Guild Wars 2

Astral Projections.7320:

I’m curious though. How is the new profession going to get its traits? Will it still need to get level to 80 and get them in the base game or will it start out in the new area and get traits there?

I’d suppose they just slam them on the same events, but this made me wonder: do the profession specializations have their own traits? I don’t remember what they said about this. And what will become of those if there are…

edit: Seems there are at least some new traits for specializations…

Astral Projections.7320:

I’m curious though. How is the new profession going to get its traits? Will it still need to get level to 80 in the base game and get the traits there or will it start out in the new area and get level/get traits there?

While the “no idea” response it correct and predictable, it really is such a case. At a guess, I think it will depend on if Anet keep their word, that gaile provided that a change is coming soon, and in a timeframe that almost certainly is earlier than HoT release. Whatever that becomes will likely have some sort of clue as to how Revenant traits will be acquired.

Just to prove Anet have a sense of humour, Colin apparantly had this gem during the announcement; “This is part of our no-grind philosophy for Guild Wars 2” in referencing masteries being account wide. Would love to know what he calls the current iteration of trait acquisition after having to do it several times. Although, it does also give hope that if such a new feature is account-wide, it might mean trait unlocking may also go that way, which would be supremely advantageous.

the least they could’ve done is grandfather the whole account instead of just the characters, would’ve saved us at least 40 paged off this thread.

It just seems unlikely that the new profession from a new expansion has to go all the way to 80 in the old game. People are going to want to play in the new area with this new profession, not go thru leveling in the old area.

If it does level in the new area, that would mean that the traits are set up so it can get them there.

Well, PAX did not mention a revert to traits ( as I expected they would not; I do not expect a reversion), thus the game will remain a side light to my other game.

No HoT for me, I have zero interest. Miss how the game was, and this seems to nail it. GW2 will now be something I goof around in for a bit on my existing 80’s when I take a break from my other game (as it has been since the April trait change).

Kumion.7580:

I was hoping the big announcement would mention traits. I was ready to give them money for a new account, ready to make new alts, buy skins, etc. Without a fix to traits though, I will not make any new characters.

Ditto. I’m stoked about the expansion stuff, but if they don’t get traits out of this mudhole, I don’t see myself even trying to level one of the new class when that’s out.

I won’t be able to play with its traits, and I SHALL NEVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES go doing a bunch of stuff I don’t wanna do, or lower myself to buy them all.

Won’t do it. Simply won’t. No discussion to be had. Isn’t a negotiation.

naiasonod.9265:

Kumion.7580:

I was hoping the big announcement would mention traits. I was ready to give them money for a new account, ready to make new alts, buy skins, etc. Without a fix to traits though, I will not make any new characters.

Ditto. I’m stoked about the expansion stuff, but if they don’t get traits out of this mudhole, I don’t see myself even trying to level one of the new class when that’s out.

I won’t be able to play with its traits, and I SHALL NEVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES go doing a bunch of stuff I don’t wanna do, or lower myself to buy them all.

Won’t do it. Simply won’t. No discussion to be had. Isn’t a negotiation.

Not only this, I have no desire to get the xpac with the existing quagmire of a trait system. I have not made any alts since the patch hit with the traits change, and will not.

Nor can I get excited about an xpac without a reversion of the trait system. Let alone no interest in making a new character, I have no desire to get involved with the xpac. I do not seriously expect a reversion, so I will continue to simply use gw2 as little diversion from my other game. I have tried to hold hope but it seems less and less likely. And specialization and mastery will no doubt strike me as similarly tedious.

Sadly, the game feels very unlike the game I loved.

Brtiva.9721:

naiasonod.9265:

Kumion.7580:

I was hoping the big announcement would mention traits. I was ready to give them money for a new account, ready to make new alts, buy skins, etc. Without a fix to traits though, I will not make any new characters.

Ditto. I’m stoked about the expansion stuff, but if they don’t get traits out of this mudhole, I don’t see myself even trying to level one of the new class when that’s out.

I won’t be able to play with its traits, and I SHALL NEVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES go doing a bunch of stuff I don’t wanna do, or lower myself to buy them all.

Won’t do it. Simply won’t. No discussion to be had. Isn’t a negotiation.

Not only this, I have no desire to get the xpac with the existing quagmire of a trait system. I have not made any alts since the patch hit with the traits change, and will not.

