Guild Wars 2

Cecilia.5179:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Cecilia.5179:

Staff/gs druid is one of the most obnoxious specs to fight against. The #3 skill on staff should have a 30s cd. In exchange, the #2 and #4 skills need to be reworked, because they are extremely lackluster.
PU mesmer is also pretty terrible considering how bulky they are despite also being very good at escaping combat.
Warrior regen is too good. Their mobility is okay.
Thieves would still be able to escape with less escapability. I would like to see thieves get some work done on them, because they seem very reliant on bug exploits. They will be more fun to play with and against if they functioned better.

Thief being reliant on bug/exploit? Please explain

The sword jump teleport they removed, shadowstepping up specific corners to make getaways or surprise ganks, and angling the camera down to do more heartseekers through black powder. Those are not intentional.

Shadowstepping VERY often doesn’t work.(Try to shadowstep up/down a tower stairs, or anywhere near SM, i dare you)

Angling camera down doesn’t give that much of advantage.(for real when engage thief doesn’t have enough initiative to do all the shenanigans)

But if you want to fix these mechanics, go ahead i would love to have skills that work as it should. Don’t think these changes will change anything in the class and if do it’s for the better.(that’s if they fix stuff instead of just removing and nerfing)

Cecilia.5179:

Thieves would still be able to escape with less escapability. I would like to see thieves get some work done on them, because they seem very reliant on bug exploits. They will be more fun to play with and against if they functioned better.

I’m curious what bug exploit you speak of? only bug i know is the interaction of shadowstep X DH traps that are buggy, against thiefs.

Svarty.8019:

Divinorium.8952:

Because forget about thiefs having no support skills, being naturally squishy and having no access to shield/invul/aegis whatever. Lets remove mobility because no one should be mobile.

It’s your choice whether to build to be squishy or not, but I have yet to see a thief wearing PVT because incredible mobility plus invisibility plus giant spike MORE than makes up for it and that’s a problem.

No it’s not. No matter how much Vitality i chose to build i can’t have as much health than a Warrior.

No matter how much Toughness i get i will not get as much as defense/armour as one Heavy set user.

Giant spike? On thief? What year are you playing buddy?

PS: more than make up for what? Thief is in a horrible position in Spvp and in GroupVsGroup.
Only thing he can do somewhat well is roam. And that’s ONLY because of his mobility.

PS: In case you never had a thief and need someone to draw.
Warrior naked X exotic Dire(cond,Vit, toug) thief

Svarty.8019:

• Let us not forget that endless runaway also equals eternal chasing classes.
• This sort of superior mobility is of incredible usefulness in WvW.
• NOBODY should be faster or slower than anybody just because of the class they chose.

(Post contains personal opinions)

Then NOBODY should have access to more defense and have more health then others.
NOBODY should have access to more CC than others.
NOBODY should get more suport abilities than others.

In fac NOBODY should have a CLASS. lets all be gray blobs equal in everything.

Because forget about thiefs having no support skills, being naturally squishy and having no access to shield/invul/aegis whatever. Lets remove mobility because no one should be mobile.

@Xyppi Sorry i completely disagree with condi scaling with power. Like Yuffi said it would only create the hybrid build meta.

@Yuffi I really don’t believe Anet can just add a extra stat to the game. Maybe in the next expansion but right now that’s utopic to say that they need a new stat.

Like i said they need to either nerf condi damage.

I another note i never really got why Anet decided that +20% of flat critical(fury) or +750 of damage points (might) It’s a good idea. That creates a nightmare to balance.

They needs stats, and pets/thief/etc, scaling from the player’s stats.
so 25 of might = 25% more power/condi. 20% of fury = 20% of YOUR critical chance.

That would make things WAY easier to balance.

But as a immediate change a nerf in condition damage, 5~10%, is a good start.

Also anet need to STOP that come every 3 months to balance. They need to be way more active into balance. Or else a weak class/build/playstyle will stay weak for 1/4 of a month.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Most power builds don’t run full soldier, because there is much better gear available.

And why does it matter, if its a druid or dh or not? I thought, no power build is viable?

Druids and DH are not exactly balanced atm.
Hard to use something that’s broken as a concept to say that another think is alright.
Quite frankly Druids and DH can go full healers and would still kill ppl, hell they can go full naked and i still believe they would still kill ppl.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

At the moment ANY powerbuild that isn’t in the zerg boonsharing, that isn’t beserk or maruder aren’t viable. PERIOD.

Good to know, now go tell that to all the people complaining about bunker druids…

Maybe it’s the enemy servers, but all “bunkers” druid build i’ve been playing against and with are druids with dire to get that stack of bleed rolling.

Do you happen to be playing in 2013?

No i’m in the boonshare abuse meta.

And i googled for Druid buils, went to metabattle and youtube. There’s a SINGLE build using soldier stuff that’s a shout trooper that is meant to boonshare.

So unless one single guy is making everyone cry with a shaddy build, you should pay more attention to the enemy. Because they are using or Zerk/Marauders or dire/viper(cond)

Trust me, there is more than 1 person running that build. That is one of the most prevalent roaming builds at the moment. Along with durability rune warriors rocking about 3k armor on power builds, glassy hybrid mesmers, and perma dodge thieves (power and condi). The other builds you are likely to run into are scrappers and tempests who also both run bunkerish power builds and try to out sustain you because they no longer have decent spike damage.

Really the only players running full dire at the moment are thieves and old school PU mesmers, every other profession has stronger power builds.

yes said stats are : Marauder(power1, precis1, ferocity 0.5, vitality 0.5)
Commander(Power1,precis 1, tough 0.5, conc 0.5)
and viper(Power 1, cond damage1, prec 0.5, exp 0.5)

With viper being a TRUE glass cannon cond oriented set.

“but in the zerg they use X” in the zerg they stack boon and share. The 25stack of might and all the others buff make up for the lack of damage. But again that’s a problem of the boonshare meta.

Granted, i really am against not having/high limit to the number of ppl that can activate a single field for combo, what makes one single light combo a infinite cleasing area.

They need to limit the number of combofield interactions for the same number of Aoe interaction, but that’s a discussion to another topic.

Wait…. so you guys have problem with 8 bags? kitten?

I run around with 2 different(Dire/Zerk and soldier for zerg time) sets and 8 weapons(2 zerk pistols 2 for boss boss, 2 zerk daggers, condidagger+condipistol, zerk SB, cond SB, soldier SB and zerk sword)
+ food and nourishement(4 types of food)

You guys need to learn how to be organized, like for real.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

At the moment ANY powerbuild that isn’t in the zerg boonsharing, that isn’t beserk or maruder aren’t viable. PERIOD.

Good to know, now go tell that to all the people complaining about bunker druids…

Maybe it’s the enemy servers, but all “bunkers” druid build i’ve been playing against and with are druids with dire to get that stack of bleed rolling.

Do you happen to be playing in 2013?

No i’m in the boonshare abuse meta.

And i googled for Druid buils, went to metabattle and youtube. There’s a SINGLE build using soldier stuff that’s a shout trooper that is meant to boonshare.

