Guild Wars 2

Sylvyn.4750:

Yeah, there were no changes in today’s stress test numbers from what we saw on the PvP/WvW test…

Not that numbers are the real and only problem.
How do they expect to fix and balance this class with no new beta or community feedback on the horizon?

A passive trait doesn’t work.
No underwater skills.
No bugfix for things that are broken since HoT.
Summons on a channeling class.
40/50 energy cost on skills.
Kalla (GS user) comes with a SB.

2 years of development.

For Renegade at this point I expect them to only change numbers, that won’t solve much since Kalla doesn’t appeal by any point of view.

It’s a failure even if they make it strong.
They should have started gaining community feedback long ago.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Everything with Breakrazor can go wrong, and there is no grand reward for things going right.

Remove “with Breakrazor” and you basically have a tl;dr description of Revenant and Renegade in PoF.

Zenith.7301:

If you think that a build from a month before release is anything but release candidate, you are hopelessly naive.

You’re right, but at this point I expect them to only change numbers, that won’t solve much since Kalla doesn’t appeal by any point of view. It’s a failure even if they make it strong.

They should have started gaining community feedback long ago.

Garr.1823:

PvE only

Not really.
- Traits are decent but not worth taking over Herald.
- F-Skills are unusable since they have energy costs that mess up with any legend rotation. F3 has the highest energy cost ever seen basically, with 40 for just an aoe with average damage.
- Shortbow is the worst weapon a Revenant can equip. And Kalla used to have a Greatsword by the way.
- Kalla skills are trash. Huge energy cost for basically nothing in return. The healing is the worst in the entire game, and is a breakstun.

tl;dt
Skills are trash and traits are not enough to compensate for what Herald offers.
I don’t see myself using Kalla in PvE in its current state.

40 energy on 1 F skill. 60 energy to use 2 utility skills. -9 upkeep on a well.

And changing those numbers won’t fix anything. Even making them 0 energy cost, those skills are useless.

Shield was decent before they nerfed it to oblivion. A condi cleanse on it would fix many issues, with just 1 line of code.

Burtnik.5218:

cut

Personal attacks aside, weapon swap was the best thing that could happen to revenant. Being free to swap between hammer and sword without also swapping legend, or being free to swap legend for break stun or energy without swapping weapon is an upgrade, a straight upgrade with no counter effects, on what Revenant was before that suggestion. And was useful in many scenarios.
Without weaponswap Revenant would have had another free limitation with no actual benefit since we don’t have kits or conjured weapons.

But that’s an old argument and it’s useless to talk about it.

Basically huge energy costs on every utility skill and also F-skills make this legend unusable (2 skills, swap, use decent legend, reswap, 2 skills, wait for swap cd, repeat).

Shortbow is decent but bugged, traits are good but not really synergic with core Rev.

Healing skill with stun break is terrible, doesn’t heal much and you basically have to waste your heal if you stunbreak or your stunbreak if you heal.

Also phantasm animations are clunky, Icerazor doesn’t chill (that would have synergy with Mallyx) and most importantly: those costly “wells” can be killed or cc’d, and also have cooldowns on top of energy cost.

On top of that, Rev was already hit pretty heavily by nerfs over the past 2 years, mainly because of PvP pre-split. Given that PoF meta will be all about condi and boonrip, Revenant will be basically unusable, having no condi cleanse and relying heavily on boons with Herald or Resistance with Mallyx.

Also no underwater Jalis and Glint/Kalla for no reason. Come on, you made 40 skills for Weaver, plus underwater.

SUGGESTIONS
- Remove energy cost on F-skills, replacing it with cooldowns. This way the core legends won’t be disrupted.
- Remove cooldowns and lower energy costs on Kalla’s skills.
- Summons should be invulnerable, or at least with way more HP and immune to CC.
- Icerazor should Chill.
- Invocation trait should remove 2 conditions, Jalis should cleanse 3.
- Make Mallyx Resistance impossible to strip or corrupt, otherwise Mallyx is dead in PvP and WvW.
- Add at least Jalis for underwater. It has just 1 ground targeted skills, come on.
- Revert some of the nerfs that were made before the PvP split (like on Sword-3 and Shield-5).