Nor can I get excited about an xpac without a reversion of the trait system. Let alone no interest in making a new character, I have no desire to get involved with the xpac. I do not seriously expect a reversion, so I will continue to simply use gw2 as little diversion from my other game. I have tried to hold hope but it seems less and less likely. And specialization and mastery will no doubt strike me as similarly tedious.

Sadly, the game feels very unlike the game I loved.

This about sums it up for me as well.

I will agree with those above me, wholeheartedly. I am not going to make a new character with the current trait system.
I do think there is a hint within the presentation today.

Easy mode fix = account wide unlock

This won’t make me happy but it will make it easier to swallow if this is indeed the route they choose to follow. Maybe it’s just my hope bubbling up or some sort of wishful thinking. I do recall Colin making a comment about making it easier for those with alts to unlock traits. Put that with what they said of the mastery and I pulled out the idea.

Source:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Misconceptions-regarding-Level-gating/page/4#post4396936
The quote:
“Finally, I want to add that a few things (hello traits!) are things that can be improved for players who make multiple alts, we’re aware of this, and though company policy prevents us from discussing what’s in development: I can say we know Gw2 can be an even better game for people who love making alts in the long run, more info: when it’s ready™.”

- I am currently holding on to that tiny gossamer string of hope.

I hope it goes to account unlock. It still won’t make me happy with the way traits are implemented, but I would get to ignore it, so no skin off my nose.

I am excited to try the new profession, and the druid isn’t a good fit with my current ranger, but OMG do I want one! That’s at least (at least!) 2 characters I want to level up, but am not looking forward to.

I do love the idea of earning traits, but the specific way it’s implemented is not fun. I don’t want to level up all my toons in the same maps just to get the map complete traits. If I just did Lornar’s Pass on my last toon, I want to go somewhere different for that level range on my next one. And that’s just one of the things about it that makes it a chore.

Shaaba.5672:

I hope it goes to account unlock. It still won’t make me happy with the way traits are implemented, but I would get to ignore it, so no skin off my nose.

I am excited to try the new profession, and the druid isn’t a good fit with my current ranger, but OMG do I want one! That’s at least (at least!) 2 characters I want to level up, but am not looking forward to.

I do love the idea of earning traits, but the specific way it’s implemented is not fun. I don’t want to level up all my toons in the same maps just to get the map complete traits. If I just did Lornar’s Pass on my last toon, I want to go somewhere different for that level range on my next one. And that’s just one of the things about it that makes it a chore.

The new profession, and the notion of specialization are quite appealing to me.

But with the trait system, I feel no desire to pursue this.

Nice to see this thread is high in vitality. I feel there will be some changes from now till the release of the xpac. Whether or not the changes will be loved, we shall see.

As for the new profession, Revenant, acquiring traits would be using the system we have now. Unless, Anet changes the system before the xpac releases. Because, why would the 9th profession be obtaining its traits different than the previous 8. Even if it did, it would not address this thread’s many problems.

As for playing the new profession in the new area, wasn’t it mentioned that the new area is for lvl 80s? I’m thinking it would be similar to our current living story, where 80s would go and play. Season 2 being playable only by 80s. Speaking of which, did anyone ever try bringing a non-80 to Silverwaste or Dry Top? Just curious. But then again, there’s the option for Anet to scale up the new toons. Similar to past special events.

As for the account unlock solution, how exactly would/should it work? Is it only account unlock within the same professions? Or, is it account unlock for all professions for that specific roman numeral trait?

Baolun.8316:

Taygus.4571:

What’s disappointing to me is they haven’t said that they will change it. They haven’t said “we’re considering this or that idea, what do you think?”
They haven’t even agreed that the current trait system is a problem.

So I’m not hopeful that they’ll fix it.

Part of their problem is they’re not actually allowed to do what you’re asking, discuss plans with players before final implementation. Supposedly, if they come in this thread and say “we’re considering options X, Y, and Z, what do you think?” then everybody on the forums will get unrealistic expectations and throw mass tantrums when every last detail of X, Y, and Z is not included in the eventual solution, so clearly the only solution is to forbid all substantial communication.

It’s depressing, because I look at the forums for other MMOs I play and see devs having reasonable conversations with players – discussing proposed changes, what the goals are, and how best to reach them – and those games really don’t have better forum communities than this one. They just have companies that understand the concept of managing player expectations.