So unless one single guy is making everyone cry with a shaddy build, you should pay more attention to the enemy. Because they are using or Zerk/Marauders or dire/viper(cond)

PS:

…
And you are really trying to say that soldier = dire? For real? maybe it’s because you are druid, and quite frankly druid and DH atm can’t be use as example of balance,…

Jim Hunter.6821:

Divinorium.8952:

At the moment ANY powerbuild that isn’t in the zerg boonsharing, that isn’t beserk or maruder aren’t viable. PERIOD.

Good to know, now go tell that to all the people complaining about bunker druids…

Maybe it’s the enemy servers, but all “bunkers” druid build i’ve been playing against and with are druids with dire to get that stack of bleed rolling.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Condi builds benefit less from going full glass, so usually zerk > sinister/viper. Many (not all) condi builds need more defensive stats than power builds to be somewhat viable, because they lack (burst) dmg, and/or defensive stats and traits compared to power builds.

And i already played a full soldier ranger and while it wasn’t optimal of course, it wasn’t completely trash either. Kinda compareable to dire ranger.

And regarding blocks, you don’t block condition ticks, you block condition application, which means, the whole dmg of the blocked condi attack will be negated. It is exactly the same as blocking a power attack.

Btw, only 2 (mesmer/necro) and 1/2 (thief) out of 9 classes are better going condi, the others are superior with power builds in most cases.

At the moment ANY powerbuild that isn’t in the zerg boonsharing, that isn’t beserk or maruder aren’t viable. PERIOD.

And you are really trying to say that soldier = dire? For real? maybe it’s because you are druid, and quite frankly druid and DH atm can’t be use as example of balance, but neither my warrior, thief, guard or engi was viable with soldier stats.
Now my thief and guard dire simply laugh at anything that’s powerbased.

And can’t burst? are you for real? my thief when i go FULL burst gets over 5k of poison in the enemy per tick, that + 1k of confusion and 1,5k of bleed means unless he clean he WILL die.

But again i don’t roll like that because the moment he cleans i will be in a tight spot.

“see cond….” the SAME happens with powerbuilds, if you go all in and get a invul you are dead. Difference being that with condi i don’t need to be all in while with power or you go all win or you will not kill the oponnent.

saerni.2584:

I have, it’s called a warrior.

And use a daredevil P/D(condition) as your sign. Yeah sure…. whatever you say mate.

saerni.2584:

Resistance is only one of many options. Durability Runes exist, incidentally, as well.

And yeah, you need to live long enough to kill the other player. If you are built more glassy then you have a good shot at it. Even “tanky” stats will take a lot of damage from glass. And if you are bunker and they are bunker, but you didn’t bring condition clears and they are condi…good luck because that is the counter to your tank build.

Condition players can take Sinister stats to do tons of extra damage through crit/power. Also glassy and gets the full damage of the conditions. Bonus damage too if their opponent doesn’t run any clears. Condition players build tanky because they are usually going to be jumped by several people, and that gives them time to react. Reaction time is the more valuable asset than increased damage.

Stop. just stop. you are being ridiculous.
" resistance for 1 second. (Cooldown: 20 seconds)"
1 sec = ONE tick of condi.
And point is: condi players only need to have one stat. cond damage.
That’s why they, like YOU said, can use viper and sinister and still be effective.
That’s the whole problem of condition. Only power in a power build means you will be laughed at. Now condition builds can roll condi and whatever he wants, because there’s no good way to mitigate it, it only REALLY needs a single stat, while it completely bypass toughness.

Now i challenge you to build a character with only power, without precision/ferocity.

Or even better make a character with only precision without power. Try it then come back.

PS: lets not forget that when you block 1 sec of power and the hit is 6k you blocked 6k one tick of condition = ONE tick that generally is 1/5 of the players actual damage. so yeah great counter.

saerni.2584:

It doesn’t bypass invulnerable or block. If you block or are invulnerable when the person used the skill that applied the conditions then it won’t apply conditions. Exceptions are unblockable attacks, of which there are a few.

Resistance is a defensive buff for for conditions…so your argument is clearly misleading on that point.

And finally, condi cleanse won’t make you invincible—your goal is to equip enough clears, resistance, and other defensive moves that you live long enough to apply the damage to kill the other player. You might be surprised if you dodged the right attacks at how few condi’s are applied.

Resistance is a “buff” that only 2~3 classes have access to.(don’t dare to come with convert chill or thief skill)

“live long enough to apply the damage to kill the other player.”
Except like i said condi builds only need to use one stat in it, so they will outlast power build. PERIOD.

That’s exactly why everyone uses that, except in zergs where boonsharing is abused, but that’s another issue.

“just dodge” yeah same works for powerbuild. Point is: There’s WAY more ways to stop/reduce damage from powebuilds than there’s to condis, that’s exactly why you and i use condi build. Easier to get my goals, kill the enemy.

Now lets stop pretending that cond is fine the way it’s right now.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

What did i said wrong?

I was specific about block and invul, neither block condi. All you know how to do is blab about reflect and that in fact gets the condition blocked, except when it isn’t a project, like half of the conditions in the game.

I say that because atm i’m playing condi thief and it’s almost sad how warriors try to use their invul against me while i just keep tossing conditions to him while he dies.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Repeating wrong arguments over and over again, doesn’t make them right …

So why you keep using these arguments?

Problem with condition is that it:
Bypass one of the two defensive stat, toughness.
Bypass most of defensive skills, yes block and invul are defensible skill that it bypass.
Bypass defensive buffs
Does as much damage than power build.

All that while you have to really investe in a single stat, cond damage, what let you get 2 stats for defense and the condi time as bonus.

“but condi cleanse” it doesn’t help much when the condi guy WILL outlast you and can easily reaply another condition.
And i’m not even talking about how some classes have almost no viable condi clear.

It need to get it’s damage cut by a good % as a simplest way to fix it or increase the damage that power builds does, and the offensive stat not the defensive.

Right now there’s no reason to go most of the powerbuilds, let alone zerk stats. Why use a attack that’s mitigated by everything when you can go condi?

If you are going to merge anything, you better merge the other server on us.

No way in the hell i’m trading Gate of Madness for anything else, Dragonbrand? Stormbluff isle?, Sea of Sorrows? wth is that? The burned, the liars and the guys asking for help (SoS).

Gate of Madness FOREVER!

PS: Sea of Madness could work but still not there.

As a player that came back from before HoT.
It helped ALOT by reducing the impact of the night crew in the score. But the biggest problem, imo, still there: You log in at the start of the day to have to deal with your side of the map tier 1 and the other side on the hand of a single server fully upgraded with tier 3.

It’s not fun to have to start every single day with a handcap for 1~2 hours because your keep is made of paper and the enemy can just send a 10 man team to sneak cap your keep while you are out of yourside of the map.

I would suggest a full reset at a specific time, preferable voted by players from the server, so at that time when your team capture your own keep it instantly get raised to tier 3.

PS: the instant upgrade should only happen ONCE per day, with the timer resetting at a hour that the active wvww players of the server vote. So if your server’s prime time start a 5PM you get your keep at 5 PM and can start your climb back from there, instead of the old get Keep> defend> upgrade the 2 inner towers> start the agression to enemy side

PS2: maybe increasing the numbers to 6,5,4 instead of 3,2,1 may be a good thing. It may be ALOT better for players to log in an see their world losing 600 -400 than losing 300 -100

The difference still the same but the way players deal with it may change.

