I feel that most of the players that have left are just taking a back seat to see what happens. It’s possible to bring these players back, but something drastic has to happen.
@ 2on2/3on3: A lot of you guys really seem to like this idea. So do we. We’re looking at game types which encourage this style of play. Another thing we’re looking at it combining the size of fights with larger tactical/strategic implications, so that there is something fun going on the micro level (the actual fight) and the macro level (the map overall).
@ Not having RPG elements in our game when compared to most MOBAS: Keep this in mind. It’s what gives the mobas their flow/pace. We need to build mechanics that change the pacing/feel of the map in a similar way, without hampering the fun players have. I think you get the same thing out of an RTS, but in a different way. Both sides start off with few resources and weak units. Over time they build up in both areas, and the middle/late game are very different than the early game.
I’ll keep looking for other things to respond to in this thread. Thanks for all the feedback/ideas guys.
I’m glad that Anet is taking these into more serious consideration. With regard to your comment about 2v2, 3v3; people just want a simple arena to duke it out. I don’t think trying to “encourage” these situations through game types and objectives will help. Those will come naturally with new game types.
With MOBA style maps, please don’t encourage gear progression. Everyone should still be equal in terms of gear, but gain point advantages through resource control. Making towers weaker by taking out trebs or something to that effect. Maybe strengthening walls through kills even. Just some ideas.
But thanks for even starting this thread. It’s giving me a lot of hope.
Esports status should naturally come to a game. Certain aspects such as watchability and a good game mode is what makes games become esports. As of right now, conquest as an esports map is not working and it’s the little things that hinder the development of esports.
Overall damage is too high which makes the speed of the game way too fast. I’m sure a lot of you guys have watched the tournaments and shoutcasters to see that. The shoutcasters talk a mile a minute. It’s a lot to take in especially when there’s a big fight for mid point. If someone goes down, it doesn’t seem like it affects the match like a death in dota or lol would. So not dying is also part of the strategy because you give your opponents points when you yourself die.
The conquest game mode itself needs a lot of work, but since it’s the only game mode since release, a lot of people are tired of seeing it. I don’t know what else to suggest for conquest because I’m also tired of playing it.
I feel the reason why MOBA style games are so popular now is because there really is a lot of strategy involved. Losing a tower, gaining a buff, and even dying affects your team, but not so much that your team is doomed or guaranteed success. There are ways to slowly fight back and still win. In GW2, once you’re 100 pts behind, its almost impossible to catch up. Sure in Forest or Foefire, you can kill the npcs for points and maybe catch a break and win the match, but I think with those maps there should be more npcs that are worth less points so that you have to weigh into your strategy whether or not taking out a certain number of npcs will reward or punish your team.
I’m just rambling at this point, and am just gonna be a little more patient to see if new game modes will actually be released. Otherwise, it’s a wrap.
The long queue times are attributed to the low player population and I don’t think things like leaderboards, rewards, or balance can bring a lot of players back. Something new and exciting like other game modes (which I believe is the culprit to the low population) will draw in players both old and new. In any mmo, balance is always an issue, but people will play through the imbalances.
Fixing the 4v5 issues should be a top priority along with new game modes. A lot of players stop queuing or rage quit when they’re 95% guaranteed a loss. This is the most basic part of pvp infrastructure.
@Wintel
While I understand where Anet tried to go by eliminating dedicated healers, it still deprives a certain group of players who want to exclusively heal. Sure Anet can push those players towards support builds, but it’s not the same (or fun to some of those players) as being a dedicated healer. The problems I see now with support builds are boon juggling. Add boon, steal boon, boon stripping, applying conditions to negate boons, etc., has caused it own set of problems, especially to classes that don’t have much access to either boons or condition removal.
I can see dedicated healers being extremely OP in the conquest game type because of the extra bunkering power provided by dedicated healers, but it’s no different now where instead of a healer being a requirement, a bunker or two are required for a team. Hopefully in the near future, we will have other game types that won’t depend on bunkers so much.
