Guild Wars 2

If you don’t like playing the profession, then don’t play the profession.
It’s not UP. There are plenty of people who do fine with it.
And being an OP class is bad because it means that you’ll be nerfed into oblivion.

I’m not a bunker build and I am surprisingly hard to kill in PvP. (unless I get swarmed…but 3 or 4 people on anyone is going to win). On top of that, I do TONS of damage. Not as much as a glass canon, probably, but my build isn’t a glass canon build, so that’s not to be expected.
No matter what you do, though, Anet will not buff the Ele in any significant way. They might fix glitchy issues with RTL or Lightning Whip, but other than that, they’re not going to do much because the game is already balanced fine.
Honestly, that’s what I love about Anet. They know what parts of their game are working and what parts aren’t better than you do. Blizzard or Bioware (Bioware especially) might look at these posts and say “oh no! People are mad! Buff it!!!” Not Anet. Just like with the explorable dungeons, they’re gonna just say “Shut up and play the game! It’s fine! You just don’t know it yet.”

Yeah, she’s been there. I’m pretty sure Anet was expecting the forum topics because of the way they designed the class which is why they put that little joke in there.

Grevender.9235:

Amnon, what’s the problem learning 60 skills when you can still be oneshotted by John Average’s thief?
We are talking about balance: this requires for everyone to reach the same goal with nearly the same efforts. Currently our class is limited to a certain range during combat, which is part of our weakness; again, if someone ever played D&D would know that – say – a melee mage build (warlock, that is) would be able to wear heavy armors, this would make sense, as the reason we cannot wear armor is generally linked to the fact mages should nuke from distance.
Elementalist, as a class, has potential but it’s still mostly still unexpressed

Another one of these? I’d hoped we were starting to get past all of the “my class sucks /whine” posts.
Only the worst elementalists ever will get one-shotted. We are EXACTLY as squishy as thieves (except they’re even more squishy) and we can do enough damage to hold our own against any profession when we play our builds the right way.

As for the weapon swap issue, I wouldn’t object to an out of combat only weapon swap because it amounts to a simpler way of doing what we’re already able to do.
However, an in combat weapons swap would be completely game breaking.
Think about it. That’s 40 1-5 skills that you have in any build. Even with our slightly longer cooldowns, you would be able to spam higher cd (3-5) abilities non-stop. It would just be stupid and the only way to balance it would be to jump our cooldowns to insanely high levels or nerf our damage output.
The thing about Ele is that it’s fine that we’re stuck at the same range in combat. With daggers, we have more gap closers than anybody. With staff, we have more escape skills than anybody. Not to mention the cc to keep them at a distance (again, more than anybody). I mean, this shouldn’t even be a point of argument. I’ve seen plenty of thieves who don’t even use shortbow at all and run with two melee sets and do fine. Or warriors who do the same thing. I’ve even seen some decent rangers who use both bows. Were fine. Don’t worry about it.

You have to remember the three abilities that you have while in Tornado form. You do damage and knock down foes in melee range, but you can also do knockbacks, blinds, and more damage. The tornado has never been an ability to use to chase someone down. But if you have a group of people fighting, the tornado can turn the tide really fast. If they’re occupied, your team could be losing the fight and tornado will suddenly have all of them permanently on their backs because they can’t get away because you’re right on top of them. And if they’re backpedaling to attack you, you are moving at run speed and can catch up to them. The only way for them to outrun you is to run directly away from you so they can’t hurt you.
I will say, though, that it really is only particularly useful if you’re a d/d ele and already in melee range.

Weapon X.5163:

Erebus.7568:

Pinkerton.5643:

Ok, I’m getting tired of this…so now warriors, rangers, necros, guardians, mesmers, AND engineers can solo 3 people easy. I have one question….what people are you soloing?

show me ONE ele that can just solo 1v3 players thats not totallykitten

i would be able to show you hordes of players on necro, worriar, guardians that can easily solo 3 people at a time..

the point is that the BEST OF HTE BEST!!! ele can stand 1v1 against bambies and half decent players…
while the best of the best of any other class utterlykittenkittenfull zergs of those types of players (yer yer not full zergs but get the point they can easily do 1v3-5 players of those types)

LOL, if any class can solo 1v3, then the 3 need to go back to WoW.

Exactly what I was trying to get at.
I can solo 1v3 on my Ele. But those 3 are not good players. I can 1v1 good players as well as other good players can 1v1 me.

Erebus.7568:

seriously -_- you are a full premade very well organized and build to support each other team vs random bambies and your doing next to no dmg and your support seems decent at best (compared to having ANY other class there) and this is your argument for the ele not being weak -_-

that is the WORST argument i ever saw…
good worriars, mesm, necro’s can solo 2-3 decent players easily.. having you hang around other very well build organised classes to drag your elekitten through is not a argument for the ele not being stupidly weak..

the dmg and support you saw of is as said decent at best, now compare it to a support guardian or a dps thief/mesm/worriar etc. and the difference is insane.

ele is insanely weak compared to any other class, doesn’t mean that you cant rolfstomp with a full premade team vs bambies.

ps: i bet you any decent worriar/necro/thief/mesm would beat you silly in that build -_- unless they are bambies and letting themself get hit by a VERY long casted burst spell you stand no chance there (and having 1 root which would be broken by any decent player would not safe you.)

Ok, I’m getting tired of this…so now warriors, rangers, necros, guardians, mesmers, AND engineers can solo 3 people easy. I have one question….what people are you soloing? If we’re leaving out the skill of the player in these comparisons, then it can’t be anybody with those same professions because they should be roughly evently matched if they’re all THAT powerful. That leaves only elementalists and thieves. And it can’t be thieves because, according to you guys, a good theif has a decent chance against anybody.
So that leaves this claim of soloing 3 people easy only a single possibility…you’re apparently coming up against groups of 3 elementalists constantly…And, ignoring the fact that elementalists aren’t nearly as bad as you people think they are, I highly doubt that’s the case.
So, I’m left with one option…these 3 people that you guys can apparently solo with any class must be terrible players, in which case the point is moot because any decent player with any profession can solo 3 terrible players.

