Guild Wars 2

Meh, I think that would net us with some very lackluster feeling weapon skills.

I’m almost to the point where I think they should just say “these classes are great in large fights” and “these classes are great in smaller fights” … give us one or the other.

Right now it’s “these classes are always great” and “these classes are only great in smaller fights”.

Our Ranger traps are supposed to be getting some reworks done to them though … so I’m holding off on comparing traps.

The Guardian’s new +15% dmg trait has me concerned though since that allows this traitline + one other to give them a total of +50% dmg on their target(s).

• Big Game Hunter + Fiery Wrath + Zealous Blade + Symbolic Avenger = 15% + 10% + 5% + 20% = +50% damage … from two specializations

Here’s a mean example which I’m probably going to partake in on my Mesmer with my Guardian buddies

• Mesmer: Mass Invis
• Guardians: Binding Blade … damage will break their stealth but they’ve got you now
• Guardians: Symbol of Wrath
• Guardians: Pull
• Mesmer: CC (shield will be great for this)
• Guardians: Whirling Blade

Profit.

I’m less concerned with it in a 1v1 as my attention and cooldowns are focused on that Guardian. In a larger group fight … that damage combination is going to be ridiculous.

Here’s a mean example which I’m probably going to partake in on my Mesmer with my Guardian buddies

• Mesmer: Mass Invis
• Guardians: Binding Blade … damage will break their stealth but they’ve got you now
• Guardians: Symbol of Wrath
• Guardians: Pull
• Mesmer: CC (shield will be great for this)
• Guardians: Whirling Blade

Profit.

On my mesmer, I’m with you Windwalker.
On my ranger, I have an initial “wtf” feeling.

Thought about it a bit more:
Signet of Courage’s passive could make Guardian stacking even more of a thing in WvW. You basically just made a new Healing Signet but with a group heal that is ideal for the melee trains.

Basically, it’d just be promoting more passive play from a class that already has loads of such passive play … enough to actually be able to facetank damage in a game where facetanking kills others.

I’d prefer to see things that promote more active play … in a game with action combat … where active plays are why you want action combat.

You have 3s stability on a 4s cooldown.

Easy access to cripple on your auto in group fights

An interrupt (knockback) every 7s if you melee with your longbow … which does just as good damage in melee as it does at range

A cripple every knockback … so do please melee with that longbow … no real reason not to.

I think you can get over the “name” issue with “Dragonhunter” and “Traps” /eyeroll.

Yeah, initial impressions looking at it … I’m aggravated. It does look like a “better Ranger”.

Already gave my opinions in the Ranger forum:

• https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/DH-Wipes-the-Floor-With-LB-Ranger/first#post5047278

They said in the video they wanted a backline weapon … that sucker isn’t backline … it’s on a heavy armor class, wants to pierce so it can cripple, wants to be in melee so it can interrupt every 7s with a knockback (that will cripple more), and so on.

3s of stability on a 4s cooldown with an 0.75s cast.

It looks like it needs some tweaking … downward if that wasn’t clear enough.

I can’t watch twitch from work, but looking at dulfy:

• http://dulfy.net/2015/05/08/gw2-dragonhunter-ready-up-livestream-notes/

Longbow skills

• http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gw2-dragonhunter-longbow-skills1.jpg

Why is their longbow hitting for solid damage regardless of range, piercing without traits, applying cripple if it hits more than 1 target, and fire every 0.75s as opposed to our 1.00s (0.90s traited). That doesn’t look right. Is there some aftercast that at least makes it more than the 0.75s listed?

Trueshot #2 and Deflecting Shot #3 both look like they’d hurt … what is up with 4s cooldown. I’m hoping that is just a “still in development” issue. It has the same cast time as the auto-attack so that currently looks like skill that you simply cast every time it’s not on cooldown. Not very skillful but looks very effective … more effective low skill-floor crap for Guardians. Deflecting Shot is in a similar position with its fact cast time, still decent damage and affecting any attacks since it’s a blind and projectile destroyer.

Symbol of Energy … this seems okay. I’m just amazed that this weapon has so many hard-hitting skills with such low cooldowns.

Hunter’s Ward … I’ll need to see the video to see the damage on this, but that final damage looks painful. At least this isn’t on some less than 20s cooldown. Bit annoyed that it not only traps but cripples too. Stepping on our toes there a bit.