Healers and tanks are a minority: a rarity even. The vast majority of players prefer DPS roles. WoW LFG taught you this. Wanted to run a dungeon? Pop the LFG tool. Wanted to wait 15-20 minutes? Queued as DPS. Wanted to wait 10-20 seconds? Queued as a healer or a tank.
I never stated that healers and tanks were a majority because they didn’t need to be in WoW. It’s true in WoW that a tank can find a group effortlessly, more so as a healer, but we’re discussing tpvp roles here. From a PvE standpoint, GW2 dungeons were designed not to rely on tanks and healers, just support and dps mainly. I never ran a dungeon in GW2 ever since release so I have no input as to how a dedicated healer would affect the PvE side of the game so I’ll refrain from making any assumptions in that regard.
Better quality can mean what ever you want. E.g. only one or two warriors at most.
If you have an opinion on what a good match should look like, please share it.
I kind of like the idea of having only one of each profession per team. That can lead to some serious thinking towards strategy. That combined with better matchmaking can lead to better games. Truthfully, I’d rather wait on more game types, but this can be a quick fix.
In regards to 4v5 situations, I think that everyone has to hit the ready button before the match starts and if there is one player that doesn’t click the ready button, they should be replaced by another player currently queued until everyone is ready to play. It might lead to slightly longer wait times, but LoL players are willing to wait until there are two complete teams before starting so I’m sure most of us are willing to wait as well.
To stay on topic before the thread gets completely derailed, none of us know much about programming or Anet’s source code for the game engine, but it’s still important to keep this topic fresh even though it has been brought up time and again. Much like the game type and rewards discussions, if it’s brought up enough times, the devs would take it more seriously. Personal attacks on character are best left to PMs.
The lack of a ptr has really hurt the implementation of balance patches in this game and if Anet (not necessarily the devs) would just be more open about the development of this game, we wouldn’t have all these problems. And if we still had these problems, at the very least we would know what is actually being worked on from a player’s perspective.
I am no programmer and I’m sure it’s easy to say what can and can’t be done in the forums, but I’m positive that whatever changes are made or are being made is not easy (especially for such a skeleton crew of pvp developers and programmers). Still, better communication on upcoming changes or some effort into creating a ptr would benefit the game and it’s community a lot.
I really feel particle effects being over the top are holding back viewers.
Many of us have the same opinion, though I’m not sure which team has that as a work item, and at what priority.
I think something the dev team might want to look into is maybe pulling the camera back a little further. I brought this up at the time the game was released, but I think at this point, instead of coding into the reduction of particle effects, it might make more sense to back up the camera and see if players can see better through the effects.
I noticed that if I ran behind the crates at the dock in the Capricorn map, the camera automatically zooms to the point where I can’t see anything other than myself. That problem on top of the particles going on the point, makes it very frustrating to play.
@Wintel
While I understand where Anet tried to go by eliminating dedicated healers, it still deprives a certain group of players who want to exclusively heal. Sure Anet can push those players towards support builds, but it’s not the same (or fun to some of those players) as being a dedicated healer. The problems I see now with support builds are boon juggling. Add boon, steal boon, boon stripping, applying conditions to negate boons, etc., has caused it own set of problems, especially to classes that don’t have much access to either boons or condition removal.
I can see dedicated healers being extremely OP in the conquest game type because of the extra bunkering power provided by dedicated healers, but it’s no different now where instead of a healer being a requirement, a bunker or two are required for a team. Hopefully in the near future, we will have other game types that won’t depend on bunkers so much.
^I can agree with that, but consider that you still can get those moments of being the savior quite easily with some builds.
Very true. I guess I just miss being a healer (especially my disc priest and holy pally) and I felt that Anet completely disregarded a population of players who actually like to heal and provide full on support.
As someone that played PvP in WoW since vanilla to Cata, I would like to think that the absence of healer is great for PvP!
In example, what was the most fun 2v2s? If you say 1 Dps and 1 Healer, I’ll start to wonder what’s wrong with you…
The most enjoyable fights was in general 2 vs 2 Damage-dealers.