@Westly: You’re generalizing. So many people in this forum have made the same hasty generalization. Just because YOU can’t do well as an elementalist doesn’t mean that it’s impossible. Honestly, I think the claim sounds a little conceited and elitist. “If I can’t do it, then nobody can”. Do you see the implicit assumption there that YOU are the single best player and know everything about the game already?
I’m not trying to flame you or anything and I’m sorry if this comes off that way. I’m trying to warn you against hasty generalizations. I can assure you that beating those classes (even when they have skilled players behind them) is very possible as an elementalist.

Dude, those are not out of context at all. You were talking about your abilities in EVER one of those quotes. that’s why you used the pronoun “I” in every one of them without ever indicating any sort of hypothetical situation in which “I” would refer to anyone but Razarei.

And I’m surprised by that claim…on account of the fact that I’ve only ever seen a single whisper from you…maybe 2 or 3 total on that one occasion.

Razarei.2809:

Again, you’re failing to read what I wrote. Tired of having to repeat myself because people don’t want to look at the bigger picture.

If you with all your knowledge of an elementalist invested just as much time in a guardian, you would faceroll with less effort. That is the point almost everyone is trying to make. You say I’m ignoring you, but it is you who is ignoring me. You, and many others think everyone who disagrees with you is simply bad at the game and needs to get better.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, I’m really good at playing my class, and I’d be happy to prove it to anyone who asks, or seems to think they’re god. Unfortunately, none of there ele-heroes have actually accepted instead of resorting to excuses. I’m pretty sure the majority of people complaining here are at least competent with their build.

I honestly don’t give two kitten if elementalists don’t get changed, because it won’t affect me at all. I will still faceroll with elementalist, because that’s what I do. There are people like me that take classes no matter what “tier” and exploit the kitten out of it to show they can do great things.

Does it make it OP? No it does not, because every class can do it, and better.

No, I don’t mean pressing more buttons than another class.

@Pinkerton – That’s rich coming from someone who dodges all my PvP invites. That’s all I’m seeing on these forums. Self proclaimed super awesome elementalists who refuse to back their claims.

Again, you asked me once…at 2 in the morning…when I was going to bed…

And by the way, so now you’re suddenly invincible and can ‘faceroll’ with your ele?
What happened to “I know my profession inside out, there’s nothing more I can learn from my class” and “I get roflstomped by any who even remotely knows how to play their class”?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Overpowered/first#post68163

Get your story straight. Either Ele is fine and doesn’t need to be changed because it’s possible to do fine with it as is or it needs to be changed because Jesus himself (aka Razarei) can’t kill a single thing as an elementalist. You can’t have it both ways and swap whenever it’s convenient for your argument.
And come on…climb down off your high horse. I can’t believe you have the gall to call ME and elitist.

Kyros.5682:

What you dont understand is that the 1 button builds “Heartseaker. Pistol whip, Crossfire, Hundred blades” are builds that should not be viable in competitive play yet are. To me it sounds like you are complaining because ele isnt a 1 button class.

And to clarify I did not say that ele was OP. You’ve obviously already made your mind up that Ele is weak and you wont hear what I or others have to say. Just brushing it off as elitest crap.

I Practice and make my builds with what i consider some of the best players in the game right now. I base 0 of my opinions off of Spvp and base 0 of my opinions of off steam rolling bads. My videos come from a poor selection of pug stomping videos I cant control the quality of teams I’m pit against. As for my opinions and Posts about how strong an ele is etc….. It comes from practicing with the best players I know.

You dont know what your talking about.

Skill is everything when it comes to balance…… How else can you utilize the Potential of a class if you herpkittenthe whole time. I think what you want from Anet is a Fireball spam spec.

Dude, you didn’t read my post? What did I tell you? Don’t listen to Razarei! He’s a whiner.

THANK YOU, KYROS!
Whenever I say I’m not the only one who thinks Ele is fine, Razarei shows up and starts whining at me. I swear, it’s like the only words he knows are “newb” and “roflstomp”. Don’t listen to him. Nothing will please him until Anet buffs eles with passive 20k power and perma-invulnerability.

I like your roaming build. I’ve been thinking it would be fun to try a water heavy build.
Anyway, kudos to you for not giving in. Just like explorable modes, the game is set up in a way that most players don’t understand yet. Before anybody starts screaming at me, IT’S NOT BECAUSE THEY’RE BAD!!!! It’s because the game is new (no matter how many times you say that you’re the best ele who ever lived or ever will and have somehow achieved that in less than a month, Razarei) and because the game is very different from the vast majority of other games out there.
I don’t think Anet will make any major changes to the profession. They’re not showing to be the kind of developer to give in that easily.

Roziel.5720:

While I understand the arguments made on skill triumphing the drawbacks in a class there is an inherent flaw in the argument. Elementalist could be fine in a player who has mastered the intricacies being able to do fine in regular content, either pve or pvp. But the problem is that you have to master the class just to be “competent”. If you haven’t mastered the class you will die often before you even get out of your teens pve wise, pvp we might as well call cleanup after other classes get done with you.

Now take another class like say the engineer. I have gotten to 38 and definitely haven’t mastered the class quite yet. But I can still progress without to much difficulty. But here is the kicker, i’m competent NOW without having mastered the class. When I do master the class then I will inherently be ahead of the elementalist no matter what since they had to master the class just to be considered competent. Now they will lag behind the classes that have more inherent power just because they have no more to give.

If you have to master a class just to be able to survive basic low level content, which as an elementalist you do, then how exactly is that NOT underpowered? Even if you want a challenge, why beat your head against a wall for hours when you can play a more fun and accessible class? That isn’t fortitude or skill when you master a broken class it is masochism. If wanting to play a game for actual fun makes me a ‘baddie’ or ‘kitten’ then i’ll just have to live with that as I rip your avatar a new one.

A couple things. First, you don’t have to absolutely master the class with no room for improvement in order to be competent with Ele. It just takes a higher level of skill than most other classes do.
Second, the skill curves are very different. After becoming competent with most professions in this game, the effectiveness level remains relatively flat all the way to profession mastery. With elementalists, on the other hand, after competence has been reached, effectiveness shoots up at a ridiculously high speed and puts them at the same effective level as other professions.
This picture is what I’m trying to get at. What happens above the line of competence, I’m not so sure on. The curves aren’t going to be constant in the same fashion as below the line, so don’t start flaming on something dumb like that. At some point, though, the effectiveness of the elementalist begins to match that of other professions.