DeceiverX.8361:

The new stats are not available to users without HoT. It’s crafted using HoT-only recipes or HoT-only rewards. ANet no longer cares about you if you don’t have HoT. Everything is full-HoT.

That’s pretty much why so many people (who no longer play and/or played competitively in WvW) hated on the expansion and still do; it absolutely broke the game with the amount of power creep it brought.

I’m hording materials for the next expansion already because I’m just going to assume they’ll release gear with another 40% more stats on it.

Just gave up in the game. The powercreep is ridiculous. Not fun trying to fight classes that have 8 buffs up without doing kitten, while you struggle to, try to, do something.

No wonders even with the links and Megaserver the game is a ghosttown, anet is sure doing a hell of kittenty job.

I guess legion here i go.

DeceiverX.8361:

I came up with something so absurd recently I’m unwilling to post it, share it, or even play it. It pretty much would get backstab nerfed if enough people caught on for how much damage it can do and how few sacrifices are made.

Blaq and Eval (two thiefy guildmates of mine) have come up recently with some very solid builds in terms of stat performance and overall strength. I still prefer raw power over ferocity since I personally believe it makes builds more consistent and thus better killers, but your mileage will likely vary depending on what you do, what weapons you use, and how you play in WvW.

So…. i went hunting for mauder stuff and since i didn’t found, it’s possible to get Marauder ascended trinkets without HoT? I mean i didn’t find how to get aside from a HoT achievement reward.

And if it’s really that i’m not sure how i feel about it, i mean Marauder have a whole 40% more stats than the stuff i have…..

DeceiverX.8361:

If you’re in sPvP, use Marauder trinket, instead. The Berserker trinket is a poor performer across the board and marauder has more stat points on it by a substantial margin, because HoT.

I’m on WvW. And should i go for for entire marauder set or just change some parts and what parts?

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Divinorium.8952:

I’m curious.
Is Thief, not daredevil, viable build at all?

Tried D/D, P/P, S/P and now i found a somewhat “success” with Power D/P.

I’m coming back at the game after some time and while i wasn’t a brilliant player i think i was at least solid and nowadays i feel like anything that has a special class(like dareveil) just beat the crap out of me doesn’t matter what i use.

All that for WvW.

Core thief is still very Viable I use it all the time in All game modes, P/P is viable as well as D/P being the better set the S/X are viable as well but are more punishing.

In spvp I run pure Zerker Core thief using Da/Tri/Cs to great effect

I run full zerk. And biggest problem i’m having is that for some reason most of the new classes are tanky and give a crap ton fo damage, agains me full zerk.

I taking damage was like this before but now it seens like i don’t have enough damage to bring them down and when they are close of dying they just pop a invul and get the way out of me while i try to chase them with my 3 and that can go in on literally forever .(invul > heal > dodge> Aegis/invisi > invul > heal > dodge > ….)

It seens like even when i outplay them the odds still in their favor due my lack of CC.

I’m curious.
Is Thief, not daredevil, viable build at all?

Tried D/D, P/P, S/P and now i found a somewhat “success” with Power D/P.

I’m coming back at the game after some time and while i wasn’t a brilliant player i think i was at least solid and nowadays i feel like anything that has a special class(like dareveil) just beat the crap out of me doesn’t matter what i use.

All that for WvW.

I don’t even play the game anymore, but keep the good job Anet.

It’s always worth to check for new patchs for a good laugh.

The change i’ve said 1 or 2 months ago:

Add a new dismissing mechanic in stealth.

How?

The first time you go in stealth by any mean you gain one stack of the “debuff”.
The debuff last 10 secs.
When you go stealth again you have half the time.
If you go again you have half of the half.
Every time you gain one stack of this debuff it refresh the old ones.

So as example:
Go stealth: 3 secs.
Go again: 1,5. secs
go again: 0,75 secs
Go again: 0,4 sec.
Go again: 0,4. sec
(it needs to have a limit)

Until when it’s not viable aside from using it to make your dps higher (using Backstab in a boss)

It would end the bullkitten of perma-stealth. What’s completely broken. While not hitting hard others playstyles of thiefs.

And for who defend Perma-stealth. It’s a broken mechanic because it’s fun for the guy using it. while it’s at the best boring to everyone else.

This explain WHY it’s a bad mechanic.

PS: Make Stealth a choice. Let the thiefs think “i should use that to begin the battle in a better position? To make my damage bigger? to burst ppl down? save it to a escape if needed?”
Not just “lol stealth, attack, lol stealth, attack, lol stealth, attack. lol stealth, realize will lose the combat, lol stealth, flee”.

Let me see if i got it right.
You are in a small group, in the open,fight a zerg that is 2~3x times your size lose and complain?

DUDE really? AC is great for defense and allows small groups to beat bigger groups WHEN DEFENDING. As it should be.

If we had a siege that allows small group kill zergs just because it “can” the game would end in a “who has more siege wins”.

Right now the problems that need to be fixed and is something that i’ve been calling since the kittening beta is: You Die, got finished after being downed, you should respawn at the primary WP of your team, the one you respawn when you enter the W3.

Why? Because right now the team who has more “numbers” can keep it’s position virtually forever.
Someone got killed? revive him.
As the game is unless you completely wipe the enemy team, what renders in no player to revive, you not even hurt the enemy zerg.

That’s what need to be changed. Got yourself killed? Respawn at WP instantly.

It would fix the “dead spies” and it would give a better position for team that actually works together.

Khandarus.2738:

Divinorium.8952:

So you stealth once you get 3/4 secs if you stealth with this condition you get 1,5/2. if you stealth again you win 0,75/1.

That’s how you “fix” thiefs. Not by placing a, useless, trap or by nerfing our damage to the ground.

Sure I’ll take that, if Shadow Refuge gives me all the time in stealth right away. And they take Last Refuge out of the game completely.
It’s not up to me to decide that.

Make Last refuge doesn’t be affected by this condition.
And this change is EXACTLY to limit the amount of time a thief can be stealthed why give 12/16 secs of stealth like it’s nothing is a good idea for you? Maybe a change to give 5/6 secs of isntantly stealth while having a longe CD is fine, but instant 12/16 secs is just trolling.

Edit :Just rephrasing.

PS: I think changing Last Refugee for something more usefull would be better too =p

Anet never test nothing, PLEASE make a test server before putting something in the game.

Anti stealth trap is good to stop portal bomb. But it’s not really useful against thiefs. Why? 1 shadow step and i’m out of the trap range, gg. AND it costs 15 badges, anyone using it to kill a thief is true moron.

Anet needs to implement a dismissing mechanic in stealth.

Something along the lines: “A condition that last 10 secs and cut new stealth timers in half.”

So you stealth once you get 3/4 secs if you stealth with this condition you get 1,5/2. if you stealth again you win 0,75/1.

The condition should stack in power and every new stack refresh the timer of the last.

