Guild Wars 2

Tachenon.5270:

The game doesn’t need a ‘mix’ of non-seasonal temporary content and permanent content. The game needs deep, lore-rich, quality permanent content and it needs it desperately. Not more ‘thank you, drive-through’ happy meal (with toy surprise!) content.

Last time I looked, there were no golden arches in Lion’s Arch.

If you don’t mind, I’m going to steal that quote for my next video

It’s why I’m quitting.
If previous temporary content could be replayed, it would be 99% better. Maybe some sort of Asuran Historical time distortion device?
I can see why temporary content is used. It’s addictive – it keeps you wanting to complete and finish everything and you need to keep logging in to do it. That’s exactly why I hate it, and it’s driven me to hate GW2 because of it.
dailies, as they are, are another temporary content I would rather do without. If they were changed to actually be “earn while you do what you normally do”, that would be something different.

Xillllix.3485:

The problem with temporary content is when you have contract jobs and have to take a 1 month break because a few contracts come in at the same time. You end up missing tons of stuff and important part of the living story.

Otherwise the quality of the new content is great, I just wished I could enjoy all of it.

I don’t think there is an important part to the living story? The living story is an excuse to do stuff. That’s pretty much it. The more important stuff, like if they open a new zone will be permanent.

I mean what important things might have you have missed. The brief alliance between the flame legion and the dredge. Went nowhere.

The refugee problem and Southsun? Not that enchanting.

The whole idea of this not being part of the “big” story is so that people CAN miss it. That’s why they’re only loosely linked, so you can jump back in and get the gist of what’s going on without actually having to know everything that happened before. It’s more like Star Trek than Babylon 5.

If these were massively compelling stories, you’d probably have more of a point, but what you’re missing is Anet giving stuff for us to do while they develop the big content. Because that’s really what the Living Story is. It’s stuff to do.

One of the reasons why it doesn’t make sense to have it permanent.

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Galen Grey.4709:

Kaaboose.3897:

“Oh no! I’m in a game and I don’t know what to do!” In this day and age the rescources to overcome this scenario are almost infinite. But let me throw you the most relevenat:

ASK SOMEBODY. It’s an MMO For crying out loud.

hehe this made me laugh but I dont think thats what Vayne really meant. I think he meant there is just no answer to the question.

Lets assume all content was released permanently. Now imagine a player who bought the game finished the whole storyline in a week and quit. He just logged on again today and asked you what he should do next?

Which one is the right answer?

Halloween, wintersday, lost short, flame and frost, The secret of southsun, dragon bash, sky pirates, the bazaar?

And thats at a high level
Some will suggest specifics they like..

Ohh man you really need to go try dragon ball its a blast! forget about dragon ball guild missions are amazing!

guild missions take too much effort, now skyhammer thats an awesome pvp map you really need to experience

Nahh forget about PvP not so secret now thats a challenge.

etc… etc..

Poor guy his head would explode before he decides what to do!

Thank you. This is the problem almost every person already finds coming back and not knowing what to do. We see some people ask on the forum and get half a dozen contradictory suggestions.

Hell, I play the game every day and sometimes I’m overwhelmed by all the content. I think with content every two weeks, this game would become impossibly clogged. The player base would spread out further and further and the people who claim that we’re losing players would have more to crow about.

This way, everyone that cares about the Living Story is more or less on the same page.

Without the tragedy of the Living “Story” (oh gods, what a misnomer), they wouldn’t have to release half made content every two weeks. They could actually take their time and put out something worth playing.

Oh look killcannon doesn’t like the living story, it must be not worth playing. I guess all the people who are enjoying it are mistaken.

Oh look, Vayne has nothing constructive to say…again.

Hate to tell you, many, many, many, many, many players don’t like it. And more every day.

The one and only thing it’s good for is to make people log in due to a content treadmill.

Many many players DO like it. What’s your point? I particularly like the current content. So do lots of people I’ve talked to.

More every day? Proof? Your experience? Maybe you only hear what you want to hear.

Same proof you have I assume. Many players like it? lmao. This isn’t even close to a 50/50 split. Just some bots nodding their head to the beat.

This is like the people who are trying to get Microsoft to reinstate their DRM policies for the Xbox.

You’re not wrong there. Before I posted this, and the video that went along with it, Anets annoucement video on the Future of GW2 had 3 dislikes and any non-positive comments were thumbed down into oblivioin.
Now it’s got 92 and the bulk of the comments are people are expressing their concerns on temporary content.
You could accuse me for abusing my ‘influence’ but take one look at the size of my channel and tell me how I could possible make any difference if my view didn’t match up with the majority of the GW2 playerbase.

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

It’s been almost a year since launch. What did GW players get a year after launch? Was it scattered remnants of recycled temporary content littering the landscape like the clean-picked bones of an unfulfilled and abandoned manifesto? No. They got a whole new campaign.

/e salute the Anet that was. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Well done.

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

What happened now is in the same amount of time where we got little new content (but a lot of changes, I dont mean to say gw1 developers did nothing, not by any stretch of imagination, I am just talking about new PvE content) we got literally a mountain of stuff to do but instead of being grateful that we no longer have to wait a year but instead are getting biweekly new stuff to do until the big stuff lands some people are angry because it isnt here yet.

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

Kaaboose.3897:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Galen Grey.4709:

Kaaboose.3897:

“Oh no! I’m in a game and I don’t know what to do!” In this day and age the rescources to overcome this scenario are almost infinite. But let me throw you the most relevenat:

ASK SOMEBODY. It’s an MMO For crying out loud.

hehe this made me laugh but I dont think thats what Vayne really meant. I think he meant there is just no answer to the question.

Lets assume all content was released permanently. Now imagine a player who bought the game finished the whole storyline in a week and quit. He just logged on again today and asked you what he should do next?

Which one is the right answer?

Halloween, wintersday, lost short, flame and frost, The secret of southsun, dragon bash, sky pirates, the bazaar?

And thats at a high level
Some will suggest specifics they like..

Ohh man you really need to go try dragon ball its a blast! forget about dragon ball guild missions are amazing!

guild missions take too much effort, now skyhammer thats an awesome pvp map you really need to experience

Nahh forget about PvP not so secret now thats a challenge.

etc… etc..

Poor guy his head would explode before he decides what to do!

Thank you. This is the problem almost every person already finds coming back and not knowing what to do. We see some people ask on the forum and get half a dozen contradictory suggestions.

Hell, I play the game every day and sometimes I’m overwhelmed by all the content. I think with content every two weeks, this game would become impossibly clogged. The player base would spread out further and further and the people who claim that we’re losing players would have more to crow about.

This way, everyone that cares about the Living Story is more or less on the same page.

Without the tragedy of the Living “Story” (oh gods, what a misnomer), they wouldn’t have to release half made content every two weeks. They could actually take their time and put out something worth playing.

