Guild Wars 2

Linken.6345:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Daddicus.6128:

BoogerSammich.7189:

It’s not irrelevant.
In fact, it’s entirely relevant.
we are talking about carrying around gear.
ID’ing the gear and/or salvaging it is a completely different conversation.

OK, so you’re saying we can ID 250 items, and put them … where?

If you ID a stack of items, that requires 250 slots. Otherwise, you can’t finish IDing the stack.

If you are carrying around a stack of 250 unidentified gear, it takes ONE inventory slot..
If you are carrying around 250 pieces of identified gear, then it takes 250 inventory slots.
249 inventory slots saved with the unidentified gear. full stop.

Now, if you decide to ID the gear, then you have taken action to convert the unidentified gear into actual gear.
You no longer have unidentified gear, through your actions you now have identified gear.
It is at this point that the conversation changes because you have taken action to convert the unidentified gear into individual pieces of gear.

But again, so long as you continue to have unidentified gear, then inventory slots are saved.

Yes true but we already had something that stacked in 250 bags of masterful gear. (3 items in each so thats 750 in that stack comparibly)

We dident need to pay about 5 silver to get the 3 pieces of gear out of those so why the change now?

Yeah, I’m not sure why they didn’t just go with a new stackable bag type instead of the unidentified gear.

Daddicus.6128:

BoogerSammich.7189:

It’s not irrelevant.
In fact, it’s entirely relevant.
we are talking about carrying around gear.
ID’ing the gear and/or salvaging it is a completely different conversation.

OK, so you’re saying we can ID 250 items, and put them … where?

If you ID a stack of items, that requires 250 slots. Otherwise, you can’t finish IDing the stack.

If you are carrying around a stack of 250 unidentified gear, it takes ONE inventory slot..
If you are carrying around 250 pieces of identified gear, then it takes 250 inventory slots.
249 inventory slots saved with the unidentified gear. full stop.

Now, if you decide to ID the gear, then you have taken action to convert the unidentified gear into actual gear.
You no longer have unidentified gear, through your actions you now have identified gear.
It is at this point that the conversation changes because you have taken action to convert the unidentified gear into individual pieces of gear.

But again, so long as you continue to have unidentified gear, then inventory slots are saved.

Daddicus.6128:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Daddicus.6128:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

How? You still need those same slots after identifying the items.

That is an entirely separate conversation.
Maybe you will randomly ID gear while in the middle of playing.
I would ID/salvage near a vendor.

That’s irrelevant. When you ID them, they separate out into individual slots. So, you need exactly the same number of slots you did before.

It’s not irrelevant.
In fact, it’s entirely relevant.
we are talking about carrying around gear.
ID’ing the gear and/or salvaging it is a completely different conversation.

Ferelwing.8463:

Ok, serious question.
Are rares and exotics being removed from the loot tables that include these unidentified gear kits?
Because this makes all of the difference.
I am operating under the assumption that they are NOT removed from these loot tables?

Ok, if they are indeed removing the chance to roll on yellows and exos and replacing everything on the loot table with green unidentified gear then I def see your frustration.
I was assuming that the loot tables would look relatively the same, save for the fact that instead blues and greens you would get the gear kits.
Carry on, nothing to see here.

Djinn.9245:

VanHalenRules.5243:

The point people make about GW2 not needing mounts is well taken, I felt the same before hearing of the PoF expansion. However, I think that this could be pretty cool if the developers add more activities using the mounts… like the race for example. Maybe they could add a new group of mini games like in Lion’s Arch for mounts, like a mount version of sanctum sprint or something (yes the current mount race is kinda like it, but it’s too plain and there are no skills used in it which make it kinda stupid imo). Would be fun to see more mini games.

I certainly hope not. I will not play minigames so they are useless to me. I would prefer more story / map / armor / etc. Yes I know that the same people don’t make all these things. But less $ spent on minigames = more $ for the other stuff.

Holy crap DJINN you’re still around?
lol I leave for 2 years and you’re still holding it down.
I have nothing to contribute, just wanted to say hi

Blockhead Magee.3092:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Blockhead Magee.3092:

Hannelore.8153:

All I ever hear about is waypoints.

Did you know for the first three years of the game all I ever heard about was how much waypoints cheapen all content?

