Guild Wars 2

What are the exact benefits of this trait? I’ve read some differing ‘theories’ on how it works.

The way I understand it – the game automatically slows everyone by a certain percentage while in combat (can anyone provide the exact % slowdown?). This is definitely known.

A thief with the trait, OOC and in stealth will move at swiftness speed and not the advertised +50% (133% speed or 150% speed?).

A thief with the trait, in combat and in Stealth will move at swiftness speed as well? (as in 133% movement) Or the thief will run at regular speed, as if the combat speed decrease did not apply.

I’m not saying this is what happens, but what I’ve read and experienced.

Panncakez.1290:

Does the same rule applies to allies?

Yes – so you should position your SR in a way that prevents a player who is moving from running out of it before they can react to the SR being used (stop moving)

Ascended condition damage trinkets are only available as +heal/condi/tough (apothecary), +condi/tought/vit/minor precision (dire/minor rabid), rabid/apoth, and rabid. There is no straightforward carrion or dire.

Is it worth it to use the dire/minor rabid accessories in p/d?

The small amount of precision may throw off any stat advantage gained from being ascended?

Chrysocola Orichalcum Earring (Exotic, with gem – carrion)
+65 power
+65 vit
+81 condi damage

Matriarchs’ Quill (Ascended – Dire/minor Rabid)
+18 Precision
+60 tough
+42 vit
+96 condi (infusion +5, + 91 regular = 96)

edit* Apothercary Ascended – Purge Signet (Apothecary)
I also have the ascended set of apothecary accessories, for ultra-troll mode in WvW. Stats of earring are below. This is also a valid option because the apothecary ascended items don’t waste points on precision. Healing power is still useful to p/d in the mass regen of the spec.

68 Toughness
+103 Healing Power
+73 Condition Damage (5 from infusion +68regular)

imo the dire/rabid trinkets represent the best possible scenario of stat combos, as precision is relatively useless to p/d than other stats.

does the small amount of precision on dire/rabid accessories throw off the overall benefit of using ascended gear?

lol @ people taking op seriously.

Azure Prower.8701:

At that same time, I’m sure all the planets in our solar system would align.

18 stacks is the max possible its definitely rare, you can also look for mes chaos bubbles/rings and shadowstep position yourself so the field is between you and your target.

my method to throw gunk is to drop targets before throwing it. Without a target the gunk throws at your feet and won’t break stealth. Plan ahead to use gunk; CnD/HiS/BP- create distance while dropping target – throw gunk – re target – sneak attack

Static.9841:

How exactly? you’re using D/P? so how are you stacking anything from gunk when you need to fire through it? Also, WHY would you use D/P on a condi perp build? This would also be purely situational on getting gunk from an engi or an NPC as well as having the #3 trigger, so it’s not exactly something you can pull of reliably or often.

So, judging that you’re using P/D on one set, you’re saying you steal into your enemy for 5 stacks and C&D (I would expect), throw gunk (which would then reveal yourself and not give you a stealth shot) or you click off target and throw it between you and the target hoping that they stay between you and the gunk, then stealth shot, then headshot and also get hit to trigger the #3? I’m with the guy on planetary alignment.

It’s definitely planetary alignment for 18 but 13 or 15 is very doable. I practice the combo on sentry because you can predict their first 2 casts and the longer cast heals: start from stealth – drop gunk at feet – sneak attack(5) – switch to D/P or P/P – interrupt bola or charge(10) – steal to get into melee(15) – perplex proc on hit (18).

Mordecai.6318:

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

It’s a trade off – With sleight of hand the confusion is not guaranteed but the interrupt to trigger perplexity is easier to pull off

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

I play soley thief since game release and done fractals since their release and not once have I been kicked from a fractal group for being thief. I don’t understand the obsession with berserker gear. No matter how good you think you are you will die in berserker gear. Stop using it in fractals.

I’m investing in the dire – sounds all very good. And I thought I was already immortal in apoth. Just made my ascended weapons for dire. I’ll get back to this later.

The one thing that sets major rage to me is that the ascended gear stats are so stupid – why on earth did they stick that tiny offstat of precision onto the dire stat gear?? Also no pure carrion gear stat..

I’ve been playing P/D for a long time now running with apothecary, carrion and settler gear sets. I switch between a mix of apoth/settler or full carrion.

I’m however curious if anyone has also tried full dire stat set in addition to trying gear with healing/vit/tough/condi.

Whats the noticeable differences? – does the toughness and vit added from dire overcome the healing from apoth/sett? I know the added condi damage will be much higher than apoth/sett.