RENEGADE
Sorry if that’s over 100 words.

Basically huge energy costs on every utility skill and also F-skills make this legend unusable (2 skills, swap, use decent legend, reswap, 2 skills, wait for swap cd, repeat).

Shortbow is decent but bugged, traits are good but not really synergic with core Rev.

Healing skill with stun break is terrible, doesn’t heal much and you basically have to waste your heal if you stunbreak or your stunbreak if you heal.

Also phantasm animations are clunky, Icerazor doesn’t chill (that would have synergy with Mallyx) and most importantly: those costly “wells” can be killed or cc’d, and also have cooldowns on top of energy cost.

On top of that, Rev was already hit pretty heavily by nerfs over the past 2 years, mainly because of PvP pre-split. Given that PoF meta will be all about condi and boonrip, Revenant will be basically unusable, having no condi cleanse and relying heavily on boons with Herald or Resistance with Mallyx.

Also no underwater Jalis and Glint/Kalla for no reason. Come on, you made 40 skills for Weaver, plus underwater.

SUGGESTIONS
- Remove energy cost on F-skills, replacing it with cooldowns. This way the core legends won’t be disrupted.
- Remove cooldowns and lower energy costs on Kalla’s skills.
- Summons should be invulnerable, or at least with way more HP and immune to CC.
- Icerazor should Chill.
- Invocation trait should remove 2 conditions, Jalis should cleanse 3.
- Make Mallyx Resistance impossible to strip or corrupt, otherwise Mallyx is dead in PvP and WvW.
- Add at least Jalis for underwater. It has just 1 ground targeted skills, come on.
- Revert some of the nerfs that were made before the PvP split (like on Sword-3 and Shield-5).

I have the same issue. Keeps disconnecting me since the Mordrem event started. Today twice in pvp map and then in norn starting city, 30 seconds apart from each occurrence. I’ve done a network check and speedtests, I’ve never had similar problems with GW2.

Is that a server problem or a problem with my provider? I’m from Italy.

Sure but no burst healing. Our only hurst heal is glint’s and only if attacked

6+9? Quickness does not affect shiro’s healing. It always has 0.5s cd between daggers

The mechanic is fine, maybe some skills need a cost reduction.
People just want an easy skillspam class, I hope they don’t get it.

Kidel.2057:

If energy is so easy to manage that you can camp a legend without swapping then it means that you have 10 utility skills (double compared to other classes) and you’re NOT paying any drawback for tham.

I agree, the problem is that people like Griffith just want 10 skills to spam, they don’t care about having to learn a class. Trust ANet, they won’t listen to an evil Berserk character.

skowcia.8257:

Sword/sword zerk ammy Shiro/Jalis (i dont plan to use weapon swap)

Some people are so sad.

Sentinel VX.1392:

Kidel.2057:

Any way to permanently remove this red “!” mark? It’s there every time I log in to my main character, even if I have everithing unlocked.

Have the same problem with the first character that I logged in after the patch.

Same here
Can any dev please look into this? https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Red-on-training-icon-Always/first

I think that all the people who logged in during the infamous patch is having this.
It’s probably caused by the fact that training was reset and now is full again.

I also have this by the way.

You can’t compare them because Revenant is not Thief.
Thief has more burst damage and stealth. 3s of BV from a stealthed thief would wreak every class in the game.

Thief already has too many toys. BV is just the cherry.
Revenant has nothing.

more then 1 second of basilisk venom + shadowstep + initiative? No please, don’t destroy pvp.
Thinks like JW and CttB are good on Revenant/Reaper because they don’t have burst and stealth.
However CttB is clearly op compared to JW, but at least it has 2m cooldown.

2s of basilisk venom and shadowstep? No please.
That would destroy pvp.

Black Box.9312:

The concept clearly is lost on you…

I hate people who are unable to provide any argument and just say things like this.
Personally I have no problem keeping swiftness up all the time without stopping once with my Guardian. I also use staff and shouts in my regular build, so I don’t really have any problem if roamers attack me (if they can reach me).
If you can’t stack swiftness properly then l2p before pretending to be smarter then others.