Oh look killcannon doesn’t like the living story, it must be not worth playing. I guess all the people who are enjoying it are mistaken.

Oh look, Vayne has nothing constructive to say…again.

Hate to tell you, many, many, many, many, many players don’t like it. And more every day.

The one and only thing it’s good for is to make people log in due to a content treadmill.

Many many players DO like it. What’s your point? I particularly like the current content. So do lots of people I’ve talked to.

More every day? Proof? Your experience? Maybe you only hear what you want to hear.

Same proof you have I assume. Many players like it? lmao. This isn’t even close to a 50/50 split. Just some bots nodding their head to the beat.

This is like the people who are trying to get Microsoft to reinstate their DRM policies for the Xbox.

You’re not wrong there. Before I posted this, and the video that went along with it, Anets annoucement video on the Future of GW2 had 3 dislikes and any non-positive comments were thumbed down into oblivioin.
Now it’s got 92 and the bulk of the comments are people are expressing their concerns on temporary content.
You could accuse me for abusing my ‘influence’ but take one look at the size of my channel and tell me how I could possible make any difference if my view didn’t match up with the majority of the GW2 playerbase.

The majority of the Guild Wars 2 playerbase are casuals and many if not most never look at a site, never go to the wiki, they just log in and play. I can’t prove it, but I’d bet it’s true.

Casual players are causal. They play the game. They stumble around. They log in, they play some, they log out. There’s a ton of them.

Simple concept but there is only one authority that has the data about the percentage of the playerbase that participates in the game and also that buys things from the gem store.

That authority is Anet. They KNOW. Now, if you’re right, if the majority object to this, if they’re not spending money in the gem shop, if they’re not playing…then why would Anet push it? It makes no sense.

If you had a business…wouldn’t you go with your strengths. Anet doing this is the proof that this is working for them.

And those that complain are the people who don’t like it. But they’re clearly not the majority. They’re a group of people who have reason to be vocal.

Pointy.9308:

Oh yeah, where the heck is Tony?

You know, sooner or later every conversation turns out that way.

Yeah, just as Orr was supposedly cleansed as part of the story, but the zone is still teeming with undead. What’s your point?

Well, the Orr is and isn’t cleansed or whatever. For a character that has done the entire story it is but for my lvl 6 guardian it isn’t. But what should be done about it? Change all the areas to state after Zaithans death and put every character that killed him on different server and there use the LS element? What about those who have not completed the story? They wouldn’t get the LS at all? Is there a time table of the LS somewhere? Does it all happen after Zaithan is dead or it is supposed to be like, you know, it can happen anytime? Because that would be my point. Zaithan is dead for certain characters and LS is done for everyone and every character no matter whether you participate in it or not. No matter what part of the story sou are in right now there is the Molten Alliance threat and you either choose to deal with it or you leave it to others. And it changes both the pre and post story world.

I shouldn’t wrote all the things around. What I wanted to say, and I did say it in the end, yes we need more permanent content, I agree there. But the thing that LS is bad for GW2 isn’t true. What is wrong with new content, stories and characters every 14 days? You can do something new even though you reached lvl80, you are fully geared up, you are a dungeon master and whatever else. And if you aren’t hardcore player the content will last you for couple days at least. And like I wrote, more permanent content is comming so what is really the problem? That you do not have the permanent content right now? You guys know what patience is? Afterall, GW2 is not even a year old.

Once again. You’re defending new content, not temporary content. This pops up time and time and time again in this thread. I should probably edit the OP to explain the diffrence.
As for being able to solve the ORR and LS delemer look here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/How-to-Fix-the-Living-Story-in-Guild-Wars-2/first#post2245623

Kaaboose.3897:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

It’s been almost a year since launch. What did GW players get a year after launch? Was it scattered remnants of recycled temporary content littering the landscape like the clean-picked bones of an unfulfilled and abandoned manifesto? No. They got a whole new campaign.

/e salute the Anet that was. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Well done.

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

What happened now is in the same amount of time where we got little new content (but a lot of changes, I dont mean to say gw1 developers did nothing, not by any stretch of imagination, I am just talking about new PvE content) we got literally a mountain of stuff to do but instead of being grateful that we no longer have to wait a year but instead are getting biweekly new stuff to do until the big stuff lands some people are angry because it isnt here yet.

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

If everything was left in, and someone came back in 1.5 years, and we’ve had 2 week upgrades during that entire time, and continued to get 2 week content, anyone starting then or even coming back then, would have far too much content to even contemplate. The game would be a full time job.

I think that’s the point you’re missing. You’re thinking having a zillion things you’ll never have time to do is better than having one thing to do that’s current. Some people will agree with you and some people won’t.

If I had to leave for even a couple of months, it would be VERY hard for me to return to the game, if I had the current content and 8 back stories to catch up on. It would literally put me off the game. I would feel overwhelmed.

Shanna.4762:

I wish people would give ArenaNet the chance to actually show us what they’re doing for this type of content. It’s obviously gonna be very big, they’ve kept millions of players happy with the temporary and permanent-lite content in the interim while improving the very core features, etc. Colin has said the living story teams are just a part of their whole development team about what seems like 900 times, and a big chunk of them are working on permanent content. Imagine what that will be like when it’s ready, considering it’s been in development for a very long time. I have a feeling this allows them to deliver content now, and have a very strong stream of permanent content without huge gaps between releases in the future.

I’m getting tired of these threads popping up, there’s only about a million of them at this point. Find one that exists and keep it running, like I and many others have with the Cantha thread in my signature.

Oh Shanna, You sound just like me defending the manifesto 2 years ago. The reason these threads are popping up so often is because people are now skeptical that Colins words in this manner might be mostly PR spin.

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

It’s been almost a year since launch. What did GW players get a year after launch? Was it scattered remnants of recycled temporary content littering the landscape like the clean-picked bones of an unfulfilled and abandoned manifesto? No. They got a whole new campaign.

/e salute the Anet that was. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Well done.

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

What happened now is in the same amount of time where we got little new content (but a lot of changes, I dont mean to say gw1 developers did nothing, not by any stretch of imagination, I am just talking about new PvE content) we got literally a mountain of stuff to do but instead of being grateful that we no longer have to wait a year but instead are getting biweekly new stuff to do until the big stuff lands some people are angry because it isnt here yet.

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

If everything was left in, and someone came back in 1.5 years, and we’ve had 2 week upgrades during that entire time, and continued to get 2 week content, anyone starting then or even coming back then, would have far too much content to even contemplate. The game would be a full time job.

I think that’s the point you’re missing.

They don’t HAVE to do the old stuff. That’s the point YOU’RE missing. But they’d have the OPTION of doing so if they wanted to.

Vayne.8563:

Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people…

Vayne this is exactly what Temporary content IS doing. Making people have to keep up.

But the casual audience of this game that ducks in and out, once they finish the current content would go exactly where?

I don’t know, But whereever they chose to go would be a kitten sight better then the current option: Nowhere.