I’ve got way too many hours played as P/D in WvW and PvE, I run full toughness/healing/condi gear and it’s easily the most troll spec we have in wvw roam and, depending on level of troll you’re looking to achieve, change around some pieces.

I bought southsun rose neck condi/heal/tough, and switch between the toughness/heal/condi rings such as Purge Signet, with condi/toughness/vital/minor precis rings such as Vassar’s Band.

I use carrion earrings right now, but will probably buy the matriarch’s quill and not ancient karka caraspace because it’d be dropping too much already scarce condi damage.

I found that the gear with major condi dmg/toughness/vital combination was most effective in trolling. However, you’ll find that the ascended gear offers this stat combo, but with the completely unwanted precision in the stat combo.

Iavra.8510:

In P/D Condi:

- Throw Gunk
- CnD
- Stealth Attack
-> 5 * 100% Projectile finisher resulting in 5 stacks Confusion

..which requires you to:

-stop #1 premature so that the mid-air bullet doesn’t interrupt your stealth before you can sneak attack

-throw goop breaks stealth if any enemy stands in it; hope that they are moving and that goop MISSES them (uh..) before CnD

-requires perfect positioning to not break stealth and to kite targets into position

it’s a situationally good ability. but most of the time I simply throw it at random and move on. mesmer steal is far superior. I’d rather get a flamethrower/net/thumper/ice grenade/elixir attack from an engi, there’s just so many better options and throw goop barely makes sense.

I run p/d in WvW with settlers armor and reyna’s armor with ascended rings/back/neck. Completely unkillable and can take minimum 3 people at once assuming they stick around and are not organized. The best I’ve done was fight a commander for ~15 mins and killed EVERYONE who kept coming to his tag.

mercury ranique.2170:

If you transmutate the the karka shell stats to the skin of the capacitor you can only use it in the recipe to make the karka shell ascended. This recipe will take a transmuted item, but will return you the old skin (so unb-doing the transmuating).

Best is to wait with transmutating till you have done the upgrade. If you dislike the karka shell skin (as I do) just hide it (so you will have no visiable back pack at all).

good explanation thanks. Sad, this requires upgrading both pieces fully then to have the capacitor (ascended) skin with karka stats

I’m thinking about transmuting the sclerite karka shell stats http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sclerite_Karka_Shell
onto my Prototype capacitor skin.
My question is.. once I transmute, will I still be able to upgrade the capacitor in the mystic forge and maintain the sclerite shell’s stats? Will the sclerite capacitor stats also be correctly increased and given an infusion slot? Note; the stat set on sclerite is not normally available to capacitors.
The farthest I’ve tested is looking at the transmutation crystal interface – the item retains the pink name “Prototype Fractal Capacitor”

I’m thinking about transmuting the sclerite karka shell stats http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sclerite_Karka_Shell
onto my Prototype capacitor skin.

My question is.. once I transmute, will I still be able to upgrade the capacitor in the mystic forge and maintain the sclerite shell’s stats? Will the sclerite capacitor stats also be correctly increased and given an infusion slot? Note; the stat set on sclerite is not normally available to capacitors.

The farthest I’ve tested is looking at the transmutation crystal interface – the item retains the pink name “Prototype Fractal Capacitor”

sorrow.2364:

Since Toughness, Healing Power and Condition Damage sets are incredibly cheap right now, I’d like to know if someone has found any viable build which fits nicely with this set.

I run P/D with mix of apoth and reyna’s, 1505 condi, 800 healing, 19k hp, 1.6k toughness, all with 25 stack/food/crystal, negligable crit and power. Nigh unkillable in wvw.

-Sneak Attack buffed with a cripple or weakness or vulnerability apply

-Body Shot given a low duration cripple or vulnerability or weakness

-Shadow Strike given one of the above

-Piercing shots for Sneak Attack or Body Shot via traits or baseline

-Baseline 20% bouncing shots to body shot or sneak attack, traited to higher %chance

The only viable fixes I can think of

bump for more input, I’m sure there’s other stuff people are thinking of

A lot of people just aren’t fully informed to AR mechanics. A few weeks ago we had someone join the level 14 group – we noticed he had 400 achievement points, which is a raging clue to a new player, so we asked if he knew what it was. He didn’t, so I explained in whispers and told him we’ll get someone else, and he was not mad or offended and said he’d look into the wiki and never even did a fractal.

With the update that took away fractal level requirement on entry, which I think was a great idea, there’s no hard restriction on entry. But we should at least have some kind of indication as to who’s prepared; to know who can at least produce some of the stat. Perhaps the buff would just say “Agony Resistance” and not even give a value. Make it show only at levels 20+ if they must.

