Guild Wars 2

Hello, could we have an ETA about fixing this problem please?

Hello, I wanted to point out that there is a big clipping issue with asuras on the new dragon helm as you can see. Not much helms allow to show the asura ears and it could be nice to get more. Was the helm intended not to show the ears or to show it with a little different design? Thank you !

Ananeos.4587:

A team posted a 5 man Sabetha on reddit recently and posted the dps values of all members in the raid. Thief did 28k+ autoattacking, Ele did 30k+ while in air attunement alone and Mesmer was doing a average of 8-9k spamming all his skills.

balance and skill mate, balance and skill…

The best would be to do a reddit post maybe they will be able to learn…

From a PvP standpoint:

deleting amulets was good.
The balance patch leads to the question if the balance team play this game or not. (e.g. look at the Mesmer forum, look at the PvP forum). A lot of people moving to BnS after this. Maybe some questions should be asked..

Basaltface.2786:

Nieguen.6235:

I did not smile. Making fun about something that was wrong since the beginning, from the design to the beta that was promoted as a “package” for the new engi elite spec.
Before any tweak on gyros, making assumption that AI can bring a plus to any profession in this game is wrong at so many levels..
Then:
can’t follow the engi (speed, wall, whatever)
hp which is a nightmare to balance (in any case it will be useless considering the amount of aoe in this game)
the mechanic they bring can be outperformed by other utilities EASILY
the CD (as if HP + Erratic movement was not enough)

Gyros are bad in terms of design and implementation, period.

At best they can compete with the turrets.

Turrets got atleast 1 blast finisher and you can nuke em instantly rather with a cast time, turrets can be overcharged, turrets can be traited to deploy a shield bubble for a short period of time what i personally find very VERY usefull and turrets got a lower CD then the gyros AND stay on the field longer too. Also i dont need to trait them to get a “nice thing on nuking” effect either.. like i gotta do with the gyros. To say compete with turrets is an insult to the to death nerfed remains of turrets that STILL outperform the gyros. I really rather slot a turret into an utility slot then any of the gyros to be fully honest cause atleast it does nice things. Only the sneak gyro really is somewhat usefull… but so is the crate, elixir-x and mortar that i also rather slot then the sneak.

That’s why I said “At best”

Because design iterations and cliff jumping

I did not smile. Making fun about something that was wrong since the beginning, from the design to the beta that was promoted as a “package” for the new engi elite spec.
Before any tweak on gyros, making assumption that AI can bring a plus to any profession in this game is wrong at so many levels..
Then:
can’t follow the engi (speed, wall, whatever)
hp which is a nightmare to balance (in any case it will be useless considering the amount of aoe in this game)
the mechanic they bring can be outperformed by other utilities EASILY
the CD (as if HP + Erratic movement was not enough)

Gyros are bad in terms of design and implementation, period.

At best they can compete with the turrets.

“We’ve been enjoying watching all of the scrapper gyros buzzing around in the jungle, helping allies and clearing the way for Pact forces. Our focus for the engineer has been to improve less used traits and to rework some functionality for scrapper traits. For the core specializations, trait improvement efforts have been made toward creating impactful choices and making each build choice more distinctive. With that said, we’re still monitoring the defensive nature of the scrapper and may look to implement a reduction in survivability.”

“We’ve been enjoying watching all of the scrapper gyros buzzing around in the jungle, helping allies and clearing the way for Pact forces” PRICELESS JOKE (useless gyros skill, too slow, can’t follow player if wall or jump)

that being said,
waiting to see which kind of rework they did on the scrapper traits.

For the core specs hopefully they deleted the illogical stuff such as:

Explosive traits line:
Cd on explosive power keg V thermobaric detonation
Glass canon

Firearms:
the obivous need of continuous use of the flamethrower (juggernaut)
the useless modified ammunition

Inventions:
cd reduction of AMR (maybe to use something different from Healing turret? )
rework of overshield (gain protection AFTER skill use)
maybe reduce pace of boons application in Experimental Turrets
rework of energy amplifier (unless Healing power becomes a meaningful thing)
rework of medical dispersion field (Engi is not a Druid).