If I need to stay ranged I can’t swap legend because it would also change my weapon. This would force me to stay into the same legend for a long time, while the class is designed to swap legend a lot to gain skill cooldowns and also a lot of energy and trait benefits.
Same can be applied to melee. I may need to stay melee but if I swap legend it gets hammer. Then what? I have to avoid swapping legend even if I need its skills and my energy is low.

DaveyC, it’s bad design, just admit it.

Also I’d have to change weapon sets every time I change a legend from the set out of the battle. Bad QoL.

Normal independent weapon swap is much better. Listen to reason.

DroidDreamer.2861:

The elite skill is a beast mode Damage Reduction ability on a very low cool down.

Even factoring the huge energy cost, the very long cast time and the very short duration?

ronpierce.2760:

Hey everyone. I just wanted to say, I feel like many of the traits are a bit weak and look like they’ve been balanced around the old system, prior to merges and general buffs, leaving many feeling uninspired and leaving much to be desired. So, lets help out and if you have a cool idea for a Revenant-fitting trait, or a change to an existing one, throw it out there!

I’ll throw a few out there, as well.

Invocation Line (The “Class” line.)
Prevalent Presence (GM, NEW): Invoking a Legend triggers one of that legend’s spells. (No ICD, each would simply be triggerable once every 20 seconds with only two swapping Legends.)
Jalis – Inspiring Reinforcements
Mallyx – Pain absorption.
Ventari – (Doesn’t require tablet, circles around you.) Natural Harmony.

Invigorating Howl (Master, rework): Heal yourself and nearby allies for 15(.02) health per energy spent. 360 radius. (No ICD)

Fierce Infusion (Adept, Change): Remove ICD. Gain 8 seconds of fury when using a heal.

Cleansing Channel (Adept, Change): Increase to 2 removed Conditions on legend swap. (Brings it in line with Brawler’s recovery, remains less persistent as it’s a slower swap cycle.)

Corruption Line
Maniacal Persistence (GM, change): Increase to 3% increased critical hit per stack (one per second). Landing a critical hit removes a single stack of Maniacal Persistence.

Diabolic Inferno (GM, rework): Landing a Critical hit with an energy-costing skill (no auto attack spam!) applies a 2 second burn. (Shouldn’t require a ICD not affecting Autos.)

Yearning Empowerment (GM minor, additon): In addition to increased torment duration, increase critical hit against tormented enemies by 10%.

Frigid Precision (Master, Addition): Add a small damage source to the proc, reduce CD to 8 seconds.

Rampant Vex (Adept minor, change): Increase chance to 66% on critical hit, for the tree to work better for non-Mace builds.

Retribution Line
Empowering Vengeance (GM, addition): Gain 2 might for 8 seconds, and extend the duration of retaliation by 1 second when struck while under the effects of Retaliation. (1 sec ICD).

Feel free to add your own, comment, and discuss!

Much welcomed.

Lyrsen.6702:

I have a full list of trait/specialization suggestions here for the four lines we could use in the revenant weekend.

Your thread gives too many suggestions. While I agree with many of them, some are a bit too early. I’d wait the end of the week with Shiro reveal. It will probably get most of the fury/might and precision related stuff.

I’d wait for Shiro trait line before making a thread so detailed.
Fury will probably go into that instead of Corruption as you want.

it’s true, that’s another reason for weaponswap

This is a nice idea, but just plain old weapon swap would be so much better and give so many customization options. Each Revenant would have 4 different combinations with weaponsets and legends, making up for the lack of utility skill customization.

It’s not difficult if every weapon just has 2 modes.

example:
Hammer + Jalis/Ventari: ranged, like now
Hammer + Shiro/Mallyx: melee+cleave

or vice versa.

And how would you implement it? A weapon taken from your inventory? What if you have 2 hammers with different stats? What if you have none? What if you just want to use 1 weapon type?

Linking weapon to the legend is nonsense.

What if I like hammer with Ventari? Why should I be forced to use staff?
Being tied to 1 weapon per legend is a BAD thing.

