Guild Wars 2

Hunter.4783:

Black Box.9312:

Rym.1469:

I’m all after giving more variety to guardians, but with a cost of superior support ability. Currently, even if group or zerg would need some support, healing or tank with tons of utility like reflections, why would they something else than a guardia
?Bt Guardians surely needs some love when it comes to variety

I think that having the option to sacrifice some of that support viability to have more build freedom is exactly what the class needs.

exactly!
We guardians aren’t asking for buffs, we are asking for more options.

Right.. “Yeah conditions and spirit weapons are so worthless blabla mye mye. We need more options!”

This thread is so funny.

Your post in “PvX Stop ingoring Guardians” was removed because it was a reply to a post that was recently deleted. This notification is only to inform you why your post was removed. It does not affect your forum account in any way.

Haha. Irony is sooooo funny. Don’t bother you guys. Arguing with a whiny guardian is like having a boxing match against a jelly.

500 per tick does hurt. Is that in PvP or WvW, Dirame? Remember that the damage is reduced by 33% in PvP and WvW. How much condi damage do you have?

Hunter.4783:

xFireize.6318:

Sauncho.8076:

xFireize, every build you mention is a support build. No one is complaining about guardian’s support. Yes, we are buff bots, in WvW and Spvp. But that’s about it. Everyone knows guardians excel with others, but what about 1 v 1, i.e. med dps. Like you said, you have to play near perfectly in order to compete in a med spec. I wouldn’t mind if the other professions were like this too, but they are not. And we are at a major disadvantage.

Yes my build is condition removal support — I really hate conditions. I’m not a fan of DPS guardian (I never said I was) and really would like to use Spirit Weapons viable against zerg. I use the foefire weapons. They look cool combined with SWs! I use SWs occasionally for 1vs1 .

Like I mentioned above, I was just commenting Hunter on how he exaggerated the nerf to vigor and boon duration.

Hunter was complaining about build viability in general which in partial was due to the many nerfs.

You countered it by mentioning you use AH and a variation of healway which is 30 honor 30 virtue, so nothing ground breaking here.

Again, why are you still posting? All you are doing is reinforcing the idea the guardian is a buff/utility bot with no other viable specs.

Huh, when did I say my “nerfed way” was ground breaking? You thought healway was completely destroyed, so I was just saying my “nerfed way” is not destroyed at all.

I never tried to prove full DPS or conditions are great. Like you said, I don’t run them so I won’t say anything about them.

Even though SWs could use some improvements, they are still viable against non AoE 1vs1. So I don’t think they are trash. Again, your points are very exaggerated.

It’s not something new. I’ve been using my signature forever because there are sooo many guardians exaggerate the problems that we have.

Didn’t you say you’re gonna play warrior? Good for you!
I feel sorry seeing guardians forcing and struggling themselves to something they are not. It’s really different from giving a constructive feedback.

Please stop posting before you embarrass yourself further.

Sauncho.8076:

xFireize, every build you mention is a support build. No one is complaining about guardian’s support. Yes, we are buff bots, in WvW and Spvp. But that’s about it. Everyone knows guardians excel with others, but what about 1 v 1, i.e. med dps. Like you said, you have to play near perfectly in order to compete in a med spec. I wouldn’t mind if the other professions were like this too, but they are not. And we are at a major disadvantage.

Yes my build is condition removal support — I really hate conditions. I’m not a fan of DPS guardian (I never said I was) and really would like to use Spirit Weapons viable against zerg. I use the foefire weapons. They look cool combined with SWs! I use SWs occasionally for 1vs1 .

Like I mentioned above, I was just commenting Hunter on how he exaggerated the nerf to vigor and boon duration.

Right.. I use AH with my 0/2/0/6/6.
Right.. I use Healway with 300 healing power.

You complained that healway was utterly destroyed. I was just replying to your comment about it. Nice try blaming me derailing your thread. It’s cute.

Please stop posting before you embarrass yourself further.

Hunter.4783:

xFireize.6318:

Hunter.4783:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Why do some of you attack anyone does doesn’t complain about the things you have a problem with?

Maybe the reason they feel stagnate is because your a band wagoner who doesn’t have the originality to build something beyond the meta? Maybe not, I dunno. One thing I do not understand, is how someone can claim a profession only has two builds, just because those are the two popular “meta” builds. Think out side the box, and perhaps it will not feel stagnate.