You NEVER EVER heard that from me, my wife or my guild mates. NEVER EVER. Waypoints were a draw in this game. Wasting time moving between locations is not fun. I don’t play video games to be bored and wasting time on a mount just to get to a location is BORING.

What is getting cheapened is the time spent in game doing something fun.

I played the demo weekend and I have to say, mounts are FUN.
I mean, a lot of fun.
Also, I am in the “waypoints cheapen the experience” camp.
I think waypoints are good, but only when used sparingly.
IMHO, the current system of strategic waypoints combined with fun types of movement makes the entire game more fun.

Thats good – for you. I also played the beta weekend and I do not find running on a mount to be fun at all. What is nice for you is that you can choose not to use the waypoints to get where you want and use the mount. Those of us who prefer the waypoint system are not given the same option.

I don’t play the game to run places, I play the game to find new things and fight (mobs, people in wvw or pvp). The way point system helps me not waste time on things that are not fun.

How do you find new things while way pointing instead of traversing the map?
That’s quite a feat!

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

JaddynnStarr.5201:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens or pretty much anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart, then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

Ferelwing.8463:

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens

The bag system is both a part of the economy, and a game mechanic. It has always been present, and always will be. Same as in any other MMO I’ve played. Also, there are tons of ways to get bags without spending gold.

Ferelwing.8463:

anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart

Again, hearts are a core game mechanic. No-one is “required” to play the game.

Ferelwing.8463:

then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

There is no need to ID the loot. You can simply salvage the unidentified gear, or sell directly to a vendor.

you are right, there is no REQUIREMENT to id the loot, but if you DONT ID it, you lose out on any opportunity to loot an exotic or rare item that can be sold or salvaged for a much higher profit price. Now you MUST pay to get a chance at an exotic or rare, that you would NATURALLY HAVE GOTTEN without having to spend money to ID it.

basically what has happened is, is Anet wants to make us pay for things we already were getting for free(minus cost of salvage kit of course…). That cost is counter productive. Say you pay 1s 68c to id a piece of gear and it turns out to be a blue tier piece. Then you pay another 68c or 1s 20c to salvage that into a mat you can use(cuz the gear is useless to you otherwise or you can sell it for 1s to a vendor). You receive 2 mithril ore from the salvage. So now you have payed 2s 40c – 2s 90c to get 2 mithril that’s worth 60c. Congratulations… now you’re paying 2s 90c for 2 mithril, worth a total of 60c…. enjoy your cake sunshine!

or the alternative is to just salvage it outright and never have another chance at getting an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop ever again… your choice.

Thank you! That exactly describes the situation. You can either risk paying 2s 40c- 2s90c for something worth 60c OR you can choose not to see an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop for as long as you are in the new zones. Neither of those choices feel like good choices.

Im sorry, but I think this argument is incredibly weak at best.
The basis of your position rests on these presupposed, theoretical drops coming out of these unidentified gear kits.
The argument here is based on pure conjecture.
You are upset about not getting something that you already do not have, and that does not exist.
If you apply this logic elsewhere, it’s like saying that every time you salvage a rare INSTEAD of throwing it into the Mystic toilet, you are somehow being robbed of the chance to get an exotic back because you didn’t get the chance to roll on it, because you salvaged it instead.
This logic is entirely circular, and will only lead back to itself.

Furthermore, you are assuming that rare and exotic drops will not come from ANYWHERE else and that identifying green gear kits is your only opportunity to roll on this gear.

Im sorry, I am REALLY NOT trying to sound rude, but this makes no sense to me.

Look, the issue I’m having here is simple… If the problem is inventory space then take the RNG to another location give everyone a token for blue/green/rare/exotic/precursor level gear and have us go to a vendor that tells us what token we’ve got no fee, just see the guy who explains it, if they wanted they could have made it a mastery.

With the Mystic forge you know precisely what will happen when you put 4 items in and it doesn’t cost you anything to put those items in. You have a very low chance of getting anything cool but it’s still there and if you want to risk it you can, at the same time it costs you NOTHING (the stuff you’ve got that you’re using you earned or bought on the TP for that purpose). Having something that used to be free and innate taken away to “save space” is a step backwards.