Yeah…I’ve seen that
as if a “we’re considering this” = “will definitely be implemented” =.=

It’s sad really, because it leads to bad “fixes”.

But even a “we heard you and the traits will be looked at”

would make me happy, as it is, it seems they are perfectly ok with the traits as they are and the repetitiveness of it on alts.
):

BentoDetective.6491:

, is it account unlock for all professions for that specific roman numeral trait?

this is what it SHOULD be.

otherwise you still have to repeat “quests” for the traits.
and it discourages playing with alts of a different calss.

So once the trait number is unlocked…it’s unlocked on all.

Isn’t that what they said about the specialisations or is it only the specific trait you’ve unlocked??
if it’s only the extra trait itself..I can’t imagine the account wide unlock being very useful…

The kittenty “unlock” system still in the game for traits? the expansion news has made me interested in the game again, but if that crap is still in it, I’m not even going to bother reinstalling it.

Cameirus.8407:

The kittenty “unlock” system still in the game for traits?

It will be lovely to see what happens when a small army of GW2 players tries the new profession… Only to be sucker punched by the trait unlock system.

Test.8734:

Cameirus.8407:

The kittenty “unlock” system still in the game for traits?

It will be lovely to see what happens when a small army of GW2 players tries the new profession… Only to be sucked punched by the trait unlock system.

That’s what lots of gold and skill point scrolls are for.

Test.8734:

Cameirus.8407:

The kittenty “unlock” system still in the game for traits?

It will be lovely to see what happens when a small army of GW2 players tries the new profession… Only to be sucked punched by the trait unlock system.

I had enough of it before, I enjoy making new characters and this system sucked all teh fun out of that.

I wont bother even trying it until this kitten is removed.

Cameirus.8407:

Test.8734:

Cameirus.8407:

The kittenty “unlock” system still in the game for traits?

It will be lovely to see what happens when a small army of GW2 players tries the new profession… Only to be sucked punched by the trait unlock system.

I had enough of it before, I enjoy making new characters and this system sucked all teh fun out of that.

I wont bother even trying it until this kitten is removed.

Same for me; I mess around on my level 80 characters, but since the trait patch I have made no alts and gw2 is a little diversion from the other game I play.

Specializations sound especially interesting to me, but I am not getting the xpac or making any more alts so long as the trait system is not reverted.

I just came back after a while, and mainly played on my main who is maxed.

Today, I decided to give my level 36 a try. What I found shocked me.
Traits now need mini-quests to complete? Are you kidding me?
Why on earth did you do this? Do you have any idea how new players will react to this? As a veteran, I truly detest this. Traits should be like skills. I would be ok with Grandmaster traits to require some mini-quest, like do Jumping puzzle A, or complete map B, but all traits?!

I really recommend you fix this “mess” you created. Especially now with the expansion pack that will bring in loads of new players. This is NOT fun content. Not at all…

(I know I’m very late with this, but I just found out. So please bare with me.)

You pretty much have to deal with it. That’s pretty much it. I haven’t been through it yet. Isn’t there a way to buy your way through the traits?

You can buy every single trait in the game at your profession trainer.

You can buy the traits with gold and skill points (need both) at the trainers for your class.

I suspect that we’re finally going to hear about a trait system revamp with Heart of Thorns when they start to release more details about it, and that’s why it’s been allowed to stay in this horrid state for so long.

Derigar.7810:

I really recommend you fix this “mess” you created.

It was changed on April of 2014. Since then, a lot of people have been complaining about this. ArenaNet has not listened for the past 9 months, it’s very unlikely they will listen now.

For the records, this was one more change made to appeal to the Chinese. And even then, the China release underperformed. I wonder why.

^ It’s however confirmed a few weeks back (by Gaile) that we can expect changes in Q2 regarding the NPE feedback.

butch.8136:

^ It’s however confirmed a few weeks back (by Gaile) that we can expect changes in Q2 regarding the NPE feedback.

Don’t get your hopes too high. The “change” you’re gonna get will mostly be a tweak in the objectives so that you can unlock a level 30-60 trait when you’re in that level range instead of having to wait the level 72.

That’s my biggest gripe against this system. Otherwise, I’m fine with it.