Razarei.2809:

Traulq.8165:

Expansive.3716:

Pinkerton.5643:

Freakiie.8940:

Pinker, since you’re apparently the only one that can actually play an Elementalist and be as good as other classes, why don’t you show us? Educate us lesser beings on how to properly play an Ele. Not by telling us to “get earth traits!!” but by actually showing us how you play. Make a few vids of you being awesome in PvP so we see what we’re doing wrong.

I’m not the only one. There are others who think the whole “Ele is UP” thing is crap. I’m just probably the most vocal. And I would…I tried, actually, but my computer isn’t powerful enough to fraps this game. My fps drops to like 5.

No offense Pinkerton, but in almost every elementalist thread where about 99% of the people are stating legitimate claims about how the elementalist is a bit lacking, you seem to be the main one claiming that the elementalist is not only not lacking, but seems a bit OP.

And when we’d like to see you show and prove, then suddenly your computer is not “powerful” enough to capture videos. I’m not trying to call you out or anything but it would be better to see a good illustration of how effective the elementalist is, in its current state.

At the least, could you gives us your in game name and one of us can join you in PVP?

Good idea, although I suspect that will be the last we see of Pinkerton in this thread now ;-)

I’ve already asked him twice, and he dodged twice. I’ve added every single one of these “super pro elementalists” and none of them are willing to face me in PvP to destroy me like they said they would.

You asked me once and it was 2 o’clock in the morning and I was getting off to go to sleep because I actually have a life outside of video games.
And how is my computer not being powerful enough to run AND fraps this game simultaneously a ‘sudden’ issue? It seems like a pretty constant thing to me…And you don’t need anybody’s player name. Their account name is right next to all their posts.

I’ve used it in practice and I can tell you that it can come in super handy in boss fights and with tough groups of mobs in dungeons.

Yukishiro.8792:

Pinkerton.5643:

@Yukishiro The same is true of the staff. Any of the 4 attunements are viable to stay in for an extended time if you’re traited for that attunement.

No, no they arn’t. Water and air are vastly, vastly inferior to fire and earth no matter how you spec. If you sit in either for more than 3-5 seconds you’re doing something wrong 95% of the time.

When you run staff you have two primary elements and two utility elements. The 15 second timer is meaninglessly punitive.

If they want to make all the elements viable that’d be different but right now the 15 second timer is too long when in reality you only have 2 elements that are fully fleshed out and 2 that are just for utility.

I didn’t say that all 4 elements have the same damage potential. I said they’re viable. You don’t HAVE to be doing damage all the time. You can be a huge help to your group in whatever you’re doing if you’re doing almost no damage as long as you’re doing something else. If you’re doing some damage at the same time, that’s a bonus.

morrolan.9608:

Yukishiro.8792:

No. It means they’re hard to play. That doesn’t mean they’re underpowered when played decently. It certainly does mean a bad elementalist is underpowered compared to a bad warrior or guardian or ranger.

To me that says that the class is inherently underpowered, the fact that a good player can get past that limitation is pretty much irrelevant.

A bad Ele will probably lose to a bad warrior, but a good ele is on at least the same level as a good warrior.
Look at it this way…have you ever played Tekken?
If you have two people who have never played Tekken before, one chooses Law and one chooses Jack. 99.9% of the time, the one who chose Law will win. However! If you have a master Law player fighting a master Jack player, the Jack will win more often than the master Law. It’s because there are intricacies about the game that, when grasped, make the advantages that Law has (faster attacks, mostly) basically irrelevant.
I’m not saying this is how the Elementalist is, but I know that there is a point where the Elementalist is at least as good as, say, a warrior of the same skill level. The game hasn’t been out long enough to know this yet, but for all we know, the Master Ele may be the most valuable player in the game.

Nenthil.4312:

Ok Pinkerton we get it. You’re super pro player and we, little worms, should crawl at your feet and pray to you, oh mighty ele.
Think about it this way (and please try to understand me). There are casual players and good players. Good player will play the profession he like no matter if it’s op or up. He will research, he will try different solution, he will practice and he will get even better.
Casual players like the profession they play but they don’t do research or the other things. They don’t want to be THE BEST. They just want to have fun playing game with the class they want. So now consider yourself a casual player that wants to play elementalist and struggles to stay alive. Suddenly you discover that your friend that is also casual player and reroll other profession is just spamming whatever key he likes and is doing better than you. Do you see my point now? While playing an elementalist you have to always give 100% of you and be fully aware of your skills. But playing other professions comparing to ele is just facerolling. I have ele and thief and honestly I don’t even know what I am pushing on my thief while fighting with mobs but, hey guess what!, I stay alive and doing pretty well.

I’m not saying I’m the best player ever. I don’t do research or anything like that. I think that stuff takes all the fun out of the game. All I did was choose a profession that I liked, spent a while looking at the traits and reviewing my options, made a build or two, picked one I liked, and I made it work. And it’s worked well. That’s all.
And I’m not saying that everyone else is bad. I’m just saying that they might have unrealistic expectations. Like the pretty widespread expectation that every build that someone makes with every weaponset they like should be able to do as much damage and survive as well as the highest damage dealers and the most survivable people. I don’t think they’re bad. I have no basis for that kind of assumption. I just think they’re misunderstanding.
And as far as thief is concerned, my roommate plays thief. He’s a SUPER hardcore gamer. He does all that stuff you mentioned there to the extreme. And what’s more, he can’t figure out how I’m doing so much better than he is on my elementalist. That’s not meant as a boast, but as an example to show that every profession has complexities and is hard to play well. As another example, I felt incredibly underpowered when I played Guardian and Warrior. The thing that I think is going on, as I’ve said before, is that certain people have certain natural playstyles that fit certain professions better and the Elementalist just requires a less common natural playstyle to be instantly good at.
Elementalist came easy to me. The trait lines and making builds seemed really intuitive to me. I haven’t had as much luck with other professions that I’ve tried. I’m definitely not the best player ever and I don’t claim to be.

Jay wilson.1702:

reroll ele weakest class

Quit trolling

Like, I said, it’s not going to win you 1v1 and it’s not supposed to. However, it has tons of great uses in group fights.
Immunity is only that bad if you don’t have any allies around you who might be able to help you out by taking advantage of that 3 seconds. When there are allies around, it can be super useful.
AoE pull leads in nicely to the immunity and, yeah, it’s great for pulling people off nodes. And it’s only really a deathwish if you just stand there after using it. Or, again, if there are no allies around.