This will bring the thief’s survivability back in line. Since we (i main thief.) will be losing “a lot” of our surviability. we would probably need a buff against more tanky builds.

That’s how you “fix” thiefs. Not by placing a, useless, trap or by nerfing our damage to the ground.

In the last hours of match the NS tried a new kinda of tactic…

I’m not sure how much they paied for that but wasn’t enough.

I have to say that kinda of trick is low and damage the image of your server…

Having that said here’s the proof:

Using the overgrowth grub will not make you guys win durius =p

haviz.1340:

Divinorium.8952:

Longer CD when their counterparts are specced for it.

Check you hammer cooldowns again and with 2nd weapon. Stop comparing 1 weapon set to 4 attunements. Unless 40s < 30s and 45s < 30s and other seemingly magical math properties exist.

And from my first post:
“Hitting 1,2k in normal hits, when most of the dps builds hit 2k at best? check.”

It’s zvz, damage is boosted to incredible amount thanks to food, other buffs and much more stats from gear. Dps builds in that game mode hit for much more. Bunkers hit for so much because they stack mights. I don’t see you crying on engy forum about hgh builds which are even better at that.

You aren’t top tier in one point? OH GOD HOW YOU WILL PLAY LIKE THAT! You only have Survive, mobility, support and CC in your favor…. Oh GOD.

You’re overdramatizing now. If you have anything productive to add, it’s often wise to express that without writing whole sentence in capital letters.

And i’m not comparing the 2 weapon of a ele. And unless i lost something in the way 8 CC with 40 secs of CD > 4 of 30.

Eng doesn’t have Top tier in all the others points with the same build

And the overdamatization was to show how stupid your post was.
“I have score 5/5 in Survive, mobility, CC and support but i only have score 3/5 in Dps that makes me completely fine.”

REALLY?

PS:

So you’re just baselessly saying this because you don’t like how instant cast skills work? Not liking it doesn’t make it an exploit, and if all classes have them, it’s not unfair. It’d be pointless to have an instant cast skill if they interrupted other actions. They’d just be 1/4sec activation skills if that’s what anet wanted.

Baseless? Sure. funny how warrior has skills that are “instant” there’s no cast in most of their gap close and still stop action. But who i’m to say that a bug exploider is a bug exploider right?

GrandmaFunk.3052:

Divinorium.8952:

A “Commander” strategist will have followers until he fails for the first time.
A “Commander” leader will have followers through the hell and back.

The requeriments to be a Commander is before anything else be a leader, strategist is a trait you can include in your council.

The more I read your posts, the more I think you have very little WvW experience.

Commanders don’t have councils and advisers, they have to be able to function solo: you get on a map, assess the situation and if a commander is needed, you toggle your tag, pull ppl to you and start getting stuff done.

The dynamic you describe is certainly possible in WvW… but it’s something you won’t encounter during the majority of a match.

No that’s what differs a effective W3 commander from a random PVE commander.
If you don’t have ppl to take advice from you only have one point of view while this point hold your own pride.

But i don’t think you actually got to play with a strong W3 guild neither with a good commander.

GoM in the early days had both, so i know what i’m saying.

PS: if a commander enters the W3 alone without support of his own crew/party he will fail when faced against any organized force.

In fact A competent commander have knowledge of all the parties in the map.
And give order like “party X and Y attack camp Z while we hold the enemy here”

If you enter a map and don’t know who are in your side in the map, don’t have scouts and don’t know what exactly the enemy is doing you aren’t a effective commander.

You are taking actions based on swords in the map and probably giving order like “group on me so we will zerg rush X place”

@Havvik and Grandma

No. he don’t.
“Why?”
Because a good leader, like i’ve said,naturally ppl with potential around him.
And more important he HEAR what these ppl have to say.

If a leader is leading his troops over a cliff the guys around him will warn him and he will make his troops turn around.

I say that for my own experience.

I played Ragnarok Online for 8 years. 7 of these years was with the same leader.

I got to know this guy when his guild had 40 players and when they never actually “captured” a castle, the main goal of this game’s Guild X Guild event.

I was/am the kind of players that want to know “everything” about the game to use this knowledge as a advantage. Using this knowledge i adviced this guy.

From 40 players we went to the wooping number of 450 players. And being the only guild in our server, it was a private with around 3k , that made the “full lock” it means taking all the 25 castles in the game and ending the battle time with it.

What this means?
His tactis were and are crappy ones.
But even with that ppl still fighting for him and eventually another ppl, with better knowledge, joined him.
I myself before joining the guild had my own with 30 players. I sometimes got a castle and we often beat his guild.

But again i was the “commander” strategist. In the WoE my guild did bad we got down to 12 players. While his guild, even not being the strongest in the world were growing.

I went there and discovered the difference between a strategist and a Leader. And why the guy that has the shinie armor and everyone see at the guys making the moves
need to be a Leader, not a strategist.

For most part of the battles i and the council of the clan were calling the moves. But he was the guy making ppl do.

That were made even more clear one time i lead the guild by myself when he couldn’t play. Even calling the same moves i did when he was online ppl just didn’t made it “right” they ignored half of the orders and things like that.

A “Commander” strategist will have followers until he fails for the first time.
A “Commander” leader will have followers through the hell and back.

The requeriments to be a Commander is before anything else be a leader, strategist is a trait you can include in your council.

PS: Clan and guild are the same thing.
And WoE is “War of emperium” the Guild X Guild event in this game.

Rob.7624:

Divinorium.8952:

That’s why i HATE the commanders system in this game. This puts a bunch of PVE players in the place to command a PVP group.(pve because the only kinda of player i see throwing down 30 g like it’s nothing or is a bot or a 100% farmer)

I haven’t played PvE since I farmed my tag in Orr during the first weeks of this game.
And I’ve commanded daily, almost totally solidly for 8months. Which doesn’t make me good by any means. But I do know my stuff.

Even if people who WvW hardcore bought commanders tags they’d still be bad commanders. Fact. Playing WvW and Commanding and both very different.

Just because you think you can WvW doesn’t mean you can command to any standard. That is something that I myself hate to read. You need to be intelligent to become a good commander. Strong mathematics and a good memory are required, if you can’t count/forget a camp is on a buff. Then your zerg gun’die.
Play some RTS games and even Chess mixed with map reading (even a bit of PR helps too).
Essentially. Be a gamer whos dabbled in all the genres. I doubt you could sit here and tell me you meet those requirements perfectly. Infact, very few people can. And thats why we have few really, REALLY Good Commanders who do it all right.

Yes “PvE Commander Super Stars” (this is their full title please us it) come into WvW and strut around thinking they are good. But they leave very quickly.
My advice to all and anyone is to recognize good commanders and just join their squad.
If you server has no good commanders, leave your server and join NSP, we have a few floating around somewhere.

Other than that join a European server.
NA Commanders < Euro Commanders.

No in fact, to be a good commander you need to be a leader. Not a strategist.
That’s why every single leader in the world have a council to take advice from.

Saying “I play RTS i know how to be a commander” is ridiculous. A commander is the guy who make ppl do the things when it needs to be done. Not the guy who thinks what need to be done, if a commander has that trait is a plus not a requiriment.

