Guild Wars 2

I got the impression it is going to be for everyone in PvP and that there is going to be a big PvP patch early next year. They made some comments throughout the discussion about how they are trying to make things good for both the hardcore e-sports players and the entry level casual players alike.

Ladder is on the horizon, game modes are not. As far as we know.

Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/919-state-of-the-game-discussion-now-available/

Ahh I did a little more research into the article and I misread it originally. I have seen people claim ANet said they would put it in so searched for a source when I found this forum and didn’t read it right but I am glad you pointed that out.

They have said it will be implemented but I don’t know that is on their radar as soon to implement features.

Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/51308-gamescom-when-its-ready-authenticators-gvg/

They said that there are going to be more things glory related that will apply to other aspects of the game. They didn’t give details and it is not something coming in the next patch but it will be coming.

Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/919-state-of-the-game-discussion-now-available/

They did mention this here.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/919-state-of-the-game-discussion-now-available/

Basically they said they know the point system isn’t great and they are working on it. I wouldn’t expect to see it till their big PvP patch coming early next year.

Your idea of balance and mine differs quite a bit I guess. I think of build diversity and think people can play multiple builds for each profession and have a role in the game. There is a place for pressure and support in the current meta and it will become more apparent with balance changes and every profession will have a place on a team with multiple builds but the overall strategy of a team will not change much because it is a fairly simple meta which promotes skill in the game over build wars.

You posted a question and I answered with my opinion on the topic. You proceed to tell me I am wrong and then either contradicted yourself or assume a lot about the future balance changes in all of your responses. I think we just have to agree to disagree about the meta and time will tell what will happen in this game.

hharry.1967:

This game cant be an e-sport with capture base game mode since all it is is a zerg fest even when it is only 5v5. Bring team death match or something, capture point is just a random BG zerg fest like WoW.

High level play the game isn’t a zergfest. Once you get into a coordinated team it is a lot about map control/awareness and combat so it is really well suited for a team e-sport. The hotjoins are pretty much a zergfest and the game really isn’t fun without an organized team and new game modes would work wonders for the non e-athlete pvp crowd.

Mrbig you are assuming an awful lot about how the professions will be balanced and how the “meta” is going to change. In conquest mode the meta is and I bet it will continue to be running a balanced group of bunkers and roamers. It will be the general strategy that is the most effective for most of the teams to win.

Flavor of the month team compositions will come and go but less likely to happen in a balanced game. GW1 was never balanced and would be impossible to balance which is why the flavor of the month teams were always dominant compositions. Guild Wars 2 doesn’t have the class/subclass to deal with so ever person doesn’t have access to the 1300 skills Guild Wars 1 had which means the game will be infinitely more balanced.

Edelweiss.9815:

Teabaker.9524:

The 14th will really make or break the eSports in this game >_> Let’s hope!

It has been killed and buried on Nov. 15. The changes that are needed are too vast to be implemented in any sort of a timely manner.

Only the best of the best become e-sports games.

The patch on the 14th won’t be a huge game changer for sPvP there should be some nice changes through balance but we probably won’t be seeing anything other than that. ANet will be on the e-sport rise in 2013 sometime I would take bets on it all day long, they have experience making an incredibly fun PvP game and they are heading in the right direction with features they are working on.

Mrbig.8019:

I would like to argue about something Lowell said about the thief :

backstab is fine : true

mug is not : also true, but this is definined only for D/D burst. S/D thieves already got nerfed to dust ( so were D/D dps pressure build) with no real reason, and mug is currently the only burst damage any S/D build would accomplish.
Nerfing mug would only polarize the thief more into D/D glass cannons or P/D condition spamming.
So any change to Mug would imply a huge balance around the thief.

Traits: lowell was also right about damage scaling and T1-2 traits scaling better than some other traits. Results ?
A thief will choose those traits ALL NIGHT LONG, and build always the same way.

You need huge rebalancing in order to make things right

If you do this with every class, you obtain huge meta shiftings, because suddenly things start to work, and some other things are not ALWAYS the best choice.

If we’re in the situation where classes are forced to build in this or that way in order to be viable ( in order to counter X or Y being too much on the strong side, like bunkers currently, or mesmers in 1vs1) then we have a problem.

If we have a problem, and also a huge one, then the meta is not healthy at all.

