Guild Wars 2

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/75713-long-run-damage-calculation-math-is-fun/

Aleph Naught.9034:

Sigh.

Your sustained damage is

power * base * ( (1-C) + C*D ) / target armor

power, base damage and target armor are constant in the comparison, so don’t need to be taken into the account.

So we have

1-C + C*D. Which is 1 + C * (D-1)

A ‘p’ percent increase in damage results in (1+p) * ( 1 + C*(D-1) )
A ‘p’ percent increase in critical chance results in 1 + (C + p)*(D-1)

Now let’s see when the former is greater than the latter

1 + (C + p)(D-1) > (1+p) * ( 1 + C(D-1) )

1 + C * (D-1) + p * (D-1) > 1 + C*(D-1) + p * ( 1 + C*(D-1) )

p * (D-1) > p * ( 1 + C*(D-1) )

(D-1) > 1 + C*(D-1)

(D-1) – C*(D-1) > 1

(D-1) * (1-C) > 1

Lol that makes no sense at all buddy, the formula is

(LRD = P * (1 + C * (0.5)) = P * (1 + C/2)

That is the long term damage formula, and its common sense that at 200% to crit, 1% more chance to crit = 1% more overall damage. Its an extremely basic concept… Also your formula literally has the effectiveness of crit scaling down as it goes up, when 1% to crit is 1% to crit…

Lordryux.9785:

it misses its second cycle of attacks when you leave it out atleast for me it out like you dont even see the Miss icon or anything at all it just hits air lol. it doesnt happen 100% of the time just randomly really

There is a bug where sometimes the numbers dont display, but the damage is being done. Its been acknowledged by Anet and tested confirmed. That said, i very rarely dont get the HUD,

Actually here is the proper formula, taken from GW2 Guru

•With 0 crit damage , 1 of crit rate will increase your long run damage by 0.5% (LRD = P * (1 + C * (0.5)) = P * (1 + C/2)

•With 50% crit damage , your crits do 200 damage (double damage), this means that once you get above 50% crit damage , 1 of crit will increase your long run damage by 1%

Your formula is wrong, if youre using 1-C then the higher your crit % is the lower the output of the equation, which makes absolutely no sense,

for example if i have 250% crit damage, and 40% crit

(2.5-1)*(1-.4)= .9

If i were to have 250% bonus damage, and 50% to crit

(2.5-1)*(1-.5)=.75

back to the drawing board

I tried it again, definitely reducing. Probably better for sustained in PVE. Thanks!

I think this is the heal heavy mantra spec, i think the idea is to use a staff, and focus on +healing + vitality, and + condition damage

Others likely know more than me but this is what i was considering for a support spec

http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/mesmer#0|0|0|0|0|0|0|30|1751|1750|2301|20|1760|2308|0|0|0|0|0|20|2319|1823|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|4|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|

Thats what some people are saying, but unable to get double credit for clones

Stin.9781:

tqhx.2190:

Stin.9781:

Its ability to instagib any glass cannon at melee range withouth cast time is what makes it insane. Thief burst takes 1-2 seconds + and uses more resources on longer cooldown.

Wait you think someone thats a glass cannon, should have survivability, because i can assure you that i do not when i run with 15k health as a mesmer myself. In fact i feel that running glass cannon with any class, is basically asking to get downed without hesitation.

Also i dont see how the thieves resources are on a longer cooldown, diversion is 45s, which is what is used to throw up quick stacks. Other than that its just a regular old MW every 15s, and lower end dps in between all of this

Even mesmers basic health with Berserkers is 21k i think… so stop talking BS about 15k hp… mesmer burst at melee range has 0 cast time=0 avoidance possible. This hard counters every single melee burst or melee based balanced spec. If i cant go in melee on melee class cuz i will die in 1 instant cast combo how is it normal ?

What are you talking about. Im a mesmer, and i have 15k health. Also you say no cast time but in order to pull this combo you have to use abilities with a cast time. The whole reason this is in question is because the video where a thief jumps on a mesmer who already pulled out 2 clones, you would have to use abilities with a cast time, or dodges to get enough clones out to pull this off in any other scenario. But please feel free to look over mesmer abilities and find a way for us to drop 6 clones and 2 shatters without any cast times

Stin.9781:

Its ability to instagib any glass cannon at melee range withouth cast time is what makes it insane. Thief burst takes 1-2 seconds + and uses more resources on longer cooldown.