I’ll somewhat disagree. In a 2v2 situation it’s fun to have 2 dps players on both sides, but when you got to 3v3 and 5v5 arenas, I had the most fun as a healer. In BG’s, I also had the most fun as a healer when you get that one crit heal on a warrior and he ends up taking down 2 or more players and we continue to wreck others cause we coordinated better. There was a sense of fulfillment when you know you’ve played a sizable role in supporting your team, especially in 5v5 arenas.
I can barely hear what the shoutcaster was saying. Sounded like the Micro Machine guy…
Thanks for getting an official thread started.
One of my biggest concerns regarding new game modes such as CTF, Team DM, KotH, etc. is the pace of the games (largely due to overall high damage across all classes). I’ve been advocating new game modes since launch but understand the challenges of implementing all of the game modes that players want to see.
Most of the game modes that are being requested can not be played competitively, but are purely for fun which in turn can increase the pvp population and maybe get a few to play conquest competitively.
Moba style battles can make for some very fun pvp. Some people will say to just play WvW, but sPvP doesn’t have gear imbalances so that argument is rendered mute. Plus WvW is a continuous mode whereas a GvG large scale map can have a winner.
All in all, I just want to see something different. New game modes with different objectives will allow for more build variety. In CTF for instance, it may be necessary to run more CC builds, whereas KotH might need more bunkers etc. I guess we wouldn’t know what will happen until it happens. I would suggest toning down the damage of every class so that we can have larger teams.
Edit: The concerns surrounding splitting the current player base is the reason why the current population is so stagnant. What needs to happen is that we need to attract more players to pvp thereby increasing the player base. New game modes will definitely bring in new and former players who will at least give it a shot. In the short term, the player base will be split, but as population increases from the new game modes I feel it will come back stronger. Casual friendly battlegrounds and GvG will make players recruit from outside the current pvp population. WoW battlegrounds are full of casual and my former guild would recruit PVE only members to come join us in BGs. Some of them remain casual and some become pvpers, but at least we got a few to pvp with us.
(edited by SuperHaze.4210)
Dont need to reference wow with regards to pvp modes, gw1 had more variety than any other game.
Random arenas random 4v4 no leaderboards of course cause thats meaningless
Team arenas 4v4 same format as random arenas but proper teams
Codex Arena limited skills available which change periodically
Alliance battle 3 teams of 4 v 3 teams of 4.
Fort aspenwood 8v8 assualt and defend.
jade quarry 8v8 collect resources with npcs
heroes accent 8v8 map progression with 9 maps in succession.
guild versus guild 8 versus 8 differnt guild halls with different tertiary objectives.
not to mention the lvl 10 arenas.
In short gw1 is an easy way to introduce something, and it doesnt matter if it works, we wont find out if it works or not until its played competetivly.
GW1 had lots of great pvp maps, but I was hoping for something larger like AV where the raid leader can break us up into groups and it was our responsibility to take out certain npc’s. Then rush down to the end of the map where the boss is at. The most coordinated servers had the best chance of winning when almost everyone fulfilled their duties.
With flag carriers in WSG, the same rules for orb carriers can be applied to flag carriers, but the flag carrier can run just a bit faster if the map was larger.
WSG, AB, and AV were my favorite battlegrounds and I would like to see these style maps in GW2. They don’t have to be competitive, just fun. After a year of conquest, the game is pretty much stagnant until there are more playable options for pvpers. Maybe a map where two teams do a dungeon speed run side by side and whoever finishes the run first wins the match. I think it would promote more team play and we wouldn’t have to focus so much on balance because non-viable builds might work in different game modes.
but…it’s hotjoin…who care…it’s not competitive.
Although true, I feel it makes the initial PVP experience for noobs really frustrating.
In the merged HotM, there should also be a multi-room dueling arena where two players can enter each room and start a duel while everyone else hanging around the HotM can sit up top and watch. I’m pretty sure there would be A LOT more people hanging out, form teams, etc. It would be a great community builder.
Warriors used to be a joke of a class and now that they have some kind of use, everyone is crying foul. The only issue I have with warriors at the moment is the healing signet. Tone that down and the warriors will be in a better place. The biggest issue for the game’s balance atm is condition damage.