The problem is heightened with yet another bug – linking non-ascended items doesn’t even show its infusion slot (assuming this is a bug actually). Meaning that if the item isn’t ascended (which have a set stat for agony), then we can’t know if it’s even infused. If its not a bug, then Anet is truly dead-set on not allowing an AR check.

Then again, all of this dumbs down the inspection idea further and now I’m thinking more about the reasoning behind not having it. I fully agree not to show stats, but at least allow us to follow up on curiosity of their armor and weapons. Show the character’s picture and formal title of the gear (ie: “Whisper’s Hood” and not “Berserker’s Whisper Hood”). However, I get a feeling that Anet doesn’t want this – maybe they want to keep this feeling of randomness and unknown armor, to create the guild wars world where a major part of gearing is to find our own sets and explore. maybe I’ve been convinced here heheh.

The TP fee is a source of gold, which is why I say to apply it to trades as well. Trading would just allow for so much more complexity.

If it is someone’s right to gear pings, then just allow it to be inspected. Also, I’m no longer talking about gear stats, but instead just a simple mf/ar value. If at high level fractals you need to see it anyway, then just allow it.

Missing the hp/toughness by wearing MF is many times the difference between getting 1 shot or surviving. A bad player will indeed be downed, but a bad player wearing MF or no AR is pretty much useless and should have been dropped from the get go. I mention a personal instance to compare it to pugging – I KNOW who can carry their own, but I do not know if a pug has even done the instance before or if he even has AR for the fractal; is he going to get 2 shot every time by the boss? only one way to find out.

Trading is more so to add some interaction, or to just avoid the silly mail trading going on, there’s no variety of offering items lower than the TP prices to have quicker sales, or selling cheaper in bulk, etc. Trading allows for player-player interaction off the TP and stirs up chat and such. Every mmo ever has had trading and while some people are saying they can’t think of a reason to add it, I can’t think of a reason for why it wasn’t included from the start. I have no knowledge of coding, but relative to other additions, adding a trade window really can’t be too difficult or resource demanding.

Yes I also agree with the ideas for MF/AR – add a buff for their character, or just make the inspection UI only show gear and total AR/MF. I understand the threat of gearing and elitist requirements.

Maybe I don’t understand how easy a gbank is to make – but from what I’m thinking don’t we need 5k influence? which translates to ~50g to buy.

And yes, people are most definitely running fractals in MF. In vent/mumble my buddy always jokes around – “carry me bro full MF” and its completely true, not that I mind because I know he can carry the weight, but who knows how many failures have been due to missing 5k hp from the gear of other pugs.

I don’t think everyone knows what I’m really aiming for – some of the features are all really just baseline things that are missing. The game with some of these such as trading, dueling, previewing, linking and such, are what I think is missing from a well rounded game, things that should have been there on release. Most of these I would think shouldn’t have even had a second thought in development.

Trading and dueling are others I forgot about – will add.

Dolan – Squad and raid UI really can’t compare. We need to see classes and health bars, maybe even endurance, of the entire group. It’d enhance gameplay so well.

To have a guild bank we still need influence and such.. but it does still work

Hard to get legendary is already hard to get with or without a precursor quest. Currently though we are crafting the legendary blind hoping to get the exact precursor we need.

Search command I’m talking about is to be used on allied players in different zones or just far away from you in general – not WvW enemies.

Guesting priority refers to large group events with enormous chest at the end. It’s very common to end up in an overflow for shatterer, maw, etc. and is most likely due to guests.

I do agree with others with respect to inspecting – avoid any other stats except AR and MF would suffice, maybe also total health as a number.

Open world PvP wilderness is due to me reminiscing over many other MMOs that I’ve played which have pvp areas. It feels way differant than WvW style of having a large team and safe zones behind you and definitely produces a whole new community within the game.

In theory we could pretty much take the EB map, leave all of its gates open to forts/garrison/tower and such and have no guards or teams. Fill these spots with hostile NPC or safe area, and make supply camp areas into wooded/water/mountain/plains/ice themed areas. Maybe even add a small dragon/drake attack event to each themed area – a way to concentrate the zone every hour or so. Just some idea of what I’m thinking of.

There’s still a lot of features to the UI and overall gameplay that are missing. I remember reading that anet wanted their game to be ready and done on release, but recent updates such as previewing items on trading post that was JUST added really shows there’s still so many basic features missing.

I’d list what I can think of in terms of ‘baseline’ features that without a doubt should have been already implemented long ago:

Alliance/Raid/Squad UI - 5 man grouping is not enough, why is there still no raid group options? Whether it be required to have a commander, or just anyone as raid leader, there’s no reason to not have raid group UI. Squad is not even close to the same thing and many people don’t even know it exists.