Wait you think someone thats a glass cannon, should have survivability, because i can assure you that i do not when i run with 15k health as a mesmer myself. In fact i feel that running glass cannon with any class, is basically asking to get downed without hesitation.

Also i dont see how the thieves resources are on a longer cooldown, diversion is 45s, which is what is used to throw up quick stacks. Other than that its just a regular old MW every 15s, and lower end dps in between all of this

I can hit f1 and f3 one after the other only so fast, i cannot get 2 shatters from the same clones. I can shatter myself without any clones which is part of the 30 point talent in illusions…

Also as far as i can tell, there is NO bug, just an overbuff in Anet and many players opinions, which they plan to scale back. It has been acknowledged

I was using 10-0-0-30-20 when i first hit 80 for a while. I was getting Zerkers and Iduelists up and taking it easy in the background while they did all the work =) At times it was impossible to keep any phantasm up though, and by at times i mean at least half the fights. In PVP it worked well enough, i could always shatter after my heal for a bonus and with 30 in inspiration your health pool is well padded. It was absolutely garbage against anyone who focused on my clones though, because i was basically hitting them with a wet noodle

Make mind stab a target bound AE again and dont touch anything else about it imo

Ziddy.2583:

Okay so PM me said video if you already have it made and I’ll admit it when I see it

Id like to see it too, i cant get it to “bug” I do get a pretty stellar MW with 12 stacks of might and 20 stacks of vuln from Diversion, but thats it.

A shatter mesmer is so focused in their shatter output, that they are useless until MW CD is up again, god forbid a glass cannon thief be killable as fast as he kills when he literally runs face first into it…

Lysico.4906:

I run GS/Staff hybrid (leaning towards power build, but some cond damage).

Works fine. Zero issues in all aspects of pvp (spvp and wx3)..

The issue is one that is in favor of the mesmer. 20 stacks of vuln and 12 stacks of might in 1 shatter, then a decoy mirror shatter will drop pretty much any other glass cannon. Anet wants thieves to be the kings of burst, not mesmer. Hopefully they only nerf the stack counts, and not how much mind wrack hits for.

The funny thing is its all spurred from a video where a thief jumps a mesmer who already has 2 clones out, gets the mesmer to 20% health in under 1 second, then in the next second gets hit with the double shatter and is downed instantly (it looks like 4×4k damage and the thief has 15k health, mind you the mesmer had the same, both were glass cannons)

JonathanSharp.7094:

@ Mesmer: We’ll be addressing the current Mesmer build that’s spiking for insane damage. Sorry that change got through – it is something we’ll be fixing.

@ Macros: Macros are against the user agreement. You can be banned for using them, so use them at your own risk. I would also advise against using them, because in live tournaments, you won’t be able to use macros. So it makes little sense to learn “bad habbits” you’ll just have to retrain later.

We adhere to the same “one keystroke = one action on one character/account”, which is used by a lot of MMO publishers when defining botting/macros.

Just wanted to clear that up – be careful w/ those macros, they can get you banned.

I play a mesmer and i can understand, but please fix this intelligently. Do not nerf shatter damage, the problem lies in the 20 vuln stacks and 12 might stacks you get from 30 point illusionary persona with a well placed shatter. This isnt something a mesmer can spam endlessly, once that burst is gone, youre left with spatial surge dps for long enough that any class has ample opportunity to turn the fight around/kill you entirely

Also you have to have the other player on top of you, and not dodging off or evading at all for 2 seconds, which is pretty dumb to do if you know that mesmer has all his cds up… Maybe cut the vulns and might in half roughly,

Please dont crush mesmers again because 2 glassies ran into each other, the fight lasted ~2 seconds, and the winner was left with 20% health. If one or the other were not completely glass this would have changed the outcome drastically. Heck, even if the thief didnt try to glass burst a mesmer that was ready for him with clones out it would have changed drastically.