The only circular logic I’ve seen thus far has been the logic used to explain why this isn’t a regression in game-play and why this isn’t a problem but a “feature”. There were better ways to solve the problem of space. Perhaps having a Mastery point that gave you a magic bag that never ran out of space that you could put into your inventory or perhaps something that turned each of those items into a token that you went to see a vendor for RNG to take place there and you could “retrieve” the items that your tokens set you up for then salvage etc… All of those would have still granted “knowledge” without setting people up to wonder whether or not they made the right choice, it also would have made the “rewards” feel like rewards rather than feeling like there are no good choices.

Ok, serious question.
Are rares and exotics being removed from the loot tables that include these unidentified gear kits?
Because this makes all of the difference.
I am operating under the assumption that they are NOT removed from these loot tables?

Yes, if you salvage the items you do not get ectos or anything else you get baseline mats, if you sell the item you do not get a rare/exotic price for them. You get a blue/green price for them. That is why we are objecting. ALL of the unidentified id’s are blue/green until id’d.

Do we know if there will be yellow and orange unidentified gear?

Daddicus.6128:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

How? You still need those same slots after identifying the items.

That is an entirely separate conversation.
Maybe you will randomly ID gear while in the middle of playing.
I would ID/salvage near a vendor.

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

JaddynnStarr.5201:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens or pretty much anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart, then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

Ferelwing.8463:

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens

The bag system is both a part of the economy, and a game mechanic. It has always been present, and always will be. Same as in any other MMO I’ve played. Also, there are tons of ways to get bags without spending gold.

Ferelwing.8463:

anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart

Again, hearts are a core game mechanic. No-one is “required” to play the game.

Ferelwing.8463:

then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

There is no need to ID the loot. You can simply salvage the unidentified gear, or sell directly to a vendor.

you are right, there is no REQUIREMENT to id the loot, but if you DONT ID it, you lose out on any opportunity to loot an exotic or rare item that can be sold or salvaged for a much higher profit price. Now you MUST pay to get a chance at an exotic or rare, that you would NATURALLY HAVE GOTTEN without having to spend money to ID it.

basically what has happened is, is Anet wants to make us pay for things we already were getting for free(minus cost of salvage kit of course…). That cost is counter productive. Say you pay 1s 68c to id a piece of gear and it turns out to be a blue tier piece. Then you pay another 68c or 1s 20c to salvage that into a mat you can use(cuz the gear is useless to you otherwise or you can sell it for 1s to a vendor). You receive 2 mithril ore from the salvage. So now you have payed 2s 40c – 2s 90c to get 2 mithril that’s worth 60c. Congratulations… now you’re paying 2s 90c for 2 mithril, worth a total of 60c…. enjoy your cake sunshine!

or the alternative is to just salvage it outright and never have another chance at getting an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop ever again… your choice.

Thank you! That exactly describes the situation. You can either risk paying 2s 40c- 2s90c for something worth 60c OR you can choose not to see an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop for as long as you are in the new zones. Neither of those choices feel like good choices.

Im sorry, but I think this argument is incredibly weak at best.
The basis of your position rests on these presupposed, theoretical drops coming out of these unidentified gear kits.
The argument here is based on pure conjecture.
You are upset about not getting something that you already do not have, and that does not exist.
If you apply this logic elsewhere, it’s like saying that every time you salvage a rare INSTEAD of throwing it into the Mystic toilet, you are somehow being robbed of the chance to get an exotic back because you didn’t get the chance to roll on it, because you salvaged it instead.
This logic is entirely circular, and will only lead back to itself.

Furthermore, you are assuming that rare and exotic drops will not come from ANYWHERE else and that identifying green gear kits is your only opportunity to roll on this gear.

Im sorry, I am REALLY NOT trying to sound rude, but this makes no sense to me.

Look, the issue I’m having here is simple… If the problem is inventory space then take the RNG to another location give everyone a token for blue/green/rare/exotic/precursor level gear and have us go to a vendor that tells us what token we’ve got no fee, just see the guy who explains it, if they wanted they could have made it a mastery.

With the Mystic forge you know precisely what will happen when you put 4 items in and it doesn’t cost you anything to put those items in. You have a very low chance of getting anything cool but it’s still there and if you want to risk it you can, at the same time it costs you NOTHING (the stuff you’ve got that you’re using you earned or bought on the TP for that purpose). Having something that used to be free and innate taken away to “save space” is a step backwards.