When they do their balancing (big balance patch in 7 days) we will hopefully start seeing more build diversity. That will not change the meta because things are working because the meta will still be a mix between bunkers and roamers it will change the flavor of the month profession builds but the meta isn’t going to change.

I really don’t think you understand what a meta is.

Mrbig.8019:

Oh yeah, i forgot aboutthe bunker.

Anyway you didn’t grasp what i was talking about: i was talking about BUILD diversity.

No accounting the fact that ranger/engie/warrior are not as viable as other classes, those 5-6 classes that create current “meta” go around always with the same builds.

One can say “well i’m playing this that is different from cookie cutters” but at the tops there are all players playing cookie cutters, or rather ALWAYS THE SAME BUILDS.

Oh yeah, let’s talk about the interview with aNet, where every player there is a roamer and 3/7 are playing thief.

Very representive, since i’m sure they totally dislike current meta

/sarcasm

Build diversity will come with balance and they know that is a huge priority now it is an issue in every game just look at League of Legends they are just now getting into a lot of item build diversity after being an incredibly popular and successful e-sport for years now.

I promise you each of those representatives on that interview are speaking on behalf of their team, they don’t play the game for hours every day just because they like and know one class and build and that isn’t why they are the top players/teams.

The issue is that is very hard to balance for top level play and entry level play at the same time. When it is balanced around top level play the entry level players need to get better but it can be incredibly frustrating and it will stop a lot of players from getting better. When it is balanced around entry level play then top level play is awful.

The game is more balanced for top level play right now than for entry level play and with the goal of being an e-sport top level play will always have priority.

Stin.9781:

Ye necros tottaly UP… every team rolls one lately plus first focus is always on necro in teamfight becouse they are UP right ?

Not to disagree with you because necros aren’t underpowered but they will probably always be a good first target. They have high long term damage and low escape abilities so they are naturally a good target but they are also naturally tanky to try to balance this.

Mrbig.8019:

Thirsty.2875:

Overall I think ANet is happy with the meta but they know it still needs tweaking quite a bit but the meta promotes using a variety of professions and with continued balance changes all professions will be viable with multiple builds.

The meta doesn’t promote using a variety of professions.

If you see the top leaderboard, the meta is pretty defined around ele roamers, thief roamers, mesmer semi-roamers, necro glass cannon for support and some engie/war here and there.

The meta is pretty defined and there are no many viable builds to be competitive: you need extremes to be efficient.

If aNet is satisfied with current meta, then i definitively put too much hope into their balancing capabilities.

You named 6 out of 8 professions as being used but said it doesn’t promote a variety of professions. On top of that you didn’t mention a single bunker in that complaint I haven’t follow the pro scene but I am pretty sure bunkers are a big part of the meta. Overall the meta does promote a variety of professions but they need to work on their balance which will open it up to to more viable builds.

The meta is a balance of defenders and roamers while keeping in mind the secondary objectives and it is healthy.

EDIT: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/919-state-of-the-game-discussion-now-available/ listen to the first 5 minuets of this and ANet as well as representatives from the top teams will tell you that you are wrong

Shukran.4851:

zone.1073:

Why do warriors have a 10 second weapon swap cooldown (EVEN OUT OF COMBAT SOMETIMES), even with the Fast Hands trait?

Why has this bug been existing since August’s beta testing?

why do all classes except for ELE can swap weapon freely out of combat while ELE has still attunements cd ?
if you think about engi, he still have at max 3 secs to swap toolkit.(engi afaik is the only class who don’t have cd for swapping. op)

Warrior CD bug is a tough fix for ANet, it was stated in a post by them and the bug only happens the first switch when you are changing weapon sets. Engis need to take up a utility slot to have toolkit and Eles get four weapon sets free with attunements.

Overall I think ANet is happy with the meta but they know it still needs tweaking quite a bit but the meta promotes using a variety of professions and with continued balance changes all professions will be viable with multiple builds.

1080>720 maybe it is my eyes but I don’t notice any difference between 30 and 60 fps but I can tell a big difference between 1080 and 720.

The streaming and viewing numbers are way less than other games because the community is a fraction of other popular streamed games. Right now I would only really consider watching streams of high level teams playing in tournaments being able to hear their whole teams comms in order to try to learn from them. Some access to builds being used by the team would be another selling point for me, putting them in the channel description or link to your team website with that info available or something.

Raine Akrune.8416:

but take a look at what happened to WAR.