Emanuel.9781:

tqhx.2190:

I missed this shatter bug, what exactly is bugged about shatter?

Appearently you can increase the damage MW deals by doing shatter inputs quick enough, MW’ing when there’s more than 3 clones out or something. People are claiming 3K per clone without vulnerability/might stacks. Thing is, nobody is actually posting proper footage, it’s mostly claims and dogging combat log screens(which can be easily shopped) from what i’ve seen and read.

There’s a video of a BullKittening GLASS CANNON thief getting instagibbed by a shatter mesmer in less than a second and complaining it’s 2STRONK without considering other potential things that could have damaged him(already existing phantasm, blurred frenzy while MW’ing, fire aoe on crit sigil/air rune, MW itself), when he dealt 70% HP damage to the mesmer himself in less than a second before getting blown up.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Mesmer-Burst/page/5
Read the last two(or all) pages.

For me, it’s just a scheme to make Devs lower Mesmer shatter damage as a whole, lol.
I hope they just fix this “bug” that makes “MW hit for 3k per clone without buffs/vuln.” and leave everything else OR make most of these useless traits actually useful.

Hah i saw the video in there on another post. The thief just walks right into a 3 clone daze 4 clone shatter, and the mesmer only has like 2k health left after the .5 seconds the thief is on him. It was a close fight, but a quick one. Honestly if the mesmer didnt burst him down that fast, the mesmer would have been dead within another half second…

Then there is another vid, and the guy FREAKS out, but he has 13k, and you can see the shatter drops him to 5k, and he is screaming that one shatter dropped him…lol (actually you can see in the combat log the total for the shatter was 7k damage…wowee….)

Honestly ive had warriors smack me for 15k in a single hit before, and ive been beaten by plenty of thieves in under 2 seconds simply because i didnt react quickly enough with a distortion.

If Anet nerfs our shatter damage that would be a bit ridiculous, but if there is a bug there by all means fix it

edit: Ok so playing around i can get this to pop off, 19 stacks of might shatter within 2 secs no macros, and im old and slow on the keys. I dont think the shatter damage is the issue so much as being able to trick all those stacks so quickly. Hopefully the nerf targets that, as just normally my shatter is only 1200ish per non crit and im as glass cannon as it gets. In the meantime, this will be fun lol

I missed this shatter bug, what exactly is bugged about shatter?

Odaman.8359:

Shattered Concentration > all… then again I only pvp

Yeha i am speaking on behalf of PVE right now but when i do PVP that sounds like a solid talent. Ill be sure to switch to it when i PVP next time and see how i like it

I stacked more vitality and toughness at first, and as time went on replaced piece by piece with zerker as i got better at surviving. At this point i use nothing but zerkers, scholar runes, crit% sigil on weapon. So basically my suggestion is only stack as much vit as you find you need to survive, and taper it off as you become more skilled. I very rarely get downed with full glass cannon. But keep tha vit gear around, as its always helpful in some of the boss fights, and wvw especially

Dhampyr.2104:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

You are very wrong on the iZerker too… ^^

Now I’m confused. Who are you referring to as incorrect? Have no clue what you mean here. xD

Pretty sure he is saying im wrong that the GS skill reduction does not affect izerker CD. I have to test it again but last time i did it was no different, maybe 2 months ago

Dhampyr.2104:

tqhx.2190:

tqhx.2190:

This is my setup, with the exception of being able to show the 5% crit on my weapons

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mmmz0mM9MMbLTmMbLTmGG9MxzcMazcq8070V7kNb70V

I dont really need the reduction in skills, as the only skill it helps with really is Mirror Blade(it doesnt seem to shorten my izerker CD). With the Clone on dodge i never have a shortage of clones up for my Wracks.

It doesn’t reflect in the tooltip, but it does affect your zerker. Cast it on training dummies with the trait and then without and watch the CD. Wonky tooltips ftl.

I originally tested it on the dummies and found no difference. I tend to stay ranged a lot so im not collecting the stacks from blade typically, and the raw damage of spatial surge at 900+ seems to offset well enough.