The only circular logic I’ve seen thus far has been the logic used to explain why this isn’t a regression in game-play and why this isn’t a problem but a “feature”. There were better ways to solve the problem of space. Perhaps having a Mastery point that gave you a magic bag that never ran out of space that you could put into your inventory or perhaps something that turned each of those items into a token that you went to see a vendor for RNG to take place there and you could “retrieve” the items that your tokens set you up for then salvage etc… All of those would have still granted “knowledge” without setting people up to wonder whether or not they made the right choice, it also would have made the “rewards” feel like rewards rather than feeling like there are no good choices.

Ok, serious question.
Are rares and exotics being removed from the loot tables that include these unidentified gear kits?
Because this makes all of the difference.
I am operating under the assumption that they are NOT removed from these loot tables?

Ferelwing.8463:

JaddynnStarr.5201:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens or pretty much anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart, then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

Ferelwing.8463:

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens

The bag system is both a part of the economy, and a game mechanic. It has always been present, and always will be. Same as in any other MMO I’ve played. Also, there are tons of ways to get bags without spending gold.

Ferelwing.8463:

anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart

Again, hearts are a core game mechanic. No-one is “required” to play the game.

Ferelwing.8463:

then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

There is no need to ID the loot. You can simply salvage the unidentified gear, or sell directly to a vendor.

you are right, there is no REQUIREMENT to id the loot, but if you DONT ID it, you lose out on any opportunity to loot an exotic or rare item that can be sold or salvaged for a much higher profit price. Now you MUST pay to get a chance at an exotic or rare, that you would NATURALLY HAVE GOTTEN without having to spend money to ID it.

basically what has happened is, is Anet wants to make us pay for things we already were getting for free(minus cost of salvage kit of course…). That cost is counter productive. Say you pay 1s 68c to id a piece of gear and it turns out to be a blue tier piece. Then you pay another 68c or 1s 20c to salvage that into a mat you can use(cuz the gear is useless to you otherwise or you can sell it for 1s to a vendor). You receive 2 mithril ore from the salvage. So now you have payed 2s 40c – 2s 90c to get 2 mithril that’s worth 60c. Congratulations… now you’re paying 2s 90c for 2 mithril, worth a total of 60c…. enjoy your cake sunshine!

or the alternative is to just salvage it outright and never have another chance at getting an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop ever again… your choice.

Thank you! That exactly describes the situation. You can either risk paying 2s 40c- 2s90c for something worth 60c OR you can choose not to see an exotic/rare/pre-cursor drop for as long as you are in the new zones. Neither of those choices feel like good choices.

Im sorry, but I think this argument is incredibly weak at best.
The basis of your position rests on these presupposed, theoretical drops coming out of these unidentified gear kits.
The argument here is based on pure conjecture.
You are upset about not getting something that you already do not have, and that does not exist.
If you apply this logic elsewhere, it’s like saying that every time you salvage a rare INSTEAD of throwing it into the Mystic toilet, you are somehow being robbed of the chance to get an exotic back because you didn’t get the chance to roll on it, because you salvaged it instead.
This logic is entirely circular, and will only lead back to itself.

Furthermore, you are assuming that rare and exotic drops will not come from ANYWHERE else and that identifying green gear kits is your only opportunity to roll on this gear.

Im sorry, I am REALLY NOT trying to sound rude, but this makes no sense to me.

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens or pretty much anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart, then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

Ferelwing.8463:

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens

The bag system is both a part of the economy, and a game mechanic. It has always been present, and always will be. Same as in any other MMO I’ve played. Also, there are tons of ways to get bags without spending gold.

Ferelwing.8463:

anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart

Again, hearts are a core game mechanic. No-one is “required” to play the game.

Ferelwing.8463:

then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

There is no need to ID the loot. You can simply salvage the unidentified gear, or sell directly to a vendor.

The crux of it is this, the entire time this game has given us fully id’d loot that we got to choose the fate of. It the problem is that people didn’t have space in their inventory because it consumed them then give us something that will fix this. Having us spend money to id something that we worked to get feels bad.

It doesn’t feel like a good choice regardless, if you choose to sell the items to vendor sight unseen you will always wonder if perhaps there was a rare/exotic/precusor in that group. If you choose not to and all you get are greens and blue’s then you will feel like you wasted money.