Heal way 0/0/10/30/30 (for the ignorant flooding this post) was our third build which was nerfed both due to vigor uptime nerf and boon duration nerf. This build, is now completely and utterly destroyed.

I’m rocking 0/2/0/6/6 300 Healing Power guardian in WvW. Same setup from before except additional sigils after the patch. I don’t feel I got nerfed. Sure Vigor up time got cut, but so did overall attack from enemies.

300….that’s it?…. Honor itself gives you 300 healing power which im sure you don’t know. You are rolling together in wvw with a zerg in which case build and gear don’t really matter. You can roll naked in a zerg and still think you are “balanced” or in a good spot. Is this your way to tell me guardians are fine. Please stop posting before you embarrass yourself further.

Saddly enough your kind is what has been holding the guardian back for such a long time. You get a build off the internet, revolving AH, using empower in the middle of the zerg, getting back half your life and thinking oh kitten that’s cool. You have most likely never made it past lvl 30 fractal on your guardian yet here you are telling me the class is fine.

This is ridiculous.

Yeah 300, and it straight comes from traits. What do you mean I don’t know? 300 + 0 = 300, you don’t know simple basic math? I don’t run healway, its DPS is weak. You thought I was running healway? It seems you’ve pigeon-holed yourself to 3 builds (and now 2 according to you). You did that to yourself yet you blame Anet. Did you get those 3 builds from the Internet? Oh irony.

Please stop posting before you embarrass yourself further

And no I don’t run with zerg. I roam with a small party. For zerging, I use 0/3/6/4/1 with AH. It’s fun to swim in an enemy zerg.

Hunter.4783:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Why do some of you attack anyone does doesn’t complain about the things you have a problem with?

Maybe the reason they feel stagnate is because your a band wagoner who doesn’t have the originality to build something beyond the meta? Maybe not, I dunno. One thing I do not understand, is how someone can claim a profession only has two builds, just because those are the two popular “meta” builds. Think out side the box, and perhaps it will not feel stagnate.

Heal way 0/0/10/30/30 (for the ignorant flooding this post) was our third build which was nerfed both due to vigor uptime nerf and boon duration nerf. This build, is now completely and utterly destroyed.

I’m rocking 0/2/0/6/6 300 Healing Power guardian in WvW. Same setup from before except additional sigils after the patch. I don’t feel I got nerfed. Sure Vigor up time got cut, but so did overall attack from enemies.

dancingmonkey, please do not be fooled nor trolled. Us fake guardians feel your pain.

You’re welcome!

My guardian is in a good place. I must not be a real guardian.

You do 0 damage?

Wasn’t guardian placed last on the CDI vote? To be honest, I mostly don’t agree with players suggestions — they are often absurd. Hence my signature.

It looks like conditions bother you a lot They bother me as well. My solutions are 3 shouts with PoV, Melandru Runes and -40% condi duration food, Absolute Resolution trait, Generosity and Purity sigil.

If you want to practice blinds and blocks, don’t use meditation build. Use the shouts instead. The stability, protection, and vigor will give you more opportunities to learn. Med build melts faster.

Want to know why they only gave Giver’s 1% each? Because of the boon duration mix n matching.

What are they called again? Oh yeah Spirit Weapons. Are those new? No? Really?

Anyway.. I’ll give it a test later tonight in WvW. AFAIK, Hammer of Wisdom’s attack, just like the Sword of Justice’s does not scale with the summoner stats. In case that I am wrong, with 2400 power and 25% crit damage on my guardian, the fully traited hammer crits for 4k~.

They are only viable for 1v1 against non aoe enemy. Other than that they die too quick to be called great.

What are you, a 12-year old? Stop creating the same thread over and over again. Here’s an attention, now shoo shoo.

Elidath.5679:

dietzero.3514:

Either give every profession low (relatively) cooldown Elite skills, or remove these type of things from the game.

Some runesets work better on some classes than other. Perplexity rune is better on an interrupt-heavy class, guardian rune without blocks are useless…
Should we add block, interrupt, basically everything to everyone, or remove runesets altogether ?

Does 5 condition conversion work better on a thief than a ranger or guardian or elementalist? Please don’t give me: with the condition meta bla bla bla thief doesn’t have condition removal bla bla bla mye mye.

Lol.. It’s not 30% less effective.. Search the forum, the discussion is pretty old.

Even without Battle Presence?