Joke class? They’ve reigned supreme in PvE since launch and now they reign supreme in every single style of play offered by the game. Something has got to give here. Just about everyone I know is rerolling warrior and if you go into SPvP or WvWvW you will find throngs of them with hammers at the ready. Their natural survivability is way too high to allow for the kind of control and damage they’re capable of at the moment.
They were a joke in PvP after the quickness nerf and plenty of people shelved their warriors for a long time until the recent buffs. You yourself said people are rerolling, which means that prior to the buffs, no one you knew were playing warriors as their main outside of PVE. Granted they are kings of PvE, which doesn’t apply here, no one took a warrior on their pvp team because they used to be as worthless as eles are now.
I did mention their regen is out of control, which needs to be toned down. Their damage is arguable because it can be dodge fairly easily. Maybe increase the cooldown or make warriors lose a bit of adrenaline on missed Earthshakers so they have to put some thought into when to use it.
Can new people stop complaining about mesmers. I was one of two mesmers in the entire mlg tournament. the recent vvv tourney I assume only had 1 mesmer. at top levels, mesmers are very underrepresented. so please please please, can new players stop complaining about mesmers simply because they havent played long enough to tell a very mechanical looking clone from the real thing?
The guy was asking for help. He in no way was complaining about mesmers.
Warriors used to be a joke of a class and now that they have some kind of use, everyone is crying foul. The only issue I have with warriors at the moment is the healing signet. Tone that down and the warriors will be in a better place. The biggest issue for the game’s balance atm is condition damage.
I can’t see a thing in the middle of the battle because of all the particles/minions/clones/bombs etc. I just want the camera to be able to back up further so that I can maybe see myself.
what will happen if 2 guys are down by the same skill (AOE?)? Who will rally first?
Maybe the closest downed player to the finished player should be rezzed?
I like the idea of a large map the size of HotM with 10v10 or even 20v20, although 20v20 is a pretty large group. I’m also tired of these small maps which forces a lot of zerging so a large WvW style battleground would be a nice change of pace.
Edo Tensei and NevirSayDie,
I don’t want to play Team Arena or Solo Arena because i’m not a competitive player and never will be.I don’t play for rankings or for place on the leader boards.I just want to have some fun with 1 or 2 of my friends while playing casually Hot Join.
I don’t want Auto balancing to break my group because one of the teams is weaker and is leaving the Arena non-stop.Also Custom arenas are not for me because for a week i play maximum 8 hours.I don’t want to buy something and to rent it afterwards so i don’t play it at all.
One of the biggest issues developers have to avoid is allowing an organized group of several friends to play against a “weaker team” of unorganized people. If you’re playing together and making the other team ragequit, you’ll be just fine in a team queue. You don’t have to be trying for a “high rating.” You could say a similar thing about PvE: “I’m not really trying for a legendary, so I don’t PvE.” If it’s fun, do it. If not, don’t.
I didn’t mean to rent a custom arena, I meant you can join one already existing. You’ll find things like 5v5 servers, duel servers, etc. Look for something that seems interesting to you and fits your group size.
If you try out custom arenas and team arenas and don’t like them, that’s fine. But don’t judge them if you’ve never tried them, especially when there are so many people telling you that they’re probably exactly what you’re looking for.
What the OP was trying to get at is that it shouldn’t take jumping through hoops to play hotjoin with friends. Coming from WoW myself, I liked the fact that me and a couple of guildies can queue up for BGs and have fun together. It might be imbalanced from time to time in our favor, but it can also happen vice versa when a guild from another server joins the same BG and gives us a run for our money. It’s a different kind of competitiveness because it becomes server vs server. Nothing beats seeing another guild from a different server and knowing you’re going to have to work your butt off for the win, yet at the same time we don’t worry about rank or forced to play strictly in a 5v5. Sometimes there would be a lone player that we would invite into our group or guild but since the WoW BG maps are large enough with plenty of players from multiple servers, there’s room for both group AND solo play. I can hop in solo and find a group from my server and we’d go at it in BGs for a couple hours. That’s the kind of casual pvp that I believe the OP (as well as myself) is looking for.