Traps

• http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gw2-dragonhunter-trap-skills2.jpg

These all hit hard. We’ll have to see how our own traps stack up to these once they are done with the rework there. Hopefully we’ll be on par. Nothing too horrible here except a Zerk Guardian with 3 traps stacked could ruin someone’s day pretty darn quickly. If you’re full melee, you might cry given they can stack on their traps and pew pew you with their new longbow.

Traits:

• http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gw2-dragonhunter-traits1.jpg

Minor Traits
Look fine. Nothing to write home about.

Adept Traits
Bleed on traps, looks lackluster, zealot’s aggression and soaring devastation could be sick if paired with other things. We’ll come back to Zealot’s Aggression.

Master Traits
Hunter’s Determination gives 3s stability per target hit by a skill that hits hard, casts quickly, and is on a 4s cooldown … so 3s of stability every 4.75s …. really?! I’m hoping that’s one of those “still in development” things that will be getting tweaked.

Bulwark looks fine.

Dulled senses isn’t too bad … until you look at the synergy with the grandmaster.

Grandmaster Traits
Hunter’s Fortification doesn’t look too bad given how long the virtues cooldowns currently are.

Heavy Light just looks ridiculous when you pair it with the other factors. First, now they want to be in melee with that Longbow because (1) it doesn’t do any less damage in melee (2) knockback is an interrupt … interrupt every 7s just from attacking (3) that knockback synergizes with dulled senses to cripple you (4) that cripple from dulled senses synergizes with zealot’s aggression for extra damage … now back to their minor that does +10% dmg at >= 600 range … or you can be crippled, constantly interrupted, and taking +10% dmg from them any time they get you within 300 range.

Big Game Hunter could hurt, but there are other traits in game that resemble it … I’m just curious about this stacking with other +% dmg traits … as that would get to pretty darn ridiculous levels.

• Big Game Hunter + Fiery Wrath + Zealous Blade + Symbolic Avenger = 15% + 10% + 5% + 20% = +50% damage … from two specializations

I think at the very least some numbers need to be tweaked here … math isn’t that hard.

YuiRS.8129:

Time Warp will be providing much longer Quickness for one.

Is that a fact? I saw no duration mentioned.

Time Warp only allows your group 10s of Quickness, they have to stay in it to get the full 10s, and it provides nothing else (no Fury). It also has a long cooldown.

This needs to be taken into account. Given that it is a large part of why Mesmers are still in the PvE speedrun meta, if care isn’t taken with this, it will likely get Mesmers edged out of the one place they are sometimes considered “meta”.

NOTE: maybe the meta will change when the specialization changes are all in … still need to take care.

For Guardian, these looks like they could be fun and interesting.

However, if you’re going to let Guardian apply Quickness to the party, then I hope you are upping Mesmers’ ability to do reliable damage in PvE. Otherwise you could possibly be edging Mesmers completely out of the speedrun meta. Guardians already do more damage more reliably and have higher uptime on their reflects … not to mention heavy armor and no worries about AOE/cleave killing their phantasms (back to the reliable aspect of damage).

Probably because it’s much easier to take a class that is strongly positioned in every Meta and very straightforward in its gameplay and make additions to it …

… as opposed to a class that is not strongly positioned in the meta and has a very “special” sort of gameplay … not to mention several different builds that can play quite differently … just compare shatter vs phantasm vs interrupt

I’d argue that pew pew Ranger requires considerable skill when faced with a skilled opponent … because skilled opponents know several ways to counter Rapid Fire and taking Rapid Fire from a longbow puts it in a bad position.

There is a reason that Guardian is part of every meta and Ranger is part of none of them.

Everything is technically killable … anyone’s HP can go to 0 :-p

I agree with you on the hard counter … but I think they have an uphill battle to fight trying to get us away from “build wars” … assuming they are even trying to get away from that.

As I said before … they’re likely going to rub the salt right back in our eyes after the stream (I can’t watch twitch from work).

Guardian has been one of the dominant classes in the meta for WvW, sPvP, and PvE. Not once have I seen someone go “oh crap, we have a Guardian in our party”.