Silv.9207:

If you want to kill a Guardian, try to use poison. All the Guardian’s viable builds need to include some healing ability. if you use poison you reduce the healing ability of your enemy (it’s only defence) by 33%.

Yeah this is true. Poison is the only condition that I pay close attention to. I only rely on Signet of Resolve to heal up, and I have to make sure it’s worth it when I use it.

sinject.4607:

xFireize.6318:

How is the current effect not broken? It’s stronger than “Save Yourself!” and Contemplation of Purity. Lyssa’s cooldown is also lower.

It’s called consequences. I choose the condition handler traits and expect to be able to cope better with conditions than those who don’t.

It’s not hard counter, you can’t just have everything. I don’t expect to have high DPS when I go bunker.

If condition meta is a problem, then it’s a whole different problem. Let anet fix that by actually fixing it, not by “balancing” other part of the game.

Is there any rune of lyssa apologists that are not a thief or warrior?

wait what? are you being serious right now? well, you’ve lost your validity either way.

“only if you go out of your way to handle something should you be able to do so”

“this is not a hard-counter”

seriously if you’re going to try to carry out this vendetta against thieves and warriors at least try.

also lol @ the guy comparing good runes against garbage ones

“why isn’t sigil of justice as good as sigil of force???? NERF PLS”

Yikes.. You got me. Your earlier post was well-written so I thought I could make a healthy argument with your context. Turned out inside you’re just one of the QQers who likes to attack the validity of a person’s argument and screams “That argument is weak!”. Oh btw, it’s a video game, not rocket science. It’s not complicated. Nice job tricking me though, I’ll give you that.

So far debating with thief apologists are like boxing against jelly.

How is the current effect not broken? It’s stronger than “Save Yourself!” and Contemplation of Purity. Lyssa’s cooldown is also lower.

It’s called consequences. I choose the condition handler traits and expect to be able to cope better with conditions than those who don’t.

It’s not hard counter, you can’t just have everything. I don’t expect to have high DPS when I go bunker.

If condition meta is a problem, then it’s a whole different problem. Let anet fix that by actually fixing it, not by “balancing” other part of the game.

Is there any rune of lyssa apologists that are not a thief or warrior?

I can’t salvage an ascended weapon.

That’s really lame. I wonder if they would consider doing it. I hate spending money for something redundant.

So I have 2 GS. One is filled with bloodlust sigil and the other is filled with fire sigil. When the patch gets implemented, I will no longer need to use one of them because I can use two sigils. So my question is:

Will the sigils be removed from two-handed weapons automatically on the feature patch day?

I will be kittened if I’m forced to buy sigils that I already have or the upgrade extractor.

It’s been 2g forever.

That’s good. I don’t understand why the rune costs 2g. Could anyone help me understand? I would think 30 hp/s is garbage.

sinject.4607:

the main and only good reason to run basilisk venom was for lyssa synergy.

This is exactly the problem.

I don’t give a crap about condition meta. It doesn’t matter what the class is, if one doesn’t trait for handling conditions, then he/she should suffer from dealing with conditions. If you think the class still can’t handle conditions even if traited, bring it to the class discussion. Don’t rely on rune of lyssa to fix your class problem. If you say Basilisk Venom is semi reliable and useless, then ask them to fix it. What do you expect from a 45-second cooldown elite skill? Something super powerful? Of course it’s weaker than the others. That’s the point of cooldown: it’s related to how strong the skill is. Rune of Lyssa messes up that principle.

I too as a guardian should be able to say that I rely on rune of lyssa if I traited for fully DPS build without any traits for handling conditions. But you know what? I can’t because the guardian’s lowest elite skill cooldown is 90 seconds.

Nike.2631:

I have to smile at how closely they followed my suggestion for Lyssa Runes in the progression CDI . Converting 5 conditions was even more slick that remove 5 at random & grant 5 at random, but its still nice to see signs they are reading our posts.

Huh.. that’s accurate and disappointing. I wish there were more discussions to it. If every class had an elite skill that has around 45 cooldown, I would not have any problems with it. The new nerfed effect is actually appropriate for the cooldown.

Inexor.7804:

There’s no pleasure like anticipation.
I want to smell all the delicious tears from the thiefs and warriors and everyone else with this stupid rune.

Too bad those classes STILL can utilize the effect better than others just because they have low coodown elite skills. Like I said, the problem is the cooldown, not the effect. 5 condition removal + opposite boons is still good for 45 second cooldown.

