Guild Wars 2

To be honest I’m kinda disappointed with firebrand. The visuals are beautiful and I was really excited about it, but after playing it in the demo I have to agree with some of the people who are complaining about it.
This is my overview:
1-The class itself feels a bit clunky.
It gives the impression that it needs to be under constant quickness and alacrity to function. While I know that we have been given plenty sources of quickness, a class that depends on a boon uptime to flow well is not exactly fun (we cannot really compare it to chronomancers since chronomancers bring much more to the table and plays fine even if you aren’t focusing on giving quickness)
2- the class forces you into melee range without providing any survivability, gap closers or escapes.
The range on the mantras and axe is short, making you have to get really close to the enemy to be able to use those skills. The problem comes with the preparation and cast times. Switching from weapon skills to your heals isn’t instant as it is with core guard or behind a 1s cast like DH. This means your survivability skills are very easy to interrupt and given we have no way to easily disengage from combat you’re stuck with what you have.
(Of course you could forgo using the new skills and weapon, but then why would you even use the elite spec.)
3- the support abilities feel awkward.
When you think of a support class you expect something that will provide a benefit (be it heals, boons or other advantages) to the rest of the party. The way firebrand is now it feels like a very selfish form of support since unless the firebrand manages to pile up the rest of their party in a small 60° cone, they are the only ones who will be affected by the buffs and heals they provide.
I understand you can turn around to use the mantras and turn again to face the enemy and maybe develop some sort of chicken skewer strategy of turning in circles while attacking and buffing, but honestly it feels really clunky to have to do so to get this spec to work. Not to mention the hitbox is sorta weird and that small altitude differences can nullify your skill altogether.
I know there are other support skills in the kit that bring bigger aoes to the table, but if you cross out the cones, you’re left with 1/2 (or less) of what this spec brings.
4-wasted tomes and cooldowns.
The cooldowns on tomes feel excessive, mixing this with long cast times both to summon and use the skills makes tomes become more hassle than useful toolkit. Not to mention putting away the tome makes it go on CD even if you haven’t used it. Because of this it feels wasteful to close a time without using all of it’s pages, but, sadly this also means running around doing nothing while the tomes skills are going to use them efficiently (aka not to overwrite stab as it’s going, waiting with heal tome open when everyone is healed up, etc)
If the books didn’t go into CD and you could switch through them freely, it would feel better. Maybe make the pages work like ammo does, regenerating over time.
5- there is really no reason to ever use the last charge in mantras
There is not much to say here, there is no need or incentive to do so. It feels more like a mechanic introduced to punish button mashers than a class feature.
All in all I feel like the class has too many problems to actually be fun, as it brings too many obstacles and provides no reward for overcoming them.

Fashion Mage.3712:

I’d rather elite specs just keep changing the way a profession plays without just existing purely to be an upgrade to an existing build for the profession. So I don’t think “condition elite spec” as just that should be a thing. I don’t really care for condition cancer personally, but they could add a 600-range support elite spec for guardians and I’d still cringe my boots off because guardians can already do just that, although I suppose it’d be marginally more fitting because of the supportive aspect of it.

Well straight damage guardian already existed before dragon hunter, and scepter used to have insane range, so technically you could argue it already existed.
I agree it should allow to play the class in different ways, but that’s not always something completely innovative.
Sadly, burn guardian has never been a top build for guardian and while it has seen improvements latley it would be nice if it became top tier.
For this reason I created the foefire avenger spec(which is was sparked this thread), just plainly hypothetical, but something I’d really like to see