Ill test it out again though!

tqhx.2190:

This is my setup, with the exception of being able to show the 5% crit on my weapons

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mmmz0mM9MMbLTmMbLTmGG9MxzcMazcq8070V7kNb70V

I dont really need the reduction in skills, as the only skill it helps with really is Mirror Blade(it doesnt seem to shorten my izerker CD). With the Clone on dodge i never have a shortage of clones up for my Wracks.

This is my setup, with the exception of being able to show the 5% crit on my weapons

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mmmz0mM9MMbLTmMbLTmGG9MxzcMazcq8070V7kNb70V

Kaiyanwan.8521:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Lazy-Kai-s-guide-to-PvE/first#post850116

Any more questions? ^^

I use Empowered Illusions over GS training, i find that the bonus damage my zerker does outweighs the 50 power.

Also i use Scholar on all my gear, and 5% to crit in my GS. (once you are over 201% damage on crits, 1% to crit > 1% damage)

FTW. 15k health is plenty with GS imo. Who else runs a glass cannon mes? This is the most fun ive ever had in an MMO! Huge thanks to Anet for fixing zerker for us =)

choigreywolf.7496:

yup think we all crashed the game i am so sad now…. nothing else to do on a fri night when i am ill. i am sure they are on it hold strong peeps!!

Ugh im sick too, such fail =(

JonPeters.5630:

Got some movement improvements coming for Mesmer also. Mostly more reliable swiftness.

Dec 14th, 2 more days:

Phantasm attack delay cut from .5 to .25
Berzerker damage restored
Reliable Speed boost implemented

edit: not completely sure on the zerker damage restored, but im hoping

Ok i guess i can deal with not being able to attack people on walls after that. Thanks for helping make this class fun to play!

I think i posted something like this in a reply to the other thread about how to resolve the whole izerker problem. Make you throw a twirling sword as an attack, which then spawns your phantasm, who has to wait for ICD to make their first attack.

Either way i agree with you, make them work like our clones in how they are created if they are so hard to “balance”

Levetty.1279:

boroguy.5690:

Here is a quick example of the delay making the iBerserker quite useless. One method of pulling I use is to summon iBerserker on the target(s) and shatter after the initial attack. The mobs kill the phantasm before it can even attack. Now imagine in PvP and WvW what AOEs from players would do. The phantasms never have a chance with a delay.

Oh man that is painful to watch.

Wow exactly, i just did that about 50 times and cringed every time. I even went into WvW and they would die before attacking?!? Its actually not worth the cast time to get one out unless you plan on hitting shatter immediately after lol

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

On testing izerker in wvw and pve, if used first i never once saw it produce attacks, it was killed by the mobs or players (maybe even ae) before it got a chance to attack. If its supposed to be a half second that is way off, i hope you timed the .25, =( maybe you can make it .15 or something?

Maybe it did too much damage and you had to cut it down i dont know, but right now the skill is 100% useless in any real situation. Maybe you should change it to a whirling sword attack that summons a phantasm and the phantasm has some delay, or make the phantasm spawn at range and travel in its whirl further. I duelist starts pretty quick and spawns far enough away to not take ae really either. It seems to work far better

alanis.6094:

AkiraZero.8514:

I think it’s time Anet gave up this whole “its not a pet its an illusion” type thing and just let us summon them like Ranger/necro/thief pets, with a set HP and skill set that attack anything we attack and die after they take X amount of damage. We rely on clones/phant’s for far too much right now and they keep becoming less usuable with each patch.

Making Phantasms to be similar to Necro minions would be an interesting case study to see how quickly this forum blows up crying about needing to re-roll.

My other 80 is a Necro, and I’d be incredibly giddy if minions were made to be 1/3 as strong as Phantasms.