A commander is different of a “master in the RTS”. in a RTS you say they do. In GW2 you need to convince ppl to do so.

The problem with PVE commanders are they don’t hear who have more experience in W3.
So even making the zerg work. It ends being pointless because they, more then often, keep attacking a target with no tactical importance and never give up/hear others players because of his pride.

In fact all the VERY GOOD “leaders” i’ve met in my life were always using opinion of other ppl over his own opinion.

Leadership is not about knowing how to do things. Is about to recognizing and knowing who know how to do things.

A commander is a leader. Nothing more, nothing less.

And what you described is a strategist.

haviz.1340:

Divinorium.8952:

Being the “Jack of all trades” is ok. Being “jack of all trades” while being top tier in every single point isn’t.

Those cc, survivability and team support skills have much longer cooldown than their counterparts. And I really don’t see how eles are top tier in damage department. The bunker build is (hopefully was) overpowered but I have yet to see complains about ele dps (before launch that is).

Longer CD when their counterparts are specced for it.

And from my first post:
“Hitting 1,2k in normal hits, when most of the dps builds hit 2k at best? check.”

You aren’t top tier in one point? OH GOD HOW YOU WILL PLAY LIKE THAT! You only have Survive, mobility, support and CC in your favor…. Oh GOD.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Just about every time I’ve logged in this weekend, we’ve owned SM. Obviously, Zombieland is doing something right. Besides… this story is lacking some details. Was that tower upgraded? A fully fortified Wildcreek is an absolute nightmare to deal with. Was anyone else working on SM at the time? A golem rush on a tough tower while a separate group takes down a wall-less paper SM is a good play.

At any rate, calling them out on the forums is no good. Just send them a whisper if you don’t agree with a plan. They might be seeing something you don’t, or vice versa.

No they don’t. In fact we normally capture SM when the GoM commanders are on, Knighpiepoe, or something like that, and The Old Spartan in especial.

While i witnessed they leaving because the moment we get SM 4 commanders pop in the mid of castle and begin to give strange orders like “attacking Durius while SM, with normal gates/walls, is being trebbed from Klovan”

Yesterday we captured SM, had ppl running supplies, 80% of the upgrade completed.
Our outter walls were down, and we called for help.(had like 15 players there)

We had every thing to hold SM, we had sieges inside lord room and upgrade would be going up in 5 minutes.
They gave orders to abandon SM and attack Meldon that were being taken 1 minute before.

Their explanation: it would be “easy” to take back SM.

They ended wasting 30 minutes on that in the mean time we lost SM and Anzalia. they lost more 30 minutes to take back anzalia and went to to enemy land to be wiped 10 times in a row without taking a single tower.
Went to SM and got wiped 5 times did this kittenty golem rush taking only one tower, and immediatly losing it after that because they didn’t defend.

After that one commander log out and the other ppl just didn’t follow his orders anymore.

From 310 points per tick we went to 200 because of them.(yes. it’s their fault because they just pop up commander when we already have commanders, 2 commanders giving completely different orders will never work)

They don’t do separate play. Their average plan for what i’ve seen is: throw players and sieges at the enemy, if it doesn’t work throw more.

I don’t think they are a good thing to GoM.

When i asked them wtf they were doing they answer with a “Shhhh GoM learn to play”
followed by a “you don’t like what we are doing? buy a commander for yourself”.

That’s why i HATE the commanders system in this game. This puts a bunch of PVE players in the place to command a PVP group.(pve because the only kinda of player i see throwing down 30 g like it’s nothing or is a bot or a 100% farmer)

This only ends in pathetic results.

In fact i’m kinda of tired of seeing commanders with legendaries that never upgrade towers/keeps. it’s almost funny how the “normal” players who doesn’t have legendaries/money to waste are the ones who actually do that.

PS: By any means or forms “Zombie Land” is a W3 guild. They don’t play like one. They don’t act like one, they don’t have the skills of one.

I Do agree with Pve Players helping at W3, but when they are the ones “calling the moves” you will end being flanked, out maneuvered and killed.
You will see a commander + 30 players waiting to the end of the Invencibility of a NPC end when it has more 4 minutes to go.
You will see a group of players trying to do a “blitzkrieg” using catas instead of rams.

That’s the problem we have right now. We have a bunch of “good players” and “good commanders”. but very few “good W3 players” and even fewer “leaders”.

haviz.1340:

Every weapon set of ele will have loads of cc, survivability and team support because that’s the whole design of ele, be jack of all trades.

Last thing, I wouldn’t really evaluate balance by proffesions’ performance in zvz, that game mode is completely imbalanced with mostly pvers playing it.

Being the “Jack of all trades” is ok. Being “jack of all trades” while being top tier in every single point isn’t.

Navzar.2938:

Divinorium.8952:

Using bad codding to teleport while casting, when the fact if you walk it stops? Check.

I’m going to nitpick this one because it bothers me. How in the world is burning a stun breaker in order to land an attack not fair? That’s a fairly large cost, and all instant cast skills like mesmer’s blink, or thief’s steal can do this.

They can and it’s alike unfair. That’s bug exploide and shouldn’t be in the game for any profession.

TheGuy.3568:

If you are going to post a WvW video of good play then post one where you finish off target and get kills in while holding your ground

Yeah sure… “hold your ground” when outnumbered.

I could have stopped here and just ignore your opinion since you are a noob. but lets go.

TheGuy.3568:

What does thief at launch have to do with this?

Because it was the same state as Elementalist right now. GOD Mode.
And for your sign you have a thief, guess you changed to ele because it got “too hard” right?

TheGuy.3568:

You should have read what said instead of getting angry about DD ele. That was simply a kitten example of DD ele being op and a bad example of out numbered fighting. You took it as a platform to criticize DD I merely criticized the video. Learn the difference. There are a number of complaint threads. Choose one and rant away.

No it IS a good example that just show the potential of a elementalist even in the hands of “not the best player over here”

TheGuy.3568:

BTW “lots” is a relative term. Hammer warrior has “lots” of CC. Guardian has “lots” of support skills. Thief has “lots” survivability potential. Thief, ranger, and warrior all have “lots” of mobility. You need to compare skills cross class or your analysis is garbage. Understand? BTW you mean “DD” ele staff would argue with what you just posted.

Let’s go by parts:

TheGuy.3568:

BTW “lots” is a relative term. Hammer warrior has “lots” of CC.

D/D Element has:
1 – Churning earth.
2 – Earthquake – Hard CC – Knock down
3 – Magnetic Grasp – Hard CC – Immo
4 – Ring of Earth
5 -Updraft – Hard CC – Blowout/knockdown
6 – Shocking Aura – Defensive hard CC -Stun
7 – Frist Aura
8 – Frozen Burst

Hammer war has:

1 – Earthshaker – Hard CC – Stun
2 – Backbreaker – Hard CC – Knock down
3 – Staggering Blow – Hard CC – Knock down
4 – Hammer Shock

TheGuy.3568:

Thief has “lots” survivability potential.

No they don’t, once he is CC he is pretty much dead. The fact he can out maneuver you doesn’t mean he can survive your attacks.