I’m actually not impressed with the nerf. The problem was the cooldown, not the effect.

Let’s stop comparing mace to hammer; it’s like comparing guardian to warrior. The arguments never end, in the end it’s just preference.

Just go back to the mace AA discussion. The only thing I don’t like about it is the third chain doesn’t cleave. The damage is actually stronger than third chain of GS. Activation time is appropriate.

foofad.5162:

You realize that Mace’s AA sequence has exactly the same timing as Hammer’s, yes? You aren’t getting any kind of AA speed improvement by using a mace instead. You still spend a lot of time waiting for Symbol of Faith to come off cooldown, and god help you if you flub Protector’s Strike and have to sit around waiting for someone to hit you or cancel out of it with no benefit.

Additionally, Shield means more, longer cooldowns. That means more waiting, and more boring. Not to mention worse uptime on everything important.

I mean, Mace+Shield is certainly visually interesting and appealing on that level, but objectively, it’s a really terrible combo for just about everything compared to our other options. It’s okay if you use Hammer as a swap. That way with some boon duration you can have effectively permanent Regeneration and Protection at the same time, and Hammer’s much more powerful autoattack complements Mace’s extremely weak AA and keeps your DPS reasonable.

I don’t think I compared mace’s AA and hammer’s. Oh in case you haven’t tried mace, its AA is faster than hammer’s.

It’s all preference. If one can afford going through the long Hammer AA all the time, sure go ahead. I don’t think anyone is against it.

I’m not denying that hammer does give higher boost to AH when you just do AA with Writ of Persistence. It’s just really boring and has more dependents. The other 4 hammer skills are fun though. I don’t think I’ll ever give up my Two-handed Mastery for Writ of Persistence.

Shield cooldowns are appropriate for what the skills do IMO. So I don’t mind doing AA while waiting; that’s how I use AA anyway. I treat every other weapons set except GS as secondaries; and for me mace/shield gives the best on-demand defense+heal, hammer gives offense+cc, and staff gives utilities+heal. If I did main hammer maybe I’d have a different opinion about its AA.

I prefer Symbol of Faith because it’s on demand and can be paired with Shield. Similarly, I prefer Protection from Shield than Hammer because it’s on demand. I don’t like long AA — wastes time and boring. To me, 3.7 seconds could be used for a lot of other moves. To each his own.

foofad.5162:

xFireize.6318:

Not just +5% damage, but +200 Healing Power; which is huge. Too bad shield trait is located in the same tier and line. I’d rather pick shield trait instead.

Mace gives a huge boost to AH.

Hammer gives a bigger boost to AH and isn’t terrible.

Did I say hammer was terrible? Hammer AH boost relies on AA hits and combo fields. Sometimes you just can’t afford waiting 3+ seconds to land a symbol. Even though I love hammer as a secondary weapon of GS, I still prefer mace & shield for self-heal and defense.

Not just +5% damage, but +200 Healing Power; which is huge. Too bad shield trait is located in the same tier and line. I’d rather pick shield trait instead.

Mace gives a huge boost to AH.

Don’t get too attached with mix n match boon duration runes; they are fixing them and if they get to the point where boon duration becomes consistent, you’ll just end up angry like the people who don’t like the Ferocity idea.

I too run non healing power 0/10/0/30/30, but I avoid using those runes. I still prefer my melandru.

You pretty much got the facts right for those two builds. At the end it all comes back to you; which gameplay do you prefer?

AH gives tons of your own survivability; not your party’s. Even though you have less support, you gain lots of opportunity to get DPS (this is the reason people use the combo of zerker, soldier, and knights). AH build is the key to Jack of All Trades guardian; giving support, tanky, and could deal damage. It’s also not set to 0/~/30/30/~. I use 0/15/30/20/5 to spam blind in an enemy zerg.

Healway is heavier towards Support. On top of the dodge heal and VoR healing, your Regeneration boon is also stronger. However, you’re missing out on awesome things when you only have 916 precision. 30 Virtues is just to maximize boon duration and Virtues.

I tried Healway. It wasn’t for me. Which one is for you?

It would be cool if it worked, but it would be more time consuming. I would like to see new features or gameplay instead; excluding Living Story.

It’s more complicated to fix balance by buffing instead of nerfing.

