Guild Wars 2

If you are wanting to buy it from the guildwars2.com website simply click “Shop” (ignore the drop down choices) in the top right corner of the page and it will take you to a page where you can then pick either HoT or PoF.

So it seems something has changed since the release of Hot and PoF as the website store no longer has a drop down option to buy up to 3 copies of the same edition of the game (affects both HoT and PoF purchase pages) within one purchase.

However, it has no problem with letting me add one of each edition to the cart (and giving the option to tie HoT at discount to each version if needed) within one purchase, and that stinks for those of us who have kids/family members that play and are trying to buy 3 (plus) copies of the same edition.

I realize that I could just make the purchase three times while being logged into the same account and using the same credit card, but that makes me nervous as that caused an issue in the past with Digital River that I would rather not have to deal with again.

So I am kind of at a lost on how best to do this.

I don’t get why some get so defensive and hostile, because others find certain aspects to be problematic.

How does non-raiders being able to progress their XP bar affect those who want to raid?

Does the non-raider asking for this to be fixed affect you negatively?

Do the raiders not get the benefit of playing the harder content and better rewards?

What do you really care if they earn spirit shards or not?

You are not impacted. Plain and simple. They are, and that’s the point they are hoping gets taking into consideration by the development team.

Personally, as raids are its own game type (despite being in a HoT region) I think they should have worked where the XP gain from HoT areas could not progress the bars and ONLY the XP gained from inside the associated raid wing could.

After all, we do not get to earn PvP or WvW XP while we are playing in the PvE game type so why should we be able to simply kill one boss and then run around HoT regions for an hour on an XP booster to max out raid masteries.

No. Raids should just have simply had their own “Raid” header (untied from any other regions mastery line) with “Forsaken Thicket” inside as a subsection from the start followed by any and all new raids as they came out.

That way it would not matter if they were in HoT regions, Core regions, future regions (crystal desert), etc.

I need some cheese after reading through this thread.

Considering “Living World” was ALWAYS intended to be played AS IT HAPPENED players should be thrilled that they are even given a way to access them post LW1.

There are a lot of obvious reasons for Bloodstone Fen being cut off (while Dry Top/The Silverwastes weren’t) to those who do not own the expansion, but if one is so blinded as to not “get it” then anyone here is wasting their time trying to explain it.

As for the “Real Life” crowd. Get over yourselves. I (as many others here) have a “Real Life” too, and I missed most of LW1 and all of LW2, but its my own fault for having 3 kids, a wife, etc. NO ONE ELSE’s!

The rest of the player base and ArenaNet should not be punished, have to stop everything, or change rules just because poor little me couldn’t be bothered to log on in time.

Obviously what ever was going on in my own “Real Life” was more important, and because of that I missed out on a lot of content that I will never get to take part in again (I have no hope of LW1 ever being repeatable), and when I found that they did the unexpected and made LW2 repeatable I bought full access without a second thought.

It was my fault, my problem, ArenaNet gave a solution.

No one has to like that solution, but its a solution all the same. I for one did not mind it. I was able to access content that under their original vision would have never been repeatable again, and why should I get it for free if I didn’t even have the time to be here when it was actually taking place?

I don’t see it as being tied to the unbound magic as my two kids have been to bloodstone fen and collected plenty of that currency and have yet to see them.

However, they have not yet done any of the current events that were released with the Ley-Line Anomalies that run around the three maps, and one of the two has finished the blood stone crazed beasts as well. Neither have seen them yet.

Now me and my brother were talking and joking around about how it would be funny if somehow they were the mursaat getting ready to pull a cybermen invasion.

So it has been a very long time (several years to be exact) since I have done personal stories, and I just got hit with this today while playing the game with my kids.

My son who joined the Vigil created the instance which me and my daughter entered.

So while my daughter remained on “Setting the Stage” (since she wanted to see if things would be different during it for her order) I chose to progress, because I thought (as I had no prior knowledge of this issue) that I was simply ending “Setting the Stage” and moving on to the first quest of the level 40 Priory storyline.

Now I could see the “brush off” given to those affected if things were more intuitive and better designed around this issue, but as this is still happening to players after a year+ it appears to be nothing more than a lazy excuse and bad design/coding choices.

The response from Jeffrey Vaughn really hit more as a punch to the face than anything remotely helpful, and really came across as making it our fault instead of admitting that the design choices in the end really do suck as they continue to negatively affect players in a way that should NEVER be deemed “Okay” or “Acceptable”.

To add insult to injury the excuse (or reasoning) of how it would be rather annoying to co-op play by not allowing progress is just that. An excuse.

When you know that your design/code is going to do(or is doing) something that is FAR MORE ANNOYING to a player then don’t you think it would then usually be better to just side with the least annoying choice rather than allow players characters to continue getting screwed up.

I find it odd that the only alternative stated to fixing the issue has to do with only being able to block progress and impacting co-op play when there are indeed other fixes.

A fairly easy one might be to have the FANCY in game mail system that already sends us mail during certain storyline parts actually send one upon reaching level 40 that contains a WARNING about “Setting the Stage”.

In that WARNING you might state that if the player will be going into this instance with other players they should not progress unless they are the same order as the instance creator, and then maybe even list the next story name step for each order.

I’m sure its not as easy, but as he has stated about how it will (should) correct itself it shows that the game KNOWS what order you are part of so then why not just redesign the code to perform a fail safe check (regardless of the order of the instance creator) upon offering the ability to progress past “Setting the Stage” so that it only offers the progression into the actual first level 40 quest of your own Order?

Separate “Setting the Stage” completely into its own little part with no attachment to the other level 40 story parts so that upon players completing it together they all receive notifications of the next proper step for the order they chose.

Even better just make it so that we have to be ungrouped during this story step in order to enter it, because lets face it the excuse of co-op and annoying has no warrant in this case as everyone will have to go in again anyway if not in the same order as the instance creator.

I get that not all fixes are easy, but seriously you cannot really think that the only option was the one stated, and as such its better to just leave it the way it is and tick players off.

Aidenwolf.5964:

1st two festivals after FTP both contain the Korean style grind you say the game doesn’t. These events before FTP did not.

I never said it wasn’t a grind, because it is, but even then it is no where near those styles of “cash grab” grinds, and to be honest with your hatred for F2P you should then know that the difference in the F2P your hating on compared to what F2P is in GW2 is huge.

Those F2P games are designed to revolve around milking the player out of real life money as the only option of continued progression during every aspect of the overall gameplay. Not just during a few silly achievements.

Look I don’t find any issue with your feelings of this being a grind or potential money maker for ArenaNet if those players who choose to do so buy Gems to convert to Gold.

I just cannot wrap my head around the idea that the last two event grinds relate to F2P being the fault of why the achievements have been harder for us full account players when F2P cannot even partake in the achievement without actually opening the gifts (or receiving donations of the drinks in large amounts through in-game mail) themselves while hoping that they can fully farm 10k drinks in two weeks.

It just makes no sense for it to be harder due to a whole account class that cannot even buy or sell the required drinks.

I think if anything that this really would have more to do with all of the feedback from players claiming that the game is to easy and wanting things to be made harder, or just plain bad development choices.

At least development choices seem more believable as getting the piece from the drinking achievement is not even remotely comparable to what is involved with getting the other pieces.

So if anything I agree with those on the forum who have been more constructive with their ideas (while not blaming an account type or players family status) said that this should have been separated into related achievements (as others are) with one giving the item needed and the other giving the title.

I think at least 2.5k drinks would be right had the development team went that way as 1k would have just been way to small of an amount.

Aidenwolf.5964:

You read correctly, I HATE Free To Play, I HATE it. I paid full price (max as I have a CE) for GW2 and they stole from me when they took GW2 FTP. I don’t care if you like it or don’t mind it My money is mine, not yours.

Free To Play games are a joke and I avoid them because this is what they do. They add so much grind that a player with a job and a family will shortcut the grind by using a credit card. That’s what Mad King and Winter’s Day post Free To Play have been… FTP style credit card simulators.

Don’t tell me to enjoy, accept, welcome or rejoice over having a product I paid for given away for free. FYI that Q for the jumping puzzle is a bit longer because free players need gifts too, even though the whole game’s a gift to them.