Ele has:
1 – Lightning Flash – Stun Breaker
2 – Cleansing Fire – Stun breaker
3 – Mist Form – Invul AND Stun breaker
And others forms of shields that mitigate damage but i’m not going to post because it will make the post way too long

TheGuy.3568:

Guardian has “lots” of support skills.

Not going to argh here Guardians are the kings of supports skills BUT when specced for it.

TheGuy.3568:

Thief, ranger, and warrior all have “lots” of mobility.

Ranger? are you sure? Still: right now Ele D/D outmaneuver both thief, ele can have have swift almost 100% of time, and Warrior, Ele has better/more teleports. not going to post what you know.

And you see something funny? Not a single profission enter in the rank of “good” at more than one point. While D/D Ele is as good, if not better as the top tiers profissions.

TheGuy.3568:

If you are going to post a WvW video of good play then post one where you finish off target and get kills in while holding your ground . Rewatch the video and take your complaints to another thread. the point of posting a WvW video is about showing good play with bad odds of winning. What saw there wasn’t that. It doesn’t matter what class your on those are the basics.

If you actually paied attention at the video His server were doing 270 and 310 points. that’s the amount of points a leader do.
If his server is doing the biggest chunk of points 5 players holding 20 at their camp IS A FREAKING GOOD TACTIC. You are actually cutting the power to fight back of them.

TheGuy.3568:

finish off target and get kills

TheGuy.3568:

Also I think you mis-counted that “20” for most of the video.

3:00 Min > ahead of the video. you will see the numbers of enemies and the enemies dead.

Dude seriously. Did you ever played W3? Most of the times you don’t get to finish off the guy you are attacking, but your team do.

Get out of the Spvp learn a bit how to play. THEN come back.

I play since the beta for GoM but i never felt so ashamed before.
Not even when ppl called us of hackers, when some kitten actually did it, neither when we fell to the last tier.

But HoD’s players that transfered to GoM Achieved something i’ve never seen before.

They went in the keep and builded 21 Alpha golems, yes you didn’t read wrong it was 21. (will wait for someone who got the SS to post here, i’m sure someone did)
AND 2 Omega golems.
That’s 31 gold JUST in the golems bluesprint.

They left the Keep and attacked: Wild Creek Post.

And was about that. they managed to lose 16 golems IN ONE kittenING TOWER, WHEN SM had Outter walls down and normal gates.

That’s such a high level of inability, that i’m pretty sure they deserve a prize for that.

And one of these “highly skilled” commander asked why no one, after this ****, was following his order.

A real big salute to the players of “Zombie Land” that for a random reason have “WvW” tag but pls transfer back for HoD.

If i could i would trade all of you guys for 3 NPCs guards for our keep.

Not even funny.

TheGuy.3568:

Divinorium.8952:

Hitting 1,2k in normal hits, when most of the dps builds hit 2k at best? check.

I really think you missed the green arrows.

Above all that I saw CE not connecting lots of good team work and very little scrimmaging on the part of the ele. On top of that I saw no focus on the DD by mobile classes like warrior and thief (or any class for that matter). I saw very little burst and even less downing enemies. The video is mostly harassing and escaping vs WvW owning. Even then they had guild buffs I saw very burst getting out.

On top of all that there were only a hand full of immobilizes ans nearly 0 chase by the enemy.

Now I know this is supposed to be impressive and show how OP DD ele is but ali I saw was a class that can’t connect DPS and enemies not chasing and the ones who did “chase” being up leveled.

Even among the many DD ele 1vx videos I can’t call this good. I am not trying to insult the OP but if it aint good don’t post it that’s the general rule. With the exception of the 2 or 3 times you Mistform + ER this type of play wont be changing and noting I sa there was worth nerfing.

You are D/D Ele Main. Didn’t get that even being highly outnumbered and CCed they had no chance to actually finish him.

He coulnd’t land a solid combo and kill 20 players when his own group is only 5 and you think it’s a issue?

There’s no classe in the game that could have done that. And 2, mesmer and thiefs, that could have Escaped these situation.

And guess what? both have very limited Aoe damage, one has almost no support abilities and other relies in a easy to find the real one mini-game.

Elementalist right now has:
Lots of CC.
Lots of team support skills.
Lots of survivability potential.
Lots of mobility on top of that.

And a average easy damage, read auto-attacks and poorly used skills, and one of the highest damage when he can land a solid combo.

All that in the same kittening build without changing a single skill.

If you don’t see a problem in that i guess you want the thief of when the game launched back.

Nice video… but just show why elementalis bunker are the “OP” right now.
Crap load of CC? Check.
Crap Load of Stun break? Check.
Crap load of Mobility skills? Check.
Using bad codding to teleport while casting, when the fact if you walk it stops? Check.
Hitting 1,2k in normal hits, when most of the dps builds hit 2k at best? check.

Fun video but it shows clearly why Elementalist are being nerfed/will be.

PS: the main problem with elementalist is that they have “a crap load of everything”

Every time i read “WvW” in a patch note this song begin to play in inside of my head.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oavMtUWDBTM

It’s just me?

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

Divinorium.8952:

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

Divinorium.8952:

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

obastable.5231:

being on hod, i can confirm that you are deliberately being double teamed. my hubby has a stash of screenies of various commanders telling people to stop attacking gom because we are apparently working together.

<- this persons guild does not approve of the situation

Please contact me in-game. I would like to have those screenshots please.
The ONLY way for HoD and GoM to reclaim their merit is to name and shame those commanders which did this.

And GoM please consider the following. you team up with the winning server, higher pop server, which is already on its way to t6… leaving you behind in t7…with us… and i can promise you. It will not be fun for you.

MIMIMI you are only not saying that in the first 3 hours of match you guys did exactly the same.

You are going to deny that in the first 3 hours both HoD and NSF only attacked the GoM side?(not kidding not even their supply camps was hit)

yes, im actually coding the video from last night right now shows us running between WC and QL the whole time And us eventually taking anz and if im not mistaken mendons? or that could have been this morning, i forget :/ And thank you very much for the tactic compliment.

And just to be clear. Good for HoD for getting the transfers! I could care less about them zerging with 80 players, i just don’t like the teaming up that we’ve been hearing about all morning. But hey, i’ve calmed down and taken it as a compliment, 2v1=automatic win no matter what the score is XD

This morning.
You guys weren’t attacking HoD at a point that you left them build 10+ golems, we have report of 25 like i’ve said.

That’s “at least” 1000 supplies. A full camp can hold 250 supplies if maxed and generate 10 supplies every 30 secs. Let’s say they had 2 camps maxed and used supplies from both. It means 1000 – 500 supplies = 500/10 (amount of times the camp need to generate) 50/2(one minute = 2 ticks in supplies) 25/2( 2 camps) = 12,5 minutes.

But they hadn’t 2 camps maxed because you guys were attacking them right? so it would take 20 mins + just to build the golems.

So you guys left them without being touched for AT LEAST 12 min. Because you guys didn’t seen the golems being build.

Yeah… sure you guys were putting a hell of effort hitting HoD. We were doubleteamed and didn’t lose our keep you guys did. deal with it.

Edit: Just explainning/fixing the math

Hard to argue with all that maths!