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

It’s been almost a year since launch. What did GW players get a year after launch? Was it scattered remnants of recycled temporary content littering the landscape like the clean-picked bones of an unfulfilled and abandoned manifesto? No. They got a whole new campaign.

/e salute the Anet that was. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Well done.

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

What happened now is in the same amount of time where we got little new content (but a lot of changes, I dont mean to say gw1 developers did nothing, not by any stretch of imagination, I am just talking about new PvE content) we got literally a mountain of stuff to do but instead of being grateful that we no longer have to wait a year but instead are getting biweekly new stuff to do until the big stuff lands some people are angry because it isnt here yet.

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

If everything was left in, and someone came back in 1.5 years, and we’ve had 2 week upgrades during that entire time, and continued to get 2 week content, anyone starting then or even coming back then, would have far too much content to even contemplate. The game would be a full time job.

I think that’s the point you’re missing.

They don’t HAVE to do the old stuff. That’s the point YOU’RE missing. But they’d have the OPTION of doing so if they wanted to.

Nope, I’m not missing it. Because achievement points now award chests and these events give massive achievement points, many will feel pressure/compelled to do them. It’s about the rewards for a whole lot of people.

What you’re saying is YOU wouldn’t feel compelled, which is another matter. Many would. Probably even most.

Sad but true statement.

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people…

Vayne this is exactly what Temporary content IS doing. Making people have to keep up.

But the casual audience of this game that ducks in and out, once they finish the current content would go exactly where?

I don’t know, But whereever they chose to go would be a kitten sight better then the current option: Nowhere.

Yes, this content is making people keep up. That’s true. That’s the POINT of this content. To make people keep up. And it’s working.

MMOs have always been about giving people stuff to do. That’s all MMOs period end of story. If it’s not dailies for your rep, it’s farming for Nick the Traveler or a z-quest. MMOs can’t have infinite content, they expect people to play for hundreds if not thousands of hours over time, so they have to give people stuff to do.

The trick is to give people stuff to do, without making it so hard to catch up that people never do.

If you don’t get this, then you don’t get it. That’s fine. But the major reason people end up walking away from games like WoW is because they know they’ll never catch up. It’s a big big big reason why people stop. They just cant’ keep going.

And if this stuff was all left behind you’d end up with the same thing in Guild Wars 2.

Making people keep up with something that is then gone actually takes the pressure OFF some people. Not all people, but some. In my opinion more than enough to justify the decision.

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

It’s been almost a year since launch. What did GW players get a year after launch? Was it scattered remnants of recycled temporary content littering the landscape like the clean-picked bones of an unfulfilled and abandoned manifesto? No. They got a whole new campaign.

/e salute the Anet that was. Well done, ladies and gentlemen. Well done.

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

What happened now is in the same amount of time where we got little new content (but a lot of changes, I dont mean to say gw1 developers did nothing, not by any stretch of imagination, I am just talking about new PvE content) we got literally a mountain of stuff to do but instead of being grateful that we no longer have to wait a year but instead are getting biweekly new stuff to do until the big stuff lands some people are angry because it isnt here yet.

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

If everything was left in, and someone came back in 1.5 years, and we’ve had 2 week upgrades during that entire time, and continued to get 2 week content, anyone starting then or even coming back then, would have far too much content to even contemplate. The game would be a full time job.

I think that’s the point you’re missing.

They don’t HAVE to do the old stuff. That’s the point YOU’RE missing. But they’d have the OPTION of doing so if they wanted to.

Nope, I’m not missing it. Because achievement points now award chests and these events give massive achievement points, many will feel pressure/compelled to do them. It’s about the rewards for a whole lot of people.

Christ man read what you type! If achivement points are so compelling to players then why do we need to resort to temporary content to motivate them?
I went over this in the OP. Yes creating a sense of urgancy is going to work in the short term, but in the long term it’s going to alienate players. Couple that with the new AP rewards system and it is not just going to alienate them from a story perspective, but also from a rewards one.
I understand kitten well why Anet is doing this, I just don’t think they, or you for that matter, see the potential long term consiquences of this buisiness model.

The trick is to give people stuff to do, without making it so hard to catch up that people never do.

Some trick there. Temporary content doesn’t make it easier to catch up. It makes it IMPOSSIBLE.

Krosslite.1950:

Devata.6589:

I don’t mind temporary events and I think most people don’t. I do mind temporary ……, rewards / skins / items ……

I wanted to key in on this part of your comment Devata.

One of the main driving factors in any MMO for many players is the ability to show off the latest and greatest toy. In most MMOs it was due to the fact that it also did the most damage for the moment. It was also due to the uniqueness of this item.
You had the newest “Shiny” to steal a word from the Skritt.

These temporary skins creates a sense if individuality that most seek to have in these game. How would you feel if everyone was running around with the Molten Alliance Greatsword on their back. It would lose meaning and interest. It would not be unique but the standard.

This is one of the things that makes me like GW2 even more. Your character or characters have their own personal look. Not just through dying their armor, but with their weapons as well. To those that RP this is a great thing. To those that live vicariously through their characters it gives them a sense that they are special as long as they have the skin.

So next year the Molten Alliance returns and more people get that skin. Then another event come along and it was a greatsword skin that leaves all other wanting and you and a few others get it. You are now the special one. Someone may come up to you and say “hey cool sword” you can thank them and move on or even join up with them in a group.

That is the purpose of the temp skins. There will more to come and there will be old ones that come back. Just go with the flow and enjoy the ride.

As will the axe, the pick and the sickle.

I did here this argument a lot but it’s not valid. If there are enough good looking items and some of them are race it will still be possible to ‘unique’ character. Example.. is everybody running around with an Eternity on his back? No.. Will at some point everybody be running around with one? No. Will it for always be very unique, will it for ever be unique? The Eternity maybe as there are greatsword’s but make 10 legendary weapons of them all and some very cool hand hard to find exotics and so on and it will still be very unique. No need to be temporary for that.

And let me clarify the not minding temporary event.. I would like to be able to see it again like in a log with video and stuff but I do understand how you might want to make temporary as some enemy attacks at some point, so in a way there is a need to have temporary but for the other thinks there is no good reason to make it temporary. The only reason I hear for that is the one you just gave and it’s simply not valid.

Besides Anet did a 180 on this one. The CE had the mini but you can still buy that.. what I hearth (I did not see a official statemend about this) that was because they wanted everybody to be able to get that skin. On GameCom they gave away skins for a T-shirt however they stopped with that during the first day because it would not be fare to people not being at GamesCom because they could then now get it (Official statement, if I remember correctly they said this on twitter).. however now every event has skins you can not ever get when you did not attend it.

Temporary content sounds more like real life. If you miss it, there’s no do over!

I’m all for it. If I miss something, to bad for me!

Vayne.8563:

I had a lot more respect for you before you started to get personal. I’m not losing this argument but I am responding to lots of ideas and people and sometime my post run together. And by repeating the same things over and over doesn’t make them more right.