Free To Play is exactly what’s wrong with the game.

Well that’s what happens with software (as with any consumer product). It devalues, and instead of just letting it die out while becoming nothing more than the foundation of future expansions they decided to make a bold marketing move to help promote future growth to the player base.

It just so happened to have got stuck with an unfair F2P label (people immediately think Korean F2P model and shy away) that does not work or fit these newer hybrid F2P models, but then again in reality GW 1 & 2 has always been looked at by players of various MMO’s as F2P as it has never had a monthly membership fee.

Which is unfair to GW2 as its F2P does not have “buy in options” that allow it to stay free while having more benefit (to either the player or ArenaNet) than a full account.

It does what they wanted. It gives a nice chance to experience the core game without taking away from or impacting the benefits of what being a full account means.

FYI though I wasn’t telling you what to “enjoy, accept, welcome or rejoice over” as my post was simply pointing out an objective argument (based on having owned GW2 since launch and using a F2P account) to your blaming only F2P for this design trend.

As I said above F2P is of no benefit to full players let alone ArenaNet in regards to these past couple months when it comes to these new grinds other than it nudging them to upgrade to full account at best.

So again. Other than hate for the sake of hating you cannot even back up your claim to blame to show how these design choices are even due to F2P.

You don’t like it, and you don’t have to like it, but unless you plan to stop playing you are stuck having to accept it. Like it or not.

In the end though this game has always had a grind (just as GW1 did) in some form that resulted in potential money making for ArenaNet well before F2P existed.

Living World event chests requiring (outside the very rare key drop) you to buy them with Gems by either farming gold and converting it to Gems or opening your wallet.

Then there was the Molten Jetpack that required you to keep grinding the dungeon in hopes to get its drop, or somehow grinding enough money to buy it, or yet again opening your wallet to buy Gems to convert to gold in order to buy it.

We really must have been playing two very different versions of GW2 since launch, because I can toss out plenty of things that have been like this or worse from time periods way before F2P that show that this has always been a “credit card simulator”, and all you have to hide behind is to simply blame F2P instead of the real issues.

Its fine though. We all have to keep our own realities sane somehow.

For me its seeing that this is a company that behind the game is in it to make money to turn a profit, pay employees, and keep the money mak…er, game going as long as they can.

At least if your going to be mad about something base it on its real source, and that is that ArenaNet wants YOUR money right now. Not some F2P that is not a sure thing.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

Festive Imbiber is a ridiculous achievement if you ask me.

Why has ANet adopted this policy of introducing overly expensive or grindy achievements? Why must we pay for achievements with gold or mindless farming instead of earning them through actual challenge or fun events? Shouldn’t Wintersday be fun?

I don’t understand. The game has been taking increasingly worse turns lately. How can you keep making so many poor decisions, one after the other without proper testing or implementation? Did you just think “oh, let’s make it 10 000 drinks because that’s the first number that popped into my head”? Did you even consider the potential costs involved for the player, in terms of time or gold and consider whether it was balanced or viable?

You are forcefully ensuring only a minority will be able to get these shoulders (thanks to resource limitations that will become increasingly worse once Wintersday ends). If your new policy is to make a game that’s rewarding and fun only for a minority, I honestly think my days in GW2 are numbered. I’m becoming very frustrated lately and I don’t think I’m the only one.

Free To Play. GW2 is no longer Buy To Play no matter what anyone says it’s now Freemium. The entire design of the game from going FTP forward is how to get gem sales and convert FTP into spenders. I never play FTP games because I can’t stand the design. Grind to the point of grabbing the plastic is all they do, welcome to the new Tyria.

No, just NO!

All I read here is hate for F2P and F2P players that causes you to have flawed and misguided theories of why there is a 10k drink achievement for Wintersday.

Which of course has nothing to do with the core game going F2P, but looks to have everything to do with blaming another player type for something that really only impacts you (and other full players).

Have you even tried the whole F2P model?

If so then you would know that its design (and limitations) is actually quite ingenious compared to other F2P games as its focus is not in trying to milk new F2P players from their money.

They have actually did a remarkable job with creating a F2P game that will actually let you enjoy just about every aspect of the core game (even with a few major limitations) without having to pay anything if they were so inclined, and it really is what they advertise. Simply a way to see what is offered while letting their game do the talking for them.

I have been playing since launch (this account right here), but I did create a F2P to introduce my kids to the game and be on equal level with them while they were seeing if this was something that they liked enough to purchase. It did its job (as advertised), and my kids are waiting for their upgrade come Christmas. All without being blocked off by a “Cash Grab” beyond nudges of seeing why getting the full game was a good thing, and yet at no time did the kids (or I on that account) feel a need (let alone pressure) to have to buy Gems in order to keep playing or accessing the game.

However, going back to the main point of how this isn’t about the game going F2P. F2P cannot even buy/sell the drinks which of course also restricts their ability to obtain the other needed items to complete Winter’s Presence. So where is ArenaNet trying to turn F2P into spenders with this?

Yeah, thats what I thought. Nowhere. So then it really ONLY affects full access players, but even if this was some conspiracy to get you to buy Gems to convert to gold it would be no different than other things ArenaNet has done since launch (well before F2P) with things like the Karka chests and gem bought keys.

Which means in the end this still has nothing to do with being about the game going F2P as they have used similiar types of tactics to encourage your parting of monety since launch. Its ALWAYS been about designing ways to sell Gems, etc to increase sales/profit while in many ways giving us fun options and things.

In the end. You don’t want to buy gems to get gold to buy drinks, and it only affects you if your full access. Similiar things have been done since launch and it does not equal being the fault of F2P. Especially when they cannot even make partial use of the ability your being inconvienced by.

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

Festive Imbiber is a ridiculous achievement if you ask me.

Why has ANet adopted this policy of introducing overly expensive or grindy achievements? Why must we pay for achievements with gold or mindless farming instead of earning them through actual challenge or fun events? Shouldn’t Wintersday be fun?

I don’t understand. The game has been taking increasingly worse turns lately. How can you keep making so many poor decisions, one after the other without proper testing or implementation? Did you just think “oh, let’s make it 10 000 drinks because that’s the first number that popped into my head”? Did you even consider the potential costs involved for the player, in terms of time or gold and consider whether it was balanced or viable?

You are forcefully ensuring only a minority will be able to get these shoulders (thanks to resource limitations that will become increasingly worse once Wintersday ends). If your new policy is to make a game that’s rewarding and fun only for a minority, I honestly think my days in GW2 are numbered. I’m becoming very frustrated lately and I don’t think I’m the only one.

If you have/haven’t played Guild Wars 1 then you would/wouldn’t know that this isn’t a “New Policy” on how these types of things work.

More so if you consider the original drinking track in GW1 required that you had to drink X amount of drinks first then at a certain intoxication level it started ticking off time spent drunk so long as you STAYED at that same level consistently in order to keep the timer going without having to restart the entire process.

It wasn’t until way later that they changed it to a point system with each drink giving something like 1-3 points with a total of 10k needed, but you were not getting several hundred drinks a day and did not have a Trading Post to easily acquire them without having to camp a main city and spam /trade.

It was actually dumbed down quite a bit, and while way easier than those who got it originally it still was a long grind if you didn’t want to or couldn’t be bothered with trying to stand around all day trading/buying.

I am sure other GW1 Veterans can testify to just how many tracks had been “Dumbed Down” over time from the start of and through the last few years of GW1.

So I can agree with you to a point on how 10k is quite a bit (even if left on through out the whole year) seeing as how it can only be advanced by Wintersday drinks, but this is nothing new with ArenaNet let alone them having adopted a "New Policy.

Maybe they should have added a “Wintersday Gift Exchange Merchant” where you could of took the other foods/junk from gifts and exchanged them at a 3-1 rate.

Any mail sent by a non-employee will stat that it was not sent by the gw2 team and the players name. Its fake. Use the report button (little ! in triangle I believe) on that mail and do not go to the site as it is a phishing scam.

lilcoffeebean.3149:

That being said, whether Anet should make allowances for such cases is up for debate, but doing it for one, while not doing it for another (assuming the situation is the same) is a poor way to go about things. However, that all hinges on the ‘truth’ which we aren’t privy to. That’s why I don’t understand why there are so many in this thread ‘up in arms’.