Internal LFG gw2lfg does indeed work, but we need an LFG channel that exists in-game. lfg site is just a hassle to use and is not as efficient as in game.

Currency Tab - I understand Anet’s reasoning behind not having this – no tab for tokens/relics/commendations/etc creates a need to buy bank and bag slots. But how about getting over it, and allowing these tokens to be held in an unlimited tab slot in banks similar to collectibles. From what I understand, a personal guild bank requires about10g to buy the influence, or a long time of solo influence.

Forums - There are no server forums, or even WvW tier forums. Not a priority, but again, easy enough.

Precursors - Spark has reached 700g, The lover is almost 700g, Dawn/Dusk 600g, legend 700g. Why is there still no other option to acquiring these beyond pure luck. The mystic forge is a complete crap shoot, chest drops are 1 in a million, and outright buying it costs about the same as the entire recipe combined; there’s nothing ‘legendary’ about any of these options and are really just huge wastes of time – a legendary quest line of some sort needs to be added.

Inspecting Players Only agony resist is relevant We still cannot view what players are wearing. The argument that inspecting creates gear requirements is indeed true – so many have suggested having the UI only show MF and AR values and avoiding gear stats all together. Or to have MF/AR appear as a buff icon.
I’m actually leaning more and more away from this. I think it’s anet’s way of pushing us players to explore and collect our own gear sets by not allowing us to see every title piece at any time.

“/Search” Command for Players The only way to view a players class is through guild/contacts/party without them being right infront of you. There should be a command to search a character for their class, level, guild, location. For example: /search playername would produce a line of text of said information.

Saving Gear Sets An option to save sets of gear for easier interchanging between armor sets.

Linking Trading Post We still cannot link items straight from the trading post.

Traits While allocating trait points, currently if you screw one up you must respec. We should have a system that only saves trait points once we are confirmed finished. It would allow us to add/subtract points at will until we confirm the traits and they become active.

Guesting Players of the server need some kind of priority over guests with respect to ending up in overflow. Major chest events are clogged at peak hours due to guesting onto other servers to complete a players alts every day – this may be fixed on the coming update.

Wilderness FFA PvP: One of the major things I would love to see is a wilderness style PvP area. A large map that allows for open world non team based PvP. Whether it be server exclusive or another WvW form, an open world PvP area is needed for a long lasting game.

This is really something that makes or breaks the game for many – I could spend endless hours in a pvp area designed for “PKing” – because let’s face it, WvW gets old, fast, with the zerg/siege/capture gameplay. I would imagine the area is heavy with level 80 mobs/veterans and gathering nodes with open areas away from the farm spots, and little to no waypoints available. There would be no teams, but instead only allowable 3-5 man groups; party members would be friendly status to each other while others outside the party are enemies. Perhaps it could share badge of honor drops, or a whole new badge currency for a new set of gear. The game truly lacks any sort of dangerous and risky PvP or farm areas.

Other suggestions

Trade - We can’t trade directly with players, another loss in community interaction and trading post variety. Put a 15% fee on it for all we care.

Duels – I have heard about an area to be added into heart of the mists, but there should still be one outside of heart to allow for custom gear sets.

Comments and other suggestions are welcome, I love hearing what people think in terms of ideas and suggestions.

What about removing the evade on death blossom, and adding it to dancing dagger. I like the idea of the shadowstepping between targets hit, but what about evading between targets?

Also, I don’t like the idea of heartseeker causing bleeds, there would be some weird choice to make between condition and direct damage as it is with death blossom being in a weird spot in d/d.

yes we do need sub forums for wvw tiers, also need forums for servers. This game lacks community so badly right now, in game and out.

Xsorus.2507:

You’re required to run 30 in Shadowarts because its absolutely amazing as a line.

Its got more utility packed in it then most other classes have in all their lines..

Your complaints about CC are hilarious at best.

Thieves have multiple escapes that are far better then most classes.

the only escape I run is shadowstep, if it’s on cooldown and I’m knocked down, I’m dead. Whenever HiS is interupted I’m basically guarenteed death unless I have all other cooldowns to blow. Do you suggest I run roll for init. and shadowstep with withdraw or something? Sure, infiltrator’s is an escape, but at that point the fight is lost, and unless I combo with every other cooldown I have (SR/BP/SS/HiS) IR is still not always effective and devours all initiative within 2 arrows, which just goes back to the good ol’ rage inducing aspect of stealth, which isn’t actually a valid problem.

saying that shadow arts is overpacked isn’t an argument – I say it’s required for any spec outside of glass because it’s really the only tree that offers any surviavbility, besides a few in acro. Glass will not put a single point in SA tree for the sake of being glass. Why does everyone think traiting into stealth healing heals for so much? I regen ~350 with near maximum healing power.