I agree necro minions could use a little boost, Phantasms are not that powerful though lol. They drop like flies and have huge cooldowns. If a zerker gets off more than 1 attack on you in PVP you literally have to be afk. They fail to summon if blind dodge evade etc, and then you also have the chance to fire up some defensive or dodge when you see them streaming at you, because that means that are about to actually be worth something. They arent really reliable, i built up in all phantasm traits and went for a phant spec before izerker was nerfed, and its not as dps heavy as my current spec which is clone clone clone shatter wait 12 seconds clone clone clone shatter, so on

alanis.6094:

tqhx.2190:

alanis.6094:

tqhx.2190:

I wouldnt call GS a crutch like the poster you are quoting states. Its more of a burst spec or pure big hit spec, its not condition heavy or boon heavy so very reliant on numbers. A lot of people, myself included always go for the big number spec, even if its not the best. Now i wouldnt mind whether its best or not, but if the izerker would work as intended, id be happy. Thats all

While you might have been one that ‘has been here since the start’, I call GS a crutch because it is what every random re-roll player chooses after he got killed or watched a video of a glass-cannon Mesmer rolling this weapon.

Frankly, iBerserker was always too powerful, IMHO, especially one a glass-cannon build. It did silly AoE damage on a short cooldown, and used to cast despite LOS and blind issues. The bug fixes to this phantasm were a good start. The current damage output is, however, too much — which is part of the reason you see the FOTM re-rollers whining and re-rolling, once again.

How is the current damage too much? Do you just mean it does too much AOE damage? Because as far as single target goes it is far from the highest hitting ability in the game, and the CD isnt shorter in all cases. But thank you, yes, i have been playing GS since release.

Well ‘currently’ its damage isn’t too much — its obviously broken a bit. The previous damage (i.e. 6 or so weeks ago) was, IMHO, much too high for a direct-damage 1200 range AoE, which also is a combo finisher. The single-target damage was actually still rather high for a 1200 range ability on a short cooldown.

I didnt think single target was that high considering ive seen those numbers and higher from other class abilities. The only thing that does any considerable damage is our shatters, which are a little difficult to pull off in PVP with the recent nerfings, but i dont mind having to up my skill in that aspect.

Btw im from TB, think our guilds may be friendly, we may see each other around in game!

alanis.6094:

tqhx.2190:

I wouldnt call GS a crutch like the poster you are quoting states. Its more of a burst spec or pure big hit spec, its not condition heavy or boon heavy so very reliant on numbers. A lot of people, myself included always go for the big number spec, even if its not the best. Now i wouldnt mind whether its best or not, but if the izerker would work as intended, id be happy. Thats all

While you might have been one that ‘has been here since the start’, I call GS a crutch because it is what every random re-roll player chooses after he got killed or watched a video of a glass-cannon Mesmer rolling this weapon.

Frankly, iBerserker was always too powerful, IMHO, especially one a glass-cannon build. It did silly AoE damage on a short cooldown, and used to cast despite LOS and blind issues. The bug fixes to this phantasm were a good start. The current damage output is, however, too much — which is part of the reason you see the FOTM re-rollers whining and re-rolling, once again.

How is the current damage too much? Do you just mean it does too much AOE damage? Because as far as single target goes it is far from the highest hitting ability in the game, and the CD isnt shorter in all cases. But thank you, yes, i have been playing GS since release.

I also still dont get the “crutch” thing when you say someone got rolled. I have to alt a staff just so i dont get rolled, the GS doesnt offer a lot of protection. Otherwise my offset would be sword/pistol

Morfedel.4165:

alanis.6094:

Ryuujin.8236:

Maybe it’s time to try out warrior :p – or… any class for that matter I’ve always got bored before getting any alt over 40

Alternatively, we have other weapons.

Frankly, I’m a confusion based shatter spec (staff, scep, torch) and feel more powerful than I did a few months back.

I think there are also other video’s of players that don’t crutch on the GS.

Now I’m going to quote you for truth. Seriously, I always had people telling me go with GS, or with sword/X; I roll with Scepter/torch and staff just like you, full gear of runes pumping me with condition damage, etc.

My confusion damage is incredible. I was playing with a guardian who expressed surprise once I got my shatter (with All Shatters Inflict Confusion), phantasmal mage (confusion + retaliation), the scepter’s #3 skill, more retaliation from the confusing cry trait, etc.

The enemy attacked my guardian friend and just melted… and he was shocked!

Maybe GS needed nerfing, maybe it went too far, but frankly, I’m not having any problems whatsoever with my damage output using other choices.