Most ele builds aren’t as strong as they used to be. There’s still d/d and the s/d Fresh Air build for burst, but it’s best to wait for the next balance patch to see if there are any buffs. Eles are currently at the bottom of the totem pole next to engis.
There’s definitely a change in the tooltip.
http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fEAQJArYhMmIblxzgjDIEFmAKIeYBOAHWUEDzAA-ToAg0CvICSFkLITQygsBNKYKC
This is the build I had been using for the past month and the dmg numbers on arcane utilities haven’t been updated yet on the gw2skills.net, but a couple of weeks ago these were the numbers I saw with Arcane Wave and Blast being around 934 base. Now it’s 714 base with the same build. That’s almost a 25% nerf in damage. Thanks Anet.
I was wondering why a couple of days ago I wasn’t hitting as hard as I remembered.
The teamwork required to cap a flag in Arathi Basin was great. It required a lot of peeling of the the flag capper and there’s no incentive for 5 people to cap the flag at one time.
People just want variety. At this point any new game mode will do. How can anyone still stand conquest after a whole year?
I would like to also point out that most of the people Spvping only do so to get the daily laurel. They show up on the metrics as players but most don’t enjoy it that much.
Love how Anet inflates the numbers. You can literally count the number of players from the hotjoin servers window and seeing the same players in tPvP will give you an idea of the real pvp population.
We are working on new game modes. As we get closer to being ready to talk about them more, we’ll give you guys more details!
Thanks for the response and please excuse the pessimism Jon, but can we get some kind of a timeline as to when you guys might be ready to talk about new game modes. Dev responses to posts have always been dodgy and vague so the community always feels it’s in the dark about pvp development. The fact that you don’t have a real PTR adds to that feeling as well. We can’t take any more conquest on tiny maps. If money is an issue, place all the pve and rank armor skins in the cash shop and I’m sure a lot of people will buy skins so that we don’t have to rank grind to get those.
@Asomal
If people stopped talking about what they want out of this game then nothing will happen. I’m just as tired of hearing about what’s wrong with pvp, but the fact of the matter is there isn’t anything being done about it. Balancing a game is a very long process that will never achieve perfection because there will always be imbalances. The thing is, I can put up with imbalances as long as the game is fun. WoW was never a balanced game, but millions played it because it was fun. I hate to compare this game to wow because this game has way more potential, but Blizz did really well with battlegrounds and what I wouldn’t give to have something similar to battlegrounds here. I just don’t see the harm in introducing more game types. Anet seems to think that new game modes will destroy this game.
(edited by SuperHaze.4210)
I’ve played since launch not caring about rewards, leaderboards, or ranks. I just wanted to have fun and beat other players. After a year of standing in a circle, I barely log on anymore because I don’t PVE/WvW. I hop on and play a couple of rounds to remind myself how much I hate standing in a circle. I would go back to wow but threw up in my mouth thinking about gear grinding just so that I could play battlegrounds. Give me wow style battlegrounds and I’ll buy everything in the gem store.
Please for the love of god don’t tell me you’re wasting resources on a better reward system…………………………..
Agreed. What good is a better reward system when the game itself is the problem. Better rewards doesn’t motivate me to stand in a circle all day.
Imbalances, leaderboards, rewards aside, I really just want to see more game modes. Don’t care about esports if there isn’t any competitive maps and game modes anyway. TDM arena was the only competitive part of wow and the rest was just for fun. Cross server battlegrounds was where it was at and that’s all I’ve wished for. I’ve lived through the imbalances of wow but still had a lot of fun in WSG, AV, and AB. Large maps made for great battles and spaced out enough that you could have 1v1’s without getting interrupted all the kitten time. If Anet was so concerned about making money off PVP all they had to do was sell PVE skins in the gem store.
I keep trying to hang on in the hopes that this will happen, but with every new map, I’m disappointed every time. I just don’t understand why they don’t put out new game modes and let the community decide which ones they want to play. WSG never had a big following, but those that played it were the most hardcore so there was enough of a following to merit it’s existence. The fear of a split player base because of different game modes doesn’t make sense because it’s always gonna happen if you offer different game modes, but let the players have their choice. Players will always favor one map over another just like how I refuse to play the Capricorn map. When I get rotated in, I end up leaving the match and joining another just to avoid it.