Alchemy:
Useless trait Health Insurance (MedKit needs a BIG rework)
Iron Blooded

Tools:
Optimized Activation V Adrenal Implant (wut???)
Rework of Gadgeteer

Tuning down a bit the defensive nature of the scrapper would be understandable as soon as there is a will to finally delete the bunker meta (and hopefully we will not fall in a “sniper” meta: 1 shot – 1 kill)

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3v0x29/how_do_anet_expect_us_to_take_pvp_seriously_when/cxk3v95

Yeah I agree that really should have been more clear, I think we felt it was and clear that HoT was setting up the first season and obviously it was not.

=> They do not make a clear statement on GW2 forum
=> They say HoT is seeting up the first season ==> So why ranked was blocked until now???

Matchmaking should have been corrected with the patch, but you know….

“We strongly believe that regular balance updates are one of the key pillars of building a successful competitive game. As such, prior to each season, there will be a balance update. League play will generally begin about two weeks after a balance update to ensure that the metagame has stabilized in an appropriate manner. Balance will be closely monitored throughout the season with the goal of having solid balance going into the postseason tournaments.”

Thanks for the answer but most of the time in PvP it does not come back

The second skill of the shield “Tides of times” bug. If the wave encouters an obstacle in the environment (part of a wall…), it does not come back.

I think there is a BIG problem about, PvP, you reduce visual noise for everything thinking it will look better, and push more player to play PvP and see ESL.

But seriously? Chaos armor is nearly impossible to see now, Auras.. etc… Soon there will be so much visual noise reduction, we will not be able to know what kind of thing is doing the opponent.

balance and bug correction should be your first priority.

Thanks for the answers. I know that there is damage to be done. And mostly the tanks are kind of hybrid between power and thoughness.

Why I tested with a mesmer: because it can be interesting to see how the tanking can be affected by a mix between thoughness and damages on a “light” class.

It would be nice to see a dev explain a little bit about the effect of the amount of damage you do VS the amount of thoughness you have. (formula)

The test I did show clearly that you need a good amount of damage to keep the aggro even if you have a very good amount of thoughness. So thoughness is not “that” important.

I talk about loosing aggro, not just doing a turn

I have already done that

Hi, as said in many different topics and website (reddit, dulfy, youtube…), the guy with the “best” thoughness will have the aggro as soon as he is close to the mob and deals damage.

So I tested with my mesmer (yes a mesmer) to tank just guardians in the raid, following is a screen of my stats without buff or food.
I play sword+shield / staff. I stayed close to the mob, dealt damage, and a reaper of my guild close to me took the aggro with only 1100 thoughness (and took it a lot of times…)

So:
Does CC reinitialize the aggro?
Does the amount of damage is fundamental for getting the aggro?

Hopefully a dev will answer the question posted by op Monday…

It is annoying, in a lot of sPvP parties, if not in any parties, there is this bug : we can not stomp someone we have to finish it doing damage. It is just game breaking in sPvP in MANY situations.

Chaith.8256:

Irenio CalmonHuang.2048:

’allo fellow Engineers, -snip snip-

At this point we’re not going to be able to change the elite specialization mechanic very much. There are still going to be changes to it with the possibility for expansion of functionality post-launch.

I am doubtful concerning a major change of the core function,of the trait Impact Savant and the 3 traits concerning rallying/stomping.

So then you are nearly unkillable? Sure.

Are.1326:

Gyros

• Detonating gyros needs to go away. Sacrifice is in flavor for Necromancer and is the mechanic of Mesmer. Engineers should be about creating life, not blowing it up.
• In place of detonating, add a ground targeted command skill that sends the gyro to a specific location and changed to a Return command that returns the gyro to orbit around you.

If you do this you lose the potential daze given by destroying gyros (their only useful utility….) plus you give more ground targeted skills. I think we have more than enough useless ground targeted skills (cf MedKit).
Gyro detonation should use the traits in explosives line and do better damage when detonating.

I am playing engineer for explosions, weapons and alchemy, not for “creating” life, if I want this, I go to play Druid.