@RizziVanizzi
Honestly, I couldn’t care less if people want to make a glass cannon build or whatever build they want. If they want to play a build and try to make it work, more power to them! That’s what this game is about.
What I don’t like and what I try to respond to are people who do that and then complain to everyone else about how their class is underpowered because they aren’t doing as well as they think they should be.

I actually found it to be REALLY helpful early on in dungeons. It was great for the lovers fight in AC story, for example. I cast it, somebody picked up the other one, and we pulled the bosses away from each other.
And it does have an immunity channel.
And I can definitely see its uses in PvP. Think about it, it’s got a cripple, a daze, an AoE pull, and immunity. It’s not gonna win you a 1v1 fight, but this game is not designed for everything to win you a 1v1 fight.

When you’re level 80, you’ll be a lot more used to the profession and you’ll do a lot better as a result than you probably did at level 8.
As far as stats, it depends on what build you want. Condi damage is pretty central for a d/d damage build, but not necessarily for a d/d support build or a staff build or what have you.
Part of figuring out your build is figuring out your what stats you need. Experiment, theorycraft, and all that. Yeah, you can ask people for their builds that have worked well for them. I think it’s way more fun to find one for yourself. But I guess I’m weird…‘cause I don’t like looking everything in a game up on the internet…

Wasselin, we ARE supposed to be switching attunements regularly. Sure, there are builds where you’ll want to stay in a particular attunement a lot longer than you do in other ones, but if you’re not switching at all, you’re playing it wrong. That’s the reason that we have longer cooldowns. It’s because we have twice the number of skills. So you can go to another attunement, use it for a little bit, maybe use 2 others for a little bit, and then come back to the first. That way, you never run out of skills even though the cooldowns are longer.
Personally, I find the attunement dancing to be one of the most fun and interesting parts of the profession. If you hate it, Laki, then maybe Elementalist isn’t for you.

@Yukishiro The same is true of the staff. Any of the 4 attunements are viable to stay in for an extended time if you’re traited for that attunement. And you can trait for at least 2 attunements. And the cooldowns really aren’t that bad. It’s only 1 second on the other attunements and only 15 on the one you were just using. I mean, seriously, there’s only one 3-5 ability for staff that has a cooldown shorter than that.
You’re not supposed to be able to go fire-earth-fire in any reasonable amount of time unless you trait Arcane. You’ve gotta cycle.

Yukishiro.8792:

You don’t do it for the +toughness. You do it for the armor of earth at 50% and the aoe cripple. It doesn’t seem like the 3 second pbaoe cripple is a huge deal but I find it actually makes a big difference in my survivability.

But yes if you already have 15 points in earth there isn’t much point going beyond that for a survivability build either.

I guess I can see 20 points in water possibly but I definitely wouldn’t do more than that.

I have to disagree. The grand master earth trait, written in stone, combined with healing signet is one of the greatest things you can do for a survivability build. Especially if you have a lot of healing power. It makes your signet passives still work while the signet is on cd. If you’re using healing signet, you normally have to be careful about the right time to use it because you lose your heal on cast for the duration of the recharge. With that trait, though, you can spam it whenever your health drops enough and you’ll always have the heal on cast. It helps my survivability a ton.

Some of the traits in water sound awesome. I’m gonna preface this by saying that I play d/d and that’s what’s on my mind when I see these things, but serously…
Aquamancer’s Alacrity: 20% cd reduction on water abilities = more heals more often (and more aoe chills!)
Shard of Ice: signets and arcane skills cause vulnerability. Huge in a group setting
Soothing Disruption: cantrips grant regen and vigor. BIG survivability boost if you use cantrips
Piercing shards is a 20% damage buff all the time in water attunement because your 1 ability inflicts vulnerability twice
Stop Drop and Roll: more condition cleanses = better
Icy Mist: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How is this NOT the coolest water trait EVER?
Cantrip mastery: More earth armor, more triple cleanse+burn, more teleporting…20% cd reduction!
Cleansing Water: see Stop Drop and Roll
Powerful Aura: Auras on allies…that is awesome in group fights. Not only will they be chilled or stunned if they hit YOU, but they’ll be chilled or stunned if they hit ANYBODY.

I was considering it before, but now I kinda really want to try a water based d/d build.

Yukishiro.8792:

Intrigued.7690:

Also it’s kind of depressing when everyone around you is killing twice as fast, and die half as much.

Uh what? Ele can farm faster than practically anyone else with the right setup.

It’s true. I go into Orr and see most people gingerly taking a mob at a time. Maybe two.
I run into the middle of a freakin event, pull like 5 or 6 mobs, knock them down, blind them, churning earth, cast cleansing fire while that’s channeling, and flaming dragon uppercut their faces to smithereens.
The only time I ever die in PvE content that I can’t attribute to my own stupid mistake is when I’m doing PvE stuff in WvW and 2 or 3 invaders come out of nowhere and destroy me when I’m already busy with stuff on cd and my hp down a little…which isn’t really PvE anymore…nor is it meant to be balanced in a way for me to be able to win.

It’s based on swapping, but you need a certain amount of time in each attunement in order to get its full benefit. Air is a pretty quick transition unless you’re using it to move fast, but other than that, the others need more time. For d/d, for example, you need a while in earth to really get anything done with bleeds. Fire needs a while in order for the burns to be more than a passing damage blip, and, unless you’re specced up the water tree, the huge benefit from water comes from the stacks of vulnerability that you can build up with vapor blade.

There are a few different ways to play. You can go arcane and be swapping like mad, but the way I play, the only time I ever need to switch BACK to an attunement during a fight that I’ve already used that fight is when I’m battling bosses that take a long time to kill. That’s why you have enough points to make at least 2 attunements really useful. That way, if you’re locked out of one, you can focus on the advantages of your other major attunement. For me, it’s earth and fire, but it can really be any combination you want.

DJRiful.3749:

Hold on tight, let them be a noob.

I was stuck on Fire Attunement for a long time and I had 30 points in Fire Magic. One day I decided to switch because I believe there is more and should be better than staying in one attunement the whole time.

I got bored, so I completely revamped my traits and stats gears.