My problems are of a different nature. In WVWVW its far too easy to identify me through my clones (one shot AOE all the clones at once, simply toggle to me looking for the buffs on me that aren’t on my clones, or heck, just watching how I move vs the others – if I actually want to “confuse” my enemy with which one is me, I have to stop moving, although I DID find a way to do it and keep at least a chance of not being noticed).

The other is that in WVWVW the players often run in zergs, and the illusions don’t have a hope of surviving with all the AOEs going off everywhere.

And don’t get me started on trying to duel a freakin thief, sigh….

So the class isn’t damaged… GS maybe, but not the entire class.

As it is, though, I may be respeccing to take advantage of “when clone/illusion dies”: effects….

PS – I’m not saying GS is fine as is; it may well need fixing. I’m just saying that this one thing doesn’t make the mesmer broken. I’ve been playing Mesmer since day 1, and enjoying the hell out of it.

There are other issues that stand out, and it does make me feel a bit substandard at times…. but not broken or unplayable, and my confusion damage output is just hellacious.

Its just the izerker that needs fixing. The biggest issue is that phantasm is the bread and butter of GS dps, the rest of the abilities are more functional and the auto is Spatial Surge which is relatively low DPS compared to other classes/weapon auto, especially as it is nothing but damage (no other effects) and also does damage depending on distance, which can be hard to pull off in a lot of instances.

I wouldnt call GS a crutch like the poster you are quoting states. Its more of a burst spec or pure big hit spec, its not condition heavy or boon heavy so very reliant on numbers. A lot of people, myself included always go for the big number spec, even if its not the best. Now i wouldnt mind whether its best or not, but if the izerker would work as intended, id be happy. Thats all

I believe precision outscales power depending on how high your Crit multiplier damage is. If youre in full exos precision and crit damage % are huge huge huge

Vexrm.6134:

Carighan.6758:

The thing is, the client never really wants to pay the time for documentation or unit tests.
As a result, few developers ever have the “luxury” of doing it.

Vexrm.6134:

I work as a software QA. I assure you that it’s insanely hard to track down some of these problems. He’s made it his goal to get it in by the 14th. It means it’s something he’s dedicating time to.

To relate, I’ve just been nearly 50% late on something which was supposed to go live yesterday (fixed it today near noon), using 10 days instead of 7 for analysis + implementation + testing + mooost of the documentation.

And I’ve done some hours on the weekend, too.

Finding anything (or changing anything) in a sufficiently large piece of software is a mind-boggling nightmare, on the best of days.

Amen. Sounds like we’ve both been on the other side where customers are (probably rightly) demanding the fix now, but the fix isn’t ready, tested, or clean. I try to remember how it goes for me when I’m the hold up for the customer when I come to these forums to complain about fixes.

Im on the same side as you guys too, and if i put through a fix on my network that breaks other things, i roll it back. Then you would look for the issues before re applying…

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

I was getting 400-600 first swing, 700-900 second swing, and 1200-1400 third swing. All three swings would always connect if there was 1 target or 10 targets. Sometimes they still all connect since the problem, and i get just that, but most of the time they seem to just whiff, nothing in the combat log or anything on the screen, its like it just doesnt even exist. You should just make the phantasm cast bladetrail then, or use something that works!!

JonPeters.5630:

Fyi, the delay on first attack has been present since BWE2. It is there for balance reasons to give enemies a moment to react to the powerful summon.

Let me get this straight, what was once our highest damage ability, and is no longer, had a delay before it struck to give enemies time to react??? Seriously? Have you guys thought this through at all? Every other class has abilities that hit as hard or harder and no one has time to “react” They simply hit their ability hotkey and presto, BIG numbers. If you are going to give people time to react, then make our phantasms have more health, and Please, please, please! make them actually do some damage again. I was getting maybe 3k total damage non crit before the patch but it was RELIABLE, and i never saw a wait, id hit 3 and it would be twirling immediately.

Ill give you credit, the LOS bug was OP, i would run around object zerker kiting people and it was really unfair, is this some sort of Karma payback going on? Judging by the comments on these forums you guys have lost a lot of mesmers. I ask to join PVE groups and get booted because they want to bring in another class because they need more DPS.