NONE of those are good answers.

The excuse you are making is that it saves inventory space, they could have done that without the “pay to id” mechanic.

Well, perhaps we can use this opportunity to make suggestions to make the system better?
For example, the unidentified gear definitely addresses the bag space issue.
However, it does come with the caveat that in order to ID the gear, you need to spend currency.
What if there were an alternate currency that could be used to buy the ID kits?
Or, what if the ID kits could be obtained at a discount, or maybe even free?
For example, perhaps a mastery line that once unlocked would allow you to obtain the ID kits for like, I dunno a copper or some trivial amount?

Again, I think the system is pretty good at addressing the inventory issue.
I also don’t feel that there is a problem with spending currency to ID the gear.
I still believe that salvaging or selling the gear are both valid options that don’t require anyone to spend anything.
I view the ID part of the system as sort of a gamble, for “theoretical” better loot.
I see it as a “pay for a chance to get something better” type of mechanic.

Blockhead Magee.3092:

Hannelore.8153:

All I ever hear about is waypoints.

Did you know for the first three years of the game all I ever heard about was how much waypoints cheapen all content?

You NEVER EVER heard that from me, my wife or my guild mates. NEVER EVER. Waypoints were a draw in this game. Wasting time moving between locations is not fun. I don’t play video games to be bored and wasting time on a mount just to get to a location is BORING.

What is getting cheapened is the time spent in game doing something fun.

I played the demo weekend and I have to say, mounts are FUN.
I mean, a lot of fun.
Also, I am in the “waypoints cheapen the experience” camp.
I think waypoints are good, but only when used sparingly.
IMHO, the current system of strategic waypoints combined with fun types of movement makes the entire game more fun.

Ferelwing.8463:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens or pretty much anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart, then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

Ferelwing.8463:

Except they could have saved space by just giving us all bags or tokens

The bag system is both a part of the economy, and a game mechanic. It has always been present, and always will be. Same as in any other MMO I’ve played. Also, there are tons of ways to get bags without spending gold.

Ferelwing.8463:

anything else that didn’t require us to first complete a heart

Again, hearts are a core game mechanic. No-one is “required” to play the game.

Ferelwing.8463:

then pay extra to id all that loot that we just worked to get.

There is no need to ID the loot. You can simply salvage the unidentified gear, or sell directly to a vendor.

Dante.1763:

BoogerSammich.7189:

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Now i want you to pay to id all that stuff you had before already id’d.

Pay who?
Unless I am mistaken, the unidentified gear can be sold directly to a vendor.
The unidentified gear can also be salvaged.
There is no need to identify it.
So, if you don’t want to id it, then don’t.
This changes nothing save for the fact that we will now have more bag slots available instead of having those slots filled with random greens and blues.

This mechanic saves bag space.
I don’t see a downside.

Wow, this post.
Way to cry about free ice-cream…
watisthisidonteven

Awesome post, thanks Blaine!

Flumek.9043:

TheDevice.2751:

GS3 Death Spiral: gets a short-range (250) dash. Nothing extravagant, just a bit of mobility in the thrust to keep up with fleeing targets. Maybe add a leap finisher.

OMG.
Im mind blown.

DevilMayCry , Dantes Rebellion pierce attack.

Would be soo good, ofc the dash range should be low, with a leap combo.
Example at 0:35 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3_p0uEnfjc
Edit: maybe the ending thrust hit of the combo at 0:20 even better as its short range

^^Yeah, what they said.

Sandrox.9524:

Dreaming serpent.5197:

Sandrox.9524:

dank.3680:

Still using the GS since my comment about not liking it the other day. I finally swapped out my staff for it instead of my offhand set, it works a lot better. I’m running axe/focus (I’ve always disagreed with axe hate its a good weapon imo) and GS..

The axe/focus is the main set but the GS when used at the right times has become very valuable to me.

4 is great everyone agrees,

3 I personally find useful because my build relies on vuln stacking a lot.

5 is very situational and you need to only use it when you know it’s going to work(much like spectral grasp has always been wonky)..

skill 2 is amazing when you set it up by baiting dodges and stunbreaks with reapers shroud.. I’ve also used it to down multiple lower health enemies at once which none of my other necro tools could have done that.