EDIT: Just for my own vanity/pride sake, while we were on. the keep did not fall.. HoD got to inner with the ungodly number of golems, but we killed them all, then picked off the GoM stragglers trying to come back inside. But alas it was 5 am for me and late for others in the guild, so after 5 hours of killing (and dying-klovan…HOW MANY CATS DO YOU NEED??!) we went to bed

Dunno the attack in klovan wasn’t planned at all… In fact i wasn’t there. Gno was leading this attack while i and others players were upgrading/scouting the map so we didn’t get caught off-guard.

PS: By “the attack in klovans wasn’t planned”. Is that the plan was to attack the camp and stick there. But apparently you guys didn’t come in enough numbers to take it back and they decided to push to klovan. They brought the tower to 50% health when they got wipped then they kept pressing until it fell.

I mean we weren’t going to hit the tower, so we didn’t took the camp and rushed the tower, with 0 defenders because of the speed. So it gave you guys more than enough time to build your defenses there.

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

Divinorium.8952:

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

obastable.5231:

being on hod, i can confirm that you are deliberately being double teamed. my hubby has a stash of screenies of various commanders telling people to stop attacking gom because we are apparently working together.

<- this persons guild does not approve of the situation

Please contact me in-game. I would like to have those screenshots please.
The ONLY way for HoD and GoM to reclaim their merit is to name and shame those commanders which did this.

And GoM please consider the following. you team up with the winning server, higher pop server, which is already on its way to t6… leaving you behind in t7…with us… and i can promise you. It will not be fun for you.

MIMIMI you are only not saying that in the first 3 hours of match you guys did exactly the same.

You are going to deny that in the first 3 hours both HoD and NSF only attacked the GoM side?(not kidding not even their supply camps was hit)

yes, im actually coding the video from last night right now shows us running between WC and QL the whole time And us eventually taking anz and if im not mistaken mendons? or that could have been this morning, i forget :/ And thank you very much for the tactic compliment.

And just to be clear. Good for HoD for getting the transfers! I could care less about them zerging with 80 players, i just don’t like the teaming up that we’ve been hearing about all morning. But hey, i’ve calmed down and taken it as a compliment, 2v1=automatic win no matter what the score is XD

This morning.
You guys weren’t attacking HoD at a point that you left them build 10+ golems, we have report of 25 like i’ve said.

That’s “at least” 1000 supplies. A full camp can hold 250 supplies if maxed and generate 10 supplies every 30 secs. Let’s say they had 2 camps maxed and used supplies from both. It means 1000 – 500 supplies = 500/10 (amount of times the camp need to generate) 50/2(one minute = 2 ticks in supplies) 25/2( 2 camps) = 12,5 minutes.

But they hadn’t 2 camps maxed because you guys were attacking them right? so it would take 20 mins + just to build the golems.

So you guys left them without being touched for AT LEAST 12 min. Because you guys didn’t seen the golems being build.

Yeah… sure you guys were putting a hell of effort hitting HoD. We were doubleteamed and didn’t lose our keep you guys did. deal with it.

Edit: Just explainning/fixing the math

Spets the MilkBandit.9031:

obastable.5231:

being on hod, i can confirm that you are deliberately being double teamed. my hubby has a stash of screenies of various commanders telling people to stop attacking gom because we are apparently working together.

<- this persons guild does not approve of the situation

Please contact me in-game. I would like to have those screenshots please.
The ONLY way for HoD and GoM to reclaim their merit is to name and shame those commanders which did this.

And GoM please consider the following. you team up with the winning server, higher pop server, which is already on its way to t6… leaving you behind in t7…with us… and i can promise you. It will not be fun for you.

MIMIMI you are only not saying that in the first 3 hours of match you guys did exactly the same.

You are going to deny that in the first 3 hours both HoD and NSF only attacked the GoM side?(not kidding not even their supply camps was hit)

We had some moronic commander trying to PUSH while being double sided. I bashed him in map chat, and as 90% of the guys who have commander title he was a child and ragequitted.

At a point we owned only our keep while HoD was using trebs from Bravost.
NSP broke our front gate and was in the inner circle. We were outmannerd, i counted 30 ppl in the keep, and we still didn’t fall.

In fact for about 2 hours we hadn’t a commanders so we agreed in just taking what was in our side and upg it.( you can’t be picky when you have 30 players against 150 in each side.

We did and we blocked NSP at hyleaks/Quentin Post. In fact Quentin and our keep was the only things we spend money.(both in up and sieges to defend)

Because we hadn’t numbers to defend anything else. HoD kept hittind the other side, and we send groups to take it back. until the moment they stopped attacking us and after 10 mins a scout, we had players around the map to know what was happening, reported a mob of golems, he told that was about 25, was going to hit SM.

SM fell you guys begun to fight between themself and we got time to breath and upgrade our side, while having the outmanned buff all the time.

Gnassomething logged with the tag of commander and we decided to hit NSP camp and make your life a misery.

You guys were the only ones hitting us. HoD was busy defending SM and since we STILL with the outmanned buff we hadn’t nearly enough power to fight both sides.

Our upgrades were ended then we procced to capture Kl. and defend. Apparently HoD decided to do the same at the otherside. we kept doing it and eventualy captured jennifer. than we begun to treb your keep, not because we though we could take it but to, like i’ve said make your life the worse possible.

HoD eventually took your keep. Our scout reported they left it. We had trebbs at jennifer than we agreed “why not?” we rushed in and took your keep.

Then we noticed HoD spawn camping you guys.

I’ve said: “Dont attack HoD they aren’t attacking us” and the “truce” begun.

PPL say that was a trade and a PNA But the fact is: This whole time we were outmanned.
WHY i should attack who isn’t attacking me?

At a moment we were doing 95 points the crazy ppl who stood at the fight were no more than 50, and we eventually grew at the point of doing 275 points per tick, while being outmanned.

My major goal and the goal that i’ve made clear to ppl who were there was:
For some reason we don’t have players right now. Let’s do the largest amount of point possible, later ppl will log in and think we still in the fight.

We managed to do so.

NSP was raiding our side with your guild doing the flanking strike, yes we knew that were your guild the guys flanking us by the way nice tactic, While HoD was too busy defending/attacking SM.

Why we should attack them?

That’s the difference between pvp players and W3 players. We weren’t there to kill ppl. We were there to try to win the W3, if it isn’t a choice, to do the best possible.

Was clear for us we didn’t have the numbers to go fight, so we defend and took the opportunity when it showed up.

The opportunity was HoD not attacking us and you guys busy with them.

W3 it’s not about the amount of ppl you kill. Is about the amount of points the SERVER do. If the best and probably the unique way to do so is a “truce” with HoD who i’m to complain?

PS: It makes me wonder, if you guys were actually hitting HoD how you guys didn’t seen 25 golems being build, it’s not something you can build in 5 min. Accept that you guys made the same, we did better.

Ruprect.7260:

Divinorium.8952:

Ruprect.7260:

Everybody knows you can hit the gate and wall with splash damage from a cata at the same time if you aim it right. Well at least I hope everyone does.