I’m not a Crit build anymore, not a condition built, not a tank build, not a healer build and what is it then?

I’m a Dance build. Mix bag support and combos build.

Air 20
Earth 20
Arcane 30

- Mass infinite buffs and combos burst damages on AoE. Switch dance on every fight and speedy + dodges.

I had issue before for staying in Fire burst build. I cannot take on Champion and more than 2-3 mobs at a time. Very squishy.

Now, 5-6 mobs + Champion. Come at me Bros! So powerful! 3-4 mobs just dies at my feet at the same time because of my constant burst of combo finisher damage and debuff damages. Mass buff during the fight + distributing Boons to everyone around me.

Also forever 33% speed all time and anytime and anywhere except you get into combat.

YAY! Good for you! I feel like this forum is turning into kind of a support group, but I’m happy with it.

More stories and builds from elementalists recovering from a misplaced feeling of dejected inferiority!
We did it! SO CAN YOU!

snaplemouton.1294:

Because all the traits help only 1 attunement. So it’s worthless to switch to another attunement since you’ll get more damage staying in one.
Better just stay in fire if you have 30 points in fire since you get +20% damage from 10% trait and 2x 5% on burning. No real reason to go to earth since you will just reduce your damage by doing so.
Ironic that the class that is supposed to be all about swapping attunement is… all about not swapping.
Water without water traits doesn’t help your team. It slows the fight as you will be dealing no damage. The heal without +healing is barely noticeable.

If your build takes only those kinds of traits, then you’re doing it wrong. 1 or 2 of them, sure, but not all of them. I take the 10% increased damage in fire trait and I use fire attunement as my execute skill. We do plenty of damage but you have to look at more than “oh, this makes my damage go up a little bit! I NEED IT!” Our damage is highest when you are swapping attunements correctly.
Also, staff Ele is not meant to be a pure damage weapon set. Kinda like you’d have to be a fool to think you could be a top DPSer as a staff guardian. It’s just simply not possible. Staff Ele is combat support. Yes, you do damage, but as a way to control the battlefield and help compliment the other people you’re working with. Even as a fire staff ele, it’s on your allies to draw the enemies to the right place for you AoEs and (in PvP) it’s on you to control the battlefield by using your damage AoEs to push the enemy where you want them to go. But your main role is to support with CCs, combo fields, and the like. As a staff ele, you’re not supposed to be the most undefeatable person ever. You’re supposed to make your team the most undefeatable team ever.

D/D PvP is the bomb.
Star in air -4-3(during RTL)-2-5
Swap to earth -3-2-4-5 (while casting, air signet for AoE blind, if you have conditions, use cleansing fire, if they run show them how bad of an idea that was with lightning flash)
I stick in earth for a little bit sustaining my bleeds (condi damage spec and I get extra toughness in this attunement).
If they run away, earth 3, then you have two options. go for the previous earth cycle if it’s off cd and there are others in the area.
OR
Swap to fire -3-4-2-5 (they’ll probably be down by the time you get to this point, but just to be safe…..)-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1
If they’re particularly good at running away…
Swap to air -4-do whatever you want.
If this still doesn’t work, they have too strong of a cowardice build and your time is better spent elsewhere.

There are still lots of situational things you can pull out, too. Like, in a high power or crit build, never underestimate this following combo when several enemies are grouped:
Swap to water -3-4 (maybe even set 4 to your auto-attack for water and forget this step)-2
When they’re all grouped up, the building damage of cone of cold is devastating. Especially after you chill them so they’re not running away. If you have allies nearby, it’s even better ‘cause you’ll heal them.

Also, the fire combo there is also greatly improved with a “line-em-up and knock-em-down” type strategy. The more people you hit with Drake’s Breath followed by Fire Grab, the more awesome you are.

There are trainers in every major city AND just outside of every major city (not including Lion’s Arch) They’re all in roughly the same area but the one for your class will have a big book floating above their head. The map icon is the same everywhere, so it’s that yellowish book that spena was talking about.

As for how it works, when you buy a trait book, you get to buy your first at level 11 and it unlocks the first 3rd of your trait lines. So you can put points into any trait line up to 10 points.
At level 40, you get to buy the book that unlocks the next 10 points of your trait lines. And at level 60, you get to unlock the last third, but it’s expensive. You might not be buying that one until close to 80 if you’re not rolling in cash.
And I’m not sure what you mean by your last question.

Well, I do feel that burning rage is a bit small, but if you have your foes constantly burning, that’s a 5% damage buff, which isn’t too bad.
Pyromancer’s Puissance is actually awesome, I think. The question is how fast can you cast fire spells? How many stacks can you build in 5 seconds? I think it would work great for a boon build. If you go up the arcane line, you get tons of boon duration and extend that 5 seconds. You start stacking might from the other sources available to the Ele and you’re gonna be drowning in might stacks. A little more is always helpful.

MystiQ.9648:

Pinkerton.5643:

DaedalusDragon.3754:

If you are using cantrips to gain stacks of might, you are doing it wrong. They have long cooldowns and shouldn’t be used like that.

The difference between me fighting at close range and anybody else fighting at close range is that they are wearing armor made of mithril (or w/e, i’m no crafting expert) and mine is made of someones old cloth straps that I fashioned to cover myself.

No, you don’t use cantrips for the sole purpose of gaining might stacks. I’m not talking about a might stacking build. But every time I hit 50% health, I get stability, protection, AND 3 stacks of might. how is that not awesome? Or every time somebody tries to run away from my churning earth, I appear right next to them again with 3 stacks of might…and then….BOOM. Or if I get loaded down with conditions, I burn everyone in the area, lose three of them, and gain 3 stacks of might.

And armor value isn’t that important. The main advantage that some of them have over you is a bigger health pool (and that’s not all of them). You have to use your defensive skills at the right times and you have to get good at dodging. That’s true for ever profession. And it works just as well for elementalist.

Sounds to me we got the exact same build. ‘cept I don’t focus on Toughness and rather went all out precision and power with a tad vitality snuck in, ofcourse this makes me squishy, but I still do less damage in a burst than what any “melee” class does. Toughness might be something to try out.

I’m loving the cantrip thing btw, imo there really aren’t any other signets that compare.
I still get facerolled by guardians though.

Really? I don’t really have problems with guardians. The thing I have the most trouble with is hundred blades from gsword warriors. It’s high damage and there’s not much warning. It’s tough to see it coming.

