Guild Wars 2

Spirits seem like another example of where the profession takes a hit for nothing more than poor implementation in fulling the Ranger paradigm.

Ranger classes usually have pets so Arenanet takes a portion of our dmg and builds it into a pet mechanic that works poorly in many situations. Result is that we suffer.

Ranger classes are supposed to be ‘one with nature’ so Arenanet takes our support utility and builds it into a nature spirit mechanic that works even more poorly than pets. Result is that we suffer.

At this point I’d gladly sacrifice some of the ranger-esque mechanics and just take dmg and utility which wasn’t gimped.

I was wondering when someone else was going to call this out. Having the player total not be instantly up to date is something you can accept if it didn’t take so long to come back and tell you that there is no room.

critickitten.1498:

Again: it doesn’t really matter how the devs define PvP,

Gotcha, it doesn’t matter how the people who wrote and maintain the game structure it, what every other game does is how it should work here. I totally agree 100% with you now. You converted me to your side, I now wish to subscribe to your blog and/or twitter feed for further wisdom,

critickitten.1498:

kaltastic.3146:

I know why people think PvP and WvW are the same thing but they are not. PvP is a very specific area of the game with its own mechanics. You cannot get the PvP daily by doing WvW. So no, it is not clearly just a PvE daily since the separate area for Pvp requirements has nothing to do with WvW. People like you can pretend that in GW2 PvP and WvW are synonymous but that doesn’t make it so

This is like claiming that the Jade Quarry in GW1 was not “technically” PvP, since your main goal was gathering supplies and capturing several points of interest on the map in order to do so….sound a little familiar? WvW is Jade Quarry on a much larger scale, and Jade Quarry was clearly PvP. No one in GW1 tried to fool themselves into thinking it was part of the PvE metagame.

Your notion is that, because WvW wasn’t built to specifically revolve around Glory, that this alone makes it not a PvP system. But PvP is not defined as “has specific characteristics to it”, it’s defined as player vs player. Which is precisely what WvW is all about.

Click the PvP tab at the top of the screen. This is what PvP in GW2 is defined as. The fact that the term PvP is some generic game term that means something larger doesn’t matter in this game. In GW2 PvP is separate domain. When they post changes and they say “This change affects PvP only” they don’t mean it affects sPvP/tPvP and WvW.

critickitten.1498:

kaltastic.3146:

WvW is not PvP, these are two completely separate aspects of the game.

It pits players against each other, ergo it is Player vs Player, albeit on a larger scale.

It is hysterical that people complain about 50 WvW kills which you can get in 15 minutes from EBG. You then turn around to others and say if you don’t spend hours running a dungeon you don’t deserve the rewards. lolz, just lolz.

It’s not about the kills, it’s about the fact that this game which was supposedly fully optimized still runs poorly on great computers (even mine will chug at times in a large WvW brawl). WvW is the worst offender by far and is kitten near unplayable for some despite those computers fulfilling at least the minimum specs that the developers posted for their game. So it’s not “lol get a better computer”, because the devs said that a computer of X specifications would run this game fine and yet there are people with specs that high (or even higher) still having issues.

Where does it say anywhere that the Monthly is a PvE daily?

“Monthly” is a PvE achievement chain (just as “Daily” is a PvE achievement chain). “Monthly PvP” is the PvP version of monthlies. That is where WvW belongs, not in the regular Monthly.

So yes, it clearly is a PvE setup, seeing as how there’s a separate location for PvP requirements.

Put back the WvW in my opinion. If you are going to force dedicated WvW players to run dungeons then you should force the PvE dedicated people to have to take SM castle or something equally as annoying

But you’re not playing PvE when you do WvW, you’re playing PvP. The devs can pretend that it’s not PvP all they like, but that’s exactly what it is and they need to start treating it like a PvP system.

I know why people think PvP and WvW are the same thing but they are not. PvP is a very specific area of the game with its own mechanics. You cannot get the PvP daily by doing WvW. So no, it is not clearly just a PvE daily since the separate area for Pvp requirements has nothing to do with WvW. People like you can pretend that in GW2 PvP and WvW are synonymous but that doesn’t make it so

Kilrain Daggerspine.6843:

I seriously don’t get the drama about this month’s monthly, unlike the previous ones it actually focuses on pve stuff, and is something anyone can complete..

