also there is boon duration to consider when thinking about resistance/stability up time. 30% from traits + 15% from traveler runes can mean almost 75% up time of resistance with the #7 ability from the video. I haven’t done the math on stability but ~3.5 seconds of stability from a dodge is pretty crazy.

Geomancy/Earth Sigil will be powerful on revenant also because the bleeds either get buried under all your other conditions better guaranteeing they stick for full damage, or because they can provide cover for all your other conditions and be cleansed without as much consequence as a condition class that stacks bleeds.

Of course, this is only with the information we know and without a doubt things will change a ton. But, with the information we have, I feel revenant is quite powerful.

Beating a turret engineer in a 1v1 is far from an l2p issue in a lot of cases. Turret engi beats tons of builds for free (provided you have half a brain), even a lot of the meta builds with the some of the best players in the game playing them.

The biggest problem with turret engineer is that I think a significant amount of the player base isn’t good enough to justify NOT going turret engi. What I’m saying is that a significant amount of players could role turret engi and perform better than whatever they usually play.

In unorganized environments or when amateur teams don’t know how to deal with them, turret engineers are extremely frustrating for them to fight and that’s not a healthy environment.

These players shouldn’t have to deal with builds like this.

Honestly it’s just time and practice. I remember learning about keybinds in vanilla WoW after watching “pro pvp videos”. I pushed so hard to learn so many keybinds I remember my hands hurting. It pay’s off in the end even though it can be frustrating.

I’ll list my keybinds:
1-5 weapon skills.
` F1
LMSB (Left Mouse Side Button) – F2
RMSB – F3
T – F4
X = Heal
RFV = utilities
Z = Elite
B = About Face
MMB (Middle Mouse Button, clicking the scroll wheel) = Stow Weapon
Shift = Dodge
Left Cntrl = Swap Weapons
G = Call Target
Left Alt = Take Target
Y = Target Nearest Enemy
Tab = Target Next Enemy
C = Interact (Stomp, etc)
Space Bar = Jump
Movement = QWEASD

I think that’s all of em. Tell me if I’m missing anything.

If one team plays pure defense they concede all the supply and heroes. I imagine a team that can freely spawn attacks at the highest possible rate can at the very least chip away at the enemies defended gate.

Maybe this makes for a 15 minute game but the defending team has 0 chance of winning since the attacking team needs only to take down the first gate and then they’ve won once the timer hits.

I think something like a “battle-mage” concept is probably the easiest and most likely but I got a cool idea.

What if torch off hand came with a specialization like “mistweaver”. Since the Revenant seemingly has abilities based on the “mists” then maybe some other classes can see some of that pop up and elementalist is the perfect candidate. Elementalist already has a few abilities/traits based on mist or vapor.

The new specialization would change water attunement into vapor/mist attunement and be mostly based on fire (that’s why the water is now in vapor/mist form)

Heck, each attunement could be sort of based on fire essentially making it a pyromancer of sorts. Air attunement abilities so hot they burn. Earth abilities based on lava/volcanos, extremely intense fire abilities, and the vapor/mist abilities/attunement to replace water attunement like I mentioned.

Sounds cool to me!

Amir.1570:

Phantaram.4816:

It’s not a bug. Not considered by the developers? Sure. But that includes a lot of other stuff in the game too.

People have been using the same exact mechanic since the beginning of the game.

Direct your mad somewhere else and not at the players.

Look at this guy. It just shows Phantaram is fraudulent because he thinks being able to heal 250 every 1/3 second with the stow lightning whip is fair game. That’s his definition of high skill cap folks, even though triple cantrips is already low skill floor low skill cap high reward no matter what you do. BLATANT FRAUD.

Just WOW. If this was league of legends, you would’ve been banned permanently or for a month for using exploits.

Not even the triple chop stow weapon is broken compared to Signet of Restoration + stow lightning whip.

You know so much about me. Please tell me more.

It’s not a bug. Not considered by the developers? Sure. But that includes a lot of other stuff in the game too.