Sorry to necro this but I dunno if making a new thread on similar topic is better.
So I have a thief guildie I keep losing to. After some research I came to this thread.
My aoe just doesn’t land on him. He keeps evading marks. He port and hit me. When I try to do anything, he simply teleports or stealth away. I tried well of darkness but he just run and wait. Same with wall.
Is it still true that a condition necro cant beat that kind of thief? Or did they make any change since June that a necro can have a little chance?
Could you link your build? I run a power/DS build that can handle thieves pretty well, but I do notice that when I play condi or terror builds, I have a harder time against s/d thieves. If you go 15 points in Soul Reaping to get Last Grasp and have spectral armor for one of your utility slots, you can survive a little longer. Plague can buy you some time if you already burned through your heal, but without seeing your build (I assume you’re playing condi or terror) it’s hard to offer advice.
(edited by SuperHaze.4210)
Thanks for the replies. That sucks. I hope they change it to make it clear 3 conditions but only if you hit your adrenaline attack.
Hi All,
Quick question, does the GM trait Burst Mastery affect Cleansing Ire? Since burst mastery reduces adrenaline use but Cleansing Ire depends on expending your adrenaline bars, it looks counter intuitive to take both traits.
3. Unbalanced Matches : I have only used the server browser/play now so far. The matches are almost always lopsided, with a near shutout, or 500 to 100 points, with me usually on the losing side. While rank isn’t a direct correlation to skill, often the winning team has several 50+ ranks, while the shutout team has 3 or more people sub rank 10.
4. Server Browser vs. Free Tournament – Where is the better place to play/learn? The forums are overflowing with imbalance complaints with the free tourney, seeming worse than the server broswer.
6. Community – I’m sure there are nice people somewhere online, but that seldom seems to be the case. Matches are filled with egomaniacs who think the only way to talk to someone is to insult them.
7. Thieves everywhere – Seem to be 50% of the players every game.
3. The unbalanced matches are just how hotjoins are. Until Anet figures out a solution, you just have to deal with it. I would recommend joining 5v5 hotjoins. It’s probably the best place to practice.
4. Unless you care about your rank, 5v5 hotjoin is your only option. tPvP is typically premade vs pug, but it can be a very good learning experience because in those matches, players play the actual map and this is where you learn map strategies and counter builds. Just don’t rage quit like some of the baddies out there. I personally don’t care about rank so I play just to learn and have fun.
6. There are always going to be immature, childish, internet gangsters out there that think they’re the best that’s ever lived. Ignore them. The nicer players I find rarely talk during the matches, myself included, but if you whisper me with a question, I’ll be more than happy to answer them. If someone doesn’t respond, just find someone else to ask.
7. You’ll see a lot of thieves in hotjoins and it’s the only place where they’re relevant because all thieves take advantage of the chaos to pick off players who are low on health. In tPVP they’re actually very weak and you won’t see many of them in a tournament setting. They require a CC/DPS partner to be effective. Like someone else suggested, try dueling them every time you see one and eventually you’ll see that they’re actually pretty weak.
Dhummfire will hit the target that’s closest to the center of, for example, your marks. It looks random but priority for Dhummfire and Withering Precision is on targets in the middle of the mark first, then goes outward from the middle.
Ragequitting is a huge problem atm and every MMO out there has some kind of quitting debuff. At the very least, a 30 minute debuff (2 hours is a bit excessive) so that even if you come up against a premade, you have some kind of incentive to stay and play the match through and maybe learn a thing or two. Obviously the hit to personal rating doesn’t deter people from quitting the match so there has to be another way to prevent this problem. There should also be rated and unrated matches so that people can practice tourneys without fear of losing rating when they’re testing builds, team comps, etc.
uberkingkong is right about SC2 BECOMING an esport. Blizzard lets their game do the talking and created an environment that fosters esports. Aside from the technical stuff like ladders and MMR, it was the players that created the esports from custom maps and a casual friendly system where people can play in unranked matches just for fun, eventually moving on to more competitive play.