Honestly if you can’t bother to invest 2 hours into dungeon in a span of 4 weeks, then news flash you do not deserve the monthly, ITS TWO HOURS.

WvW on the other hand does not belong on monthly, it is something that is unreasonable to expect people to do:

1: because there are already pvp monthlies.
2: because WvW will absolutely murder the average computer.

WvW is not PvP, these are two completely separate aspects of the game.

It is hysterical that people complain about 50 WvW kills which you can get in 15 minutes from EBG. You then turn around to others and say if you don’t spend hours running a dungeon you don’t deserve the rewards. lolz, just lolz.

Where does it say anywhere that the Monthly is a PvE daily? Put back the WvW in my opinion. If you are going to force dedicated WvW players to run dungeons then you should force the PvE dedicated people to have to take SM castle or something equally as annoying

The Ranger doesn’t need LoS on the siege to throw down the guard but you do need LoS on the siege to command the pet to attack it. The pet does not just climb up the wall and start wrecking through all of the siege.

Indoles.1467:

However, I almost agree with you, but wouldn’t the purpose of setting a trap on a downed enemy be for someone who risks reviving them having it burst in their face? That makes more sense to me.

I did think about that scenario and if that is a more desirable behavior. My conclusion however was that in much more of the situations where it would help just to drop a fire trap on a downed players head it is because the battle is moving on (e.g. ppl are fleeing) or you are in a 2v1 where if someone stops to rez you can just drop on them both anyways.

It doesn’t seem right that putting a trap on a downed player will not trigger it even if they are attacking you. There are lot of situations where it would be extremely useful to drop a trap and move on without having to stomp or dps down someone. Traps are a big part of ranger AOE and other professions can accomplish this with their AOE’s without similar issues

I am going to assume that this is a troll post whose purpose is to get people to watch OP’s awesome sPvP skillz video. Having watched it, and feeling stupider for it, there is nothing in there that even hints at over-powered abilities.

Yes rangers get to control their pets when they are downed. This can be useful if:

-pets are even alive, not a given
-pets f2 isn’t on cooldown
-pets f2 even does anything useful on cooldown. 1 pet out 50+ possible choices has an aoe fear and that is op?

In tourney play where a strat is to put some bleeds and try in keep them in a downed state perpetually is indeed tougher on a ranger who can use pet to self-rez. To be honest though, if you let a downed ranger live long enough to use their downed ‘3’ you did something wrong. The statement ‘After 8 seconds have passed and no stomp, a Ranger will 100% revive for sure.’ is just pure fabrication. Even one good dps can overcome ranger + pet self-heal and and the pet dies it is all over.

As 1000’s of thieves have said on this forum before….l2p

Agreed that when attacking a keep that it is frustrating to have the ele who drops down, attacks the siege until they die and then just mists in the door.

Frustrating is different than game breaking however. I like GW2 because professions have things that make them unique. They have skills that shine in particular circumstances that other professions may not have. When this gets out of hand and is giving people too much of advantage then Arenanet seems to take action however this isn’t one of those cases.

One of the things I grew to hate about WoW was that at some point every unique skill was either removed or distributed to all the classes in some slightly different form because of the “it’s not fair that….” complaints

Daddy.5986:

-WvW is nothing more but zerg vs. zerg (there is no real skill involved)

Running around as a single person attached to a PuG zerg can get mindless and lacks skill.

Working as part of a team/guild and strategically attacking and defending objectives is immense fun and extremely rewarding. To be successful takes a group of skilled and dedicated people working together.

The title says it all. I play WvWvW mostly with a server-wide mumble and usually at some point of the day someone busts out with a Ranger slam. Ranger is the go-to joke when making fun of bad professions. We are the poster child for weak DPS and ineffective support.

Last night someone asked which alt they log on and the answer was “bring anything but your Ranger”. This led to almost 15 minutes of joking and gems like:

“Words you will never hear; We need more Rangers online”
“Rangers are walking honor badges”
“ArenaNet should auto party Rangers together so they can get a short-bus to drive them around” (my personal favorite)

You see it in all sort of posts too. In sPvP threads, video threads, profession build discussions, people always throw in the aside of “except rangers”. As in “I have been beat at some point by every profession except a ranger” or “I can bring any profession to the fight an usually win, except a ranger”

Reality of Rangers aside (not looking to start an argument on actual effectiveness) I am hoping that this patch at least will alter the community wide perception that we are so flawed that we hurt the team by not bringing a different profession to the fight.