The difference between GW2 and WAR is GW2 has game play that is unique. A lot of games have come out trying to do great things with their pvp, it is released unpolished and people leave and don’t come back even when the developer makes a large effort to bring those players back. I loved WAR and really wanted it to work out but it was very similar to WoW and many other more successful games in terms of game play.

The combat system in place for Guild Wars 2 is why so many people want sPvP to work and it is why ANet will be able to succeed as an e-sport if they put in the effort building their PvP community once the necessary features are implemented. I really hope to see a f2p PvP version implemented when there are PvP gem store items and PvP is in a good place.

mulch.2586:

At what point is it just too late?

It is too late when the developer gives up or a few years. There are tons of things ANet can do to bring players back that leave and in the MMO market you can have a year old game still be one of the newer games on the market.

I think I will give up on sPvP completely if it isn’t growing with the first expansion release. That time will bring in a wave of players coming back or trying the game and I am guessing we will start hearing about it end of 2013.

Mahikosan.8609:

As the title says, why is this armor in the paid tournament reward chests? I understand that Tpvp and guilds go together very well, but why is such a bland set a reward from this? I can’t think of anything more disappointing that putting a paid token into the forge and getting guild armor out of it ( I’ve gotten several pieces now, and it’s very disheartening)
Wouldn’t the guild armor be better unlocked as part of the heavy armor vendor for glory, or have a requirement of some sort rather than being from paids?

Anyone else think so? I’d love to get some more opinions on this

I think having it in free tourneys is a lot better option. It would allow it to be accessible to a lot more players and the paid tourney gear should be higher end skins.

I highly doubt you will see them in the next 6 months at least. They have a lot in the works but unless they are keeping it a super secret this is not even on their priority list.

No good mesmer’s are not unbeatable 1v1 and they got a greatsword damage nerf yesterday.

I played a few hours last night and no one reported any loading screen bugs on my team or complaints from the other team so it is better if not completely fixed.

I put a few messages in the heart of the mists this weekend and filled up a tourney group in a matter of minuets. Got everyone into voice chat together and throughout the night we got 2nd place twice and won 2 tourneys with a complete PuG group. It really isn’t hard to have a little success in a free tourney.

A better fix than ditching the tournament system is ditching the hotjoins. This would allow them to have a less segregated player base so you can split group ques and solo ques without destroying your pvp downtime.

Guild Wars 1 has been around for 7 years and it was a very popular PvP game years after its release and it was lacking a lot of features for a long time in the beginning. The pvp in Guild Wars 2 is not going to become extinct like so many people seem to think is happening.

While I do think ArenaNet could learn a lot from Riot Games because they have a successful e-sport the games are completely different and LoL has been around for over 3 years now while GW2 has only been out 3 months comparing features in either game is not a good comparison.

Jumper.9482:

Right now, in free tournaments, yeah you could say that it’s a problem for new teams to get stomped by top players.

This is not correct. I am not good at PvP, I am only rank 11 and I went into tournaments Saturday with a complete PuG group more than half the matches we progressed to round 2, we placed 2nd multiple times and won the whole free tourney twice this weekend. That was only a few hours worth of playing but new teams forming should be able to have a lot of success just from playing as a team. There are very few “pro” teams in this game now and the majority of them stay in paids.

That is very likely, it sounded to me like matchmaking was their top priority right now and that would be the next feature we saw implemented and then there would be a big pvp patch next year. I took that as we might get matchmaking for christmas and that was their goal but didn’t want to say it because it might not be ready in time.

Check this out

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/919-state-of-the-game-discussion-now-available/

Discussion last week with Jonathon Sharp and representatives from top EU sPvP teams. The only thing we might be getting before the end of the year is a matchmaking system but they do have big plans for the future and early next year (first quarter I assume) we can expect to see a large patch dedicated to sPvP and WvW.

EDIT: Downstate isn’t going to go away. It is a great mechanic that will continue to get tweaked but none of the top sPvP teams seem to be asking for them to completely ditch it and ANet doesn’t seem to have any plan to do so.

1.) /m and say you are looking for more in the heart of the mists with your friend. Have the players join you on voice chat and you will have success in free tournaments. I won or came in second place in quite a few tournaments doing this over the weekend.

2.) Unfortunately it is no different than playing most FPS games. You can join the same server and when the teams are off balance you can switch teams. If there are just two of you than it doesn’t take much time for one of you to be able to join the other team, open the scoreboard occasionally and look for your opportunity. When I go in with one friend it is usually within one match that we can get onto the same team and we will often be able play together for quite a while before getting separated.