@Dabrixmpg: The issue with only a small number of people being good at elementalist has to do with the overall design of the class. In order to make the complainers happy, Anet would either have to buff the class to godmode status or overhaul the entire thing so playing isn’t even recognizable. It has a weird skill curve. So what? Ride the curve or don’t. If you do, you’ll eventually figure it out and then you’ll forget about all this underpowered nonsense.

DaedalusDragon.3754:

If you are using cantrips to gain stacks of might, you are doing it wrong. They have long cooldowns and shouldn’t be used like that.

The difference between me fighting at close range and anybody else fighting at close range is that they are wearing armor made of mithril (or w/e, i’m no crafting expert) and mine is made of someones old cloth straps that I fashioned to cover myself.

No, you don’t use cantrips for the sole purpose of gaining might stacks. I’m not talking about a might stacking build. But every time I hit 50% health, I get stability, protection, AND 3 stacks of might. how is that not awesome? Or every time somebody tries to run away from my churning earth, I appear right next to them again with 3 stacks of might…and then….BOOM. Or if I get loaded down with conditions, I burn everyone in the area, lose three of them, and gain 3 stacks of might.

And armor value isn’t that important. The main advantage that some of them have over you is a bigger health pool (and that’s not all of them). You have to use your defensive skills at the right times and you have to get good at dodging. That’s true for ever profession. And it works just as well for elementalist.

morrolan.9608:

Pinkerton.5643:

Low HP pool is the same HP pool as thieves and guardians.

But thieves hit like a truck from stealth. Their burst damage is greater than ours and their condition damage is better overall as well.

Thieves have the highest burst potential in the game thanks to their initiative system. And that’s precisely why they’re significantly squishier than we are. But I would have to disagree with you on the condition damage bit. They have poisons, sure, and a couple bleeds and whatnot, but a condition ele can have a huge burn plus 15-20 stacks of bleed on you at the same time. Thieves cannot come close to matching that. Come to think of it, a good condition ele can have huge burns on all enemies in the area, 15-20 stacks of bleed on one, and up to 10 stacks of bleed on every other enemy simultaneously. And we can hit like a truck, too. Make a fire build around fire grab and tell me there are no truck-based massacres involved.

And @Elric of Grans: Yes, elementalist IS one of the squishier professions in the game. And you’re right, it doesn’t matter. What I’m trying to say is that we’re nowhere near unbalanced squishy and we DO have enough damage potential to make up for it.

DiogoSilva.7089:

The elementalist’s traits and elites are lacking. Their damage isn’t as high as other professions, or when it is, it comes at a much greater sacrifice. Attunement dancing makes elementalists hard to play, but it doesn’t offers them any inherit advantage over other professions. Yes, it’s a requirement for you to not suck, but that’s it. It’s even hard to argue that elementalists are more versatile, because elementalist’s skills have high recharges, are simpler than other professions’ skills, and the profession is stuck into one range.

There’s a reason for why the elementalists with the most success are all Staff support. A lot of CC and combo fields there, enough distance, no need to rely on their lacking damage.

I don’t think elementalists need drastic changes, but they’re clearly lacking in many aspects. When you create the profession with the worst passive defense in the game, giving it skills so you can be as defensive as any other profession won’t be enough. Elementalists are currently jack-of-all-trades, master of none.

Traits aren’t lacking. 3 stacks of might on cantrip is awesome with the right utility skills. armor of earth at 50% health is great. remove condition on water attunement is invaluable. maintain signet passives while on cd is the greatest thing ever, as far as I’m concerned. Elites work great if you know how to use them. I do comparable damage and sacrifice nothing (I have over 2k toughness). And dagger dagger has so many gap closers it’s not even funny. Who cares if you’re stuck at close range? When they’re fighting you, SO ARE THEY!

DiogoSilva.7089:

Pinkerton.5643:

Dude, pay closer attention. lightning whip is THE hardest hitting 1 ability of any dagger attunements. And going heavy air doesn’t mean that you get to sit in air attunement for the entire fight. The stats there also help your fire, water, and earth attunement abilities. Find a way to make your elements synergize in a way that works for your playstyle.

Who uses the ele’s auto-attack skills, anyway? They are clearly underpowered, and their only purpose is to be auto-casted inbetween other spells, when you’re not being fast enough.

Air is a control or burst support element in this game. Outside of fire, earth is usually the second attunement in choice for damage.

That’s nowhere close to the truth with any attunements but fire. And it’s hardly true with fire because drake’s claw does almost as much damage as lightning whip. Vapor Blade inflicts vulnerability stacks very quickly (super useful, especially in group setting), impale inflicts bleed, and lightning whip is the brunt of d/d air attunement damage. You might be surprised how spamming that with the right build can tear through an enemy’s health.

Jnaathra.6549:

Pinkerton.5643:

Drizty.3872:

this is becoming extremely frustrating and game breaking after asking if I could join a CoF group his initial response to me being ele was " Ehh " i’ve taken a screen shot below more as proof ( he then stated that he wanted someone more " tanky " but i got the feeling this was more of a nice way to so gtfo your an ele )

this is now extremely game breaking now that I am very limited to the amount of groups that will actually invite me! and its makeing it very hard to progress

it would be great if Anet gave some indication of when this is going to be looked at / or if it is at all going to be looked at all

or has there already been an indication? if so can anyone give me a link or point me in the right direction?

Haha, that picture made me laugh. That guy you were whispering doesn’t know anything about this game. You can’t tell from somebody’s profession how tanky they’re going to be. There aren’t even actually tanks in this game at all! What he means by tanky is survivable, and you can’t tell that by somebody’s profession. My Ele is incredibly survivable. If he had asked for your build and it was fire/air, then I might be able to see that answer depending on the existing group comp, but that was just complete and utter stupidity and ignorance on his part.

Low HP pool. Weak traits that do not synergize well across trait lines. Weak armor.

Sure you can tell if you know how the professions work.

Low HP pool is the same HP pool as thieves and guardians.
Traits are not weak and of course they don’t synergize if you take all the 10% damage in x attunement ones. And armor rating doesn’t mean half as much as toughness. Combine toughness with defensive earth abilities, you’ve got a prettykittensurvivable Ele.