If I’m using 1 spam on any weapon, it’s not a vital thing I’m doing so I don’t really mind the slowness of it, besides I don’t have issues landing it when I want to and it does huge damage.

I dumped staff too, Axe give more range threat, while RS and GS for melee attackers

Sameize. I’ve been Running a Axe/Wh GreatSword well pure zerker in pvp and having a blast. It’s not meta by far, but the wells really sustain you in a team fight and gravedigger can literally take people from 75% health to downed.

For Best effect, use spectral grasp, give life force, and they don’t expect a second pull from gs.

If only the gokitten skill would connect when it should be >.<

This^^
The pull on GS5 doesn’t seem to be reliable at all.
It feels like a crapshoot as to whether or not it will actually pull, and if so how far will it pull?
GS could also benefit from a small “out-of-shroud” gap closer and possibly even a short root.
But that’s asking a lot i guess.

Bhawb.7408:

Berullos.6928:

Greatsword is great in pve. However if you look at it carefully its a hybrid weapon due to the fact chill can damage.

That’s not really how hybrid weapons work. Everything about it is a power weapon, and while that one trait happens to make some abilities deal condition damage that’s like saying Barbed Precision makes dagger a hybrid weapon. GS is pure power.

I agree with Bhawb here.
It feels like the entire reaper spec is the necro answer to the power build we’d all been playing with the dagger.
They basically just gave us what we had been asking for.

@Cogbyrn.7283
Seriously? I wasn’t even responding to you.
Why do you feel like everything i say somehow is directed at you?
Really, i have no beef with you.
Also, “propaganda”. You keep using this word, i do not think it means what you think it means…

@Spoj
Thanks for the response.
Your comments definitely provide a contextual framework that i did not have before reading them.
However, I would argue that your comments, although informed, are mostly subjective opinion.
Whether your opinion and motivations are shared by others is irrelevant in face of the fact that they do nothing to discount or devalue the data that we do have.

EDIT: Hey, at some point should we stop arguing and just get to work on objectively acknowledging our class’ strengths and weaknesses and maybe even suggest improvements?
I dunno, maybe im crazy. You guys let me know what you think.

Maxzero.4032:

Cogbyrn.7283:

Garo.5304:

It’s because this forum is particularly obsessed with melee grade DPS. For some reason necros have to be able to do it to. If you win a fight even though the math says you’ll lose. The math is no longer valid.

I don’t think the math has ever said Necros will lose a fight. It just says that another class might win the fight faster.

Another class or another Icebow?

http://gw2dungeons.net/Records

Here are the GW2 dungeon speed records. What do you notice about the class representations? Every single group has at least two Elementalists. I wonder why?

You know what else is interesting?

THERE IS NOT A SINGLE NEW RECORD POST ICEBOW NERF.

Funny that.

I suspect that the site is going to become very stale since its going to be hard work trying to top speeds done by groups generating 80k dps per Ele abusing exploits.

Funny how you bring up a completely relevant point with observable data and it is immediately pettifogged and ignored…

@Clairenix.2780
I apologize if my post /rant came off as a personal attack in your direction.
I absolutely did not mean for it to come across that way.
Also, i don’t discount anyone’s research.
However, most of the player research is unfortunately devoid of the factual data and control necessary to formulate any real and meaningful conclusions. (I am of course largely referring to DPS comparisons here)
I say “most” because there are things that we do in fact know and much good has come from the examination and comparison of this real data.
What i discount is the rhetoric that we see being thrown around and “substantiated” by made-up information.

Hi @Spoj!
I am indeed ignorant, of many things, not just GW2.
Given that fact, i am always open and enthusiastic to learn.
I love to be proven wrong, when it leads me to greater understanding.
So i challenge you; provide context, right my misinterpretations and for the love of god educate me!
I am serious.
I respect your opinions, even when i don’t agree with them.

I am loving GS for PVE.
GS5>GS3>YaaW>DS4 will normally melt an entire pack of mobs.
Then just spam GD once or twice if there are any vets left over.

I’ve been using axe/focus for the second set but it’s underwhelming to say the least…

AngryBear.8741:

spoj.9672:

The anti meta propaganda is really getting tiring at this point. You do realise its now switched to a sinister meta for fractals?