Not disagreeing with your reasoning I wish there were better methods of playing with your friends but implementing it will either lead to “ques” or unbalanced matches.

Juan Ignacio.8903:

All i see is a bunch of devs trying to fix the meta of this game and then they just fail to realice that the pvp system (conquest) is really bad. But then again u get a dev that call ppl newbs l2p or noobs whatever and talks about league of legends.
Its really dumb to wait 40mins for a q to pop in a paid, guess what… only a few ppl like conquest to actually have a guild going just for that or the ppl that say oh it must be good becouse it has guild wars on the name, its terrible.
Really hope that they add other stuff that is not pve into this game … well ok add pve cuz some dudes love that but really the name of the game is guild wars, not run dungeons or capture points.

If you think conquest is so terrible why would you even try to que for a paid tourney? At first glance and when I joined 8v8 hotjoins I hated the conquest mode too but the past week I have been playing free tourneys mostly with PuGs that I get into voice chat and I have been having a blast. The meta isn’t bad and balance really isn’t near as bad as the vocal minority thinks. The devs are mostly right people do need to just learn2play and by that I mean learn2play as a team this isn’t a 1v1 game and neither was guild wars 1.

I don’t think paid tourneys are in a good place right now the competitive community is too small but free tourneys offer the same thing with slightly lower rewards. sPvP wasn’t meant to be something you grind for the rewards you do it for fun and you happen to stumble across some new gear skins as you go. The PvP community might be shrinking a bit but I didn’t wait more than 2 mins all weekend for a free tournament que to pop and I don’t think I faced the same team twice all weekend so to the OP the community doesn’t need rescued.

Pretty good stuff in here.. sounds like they do have very big plans for sPvP but you can’t hold your breath at all. We will be happy within a year with a ladder being the next implemented feature and a large PvP patch coming early next year. A lot of people won’t be happy with the timeline but I am very pleased with what I heard overall.

phfresno.1230:

ArenaNet has devoted about 7-10 people to sPvP development.

I am pretty sure that is incorrect. I can’t find the post but I remember seeing a list of people and teams working on things associated to sPvP shortly after the chris whitside incident where he said we only have 2 people working on this stuff. I don’t know the exact number and I don’t think the number was clear but I am fairly positive they have more than 10 people working on it.

EDIT: found it https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/The-teams-that-work-on-PvP-WvW-Balance/first#post821794 the list was people working on balance but I am still curious where you got your numbers of 7-10.

With the addition of private servers coming soon (I hope) will there be any implementation of private tournaments?

Umbernont.6752:

I may be a minority in this thread but I prefer pve. I would be more attracted to PvP if there was some reward other than PvP rewards. If I’m not mistaken there is no xp reward.

For me, this would make me want to spvp more.

Giving exp for doing sPvP might encourage more people to play it but it wouldn’t make it any better of an experience. The sPvP is supposed to be a game structured closer to an FPS where you play to have fun and you are rewarded with a higher skill level. The people getting more PvE type rewards would bring in a few extra players trying to grind their levels in PvP many of which would exploit the system for ‘better’ exp which would take away from the people that are there to have fun.

hackks.3687:

I can’t help but wonder if the learning curve for players new to s(t)PvP is too steep.

Tl;DR – sPvP does not cater to casual or PvP-curious players.

I strongly disagree with the first point and strongly agree with the TL:DR. The learning curve isn’t really the issue because the time it takes to become an average or even above average pvp doesn’t take that much effort. If you compare it to other games like LoL the most successful player vs player video game on the market right now the learning curve is WAY higher.

The issue with guild wars is that there is no matchmaking at all which somewhat leads to my second point. There is no place for a solo player to go and find a decent match when you solo que in a free tournament you are going to be playing with 4 other players not communicating effectively if at all usually against 5 people in voice chat that play together frequently and coordinated their profession choices.

The game is very team based you can have 5 people with much higher personal skill level not communicating and queing as their favorite profession against 5 average skill level players communicating and the average players will win 80% of the time if not more.

I just started an sPvP guild and as of now I spend all my time playing guild wars doing sPvP. Most of the people in the guild so far represent their other guilds and then I get on message everyone and some jump into heart of the mists and there we go. I didn’t mean to hijack your thread to promote my guild but I couldn’t find a guild like this before that is 100% focused on PvP so I made one. See my signature.