The thing with games like RTS games like SC2 and to a lesser extent, DOTA2 and LOL is the pace. Those games can drag on for almost and hour whereas GW2 tourneys are short and fast paced. There’s no comparison to GW2 in those regards. If anything, GW2 can be compared to WoW’s arena and battleground system and what I see Anet doing with GW2 is trying to meld the two together, which to me, doesn’t seem like it’s working. One game type with one queue system which is always a rated match is detrimental to serious players because the casuals have no other way to learn and play the game as it was meant to be without affecting the competitive players. Hotjoins is a complete mess and doesn’t foster the skills necessary for competitve play. Why force a casual pvper to queue with serious players and have to go against a premade that will stomp them time and time again? “Find a team” is what some people are saying, but SC players don’t need a team and can play 1v1 competitively.
By the way, I always held out hope that pvp would become fun like I remember it from gw1. I’ve now realized that there are multiple, fundamental, conflicting reasons why it can’t ever be as good as its predecessor. I’m just going to look for a better game that’s serious about pvp. Later all.
+1
After this patch, I have no hope of this game being anything similar to GW1 (which is why I bought it in the first place and waited patiently for updates that can somehow make this a possibility).
If you were hoping this game would be GW1 version 2 you should have just read some Dev posts where they clrearly stated that this was not going to be the same game – if you liked GW1 play GW1 – GW2 is going to stand on its own. Would have saved you lots of time.
I wouldn’t have bought this game if it wasn’t touted as being an esport, but that’s old news now. At this point in time, I had been waiting to see how this game progressed in regards to competitive pvp (not esport btw) and have been disappointed with the direction that pvp has been going. I won’t complain about balance because there are always going to be imbalances, but the game isn’t even fun with conquest being the only game mode. The topic of other game modes have also been beaten to death and with the release of custom arenas (even if it’s still in beta), it just looks like more of the same. I’ll probably be going back to gw1, but tell me a player that’s happy with going back to the prequel of a current game because of what the new game is lacking.
Im with you and aI definitely understand. I wanted GW2 to have the GvG and HA style games, but Im here, Im not willing to give up the engine upgrade (i.e. jumping) to go back to GW1 and having played GW1 since release I dont feel like I can go further with that game. I have, in general, lowered my expectations of GW2 and all future updates since January.
It just seems that Anet devs are being really closed minded about what they can do with pvp. To them, there’s no option for pvp other than conquest. There’s also just too much crying about balance that they seem to be focusing on just that. Coming from wow, I didn’t mind playing BG’s against imbalanced classes. It was fun regardless and balance was only important in arena matches and most of the imbalances come from tiered gear. At least wow had different BG’s to choose from. I just think that if they could implement the things that made GW1 so awesome, the players will come regardless of balance issues.
This game was built around tag teaming one player so it really is a team game. A 1v1 can last a good minute or two, but add in one more person and the fight will only last 10 secs at best. I will never be able to take down 2 opponents because by the time you down one of them, all your cds are spent, your health is usually half or less, and there’s no way to stomp the downed player without the other one dpsing you down on top of the downed player dpsing from the ground. The problem is the whole downstate mechanic, but that’s another topic for discussion.
This is basically the reason why I stopped playing months ago.
If you join with a team, you’ll most likely face a bunch of pubs and destroy them.
If you join alone, you’ll most likely face a premade and get stomped.Also, daily PVP achievements injected a bunch of PVErs into the system who couldn’t give half a kitten about PVPing and are in just for those laurels.
The only thing that could make me consider getting into the PVP scene again is the creation of a system that caters to both solo players and team players. We’ll see what happens when Custom Arenas go live for everyone I guess, but I’m not getting my hopes high.
I’m on the same boat. I mostly solo pvp and when I get grouped with a pug that wants to win, a victory is that much more sweet when it’s against a premade. There should be ranked and unranked 5v5’s so that those who want to practice on their own with a pug should not have their rating affected.