Windowlicker.6019:

Pinkerton.5643:

You guys, this game is about builds. If your elementalist can’t do much, it’s because you haven’t set it up properly.
Your healing isn’t supposed to be amazing unless you spec heavily into it
Your air give GREAT damage. heavy air is all about stacking heavy power/prec and knowing how to avoid damage.

There goes your posts credibility, soaring out the window. It is my sole wish that I could stack air through the wahzoo and have D/D lightning hitting like a truck, but it doesn’t, no matter how hard you stack it. (Yes, I know. I run a very heavy power/prec sPvP build at the moment)

Dude, pay closer attention. lightning whip is THE hardest hitting 1 ability of any dagger attunements. And going heavy air doesn’t mean that you get to sit in air attunement for the entire fight. The stats there also help your fire, water, and earth attunement abilities. Find a way to make your elements synergize in a way that works for your playstyle.

Freakiie.8940:

Pinker, since you’re apparently the only one that can actually play an Elementalist and be as good as other classes, why don’t you show us? Educate us lesser beings on how to properly play an Ele. Not by telling us to “get earth traits!!” but by actually showing us how you play. Make a few vids of you being awesome in PvP so we see what we’re doing wrong.

I’m not the only one. There are others who think the whole “Ele is UP” thing is crap. I’m just probably the most vocal. And I would…I tried, actually, but my computer isn’t powerful enough to fraps this game. My fps drops to like 5.

DiogoSilva.7089:

“No! Someday someone will master this profession and prove you’re all wrong!!!1”_ kind of post again.

I’m not sure if you’re aware, but the elementalist is not the only profession that is hard to master. Let’s not forget that there’s more than warriors, guardians and elementalists in this game.

Also,
Most of the time, PvE is easy. It has its challenging moments, but general questing/ exploration is fairly easy. It just happens that an Elementalist player has the idea that PvE requires a lot of effort. For that reason, when a few pro players come here claiming how a well played elementalist can kill fast enough and survive well enough by pressing 237140845 buttons at the same time and with the right timing, they’re unaware that an average player from other professions can achieve the same results for less effort, and without being half the pros they are.

I know there are more than those three professions, but everybody always talks about how guardians and warriors can faceroll. It’s not even necessarily an issue of being hard to master as it is an issue of the class not meshing with most peoples’ playstyles. I did great with the elementalist from day one. The profession fit my playstyle naturally and I’ve been able to keep up with the best of them. On the other hand, when I played guardian or warrior, I felt extremely underpowered. Not that they are UP, but they didn’t fit my playstyle.
Also, those average players from other professions can’t accomplish the same thing. I know because I beat them all the time. EVERY profession is difficult to really master. The difference with Ele is that it’s not very effective until you’re VERY good with it. There’s a tipping point past which your effectiveness skyrockets.

Razarei.2809:

You clown almost every person in the game is running glass cannon, except they’re cannons but not made of glass, because for some strange unknown reason they’re able to get insane offensive while still having great defense. cough engineer cough

I can solo a champion, does that make me awesome? No it does not. I’m tired of quoting your crap because you don’t have any idea what you’re saying. You’re in here telling people ‘gtfo get some skill neb’ and then you tell people to roll another class- specifically warrior if they want to roflstomp people. And I don’t know how many times I’m going to have to TELL YOU SPECIFICALLY to stop talking out of your rear, because ele’s cannot run all builds, ele’s can not match anyone, and ele’s certainly ARE UP.

I feel like you’re actually just trollin’ tbh.

I actually want to face you in PvP so I can hand yourkittento you so you can stop with the elitist bullkitten.

1. The comment about nobody doing glass cannons was hyperbole and more of an opinion comment. Because I hate playing glass cannon.
2. Even a fire/air ele has plenty of defensive capability if you use the right utility skills and swap attunements at the right times.
3. You might be able to solo some of the wussy champions, But I was referring to the real ones. Like the champions who regen health faster than any class can do damage (yes, there are some).
4. I don’t know why you put that “gtfo…” comment in quotes. I didn’t say that and I don’t talk like that. I told people to pay more attention to their builds than just going “look, power!” And I told them to go play warrior if they want to kill stuff without thinking a little. A class being harder to play well doesn’t make it underpowered. It makes it interesting.
5. I don’t troll
6. I’m not an elitist, I just get really annoyed when people give up so easily and start immediately whining about how their lives are hard.
7. And I’m the one who ends up handing people kittens

Vesper.8359:

I too gave up, you pretty much need to put 30 in water just do be able to do anything in dungeons and not get down the fastest because for some reason we have lower life pool than any one else. D/D is amazing but why do I have to go sigils/auras or water traits just to take more than 1 hit? It feels like the WD in d3 having to get the mana passive and 4 useless cds just to be able to do what other classes can do.

Also, everyone always compares ele to spvp…. Anyone can be top in spvp

Thieves and Guardians actually have the same exact size health pools as we do. I only have 10 in water and I can take a reasonable beating. But taking a beating is not how you play this game. You dodge, avoid, and use conditions. You have to watch enemies for the tells associated with their attacks. You can’t just tank and spank like in other, less interesting MMOs. Once you’ve figured out how an enemy works, you can survive any encounter.

IT’S NOT UNDERPOWERED! You’re either building it or playing it wrong. My D/D ele kills all kinds of things very fast. Especially when they surround me!
It’s not a matter of mastering an underpowered profession, it’s a matter of mastering a profession that takes more than the intellect of an ape to master. If we get a buff, I won’t just feel like a god…I will BE a god. As cool as that would be, I don’t want that to happen because more people would figure out the class over time, people would start complaining that Eles are overpowered, as they absolutely would be, and then we risk being nerfed into oblivion and ACTUALLY being underpowered, as opposed to just intricate.

Morthis.3968:

PvE:

Elemental: It’s alright, nothing spectacular. It’s useful, but it’s pretty boring, since we get the same thing (but weaker) as a utility skill as well. Don’t expect me to get excited about a copy/paste elite.

Tornado: lol

Sword: Meh. It’s alright damage, it looks really cool, but I just don’t feel it’s strong enough for an elite. It’s got the cool factor, but I actually feel more limited using the sword.

WvW:

Elemental: Useful in something like a 1v1, anything else it’ll be dead in seconds.

Tornado: When multiple elementalists use this at the same time against a zerg hitting the door, it can be devastating, but extremely situational. Very cool when it works, too bad it’s useless or plain suicide 99% of the time.