But things have far from settled. So all this continued bull about the meta is no longer relevant. Please just let it go.

I think issue is more about how it came to some situation, not the situation itself. It is not important whether it was zerker meta, or sinister meta or whatever. The important thing is what created such atmosphere, because even though meta shifted, such mindset can repeat itself over and over again.

^^THIS

spoj.9672:

The anti meta propaganda is really getting tiring at this point. You do realise its now switched to a sinister meta for fractals?

But things have far from settled. So all this continued bull about the meta is no longer relevant. Please just let it go.

I agree Spoj.
It’s not relevant, never has been.
But unfortunately, it’s still a very real thing.
Just read the posts.
People recycling the same old false jargon…

Clairenix.2780:

[spoiler=SNIP]

[/spoiler]

Clairenix, i don’t mean to pick on you i just wanted to point out the biggest issue with necros right now and your post illustrates it perfectly.

The problem with necros, IS NOT with necros.

It is with the culture of misinformation, that is aggressively spread by a very vocal and very ignorant minority in this game.
It all revolves around this so called “Zerk Meta”.

I wont go into too many details here because its a dead horse that i just don’t have the energy to beat on right now.
But basically, the whole idea is that there is this small contingent of players who are VERY BAD at the game and have no idea how it actually works.
These players have essentially been spreading poor, misguided and ignorant “information” for the past 3 years regarding the necro and other classes in the game.
They say things like, “necro has no party support” “bear bow rangers pew pew” “X class has the best DPS” etc etc.
These players, by and large, have no idea how the classes actually work and more importantly they make claims which have no factual proof or evidence behind them.
Case in point, ANY person who tries to tell you about DPS numbers is flat out full of crap.
We have NO DPS tools in this game, disregard this propaganda.
These players run whichever classes/builds have been handed down by other ignorant players and the whole situation just perpetuates itself.

Unfortunately this particular contingent is very loud, and volume is how ignorance often tends to spread itself…

But the greatest tragedy comes when other players simply take these statements for granted and repeat them on forums like we are seeing here…
People literally repeating things they have heard with absolutely no understanding whatsoever…
This, is just plain lazy…

PLEASE, do NOT help to spread this propaganda.
Be aware of the fact that when you repeat these things, you are promoting a culture of ignorance, laziness, exclusivity, elitism and poor performance.
DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH,
KNOW YOUR CLASS,
MAKE YOUR OWN DECISIONS,
FORM YOUR OWN OPINIONS.

^^This
15chars…

Naustis.8510:

@Quarktastic
I do love when ppl thinks that Gravedigger is the only damage ability… U know that while casting Gravediggers, there are pets, dots and wells?
ATM good reaper can easily sustain 14-17k dps while being far more tanky than ele or engi, that means u can dps for longer than the aforementioned clases

Given the lack of a DPS tool, i can’t confirm or agree with any actual numbers.
However, I can certainly agree with your general statement that Reaper, and really any class for that matter, can sustain comparable DPS to other classes.
Aside from exploits and broken mechanics, i would imagine that this is probably one of the foundational priorities considered when designing and refining any class.
Just sayin’.

Soooo, then you don’t have a DPS meter?

Quarktastic.1027:

BoogerSammich.7189:

dace.8019:

Exos.3472:

And I cried… and cried… (20k dps)

Don’t fear the Reaper.

Yep, it pretty much went on like that for the last 50%.

25K GRAVE DIGGARZ!!!!!!!
kitten I love reaper.

25k gravediggers still only puts you at ~12.5k DPS….Which is leagues behind sinister engi or zerker ele. Hell, I think that’s barely on par with ranger DPS.

Still, reaper is tanky enough to unload more perfect rotations in real situations (i.e. where your target is actually trying to kill you) than eles, engis, or rangers.

Reaper is not going to become the next meta profession or anything, but it’s fun as hell and I’m enjoying it.

Oh, you have a DPS meter?
AWESOME! can i get it?

dace.8019:

Exos.3472:

And I cried… and cried… (20k dps)

Don’t fear the Reaper.

Yep, it pretty much went on like that for the last 50%.

25K GRAVE DIGGARZ!!!!!!!
kitten I love reaper.

New Map, “Bahamas” CONFIRMED for HoT living story patch.