I’m just confirming that there’ll be a change.

I couldn’t care less about it, as I’m fine with the system and I mostly do Pvp.

Derigar.7810:

Do you have any idea how new players will react to this?

I think the real question is, do YOU have any idea how new players have reacted to it?

Fact is, new players don’t know any better and will see it as a way to progress one’s character. You as a veteran are used to the convenience of having all your traits so obviously you’re going to complain but new players, nope. They’ll just roll with it.

I don’t really understand why all the vets feel the need to speak for new players…

I played this game a little when it first launched but was busy with college and had to give it up before really getting into it. Recently however I decided to come back now that things have calmed down for me here.

As such I came here basically as a new player who has never done living stories, fractals, dungeons, WvW, cosmetic stuff, crafting or any map higher level than Gendarran Fields… but I DO remember the old trait system.

I actually don’t mind the new system at all. It’s kind of fun being able to go out hunt down those elusive points for your build and it gives you an entire extra platform of content to spend time on. I also like the little pop ups after each level gain that show what has unlocked. It breaks up the old grindy feel and makes me feel like I’m actually getting somewhere with my character finally.

I can’t speak for others on the matter and I’m sure not all the new players agree but I can speak AS a new player… I think that’s important.

Sorry, but what you are saying is totally rubbish.

It is not the new players who will get affected, it is the VETERAN players who want to run with 20 alts. New players will not notice anything and while there is flaws with the system, it generally works fine and will make players play different types of the game, instead of running EOTM to 80 and then opening forum threads asking Anet for content.

The system id different, it is not bad.

So, it isn’t bad that a first level Trait can only be unlocked if you venture to an event 26 levels above yours?

misterman.1530:

So, it isn’t bad that a first level Trait can only be unlocked if you venture to an event 26 levels above yours?

Hm?
Which one might that be?

lordkrall.7241:

misterman.1530:

So, it isn’t bad that a first level Trait can only be unlocked if you venture to an event 26 levels above yours?

Hm?
Which one might that be?

Heres one, i found within a few seconds; Level 36 gives you the second trait point. But Illusionary Defense, a Mesmer adept tier 1 trait, requires you to defeat Victurus and his Branded army in Iron Marches; that is a level 58 group event, in a zone designed for 50s to 60s.

The only effect of the change to the trait system has been to restrict players builds.

I encountered this on my Thief. I unlocked Adept Trait points at level 30 and I noticed that to unlock Shadow’s Embrace (IV) under Shadow Arts (which is the 3rd Trait line) I would need to do the event “Defeat Victurus and his Branded army” – which is at level 56 or so.

That was the one I noticed. Seemed odd and…well…badly designed.

Ceta.6057:

lordkrall.7241:

misterman.1530:

So, it isn’t bad that a first level Trait can only be unlocked if you venture to an event 26 levels above yours?

Hm?
Which one might that be?

Heres one, i found within a few seconds; Level 36 gives you the second trait point. But Illusionary Defense, a Mesmer adept tier 1 trait, requires you to defeat Victurus and his Branded army in Iron Marches; that is a level 58 group event, in a zone designed for 50s to 60s.

The only effect of the change to the trait system has been to kitten players builds.

Lol. You wrote this just as I was writing mine!

Aye, that is probably a slight oversight, and should indeed be fixed.

Because of double XP weekend, decided to use up an empty slot. Wanted to lvl fast to get past the NPE stuff and hit 60. Now see if my math is right here!

6 trait points at lvl 60. Old system that was equal to 30 points OR 30 levels. SO if you start at lvl 11, you should be lvl 41 (or 42) right??? Geee no wonder I feel so underpowered at 60. Ya this will go well in lvl 60 maps haha!

Fix this before you release your expansion.

I’m not a new player anymore, but my first character was created after the update.

Unlocking the various traits can be fun (and/or a chore, depending on the specific trait) the first time around. With my first character I wanted to explore the world of Tyria, and so I unlocked the traits.
Some of them came naturally, some others not so much.

Thing is, I did it once, I really don’t want to do it all again a second (third, foruth, etc.) time with my alts though… I’d like to bring them to WvW and do dungeons with them…

As a side note, I think this thread will be merged in the big one.

The fact that this system, which even a cursory glance at shows the fundamental flaws with, got into the at all, is pretty appalling.