I agree, but think about this. Why is burning guardian not the optimal build for wvw/pvp? I believe is because it relies on that “surprise factor” to be effective.
I think bringing the specialization would make it easier to spot (if you see someone with two torches running at you, it leaves very little space for doubt), and, with reduced burning on PvP modes shouldn’t be too terrible to fight.
Again the biggest weakness is the lack of variety of conditions, plus in wvw/pvp you’re likely to take some cleanse/cc utility skills rather than just the burning ones that the new spec provides, reducing the amount of burning you produce as well.
I agree that the main issue could be the virtues, but since they change when you equip the specialization, those can be tuned as well to space out the burning just as the other skills without affecting how core guardian works. Also keep in mind that the new torch skills have 30s cooldowns (exept auto) so if you see them coming and they have used their skills you have a big time gap to turn the match/duel against them, i tried to line up the general cool downs with the average cooldown of the cleanse skills from other classes.
A burn spec is definitely something people have wanted for a long while, and though challenging to balance, it could prove really fun to play. Specially if you were to use a condi/healer build with seraphs or zealots.

GWMO.4785:

Nice idea.. tho i do not think Anet will make weapons compatible by equipping it in another set. Pretty sure duel handed will always remain duel handed, main as main and offhand as offhand. Tho i do see possibilities in spear and trident becoming a territorial weapon.

That being said guardian does already have access to frequent burning. Adding a condi spec specialization will bring serious balance issues to guardian. Maybe not in Pve, but i can definitely see it happening in PvP and WvW.

I dont see it becoming a problem in WvW because of the same reason the current burn guardian isn’t a threat, and, though decent its not the favored build. The lack of varied conditions makes it pretty easy to shut down the burning. Though builds that carry absolutely zero condi clear would see it as a big problem. Compare it to thief or mesmer condition wise and they will still have the upper hand since most condi clear skills dont allow you to remove all conditions, and having varied kinds would make it harder to cleanse.
I get what you mean with the burn stacks going up to fast but as Phantom said, that can be toned down in different game modes as they have been doing so far.
That said, im not an expert in pvp :P

About the main hand torch, yea, i think you may be right, but it was a cool idea that i would love to see ingame. I mean, its not like there arent any weapons that behave in this way, just like dagger can be main/off hand i dont think it would be too much trouble to adjust it be behave in the same way.

Still, i appreaciate the feedback! thank you for commenting

-Space for extra stuff-
EDIT: i forgot to add something about the profession mechanic.
Originally i wanted Vengeful Spirit to be an F4 skill, but i set it as auto trigger because i felt it would get used more like that.
It just occurred to me that the best would be to combine both and make it a F4 skill that can be set to auto cast (like some of the normal skills) and so get the best of both worlds

Traits:
Minor adept:
Spiritual successor: your virtues take upon the form of the foefires power, changing their physical manifestation.
Your superior attunement to fire allows you to wield torch in the main hand.

Major adept.
1.Healers Respite:
Adds outgoing healing based on your precision
7% of your precision is turned into outgoing healing.

2.Well are you going?
Wells cripple your enemies, well recharge is reduced.
Cripple: (5s)
Well recharge: 20%

3.Wild Abandon
Reduces the heal on last resolve in exchange for more burning on the same skill and extra determinations stacks.
Healing reduced: 50%
Burning increased: 50%
Determination stacks +3
——————————————-

Minor master
Conditions you cleanse turn into random boons

Major master[b/]
[b]1. No man left behind
Strengthen the barrier from burning courage, increasing its radius and making it reflect projectiles. Aegis now affects up to 10 allies.
Burning Courage radius: 320

2. Symbolic Wrath
Symbols now burn enemies that stand in them, if an enemy dies within your symbols, the symbol explodes when it ends.
Burning: 1 stack of 1s per pulse

3. Critical Aid
Your critical hits heal you and allies standing close to you by a small amount.
Healing:130

Minor Grandmaster.
Everlasting wrath
Conditions you apply last longer
Condition duration increase:15%

Major grandmaster
1.Torch Prowess
Using torch in both hands grants you bonus burn damage. Torch cooldowns are reduced.
Burning damage increase: 10%
Recharge Reduced: 5%

2. Hardened by Flame
Gain protection when inflicted with conditions. Conditions on you are shorter.
Condition duration decrease:15%
Protection: 6s
Cooldown: 15s

3. True Avenger
Reduces the stacks needed to trigger vengeful spirit, your virtues reset when vengeful spirit ends.
[i]Stacks required: 20[i/]

—Possible Builds—
Condi/power avenger – viper gear
Symbol burn avenger – viper
Burn heal avenger -seraph or zealots
Crit heal avenger – magi or seraph

Lore paragraph:
Something changed in you after mordremoth died, perhaps it was that you got too close for too long during that last battle, but some of its power seems to have seeped into you..a destructive blighting force welling inside you, tempting you to take hold of it. Tempting you to realize your newfound strength and use it to watch the world burn.