I don’t have much hope for custom arenas atm because it’s still conquest being shoved down our throats. I really really don’t understand why there can’t be another game mode that’s not conquest. GvG, CTF, KotH, etc., and the list goes on and on and on…
By the way, I always held out hope that pvp would become fun like I remember it from gw1. I’ve now realized that there are multiple, fundamental, conflicting reasons why it can’t ever be as good as its predecessor. I’m just going to look for a better game that’s serious about pvp. Later all.
+1
After this patch, I have no hope of this game being anything similar to GW1 (which is why I bought it in the first place and waited patiently for updates that can somehow make this a possibility).
If you were hoping this game would be GW1 version 2 you should have just read some Dev posts where they clrearly stated that this was not going to be the same game – if you liked GW1 play GW1 – GW2 is going to stand on its own. Would have saved you lots of time.
I wouldn’t have bought this game if it wasn’t touted as being an esport, but that’s old news now. At this point in time, I had been waiting to see how this game progressed in regards to competitive pvp (not esport btw) and have been disappointed with the direction that pvp has been going. I won’t complain about balance because there are always going to be imbalances, but the game isn’t even fun with conquest being the only game mode. The topic of other game modes have also been beaten to death and with the release of custom arenas (even if it’s still in beta), it just looks like more of the same. I’ll probably be going back to gw1, but tell me a player that’s happy with going back to the prequel of a current game because of what the new game is lacking.
By the way, I always held out hope that pvp would become fun like I remember it from gw1. I’ve now realized that there are multiple, fundamental, conflicting reasons why it can’t ever be as good as its predecessor. I’m just going to look for a better game that’s serious about pvp. Later all.
+1
After this patch, I have no hope of this game being anything similar to GW1 (which is why I bought it in the first place and waited patiently for updates that can somehow make this a possibility).
I don’t understand why everyone wants this game to be like LoL or Dota.
Spectator mode just looks like an FPS point of view when it should be panned out so that the whole map can be seen. This is GW2 which is suppose to be a sequel to GW1 where large scale matches should be bird’s eye view.
Custom arenas just made things more complicated with server owners making up their own verbal rules even though the maps are the same conquest maps (e.g. “No capping points”). I don’t know what to make of all the changes, but I feel we’re not heading in the right direction with the competitive structure of this game.
Arenas do not have the full set of features that they will have when they exit beta. And if you think the addition of custom arenas and spectator… even in their current limited state… is not heading in the right directions for a competitive game, then I couldnt possibly guess what you think a competitive structure is.
I’m not saying that an esport game doesn’t need spectator mode and custom maps. The way these features were implemented I feel are wrong. Spectating should be done the same way a sports game is watched, which is from a bird’s eye view. In relation to LoL and Dota, matches may have 5 players on each side, but when you add in minions, npc’s, and towers, it becomes something like a giant chess match. People have been asking for GvG as do myself because that can be watched similarly to LoL and Dota, but instead of minions, you can have more players. Throw in some walls, lords, maybe a flag, and you have a full on game of chess where decisions of priority need to be made for the entire team in order to win the match.
I don’t understand why everyone wants this game to be like LoL or Dota.
Spectator mode just looks like an FPS point of view when it should be panned out so that the whole map can be seen. This is GW2 which is suppose to be a sequel to GW1 where large scale matches should be bird’s eye view.
Custom arenas just made things more complicated with server owners making up their own verbal rules even though the maps are the same conquest maps (e.g. “No capping points”). I don’t know what to make of all the changes, but I feel we’re not heading in the right direction with the competitive structure of this game.
Both suck because it’s conquest.
As a community, we just want options. TDM may or may not be popular, but it’s still something other than conquest that players have an option to play. I don’t see a problem with releasing other game modes and if they don’t pan out, remove them. Just let the players decide what they want to play instead of shoving conquest down our throats. Conquest can still be the default tournament mode, but not everyone likes it and would like to play something else.
No more conquest please. I understand everyone trying to make the best of what we got, but what we got is only one single game mode with an afterthought tossed in to make it look like it’s something different. I’m glad people are throwing out their ideas and maybe someone at Anet might actually consider thinking about it.