People have been using the same exact mechanic since the beginning of the game.

Direct your mad somewhere else and not at the players.

The Game Slayer.7632:

So interesting you made this video, because, all of this stuff I already naturally did.. But I was never consciously aware of it. Good video!

Yeah that’s why it took me this long to make a video about it. I’m finally figuring out how to articulate what I already do sub-consciously almost.

And yeah Chaith, I’ve been told plenty already. I swear I’ve heard it pronounced “swaydo” somewhere but I’m probably just imagining things lol.

Quick guide on how to play Celestial D/D elementalist. It explains how I think the build boils down to 2 basic rotations that you can do most of the time. Thanks for watching, enjoy!

I personally think D/D does everything way better than staff except for heal/remove condis. Even in that category it is only slightly worse than staff.

The personal survivability of staff ele is actually pretty bad and it’s horrible at 1v1ing while dd ele is a 1v1 god and can escape most 1v2s. You are simply holding your team back if you use staff to be quite honest.

There were some 6v6 gvg (6v6 on graveyard node on legacy) tournaments many months ago and I played staff in that and it was super fun. It’s certainly a good weapon provided you can always be in a large 5 man + group fight or so, which is never in spvp.

Sizer.5632:

Phantaram.4816:

I’ve been using d/f fresh air with great success. Not popular at all but in my opinion it’s the next best build after d/d cele. Like s/f just better. Just started using it about a week ago.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-k3c;2B2kT0-5gNkY0;9;5T9-T;139B5;317AIN0;3Ewk2Ewk25f

Is one with air a mistake or do you actually use that?

Yeah it’s not a mistake. I started using it on scepter when a viewer on my stream told me to try it. I had tried it before but gave it a shot again. Decided it was at least more fun than bolt to the heart and had some potential. On scepter I still think it’s a choice but on dagger I absolutely love it. Helps me run away or get in so nicely.

The super speed only works when you are running forward, which is most of the time with daggers. With scepter there is a lot of strafing so it’s not used as often.

I’ve been using d/f fresh air with great success. Not popular at all but in my opinion it’s the next best build after d/d cele. Like s/f just better. Just started using it about a week ago.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-k3c;2B2kT0-5gNkY0;9;5T9-T;139B5;317AIN0;3Ewk2Ewk25f

BAM. I showed up Zoose. Looks like you put a lot of work into this video. Well done sir.

Elitist.8701:

The thing is, mesmers role is basically +1ing fights because you never really want an even fight with a mesmer… cuz they suck at 2v2s, 3v3s, etc. But even when they +1 fights, they have similar effect to something like a Thief or Necro, but Thief and Necro can do so much more elsewhere as well. Thats just what I think.

-Teef Teef Teef Teef

I think this is accurate. Celestial isn’t whats causing mesmer to be out of the meta. The only roamer build that uses celestial that competes for the roamer slot is cele engi. So it’s a small part of it but there is plenty of other roamer builds/classes I would take over a mesmer that don’t use celestial.

Best on point classes use celestial, but mesmer does not compete for that slot on a team.

This is a very simple way to put it and if the on point classes weren’t celestial it would make mesmer more powerful by alleviating some of it’s problems but that doesn’t alleviate the fact that there are other more powerful roamers you can take.

I’ve been playing zerker Dagger/Focus fresh air in spvp a lot lately and in my opinion it’s the next strongest build for Ele after dd cele in spvp. Stronger than Scepter focus fresh air in my opinion.

0/6/2/0/6
Air: Super speed on air attune, 10% damage in air, fresh air
Earth: 10% damage in melee
Arcane: Vigor, Ele attunement, Evasive Arcana
D/F
Ogre Runes
fire/air sigils
Berserkers amulet

Utilities: Arcane Shield, Lightning Flash, Signet of Air
Elite: Fiery Greatsword.

You could use Mist Form instead of Signet of Air if you’d like. Then you could replace Ogre with Rune of the Pack so you still have good mobility.