I don’t know if any other Rangers feel the same way but being the butt of everyone’s jokes wears on you after awhile

“He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else.”
-Ben Franklin

Next week can we please have a score thread and then a separate ‘here are all the real reasons we aren’t winning thread’ since apparently after three weeks people haven’t exhausted their rationalization skills?

restoration.2806:

This is true happens to me a lot too. I just gotta wait for the recharge and i press rez me again.

Just confirmed this bug myself. It took awhile since I play WvWvW mostly and our #2 is so lacking that it is rare to stay downed long enough to even get to use #3.

Does any other class have a down state trait that just plain is bugged?

holy kittening kitten on a Popsicle stick, Taym is 100% right. I just tried this out in WvWvW and it works exactly as he says. never noticed this.

They take a sub-par class and fix all of the bugs that worked to our advantage (e.g. traps and sb) and leave all of the profession breaking ones for another day, if ever. You can feel the love

Indo.8629:

Simple solution? Don’t cheat and you won’t have fingers pointed at you.

You guys cheated in T1 and people of course were pissed, you did the same here.

What did you expect? lol.

P.S and I’ll take the finger pointing title over being known as the cheating/exploiting server title any day of the week.

Wow, you have us pegged exactly. Now that you have successfully called us out, everyone on BG might as well fess up to other nefarious behavior you might have missed. I’ll start:

When we took your garrison early this week I personally:

• Washed my hands with the decorative soaps in the Garrison bath room

• Repeatedly opened and closed the Water Gate even though it had a sign that said "Keep this gate closed at all times

• Drank the last cup of coffee in the Lord’s Break room without brewing a fresh pot

I will understand if these deeds leave you to outraged to properly compete next week.

preech.4071:

One thing im still trying to figure out is how BG is pulling ahead of SOR so fast if our potential pts are as close as theyve been ….. as much as i hate to point fingers (thats a lie ) i believe BG is chaeating agn ……. the points arent adding up and i heard they are getting more pts for yak kills than any other realm and im not sure why theyve been at even ##’s with SOR the past 2 days as well, holding the same amount as we have but rocketing past us in overall points. Again id hate to acuse ppl but I believe there is foul play afoot!

Why are people even taking the time to respond seriously to this nonsense? It is either another very bad troll attempt or someone extremely desperate to look for excuses. Either way it all it deserves is to be ignored.

Bash.7291:

Can we SERIOUSLY stop arguing over the glitching. It happened, its done with get over. I am sick of seeing this thread being nothing but a flame fest. For the asking of proof there was a video and screenshots that were deleted because it is actually against the forum policy to post things like that in the forum. For the people on SoR that can’t seem to get over it, just stop. You are doing nothing more than making the fighting continue for no point what so ever.

Can’t we all just get along and kill each other like civilized WvWers?

Amen.

99.99% of the people on the other servers are just like you; gamers who are playing GW2 for the fun and competitive pvp it offers. Letting your self go nutty over the .01% of people who are really nothing more than trolls just feeds into why those people grief in the first place. Flaming out for days and days just gives them more and more satisfaction.

1500 yard range in WvWvW is a huge advantage with the LB. Sharping Stone + Barrage at 1500 is very effective.

I use SB/LB in sPvP as well. People stack on the control points, being able to run up and AoE 5ppl at once is nice.

Over an hour and not even an acknowledgement from Arenanet that there is an issue….sigh

I’m located in New York

same issue here

meh, I was mad at the time but it is all water under the bridge at this point. As a skill , SB + QZ probably deserved to be nerfed on its own merits.

What I don’t understand is why this one OP skill wasn’t taken in the context of the entire class. Our last 3 balance basically worked out like this:

-Nerf shortbow + QZ
-Nothing
-Underwater buffs

Basically Arenanet is saying “We don’t have the resources to fix the fundamental issues with the class but we did have the time to squash the one thing that worked to balance them out”.

As a ranger running 30 WS , toughness gear and toughness runes I still wonder how I can get BS for 8k and this isn’t on any list to be balanced.

Reset is delayed to balance concerns around Ranger under-water buffs. Devs looking into reports that Ranger surviability when swimming away from Thieves was increased higher than intended

Azel.4786:

It means that not only will your arrows get obstructed but you will run out of them!