It is that class that can facetank in a game where most people that facetank die horrible, disfiguring deaths … one of the very reasons I love being on my Mesmer so I can strip most of that BS from them so they can either “not play like crap” or “just die” (I hate extremely effective low skill floors … so love “correcting” them).

There should be no surprise that its new Specialization is powerful.

Too strong? Because the list of ways to counter a phantasm attack isn’t long enough?

• Blind the Mesmer … phantasm not even summoned
• Interrupt the Mesmer … phantasm not even summoned
• LOS the Mesmer … phantasm not even summoned
• [Accidentally] kill the phantasm … no phantasm attack
• Blind the Phantasm … phantasm attack misses
• Aegis … phantasm attack blocked
• Block … phantasm attack blocked
• Dodge … phantasm attack dodged

… on and on …

I’m still trying to figure out where my arrows and axes are coming from … they’re never-ending!

Link to it at 37:39 right when he’s going to click the ability twice (your link didn’t include the specific time).

• https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=vvpSVqvJLlo#t=2259

What? You don’t have butterflies? I win.

/thread

With my class, I can have fun beating people when I play better than them … boo yah!

With my class, I can also have fun beating difficult content when I don’t play poorly … boom!

/thread.

I think we’re all forgetting that the Elite Specialization is going to come with a new Staff skin :-p

Aye, they can choose any class they want. I won’t care one bit. They’ll likely still die and complain in whatever class forum(s).

Currently:

• Bleeding = 42.5 + (0.05 * Condition Damage) per second per stack
• Poison = 84 + (0.1 * Condition Damage) per second

So if they kept that it would make poison drastically stronger than bleeding.

They have alluded to the fact that they will be making changes to the damage done by burning/poison since they will be stacking … so I expect the poison to be dropped a bit.

I fully understand the concern about using bleeds to cover an opponent’s heals, but I’m not that concerned with it as a Ranger given that we are very good at re-application of Poison … and with conditions, even now with stacking duration, re-application is king.

If you don’t like Warrior’s Longbow, you might not like Guardian’s either … from the info they’ve given, it looks like it could be Guardian’s condition weapon.

Mind Wrack’s AOE is small.
Ranger can combo Rapid Fire with Barrage and Pet … lead with Barrage cast, go into Rapid Fire.

Mesmers aren’t the only ones that can combo things.

I do agree that it is somewhat apples to oranges, but when you break it down, it doesn’t look great.

Back to what I originally said though … I’d be perfectly happy if Mind Wrack just had the same cooldown as my Rapid Fire. Even with 6 in Illusions my Mind Wrack has a longer cooldown than Rapid Fire … and Mind Wrack has a setup (Illusions).

Chill or Slow … I’m happy with either. Slow down their attacks or slow down their cooldowns … attacks does affect Thieves more though … tired of them being immune to our crap due to their initiative system … wish Anet would come up with some way for initiative to be affected …

In my opinion, Emphathic Bond isn’t good enough to need to be nerfed. It already suffers from a long cooldown that you have no control over and can’t even see.

That’s not magic, that’s skill. I have a bag of infinite axes and I pull 5 out at one time for a single skilled throw :-p

I’m also so skilled with axes that I can spin them and aim them sufficiently to hit 3 targets :-p

Aye, I’m waiting to see traps and spirits.

If spirits are still procs, but finally worth taking … shortbow will likely be the better ranged weapon with them due to its faster attack speed.

I’ve had the same thought about poison volley. That with Poison Mastery could be even meaner

I still am holding out that they’ll remove the darn condition (flanking) from the condition application of our shortbow. It’s a small angle, but still aggravating.

I’m all for more pet customization.

I disagree with removing the F-keys for attack/come_here … those simple commands are necessary for better control of your pet … as is passive/active.

I disagree with requiring content to make the pet stronger. I’m happy that it keeps up with me since it is essentially a part of my character.

I disliked having to level any new pet I got in GW1. That was quite annoying.

I disagree. In Diablo 2, the druid was summoning the wind via magic to “do its thing”. With Whirling Defense in GW2, the Ranger is moving the Axes so quickly that they are deflecting/reflecting the projectiles.

Aside from looking evil (not my thing), I think that looks really cool, miststim.