It’s completely plausible that people don’t macro and pull off things like jump dodge and stow weapon lightning whip with a very low amount of messing up.

SobeSoul.6910:

How is ele traited for good damage?

All comps historically have had 2-3 people who stand on point for their team. In the past these were fully dedicated bunkers, like bunker guard, beastmaster ranger, or cantrips ele. These builds also took lots of rez utility making kills on each teams dps much rarer because of how many rezes you can get off. These days it’s just 2 cele bunkers on each NA team and EU is catching on to that style of only 2 bunkers.

In the cele meta things that stand on node actually do damage and this quickens the pace of the game by a lot.

The main difference is that when you take these dedicated bunkers its often not a bad idea to take 3 and let your thief/mesmer roam and do all the work. We’ve seen this on EU quite a lot and that is the source of the slow paced games that all time out, not the cele meta. The cele meta encourages the complete opposite.

I’ll say it now though. I personally like their being more damage in the game. Does it restrict what people used to play out of the meta like bunker guard mesmer etc? Yes. Is it too powerful? Yes. But it’s certainly not all bad and it’s something that should be worked around and not deleted.

Cele does need nerfed. The other classes/specs can be brought back. Regardless of how much cele has restricted out of the game, this is still some of the more diverse guildwars we have seen compared to the past although as of the last few weeks we’ve seen more and more of it.

I just came here to clarify one thing and it’s a post from the other thread that got closed. I’m a noob so I dunno how to quote someone from another thread so I’m just copy pasting it.

“Games going to Timer – Because there’s three decaps almost all the time, it’s boring to play and watch. I vastly prefer the super active fights where doing something wrong can spell death, not a slight loss in health. I want people to be making PLAYS, not just trying to stall the game/fights.”

This couldn’t be farther from the truth. I honestly can’t remember the last game on NA, the home of celestial, went to timer. This is EU, aka berserker thief/mesmer meta with 3 bunkers, causing the games to go to time out. Not claiming either is a better style of play just clarifying some misinformation.

Celestial isn’t about bunkering, it’s about high damage everywhere. There are more deaths in this celestial meta than at any point in this games life span.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Auto attacks for both engineer and ele are weak intentionally. They have stated this. They say it is because we have the availability to swap kits/attunements, to have much more access to stronger attacks much more often then the other professions. As this is true. It is reasonable the A A have the limitations they do. Neither profession is intended to camp in one attunement/kit.

More access to stronger attacks is unfortunately not true, at least for ele. And engineer has a strong rifle auto attack but the pistol one is pretty bad. but, engineer has what the dagger weapon set has going for it. A nice feel for constantly using strong abilities. Staff and scepter do not have this feel. You often are just throwing out abilities that literally do almost nothing.

Staff: In general I feel this weapon lacks damage unless you are just throwing your abilities into a big zerg, in which case you can’t miss!

Fire Attunement:

Fire #1 – Fireball – Staff has this problem where all of the auto attacks (except for air) list 1200 range but they can’t be hit reliably without being sub ~800 range. This is one of them. Otherwise, good ability.

Fire #2 – Lava Front – This abilities hard to get anything out of except on crowd controlled opponenets. I remember way back in the betas this did damage as soon as it hit the ground allowing for often 2 hits on even moving targets. I don’t think this would be too crazy right now but if it is then perhaps just decrease the amount of delay it currently has before it does the first tic.

Water Attunement:

Water #1 – Water Blast – This abilities functionality should be completely changed and here is why. Any good elementalist knows that you get in water attunement, do all your healing, and get out as fast as possible. You do this because Healing Ripple and Evasive Arcana occur every time you switch to water, and the faster you get out of water the faster you can do Healing Ripple and Evasive Arcana again the next time water comes up. By spamming Water Blast to heal allies or yourself you are actually doing less healing by delaying the next Healing Ripple and Evasive Arcana and spending your time spamming Water Blast instead of using useful abilities in other attunements. Besides that, it also suffers the same problems as Fire #1 but has even slower speed.