Lore reskin option: option b for the same class concept could be be a mordemoth/blight themed avenger. Instead of firey/ghostly, the skills should look like they have burning blue vines and that should make up for the theme. Of course, skills and traits would be changed to reflect this. For example, "wild fire" (main hand torch 3) could become "blighting chaos". The looks of a few of the skills could borrow from the mordem attacks in the HoT area , but recolored to fit the class. Another thing that I thought is that the applied conditions could become more varied if used with this theme, applying torment and poison as well as fire. But i considered that it could make it too strong in PvP and therefore I left it as is, though it could fit both themes well.

Credits:
A million thanks to Tacwizard and Alpha Strife for helping me “debug” this class. Couldn’t have done it without you guys.
Ps, I drew my guardian with main hand torch and posted it here as well, hope you guys like it.

Wells:
All wells inflict a base burning damage of 1 stack of 1s per second of standing in it and give 4 stacks of determination to the avenger. The wells are adapted to the foefire theme

1. Well of Light (Heal Skill)
Heals you for a small amount, removes 2 conditions and heals you and your allies based on the number of allies standing in your well when it expires.
[i]Cooldown: 30s
Duration: 4s
Cast: 0.75s
Healing: 3k
Radius: 300
Conditions Removed: 2
Healing when expired: 1k healing per ally standing in the well (up to 5k healing)
Number of targets: 10
Determination: 4[i/]

2. Well of Charring
Fire damage well, gives might to allies when it expires.
Cooldown: 30s
Duration: 5s
Cast: 0.75s
Radius: 240
Damage: 600
Burning: 4 stacks for 4s
Might: 4 stacks for 10s

3. Well of Ash
Pulses to inflict blindness and vulnerability on enemies, gives allies protection when it expires.
Cooldown: 20s
Duration: 6s
Cast: 0.75s
Radius: 240
Damage: 200
Pulses: 3
Blindness: 2s
Vulnerability: 5 stacks for 5s
Protection: 4 stacks for 10s

4. Well of Embers
Slows enemies and gives stability to allies when the well expires.
Cooldown: 35s
Duration: 5s
Cast: 0.75s
Radius: 240
Damage: 200
Slow: 3s
Stability: 3 stacks for 6s

5. Foefires Revenge Well (Elite Skill)
A giant ghostly sword appears and plunges into the ground pulling enemies in, and calling blue pillars of flame from underground it will float enemies up while dealing fire damage. When the well expires, it gives everyone standing in your well ghostly appearance and reduced damage. Can only be used if in foefire spirit mode.
Cooldown: 120s
Duration: 7s
Cast: 0.75s
Radius: 300
Damage on explosion: 600
Pull: 300
Float: 1s
Burning: 5 stacks for 5s
Ghostly protection: 5s (50% reduced damage)
Number of targets: 5

*Foefire Avenger *
Guardian that gains the ability to wield a main hand torch, increasing their burning powers. Also gains access to Wells and foefire themed skills.

Lore: After being exposed so much to the mist shifting abilities of the mursaat and the white mantle, your body started to develop a strange sensitivity for the magic embedded on the land, the exposure to the mists borders in lake Doric only strengthening this skill. Suddenly you felt an old hidden magic resound with you, filling you. Taking this new power in your hands you learnt to do what no one could in ages past, to gain full control of the foefire.

Profession mechanic:
Virtues have changed again, influenced by the power of the foefire.