Well for the most part unless you are in a low tier server you are never going to see an empty camp long enough to solo the camp. So most ppl don’t bother, it really does no good. These are not tricks they are common knowledge that is no longer useful. As far as siege goes.

It sounds to me like you play on an empty tier and have no idea what real competition is like. It’s easy to run into an empty bl and find a zerg and say huh nothing has changed.

In fact my account is in the GoM 7 tier but this didn’t stop me from taking the account of a friend who bandwagonned to the Jade Quarry.

PPL use more siege? Yes.
PPl Now use scouts? Yes.
Still always ending in 2 big zergs.

The whole point of WvW is to have large armies battle it out. Of course this is going to end up with large armies battling it out.

I can’t picture an army of 5 going to a castle in ancient times and taking a castle. Obviously this is not real but it is based on the premise that you need an army to siege a castle/tower/keep. Camps on the other hand are meant to be taken by small groups.

That’s the problem. right now a defense will have a bad/impossible time with any half good attackers, you know using the AOE to damage the gate/wall while the cata is behind something so the enemy can’t use the ballista to kill your cata it’s something that i could call “usefull”.

But right now the tower and the keep have the same difficulty to take of a camp.

The wall still punishing the defenders, seriously tell to the ppl of your party/server to hug the wall and watch and laugh while the defenders can barely aoe you when you can aoe them.

You can say “make good use of sieges and you can defend a tower” but guess what? the same is true to the camps and even some places in the map.

Npcs of towers SHOULD BE A PROBLEM. Not just as strong as a deer in the forest. and guess what? now they are weaker because you can buy a buff to make so.

Bleh… The game still being resumed in “strenght is numbers” doesn’t matter if it is in the open, in a camp or in a tower.

Kilger.5490:

I dont get the complaint. There were large zergs before the patch, at least on JQ, whats changed???

If its a complaint about lots of new people out in wvw having fun I dont get it.

Guess the problem is the lack of changes…

Ruprect.7260:

Everybody knows you can hit the gate and wall with splash damage from a cata at the same time if you aim it right. Well at least I hope everyone does.

Well for the most part unless you are in a low tier server you are never going to see an empty camp long enough to solo the camp. So most ppl don’t bother, it really does no good. These are not tricks they are common knowledge that is no longer useful. As far as siege goes.

It sounds to me like you play on an empty tier and have no idea what real competition is like. It’s easy to run into an empty bl and find a zerg and say huh nothing has changed.

In fact my account is in the GoM 7 tier but this didn’t stop me from taking the account of a friend who bandwagonned to the Jade Quarry.

PPL use more siege? Yes.
PPl Now use scouts? Yes.
Still always ending in 2 big zergs.

Ruprect.7260:

Divinorium.8952:

Ruprect.7260:

I have never had a problem with properly set AC’s not being able to defend. The only issue becomes when they can setup catas outside of range of ac’s. But then you just build a ballista.

I think one of the biggest issues is people do not know how to properly place siege.

I will try the pulling 1×1 out of a camp tonight, I am curious, I have never been able to get them far enough away where they don’t pull everyone else or you lose agro.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGjpyJrXjpA

video showing how it’s done.

And about the Sieges in towers more like the players you play against don’t know how to deal with siege.

Since since catapult have MORE range than ballistas. (cata has 4000 ballista has 3000)

And as i’ve said before, AC or damage everywhere and get aoe or place out of aoe range but ppl close to the gate/wall can’t by hit.

How do you find a camp with no enemies around? lol It is rare for that to happen on my server. But good info, I will be trying to solo a lot more unupgraded camps now.

As far a AC’s, it is dependent on the tower/keep. There are towers that it is possible to place siege that cannot be hit by AoE and still hit those close to the wall if you know how to aim it. There are others where this is not possible and they are harder to defend. There are very few spots where you can place a cata outside of range of a ballista. Other than reset night it is also pretty rare to come across a tower/keep that is not upgraded.

I just recorded it, off-time hour so the borderlands are kinda empty.

Not completely true. in fact most of ppl still don’t know how to aoe properly.

As a example of the “you don’t know how to aoe” you can do damage to gates/walls with the aoe of the cata, it don’t need to be a direct hit. So you don’t need to have clear sight of the gate/wall.

And seriously what amuse me the most is how, apparently not just the Anet didn’t improve the W3 but the W3 community looks like didn’t have improved at all.

As i’ve said i took a break of 3 months without playing GW2. These “tricks” worked at that time and works now. but most of the ppl don’t know about that…

PS: i think it’s the “zerg effect” ppl are just so attached to playing with 40+ groups that they don’t need learn how to effectively use the things. Who need to be skilled when you have numbers?
And that’s not pointed to you Ruprect, it’s pointed to “all the W3 players” in fact most of these things and a lot of others “tricks” i’ve learned in the beta, still working, was always there yet is so rare to see ppl using it, even being a tide changer thing, that is almost like ppl just stopped trying to improve

Ruprect.7260:

I have never had a problem with properly set AC’s not being able to defend. The only issue becomes when they can setup catas outside of range of ac’s. But then you just build a ballista.

I think one of the biggest issues is people do not know how to properly place siege.

I will try the pulling 1×1 out of a camp tonight, I am curious, I have never been able to get them far enough away where they don’t pull everyone else or you lose agro.

video showing how it’s done.

And about the Sieges in towers more like the players you play against don’t know how to deal with siege.

Since since catapult have MORE range than ballistas. (cata has 4000 ballista has 3000)

And as i’ve said before, AC or damage everywhere and get aoe or place out of aoe range but ppl close to the gate/wall can’t by hit.

Ruprect.7260:

You can’t lure one mob out, once you attack any one of them they all come running. Not sure when this was changed but I soloed a camp the other day and I had to take them all on, I tried to lure one out, one came running alone as soon as I hit it they all came running.

Night capping didn’t occur to me, good call.

The catas don’t really make that big of a difference, a few well placed superior AC and ballista’s can hold off a zerg for a long time. I have had and run into towers/keeps with so many AC’s that your HP’s just drain in seconds, there are places where you can cover the entire ground with AC fire where there is no place for the invaders to go.

Partially true. you can lure them to get out of the range of activity of most of the group(when they wield their weapons and begin to regenerate) and take the mob 1×1 this way.
The mobs npcs in camps/towers doesn’t work as a single mind. when you hit one he alerts the others, make sure to hit them AFTER they are out of the range to alert the others and you can kill them in 1×1.

AC? LoL. ACs have 2 situations:
1 he is close to a edge so it and the guy using it can be AoEd
2 he is out of range of most aoe skills(elementalist will sttil hit it) but he can’t hit ppl close to the wall. in both cases the defense using AC will fail.

Ruprect.7260:

Your average player cannot solo a camp lol. I have never seekittenman group flip an entire map (where do you play – you have no opposition????)

I have successfully defended a tower/keep with 5-10 ppl numerous times agains full 50+man zergs, it’s called siege – use it.

A average player can solo a camp. In fact any pve player know how to do that: DON’T RUSH IN LURE THE MOB OUT.

Night squad/attacking a borderlands map for you.(before they react you can flip half map)

And as i’ve said now without the catas behind the gates i want to see you defend a tower/keep.