Air Attunement:

Air #2 – Lightning Surge – Doesn’t do much more damage than spamming #1 (and in a lot of cases less damage), has a really long cast time, and your only reward is a blind that will 100% be on some random skill because of the cast time. Needs to be more rewarding to hit.

Air #3 – Gust – Can’t hit moving targets past something like 400 range. The key though is to just un-target and skill shot it. I think that’s fine for skilled players but I’m very sure many people are frustrated by this ability.

Earth Attunement:

Earth #1 – Stoning – Same problem as Fire #1 but multiplied. Weakness is really strong though. Make the damage just a little bit higher and increase the projectile speed by a lot.

In WvW, where staff is already strong and optimal in large groups, I don’t feel these changes will make much of an impact. However, they would improve the staffs capabilities in small scale fights quite a bit.

If you have any suggestions of your own for improving certain elementalist weapon skills post your thoughts and thank you for reading.

Disclaimer: post tagged as spvp because thats pretty much all I play.

As an spvper I am of the opinion that some weapons are lacking in a few areas or just in general and I’d like to propose what weapon skills need to be changed and some suggestions for what could be done.

First I’d like to state that I’ve always had this opinion that dagger main hand has this nice flow between all the attunements, always feeling useful in every attunement. Staff and scepter don’t have this and often it feels like you are doing practically nothing. Many of these changes seek to alleviate this.

I’ll start with scepter because its my favorite weapon:
At the moment scepter lacks good consistent damage outside of air attunement. For this reason, it’s a great weapon to take if you are playing fresh air because then you can just avoid using the other attunements except for the cooldowns and just stick with air. Also for that reason, it’s a really bad weapon if you don’t take fresh air.

(I’ll only list abilities I feel should be improved)
Fire Attunement:

Fire #1 – Flamestrike – Needs improved somehow, it casts too slow for what it is. Easiest fix: reduce cast time.
Awesome but hard fix: change the ability to something else! Scepter doesn’t have to be a condition damage weapon.

Fire #2 – Dragons tooth – A really cool ability but in it’s situational uses it needs to be casted faster. Perhaps the delay on the tooth landing could remain the same but being stuck casting this ability for so long is a real bummer. Some people have suggested making it ground targeted but I don’t care either way.

Water Attunement: This attunement is a nightmare.

Water #1 – Ice Shards – This skill may as well read 300 range because if a target is moving and farther you are not going to hit hardly at all. If you hit all hits though its actually pretty decent damage. I avoid using this skill if at all possible. Revamp or clean this skill up immensely.

Water #2 – Shatterstone – I probably use this skill for an actual purpose 1 out of 3 games and those are in dire situations where I have no other options. Mostly on a downed opponent.

Earth Attunement:
Earth #1 – Stone Shard – an obnoxiously long cast time and wind up and the ability just feels clunky. Does decent damage though. I think this ability just needs cleaned up a bit but it’s mostly fine.

Earth #3 – Dust Devil – I’ve come to really like this ability and with it’s situational use I see it as a way to really separate yourself from other eles by using it at the right times. However it just feels slightly lacking and often like a filler while I wait for other attunements to come up. Increase it’s speed and add some more power damage to it and call it a day! Or whatever other improvements you like.

Focus: Only one ability really concerns me here.

Fire Attunement:

Fire #5 – Fire Shield – compared to most solid abilities on most ele weapons this ability just falls short. Situationally its pretty great, like when a mesmer has a bunch of clones hitting you and you stack 15 might in seconds. These situations are slim and thin, and focus these days is being ran by almost all glassy builds in which you can’t just stand and take some hits to take advantage of the aura. The Flame Aura part should definitely stay so both offhands (dagger and focus) still retain synergy with aura traits. On top of gaining the aura something should happen though. What happens could be so many things but I’d personally enjoy some mobility. Just pop some mobility on there that doesn’t closely resemble any of the other elementalist mobility skills and it’d be great!