FearSeven.6357:

Haha, now you admit thiefs are OP, there is no counter to a ‘bunker’ thief like you just admitted, 30 points in shadow arts makes a thief unkillable, while it can still wear berzerker gear for superb damage. That’s no bunker thief, that’s a flawed mechanic.

haha…? don’t try to mince words, try reading previous discussion before, I’ve already said it plenty of times before, if I get hard CC’d just once or twice, I’m as good as dead, there’s almost nothing I can do, especially when not running with a stun breaker.

I said we are required 30 points in shadow arts to maintain surviving. And no, we can’t wear berserker gear to the same effectiveness. I’ve already said it (again please read) that I wear full healing/vital/toughness/condi gear running with all points spent into survivability and stealth, and yet I still die to hundred blades glass or engi bombs or glass thief, well executed CC will destroy any stealth spec.

I’m not complaining about it though – that’s the counter, any hard cc really.. I spend all my effort into surviving and avoiding CC

Columba.9730:

A thief can take the same risks we do by rezzing others.

I will never attempt a non-stealth dunk while in a group, doing so 100% ensures I’ll die.

mist stomp >Shrink stomp >Stability stomp> Swiftness stomp >Stealth stomp.
Bubble revives>Chain invuln revives>Stealth revives.

Stealth stomping: No counter, I can’t target you.
If you see a thief CnD on your teammate, you use aoe and autoattack on the area s you anticipate the stomp cast. Stealth stomps in groups are rarely effective when defended against. What am I supposed to do against a tiny stomp or bubbled stomp?

Condition damage should be the counter for stealth, but with this trait and the heal while stealthed

It is, which is why a ‘bunker’ spec, or actually any non glass spec, mandatory has to put 30 points into shadow arts, which offers absolutely no damage increase at all. My shadow rejuv ticks for 342 with max +healing armor/weapons and +6% medic buff. I can remove a maximum of 3 conditions every ~15 seconds assuming I land CnD and want to blow all initiative and deal zero damage. If players stick around for that long over and over it’s their own fault for apparently wanting to fight a bunker. But that’s not the point really.

In the end culling is the absolute problem, lets see how everything changes when it’s fixed.

Sunflowers.1729:

Umm culling benefits thieves the most, so why haven’t thieves been balance to the same degree they have been in Spvp,, eg nerfed to Spvp? If culling helps them more, then why have they been made MORE powerful in WvWvW?

Did you read what I said at all? take a couple minutes to understand it.

WvW and sPvP are not the same, not even remotely close, and thus stealth has hugely different impacts in each.

Culling exists in WvW and is the MAJOR factor to why stealth is so effective. Mass groups of players roam around WvW maps with little to no coordination with each other, while in sPvP your focus is on small control points with small groups.

Sunflowers.1729:

Umm culling benefits thieves the most

yes

Sunflowers.1729:

If culling helps them more, then why have they been made MORE powerful in WvWvW?

read above

FearSeven.6357:

1 – Get rid of stealth reviving and stomping.
2 – Nerf Shadow’s Embrace.

And what would you propose is done? Just rambling about things you think are wrong because of how you lost to it won’t ever help.

A warrior/guardian can res a player with stability, shields, aegis, protection, etc. An ele can mist form back to the lines and guarantee a res for himself. A thief can stealth and res. Without the stealth a thief can ….? Even so, if I try to stealth res or stomp against a group of competent players, I WILL die. How about next time you see a thief stealth stomping, you AOE the player he’s stomping, or even counter stealth the player, knock backs on the player, it’s so easy.

Shadow’s embrace is the only condi removal thieves have and costs 6 initiative or a minimum 40 second cooldown to trigger. With black powder builds it costs 6+3-2(refunded) initiative to activate stealth. What do you propose to nerf shadow’s embrace or stealth stomps? All I see is resenting a mechanic that you lost against with no insight on how it even works.

Columba.9730:

Daeqar.8965:

Sunflowers.1729:

sPvP is based around holding points with very small numbers of people. WvW is not. If you fight a thief in sPvP and he is unable to kill your fully bunker build, you win cause you have successfully defended the point. If the same thing happens in WvW it is at best a draw, unless you both happen to be solo with no NPCs (which is extremely rare) in a supply camp or something.