For it not to be addressed 9months later does not speak well of Anet.

I accept things dont always works as expected, and mistakes get made (though this is fundamentally flawed right from conception), but I expect responsive attitudes from devs and to put their hands up and go “ok, did not work, reverting it asap, sorry”, in which case I usually think better of them for doing it.

To do nothign, for so long, on such an important issue……just destroys any faith I may have had in them.

misterman.1530:

I encountered this on my Thief. I unlocked Adept Trait points at level 30 and I noticed that to unlock Shadow’s Embrace (IV) under Shadow Arts (which is the 3rd Trait line) I would need to do the event “Defeat Victurus and his Branded army” – which is at level 56 or so.

That was the one I noticed. Seemed odd and…well…badly designed.

These are the things that should be fixed indeed.

misterman.1530:

Ceta.6057:

lordkrall.7241:

misterman.1530:

So, it isn’t bad that a first level Trait can only be unlocked if you venture to an event 26 levels above yours?

Hm?
Which one might that be?

Heres one, i found within a few seconds; Level 36 gives you the second trait point. But Illusionary Defense, a Mesmer adept tier 1 trait, requires you to defeat Victurus and his Branded army in Iron Marches; that is a level 58 group event, in a zone designed for 50s to 60s.

The only effect of the change to the trait system has been to kitten players builds.

Lol. You wrote this just as I was writing mine!

LOL,

I just ran 2 characters through ( to 80 ) with minimal existing account support. There is little encouragement to explore builds when you don’t have that much gold, few skill points and you can’t reach the activities. The change impacts up levelling as well.

The trait issue is made worse by the increased speed of levelling. Every few levels, new armor, weapons, etc, sucks up the gold; Traits get a low priority.

lordkrall.7241:

Aye, that is probably a slight oversight, and should indeed be fixed.

The whole trait system should be fixed. It is terrible and should never have gone live (which people were saying but which Anet ignored).

I am not sure why people keep talking about how the terrible trait system only affects veterans or new players. I’m a veteran who loves making alts and I hate it. I convinced two friends to give the game a try and they could not wrap their heads around the awful trait system and ended up quitting, neither logging in for over 5 months now.

A terrible system is a terrible system, regardless if you PvE or PvP, if you are a new player or a veteran player. It has taken a core function of the game and gated it behind various inane “quests” in order to FORCE me to do things. Hell, there is a 77 page forum post detailing why it is so bad with absolutely no feedback from Anet. Not good.

I think the expansion looks great and I will buy it as long as the trait system gets a total overhaul.

The thing is, in 2-3 years when no one is there to do the group events, you just won’t be able to unlock 70% of the traits unless you buy them.

yasb.6592:

The thing is, in 2-3 years when no one is there to do the group events, you just won’t be able to unlock 70% of the traits unless you buy them.

Haha. What about today. I went hunting traits and had to give up.

Does the new expansion not require this trait system but uses something else for acquiring traits? If so, not fixing this current trait mess could be intentional to encourage buying the new expansion.

This current trait system and the current dailies system are the two main reasons that I am not exited in the least about the expansion. Until they provide specifics about their systems in the expansion, as well as for the changes they will do to the current trait system, then I will continue staying away from GW2. And that’s a bloody shame because I otherwise enjoy this game a lot (or used to anyway)

Look, this is for the best really. This way people only ever unlock the traits required for the Meta build they find online, and are then physically unable to be badly traited since everything else is locked!

Big win for the meta.

If anything, the system is unambitious. Just think if you had to unlock armour set stats too, then everybody would unlock zerker stats, call it a day, and we wouldn’t have to spend 10s more per dungeon boss!

All hail the trait unlocks!

Came on guys. This game becoming for smaller and smaller community. I think where Arenanet is heading.

Few people are happy with it and despite the hollow assurances Anet have attempted to give, 8 months of ignorance suggests that they have no intention of changing anything.

cafard.8953:

Look, this is for the best really. This way people only ever unlock the traits required for the Meta build they find online, and are then physically unable to be badly traited since everything else is locked!

Big win for the meta.

If anything, the system is unambitious. Just think if you had to unlock armour set stats too, then everybody would unlock zerker stats, call it a day, and we wouldn’t have to spend 10s more per dungeon boss!

All hail the trait unlocks!

LOL.