Everyone knows where to start on CURRENT content. That’s not really the point. But no one knows where to start once they finish the current content. So a guy does what’s currently there, and spends a few days a week in the new content. He only has 1 week before the next new content comes out.

So he goes where? Remember this story is relatively linear. So he goes from the refugees on Southsun backwards to the MF dungeon? Does he go from the Sky Pirates back to the mystery where they first appear?

When I go through this content, there’s an understanding of continuity. It’s not great stuff, but it’s followable. The context for some people is important. I’m following a story and characters. Obviously not everyone well.

Throwing it all in at once ruins the context and with maybe a week to go back and do four chapters now, ten chapters in another 12 weeks….you’re not seeing this problem because you personally wouldn’t experience this problem.

I’m TELLING you (not a guess) it would be a problem for a lot of people. You want tons of content and you want everything there. Fair enough.

But the casual audience of this game that ducks in and out, once they finish the current content would go exactly where?

This game is designed around casual people and people jumping in and out of the game. Keeping this as temporary content KEEPS the game a casual game. Particularly now that there are rewards for achievement points.

Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people. And you’re wanting them to add stuff that people would feel they have to go back to do.

It’s a bad move.

It’s not personal at you but at your comments
“Everyone knows where to start on CURRENT content.” You said they didn’t.
“But no one knows where to start once they finish the current content.` He just picks something he likes.. you know just like he now would when he is done with the story. He go´s for some dungeon or whatever.. The dungeons in this game also have all linear story so if you think it´s bad to keep the new dungeons in because people might not know what to do then we could just as well delete all dungeons after you completed it once. Thats exactly the same.

And of course he still has the option to not do any of it.. same as what you now are forced to.

I mean, come on, this is the exact same of argument I was talking about in the last comment. You do see it does not really make any sense?

“Throwing it all in at once ruins the context and with maybe a week to go back and do four chapters now, ten chapters in another 12 weeks….you’re not seeing this problem because you personally wouldn’t experience this problem.”

You do not have to. You have the option to. Thats something else. If you do not like that because it’s a problem for you then you don’t. And if you have a problem with not being able to read back a chapter then you still have the ability to do so. win win.

“But the casual audience of this game that ducks in and out, once they finish the current content would go exactly where?” The same place they go now.

“This game is designed around casual people and people jumping in and out of the game. Keeping this as temporary content KEEPS the game a casual game. Particularly now that there are rewards for achievement points.”
I wonder is casual players ever care about the story so then being able to do old dungeons to get the thinks they like would even be a bigger plus.

And it’s not temporary content that keeps them busy it’s content that keeps them busy. No need for it to be temporary to keep them busy.

“Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people. And you’re wanting them to add stuff that people would feel they have to go back to do.”

How is making them doing anything.. if there is any talk about making them do something it’s with the current system.. Do it now or you can’t. But really.. nobody is ever really making people have to keep up.. certainly not when the content is not temporary.

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Temporary content sounds more like real life. If you miss it, there’s no do over!

I’m all for it. If I miss something, to bad for me!

Yeah indeed. And if you die you may never ever start GW2 again That would make it more real life.. You are all for it?

I do like that in those games some elements are not like in real life.. Like missing out on things and so on.

Vayne.8563:

Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people.

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Making people have to keep up, even as they’re doing it now, is too much for most people…

Vayne this is exactly what Temporary content IS doing. Making people have to keep up.
.

Kaaboose.3897:

They don’t HAVE to do the old stuff. That’s the point YOU’RE missing. But they’d have the OPTION of doing so if they wanted to.

Vayne.8563:

Yes, this content is making people keep up. That’s true. That’s the POINT of this content. To make people keep up. And it’s working.

The trick is to give people stuff to do, without making it so hard to catch up that people never do.

If you don’t get this, then you don’t get it. That’s fine. But the major reason people end up walking away from games like WoW is because they know they’ll never catch up. It’s a big big big reason why people stop. They just cant’ keep going.

Making people keep up with something that is then gone actually takes the pressure OFF some people. Not all people, but some. In my opinion more than enough to justify the decision.

“The trick is to give people stuff to do, without making it so hard to catch up that people never do.”

So hard to catch up.. hmm well the only way they can now catch up is to be do the events whenever they are available.. else they will never ever be able to catch up.

So if people walk away from WoW because it’s so hard to keep up, why would they not walk away from GW2 because it’s impossible to catch up?

And once again.. you are not making them do anything. But with the temporary stuff you do provide more pressure then with permanent content.

And those people you are talking about are probably the same that also don’t care if they do not catch up in WoW because they care or they don’t care. The difference is having an option or not.

Vayne i think your posts would be better received if you stopped stating opinions as facts when your statements essentially boil down to

Vayne.8563:

I can’t prove it, but I’d bet it’s true.

while i take your point this is a terrible example

Vayne.8563:

If you don’t get this, then you don’t get it. That’s fine. But the major reason people end up walking away from games like WoW is because they know they’ll never catch up. It’s a big big big reason why people stop. They just cant’ keep going.

you can always catch up in games like wow, they periodically do gear resets with new tiers and make the previous top tier more accessible. imo the reason people walk away from wow isn’t that they wont catch up its that the constant grinding treadmill to stay relevant isn’t entertaining and they burn out.

a better example would be GW2 where you cannot catch up as those players will always be X amount of time ahead of you (assuming they keep playing) in laurels for acquiring BIS or WvW rank unlocks etc so you will never match them because you are time gated from doing so. you can also never experience the wealth of content that’s been removed from the game

i have a few friends who have recently joined the game interested in content i enjoyed and mentioned in previous months, the answer in every case when they ask where they can do that content is “you cant they took it out of the game if you hurry you might be able to do the current stuff before its gone”

its that sense of urgency that the OP is talking about that will ultimately lead to faster burn out and players leaving, and once gone what is there to come back to? the one current event you need to race to complete before it gone?

ultimately this feedback will be disregarded if it doesn’t fit their existing plan, much like the 200 odd page feedback thread on ascended items was locked and discarded for a smaller more positive looking feedback thread in November.

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Temporary content sounds more like real life. If you miss it, there’s no do over!

I’m all for it. If I miss something, to bad for me!

I can’t speak for all but one of the reasons I enjoy gaming is because it doesn’t have the same limitations as RL. Even Day Z lets you start all over again when you die.

Everyone keeps mentioning content… Hmm what content? Huh? Content is something material, something thats there. I don’t see jack. There is a tab with some molten something alliance… seems like I did it all. Hmm… What exactly did that accomplish? Where are they? What did they change? Content? Nope. Its a bunch of text in my achievement panel NOTHING more. I don’t even recall what the hell some of living story was about. Thats how memorable and impactful it was. Pfft. I put more content in a toilet in the morning. And guess what even after I flush it… it doesn’t magically disapear. It goes to sewers and from there on a long and arduous road. Unlike living story what I put in toilet has a longer life span and infinitely more impact.