Only other critique is that you’re not a Norn … you should hang your head in shame :-p

@Lazze:
Good eyes. I think you’re right.

samanosuke asakura.6240:

hmm i hope your right lazze. btw you think they will take a look on the shouts as well?

We can only hope. The shouts need some work.

I could see something like that for the druid, but a Ranger isn’t going to just throw his Axes in the air and them defend him while he does other things.

It makes zero sense

I agree with Durzlla’s post on “consecration”.

Consecration is the solemn dedication to a special purpose or service, usually religious. The word consecration literally means “association with the sacred”. Persons, places, or things can be consecrated, and the term is used in various ways by different groups. A synonym for to consecrate is to sanctify; a distinct antonym is to desecrate.

So let’s go through it:

• Druids in other lore have held Nature to be sacred
• Druid in other lore have spoken of the sanctity of nature

Heck, look at some of the dialogue/lore in Warcraft (RTS and MMO) with their Druids.

@mistsim:
No, I’m there with you on the pets getting BM points by default … though it likely won’t be the full 300 since the other classes aren’t getting their full points from their class-specific traitline either …

… though Elementalist can further reduce their attunement cooldowns by taking Arcane … so maybe one of the minor adepts for BM will change to give us those last few BM points for our pets.

If you want to know the effects of BM points on your pet … please see this post I made over a year ago with the math for it.

• https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Beastmastery-Math/first

Let’s make something clear … I (and others) don’t give two craps how much time anyone claims to have anywhere in the game. Do you know how many people I’ve interviewed for actual jobs at my workplace that have claimed years of experience with something and either didn’t have knowledge that reflected that or were completely BSing?

Saying you have X time with something means nothing.

To make the point even clearer … do you know how many hours my kids (9 & 5) have on Minecraft? Tons. They’ve even made their own minecraft videos for their friends. Does that make them experts? Heck no.

This isn’t just directed at you mistsim … plenty of people doing this every day.

Now that that is out of the way …

Whether or not Path of Scars is “too slow” is debatable. Even with it hitting once per usage, it has some of the highest Ranger weapon DPS. If it double-taps, it’s head and shoulders above other skills. Would I like it to be faster? Sure. Does it need it? That’s debatable … It either needs to be faster or we (the players) need to work with the current speed.

Whirling Defense. Is it horrible DPS? Yes. It’s worse than all auto-attacks except for MH Axe when it isn’t double-tapping the target.

Does being immobile for so long make us an easy target for any non-projectiles? Yes

Do these two facts largely see the glory of Path of Scars overshadowed by Whirling Defense? My opinion is yes and I believe I’ve seen several other opinions that match my own on this one … though some of them thinking allowing movement during it would be sufficient while I think we’d need to look at an OH weapon skill with a huge cooldown doing less than auto-attacks … as that throws a red flag in my mind.

I do like your suggestion for us to be allowed to do other things during it … functionally that would be nice. From an actual look and feel though, I’m not sold. How would I be keeping up a whirling defense with my axes while my hands are doing other things or I’m rolling on the ground?

I think it’s more a result of the Ranger getting more than just the Specialization changes.

With everything in ANet’s pipeline, Rangers have:

• Changes from Specialization System … just like everyone else
• A new elite Specialization … just like everyone else
• A new weapon … just like everyone else
• New utilities … just like everyone else
• Traps changes … just us
• Spirit changes … just us
• AI changes … mostly us … Some other classes use AI, but theirs is drastically simpler given that their AI never has to deal with commands issued from them except to die to create some other effect. No one else has AI with auto-attacks, 2 skills with cooldowns, an F2 ability, passive/active settings, and attack/follow commands … not to mention interaction with Shout utilities (Search & Rescue and Guard).

That’s considerably more stuff that needs to be done for Rangers … so we’re “less finished” than the others.

@OP:
Do what you want and have fun with it.

What you decide won’t affect my own decisions one bit.

I don’t think that took you that long … and here’s a nice agreement

• You be nice and help others
• I’ll be nice and help others.

If we were all nice and helpful … we’d all win :-)

Thank you for providing the link and info.

It’s not me questioning you, it’s me wanting to know exactly what you’re referencing.

If I didn’t get the link from you, I’d find something and come back and ask “is this what you were talking about?”. I’d rather just ask you and skip a step.