As posted in my post above (which also shows how we are agreeing to ToS based on our own use not anyone else’s) and according to the Forum Code of Conduct

• Do not debate Customer Support decisions or actions. Threads or posts designed to announce, appeal, or contest your own or another player’s suspension or account termination—be it forum or game account—will be removed without notice.

So no the issue/s are not up for debate amongst ourselves and in itself is a punishable breakage to the rules that were accepted by users when using the forums and/or in game chat, etc. So each person that has went on in this thread (with more than just a simple statement of displeasure) about how the reinstatements are the wrong choice should then also have the proper rule enforcement placed upon them. Right?

I mean fair is fair. If one is to have the attitude that something regardless of severity is a violation then they should also face a punishment, because you know rules can’t be allowed to be broke under any circumstance.

The problem here is that some have taken to the extreme about things in this thread and leave a very toxic impression and stain on others in the community.

It isn’t really that hard to understand how/why they may determine different outcomes. Whether we agree with them or not.

It can be as simple as Player A was dumb enough to think that he was going to lie and hide what would be found in logs, etc upon deeper investigation where as Player B owned up in full up front for what actually happened and upon that deeper investigation they could see that while yes he may have shared that account the stuff that was done wrong was from an IP states away from his locale.

Seeing as how he had already suffered an extended ban they may have felt that the sharing which was broke on his part was a minor infraction that my have just warranted a temp suspension for a first time offense. In the end time was served.

Nothing in the ToS (outside of severe infractions) says that the only punishment is account termination, but plenty states that it is at THEIR DISCRETION not ours.

The constant bickering of those who feel an “Iron Fist” approach is needed for every case is unacceptable and not even in their right to expect or demand, and for good reason as unintentional mistakes by an entity that means well do in fact happen.

The attitude here sets a toxic stage for those who really did/do have issues where they were/are caught up by the detection system and never did anything wrong.

Over the years I have seen where many of them were also chewed alive by same minded people as in this thread, and in quite a few the players affected as an unrelated group were all cleared as it was not their fault. In fact in one instance it was a mistake in coding for a jumping puzzle that was causing players to be flagged wrongly.

Posting alone does not equal incrimination. So those here that want to continue with the guilty at all costs mindset need to stop.

Seriously though ArenaNet has allowed this to go on way to long. Its toxic and needs to be ended.

9. ACCOUNT ACCESS AND PERMISSIBLE ASSIGNMENT
(a) By clicking “I ACCEPT” You warrant and represent that You are: 1) at least 18 years of age and otherwise legally competent to read, understand and accept the provisions of this agreement on behalf of Yourself; 2) at least 18 years of age and otherwise legally competent to read, understand and accept the provisions of this agreement on behalf of Yourself and a minor age 13-17 for whom You are legally permitted to allow access to the Game; or 3) a minor age 13-17 who has been authorized to click “I ACCEPT” under the provisions of Section 9© below. YOU ARE HEREBY FOREWARNED THAT ArenaNet MAY, IN ITS REASONABLE DISCRETION, EXERCISE ITS SECTION 3(b) RIGHT TO TERMINATE BASED ON FAILURE TO COMPLY WITH THE CRITERIA ABOVE.

The very last part of 9(a) says what exactly?

16. GENERAL PROVISIONS
(a) It is Your responsibility to read, understand and accept this agreement in connection with Your use of the Service. You acknowledge that ArenaNet may make changes to the provisions of this agreement at any time and that Section headings in this agreement are for purposes of convenience only. You also acknowledge that each and every time You click “I ACCEPT” You warrant and represent that You did read, understand and accept the provisions in effect at that time.

What does the first line of 16(a) say?

When we click “I accept” or “Login” we are doing so only for our own personal use of the service, and not in regards to any other persons agreement with the ToS or how they may or may not be punished.

We don’t have to like it…oh, wait! Yes we do, because when we clicked “I accept” or “Login” we also agreed that possible punishments were at their discretion.

Just about every area of the ToS states things in a fashion similar to this snippet from the dispute section “ArenaNet may take any action, as conclusively determined in the reasonable discretion of ArenaNet, or no action whatsoever, including but not limited to termination of an Account under Section 3(b). ArenaNet has no obligation to explain any decision to take any action, or no action whatsoever”

In fact here is from the Forum Code of Conduct

• Do not debate Customer Support decisions or actions. Threads or posts designed to announce, appeal, or contest your own or another player’s suspension or account termination—be it forum or game account—will be removed without notice.

So, yeah! I really like this last one, because how does it look to continue to break rules that one agrees to, while trying to push so hard on how a reinstatement doesn’t send the right message to those who break the rules. Kind of a double standard huh?

The solution is very simple. Let it…Go! This issue was never open for debate between us and ArenaNet and should have never been allowed to go on as long as it has.

You know its the internet “Grain of Salt” and all, and its easier to just assume that anyone claiming in contrast must be guilty. However, in these circumstances assuming guilt is flawed anyway as only Anet and the given User really have the facts.

Now while I cannot/will not assume this persons guilt or innocence reading threads like this does make me (and I’m sure others) kind of concerned with what safeguards Anet actually uses for those of us users who have several computers networked and all of course showing the same IP to the outside world as if they were one single computer.

My household for instance has 3 PC’s and 6 accounts (with four different unique registered users), but at any given time depending on other household needs (such as homework for example) any of these 6 accounts will access any of the 3 PC’s.

We also usually play with other family members outside of our home that on occasion they may log in to their own account at my house (or vice versa if visiting them).

Now account sharing alone is not so easy to prove, and you cannot just assume that that is the case just because multiple accounts reflect the same IP address.

However, as a hypothetical lets say someone visits my parents house a few times a month from out of town and them having no idea what an MMO is other than a video game let the person use their PC to play GW2, and they for whatever reason decide to cheat while playing.

What keeps my children who spend the weekend every so many weeks at my parents (their grandparents) house from getting on one of those PC’s there to play GW2 with me for a short bit from now being looked at as an account that is somehow linked to this other past guest of my parents?

Lets say in this scenario whatever allowed this person to cheat was no longer present and my children’s accounts are still squeaky clean, but now since they show as having accessed their account from a PC that a possible cheater used they are guilty despite having a squeaky clean account.

However, as their accounts have also accessed the game from home the rest of our accounts which are also squeaky clean get drawn into the loop only because their accounts were logged into a PC at my parents house where one of their guests played GW2 using his own account had cheated.

It just cannot be that simple, and imagine what implications that type of policy would have on Anet with so many people in various parts of the world logging on from coffee shops, internet cafes, book stores, campuses, etc, etc, etc.

I did. In fact that was the first thing I did, but I also feel that it doesn’t hurt to post my displeasure at the whole circumstance in hopes that maybe those higher than just the ticket readers might read this, and maybe even make changes so this doesn’t happen.

Not to mention that ArenaNet appears to have the worse tools for GM/CS to do anything to fix accounts, and with the one issue just before this I was told they have no way to enable a disabled key.

So I doubt that it will be as simple as billing me $184.94 and reactivating these accounts with the current keys attached even though this is not my fault.

So older son gets home today. Logs on and plays for awhile. I have him log to character screen to go eat dinner and we find a suspension message. Cryptic and unhelpful per the norm, and no email at registered account emails explaining anything.

I go log into my account, BOOM, suspension. So try my wifes, then daughters who also have a suspension. In total 6 accounts suspended. No email, no reason that is not cryptic, and us panicking to find out what the hell went wrong.

So I go gather all my email info, etc and file a ticket with all accounts and info to find out went wrong, and go log into my bank account to handle other household matters, and see that all 6 account purchases were charged back to my credit card.

Funny thing is I bought the first two in apirl during the 50% off and those two cleared on 4/15 and I paid the CC balance on 4/16, and the other four bought during the recent 50% off sale cleared on 5/5 and I paid that balance off today (5/6) yet all 6 purchases were credited back today (5/6).

I don’t understand this. It was ArenaNet staff who suggested I buy 2 two new serial numbers to tack on and reactivate my son and daughters old account (to handle issues I just discussed in a ticket) so that they could progress with making their new account.