Shadow Blade.1324:

Vayne i think your posts would be better received if you stopped stating opinions as facts when your statements essentially boil down to

Vayne.8563:

I can’t prove it, but I’d bet it’s true.

while i take your point this is a terrible example

Vayne.8563:

If you don’t get this, then you don’t get it. That’s fine. But the major reason people end up walking away from games like WoW is because they know they’ll never catch up. It’s a big big big reason why people stop. They just cant’ keep going.

you can always catch up in games like wow, they periodically do gear resets with new tiers and make the previous top tier more accessible. imo the reason people walk away from wow isn’t that they wont catch up its that the constant grinding treadmill to stay relevant isn’t entertaining and they burn out.

a better example would be GW2 where you cannot catch up as those players will always be X amount of time ahead of you (assuming they keep playing) in laurels for acquiring BIS or WvW rank unlocks etc so you will never match them because you are time gated from doing so. you can also never experience the wealth of content that’s been removed from the game

i have a few friends who have recently joined the game interested in content i enjoyed and mentioned in previous months, the answer in every case when they ask where they can do that content is “you cant they took it out of the game if you hurry you might be able to do the current stuff before its gone”

its that sense of urgency that the OP is talking about that will ultimately lead to faster burn out and players leaving, and once gone what is there to come back to? the one current event you need to race to complete before it gone?

ultimately this feedback will be disregarded if it doesn’t fit their existing plan, much like the 200 odd page feedback thread on ascended items was locked and discarded for a smaller more positive looking feedback thread in November.

That’s an excelent point on the “burn out” factor there Shadow Blade. My partner is already suffering from this and hasn’t logged in since the Bazzar began. She claims it’s because she’s sick of being pressured to play the thing and thus is put off by it.
I was feeling that burnout not long ago, but then the Sky Pirates patch came out and the AR dungeons got me pumped as it was so different from the existing dungeons. I jumped back onto my ranger alt because I wanted to try out some new things in there but sadly didn’t have enough time to get his build fleshed out before the dungeon closed.
I must say it was refreashing to go back and revist some of the old stuff as a different class and try some differnt PS options (Though I got burned out on that when thaerene showed up again as the missions that are common to everyones PS really drag and tend to be boring) and the only thing souring it for me was knowing if I took my time doing what I wanted I wouldn’t reach 80 before AR was removed (Which I didn’t, I gave in, thought “kitten it” and just played for fun.)
Long story short feeling rushed is defintly making me feel burned out. I logged back in today after listing to WP’s latest video about Glint and the LS but after standing around lsiting to a few NPC’s I was left with the option of grinding some more META or my dailies when all I really wanted to do was Play AR with my ranger.
So I came here, read the comments and wrote this instead.
Sad to say this was more compelling.

I had started to do the JP part of this new content and realized that I hate JPs and that I don’t really care if I complete this part of the LS. What irks me is that I would love to do the F&F dungeon again, it was by far the most fun I have had in the game and that makes me sad.

I really want new permanent content that has a strong story behind it(where are you gw1 writers?) with engaging mechanics and high risk/ reward. I doubt that i will get my wish

Back to the old(and boring) routine of doing dailies and metas and logging out to enjoy the weather

The thing that all of us have to keep in mind is that each player is unique and motivated by different things. In it’s simplest form, the reason that temporary content is a hot-button issue is that there is content being released that the players like…and at some point it is taken away and they can’t have fun with it anymore.

Now everyone has different opinions on what parts of the content are fun and what parts they could do without. But the main theme is that there was something available in game that we enjoyed doing and it’s just not there anymore.

Almost every MMO I’ve ever played has had temporary content in some form. Whether it be holiday events or story content leading up to an expansion there has always been at least a bit of content that was only available for a short time. The difference with GW2 is the type of content that is released as temporary and the sheer quantity. For some, the temporary nature of the content may help to create a more immersive and alive world. For others, it may just serve to limit the content available to them.

For me personally, I would like to have a mix of both. For content that is more sandbox-style content (jumping puzzles, mini games, scavenger hunts, holiday events) I don’t mind the temporary nature. These things allow players to experience the world in a different way and keeping these things fresh can be exciting. Other content is story-driven and develops characters, changes the world, and creates new enemies to face. This is the type of content that I would love to see be more permanent. A good story is typically one you want to experience more than once. Just like there are movies I watch regularly and books I enjoy rereading, good story content in an MMO is something I enjoy experiencing again and again.

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Vayne.8563:

Kaaboose.3897:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Galen Grey.4709:

We all know such content takes time. Even if they didnt use some of the resources to create these events, you’d still expect them to take at least a year… some games take even 2.

snip

What the heck happened between then and now?

Its been 10 months well 10 and a 1/2 now to be fair. And what did Gw players get in that time in terms of new content as far as I know just Sorrow’s Furnace. (might be wrong feel free to correct me if thats the case)

snip

Even if it takes them 1 1/2 years now instead of 1 year I am personally very grateful they went into the extra hassle of essentially constantly proving fresh stuff to play.

C’mon man not this again. We’re not upset we’re getting content every 2 weeks (Well maybe some are but that’s not the focus of this post.) We’re upset it is getting taken away again. They’re concerend that if they do come back in 1 1/2 years they’ll have missed the majority of the content that came out in that time span.

If everything was left in, and someone came back in 1.5 years, and we’ve had 2 week upgrades during that entire time, and continued to get 2 week content, anyone starting then or even coming back then, would have far too much content to even contemplate. The game would be a full time job.

I think that’s the point you’re missing.

They don’t HAVE to do the old stuff. That’s the point YOU’RE missing. But they’d have the OPTION of doing so if they wanted to.

Nope, I’m not missing it. Because achievement points now award chests and these events give massive achievement points, many will feel pressure/compelled to do them. It’s about the rewards for a whole lot of people.

Christ man read what you type! If achivement points are so compelling to players then why do we need to resort to temporary content to motivate them?
I went over this in the OP. Yes creating a sense of urgancy is going to work in the short term, but in the long term it’s going to alienate players. Couple that with the new AP rewards system and it is not just going to alienate them from a story perspective, but also from a rewards one.
I understand kitten well why Anet is doing this, I just don’t think they, or you for that matter, see the potential long term consiquences of this buisiness model.

The trick is to give people stuff to do, without making it so hard to catch up that people never do.

Some trick there. Temporary content doesn’t make it easier to catch up. It makes it IMPOSSIBLE.

If the other content isn’t there, then people can’t do it, and they just do the new stuff. There’s no reason to HAVE TO catch up but people will feel they have to. That’s the issue with people. Anet made it so they can’t. Now they won’t feel that pressure.

A percentage of people, mostly people who have TONS of time to play, will be annoyed by this. Casual players, most of them I suspect, will be relieved.