I’ll copy what I said in the other topic:

SO…. after nearly a week.
Hammer is fine, little tweaks to do between animation and skill effect on rocket charge (evades finishing sooner than the animation [last attack])
TRAITS
Minor adept: Function gyro useless in pve, slow and useless in pvp as we can’t chose between using it or using the self stomp. Poor core elite spec function as said again and again and again in MANY threads.
Major adept: No choice to do, without hesitation we chose Recovery matrix.
Shocking speed is too much situational and bring ONLY 3 sec of superspeed for allies -> USELESS.
Stabilization core is also too much situational with a PvP perspective in which Recovery matrix will be far more useful.
Minor Master: Decisive Renown, again too much situational, and again only designed for rallying/stomping in a PvP perspective, again only 3 sec of superspeed -> not really useful.
Major Master: Expert examination will only be played if gyros are, and it will never be a real choice against the two other possibilities, Mass Momentum and Rapid regeneration are great

Minor GrandMaster: I want to say LOOOL, why? Basically without the scrapper spec the engi is limited in terms of stun/daze: 2 at best. So the scrapper brings one stun and dazes if there is the hammer combo 5-3 OR if there is use of gyros. As a consequence, this elite spec MINOR TRAIT “improves” the dazes provided by the elite spec. It is a funny circle, why not just increasing the basis dazes provided by gyros and the hammer combo? And not talking about the 25% reduction on daze or stun. This minor grandmaster is a placeholder, and it’s as a shame as the function gyro, minor adept and decisive renown minor master.
Major grandmaster
adaptative armor: great trait nerfed to 60 robu..lol for around 4 strucks we get 240 < 400 previously…
Final salvo: lightning field + 3 sec superspeed, why?? It seems that the WHOLE spec has been designed around Hammer 3.
Perfectly weighted: why stab on evading attack, why not dodge like the revenant?

GYROS
Since they can live in pve it is “nice”.
In PvP: medic gyro can be iteresting against healing turret but still testing.
I don’t see the point of the shreeder gyro, seriously a field is never lasting long enough to get it useful and too much rng in the strikes.
Blast gyro is useless since it can’t be affected by the ferocity etc.. of the engi.
Sneak gyro could be useful in stronghold.
Gyros are poorly designed they do not give enough improvement, or use against the elixirs or kits. And even the toolbet skills are useless against the toolbet skills of gadgets (slick shoes vs blast gyro)

========

Overall I am disappointed, I feel that this spec has not been designed with passion or love but much more around limited skills and ideas which do not reflect the enormous potential of the engineer. The whole spec is constructed on the hammer, half of the traits are too much situational and focused on rallying/stomping, gyros are very much limited considering the ratio: skill effect against cooldown + AI + hp +timer system (fuel lol). The core mechanic of the elite spec is just nonexistent by a poor and so much limited design and even not fully thought when chosing between using it or doing a self stomp.
Such a shame for the engineer class, It deserves much more passion and interest in gameplay design.

The only thing I can say is that the name is really well chosen: this spec has been made with scrap. Hopefully the team behind the scrapper will give it some reworks and more love.

SO…. after nearly a week.

Hammer is fine, little tweaks to do between animation and skill effect on rocket charge (evades finishing sooner than the animation [last attack])

Traits:
Minor adept: Function gyro useless in pve, slow and useless in pvp as we can’t chose between using it or using the self stomp. Poor core elite spec function as said again and again and again in MANY threads.

Major adept: No choice to do, without hesitation we chose Recovery matrix.
Shocking speed is too much situational and bring ONLY 3 sec of superspeed for allies -> USELESS.
Stabilization core is also too much situational with a PvP perspective in which Recovery matrix will be far more useful.

Minor Master: Decisive Renown, again too much situational, and again only designed for rallying/stomping in a PvP perspective, again only 3 sec of superspeed -> not really useful.

Major Master: Expert examination will only be played if gyros are, and it will never be a real choice against the two other possibilities, Mass Momentum and Rapid regeneration are great

Minor GrandMaster: I want to say LOOOL, why? Basically without the scrapper spec the engi is limited in terms of stun/daze: 2 at best. So the scrapper brings one stun and dazes if there is the hammer combo 5-3 OR if there is use of gyros as a consequence, this elite spec MINOR TRAIT “improves” the dazes provided by the elite spec. It is a funny circle, why not just increasing the basis dazes provided by gyros and the hammer combo? And not talking about the 25% reduction on daze or stun. This minor grandmaster is a placeholder, and it’s as a shame as the function gyro, minor adept and decisive renown minor master.