Continued…

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-k33;2B2VU0-5wM-Z0;9;69TT;44;049A17ASs0;3CoF2CoF20i

Celestial is 100% better. It literally just does everything better on ele. Good luck!

Even dagger/pistol is too strong now.

It has everything to do with the initiative regen buff.

ColinJohanson.2394:

So an open question to add to the brainstorm, when considering leagues rewards is always going to be an important component to driving participation. There is some great ideas in this thread on rewards already, but it’s worth delving deeper into what type of rewards will motivate different types of players in the league structure. Top tier players might be motivated only by $$$ for example, while lower tier players may be driven primarily to earn levels/gold. (These are just random examples)

With that in mind, what rewards would you like to see for a pvp league structure based on player categories who would be motivated by those rewards at different tiers?

I’ll give myself as an example: I consider myself competitive casual. I will never join a top PvP team to compete in tournaments to be the best in the world, I will however play in any solo play league or rated solo play if the rewards are compelling enough. I generally play hot join and custom arenas as my core game mode type.

For me, unique skins for my character that I can only earn from participating in a league structure would be the biggest motivating factor. This would allow me to show off to others that I was there, and also feel like I earned something unique and exciting for my time spent. Similarly, any rewards that help speed my progress towards building a legendary would provide a large amount of motivation for me. And gems would always be nice, can I always seem to be finding more on the gem store I want to buy than my wife will be ok wit

As one of these “top tier players” I’m glad you brought this up Colin!

I think most players in most games would put themselves in this “competitive casual” category that you have described yourself as. These players solve all the problems that high level players run into. Those problems being $$$ and long queue times.

So making the system to highly attract the competitive casual players is of utmost importance. This is something WoW arena failed at miserably. People make fun of duelists because they just didn’t make it to gladiator, you’d rather just have no title at all, it’s a system only encouraging people to attain the highest of ranks possible.

The highest ranked people can get there little something that can separate them from everyone else and they’ll be happy. Give everyone else regular in game currency rewards like gold/gems (whatever else I am not to keen on too many in game things as I pretty much only pvp)

And as a side note I am in full on agreement with others on the subject of having short seasons. In WoW too many players only played during the end of seasons, it’s only natural though, can’t blame em!

Or even make a season 6 months long, but every 2 months there is a preliminary with lesser rewards which will keep people coming back more often.

Played a 10 hour session of solo queues yesterday and I can’t express how much of a great change this would be to elementalists. Chill is just insanely strong against elementalists.

That’s part of the point though. The only power tanky class we’ve ever seen work is warrior and that’s because they are grossly overpowered. We’ve never seen any other class run this because they’ve never had the proper amulet to run it.

It’s simple, introduce proper tanky amulet -> nerf warriors. Ele and Mesmer used valks during the power meta (a long time ago) and let me tell you the game did not feel tanky. Just because there is an actual tanky amulet that works doesn’t mean the game is tanky, that is just a fault of too many dodges/immunities/warriors, not the amulets.

And because ele and mesmer were allowed to run valks because of the lack of condis, we actually survived against thieves, which is exactly what we need rather than just instadieing to the thief that just turns his gaze our way. And we have to run berserkers on ele/mes because otherwise we don’t do enough damage to kill warriors.

I do not think it will make things worse unless warriors are left untouched.

MrYay.7063:

Nerfing Thieves won’t change a thing. Elementalist needs more immediate damage and less useless/unusable skills, effectively more synergy between their skills.

Strangely, also, condition builds on Ele do not work that well. In a condition based meta, no wonder why they can hardly make it (and no, adding more purge is not an option).

Peace

Changing thieves will change a lot.

While charging it lightning flash right in your opponents face so you can ignore its travel time. Pretty easy to hit that way.

Vuh.1328:

Romek.4201:

Justin ODell.9517:

Guys, guys… all is (maybe not) vain.