The question is who has the numbers. Will more people be kitten ed off they can’t catch up, or will more people be annoyed that they feel they have to and they leave in frustration. It’s not as clear cut as you’re trying to make it out to be.

First of all, many who’ve been here since launch (and there are a lot of us) have already done all that content. I have. I think I missed a couple of achievements here and there…and I’m glad they’re not in the game. I don’t need them hanging over my head.

But then there are people who leave and come back. Are they really going to hang around and to EVERYTHING or are they leaving and coming back because real life doesn’t leave them much time.

How many people play this game with unlimited hours and how many just log in, bang around for a while and leave again.

Until we have those numbers, the whole argument is pointless. You’re saying most people will become frustrated, I’m saying most people will become frustrated if this stuff is all there.

Anet chose an answer based on their knowledge, which anyone would have to admit is better than our knowledge. They track what people are doing. They know how many people have already done all those other achievements. They know how often and for how long people log in on.

My money is on Anet knowing more about who plays their game and either of us.

On this issue of burn out, people have a month to do most of the achievements, not two weeks. I agree two weeks isn’t really log enough. I think the two week release schedule is too ambitious and it should be 3 weeks to a month.

And stuff is being left behind a bit at a time. Maybe not the part any individual wants.

There are a lot of people here who say well I’d be happy if MF was left behind. I’d wager it would be hard to get a group for now, and probably be even harder in another 3 months. It’s just how old dungeons in games tend to go. No matter how good stuff is, the shiny factor wears off. People now do stuff like CoF path 1 because it’s an easy money maker, not because it’s a great dungeon.

But that doesn’t really address this issue of whether content should be temporary or not. Let’s say they left all this in. Someone who didn’t want to be rushed would just fall further and further behind anyway. It would build it. It would never end.

Someone leaves, because they feel pressured. And they’ll feel LESS pressured having it ALL there and wanted to catch up. I don’t think that’s true for most people.

People say things like X person left because they feel pressured, but they simply don’t know how that person would feel if they didn’t have time to do stuff and it remained…because it hasn’t happened. They could end up feeling MORE pressured and leave anyway.

This content isn’t made to do all of it. It’s made to bang around in and have some fun. That’s why meta achievements are so much less than all the achievements. You don’t have to do them all. If you can’t get 14 points of this content in a month…you probably aren’t going to do well at any MMO.

Aramean.2354:

The thing that all of us have to keep in mind is that each player is unique and motivated by different things. In it’s simplest form, the reason that temporary content is a hot-button issue is that there is content being released that the players like…and at some point it is taken away and they can’t have fun with it anymore.

Now everyone has different opinions on what parts of the content are fun and what parts they could do without. But the main theme is that there was something available in game that we enjoyed doing and it’s just not there anymore.

Almost every MMO I’ve ever played has had temporary content in some form. Whether it be holiday events or story content leading up to an expansion there has always been at least a bit of content that was only available for a short time. The difference with GW2 is the type of content that is released as temporary and the sheer quantity. For some, the temporary nature of the content may help to create a more immersive and alive world. For others, it may just serve to limit the content available to them.

For me personally, I would like to have a mix of both. For content that is more sandbox-style content (jumping puzzles, mini games, scavenger hunts, holiday events) I don’t mind the temporary nature. These things allow players to experience the world in a different way and keeping these things fresh can be exciting. Other content is story-driven and develops characters, changes the world, and creates new enemies to face. This is the type of content that I would love to see be more permanent. A good story is typically one you want to experience more than once. Just like there are movies I watch regularly and books I enjoy rereading, good story content in an MMO is something I enjoy experiencing again and again.

I have books I enjoy reading more than once too, but this is mroe like a long term soap opera type series.

There was a cop show in the UK called the Bill. It ran for well over 25 years. There was no way I was going to go back and watch all the old episodes, even though I got into it and watched it for years.

The content is coming fast enough where you can’t compare it to other MMOs because no other MMO has done this. There’s just no way to say, well in other games they did this or that.

If Anet keeps producing content every 2 weeks (and some of it DOES stay in the world btw), then over a year or two,. there’s going to be a lot more to do in the world an at the same time we still have stuff to do every two weeks.

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before. But if you are going to compare it to something compare it to a soap opera, or profession wrestling. You follow it for a while and if you stop and watch it again, you can’t really go back and watch everything you missed.

It would be prohibitive.

Vayne.8563:

If Anet keeps producing content every 2 weeks (and some of it DOES stay in the world btw), then over a year or two,. there’s going to be a lot more to do in the world an at the same time we still have stuff to do every two weeks.

I agree that they are releasing content fast enough that there is definitely permanent content being added. And I’ve already said that I don’t mind temporary content. I’m just saying there are some things (the dungeons for instance) that I would prefer to be able to do for a longer period of time.

Vayne,

Sometimes I find your content on the verge of trolling, but your last couple of messages in this thread are spot on. ANet is breaking new ground, and I pity the players who feel compelled to jump up and down, shaking their first about how the world is not how they feel it should be. Get over it! Play! Enjoy! It’s supposed to be FUN!

:)
A

Devata.6589:

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Temporary content sounds more like real life. If you miss it, there’s no do over!

I’m all for it. If I miss something, to bad for me!

Yeah indeed. And if you die you may never ever start GW2 again That would make it more real life.. You are all for it?

I do like that in those games some elements are not like in real life.. Like missing out on things and so on.

So what’s your point? I can’t tell whether you agree or disagree…

Which are “those” games? Do you proof read what you write?

Mystic.5934:

It’s why I’m quitting.
If previous temporary content could be replayed, it would be 99% better. Maybe some sort of Asuran Historical time distortion device?
I can see why temporary content is used. It’s addictive – it keeps you wanting to complete and finish everything and you need to keep logging in to do it. That’s exactly why I hate it, and it’s driven me to hate GW2 because of it.
dailies, as they are, are another temporary content I would rather do without. If they were changed to actually be “earn while you do what you normally do”, that would be something different.

You are basically admitting that this is a problem with you, not the game. Its as if you are unable to just enjoy the game and instead feel compelled to do certain things for the reward, which takes away from what you actually enjoy. So you are choosing the reward over what you actually want, which is to have fun playing the game.

I’ve seen this same behavior with people I play with, who will grind away for this or that reward only to not enjoy any of it. I’ve always felt that was a silly way to spend your time.

I can’t believe people are actually defending temporary content. My friend is away from home right now and will be untill this arch is over, so he’ll miss it which is a shame because its one of the best updates we’ve had.

Now imagine that we get to fight Kralkatorik, or any other elder dragon in the living story. Do you reall think its fair that only the people who are playing at the time get to experience THE MAIN PLOT OF THE GAME?

And yet you come onto the forums to see most people defending temporary content because “having too much content is bad” and “it’s realistic”. Well i’ve got news for you guys, more content IS better, and I don’t play games to simulate real life.