And WvW is based around holding points (objectives) with very large numbers of people. Thief happens to be even worse at that comparatively than with very small numbers.

Yet so many people want to be terribly worried about what happens when they run around solo, even when it has very little impact on contributing to a win.

Where does it say that only thieves are allowed to solo?

Secondly, if Spvp and WvWvW are the same, how about we balance thieves in WvWvW the same way they are balanced in Spvp?

You cannot balance WvW as sPvP. WvW has culling issues because of the mass amount of players. And because of the mass of amount of players thieves are able to move around in stealth and pick straggler targets with ease. Also in WvW there are lowbie players who get destroyed by thieves – in sPvP we are all on the same playing field with level and gear; optimized for even and fair pvp. WvW is not even and fair

amiable.4823:

slender.1482:

engi to give up healing,

Your healing in stealth is FAR better then overall engi healing

With healing power on all of my armor and weapons, gives me +500 healing power, my stealth heal ticks for 342/sec and is the only other heal I have besides HiS. Bleeds tick for 104-111 depending on might and auto attacks hit for sub 100. The only reason I survive any sort of FF is with 21k hp/2.5k armor. 100% bunker specced, there’s no reason anybody should be sticking around to fight me for more than a minute. Its so silly to fight a bunker spec of anything, ever, the only way you’ll lose is if you let me widdle you down.

I agree that culling is a major contributor to the problem, I’ve said it many times already. If you notice in sPvP stealth is no problem at all. It’s because of 1) no culling and 2) much smaller groups. Less chaos in sPvP and no culling = you find that stealther right away (look for stealthing swirls animation is so easy mode).

Allowing to target the stealther while in stealth is not the answer, it would completely negate the point of stealth.

I think that we should be able to put a target over the stealther’s head, and that target should not be lost unless you choose to. Only with the target will you be auto-targetted back to the stealther. Similar to the current focus red target already in game but with more utility to it. Whether it is a totally new command and color, ie) press F12 to place a green arrow over the player, for example or some kind of option in settings to enable, I think this is the best bet for auto targetting.

An automatic targeting system seems too far – in that there’s no effort involved in the process. If you want to target the thief you must first see and find him and manually target, not just sit back and wait

LordByron.8369:

slender.1482:

I don’t understand why the elementalists don’t ride the lightning to me the second I start using sneak attack,

self stun is not fun you know….
And then you say L2p

What? Yes it is your 100% best best. The second you see my bullets firing from sneak attack, your ride the lightning should be used. Same goes for any other type of gap closer/magnet/stun/knockback.

Guardians who understand how to use aegis to block backstab, to block CnD, and NOT to block my autoattack will win guaranteed. An ele who lands ride the lghtning, or uses it to stop my sneak attack and force a dodge WILL force me to leave the fight or die.

The biggest issue is the nerd rage, and no not using the term in a negative way, it’s just a hilariously true definition. When a stealther runs away from the fight and leaves the enemy with no kill, people get mad and call for nerfs. When the thief kills them by using stealth, nerfs.

But I don’t think alot of people get that thieves have no knockdowns, no burst with CC, no CC with burst, no aegis, no protection, no block. Stealth is literally the ONLY way my p/d build survives. This is like crying for guardians to lose their mitigation, or for mesmers to give up copies, engi to give up healing, ele to give up condi removal. It the nature of the class using its abilities.

And like I said many times before, WvW chaotic fighting enables stealthers to exploit stealth so easily and in a punishing way. I’m able to position myself around groups of players, attack, disappear, and leave them running around like chickens with no heads while the lowbie and inexperienced players die off so easily. To contrast, I could fight a group of 4 players new to the game and win, but fight a single engi who knows the class and lose miserably.

Teamkiller.4315:

Slender, if you’re trying to argue that stealth ISN’T overpowered maybe you shouldn’t start by saying “Hey I just won a 1v7 but it’s because I played smart”.

I’m trying to point out how the majority of the playerbase is relatively terrible. Learn what thieves run with – in this case I had no stun breaker at all, and only one on command stealth (blinding powder – HiS/SoS/BP/caltrop/guild) and I don’t think I was CC’d once beyond the comm’s fears.

Also, there was only 3 or so at a time, I was just there so long fighting a commander tag that more kept coming. Why out of all of them, was I never knocked down, immob’d, feared, stunned while casting my only blatant heal, AOE bled, AOE burned, confuse bombed, cripple spammed? While I was hit with CC, it wasn’t coordinated (random WvW low levels and pugs?) and taken advantage of. With the chaos of WvW combined with using line of sight to block range, stealth builds excel so well, there’s no fix for that sorry.