From a lore standpoint, it’s a trait for Survival skills and as such seems to belong in the Wilderness Survival specializations.

They talked about moving traits to that each had particular purpose(s) / theme(s) you can select from. It looks like:

• Marksmanship = Signets
• Skirmishing = Traps
• Wilderness Survival = Survival
• Nature Magic = Spirits
• Beastmastery = Shouts
• Druid = whatever new skill type we’re getting.

As such, Wildnerness Knowledge being in Wilderness Survival makes sense.

You realize you’re talking on the Ranger forums about having to deal with cooldowns you can’t see, right? :-p

Have you seen:

• Ranger pets?
• Ranger passive condition removal (Empathic and SoR)
• Our plethora of traits with their ICDs?

Just saying :-)

Well, if we assume that Wells and Traps are out of the picture … what does that leave us from the list of abilities? :-p

I’m right there with you loving Druid. Was a WoW Druid myself … so versatile!

@TheFantasticGman:
Do you have a link to where Jon Peters confirmed that?

Chaos, there isn’t enough salt here … not salt from tears but salt to really rub in the wound ;-)

Though … they might rub it back in our eyes after tomorrow’s PoI :-p

I’m hoping to see the most come out for Necromancer, Ranger, and Mesmer … Engineer and Thief following behind us … Warrior, Guard, and Ele can give the rest of us a turn.

I think people keep forgetting that the devs said they’d be revamping Ranger spirits and traps and other posts have discussed improved AI for HoT … so we might all get blown out of the water by the Ranger love … I wouldn’t mind that … it’s my other GW2 baby

Banners wouldn’t be a bad thing to get as far as PvE is concerned … Thief consecration makes me lol.

Good points Sorel. But if we’re going to bring up the instant cast even while CC’d … let’s factor in everything.

Rapid Fire

• Pro: Drastically longer range (1,500)
• Pro: More damage
• Pro: Lower cooldown
• Con: Projectile (anti-projectiles, reflects, etc.)
• Con: Non-instant

Mind Wrack

• Pro: Instant
• Con: Less Damage
• Con: Longer Cooldown
• Con: Drastically Less Range
• Con: Requires Illusions

The only thing I can think “balance-wise” is that they are factoring in our other damage … but shatters (pre-Chrono) kill a chunk of that damage (Phantasms) until you can resummon it.

I, too, love the shatter playstyle because it feels more “active” to me than alternatives (except interrupt) and because of the crazy shenanigans it allows which often lead to a friend saying in TS “how the … did you do ….”.

I’m a long-time 4/4/0/0/6 Mesmer from back when it was 20/20/0/0/30 … I just can’t help but compare the two classes I play the most.

That would make more sense to me SlimChance.

I had a recent random thought while playing the other night …

Why does my Mesmer’s Mind Wrack do less damage then my Ranger’s Rapid Fire but have a longer cooldown and require illusions?

pick 2 of those, but all 3 … meh.

• Less damage but same/less cooldown and require illusions
• Same damage but longer cooldown and require illusions

Those would make more sense to me … and I’m not even touching on the much longer range of my Rapid Fire nor how a viable counter to it is “whoops, your illusions were accidentally cleaved/AOE’d before they shattered”.

Fluffball.8307:

Sebrent.3625:

Will have to see the rest of the specializations, but it’s an interesting thought … not sure if I feel like Chronomancer is Mesmer + Necro either.

6 gods, 6 dragons, 6 specializations we don’t know about yet. 6×6×6 is 216. 2+1+6=9. 9-6(gods/dragons/specializations we don’t know about) = 3. 12(months)-5(May)=7. 7+3=10. HoT is released in October.

LMAO! I love it! … made better due responses.

Less vocal doesn’t correlate to less important.

One player on the Guard forums was saying that it makes sense to them and that for those who are familiar with how GW1 works, specializations seem like a way to do the dual classes in GW1.

He believes that:
Chronomancer = Primary Mesmer + Secondary Necro
Dragonhunter = Primary Guardian + Secondary Ranger

Will have to see the rest of the specializations, but it’s an interesting thought … not sure if I feel like Chronomancer is Mesmer + Necro either.

You’ll never get our Ranger pets!

Having little buddies you can name is our domain :-p