Imagine if all the content we’ve had so far wasn’t temporary. 2 new dungeons, events on southsun that matter, a new area, Crab toss, story instances… The list goes on.

Making people do content that is temporary and not in there own time-frame is work, not fun, contrary to what Vayne said earlier.

Stone.6751:

Mystic.5934:

It’s why I’m quitting.
If previous temporary content could be replayed, it would be 99% better. Maybe some sort of Asuran Historical time distortion device?
I can see why temporary content is used. It’s addictive – it keeps you wanting to complete and finish everything and you need to keep logging in to do it. That’s exactly why I hate it, and it’s driven me to hate GW2 because of it.
dailies, as they are, are another temporary content I would rather do without. If they were changed to actually be “earn while you do what you normally do”, that would be something different.

You are basically admitting that this is a problem with you, not the game. Its as if you are unable to just enjoy the game and instead feel compelled to do certain things for the reward, which takes away from what you actually enjoy. So you are choosing the reward over what you actually want, which is to have fun playing the game.

I’ve seen this same behavior with people I play with, who will grind away for this or that reward only to not enjoy any of it. I’ve always felt that was a silly way to spend your time.

Oh and there we go, the “if you don’t like it don’t play it” response. My guess is he/she does like the game, but is being forced to play it due to temporary content! You actually provided no points as to why temporary content is a good thing, nice job.

Please leave the living story in game for those who missed it. or stop focusing on? temporary content. It’s very hard to do all of it every 2 weeks. Better do something really hard, like UW of FoW dungeons, and better farming system, I’m really tired of pots and soups

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

Temporary content, such as has been provided by the Living Story, serves no purpose that could not be equally or better served by permanent content, which is what could have been and should have been provided with the Living Story.

Temporary content is, for anyone who happened to miss it, vaporware.

Boreale.3129:

I can’t believe people are actually defending temporary content. My friend is away from home right now and will be untill this arch is over, so he’ll miss it which is a shame because its one of the best updates we’ve had.

Now imagine that we get to fight Kralkatorik, or any other elder dragon in the living story. Do you reall think its fair that only the people who are playing at the time get to experience THE MAIN PLOT OF THE GAME?

And yet you come onto the forums to see most people defending temporary content because “having too much content is bad” and “it’s realistic”. Well i’ve got news for you guys, more content IS better, and I don’t play games to simulate real life.

Imagine if all the content we’ve had so far wasn’t temporary. 2 new dungeons, events on southsun that matter, a new area, Crab toss, story instances… The list goes on.

Making people do content that is temporary and not in there own time-frame is work, not fun, contrary to what Vayne said earlier.

I guarantee you content to fight an elder dragon won’t be temporary. I think you’re missing the entire point.

First, this content is like a festival. It’ll be back. There’ll be an opportunity to trade again with these people, just like SAB will be back. They’re making content which can be rotated in and out.

But when the main storyline is involved, that content won’t be temporary. You’re simply inventing something to try to prove a point. The stories in the Living World are intentionally left as not part of the main plot line, they’re sidelines that we can explore between major events in the world.

As such if they go away it’s not such a big deal.

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

Except that a lot of people think this will work, even if a lot thing it won’t. I’m one of the people who think it will. I don’t think anyone would think square wheels will work.

No one one has done this before because everyone has thought that the old let’s throw a raid at the end of the game and make people take months to farm it is the right way for MMOs to be.

And since I hate those types of games and won’t play them, at least Anet is trying something different. Because I can guarantee a LOT of people who have no interest in raiding very well might enjoy MMOs otherwise.

Tachenon.5270:

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

Temporary content, such as has been provided by the Living Story, serves no purpose that could not be equally or better served by permanent content, which is what could have been and should have been provided with the Living Story.

Temporary content is, for anyone who happened to miss it, vaporware.

No…temporary content for anyone who missed it is history not vaporware. It’s not being readvertised.

As I said earlier this is more like watching a very long TV series. You jump in and learn the characters and move forward from when you stopped watching. Not doing the past stuff doesn’t invalidate the enjoyment you get, unless you allow it to.

Those who say this temporary content should be permanent are thinking it’s better than it is…and it’s not. It’s filler content until permanent content comes out..except for stuff that will come back periodically.

I think that this experiment is being prejudged by people who don’t see it’s potential. And I think in a year or two, even if those people go, Guild Wars 2 will continue to be successful.

Tachenon.5270:

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

Temporary content, such as has been provided by the Living Story, serves no purpose that could not be equally or better served by permanent content, which is what could have been and should have been provided with the Living Story.

Temporary content is, for anyone who happened to miss it, vaporware.

That’s your opinion. You are welcome to develop an MMO based on old principles and see if they are really better.

Ronah.2869:

Lets remember GW1 has Nicholas the Traveler which is collecting different item every week for giving you 5 gifts. Players are farming these items in various locations each week and then use or sell the gifts.
The gifts give you consumables which are good for getting titles. Players who sell them for gold, they are later using the gold for getting other titles

Does this sound familiar?

Yes, GW2 has transformed the Nicholas from GW1 into the Living Story:
- it happens (almost) on a weekly basis
- it happens in various / different zones
- it is mainly a farming activity: 40 Sky Crystals, 50 Ascalonian Aetherblades, 300 Fireworks, 16 Samples on Southsun Cove, etc
- it helps players get different achievements or titles

So, A-Net has just improved the concept of Nicholas the Traveler from GW1 in a better way because the Living Story…
- has more depth regarding story and lore,
- adds more diversity and complexity to a basic farming/grinding activity
- helps introducing new zones / minigames / etc into the game in a more natural way then a simple expansion patch

I just quoted myself

The only thing I dislike about temporary contents is that it seems to take all Anet’s time of work.
There are some problems and bugs in the game since the beginning which are still not repaired ( e.g. Trading Post font readability when UI is set to small ).
There are others bugs that appear with the constant updates, but there is no time to correct it… Even if you report that bugs in game since months, and even if this is an “half-hour patch” to be done.
The biggest part of the work is about the next temporary content, that’s all.
It makes me hurt to see unfixed things. No need to give examples, just browse the forum.

The game temporary contents are great, sure… But the game needs polishing as well.
I venture to say it needs polishing BEFORE new contents.

4 teams on Living Stories, is that it ?… And how many on polishing ?

Vayne.8563:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

Except that a lot of people think this will work, even if a lot thing it won’t. I’m one of the people who think it will. I don’t think anyone would think square wheels will work.

No one one has done this before because everyone has thought that the old let’s throw a raid at the end of the game and make people take months to farm it is the right way for MMOs to be.

And since I hate those types of games and won’t play them, at least Anet is trying something different. Because I can guarantee a LOT of people who have no interest in raiding very well might enjoy MMOs otherwise.

I never mentioned raids. Why are you talking about raids?

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

Temporary content, such as has been provided by the Living Story, serves no purpose that could not be equally or better served by permanent content, which is what could have been and should have been provided with the Living Story.