With the 33% MS in stealth (another misconception – the 50% speed is only so high to compensate for combat speed debuff) I’m able to exploit the chaos much easier when I reposition myself AWAY from the group and only close to my target. This isolates the players who don’t understand staying together will win. There could have been 3 thieves and all the group would have to do is stay close and focus fire.

I don’t understand why the elementalists don’t ride the lightning to me the second I start using sneak attack, or why I don’t get bull rushed instantly, or why I don’t get feared out of my shadow refuge, or why the ranger just stood still while I dropped caltrops on his feet, why the guardians don’t magnet pull me out of refuge, or why I was able to spam cloak and dagger over and over as they never learned to dodge and cripple when I come into melee range, or why the engi’s don’t seem to realize care package stun will end my life, or understanding why aegis as group buff will wreck me, why do people dodge roll when I’m in stealth – the moment after I stealth? (hint: wait 2 seconds and don’t backpedal..)

WvW allows stealth to excel much more noticably than say a guardians group aegis, it’s just so much more rage inducing to everyone when it’s so much more graphic and visible, and thus more crying ensues. Seirously, l2p and use skills to counter the mechanic – whenever I see a stealther I immediately switch to shortbow and immob followed by AOE spam in the likely direction of movement, of which almost always works, use blinds or aegis when they get close for the CnD.

This is coming from a player who just took down 7 players total in WvW, alone.
One of them was an enemy comm with incinerator (meaning a competent player), three of them were under level 80. At first 4v1, then all downed, then 3v1 to all downed. I am able to stealth, reposition to the far end away from the group and attack, and re-enter stealth to do it again and again. The fight took about 20 minutes total of which they should have just left after 1 minute, so for what it’s worth, it’s their own fault.

Is stealth overpowered? I think it’s completely situational – right now in WvW my 4 second stealth (CnD) turns into 4 sec of being completely invisible, assuming I don’t leave early. 2-2.5 sec of actually waiting in stealth, then attacking – rarely will players stay in stealth the full duration, only doing so to remain hidden and hiding, and note – staying in stealth for full duration and remaining WILL consume all initiative within ~12 sec, traiting for initiative gain loses us ALOT of healing, utility, condi removal and mobility and while doing it deals zero damage.

I think alot of players don’t know how to counter it, and the answer to how to counter is extremely simple – KNOCKDOWNS and BURST. Nothing else has ever 100% guaranteed my death when fighting 2+ players, and even so, 1v1 a knockdown will severely disrupt my play. Maybe I’m not allowed to say it, but it’s actually extremely frustrating to how vulnerable thief is to knockdowns. Players who know how to dodge the incomming stealth attack, and locate+follow the stealther while in stealth, will cause me to leave the fight or die within one round of cooldowns.

Stealth is not overpowered, but when facing players with no reliable knockdown or anti-stealth tactics, it can be exploited to no end. I think that a stealthing class that knows how to utilize their evades when needed (saving dodges for major hits), combined with blinds/copies/blocks, will be able to outlive nearly anything it faces. ie, a skilled a well informed player WILL destroy any “noob” player who does not know how to play against it. I’ve taken down many 1vX lowbie fights with ease, but on the other hand have also been outright murdered by a simple well executed knockdown combo.

In the end I think it frustrates people when a stealther runs away and the player is left angry with no victory stomp. I think that stealthers are able to crush new and lowbie players ONLY in WvW because of culling (notice how sPvP stealth is much noticeably differant) and really people just need to l2P when it comes to countering stealth. It is a very demanding and punishing ability when used correctly, and unorganized chaos of WvW allows it to greatly excel.

Try P/D for roaming 1vX super troll never die with healing gear

Loading.4503:

Aberrant.6749:

I wouldn’t go full apothecary though… vit works as anti-burst/anti condition. Toughness is anti sustained damage…

i disagree, ive gone full apothecary before, everything, armor trinkets, weapons, and paired with undead runes you have enough toughness to take a bs, or hb with enough healing to laugh at it once u stealth or cast your heal. i was worried at first about the low hp, but you have so toughness to make up for it, and with sigil stacks and food, i was still able to do high bleed ticks

I’m aiming for around 18k hp combined with high toughness as a safe spot to avoid any possible burst by groups of players, if that’s possible by traits alone then I’d agree. P/D’s primary and blaring weakness is the threat of being bursted down while stunned/knocked down etc; hard cc has been the only thing I die to.

what are you guy’s bleeds like? I’m getting minimum 115 usually, max around 125ish, 25 stack via caltrops reaches 130+ (with food/crystals)

Apothecary. In the context of WvW, I’ve been running with condi/healing/vitality gear, carrion earrings/rings, p/t/v back/neck and am able to destroy any other class combo. Literally am unkillable in 1v1, and can easily take on 2-4 other players. I’d have made a video by now if I wasn’t so lazy with it.