You guys should start a thread with software requirements, and workflow (from queueing to getting into a match), that you feel are ideal. cough

ok just for you …

optimal would be:

Unranked Que (join system same as teamQ we have right now 1-5 people)

• no lvl requirement
• it use MMR from the competive Ques
• first 20-50 games are to find hidden the START MMR for this guy
• no Leaderboard, no Ladder
• Archievements work here too (like champion titles)

SoloQ (join system same like it is now)

• Start lvl = played atleast 25 games in unranked Que (50?)
• start MMR from unranked Que
• no unCompetive Maps like Skyhammer

TeamQ (join 5 people Team only)

• when Waittime for match longer than 5 minutes the team get the message: we dont have enemy for you atm, wanna play unranked game while waiting?

done

thank me later^^

I’d love a unraked queue where you could queue up as 2-3 and then remove hotjoin, basicly smites casual queue :P

Remove hotjoin add unranked queue? My body is ready. Really this is the kind of bonus that league or any other e-sport has. The casual base plays exactly what the pros do. Hot join is not even remotely the same as an actual 5v5 match. #Esports

But really. Friends don’t wanna go hotjoin together, they wanna queue team q together but then they run into an organize team and get stomped. Unranked queue is amazing for just a casual group of whoever to just queue and have some fun. Would be the perfect place to go and play joke builds too.

So this posts just a little bit old but I’d like to mention a sort of hidden nerf.

Evasive Arcana used to proc Healing Signet 2-3 times (3 times in earth twice in the other attunements) for whatever reason. It also proced confusion. Evasive Arcana no longer procs either of them. Hurl on Scepter also proced healing signet and confusion 5 times now only once.

This was the cause of every single ele using it for a long while. You could just make sure you did a dodge every time you swapped attunements and it was about 500-750 healing every time. You had to be super careful with confusion back then but yeah you get the idea.

Really if you think about it, if people would have utilized all of the healing ele really had at its disposal at release even zerker eles would have been extremely hard to kill lol.

1. Elementalist
2. Mesmer
3. Ranger – Everything but spirits

Acandis.3250:

Phantaram.4816:

Acandis.3250:

Acandis.3250:

I wouldn’t touch them, they’ll be fine if the other classes get toned down.

Mr. Acandis we all agree. Clearly it’s not what is going to happen though unfortunately. So the least we can do is influence the direction the devs are going to take ele.

Edit: for those wondering Heal sig is still not going to be good. It’s bad in PvE and it’s only getting buffed in pvp to the pve level so… it’s still bad. If you don’t know why it used to be extremely strong I’ll provide a short explanation.

Evasive Arcana used to = 2-3 Heal sig procs, now its 0
+ hurl used to = 5 heal sig procs, now it’s 1

You’re deluded if you think the devs are going to be influenced in any way, by anything we say here that isn’t referencing some proposed change they have already shown us.

They don’t give a kitten anymore. They have their own list of “ideal” world, and they’re looking to get the game to that state. Nothing we say or do will change that.

I only come to the forums to at least try to make a difference. Sometimes there is a funny post I see while I’m here and I’ll post in it. I don’t post or browse in the forums just for the heck of it though. If my suggestions fall on def ears whatever. It turns out to be the same result as wasting my time posting on the forums for no reason.

Acandis.3250:

Acandis.3250:

I wouldn’t touch them, they’ll be fine if the other classes get toned down.

Mr. Acandis we all agree. Clearly it’s not what is going to happen though unfortunately. So the least we can do is influence the direction the devs are going to take ele.

Edit: for those wondering Heal sig is still not going to be good. It’s bad in PvE and it’s only getting buffed in pvp to the pve level so… it’s still bad. If you don’t know why it used to be extremely strong I’ll provide a short explanation.

Evasive Arcana used to = 2-3 Heal sig procs, now its 0
+ hurl used to = 5 heal sig procs, now it’s 1

Mbelch.9028:

All ele needs now is cleansing water’s ICD removed.