Temporary content is, for anyone who happened to miss it, vaporware.

That’s your opinion. You are welcome to develop an MMO based on old principles and see if they are really better.

“That’s your opinion.” = “I can’t counter your argument.”
“Oh, yeah? Well, make your own!” = “I can’t think of anything relevant to say.”

In my opinion, of course.

Warruz.8096:

I felt like it was worth tossing my hat in the ring with the OP.

Long story short i decided to stop playing during dragonbash (did not care for the event at all) and i simply havnt come back yet and most likely wont until i see something permanent added. The further we get from when i quit the less likely i am to return as im just missing more and more, in addition to this there isnt anything added beyond the current event that i have experienced all ready.

The amount of content that existed when i quit and return is the same as nothing permanent has been added.

The issue with this type of content is thats its great when you are playing, however once you take that break it actually creates a barrier to return.

actually to be fair I dont think we had a single month where nothing permanent was added. sometimes it was small stuff sure but there was always something permanent. This month its the drinking mini game + new pvp map.

Last month it was the jumping puzzle.

The month before that we had the karka queen meta event + some dynamic events.

The month before that was new guild missions

So feel free to come back whenever you feel like.

Also you said you quit because you didnt like the temporary content but you’re also saying you dont want to come back because you’re missing too much temporary content that you dont like. Thats quite a contradiction there. Either you’re not playing because you dont like the content being added.. fair enough but then why are you angry for missing the content (by your own choice might I add) that you dont care to play in the first place?

Kaaboose.3897:

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Temporary content sounds more like real life. If you miss it, there’s no do over!

I’m all for it. If I miss something, to bad for me!

I can’t speak for all but one of the reasons I enjoy gaming is because it doesn’t have the same limitations as RL. Even Day Z lets you start all over again when you die.

Lol in my reactions to that post I fist also put exactly the same line about DayZ. But I took it out before posting.

Tachenon.5270:

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

AntiGw.9367:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There’s just no way to compare this to anything because it hasn’t been done before.

Probably for the same reason auto manufacturers have not embraced the concept of square wheels.

It’s not for the same reason.

Square wheels don’t serve any purpose. Living Story serves a purpose. Permanent content serves a purpose too. Anet has goals that work best with the LS instead of the traditional content patches.

Temporary content, such as has been provided by the Living Story, serves no purpose that could not be equally or better served by permanent content, which is what could have been and should have been provided with the Living Story.

Temporary content is, for anyone who happened to miss it, vaporware.

That’s your opinion. You are welcome to develop an MMO based on old principles and see if they are really better.

“That’s your opinion.” = “I can’t counter your argument.”
“Oh, yeah? Well, make your own!” = “I can’t think of anything relevant to say.”

In my opinion, of course.

“That’s your opinion.” = “Arena.net thinks otherwise.”
“Oh, yeah? Well, make your own!” = “You are here to play Arena.net’s game, with Arena.net’s rules. The LS is part of their design plan.”

Devata.6589:

Your usual friendly snip…

1/2

Its very possible to farm. I dont know how it is on your server but on mine I havent seen a bot in months now (well done Arenanet) that means the stuff you’re buying has been farmed. It didnt pop out of tin air which in turn means you can farm perfectly fine.

The reason why you think its impossible to farm is because you’re comapring farming mats directly with cof p1 which is a path that needs some nerfing fast. ITs that one single activity that overpays not farming that underpays. I’ve seen players claim a profit of up to 8 gold per hour farming cof. nothing else in game comes close to that. Generally its between 1 – 2g per hour and farmed materials are priced accordingly. I spend a lot of time farming corrupted lodestones and I used to get 1 maybe 2 per hour. currently they’re selling for 1g 68s 93c which makes sense. Of course if you’re going to compare it with Cof p1 it will seem stupid to farm corrupted lodestones directly and you’d be right you can get 6-7 per hour doing CoF but like I said thats just legalize cheating currently. If every activity in the game gave you 8g per hour then corrupted lodestones would sell for 1.68g, they’d sell for 8g+ because dont forget every single lodestone you buy was farmed by someone and the price they’re selling it at for the most part has to reflect the cost in time it took to get that stone.

Given time yes everyone can have at least one legendary weapon. The cost of legendary weapon is essentially all time (tons of gold for the precursor, a mountain of mats etc..) Currently legendary weapons are rare because people didnt get enough time to save all the required items and because of costs to gear up their characters. But in 5 – 10 years time yes affording a legendary weapon will be trivial. Right now it costs 1900g to buy eternity that means that in about 1900 hrs a lot of people will be able to afford one. in 3000+ hrs plus probably everyone will be able to afford it (much less if they buy the mats and build it themselves) but anyhow yes for now legendaries are rare because of the effort they require to get. Assuming Eternity is really worth those 1900g (really worth means it takes close to 1900hrs to farm all the stuff you need to build it ) you’d need to have spend that much time playing with the aim of acquiring it. Personally I only played 900hrs so far and none of that was aimed at acquiring eternity. In fact only got about 120g in all. (tons of mats stockpiled though).

But yes given enough time I am sure legendaries will no longer remain rare because getting one so far is just a matter of time nothing else.

Just look at gw1 when you start playing the game most armors seem impossible to get. But then a few months in you can get multiples per month if you want to. I also remember when I started to play eve online. Battleships seemed stuff that it was impossible to ever own. In hours of gameplay I would earn less then 100k and it took 100m to buy a single one. After you played enough though 100m is nothing. You can even see that in real life, how many things were unaffordable when you’re young and you buy them without thinking twice once you’re older?

She didnt buy it from TP because apart from a monstrous evil odds its also bind on pickup. So it cannot be sold. I dont understand what you mean by “Now try this in GW2.. your friend had no possibility at all to get the mount.” Well apart from the logical part that you cant get wow drops in gw2 I assume you mean cause you said its impossible to farm in gw2? But it most certainly is Like I said I got 3 tickets from dragon bash. I got 6 items from SAB and okey none of the sclerite weapons. All of those I got through farming. Like I said didnt buy a single one of the chests. strictly speaking unless my friend gets really REALLY lucky she’ll never have that mount because all things being equal, probability speaking it will not drop for her for another 45 years and I doubt she or anyone else will be playing WoW by then.

I am sure you know that these Odds and locks etc.. come from design decisions. The weekly lock is there to keep a balance between hardcore players and less hardcore players. This mount was designed with a rarity high enough thakittens meant to drop once every 48 years for a specific person. If the remove the lock they still will want to keep that 48 years and they’ll do that by increasing the odds to match the maximum frequency players can play the game and that will make it worst for everyone. For simplicity reasons lets assume everyone can play the raid once a day. That means now the odds need to be multiplied by 7 to compensate for that which in turn means that people who can only raid once a week just had the odds stacked against them by 7 times. Sorry you’ll get the drop in another 336 years. The limit helps there.