Major grandmaster
adaptative armor: great trait nerfed to 60 robu..lol for around 4 strucks we get 240 < 400 previously…
Final salvo: lightning field + 3 sec superspeed, why?? It seems that the WHOLE spec has been designed around Hammer 3.
Perfectly weighted: why stab on evading attack, why not dodge like the revenant?

Gyros
Since they can live in pve it is “nice”.
In PvP: medic gyro can be iteresting against healing turret but still testing.
I don’t see the point of the shreeder gyro, seriously a field is never lasting long enough to get it useful and too much rng in the strikes.
Blast gyro is useless since it can’t be affected by the ferocity etc.. of the engi.
Sneak gyro could be useful in stronghold.

Overall gyros are poorly designed they do not give enough improvement, or use against the elixirs or kits. And even the toolbet skills are useless against the toolbet skills of gadgets (slick shoes vs blast gyro)

Overall I am disappointed, I feel that this spec has not been designed with passion or love but much more around limited skills and ideas which do not reflect the enormous potential of the engineer. The whole spec is constructed on the hammer, half of the traits are too much situational and focused on rallying/stomping, gyros are very much limited considering the ratio: skill effect against cooldown + AI + hp +timer system (fuel lol). The core mechanic of the elite spec is just nonexistent by a poor and so much limited design and even not fully thought when chosing between using it or doing a self stomp.

Such a shame for the engineer class, It deserves much more passion and interest in gameplay design.

The only thing I can say is that the name is really well chosen: this spec has been made with scrap. Hopefully the team behind the scrapper will give it some reworks and more love.

ps: Thank you for the adaptative armor and HGH nerf, it is everything the engineer needed /ironic

Irenio CalmonHuang.2048:

Thanks for spotting this! Definitely unintended behavior on Jump Shot and Rocket Charge.

Thank you Irenio, it seems also that there is a difference between the animation and the evade of rocket charge (it finishes sooner than the animation)

Interesting concepts, in every case, we must have a rework… It can’t stay like this currently, it is not an elite spec at all.

santenal.1054:

Why do I have to use the scrapper traitline if I want to use the hammer? As someone who likes to theorycraft I hate being forced into traitlines and the elite specializations do just that. It limits the build possibilities by alot if you want to use a hammer or gyros. Is this restriction really necessary (for the engineer and/or other classes)? It’s also annoying when I quickly want to slot a scrapper skill but dont have the scrapper traitline activated.

share your opinions.

It is funny, because it sums up pretty well this elite spec design: a hammer.

The traits line do not provide an interesting improvement (give power we already have, need a lot of daze ONLY provided by destruction of useless gyro, superspeed that does not stack) , or new mechanic, the core mechanic (function gyro) is more than laughable, and the gyros are mostly useless by the crazy cooldown on toolbet, their destruction not using traits of other lines. In this spec there is NO synergy, at best you can use a FT which will force you to use ONLY the FT.

Laughable elite spec.

I just want to say thank you for the fabulous map design from the architecture to the beauty of the graphics and the superb music which strengthens the immersion in game.

Great Work!!!!

ps: the story is awesome, period.

Theonord.6359:

- Gyros’s CD starts after they die, not when summoned as promised

It has been changed to the previous state, so no bug here

I deblocked the elite spec using hero points with my necromancer in Heart of Mists but the success was not validated, as a consequence I can use the elite spec in PvE but I did not validate the success thus I did not receive the claymore “Reaper’s greatsword”

Haralin.1473:

Nieguen.6235:

The function gyro is still slow, the animation near the avatar head is very small, and the function gyro bugs when a downed foe moves (tp of a thief or mist form ele)

Did the Function gyro even use your finisher, or did he have the standard finisher.

it used my finisher

The function gyro is still slow, the animation near the avatar head is very small, and the function gyro bugs when a downed foe moves (tp of a thief or mist form ele)

So predictable…

Basaltface.2786:

Well… imo they just scrapped (HA!) the old spec and used some trash laying arround to quickly tinker the engi spec together cause they had to…not cause they wanted to. I feel no love or dedication and thought to the spec at all.. like for example the reaper and chrono got […] Busy with druid…the motto of the scrapper.