What did ArenaNet really not want to honor giving 50% off?

Was the fact that they or their fraud department did not like 6 accounts bought? Is it my fault that you do not allow us to buy copies of the game in any other way except ONE SERIAL NUMBER at a time? I didn’t know it was such a big deal, I mean staff on the forum even explain to players how to gift a copy bought direct online.

So now, FOUR brand new accounts get flagged and marked records, and I get left for a few days with 3 other people waiting to hear exactly what reasons ArenaNet has for auto charge backing accounts.

Yay, me. Yes I am upset. I came back to this game with my wife and resovled the issue for my two kids to have this happen. Quite the blunder.

EDIT:

I did call my bank before writing this and they stated that as the 6 charges were processed and that since I had not requested a charge back (pointed out that I even paid them off within 24 hours) this was not from the customer/bank side, and said that ALL SIX CREDITS were issued on behalf of and from the merchants end.

champ.7021:

If you say get a precursor that sells for 500+g (spark at 520g now) why would you undercut sellers. Sure most of the precursors will sell but youre missing out on a lot of profit. I was recently looking at the spark because i want to make my legendary and i jsut saw people missing out by undercutting almost 25g. Why would someone do this.

Simple. Its an item that exists in a market that is decided by the players outside of an in-game merchant paying only 2s64c for it.

Its worth is set by the developers, and they feel its worth 2s64c so anything above that that you get from a player is your profit.

Just because a 2s64c item gets placed by the first person at 500g doesn’t mean its worth that, and most people know this, but they will place theirs near that due to not wanting to miss out on a major transfer of wealth, and most will eventually just buy it because they WANT it so bad. Not that they really need it, because no on really NEEDS a legendary. They WANT a legendary.

You don’t have to like it, but once that item drops for a player it is theirs to decide what to do with and what they feel its is worth, and if they don’t feel the current prices are its true worth they have every right to sell it for less than the so called “going price” that fellow players think/assume something is worth.

You don’t want me to find a precursor, because while I would like to make as much as I can I also do not feel that that amount is the same as what the so called “going price” tends to be, and rule of thumb in every online game I have played is going at least HALF of the lowest price.

I don’t worry about who I upset or if another player is either going to get a very lucky deal or just come along and buy it and flip it at a way higher price, because I made what I felt was fair, and while they are buying up my cheaper more reasonable goods I am selling my stuff faster than they can theirs. So my share of the transfer of wealth comes in much quicker than their occasional burst of coin here and there.

Now for me I see someone as under cutting not because they feel the item they are selling is worth 100g less, but because they come in and set their item for 1c less than the current lowest offer.

They outright know that they are admitting that they feel the item is worth 500g, but they want to make sure that they sell first even if it means taking 1c less.

Just be glad that the developers don’t allow selling for under the merchant price, because that is a very profitable area for those of us who know what to do, and it makes flippers (and even under cutters) seem like they walk on water.

Apathy is only a bad thing, because in this case the developers have failed to give me (and others like me) a reason to want to part with my money let alone try to sell drop #2459739 of the same item that is already flooding the market, because its unwanted garbage (like the other 95% of the stuff I just vendor) that NO ONE needs.

If ArenaNet would create some ITEM SINKS (like Nicholas Sanford for example) that made use of even some of the more common drops (Broken Lock Picks anyone?) there would be more reason for non-flippers to make use of the TP and take a share of that wealth being spread around instead of complaining how unfair flipping is.

The problem is that I just do not feel a reason to worry about how much I make or don’t make, because there is no reason for me to really WANT or NEED anything in this game that I cannot get without spending a copper.

Behellagh.1468:

Michael Fejervary.8576:

TBH.

The constant reference to patient vs. impatient buyer/seller starts to get a little offensive and insulting after awhile since some of you have this need to keep assuming that impatient people make up the total of those who do not use buy/sell orders and thus it is only the impatient people that empower flippers.

Then explain why you would sell an item immediately at a 50% discount to the lowest sale price or buy an item that is twice the price of the highest bid? Because you like to overpay for an item or receive significantly less ifor selling it? Of course not, it’s because of the immediacy that you are willing pay a markup or accept a discount. If the root of that isn’t impatience than what is it?

Really? It needs explanation? Really?

Okay, then how’s this?

Some of us just don’t care about in-game coin (believe it or not, and this is only one example) to the point that many of our fellow gamers are getting their undies in a bunch about it as displayed in this thread alone.

We have our bags full and are just happy to click the BLTC button (as we are no where near a merchant and don’t want to pay 3s to WP) and sell to someone who wants something in our bag of junk and the only thing we care about is that the final amount we get after the fees is at least what a merchant is going to pay for it.

That’s not impatience. That’s just not caring if we are richer or poorer.

As for buying. Well, as I vendor almost 95% of everything I find (and am thus poor by my own choosing) I know what I feel something is worth and what I am willing to pay for it. If an item pops up that I feel fair I will buy it at the lowest price as I do not feel the need to waste my time placing buy orders for stuff that will never be fulfilled.

That’s not impatience either. I already know what I feel its worth, and what others feel its worth by looking up the item, and if I feel that my buy order based on my view of its worth is never going to be filled I am going to buy the cheapest one on the list unless I just don’t feel its worth it in which case I will just pass even the cheapest up and go farm it. Hmm, passing up cheapest non-buy orders in favor of farming it ones self. Yep that REEKS of impatience.

In the end. Your views and others views of buying/selling habits are yours, but many players do things for many (of their own) good reasons and it doesn’t just equate to impatience across the board, because you THINK or SAY so.

The End.

This whole conversation and the misinformation contained within is no different than every other game out there that has an in-game economy.

It never fails to amaze me at how so many in a game forum somehow feel the need to punish those who have large amounts of money (no matter how they got it), and in this games case its the misperception being put on those who play the TP.

The problem isn’t the flippers, and they are not the ones causing inflation (if anything they cause deflation for as long as they can obtain certain items).

Nope. The simple truth is the problem being with how ArenaNet has worked very hard to do everything they can to keep the player base poor in order to fight/curb future issues with inflation due to new coin being created and entering the economy.

This is why merchants pay GARBAGE for everything, and that we have so many more trophies and whites/blues as drops (when drops even happen).

This is also why they continue to decrease coin rewards on any and everything that they may have overlooked as having the potential to become way to profitable.

Bottom line.

Wealth moving around from average players to flippers (or other TP players) is not doing anything to the economy other than them finding a way to make money in a system that is regulated by ArenaNet to keep everyone poor.

Sure they can afford more than you, and pay higher prices than you, but that isn’t exactly their problem or fault anyway as OUR FELLOW PLAYERS help to set the prices on WANTED ITEMS and if they perceive the WANT or NEED to be great they are going to price them higher than you could afford with or without “Flippers” existing, because at some point someone else who still has more than you will buy it.

In the end inflation is not caused by them or the TP itself even.

It is caused by the lack of overall goods (and having so little merchant value to begin with) coming into the game filling the supply chain to levels that meet demand while maintaining a modest enough supply as to not create a huge shortage either (unless its intended to be a truly unique item).

The problem here in GW2 land is that WAY TO MUCH of the supply is kept so decreased in its ability to be obtained through drops that shortages are the norm instead of the occasional rare item being harder to come by thus worth more than the average player will be able to afford.

Every game with economies face this problem in some way, but due to choices by the developers to over fight inflation (as in how fast coin is coming into their game) it has become far more obvious at the seams far sooner than every other game I have played, and most of those did not start having these issues until a few years in (and GW2 isn’t even at 1 year yet) so just imagine what this thread will look like at year 2.

If all of you that think the TP is what the problem is and thus needs to be limited for profit gain, etc you just don’t have a clue. It won’t fix your so called woes or issues as you will still be poor, because that is how ArenaNet intended things to be.

No the problem isn’t the need to limit the TP in anyway (let alone fellow players ability to make whatever they can in it). The problem is ArenaNet trying to fight incoming coin so hard as to try to prevent perceived issues in other games with inflation that they are only creating new and unique issues with their own economy.