Give us a break, and please hurry

Moderator edit: removed CoC infraction

Nekroseth.5186:

Hi all!
I was thinking of going Gs as main weapon, does anyone have any suggestions for builds, and side weapon?

Or Should i stay with Staff for main?

i am 20/20/0/0/30 shatter GS spec. The dps is pretty amazing. Using full COF gear (power precision crit mult)

In Domination take Mental Torment and Greatsword Training,

In Dueling i took Deceptive Evasion and the other is a toss up but i use Phantasmal Fury or Desperate Decoy depending

In Illusions take Precise Wrack, Compounding Power, and Illusionary Persona

The biggest thing here is illusionary persona, it will add about 15-20% damage to your shatter at all levels, and you do not need to be close to the target to get it. In fotm ive seen single clone shatters that crit for 8K, and 2 clone where each clone is 4.5k, then with 3 clones its usually about 3.5k each. With the shredding recharge rate bonus wrack is up quite a bit.

For enchants im using 5% crit on weapon, Scholars on gear, and the exotic ruby in all of my jewelry. I do have the Beryl Orichalcum Necklace and my GS is Power/Vit/Crit so those two items seem to give me enough Vitality to not die too easily in PVE. For WVW i swap out a lot of pieces and drop some prec/power for toughness, so my damage isnt as high but its still really nice.

Try it out you will love it!!

cold.3946:

Tell me more about how your class is UP…

This thread is about the GS Izerker damage nerf, not about mesmer being UP. That mesmer is not even using a GS. So? Irrelevant

I get about a 1k heal with 3 up when i use this. Honestly its not even worth putting points in the tree for in its current state. It was actually decent in beta =(

Nuka Cola.8520:

iZerker is the reason to run a glass cannon build, now there’s none.

30/30/0/0/10 with sword/pistol or 20/20/0/0/30 with GS are both pretty amazing glass cannon specs that dont rely heavily on izerker for DPS. I run the second.

Xavi.6591:

I find glass canon builds are not very effective in dungeons as there can be lots of AOE and other random damage that is very hard to avoid or unavoidable.

With full berserker’s armour, weapons and jewellery, you will only have about 15K HP with no toughness.

Are you crazy? I love glass cannon dungeon running. I dont die very often, sadly usually less than other group members

Winds.3087:

tqhx.2190:

I went and checked by killing 3 dolyaks with nothing but Spatial Surge. Not a single crit. Im at 32% crit as well. Am i doing something wrong because i would love to see Spatial Surge crit? I also have 80% crit damage so if i were to crit it would be pretty darn obvious. Does it only crit on certain mobs or only in PvP or something?

That’s really strange and looks like bug. Even at 32% crit, your abilities should crit at least sometimes on anything unless it’s structure and spatial surge is notoriously crit-friendly due to multiple hits(and each can result in crit).
http://i.imgur.com/p41Bp.jpg
This is my spatial test on some orrian stuff. I’m running mix berserkers-valkyrie with 49% crit chance and that fire blast was from sigil.

You would think 1 out of 3 chance in critting at 32%. I dont know how there could be something wrong with my character. Does your combat log state 1536 for that hit or does it say less? I do notice my Spatial Surge never records correctly in the combat log making it very difficult to calculate my output, does your log work the same as mine?

Winds.3087:

tqhx.2190:

With a GS the only crits you can get are Mirror Blade initial attack, Mind Stab, and Mind Wrack, so you should be stacking Power on every single slot, regardless of the other item stats on your gear, top should always be Power.

Any GS ability can crit, even GS5. In fact, there is an entire condition build based on bleeds from gs clone’s auto crits.