+1 this made me laugh so hard my wife asked me wtf was I reading

I think the devs used hard numbers to support which traits need to be buffed. If you look at the logs I’d bet you see that Rangers spend more time in WvWvW jumping in the water to escape other classes. Water buffs make perfect sense

Stormleaf.1769:

People rage and whine about a “stealth nerf” without even pausing to think for a moment it might be a bug, it’s then confirmed as a bug that will be fixed the same night that it’s introduced, and people respond with yet more irrational insults. You just refuse to give ArenaNet even a drop of respect, don’t you?

Stop behaving like irrational brats just because you didn’t get every single buff you dreamed of in one patch. ArenaNet doesn’t deserve this kind of grief, regardless of what you all think.

I’ll reserve judgement when I see that the bug fix patch notes don’t read:

Fixed tooltip on traps to match new cooldowns

ChairGraveyard.2967:

kaltastic.3146:

Limiting the number of players affected by boons make some sense, changing the AOE mechanic however is just crazy talk.

People keep talking about only being able to dmg 5 ppl at a time in a stack of 40. If I am a solo person taking on 40 ppl should I expect to win anyways?

Sorry but that logic breaks down instantly when you realize no one in this thread is talking about a single player fighting the whole 40 person turtle. The problem is that they are immune to any amount of AoE due to the 5 person cap on AoE, not that one person can’t kill 40.

Is this really the way it works? I can have a group of 100 people casting AOE on a stacked group of 40 and the the server randomly picks 5 ppl in the stack and all of the AOE dmg is limited to them?

I guess I am unclear on what exactly is capped at 5. Is it the number of enemy a single player can damage or the number of people in the turtle than can be damaged regardless of how many people are dropping AOE.

If the cap is 5 enemy per player then I stand by what I said. If you have even roughly the same numbers and each of you is damaging 5 random ppl in the turtle that seems like enough damage going around to wipe them. The boons that apply to the entire turtle might make this more difficult but, like I said, I agree that those should be looked at.

Limiting the number of players affected by boons make some sense, changing the AOE mechanic however is just crazy talk.

People keep talking about only being able to dmg 5 ppl at a time in a stack of 40. If I am a solo person taking on 40 ppl should I expect to win anyways?

Lets say that I have 10 other people with me and we all AOE a group of 40, will the outcome be all that different than if we fought 4x our numbers with our normal non-aoe skills? We actually might make out a little better AOE-ing with the current mechanic than each person being taken down 4 to 1.

We dealt with a guild from JQ last night that was using portal bombing and turtling very effectively to attack our siege equipment. When we would see the portal go down we would call out for people to focus their AOE and with roughly equal numbers we would mow them down in pretty short order.

Later on when we finally broke into the Lord’s room there was only about 10 of us left alive when they portal bombed the turtle in again. It was annoying to not even be able to damage them however if 40 random players ran through the door the normal way I wouldn’t be expecting us to have wiped them all and carried the day.

To think that the thousands of different players who participate in WvWvW on Blackgate are all in cahoots together on some nefarious plot to hack and cheat is pretty much nutty conspiracy theory type thinking.

If you played on BG you would see that the same type of arguing, zerg mentality and moments of total lack of coordination take place. BG does have a strong guild alliance that coordinates their efforts but this accounts for only a small fraction of the people zoned in to WvW at a given time.

I was with the team all last night when we took JQ BL over. There was 10 of us working together and herding cats to whole time to keep the rest of the players even slightly focused on task. No hacking, no turtling, no portal bombing, just playing and having fun.

You usually can’t get most people to not stand under the boiling oil, you think you can really get 20-30 other random ppl to stack up on command? We had a mez creating portals to speed up supply runs to a tower and despite spamming chat and says people still ran by it and took the long way.

You give too much credit to think that people could pull off a massive and complicated plot across enough random players to think it would make a significant difference in the outcome of a week long battle.

Case in point: I have a friend on Yak’s Bend. They won their 1st week long match in a blow-out and posts went up in the forums accusing the entire server of sand-bagging the 24 HR matches in order to purposely get a low seed and dominate.

It was ironic since my friend had been complaining for a week about the total lack of coordination and how most night’s were dominated by the different commanders on the maps calling each other kitten for hours.

A ranger queued for sPvP

/endjoke

You can make a case that SB + QZ was imbalanced or even just plain SB auto however given how much many aspects of the profession are lacking it was the thing that balanced it out.