Same feeling here..

SelenaDread.2814:

Nieguen.6235:

I am sorry to ask this Roy but I would like to know:

Why do you put HP on minions and not rather a timer?
-> Minions being impactful for a short time, but still useful even if they are there for a short time. And It could be used in EVERY game modes.

Because with your “weird system” you can only fix PvE for processing problems and not PvP and WvW where it would impact to much the game by non desired server calculi. And even, you do not really know if the creation of multiple minions in Raids will not impact the game experience (let say 6 necros with full minions and a lot of attacks around).

That does raise another question of why would you have 6 minion master necros in a 10 man raid. O.o

When you do code you have to test it and debbug it. It is just an example to know if the game can be impacted by a non desired amount of calculi implied by this “new” system of damage management for minions.

I am sorry to ask this Roy but I would like to know:

Why do you put HP on minions and not rather a timer?
-> Minions being impactful for a short time, but still useful even if they are there for a short time. And It could be used in EVERY game modes.

Because with your “weird system” you can only fix PvE for processing problems and not PvP and WvW where it would impact too much the game by non desired server calculi. And even, you do not really know if the creation of multiple minions in Raids will not impact the game experience (let say 6 necros with full minions and a lot of attacks around).

Considering the design of the core elite mechanic, the behavior of gyros and this “fuel” which is in reality just a kidding cool down + the datamined hammer skills a long time ago :

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/Guardian-and-Engineer-leaks

It seems that there was a “heat” or “fuel” generation via hammer skills which would not be surprising considering the first trailer of HoT you are talking about.
So yes, a lot of design iteration IMO which with bad project management lead to an unfinished and weirdly designed elite spec (not to say something else…)

Since we do not even know what we are really going to have for the elite spec, do not expect much in design

Killyox.3950:

Well, recent changes they gave us in a patch were just tiny part of balance changes so I have some hopes for future :P

Hopefully it is not tiny, but seeing how they look into the engi, I do not expect much..

Manuhell.2759:

lorddarkflare.9186:

They do not want minions to be effective in PvP. That has been obvious for years.

Short of a complete re-work, I think turrets are mostly dead in PvP.

Truth be told, I can live with this.

Honestly, i don’t care a bit whether they want or not for them to be effective.
Those utilities are there, and they have to work. In any mode.
If they don’t want them to be effective on purpose, then remove them and give us something that is supposed to work. But just don’t leave them to waste.
And for the love of the six gods, especially don’t make new ai-based skill types if they are purposefully designed to be useless in two thirds of the game. Cause it makes no sense at all, and it ends up being a waste of time for both us and them. Yes, i’m talking about gyro.

^
This.

Zenith.7301:

If you’re worried about pets tanking bosses with 95% reduction, why not remove them from the aggro table of raid/dungeon bosses?

Since aggro is so random, this help will help SOMETIMES, and what this means is that for my ranger it’ll still be risky using something like jaguars since we cannot control who a boss targets and minions are an integral part of a class’s performance.

I’m also curious why this approach won’t apply to WvW, ranger/mesmer/minion necro are virtually crippled in WvW team fights because of AoE spam.

Don’t get me wrong, this is a great step in the right direction at least, but the lack of control over mob aggro mechanisms still means the protection is random.

I just don’t know why we are so afraid of pets having 100% uptime in PvE when the very classes are BALANCED around that full pet uptime to have competitive damage output compared to classes who are not.

Also, what about boss melee cleave attacks like mossman and archdiviner and Ettin melee swings, will those count as reduced AoE when the pet is not targeted?

Nieguen.6235:

Morfedel.4165:

Nieguen.6235:

So you fix PvE but do not even bother of PvP or WvW for 12 skills of the engineer.

A.W.E.S.O.M.E.

/ESports

I think in most cases it’s only a really a problem in an AoE rich Zerg environment. In small numbers I don’t think it’s usually going to be as much of a problem.

However I am Not Dead certain about that. I just know that as a mesmer main, I have felt moderately fine about the status of illusions in 1v1 and small groups.

Illusions/Phantasm are generated easily by many different skills and soon traits. There is nothing to compare with turrets (utilities, long cd, hp) and soon gyros (utilities long cd, hp).