1.Blast of Justice
Leap towards your target area, causing a fiery explosion on your landing and shortly dazing your foe.
Cooldown: 40s
Cast:1s
Daze: 0.5s
Duration: 1s
Burning: 3 stacks of burning (5s)
Radius: 120
Determination: 2 stacks

2. Last Resolve
Focus your power into 3 fire waves that heals allies and burns foes.
Cooldown: 30s
Cast:3s
Duration: 3s
Burning: 2 stacks per way for 3s
Healing: 3 waves of 1k
Radius: 360
Determination: 2 stacks

3. Burning Courage
Give aegis to yourself and your allies and place a small, circular, fire wall on the floor that destroys projectiles.
Cooldown: 80s
Cast: 0.25s
Duration: 5s
Radius: 160
Determination: 2 stacks

4. Vengeful spirit
Wells, symbols and virtues grant a special boon to the avenger “determination” when this boon reaches 25 stacks, the profession mechanic “vengeful spirit” automatically triggers. This changes the avenger into a ghost like appearance, reduces the damage they take, increases healing and gives additional burn damage to every skill.
While this skill is in effect, and while the skill is on cooldown they can not generate any determination stacks. Stacks decay after 60s out of combat at a rate of 1 every 2 seconds.
Vengeful Spirit cooldown: 80s
Duration: 15s
Damage reduction (ghostly protection buff): 50%
Burning per skill used: 1 stack for 1s
Healing increase: 10%

Determination stacks per skill type:
Virtue: 2 (5 if traited)
Wells: 4
Symbols: 1

Main hand torch skills

1. Burning Barrage (Auto Attack)
Burn the enemy with your torch, throwing flames in short distance.
Cast: 0.5s
Damage: 200
Burning: 1 stacks of burning (2s)
Range: 480

2. Symbol of Avowal
Throw a ghostly torch onto a targeted area and place a symbol on the ground that burns enemies and heals allies. If you pick up the torch before the symbol expires the cooldown is reduced by 33%.
Cooldown: 30s
Cast: 0.25s
Duration: 5s
Damage: 400
Burning: 3 stacks of burning (5s)
Healing: 500
Radius: 180

3. Wild Fire
Strike the floor and create a twisting line of fire that explodes and burns enemies standing on it.
Cooldown: 30s
Duration: 2s
Cast: 0.5s
Damage: 600
Burning: 4 stacks of burning (4s)
Range: 480

I love this idea! ever since DH came around my build has relied on symbols, so id be hyped to see this change.

I like the idea of adding the cleanse to the staff, though i think it would be slightly broken in pvp. May be a bit out of tune since no other guardian weapon offers a self cleanse, even if its just from movement effects (i want this though.. so so much)
I have the same feeling about cleansing on mace.
Also mace already has heals built in, they are reaaaally tiny, but they are there. Also there is a trait that does the heal per tick on symbols.
I would instead suggest adding might or vigor to it, I feel since the topic of it is faith, it would be matching for it to give strength or to invigorate to whoever stands in it.

ps, sorry for the multiple edits, im the typo/grammar mishaps master

Here is my rice grain on this topic. Back when HoT came around i was a fresh 80 on my guardian, and yes, i did feel the difficulty increase. If you don’t know what you’re doing it can feel like switching from skyrim to dark souls.
The story is soloable, and traversing through the areas shouldnt be that bad
(except tangled depths, that place is like navigating through spaghetti)

These are my tips if you’re having a hard time:

1. Get more people to run with you.
   I know you were talking about the content needing to be soloable, it is. But you can always ask for help. Find someone to run around with you or stick to groups, they make life much easier.
2. Get exotic or ascended gear.
   Gear isnt everything, but it helps.
3. Learn that running is not always an option
   Things will chase you and shoot you down, you cannot always run. If youre going to attempt running, make sure you can outrun your enemies
4. Avoid unnecesary combat
   Don’t jump in the middle of a hoard of enemies and try to kill them all at the same time. Take it slow. Sometimes staying on the sidelines without calling the enemy’s attention is a better strategy
5. Be ready to get lost
   Yes, the maps are complex, you will get lost at first, but once you unlock the masteries that allow you to move around, you’ll notice how much easier it becomes.
6. Bring cc skills
   Lots of the enemies in HoT have breakbars, cc them to break those and they will get stunned for a while and take more damage.
7. Dont get frustrated
   Since youre not used to these different maps its normal to die. The HoT areas have quite a few unexpected dangers, but again, running with someone will improve your success rate a lot, and at least they can ress you in case of need. Its ok to die.
8. If you really hate it..
   Finally if you really reaaaaaalllly hate it, just dont do it. There’s no point on bashing your head against your desk. Dont do it if you really believe you cant play it without suffering. Its a game, and its meant to be played for fun

TLDR? its all about adapting. In the end, you wont find it hard anymore. But, as usual, having someone by your side will help ease the transition. Dont get frustrated about the maps, the different masteries you can learn will make it so much easier to move around. (Except Tangled Depths… that evil, treachrous land! ..i mean seriously.. those chak.. who’s idea was it to make the karkas into mesmers?? and why?? its still fun tho)

Ps, I wont be available this weekend, but if you need help with the story, id be happy to assist. That is, if you still have any interest in finishing it.

drgast.1469:

In limited use on the HoT maps it feels pretty crappy so far. Maybe if I were running a condition build where I was building in some condi duration it would feel better?

I don’t think it would make a difference, none of the traps burn

Nike.2631:

So it loses some situational effectiveness, a small amount of CC break bar punch, and DEFANGS 50,000 slavering haters who lose their minds every time they get dazed by a DH trap?

This change is still at least 80% made of win. And honestly, taking away the incentive to drop traps on immobile enemies to interrupt them makes them more like “traps” and less like PBAoE fart-bombs.

Ahahaha “PBAoE fart-bombs”, you, sir, have made my day.
After playing some time under this change, I don’t mind it as much as i thought i would, but id like an extra half second of slow for PvE to match the old break bar points. Sometimes you gotta fight an immobile boss, and having that cc really makes a difference.

mrauls.6519:

I honestly am grateful that traps don’t daze anymore. I never realized how stupid it was that people could interrupt me so easily until yesterday. I just wish that instead of slow, traps on activation gave us fury… Slow doesn’t even make sense. I would also be okay with every trap crippling enemies instead.

I get it was ridiculous in PvP, but I don’t like to lose break bar value for PvE. Don’t really understand why every class got split changes but they took our daze completely on both game modes. I agree that slow doesn’t make sense, but at least it has better cc value than cripple.
Slow does 50/s, so giving the traps 2s of slow (instead of 1.5) would do the same as what daze used to, I’d be glad to see this happen even as a PvE only thing.

Its a versatile class able to adapt to most situations, I like the fact that I can choose from a big array of weapons, providing good dps both at range and in close quarters.
It’s a supporty dps with a kit filled with useful skills, such as condi cleanse, party-wide stability and aegis, healing, and damaging traps.
I also like putting blue fire over my character. A lot.

Pregnantman.8259:

Sigfodr.9576:

Great, one of the very few PvE changes in the patch is a hard nerf to guard :/ going from 100 insta cc points down to 75 points over 1,5 sec…

well as we all know, all raid/fractal group only accept guards, we need that nerf to make room for atleast a few temps.. or wait.. what?

Overreacting much? We can still CC really well and trap daze was never the main source of our CC.

I used as my main cc, it was nice and accesible and it allowed me to not waste my signet..
in PvP it was a great way to interrupt burst combos, reses and stomps
Ill miss my dazes. I understand that this will make WvW encounters more bearable in the case you encounter a large group of guardians (otherwise it was daze for days) but im mostly saddend about this change.

I personally don’t like it, i feel like daze worked better for my survivablitiy both in PvE and PvP,

Just think about the poor orphaned baby griffons..
Corrupted griffons seem to be fine since ice floats on water as you can clearly see in this gif..

All jokes aside, just wanted to bring this bug up to you guys. Keep up the great work!