Spirit Weapon is the guardian’s most expensive utility skill set, trait wise; yet the reward is not as great the investment. They are viable, only to certain weak classes who don’t do much AoE damage; like thief, ranger, etc. Hammer wrecks them up.

Retaliation. Too bad it’s nerfed in WvW. 5 duration stack cap is kinda dumb too since Symbol of Wrath will use them up quickly.

Although I too prefer Renewed Focus, saying every guardian runs it is a exaggeration. I still see guardians run tomes and prefer them. You will probably see ones who love Tome of Courage soon in this thread.

Elite Focus trait is weak though. I don’t think it would be too OP to add an additional effect to it, such as -20% CD to elite skills.

Renewed Focus was never 3 secs. Tooltip bug.

AoE Protection+ Regeneration + Stability + Retaliation on party and Weakness on enemies; your party will have no problem shrugging off direct damage. It’s perfect combined with “Hold the Line!” and “Stand Your Ground!”.

Combined with PoV and Absolute Resolution, you pretty much provide tons of direct damage mitigation and condition removal for your party.

For me, it’s an alternative for “Save Yourself!” when I run with a zerg. As we all know, “Save Yourself!” can back fire.

I already trait -20% CD for Signet of Resolve, so adding another signet is no problem to me. I love that they removed the cast time and added stun break to the skill when Weakness got buffed.

Obtena.7952:

I’m not sure what 4 runes you are referring to but all rune sets are getting revamped to make stacking the easy choice. I don’t need to stop relating the problem to intelligence because the whole premise that Anet states to make this change is to make it easier.

You’re right though. I can wait until mid April to complain this. If the rest of the runes follow suit from just the handful they gave examples of, I don’t think I will be alone.

Good luck with your intelligence argument mid April. I hope there won’t be many people like you.

Blocks, HP pool, mobility and healing threads always attract whiny guardians and warrior wanna-be’s. It also always starts with a newbie asking a simple question that could be answered easily. It’s really getting old.. I’d love to give my opinion but this crap just doesn’t end.

Obtena.7952:

I don’t think it’s end of the world but I don’t see a reason to placate the lowest common denominator either. Perhaps you don’t mind being told how to play because you can’t handle the stress of making gearing choices but if that’s the case, the change won’t incentive you to stack runes anyways.

This isn’t the same as bugged PoV. It’s a change that assumes we are all idiots because runes are so complex and we need Big Daddy Anet to hold our hand and tell us what to do.

The others here are giving feedback that they are upset, which is to me, very reasonable; but to be insulted? Seriously.. Don’t worry big boy, your intelligence is not at stake.

Stop relating the problem to intelligence LOL; it’s pathetic. Give a legitimate feedback maybe you’ll be heard; maybe even by Anet.. who knows. Like I said; it’s just 4 runes. It happens. It doesn’t take an intelligent person to mix-n-match those runes. It does not take one either to figure that those runes are anomalies compared to other runes.

Remember that ferocity is coming soon. Maybe you have a clearer idea which one to choose after it gets implemented. I suggest you wait.

Obtena.7952:

xFireize.6318:

If they intended everything can be mix n match’d, why bother making the stack effect bonuses at all? If they did intend it, every rune would be similar to Rune of Divinity, where the 6 effect bonuses are equal. That rune is unique because it has non min-maxing attributes.

Not necessarily. By making stacking bonuses, you give non-halfwits the ability to choose if they want those stacking bonuses or mix/matching …. like what happens now. I think the boost to the higher tiers of runes was a good move because the stacking really wasn’t comparing to mixing. ON the other hand, nerfing the stacking bonus would simply relegate mixing to ’don’t mix unless you suck’ status.

From what I can see, how the runes are being dumbed down so the choice becomes obvious insults everyone’s intelligence.

Gee whiz.. Anet must have insulted your intelligence really bad huh? I’m sorry.

Players will realize it’s not the end of the world; just like the bugged PoV. It started with an Anet’s mistake. Then players got spoiled. Then there’s some angry mobs. Then everyone will move on. Meh.

The design idea is the more you stack runes, the more powerful effects you get. Right now, there should be only one rune that does not follow that design; Rune of Divinity, which does not have min max attributes.

I don’t think that’s hard to figure out and it should be easy to see this fix coming. Too bad it lasted long enough so a lot more people are attached to it.

With this upcoming fix, I hope they would also fix Giver’s armor and/or add more fun sources for boon duration.