Either give normal premade weapon swap or nothing

At the moment it’s pretty much a glass cannon with no cannon. Almost squishy as a thief, but without peak damage and all the mobility/escape/blindness/invisibility

Douwe.1746:

On weaponswap sigils do not proc when you swap legends.

they do. At least aoe bleeding one (Earth), checked it myself

Hammer skill #3 (the leap and teleportback one) doesn’t make you teleport back if you go down in the process. Happened to me while fighting Claw of Jormag.

The animation is too slow to allow that to happen.

why did you open loot bags and chests?

give weaponswap and buff current skills (including weaponskills), plus more stunbreakers and swiftness.

No need for customizable skills, it would wipe out the class base. Those are not your skill, those are the legend skills. And you’d need to recustomize them everytime you equip a legend (unles they implement a way to remember them, wich they won’t)

Check out also this thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/3-Days-Revenant-PvP-Review-Suggestions/first
It’s amazing.

Awesome thread, OP. One of the best so far. I seriously hope devs listen to all you said.

I’m appointing you as my voice here. I agree with almost everything and I’m happy you said that weaponskills should not have energy cost at all.

Thanks for your hard work. This should be sticky and get visibility.

This guy also did try a tank build in pvp https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/PvP-tank-Revenant/first
Both of you say similar things, that the Revenant is fragile and once they target you it’s over.

It could be 5, the problem is the same.

1) it’s useless because you still have cooldowns. Having cooldown and energy makes no sense.
2) toggle skills that easily suck away all your energy will make you unable to do anything. While this is not a serious issue in pve, it is in pvp.

LetoII.3782:

Kidel.2057:

Make it follow, like an engineer turret

I think he was referring to the regen part that you cut.

Did it also have cooldown on skills with energy? Seems stupid.
Also GW1 system was a lot slower compared to GW2. We either need infinite energy or a different pool for weaponskills.

Autosummon: a must.
Only reason to swap to a legen is to use its 6-0 skills (since they don’t change 1-5), and summoning the tablet is the only way to use Ventari ones. Makes no sense then I have to swap then summon. It’s redundant.

Autofollow: maybe that, maybe insta cast on 6 (and all other skills), so I’m actually able to do something while managing the tablet.
At the moment every tablet action locks you, making impossible to do anything else.

Or make some skills toggle and passive maybe? Like “6-mode”, “7-mode”, “8-mode”, and it’s just toggled to be triggered every X seconds.

tldr; make something to allow people to manage tablet and attack/dodge

+1 nice test. I felt the same way, while I did not focus on a tank build, even with Jalis traits and skills I was fragile in pvp.

Being forced to use Mallyx elite means you don’t use weaponskills for long. The shared pool is a serious issue.

This thread however has more suggestions and many of them are to the core (no swap, energy cost, mobility): https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/My-big-Revenant-Rework/first

Hammer Bolt:
- Jalis/Ventari: Unchanged
- Mallyx/Shiro: Melee attack with increased damage and cleave up to 5 targets.

Since everyone in Revenant forum already knew about Shiro, it makes sense they just reveal it. Why hide it any longer?
Amazing art.

Please. It makes no sense that I can’t use weaponskills if I activate a toggle utility/elite.

Thief has no cost on utility, Revenant should have no cost on weapon, also because they already have cooldown.

Lore-wise, weaponskills are made by the character, the Revenant. Energy is something used to invoke a legend skill, so it should only be on legend skills.

I agree with OP. I hope this thread gets more visibility.
Solutions 1 or 3 are the best options for me.

Seriously, why no weapon swap? Only because like that there is 1 class for each type? Seems stupid.

Revenant can get 5 new skills from 6 to 0, but those are s bit underpowered compared to other classes, and are not customizable. This makes up for the swap already.

Also all revenant skills have cooldown AND energy cost, why?

Not only they’re useless, but most of the time downed skill #3 doesn’t even work.
Compared to Warrior/Guardian downed skills, they’re a huge mess.

Shiro can be great, but Revenant will have huge flaws if other legends are not fixed.