AoE in sPvP can be really rich. Try it yourself you will see how turrets are dead.

We will even have the 23rd 2 ELITES defined by AI, with kittenty hp.

Not really. Phantasms have 15-20 second cd’s, and mesmer autoattack and other ability sustained damage is so bad without ramping up 3x phantasms.

Engineers don’t heavily rely on turrets to do sustained damage anywhere as much as mesmers rely on illusions.

Please see that I was talking about PvP (no mesmer play with 3 phantasms continuously in sPvP) and your CD argument is invalid when using a 2H sword vs an engineer’s rifle. And try supply crate yourself in sPvP see how long your turrets stay alive. And just to get a better perspective compare the fact that the more interesting phantasms are in your weapon bar, not utilities, plus look at turrets cd (rocket, thumper, net turret in particular for PvP) and supply crate cd https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Turret

Come on, do not compare continuous generation of illusions/phantasms with utilities such as turrets, it is just not at all the same thing and not the same purpose in sPvP. It is like comparing oranges and tomatoes.

Roy Cronacher.1576:

We felt like minions were in a good place for PvP so we didn’t want to change them there for now. Thus, the interaction between players and minions in PvP combat will remain the same.

This made my day…

I think ANet needs to leave dev servers and do some PvP (ranked please…) or WvW using a ranger, spirit weapons of the guardian, necro minions, turrets of the engi (and even gyros… yay) and so on…

Morfedel.4165:

Nieguen.6235:

So you fix PvE but do not even bother of PvP or WvW for 12 skills of the engineer.

A.W.E.S.O.M.E.

/ESports

I think in most cases it’s only a really a problem in an AoE rich Zerg environment. In small numbers I don’t think it’s usually going to be as much of a problem.

However I am Not Dead certain about that. I just know that as a mesmer main, I have felt moderately fine about the status of illusions in 1v1 and small groups.

Illusions/Phantasm are generated easily by many different skills and soon traits. There is nothing to compare with turrets (utilities, long cd, hp) and soon gyros (utilities long cd, hp).

AoE in sPvP can be really rich. Try it yourself you will see how turrets are dead.

We will even have the 23rd 2 ELITES defined by AI, with kittenty hp.

style.6173:

Nike.2631:

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Hey all,
…
We felt like minions were in a good place for PvP so we didn’t want to change them there for now. Thus, the interaction between players and minions in PvP combat will remain the same.
…

That’s a joke right? While ranger pets are more or less a thing because they have to be, Ranger Nature Spirits, Guardian Sprit Weapons, and Necromancer Minons and even Elementalist Elementals are extinct as an entire class of utility skills in sPvP and WvW. Even Engineer turrets have largely been bred out of the competitive environment and you can’t expect gyros or Reaper’s shambling horrors to change that.

Actually ANET made the right decision here. Everything you mention is considered skill-less play in PvP. They don’t belong there.

In PvE, it is fine to buff the minions because it isn’t competitive and people can play how they want.

Ranger pet skill less? core mechanic
Necro minions skill less?
Supply crate skill less? elite
Thumper turret skill less?
Rocket turret skill less?
Net turret skill less?
Healing turret skill less?
Sneak gyro skill less? elite

seriously? It is not used (or rarely) because it is broken, do not confound it with “skill less”

So you fix PvE but do not even bother of PvP or WvW for 12 skills of the engineer.

A.W.E.S.O.M.E.

/ESports

Waylander.2103:

Something i just saw in the HoT forum section posted by Colin:

Engineer Profession Icon
We’ve had some issues over the years with folks being able to tell the difference between the Engineer and Elementalist profession icons, in particular when they are shrunk down to smaller sizes for party UI. This became even more apparent when we began testing
our updated large squad UI. As a result, we’re going to be changing the engineer icon to better differentiate between the two. We’ve also done a bit of re-work to better differentiate the icons between Scrapper, Tempest, Engineer and Elementalist.

Source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/Handful-of-HoT-Notes/first#post5624087

Mate, we have bugs not corrected, lack of synergy inside traits line, poorly designed elite spec around AI when we said a long time ago we did not want it, plus the worst ever elite core mechanic (function gyro), we give feedback to obtain improvement and there is still nothing. Are we heard? Not really…

So why bother about a new Engi icon?