Ursan.7846:

Essence Snow.3194:

It does that for impatient buyers and sellers. It does the opposite for patient buyers and sellers.

Priceline.com is a service. It allows shoppers to find cheap discounted rates for hotels. The hotels benefit by a higher volume of sales due to a lower price.

I like that example, but imagine if Travelocity.com came along complaining how it was unfair that Priceline.com made more money than them faster because they were able to flip the flights/hotel rooms/car rentals faster due to more people wanting to pay them since they were somehow cheaper or maybe they just liked Shatner (at the time) better than the Gnome (at the time) so in order for their company to be competitive and reach equal footing with Priceline.com they needed a judge to place a profit limit on them.

Outside of some very, very rare and specific circumstances that would not happen.

TBH.

The constant reference to patient vs. impatient buyer/seller starts to get a little offensive and insulting after awhile since some of you have this need to keep assuming that impatient people make up the total of those who do not use buy/sell orders and thus it is only the impatient people that empower flippers.

Essence Snow.3194:

Ursan.7846:

In the end, flipping is a service. People spend money for convenience. This cannot be denied. As long as there is demand for this service, it will remain profitable. It’s the same as getting tipped for portal JPs or being paid to run people through dungeons in GW1.

I might have to debate on the validity of flipping here being a “service”. The demand is for the items, not the “service”. With or without the “service” the demand remains the same.

The “service” provides “value” so while the demand may stay the same even if the “service” is not there the “value” over time will not.

You can say that’s not true, but without flippers trying to buy low/sell low the more seedy of us set in, and inflate the prices just out of reach and beyond what the average player is going to want to (let alone be able to) pay, and you still have the same issues since there will always be those who have more money than another and will still pay the price if they “want” something bad enough.

So then it all comes down to “want” and how bad any one person wants something.

Which I would say is pretty bad, because if there wasn’t so much “want” then flippers (or other TP player types) wouldn’t be shifting around money (while losing a % of it and not creating any new money into the game) to the point that these threads exist.

ilr.9675:

We don’t need more arbitrary limits on supply, we just more limits to the INSTANT manipulation of prices. IE: temporarily account-bound whatever is bought for 3-7 days (make it random since Anet loves R.N.G. so kitten much) and limit the number of bids that can be made per account. It’s really really simple.

Umm, NO we don’t.

This may seem to fix issues in your (and the like minded) thoughts and theories, but it will produce other long term issues within the community than the misguided perception that playing the market is somehow ruining the economy.

I for one like to help others in the game, and this would prevent any random act okittendness among players which in turn ruins the whole concept of being a community.

ilr.9675:

Michael Fejervary.8576:

long manipulative post, because I don't agree or comprehend what I read

hide spoiler

See original post as this put it over 5001 characters in length

wow….
I dunno where you came from but it doesn’t sound like it meshes very well with the Roots of this game. It’s no wonder your own characterization is “being lazy”… Maybe it just wasn’t meant to be? You don’t change that though by tearing down this game’s casual player base.

Umm, if your going to make a comment based off a reference I make then at least show the courtesy of not manipulating the context of what was stated.

Lets look at that section again in its whole context though shall we?

“I have been very lazy when it comes to this game and trying to make money, and for my time spent in it having 120g makes me happy even if its nothing compared to what others may have, and if those others took part in earning money through the TP I can care less. More power to them.

I have not spent time in this games market as I have just been uninterested at the moment due to other things I have been enjoying in the game, real life, etc."

So yeah I see your quoting me and having to post to it as being pointless and non-helpful to the threads topic so lets leave it at this.

I have played my Necro since mid-April and only have 120g (which is the most I have ever had at one time, and I barely spend in-game money) without playing the market (for reasons stated above).

So it would appear to me that I am a very, very, very, casual player compared to most of this player base, and it would also appear to me that my play style meshes just fine with the roots of this game and its casual player base.

Not only does that part of my post show me NOT complaining about how poor I am in game it also shows that I am NOT complaining and asking that everyone else be limited and punished because its not fair that I am so poor.

I am simply content with my 120g.

Other than that the context of the rest of my post is/was lost on you so its better to just leave it at that and avoid each other. K? Thanks, LATER.

John Smith.4610:

Except for the part about my feelings (I just got back from crying in a corner), everything Ensign says is correct.

People take part in an MMO world in different ways, and just with your response John it would seem that ArenaNet does not have an issue with so called power traders (at least that are not exploiting, etc to do so) which if true is a good thing.

Your competitor SOE has talked about some of this with their new game coming up, and one of the things they bring up is making a game where a player is able to spend their time in the world the way they want doing the things they enjoy doing in it.

As they pointed out. Some socialize and level very slowly, others spend most of their time crafting, while there are also those who play the in game markets, and their goal is to create something that has potential for all of those different types of play styles.

In otherwords as the developer they understand that people are going to find their own fun doing various things within their games world, and they want to not interfere with all that as much as possible.

In my experience of MMO’s (going back to EQ1) I have played the biggest complainers about any form of in-game trading there was (East Commons tunnel anyone?) are those who expect to obtain something from others for very little of their own effort.

I have always looked at them as trying to bring some form of “Socialist Reform” to a games economy, and when a game tries to allow for a free market structure allowing players to dictate and set value and worth among each other its just dead wrong.

I have been very lazy when it comes to this game and trying to make money, and for my time spent in it having 120g makes me happy even if its nothing compared to what others may have, and if those others took part in earning money through the TP I can care less. More power to them.

I have not spent time in this games market as I have just been uninterested at the moment due to other things I have been enjoying in the game, real life, etc.

The biggest thing that I see to impede the process though is the inability to sell below merchant prices, as it sets a base that can be high on some items which you don’t want when your goal is to make quick coinage.

See as someone else said you don’t make quick money by selling/reselling and blowing the price sky high off the bat. You find the stuff that goes fast that everyone wants and is easy to come by (harvesting, farming, buying and reselling) and you dump the market.

The faster and cheaper you get it the faster you make a profit by simply marking it up a small %, and you don’t worry about that other reseller who decides to buy all your 1000’s of 3 copper items to try to make 6 copper each on, because when you know what your doing you know to get a fresh supply back up fast and still undercut them from what they just bought. You make fast quick profits, they keep buying up large chunks of your stock (along with others who just need it) that they get stuck with longer and longer hoping to turn an even larger profit. Plus, if they undercut you its no biggie, because now they are losing money.

TBH though those of us doing this would actually be helping a larger chunk of the player base as we would be getting stuff up on the TP at a lower price, and sure we would still have a lot more money than most players, but isn’t that the issue here?

Those who want to restrict the ability can’t stand others having more money, because they chose to spend X hours running dungeons instead of X hours on the TP, or those who just can’t stand that someone else may feel their items are worth X amount as its out of their reach yet many, many, many other players have no issue buying them for that so they continue to sell for the higher price keeping it out of the hands of those who feel that it must only be worth X lower amount, because that’s all they are willing to pay and since they cannot or will not pay X higher amount the seller in some way just needs to be punished.

Honestly, with how many people complain so much about how poor they are maybe you all should ban together and ask ArenaNet to introduce the first (???) “Welfare” system into an MMO game, but TBH all the complainers would still be unhappy every time they got their “Tyrian Welfare Check”, because there still would always be those who had more than they did, and they still wouldn’t be able to afford those rare items they drool over.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

Now all my characters are going to have access to all my gold all the time. Which is a bad thing and causes people to start wasting gold more often cause they have it available all the time now.

Guess we can call this a new form of a GOLD SINK then.

That’s good and all, but in the end it comes down to allowing us to have control over our privacy so yes ArenaNet should allow their players the choice (as many other games do) of who they remain friends with or allow to follow them.

I appreciate your effort, but they are not feasible to fixing the issues with blocked accounts (why would you want to chat with a person you blocked anyway), inactive accounts (players been gone for over 3 months and not coming back), and refunded accounts (can’t interact with these at all) being stuck forever on your contact window lists.

Blocking a follower doesn’t fix the issues, and boy do I ever have a very big issue with the whole blocking feature in this game as its pointless and useless other than preventing people from contacting you through chat/mail.

The blocking system is a complete JOKE.