I also want to get my hands on apothecary accessories and armor as I expect it’ll be endlessly better to combo toughness with healing rather than vitality. I’m at ~22k hp but with relatively low toughness

For PvE I’d stick with p/t/v accessories with carrion gear.

FxyO.8243:

i was wondering for dps if its worth dodging then using death blossom for the extra 3 bleed stacks, or should i not dodge and just sit on the mob?

in my experience dodgetrops are pretty terrible, they don’t last long enough on the ground and the patch size is very small. if feels like they last 1 sec with a circle about the size of my human character’s hit box.

there’s never been a noticeable damage output from whenever i’ve tried using them.

oZii.2864:

slender.1482:

Fleet shadow (+50% ms in stealth) is very good, I like it better than might on dodge.
take condition removal in stealth over patience or infusion, it’s one of the best traits we have. you always want the condition removal and shadow’s rejuv, the condi removal is far too valuable and easily accessed.

consider taking shadow protector (regen boon from stealth) or cloaked in shadow (blind on stealthing) as well. cloaked in shadow blind while in melee range is extremely useful, and you will never be initiative starved in a p/d build.

I feel like fleet shadow is good if your not running SoS. If you are running SoS +8% ms in combat isn’t that great.

fleet shadow is 50% MS in stealth, it’s huge and makes re positioning yourself after CnD so much more effective. it is one of the key reasons I can maintain a 3v1, moving behind the enemy players over and over sews chaos in their groups (sounds cheesy I know, but completely true)

Fleet shadow (+50% ms in stealth) is very good, I like it better than might on dodge.
take condition removal in stealth over patience or infusion, it’s one of the best traits we have. you always want the condition removal and shadow’s rejuv, the condi removal is far too valuable and easily accessed.

consider taking shadow protector (regen boon from stealth) or cloaked in shadow (blind on stealthing) as well. cloaked in shadow blind while in melee range is extremely useful, and you will never be initiative starved in a p/d build.

here’s to getting spawn camped for no reason at all (notice guild tags):
http://imageshack.us/a/img12/7894/gw046tk.jpg

here’s to fighting a bunch of morons who chase one thief into server border and die:
http://imageshack.us/a/img138/6493/gw045w.jpg

and here’s to players who run from a 1v1/2v1/3v1 into guards of which own the entire map:
http://imageshack.us/a/img820/8421/gw049ea.jpg

most of these players from the server are a disgrace and this match up is simply the stupidest thing ever, HoD shouldn’t be fighting GoM or kaineng. Kain has had a sizable zerg in every BL at all times, and GoM isn’t smashing everything again simply because of kain’s giant zergs.

Cempa.5619:

Sigil: Might on Swap+Condition on kill P/D D/D

Thoughts?

I’m using the AOE freeze on shortbow swap. I don’t think i would use d/d at all in p/d build, d/d is more of a direct damage unless you trait for initiative gains for death blossom.

here’s what I’m running in WvW atm:

http://www.gw2build.com/builds/simulator.php#1.7.6.10.13.0.1.32.0.0.154.157.159.168.177.0.0.0.454.458.0.0.0.0.484.481.489.501.505.0.0.0.0.20.0.30.20.0

I use vit/healing/cond gear and jewelerly, and can easily take an unorganized group of 3 and finish them. Everyone should note though, that p/d build excels so well in WvW because of the natural chaos of the zone. If a group catches on and coordinates 2 or more hard CC on the thief, he is dead.

I’m seeing these other builds around and I’m wondering how others like toughness or power over vitality or healing. I find toughness to be rather ineffective as any thief will easily be bursted down with 16k hp

Also, how does shadow rejuvenation (regen health in stealth – shadow arts) compare to shadow protector (stealthing an ally grants rejuv for 5 sec – shadow arts)

here is wiki information on the skills:
shadow rejuv: Each pulse heals for 293 + 0.1 * Healing Power at 80. ( i am unsure of pulses)
rejuv: Health Restored = 4 + level + (0.06 * Healing Power) per second
and assasssin’s reward in acrobatics: At level 80, this heals you for 69 + (0.035 x healing power) per point of initiative spent.

What about using pirate runes on armor? 6 piece will provide +50% MF, a PARROT!, which hits for ~1k, might duration and an aoe might. Or even travelers runes with +50% MF, +50 vit, +5% movement