Wintersday starts in 2 weeks and a day. The last balance patch was almost two weeks ago. The last major patch included both thief nerfs and ranger buffs, not claiming they are balanced but they are clearly working on it.

Find an sPvP guild

The fundamental issue with sPvP is that it is built to be a very populated e-sport and it lacks the essential features to be able to do that. With their current PvP population it should be a no brainer to ArenaNet that achieving their desired e-sport status is a long way away.

They need to stop trying to make the game e-sport worthy because you need a large number of players interested in the game to be a successful e-sport. If there are 10 great teams that are exciting to watch but no one else even plays PvP they could have amazing tournaments but no one will watch them. They need to give the masses better PvP to play in to build up their PvP community and let it evolve into an e-sport as their popularity grows and they implement the proper features.

Hotjoins have been a lot more fun since they introduced 5v5 from my experience but there are definitely still issues there. One big thing I think would fix this is getting rid of your option to join specific servers and make you simply join 8v8 or 5v5 and it will put you in the next open slot.

You will need to implement a way for players to que together and maybe even for one person to que specifically for a friends server they are already in. This will put everyone into full servers and keep the games more balanced rather than having half your servers half full. This system would also allow you to put in some sort of matchmaking in the hotjoins. If I have to join a que to get in a better match made game I would be fine with that because I would be much happier waiting 2 minuets and getting into a great balanced game than my options now.

I miss the portal gun in every game I play… but really there isn’t anything I think of when playing guild wars that I say man they need to have this in here as far as game mechanics go.

I do however miss the dodge button in every other game I play now.

Astralporing.1957:

They are now saying that is not only a possibility, but a certainty (eventually). Also, notice that while they did say the legendaries will always be upped to new top tier, they never said anything about upping their level.

I apologize I was wrong… I just looked it up and found out but I am completely baffled by that decision and it makes me a very sad panda

I have heard people have success offering a few gold to a large guild or commander to take a certain point for that reason.

yarpen.1364:

karma, skillpoints, map 100% isn’t problem at all.
it’s hard to say how much gold is needed but it’s a lot. 1 lodestone is around 1,5 gold, powerfull blood around 25 silver . And because you can buy gems and convert it to gold, for now legendary in 95% can be bough buy cash (because can be bough by gold).

Have you tried to farm half a mil in karma? Do you have 100% map completion? Those things take time. Buying gems and converting them to gold to buy a legendary would take hundreds of dollars I saw a report of one person spending over a thousand dollars worth of gems on their legendary.

The point everyone is trying to make that you don’t seem to get is that you do not HAVE to buy gems to get the legendary I know a few people who have them without spending a dime on gems but they put a lot of work into the game.

ocfallwind.4821:

Someday when ANet raises the level cap, will all the L80 Legendary become obsolete?

They won’t… problem solved

There is no reason for them to do so.. they will introduce new skills and probably revamp the traits or add other types of character progression in a similar manner but there is no reason to raise the level cap.

kiranslee.4829:

Thirsty.2875:

you don’t have to buy gems to obtain the cool factor and if you did you aren’t buying better stats just a better looking item.

That may be true for you, not for all, and not for me.
Hopefully , ascension gear will stay grind fest , and everyone who wonna get it will feel same pain as those who care for “legendary” , models.

How is that not true for you or everyone else? Do you lack the ability to do anything in this game? Everything you do gives you money you just lack patience not the ability to get the cool factor without buying gems.

Aragiel.6132:

so we have a WINNER

- take combat, proffesions, skill mechanic etc. from GW2
- take matchmaking / ladder / game modes from GW1

mix it and here we go = GW3

/bow

I have high hopes for the first GW2 expansion to bring me great things rather than GW3

Both large updates we have received there has been new things given to sPvP. Maybe not the features we needed most and probably not the features you wanted but they are clearly working on their PvP go play another game for a few months and come back.

I agree 100% but the reason they didn’t do this is because they wanted GW2 PvP to be an e-sport. HA wasn’t really e-sport material no matter how awesome it was because it was impossible to balance with all the different class/subclass, skill, game types involved. This is less of an issue with GW2 but they put all their PvP resources into trying to make it an e-sport first and slowly make it more enjoyable for most of the players and they needed to do that in reverse order. Especially because they didn’t launch with the features needed to be an e-sport anyways.

Less levels bigger difficulty jump each level… problem solved