I went and checked by killing 3 dolyaks with nothing but Spatial Surge. Not a single crit. Im at 32% crit as well. Am i doing something wrong because i would love to see Spatial Surge crit? I also have 80% crit damage so if i were to crit it would be pretty darn obvious. Does it only crit on certain mobs or only in PvP or something?

idk what youre doing but im 400/800/1200 on the dummy at 2177 Power. Are you slotting pieces that have other stats? With a GS the only crits you can get are Mirror Blade initial attack, Mind Stab, and Mind Wrack, so you should be stacking Power on every single slot, regardless of the other item stats on your gear, top should always be Power. Not trying to be mean to assume you dont know, but im trying to help just in case you would like some advice (i know this has nothing to do with nerfs etc)

Good luck, i do hope they buff Spatial Surge and its funny i think about 20-30% would be a good spot. Well, in event they dont change zerker back or buff that. It would be nice to have some ok DPS that isnt coming from a phantasm though

Fennick.5029:

tqhx.2190:

Clerigo.9475:

Karl McLain.5604:

Illusionary Berserker has not received a direct damage decrease. Instead, is seems that the damage reduction you (and I) are seeing is most likely associated this fix:
“Fixed a bug that caused many piercing, boomerang, and bouncing projectiles (those that hit more than 1 target) to continually increase in damage the more targets they hit.”
We are aware that this particular phantasm is now experiencing a significant drop in damage and are looking at getting it back to a more effective state.
Thanks for keeping the post civil and constructive!
-Karl

Not only the Berzerker Phantasm deals less damage, but also the main great sword atack also pulses for less damage.

On top of that, i had a boss encounter yesterday where seems to me that the berzerker damage was paralel to the great sword damage i was dealing, according to a given distance.

Using other words: if i was closer to the boss, thus dealing less damage with Spatial Surge, by berzerker would also deal less damage. Is this normal?

Also, since when is that particular phantasm a “bouncing projectile”? Is there a skill where i can pick it up and throw it in the air at some1? … Plz fix this.

Im runing low on patience with everything going on with this game….

Spatial surge is unchanged. The only issue is that the berzerker is not hitting with all swings on a single target.

Spatial surge has definately been adjusted. I wear pwr/tgh/vit gear and i assure you it hits for upwards of 30% less since the patch. I never get might anymore from GS #2 either. People in berzerkers gear probably are not noticing much of a difference though.

I have been DPS testing on the dummies for a long time. I have power tough vit gear and power pre crit gear. I have tried different combos etc to figure out whats viable for me and what isnt. I spent hours on those dummies prior to the patch. After hearing the nerf cries i went and retested everything. Spatial Surge is NO different, and im still getting 3 stacks per bounce from Mirror Blade. Zerker still hits other targets just as hard, but suffers big time when you are fighting single target. None of these abilities have had their damage calculations touched in this patch.

Clerigo.9475:

Karl McLain.5604:

Illusionary Berserker has not received a direct damage decrease. Instead, is seems that the damage reduction you (and I) are seeing is most likely associated this fix:
“Fixed a bug that caused many piercing, boomerang, and bouncing projectiles (those that hit more than 1 target) to continually increase in damage the more targets they hit.”
We are aware that this particular phantasm is now experiencing a significant drop in damage and are looking at getting it back to a more effective state.
Thanks for keeping the post civil and constructive!
-Karl

Not only the Berzerker Phantasm deals less damage, but also the main great sword atack also pulses for less damage.

On top of that, i had a boss encounter yesterday where seems to me that the berzerker damage was paralel to the great sword damage i was dealing, according to a given distance.

Using other words: if i was closer to the boss, thus dealing less damage with Spatial Surge, by berzerker would also deal less damage. Is this normal?

Also, since when is that particular phantasm a “bouncing projectile”? Is there a skill where i can pick it up and throw it in the air at some1? … Plz fix this.

Im runing low on patience with everything going on with this game….

Spatial surge is unchanged. The only issue is that the berzerker is not hitting with all swings on a single target.

Carighan.6758:

Well the no-LoS is on a basic level ofc fine. I’d change the Berserker, Warden and Defender (being the AE / PBAE Phantasms) to spawn with a ground target marker (but attacking the current target!), and requiring LoS to the GTAE-marker, not to the target.

So in theory in some situations they can be sent around corners, but this’d take the damaging Berserker at least 2 moves (giving players 6+ seconds to kill it in all situations), while for the Defender and Warden it’s still be a non-issue, but both would be easier to utilize.

That wouldnt work at all, then your zerker could go any which way, and doesnt have a target. Id prefer to keep these phantasms target cast