At the moment our family has a few REAL LIFE FRIENDS that we are no longer friends with (and no chance at that ever being reversed), but blocking them does not break the friendship so you still remain on their friends list where they can still see everything about you in full detail as if they were never being blocked.

Yes, I have confirmed this by blocking my wife, and she was still able to see my status, my points, the second I changed characters and where I was at, etc.

Sorry, that’s not just something that can be hidden or ignored. It needs to be fixed, and the fix is INSTANT REMOVAL from the blocked persons lists.

Giving us an option to right click on a person in the follower list and click “Remove Follower” so that your removed from their list is also needed (for various reasons), and in the end no different than any other game that makes you confirm a friend while removing both you and them from each others list when unfriended.

There are seven options when you right click on a person in any of the contact windows and not one of them allows us to remove our account from a follower.

This wouldn’t be such a big issue if this game was programmed to break all friendships on blocking a player (as other games do) as you could block and then unblock them to get them off the lists, but even that is not ideal as being able to right click on a follower and click “Remove Follower”.

No instead you block someone and then clear you block list later and they are all back in your friends or followers, and that makes sense why? In case of accidental block, but even then give a confirmation window on unblock asking if the person wants them added back to friends/followers/or all contact broken.

It is frustrating having to deal with account names in lists that are just permanently there now due to various issues, such as, refunded accounts.

I had a mango pie buff, and I sat there for 15 minutes straight with us just both going up and down in health before he finally just kept drinking and killing himself off.

Nice to see that they are going to tweak him even if it is after the fact.

GuzziHero.2467:

Unless you go in with 3+ <50 characters I don’t see how you could fail this.

Well not being able to get a group to even get a chance to try is an epic fail in my book, and lucky me I seem to log on at all the wrong times as when I look people are like good luck its to hard.

Delryn.7235:

Don’t bother, there will always be people to complain about everything. Hand them a platter full of the finest foods on earth for free and they’ll find something to complain about.

That’s because that platter is sure to have caviar, and I don’t do caviar.

join me up. my necro would like to experience this dungeon.

However, “just a clever usage of normal game mechanics” does not in itself mean that something is not an exploit or against the rules.

MR

I can see giving some forgiveness toward the GM’s/Support people as they are not always made aware of everything going on that could be a potential issue, however, that still does not excuse ArenaNet/NCsoft’s tone or attitude with dealing with their customers and Gaile’s (who is doing her job the way she is told and does it well under what restrictions may even be on her) statement on behalf of the company is a start, but not a total solution to win/maintain customer confidence/loyalty.

As an unaffected customer that is still what bothers me (and it seems many others), and not just because of this one issue or mistake, but many ongoing ones and this is just one more thing to add to my questioning where my confidence/loyalty is.

If anyone thinks that they have rights and protections in online gaming they are mistaken (the laws have not fully caught up to things) as they are 100% at the mercy of the company with them being the final “Judge and Jury” on the matter.

Don’t believe me? Read the ToS on just about any online game. Summed up from the boring fine print the ToS is not in the customers favor, it is written fully to protect the company, and just about everyone of them state that the developer/publisher is the final say in all matters. Meaning you have no real legal recourse which is why you agree everytime you log on that if you do seek some kind of recourse you will by means of arbitration and not court action.

As far as bugs. No! That’s no excuse for the developers.

Yes they take time to pin down, but unless they are doing things behind the scenes that is just way off from the norm then they have databases for everything a character does and can pinpoint things such as the x,y,z and height information of where a character was when they triggered a bug causing an issue in that JP, and slowly close them up as bug reports come in.

Most of the time the reason why it takes so long comes down to priority of importance and manpower to handle it. In every MMO I have ever played things like that JP issue would have been a very low priority issue, but had it been something like “Jump here, fall, die, revive at nearby WP, gain 2g instead of having 1s53c removed” the WP would have been shut down (along with the portal up most likely), and this thing ironed out within days tops.

The issue has happened since forever, and it was not a priority as annoying to us as it was, and now we sit and hope that since the detection methods that they have “complete confidence” in are triggering due to it that it should now be a high priority to fix as this can cost them customers in the long haul.

Bottom line. In the end ArenaNet/NCsoft while not horrible compared to other MMO companies is not as transparent about things either as you are trying to imply.

Pointing to the ToS and saying don’t do it again doesn’t cut it, sorry that’s where I disagree with Arenanet/NCsoft. It then comes down to “Do what again? You never even told me what I did to begin with”, and that is not fair to a paying customer as not everyone cheats or uses exploits intentionally.

The online gaming market has changed a lot in the last five years. The move to micro transaction gaming in the US alone has increased greatly, and its getting the attention of those who can pass laws and regulations on them.

Some states have already started passing certain legislation on online gaming companies to protect customers in their states, and those companies have complied.

If the industry doesn’t find a way to better regulate itself with dealing with things and actually giving paying customers that have invested in digital usage rights in the 100’s of dollars (and more) better details about what is going on when said accounts are at risk for complete termination then it is only a matter of time before laws catch up that are not in a companies best interest let alone our own.

Darkk.3018:

Even though I was not affected by this bug, it has left me worried should a situation like this happen to me. I would like to ask whether you’ve changed your email responses to people? If I knew I was completely innocent, I would be very distressed to receive an email that said

“The account will remain permanently closed and is not eligible for reactivation under any circumstances.” or

“and we will not entertain further discussion about this incident. Subsequent tickets will be closed without response.”

Those responses would horrify me if I received them and I would not know what other avenues of help I could use given that the official forums would be banned? I could always try other forums/reddit but sceptics will be everywhere :/ I do think chances of things like this happening are pretty slim, but I have experienced things that I’m told also only had a small percentage of happening.

I was not affected by this, but I was doing this JP the day it happened, and fell and died “A LOT” while trying to finish it.

If I were to have become banned and received such “Final” responses I would have just been done, took my money, and not even have bothered checking anything GW2 related and not known about the issue that happened resulting in the unfair ban.

Now my post game purchases may be modest, but as I play with my 13 year old twins, and their step-mom, across four accounts it isn’t so modest anymore for a family of five (I have a 2 year old that cannot play yet) buying gems for each person.

Thing is that is now four accounts and all future purchases be it gems or expansions now gone as income (since we game together as a family), and that may not be a lot, but when you have how many other unfair banned players just leave and their friends and family members leave it adds up to a lot more a lot faster.

I don’t have the luxury to expel money on a whim for a chance at maybe getting away with cheating, hacking, or whatever may break ToS, but TBH since this all happened though I just really have not been playing much.

I am all for anti-cheating mechanics of various kinds, and some games I have played have even implemented open monitoring of program processes which I really just don’t mind as I (one of the few probably) read the ToS and follow it (even if I do not agree with certain overboard things compared to other MMO’s).

I have to say that the language in which players (aka customers) are responded to when things like this happen is just (as I have posted elsewhere) shameful (and then some) compared to my experiences of how other competitors in the MMO market handle things that could lead to some form of disciplinary action.

I understand that near 100% may claim false ban and be lying, but that should not mean rude wording, bad treatment, or the appearance of support members taking the easy way out for that small % that is telling the truth.

While ArenaNet did the right thing (which I will admit they are usually very good at) and ate their “Humble” pie by posting their mistake it still does not fix the attitude as “NO ONE” should ever be able to find the nerve to claim “100%” or “Complete” confidence in anything really.

I have pointed out many times that Gaile is very good at what she does, and I have seen many people find help that if not for her they may not have (or it would have took way longer), as well as, the fact that many times she goes above and beyond for the community and players.

In many ways she reminds me a lot of “Moorgard” and “Blackgard” community liaisons (more or less) from the first few years of Everquest 2, and when they moved on for what they thought to be better pastures we all felt the loss, and Gaile reminds me a lot of both of them, and she does an awesome job doing her job.

I just think that while Gaile attempted to do a good job (and did for what she would be allowed to disclose) with reaching out to us we all know that even her hands are still tied to what and how she can say things, but even that all still does not give (and not by her doing) any real reassurance on future issues should they happen, or how they can and should handle communications to their players/customers differently.

That is what bothers me the most, and why right now I am just having a hard time logging in to want to play, and right now that’s four accounts less of possible income coming in right now which may be modest, but its still lost income.

