Other 80s: Any but Warrior
(edited by Advent.6193)
Once these things are finally accomplished, we can at least see the Mesmer class as it should function, and only minor, periodic adjustments would be needed afterward.
MINOR adjustments, Anet! Like what you guys did for Healing Signet, not the WvW Confusion Debacle, or what happened to the old-style D/D Ele. 
(edited by Advent.6193)
Poor UI, bad camera angles, hard-to-see circles, stuff obstructed by nothing, screen blinds, are all things that are artificial difficult in my opinion. These things should get fixed, and by fixing them, ArenaNet could present us with better challenges than Liadra.
Hate to say it, but I think they need to replace their testers. Their current ones have missed glaring issues is most every update that are obvious to everyone except them for some reason. They are either not doing their job, not capable of doing the job, or choose to not do the job all of which warrant replacement.
Got to quote this. I mean, no one of them had ever gone near the border?
And it makes me wonder if they even tested with norns and charrs. You can’t see anything with the firsts.
Hate to say it, but I think they need to replace their testers. Their current ones have missed glaring issues is most every update that are obvious to everyone except them for some reason. They are either not doing their job, not capable of doing the job, or choose to not do the job all of which warrant replacement.
Plenty of tries, many rages but even after doing it http://i.imgur.com/ybS80Dc.jpg the challenge itself was interesting but the timelimit on it was horrible.
If you look at my pic, you can see the announcer counting, down, that was for my gauntlet. I only managed to make it within a second or so.
The whole theme and concept, good. The achievement part of it, bad. The gauntlets have a 2min timelimit on them I believe so that means you had to atleast use an orb once every 15 seconds.
Never want to do this kind of thing again. Halloween jumping puzzle fun, gauntlet timelimit orb collection race, not so fun…
I do not consider players who have beaten her skilled, she is easy, her location is just bad and the camera is horrible, all the skill that she requires is know how to dodge and good timing.
I hate bosses that have millions of hp like all other bosses, its refreshing to bring her in the game, but 1 shots aren’t the way to go when not everyone wants to be a zerger.
Fix the camera, fix the bugs and fix the issues caused by having a zerg right underneath.
And this content is no different from what you’ve been getting with just about every single boss in the game. Instant kill AoE spam does not make for good boss fights. The sooner Anet learns this lesson the sooner we can get quality content.
I just did it as a Necromancer…
It’s unreasonably hard without a doubt.
And if arenanet so would do and nerf it down to 6/7 that would seem suffice.
One of the main things, because we Reaaaaly lack mobility and vigor as necromancers is to; equip staff, offhand dagger , well signet and condition removal in death shroud.
This way you will never ever have cripple and can actually managbe to get a fair ton of cripple present on her aswel so you can kite her around.
When there’s a mark on the floor for the illusions try to run left and right
Because as is, in P2 the map is competlely covered, but in pretty much every scenario the left and right side of where it’s supposed to drop will ussually be free of any aoe.
I’ll try and mash up better help later on, but this is the best i can do right now. Really have to do my dailies.
Alrighty, here we go. Please feel free to comment and add anything that I have missed, and I’ll update the post to reflect that.
Weapons
Scepter
Mainhand Sword
Offhand Sword
Offhand Pistol
Offhand Focus
Offhand Torch
Utilities
Null field
Arcane Thievery
Mimic
Polymorph Tuna
All Mantras
Traits
Vengeful Images
Temporal Enchanter
Phantasmal Haste
Illusionary Elasticity
Masterful Reflection
Deceptive Evasion
Confusing Cry + Shattered Conditions
General
(edited by Pyroatheist.9031)
Yes, from the pvp community as well. This change did not significantly hurt phantasmmesmers. It greatly hurt everyone else who wasn’t shatter. Clone spammers unite! :P
Greetings. Since english isn’t my native language I want to apologize for any mistakes in advance.
Please consider to lower our overall incredibly high cooldowns – at least in Pve. With the recent nerf of IC our most common fractalbuild received an uncalled nerf. This would be bearable if similar changes to cooldowns wouldn’t have been made before.
With every patch since release I feel like having to spam 111111 more and more due to excessive cd’s. This issue affects a majority of our skills – I still remember dearly the good old days when Chaos Storm was a great defensive skill on a moderate cooldown.
Though I understand the need for balancing our class in Pvp (not some of the changes though) I wish the Pve Community wouldn’t have to suffer for this.
Is anyone getting weird values for Mind Spike? (Sword 1, end of the chain) Specifically, I don’t think the bonus damage for using it on a boonless target matches the tooltip, and neither of those match the patch notes.
I’m getting the bonus damage to be about… 20% above the base damage, and the tooltip indicates I should be getting a 33% bonus. Either way, using the values I get for the first part of the chain I’m not striking for high enough damage for the tooltips to be accurate.
Vengeful Images is not applying it’s retaliation during it’s five second run. No damage, no retaliation indicator either.
I think everyone else has covered this pretty extensively, but FWIW:
Shatter mesmers were the least touched of all the builds. Not only do you retain IC, you also generally will trait sword, reducing the cd increase to only 1.6 seconds as opposed to 2 seconds. The fact that you seem to be unable to get high scores in sPvP hotjoin is a reflection only of your lack of skill, not the fact that shatter builds got nerfed.
The picture was not about the score, its about the amount of players that now bandwagon to necros and warriors. and i’m still killing in spvp. I just think its unfair that sword got such a big nerf, okey remove distortion but why make it such a long cd?