Haralin.1473:

Ardid.7203:

I feel this is the most relevant problem with the Scrapper. Everything else can be adjusted and improved. This needs a TOTAL overhaul…

Thats why it was a bad decision to reveal the last two classes so close before HoT release, they should have revealed them all at the same time, so they have enough time to think about the Spec. Or they should have talked to the community about there thoughts.

Now we have a Spec that is bad designed, they already said the mechanic will not change much for release, but as always such workarounds they do now will last very long and none will look at the scrapper after release. There will be some changes, but i thing they will not change the mechanic they gave to us.

When you see the trailer with the engi the showed little time ago, you can deduce they changed the whole design of the core mechanic. In fact 1 year or 2 years ago there was a leak about new weapon for class with the engi getting a hammer and producing fuel as he smashes ennemies with fire attacks.
In the trailer we see fire attacks. But now we have electrics one with the hammer and the “fuel” is just a cooldown on the gyros.

Basically it smells a lot a complete change of the core design of the spec without enough time spent on the engi (project management…).
-> kittenty gyro
-> super speed not stacking
-> LOLILOL function gyro LOLILOL

So hopefully they will fix this with the balance patch they should do mid november before ESL leagues

Korra.4251:

Hey, I’m so glad to see the increase in communication, having solid information goes a long long way to help resolve fears for the class, as it helps rest the worst case scenarios that the mind dreams up. While I am an avid fan of the game and our wonderful devs, a lot of personal anxiety has stopped me in the past from joining the discussion. Fears of putting my passion and opinion out for all to judge paralyze me, and leave me hoping that others will manage to express my concerns. With that said, I can barely even imagine what it would be like to expose your work as a designer to the vitriol that comes out of forums. I work to keep that in mind, because I admit I had to rewrite this post a couple times to ensure I wasn’t adding lethal doses of salt. I care about the game enough that it’s got the potential to work me up, and I know the devs must care even more so. I really hope both that my voice is heard, but more than that, I hope that it’s helpful, and truly constructive feedback, because we all want the same thing, to continue the guildwars way of being one of if not the most innovative game of its kind.
+many hooray for hammer changes
+1 for Impact Savant change
- Gyro changes sound good and in the right direction. Would still prefer not ai, but if that’s what we got. They’re moving towards what they need to be. I can actually see a full gyro build being a real thing.
- the trait Final Salvo needs a re-examination. This is not strictly because there is anything wrong with it, but rather because the dynamic of the gyros no longer fits with it as the gyro interaction/support trait. Gyros now seem to be developing a much more solid identity as a passive bonus that is activated for a short time, and is POWERFUL at the cost of duration limit and the ability to kill the source. As ever, tuning may be required.
- still no stun breaker?
- gyro destruct effects are still in a weird place. They are highly fit for the blast and shredder, and decent for the bulwark. For the others, they feel odd, as while you receive nice things on death, they aren’t the nice things you need, and don’t really apply. Akin to being given salty food while stranded without water at sea. The thought is appreciated, but isn’t what was really needed at the moment
-super speed is fun, and while I was skeptical about how useful it would be, the vale guardian is all ready proving its worth. Issues included wasted interactions due to it not stacking, and being overshadowed/overwritten by application from other sources ie; the revenant/herald. Also would seem to limit the number of scrapers to a max of 1 in 5 for any given content, as they would step on each other’s toes per say.
+1 Medic Gyro sounds great, and atm, has a bright future as a real alternative to the Omni present healing turret, hinged upon good play.
- Purge Gyro is TBD, hinged on improved functionality. Tool belt is very “eh” and unfit mechanically. A light field would be fitting, as it could combo with the shredder for more condi cleanse.
- Shredder Gyro is interesting, possibly under tuned, possibly misunderstood, somewhat underwhelming at the moment. Double whirl finisher a la the warrior double leap finisher as an interesting experiment? I feel that it has incredible potential (the gyro, not my kitten suggestion). So far in discussions I’ve only seen this theorized to be light space control and/or burst condition application. I could see with higher tuning it providing incredible condition cleanse, aoe blind lockdown, and potentially synergy with medic gyro to increase the healing potential to the hands down best healing skill combo.