How many others feel the same right now? How many others are feeling “Bleh” about all this and logging in less? How many others by logging in less or not at all right now are not putting income into the game?

If my families four account are the only ones feeling this way and logging in less then I deserve a reward for being the only 1-4 out of how many thousands of players?

GuzziHero.2467:

I got the WvWvW one just fine. Well, except for accidentally upsetting an invader when my flamer auto attack went off on him because I clicked him by mistake!

If that guy is reading this, I was the Dragonbrand guy using engie flamer as a torch. Sorry!

Michael Fejervary.8576:

Now while I did make it to the area without a teleport my 2 year old helped me fall off a cliff near the final chests at which point I did accept an offered teleport as I needed to log in order to put my focus on my child not the game.

You need to prioritise better. Games ALWAYS come first

IKR, but that’s what being patient until they can game with you is all about. Worked great with my 13 year old twins, and usually I don’t mind my 2 year old helping out by getting me killed though in there it was a bit more interesting that’s for sure.

Anyway, that wasn’t me that got flamed, but I do have to say once again that Dragonbrand was exceptional in helping allow for an unofficial truce even if others from SoS were not so exceptional about it. I was walking by large groups of you guys clustered around and noticed that no one was trying to instant kill me so I caught on pretty fast. I mainly had to watch for the little riots fellow SoS’ers started and the other realm (EB??? Can’t recall atm).

Luthan.5236:

Omg how did you do the Obsidian Sanctum Cache. Did they Hardcore WvW griefers not roflstomp you, you PvE guy?

Congratulations. This proves it was okay for ArenaNet to place 1 cache in WvW area.

I am more PvE than PvP and managed to get this.

Now while I did make it to the area without a teleport my 2 year old helped me fall off a cliff near the final chests at which point I did accept an offered teleport as I needed to log in order to put my focus on my child not the game.

It also helps that at least on our server line up most players were aware that more PvE types were in there and for the most part there was an unofficial truce going on, and while that made it easier it wasn’t a walk in the park either.

I don’t mind PvP content mixed in to a point with my PvE experience when it is something like “Crab Toss” or “Dragon Ball”, however, just because some of us that fall into the more PvE player type obtained this achievement that does not prove that it was okay for Arenanet to force this style of play on players.

They allowed a lazy habit of players relying on portals to get to the end of a good chunk of jumping puzzles (I have mixed feelings on this myself as in other games I have played it would be considered a legal, but not so legal exploit) in which case it seems that they may have just went with this expecting that players were going to use portals and that PvE’ers would take advantage of them and it would not be so painful.

To be honest though if that were even part of what was considered then it just seems even more lazy on the content designers parts, but I am one person with my own view and opinion so I don’t care if anyone agrees or not.

If they want to make PvP’ers feel like they get something out of these living stories other than just PvP games then make better neutral content around that so that even PvE’ers can fit in better.

To be honest it would have been interesting to have a PvP/WvW type zone based upon the Aetherblades theme where the achievements were a mix between NPC Aetherblade kills and PC kills.

Things like that where even the least experienced PvP’er could take part in something less frustrating, because as many have said about their own server line ups they won’t even have a chance at this cache as they do not own/nor will they own a keep to get in to begin with be it small server or not enough PvP interest as a whole on it, etc.

So when all is said and done I am all for an achievement taking reasonable skill and effort, but to dangle a carrot in front of hundreds of people that will never be able to even attempt this is just wrong.

All achievements even if hard should be at least accessible, and they could have thought that part through by allowing even a temporarily patched in portal into the WvW JP where you zone into the EB.

Though it is what it is and they did put it into a PvP JP area so outside some of the considerations they could have did with this being a limited event I don’t agree with those complaining that people are PvP’ing them, etc.

Even being more PvE myself I knew very well that even trying to attempt this once in was what it was. A PvP area.

Hoping I can find a group to do the dungeon with for the achievements as I don’t do many dungeons, but I did have fun doing the “Flame and Frost” one, as well as, Arah for my personal story completion.

Pretty much all of the people I came with from GW1 left within the first two months after launch so I never got the chance to fully learn the whole dungeon thing with the group of people I was familiar with.

While it is good to see that they found the issue and are working on reinstating those who were wrongfully banned the responses to those tickets just really bothers me.

Is it just me or do they really just come across as having a highly arrogant tone?

I understand things happen, and that 97% of the time those claiming they did nothing wrong did, but still the smugness in the final responses is just shameful.

It almost comes across as a waste of time to worry about those 3% of customers that may have been banned due to the detection methods (guessing auto-detection software plays a big part) not being worthy of “complete confidence”.

It also comes across that a chance to a fair appeal since NCsoft is “confident that our detection systems are accurate” is never really going to happen and these customers just got lucky plain and simple, and while they may have confidence in their detection methods it does not leave me with that same confidence anymore.

Its frustrating, because in the end we are just all at the mercy of the company behind the game we are currently playing with no real rights or protections other than trust, but how do you continue to trust under such circumstances?

I hope the best for all who were hit by this and that you rightfully get your accounts back, and Arenanet while I do understand mistakes happen (and in the end you guys are usually pretty good about doing the right thing) the tones being communicated to your customers just seems to be very poor.

Is this suppose to be looting dropped chests?

If so it was not working for me on that as the wooden chest I had drop was well within its AOE distance, but I still had to walk to it and loot it.

I do have to say that at least some due to the nature of the event are going above it being a pvp zone, for whatever reason, and was floored that Dragonbrand having tons of people in there trying to attempt it too was not finger happy with their skills.

Walked around 10-20 of them at a time without them messing with us Sea of Sorrow players.

Though I am disappointed with PvP being mixed into PvE content in this manner. The little rival games like “Crab Toss” and “Dragon Bash” are one thing, but it was far from necessary to pick a PvP Jumping Puzzle as part of a PvE event.

Its not like its not already hard enough to do some of them under normal PvE conditions.

What better excus…er, reason to push for one day a year that honors “Nicholas Sandford and Professor Yakkington” and allows a player to do one free world transfer while having some kind of in-game remembrance on that day for them.

Gaile, understanding and not suggesting as an immediate consideration (as this is something I myself have no need for), but as far as display name requests there is a way to do it while following all the “Very Good” reasons you stated above.

First: It should always be a “Paid Service” set more toward a premium price (not just an easy “Meh, 800 gems is nothing to me” so as to discourage its frequent use.

Second: If a person has had any complaints of harassment or anything for that matter that has flagged their account for investigation it will not allow a change at all until fully resolved.

Third: If they had been found at fault for breaking the various rules that being able to change a name would restart their reputation, etc then this can not be done for at least 6 months from the last occurrence (if ever).

Fourth (and onward): Whatever else of importance to prevent issues that I may have forgotten.

Now provided an account passes all of those then a player can do one once every 3 months and when they do they will have something like “Formally Known As” in a popup box when their display name is hovered over.

If a player has not been found to break any rules then past names could start to fall off over a period of time as if they have not broke any rules then they really are not a threat to be in need of starting over with a new name, and maybe this can start at 6 months to 1 year depending on their reputation and track record on their account.

Of course if they become an issue then they just don’t get the fall off or another name change later.

I only suggest the fall off phase based on an issue I had when I was setting up my “Steam” account where I was following what it said to do and due to an error it goofed up my display name to at first only display half my name which I corrected right away, but now thanks that error (which I fixed within seconds) it forever shows me as having a name that was not even my first display name.

Bottom line though had that not happened it would not even have a former display name to be looked up as I have never changed it, nor do I want to.

I was considering suggesting the above, but I have not as of yet as it seems you were trying to condense all of this to one thread.

Just my view.

Other than “Bits” and “Bytes” taking an online avatar through a virtual world MMO’s are really no different than the “Blood” and “Bones” that take our physical bodies through the real world.

Even “Real Life” keeps us prisoner to some form of RNG everyday, and just like in real life you are never going to have it all in a virtual world either.

In real life we have “the Lottery” and “Casinos” and when someone spends hundreds of dollars they don’t have only to lose it they tend to blame those who created that form of RNG.