I’d accept also having RTL’s cooldown reduced.

Class=fine at that point.

Stop tweaking it past that.

Only bunker healing ele specs use cleansing water and that is the only ele spec already working. No full damage spec spec goes 30 water and very few mid range (valks amulet) builds go 30 water. I think when most people are complaining about ele balance it is to do with elementalist specs that are meant to do damage.

Anyways, there is a reason it has an ICD. With Runes of Dwayna + the new 10 point trait that gives regen when crit, you’d be practically immune to conditions.

Oh wait there is already traits that make you immune to conditions in this game, bring on no icd cleansing water! (joking, and seriously showing how dumb the immune to condition traits are)

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Phantaram.4816:

If things remain even remotely as close to as tanky as they are, they need to increase elementalist damage outside of Freshi Air. They could do this a number of ways but the easiest is to actually make our auto attacks good outside of air, and improve all of the auto attacks on staff.

This is probably the worst scenario that could happen. This would generate even more power-creep and is overall not a good solution. As you said, the pre-dhuumfire-balance was probably the best we had. If you keep buffing classes the balance will go further away from that state.

Yeah, I agree bringing things down to the ele level is the ultimate solution like I said. However we have to look at it from the perspective of the devs. For them bringing ele up to the level of everything else is much easier and probably the path they are on. So I’ll try to influence making that path as good as possible since the other path we all want is such a longshot.

Glass Fresh Air ele – Can kill things like bunker guards/warriors and actually does well 1v1 against quite a few things. Thieves completely hard counter you, and a soldiers warrior can 100 – 0 you if he hits a pin down and you happen to not have a 75 second cooldown utility.

Mid-Range ele (Valkyries 0/20/0/20/30) – feels like you are just performing below average all the time. You can’t kill a guardian or warrior whatsoever. They could really care less if you are attacking them or not. Thieves can still whittle you down and kill you 1v1. If you are low on cooldowns you still die just as fast as glass ele to necro/thieves.

Healing Bunker Ele – This still has the weakness of getting killed by thieves with sleight of hand, just like any elementalist. But with all players spread across all 3 nodes a healing ele can properly keep themselves and 1 teammate healed during a 2v2 and slowly whittle them down. It’s only working because of the bunker meta so damage is low so the elementalist doesn’t just get bursted despite being bunker. Same weakness as valks, once you are low on cooldowns a thief can just train you and you are dead.

If things remain even remotely as close to as tanky as they are, they need to increase elementalist damage outside of Freshi Air. They could do this a number of ways but the easiest is to actually make our auto attacks good outside of air, and improve all of the auto attacks on staff. From there lower the cooldown on all of our stun breakers by a bit. After these things are changed I think they just need to decrease the power of thieves and see where elementalists are at at this point.

The ultimate solution is to nerf like 5 layers of broken things and just bring it back to before the necro burning patch. Everything was so close to balanced back then and just tweaking things would have been swell. Instead warriors and necros got like 1/4th of their whole class buffed to insane amounts, and it’s continued since then.

Jelger.6758:

S/p isn’t that different from s/d in team fights imo, less evades, but more daze/blind. Still the same step in for the kill, cleave/rupt, back away tactic.

I think S/D works in team comps like double war/ranger/guardian because it can mostly come out of fights alive if it wants to, the thief just has to know his limits. I don’t feel like S/P could execute what S/D does in that comp. S/P is typically thrown into more high damage comps where dagger thieves used to belong.

Anyways I feel like it’s the ultimate roamer and isn’t afraid. On most classes you could color a map with red/yellow/green at any given point with red being the most dangerous, and there’d be a mix of all 3 colors. S/D thief could just color the whole map green because there is no way he isn’t escaping a situation that isn’t a full on team fight.