Sword: Again, doesn’t feel that special, and I simply lose too many spells using the sword.

Basically, the elemental is ok in PvE most of the time, but it’s a plain boring spell because it’s a copy/paste of a utility. Tornado can be ok in WvW, under the right conditions. Most of the time, I’d just rather have another utility slot. That screams of utterly failed design with elites, if I’d even consider wanting to use another utility slot instead. You have some classes who have extremely useful elites, where they can’t wait to unlock them. If they removed my elite slot entirely, I wouldn’t even notice most of the time. That’s just a giant failure by Anet.

With Tornado, you’re doing it wrong. I’ve done plenty of PvP, I always use Tornado, and I use it very often. At least once or twice a match. I have only ever died once while in tornado form. Also, I can stop an entire team from capping a point for a significant amount of time by myself when I use Tornado. I repeat, you’re doing it wrong.

Drizty.3872:

this is becoming extremely frustrating and game breaking after asking if I could join a CoF group his initial response to me being ele was " Ehh " i’ve taken a screen shot below more as proof ( he then stated that he wanted someone more " tanky " but i got the feeling this was more of a nice way to so gtfo your an ele )

this is now extremely game breaking now that I am very limited to the amount of groups that will actually invite me! and its makeing it very hard to progress

it would be great if Anet gave some indication of when this is going to be looked at / or if it is at all going to be looked at all

or has there already been an indication? if so can anyone give me a link or point me in the right direction?

Haha, that picture made me laugh. That guy you were whispering doesn’t know anything about this game. You can’t tell from somebody’s profession how tanky they’re going to be. There aren’t even actually tanks in this game at all! What he means by tanky is survivable, and you can’t tell that by somebody’s profession. My Ele is incredibly survivable. If he had asked for your build and it was fire/air, then I might be able to see that answer depending on the existing group comp, but that was just complete and utter stupidity and ignorance on his part.

Killer.4709:

Pinkerton.5643:

Anlyon.8375:

PvE

• Gather 5 mobs -> Glyph of Storms is Earth -> Churning Earth -> any Burning skill -> /dance -> collect loot

WvW

• Equip Staff -> Glyph of Storms in Earth -> Eruption -> Flame Burst -> Collect loot

PvP

• Play lots and learn what to dodge, and what to do when -> Get a decent build -> ??? -> Equip awesome looking Scepter/Dagger.

I think we have a little work to be done, but all in all, we’re in a good spot, and i’ve been playing since BWE #1 and watching the ele since 2009.

Swap that scepter/dagger for d/d and I’ll be your friend =)
I’m glad I’m not the only one who’s figured this out.

You haven’t done dungeon have you…

I love this class but come on we are a little underpowered. With my boon build I can run with 25 might stacked and I still don’t hit as high as a ranger with 2 buttons. I watched a video of a ranger and all they did was run in circles with a rifle on click the first skill button for 600 damage a hit then click another skill which fired multiple shots for almost 3k a piece… and that was on arah explorable. For them to get that kind of damage and have 24k hp and medium armor while I sit there with 15khp and my light armor trying to survive while switching 4 elements and balancing all like 7 of my boons and still hitting less than that just seems a little unbalanced. Luckily I don’t care cause I’m having fun. Only posted on here cause I didn’t like how you both oversimplified a very challenging character. And if your truly only doing that in dungeons too you’re not even close to holding up your portion of the dps.

I have done dungeons. They’re not that hard either. If you’re playing the ele right, those things we mentioned that you say are so oversimplified do buttloads of damage. If you have a boon build, then yeah, you’re gonna be expending a lot of energy managing boons. But you don’t have to run a boon build. Also, boon builds are best when you can also apply boons to allies, and that is where your big contribution as a boon build comes in. In high level dungeons, my 1 skills in fire and air do at least 600 per cast (keep in mind, that’s split into three hits for fire and two hits for air, but it’s still one cast same as the ranger’s) My earth 1 skill hits for around 300-350 but crits around 600 AND applies a 10 second bleed. And my burns and bleeds are stupid powerful. For big hits, fire grab and churning earth are huge. I can do as much damage as any other player out there. If you can’t, then that means that your build isn’t made for it. And that’s not even a bad thing, necessarily. It just means that your build is not a damage build.

Anlyon.8375:

PvE

• Gather 5 mobs -> Glyph of Storms is Earth -> Churning Earth -> any Burning skill -> /dance -> collect loot

WvW

• Equip Staff -> Glyph of Storms in Earth -> Eruption -> Flame Burst -> Collect loot

PvP

• Play lots and learn what to dodge, and what to do when -> Get a decent build -> ??? -> Equip awesome looking Scepter/Dagger.

I think we have a little work to be done, but all in all, we’re in a good spot, and i’ve been playing since BWE #1 and watching the ele since 2009.

Swap that scepter/dagger for d/d and I’ll be your friend =)
I’m glad I’m not the only one who’s figured this out.

Erebus doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Health pools don’t really mean that much in this game, to be honest. I have 11.8k hp on my Ele, enough toughness to choke a horse, and I do enough damage to pretty quickly win a 1v1 against just about anyone I’ve come up against.
If you spec for full damage (i.e. a glass cannon build) you shouldn’t be trying to 1v1 anything. You should be coming out of nowhere to very quickly turn the tide of close battles. You can make all kinds of builds that will be useful and have great applications, but they won’t all be able to go toe to toe with everyone in 1v1 situation. This is a different kind of PvP and Arenanet likes it that way. I do, too. There’s more to strategy than “run at enemy, mash buttons, repeat”

Jnaathra.6549:

I have been able to manage all the story quests solo as a staff elementalist. Lot of circle strafes and kiting.

For WvW they make a great keep bomber/defender. Beyond that I consider them extremely sub-par for both wvw roaming and spvp.

That’s because staff ele is not designed to be a roamer. It’s designed for group combat. Everyone wants to be a roamer and expects whatever weapon set they like to be good at it, but this game isn’t designed that way.

DeXyre.6025:

Pinkerton.5643:

But we’re not the lowest in the game. That prize goes to Thief.

We have the same base hp as thief (and guardian)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

hmm, good to know.
All I know is my roommate has significantly more trouble doing well on his thief than I do on my elementalist.