-Blast Gyro is fun, but potentially just unusable. The counter play/potential points of failure are just too numerous, the reward too low for it, and it is mechanically disjoint, as it lacks the dynamic of reward for keeping it alive.
Possible change -Something akin to a gyro rocket/thumper turret, a floating shooting deal that tracks/follows/shoots the target tagged for its duration would be more appropriate as it retains all of the current counter play options but increases reliability and deals with a number of unintended points of failure (for example; the gyro doesn’t always spawn near enough to you to provide support for it, and the path it travels based on spawn makes thoughtful combos impossible to set up). also cool I don’t care how salty anyone is over gyros, a gyro that releases smaller explosive gyros is the most amazing thing, like a gun that shoots smaller guns.
+1 Bulwark Gyro was already quite good and enjoyable. Increased QoL is always welcome
- SNEAK GYRO -
Tool belt is cray cray powerful. Like purge, this will live or die by the improved functionality. My new understanding of the skill and the stealth application interval is that your supposed to be a Nika backup/equivalent, flashing in and out of stealth while in a combat scenario. Not a huge fan, but significantly cooler than being an elite skill that makes you a bad Mesmer.
MAJOR CONCERN: both skills feel less like general complements to the spec, and more like specific answers to individual scenarios. Good cause reason to take scrapper. Bad cause it feels bad if you aren’t needed because your good, but because your the only person with the win button required for a couple specific encounters.
- FUNCTION GYRO -
Should honestly have its own thread. I could write a small thesis of my thoughts on it. It is strictly an improvement. It feels deeply underwhelming when held up to other classes. It sits in a bizarre gap of perspective, as it is something that can literally only be understood as a flat out and powerful new tool/buff for the class, but inspires only feelings of jealousy, anger, resentment and betrayal (for me at least, and I suspect a fair number of others) when compared to the breathtaking changes available to other classes. It makes sense thematically and mechanically, and yet could be honestly construed to not change the class in any meaningful sense.
My end take on it, I turn to the dark side, I trust my feelings, I know them to be true. I think that the function gyro is insufficient as a mechanic, and under the current paradigm of use, with one at a time, targetable, and literally only two applications that may not even see real use in PVE content (this is a weird thing, as it acts as a safety net, rendered useless if your group plays well, as you shouldn’t need to res anyone, in person or by bot). Under those restrictions, there is no amount of tuning that will fix this, a mechanic that is barely more than a ranger utility skill. Additionally, it renders the master minor (Decisive Renown) hilariously irrelevant for PVE, 1v1 scenarios and the like.
This is also especially irksome, as it was announced that the Druid class mechanic, would receive an overhual despite its largely warm reception, but that there isn’t time for a engineer re-examination. The criticism of the sneak gyro I made I feel applies to the function gyro as well, the option is nice, the concept is limited and it just feels awful because the it is a set use tool, without the ability to improve upon or exploit the performance by way of gameplay, and indeed creates a tension where scrapers are valued not for their skill but a specific and limiting set of options, that as far as we know, aren’t even useful enough in a PVE setting to justify running! The vale guardian kill engineers were more often then not, not even bothering to run scrapper!
I cannot stress enough how much the flair aspect of the mechanic is integral to the visceral dissatisfaction I feel. A lot of work and love went into the reaper shroud and the Druid cele form. The guardian virtues all make use of more active mechanics and new technology. The berserker and daredevil mechanics are interwoven on an almost second to second level with their gameplay to creat a uniquely different play style. The herald and the chronomancer mechanics are awe inspiring in their game wide potential to shift combat and maximize the class. And while I do not doubt that great effort was put into the engineer and the scrapper, and absolutely recognize that the versatility of the tool belt limited the possibilities for the new mechanic, the function gyro just does not hold up in comparison. Not in terms of interaction with self and other class mechanics, not in terms use from moment to moment, not in terms of unique function and not in terms pure shiny wow factor. I don’t care if the game ships in the scrappers current state, all I need to hear is that the scrapper development cycle will continue full steam after release, not just in monitoring for balance like you would for any new class, but actively working as if we were still in beta.

^
This is I think the best feedback posted on the forum, in terms of feelings, completeness, critics and possible ways of improvement. A must read, waiting for an answer in particular from Irenio for the last sentence.