In the virtual world we have “Drops” and Crates" and when someone spends hundreds of dollars they don’t have only to lose it they tend to blame those who created that form of RNG.

In both cases most will still repeat the whole “Chance” and “Blame” game of RNG regardless of it being real life or a virtual world.

Sure we could all say that we don’t play in a virtual world to experience real life, but the core of any fantasy world is still based on the real life experiences of the creator.

In this case its developers working for a company, and the creators don’t stay in a job and keep the company profitable by getting rid of all ties to real life. In which case in this genre it has always come down to either having RNG in a subscription based game or RNG in a virtual funds (bought with real life cash) based game.

Thing is in a virtual funds based RNG game there is less profit to maintain the game, developers, turn a profit, etc when and if to many things are allowed to be tradable, and that is the trade off to be had compared to a subscription game where almost everything can be traded to other players and non-tradable items are far fewer.

In the end your going to pay for your RNG experience one way or another and short of quitting gaming (or never buying virtual funds again) your not going to escape it.

Myself I understand that there are always going to be things that no matter how bad I may want them in-game I will never have them so I just don’t let greed get to me and instead just concentrate on having fun playing.

I was just happy to get a jade ticket out of the normal coffers as I would have never spent real money on just the chance of a skin alone in that style of obtainment.

CorneliusCoffin.3169:

What I think is funny is that so far 100% of the people that keep coming in here to tell us we’re idiots and can’t read haven’t adressed the issue we’re trying to raise here.
It’s dramatic irony, really.

What I think is funny is that you started your own post along with a title and content that portrayed you as having issues with things not being clear without having to go to a wiki, update notes, or some sort of walkthrough as your main focus.

Then it appears very shortly after the first few that agreed with your initial post that as soon as others started pointing out how (or why) they felt different from you that you appeared to then portray a reversal from your original main focus.

As stated by you;

“It was meant to be constructive criticism to turn something that is good already into something ever better. If that pains you so much, but you have nothing constructive to add, other than we’re all idiots because some us have actually studied narratology, then please suffer in silence.”

So those of us who had stated their constructive criticism about how if anything your original post was flawed, because we felt that if anything way to much information was given at every turn and maybe the fault was in part that of players not paying attention was somehow attacked by you in various ways as not being constructive.

In that case I guess one could say the same thing to you “if it pains you so much” that not everyone shares your initial view and their constructive criticism doesn’t fit total agreement to yours then “please suffer in silence” and stop quoting and posting against them every time they share a thought that does not match yours.

I do not recall anyone saying things were 100% perfect and without flaws, and most of us also pointed out agreement (even if ONLY to a point) about Kiel and the last 2 suspects. However, many of us also pointed out that regardless of in-game prompts or narrative communication (depending on which side you changed to) that we still had no real issues with following the story progression and knowing what to do.

I am sorry, you didn’t get the results you may have been looking for, but I think overall most have left decent enough feedback from both sides even if not in total agreement to your original post to give the developers that may read this some ideas on how to maybe help link things better without ruining things by making it even easier than it already is either.

Mourningcry.9428:

Shame it seems so few people had the opportunity to experience the games of yore… back when all you got was “There is a small mailbox here.”

Imagine having a gamer think for themselves….

West of House
You are standing in an open field west of a white house, with a boarded front door.
There is a small mailbox here.

The C64 days when there were no instant online FAQ’s, and before the “Not so useful” hint decoders that eventually came with Infocom games.

Now to find my DOS emulator as Windows 7 does not allow me to play Zork I, II, or III anymore without one.

Thing is “Over time” can mean anything be it a few weeks, a few months, or worse case a few years.

Understandable that any developer would not want to give an exact time frame due to how players mistake even “if things go right we hope to do this within the next six months, but to be honest it may take longer” and run with it as a “Hey, they are going to fix that within the next six months they promised”.

However, infancy or not almost a year that the game has been out is a long time in MMO Land, and it just sounds more like a brush off wait and see and if we decide to get around to it answer.

I understand that that may not be how you mean it, but considering most MMO companies have teams (even if its two people) tasked with working on watching these things from launch to tweak as needed as they expect the initial rush of players entering and fanning out among the games upper zones, etc.

I was wondering where all these events that I remember doing back at launch over the first month were, and have sat around waiting for them to start scratching my head while on my main (who is level 80) as I like to go back to old areas as this game makes it meaningful to by way of de-leveling and what not.

I just don’t understand how almost a year goes by and something like this gets overlooked when this game is built upon being de-leveled and having the “END GAME” at all areas and stages of the game, etc.

Yes, I am actually quite upset to read the answer as some of my favorite moments in game were doing these events, and still going back waiting around hoping to do them again or catch those that I never got a chance to do yet, but knew they were there.

No wonder why so many zones feel so much more barren an uneventful.

I guess I don’t have to sit around in game scratching my head wondering anymore, but this is one those moments where you find that it was probably better off being clueless than knowing the real reasons why.

No disrespect to you or the team was meant here either so I really hope it didn’t or doesn’t come across that way. If so I am sorry as that was not my intention at all.

Gaile might I suggest your development team take the time by adding code that prevents this from even being possible to begin with.

I have seen just through your posts on related areas that you seem to go way above and beyond in helping forum goers after the support tickets, etc and that is great, because overall it seems that ArenaNet is not in the market of intentionally taking people for mistakes due to what the game code may allow when it shouldn’t.

To those this may happen to I also would just like to say that just as with any company an employee may not always make the best choices that would reflect their employer (intentional or not), and being human even the best employee is subject to making mistakes or wrong decisions while trying to follow their best interpretation of policy while trying to perform their job as instructed.

It doesn’t excuse things fully, because it does seem that there may be some lack of cross communication within ArenaNet’s own inner structures that could be dealt with as well by making sure for example all of their CS staff is aware that in a case that an item such as the bank tabs has this issue and the customer is at max it would be allowable to be considered an exception to the rules, etc.

People also have to remember that past paying whatever tax one may on obtaining a virtual currency the currency itself and what it may obtain is just really not regulated by any means for a consumers protection.

In many ways its still to new and laws/regulations have not yet caught up to it, but that’s why its even more important that companies who really are honest and trustworthy do the right thing for many reasons including preventing over regulation creeping in by laws of any various country they may do business in.

Again, while its always unpleasant to see someone have a bad time with this, so far ArenaNet has overall been pretty good about being reasonable in the end (despite whatever mix up CS may have at the start).

However, again it would go so much farther to make sure things like this was not even possible to begin with by game code. More so when so many players have come to GW2 from so many other MMO’s where this was already the norm and they would not think to even know that this games system would allow it.

While I think coin sinks can be a good thing in a MMO and “Moa Racing” has potential to do that I just don’t see how its long lasting past the event.

Most people are only doing it for one of two reasons and that’s to either get the achievement (and cash out) or to get the achievement and the special event moa mini.

What about afterwards? What is really left as a reason once the event ends?

To get the non-event moa mini for those who have to “Bank Them All” maybe, but once that is done what is left as a reason to keep going?

By design “Moa Racing” is not going to make anyone rich (or richer) as the odds are stacked to high as a way to remove money not create it and add it into the economy.

Even then a coin sink is only as good as its design and a long term coin sink has got to offer up reasons for players to keep taking part in it so that it can continue to help keep the economy in check. I just don’t see how 2 mini’s are going to do that alone to warrant it remaining as a long term coin sink.

Now maybe if they added some other interesting reward options for players to work toward with higher ticket values to obtain it would be a worth while long term coin sink.

Don’t take me to serious as its just random ideas, but add other things like maybe a “Legendary Moa Hammer” or “Legendary Moa Greatsword” that costs an insane (but doable over the long haul) amount in tickets. It would be insane to see a player with colorful moa strapped to their back or wielded by their legs with their neck stretched out straight like a sword attacking things in the open world.

Sure “PETA” supporters may be up in arms, but it wouldn’t be the first time, and besides its a game where most of the human population is going to understand the difference between imaginary and picking up and wielding their pet poodle in real life.

Anyway, as I said as cool as it could be its just an absurd idea to get the point across of how I could see “Moa Racing” needing things a lot more long term than just one or two mini’s before it just isn’t useful anymore as even a coin sink.