^^This.
Trying to shoehorn ranged into your reaper build isn’t playing to the class design.
On a side note, i really wish axe didn’t suck lol.
Tired of carrying a dagger…

would it maybe be nice to have an immob outside of D3? maybe either on a utility or one of the GS skills? The chill/slow is nice but for a spec that emphasizes and really DEPENDS on impairing your enemies movement, at least an immob on a reasonable cooldown could go a long way.

^^Thread locking in 3,2,…

Yes, every class is viable.
Using the word “viable” is just silly.
Also, i have great respect for all of the people who put in work trying to figure out how these classes work, damage output, etc.
However, I see VERY few posts, guides, or “information” that does anything other than promote a particular person’s agenda.
This is from all sides of the argument.
Bottom line:
-We have no DPS tools, any conversation on this topic is merely speculation. albeit, often informed speculation, but speculation nonetheless.
-There is more to combat than DPS. Anyone who feels otherwise or simply does not acknowledge this fact is just not worth considering as a source of information or even conversation.
-Anyone who would either kick a player or flat out not accept a player to group based on speculation and 3rd party “information” is a bad, lazy player. A discerning person would be inclined to disregard this sort of person and their opinions.
-And finally, ALL classes are “viable”. ALL classes have their strengths and weaknesses. A GOOD team of GOOD PLAYERS, will put together a winning group with whatever you feel like bringing to the fight.

/RANT

Agreed^^
I feel like a harbinger of death when im smacking fools upside the dome with mah GRAAATESWORD!

#CITADELOFFARM
15chars

Yeah, i want to check out minions too as they are now much more resilient.
As a side note, I am ALWAYS solo since i moved to the west coast. (My friends are still on Eastern time) So if you see me in game feel free to hit me up. Ill run some Reaper Face Smashing Madness with you

Lol, yeah I’ve been running GS/A+F in general PVE/Maguuma leveling.
I have been having a BLAST.
Although, GS/A+WH might end up being a better option. I like the focus for the vuln and just the variety of playing an often overlooked weapon choice.
The axe gives you the ability to drop back when needed and builds your life for RS2 leap back into melee.
In my experience, reaper plays best as an “In your Face” juggernaut.
Play to it’s strengths and it really starts to shine!

Hi there!
I don’t want to sound rude but there are multiple threads here addressing all of the questions you are asking.
Poke around, you will see a ton of great opinions, builds, etc.

IMHO: Reaper > *
but that’s just me lol

^^this seems legit
I like using the focus just because it NEVER gets used lol. and just having different icons on my bar is a refreshing change.

yeah, i agree with Bhawb. it’s a skill you can spam on CD almost just for vuln upkeep and LF. No fanfair is necessary.

I main GS with A/F offhand in maguuma.
It’s kitten and a ton of fun!
The cleave is real and the crits are BANANAS.
As an aside, i rarely ever switch to axe unless i need to drop back to build LF or something but that’s not frequent.

@leinhart
I doubt what you describe is going to happen. I just had a terribly frustrating conversation with some “Meta Head” guildmates.
There is still a huge contingent of people in this game who, after all this time, still have no idea how the game works and who cling to the narrow strategy and party comp that we all know and love…
As an aside, is really a bad thing that our favorite class is getting some love and attention?
I love running around seeing all these “band wagon” reapers.
It’s like seeing someone wearing your favorite team’s jersey just because they won the championship. Sure, its a little disconcerting but it’s still my favorite team and i like seeing the jersey! lol

Reaper is amazing. LOVE IT.

I like Decimate and Dhuum simply because with Decimate we can have that awesome crit chance both in and out of shroud now.
Here is my current build attempt:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAR3dnMbCtbilbCu0A0bilfBLOJGFriUZhvwwCKpFA+AA-TBSBABbcQAoZ/BCeAAmpE8Klf4pbAT1fA4KAEA4A43fz3+G88zP/8zP3v/+7v/+bpAiYrF-e

This is what im thinking for PVE:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAR3dnMbCtbilbCu0A0bilfBLOJGFriUZhvwwCKpFA+AA-TBSBABbcQAoZ/BCeAAmpE8Klf4pbAT1fA4KAEA4A43fz3+G88zP/8zP3v/+7v/+bpAiYrF-e
Feel like there may be better runes though.