Reevz.2617:

yep, not just s/d though s/p even— sword mainhand teleport is kinda kittened. on demand instant gap closer that also immobilizes and you can teleport back with it? you can pre cast pistol whip and teleport. but in all honesty thiefs in general right now are too powerful they fill their niche role, and only thiefs can counter thiefs ;/

Yeah I agree s/p is too strong also. It’s actually even more of a nightmare than s/d for my ele in 1v1s. I don’t feel like s/p is as safe to play in team fights though.

No other class can do that much raw damage with that much mobility and still bunker points 3v1 for large periods of time.

Some things that could be looked at to balance it.

1. Too much damage (I feel like this one is never brought up but the amount of raw damage an S/D thief can do is insane, and none of it is on a cooldown. Their burst and consistent damage are all the same thing, they are constantly doing both.)
2. Too much dodging
3. Lyssa runes

Bring up whatever else you think could be looked at balance wise for an S/D thief.

Hmm. That sounds awesome but I dunno if a chill will still allow us to hit the dragons tooth unless dragons tooth was adjusted to fall faster or something, at least making them waste a dodge to get out (similar to dodging whatever sets up 100 blades).

Sounds awesome though, I like the idea.

Without air attunement our consistent scepter damage outside of big spells is absolutely atrocious.

It’s clear that air is meant to be the most highly consistent damage attunement, but on scepter it is vastly better than the other attunements by an absolutely huge margin.

Dagger is a better example of how the damage can be better on the other attunements outside of wombo combos(scepter has plenty of damage from the big fire spells, as does dagger). Abilities on dagger like Fire #2, water #2, earth #2 and #1 can keep the consistent damage flowing through-out the attunements. Certainly not as high as Air #1 spam but it’s still quite acceptable consistent damage while rotating through all the attunements.

Scepter is left with Fire #1, Water #1, Earth #1 and #2. I understand scepter should have some weaker consistent damage because it is ranged but these abilities are really bad with the slight exception of Earth #2 because you can charge it before combat. During combat it is mostly just average. To be real though Water #1 and Earth #1 are not ranged abilities because if you use them at long range they can just be strafed.

Some feedback for consistent damage scepter abilities!
Fire #1 This ability feels good to use, which is not the case for some abilities like Water #1 and Earth #1. It just lacks some physical damage besides the burning. Slight buff to physical damage will do the trick.

Water #1 – For me this ability might as well be called “me attempting to proc fresh air” because that is it’s only use outside of a filler while waiting for other attunements. Extremely hard to hit because the projectile is slow. DPS is actually comparable to Air #1 if you hit every single shard but doesn’t have lightning strike to back it up. Did I mention it’s extremely hard to hit?

Water #2 – I still almost never use this ability except very rarely on a down-state person. I’d rather spam Water #1 than use this in actual combat in almost every situation. Dragons Tooth is just like this ability only it is much stronger and has a larger aoe. I can use it then stand under it forcing people to stay away from me unless they want to get punished. Water #2 is so small people will never get hit, not to mention how nonthreatening it is even if it does hit.

Earth #1 – Was worse in the past but they increased it’s projectile speed but it still misses quite often. If it hits, for it’s cast time, it’s still bad. Even for a full condi spec(lol ele condi has never been good) because you are only applying 1 condi and when the bleed stack gets high and finally starts doing okay dps it just gets removed and you just wasted 15 seconds spamming #1 for nothing. Does not feel fun or good to cast.

Earth #2 – Really fun spell and when combo’d with combo fields is also quite strong. only acceptable consistent damage ability outside of air for scepter in my opinion.

I’d really like to be able to out damage a warriors healing signet without fresh air sometime soon(lol soon) so let’s push these changes!

Harbinger.8637:

AxeSword Warriors

What build is this?

Have you not been hit by impale? You are in for a treat.

Waka I shall try this. If I like it there is a chance I will forgive all of your troll posts for this 1 useful post.

Good news, just from what I’ve done to the golems I can tell this is gonna be mega fun. You are forgiven natty.

Edit: not as much fun as I thought because I just melt so easily. 3.2k lightning strikes from sigils is not fun