Why on earth do you care about the amount of players that bandwagon to necros and warriors? That makes 0 sense.
What i intended to say is that they aimed for build diversity instead they put 2 to 3 classes on the game. All other classes are no longer a good option, in order to do anything u need to feel like u have to invest so much.
Not over reacting, just saying that the nerf on sword was a little too much.
I agree, the cooldown nerf on blurred frenzy was too much at the time. They should have changed it to evade and waited for the next balance patch to nerf the cooldown if it was still felt necessary.
I also agree that they massively failed if they were trying to provide build diversity, and I’ve been over this many times.
That being said, the classes showing up in hotjoin are not representative of anything other than the current flavor of the month. Trying to use that as an example of anything other than what the current flavor of the month is, is absolutely illegitimate.
A message to our esteemed forum moderators
To encourage thoughtful and organized discussion, it is best to leave threads approaching the patch notes from different directions as separate threads. Far from cluttering the forums, this allows for different aspects of the changes to be considered and discussed in an organized manner. If all such threads are merged into one, as has been done so far, it simply creates a disorganized mush of what could be helpful discussion.
That being said, here are my thoughts.
It seems to be that balancing and changes with regards to the mesmer class are being made while completely out of touch with the reality of this game. This patch only exemplifies that more.
Good Changes
That’s about it. Now for the bad changes.
These are abbreviated versions. There are obviously more changes that I didn’t touch upon, but these are the only changes that (in my opinion) actually make a difference.
Here is the main issue. The positive changes to our traits and skills are relatively minor or are complete bug fixes. On the other hand, the nerfs are massive. Anet is obviously spending developer and programmer time figuring out effective ways to nerf mesmers, while completely ignoring the parts of our class that are still completely broken. I will now list the largest offenders.
These are a lot of massive problems. However, instead of fixing these problems, Anet decides to hand out significant nerfs. The nerf to signet of illusions, in my opinion, is reasonable, but that’s pretty much it. Blurred frenzy is nerfed twice, once in evade and once in cooldown. Vengeful images is, for all intents and purposes, no longer a trait. Lastly, Illusionist’s Celerity is moved from 5 point minor to 25 point minor, nerfing every single build that is not shatter.
And as if all that weren’t enough, these changes are made in the name of build diversity. Anet is telling us “These changes are actually good for your class. We are doing this to help you.”
Build diversity eh? These changes make a tank build very difficult to play effectively now. They vastly remove potential diversity from both PvE and PvP phantasm builds. They significantly nerf the already very weak condition builds that mesmers have. Across the board, all non-shatter builds that mesmers have are negatively impacted, most in very significant ways.
The small buffs that they gave us are insignificant. Shattered conditions is nice, but with the other changes, it’s now much more difficult to use it effectively. The interrupt traits are nice, but when you couple that with the other changes they just become another shatter variant. Bounce logic was fixed, but builds that rely on that (conditions) are even weaker now.
On top of all this, the phantasm builds that were stupidly overpowered in a 1v1 are still stupidly overpowered in a 1v1. A small cooldown nerf won’t change that. People are still going to get facerolled by any competent phantasm build player and they’ll just cry for more nerfs.
Get off that horse dude, seriously. There’s more people around these forums with design or development experience than just you.
Don’t you think this is a little ironic as ANet employees most likely have much more design and dev experience than you, (and most people on the forums) yet you question and tell them they are wrong? Carighan is right in the quote you have there… I think it’s you who might have to step off the horse and realize that mesmers are far from dead and are still extremely strong. IC being moved to GM is hardly the end of the world.
It’s not the end of the world, but the analysis is spot on. The movement of IC is a de facto nerf to any non-shatter build. This is caused by the fact that it was a baseline requirement for almost any mesmer build to be properly effective.
The trait is too strong to be an adept minor. It’s also too strong to be a grandmaster minor. It shouldn’t exist. When a trait like that becomes so necessary that every build takes it, it is now a baseline part of the class and not actually a build option. Being a baseline part of the class and not actually a build option, moving it simply is a nerf to that entire class. A proper solution would be to remove the trait entirely, change the cooldowns to absorb that baseline effect, and put something else that is balanced in its place.
Summary
These changes accomplished nothing positive for the mesmer class. The fact that they were made in the name of build diversity is insulting to every intelligent mesmer player. These changes, far from providing build diversity and flexibility, have significantly lowered the diversity of the mesmer class and restricted the flexibility our builds have. This is far and away the most devastating and most ill-conceived patch since this game was first released.
This couldn’t be better put.
Summary
These changes accomplished nothing positive for the mesmer class. The fact that they were made in the name of build diversity is insulting to every intelligent mesmer player. These changes, far from providing build diversity and flexibility, have significantly lowered the diversity of the mesmer class and restricted the flexibility our builds have. This is far and away the most devastating and most ill-conceived patch since this game was first released.
Well said
imo build diversity suffer from lack of synergy between traits and their placement.
(pvp)
for example 3sec frenzy on interrupt is quite nice with sword/pistol setup. If you use pistol5 early in damage rotation you can get a nice boost. but because of the nerf of quickness it is not enough to justify grandmaster placement :\
if combined with 5might on interrupt it could boost your burst even more…. but then you are no longer a shatter mesmer so burst is meh.
another thing: 5might/interrupt is chaos master trait… more a defence trait line… but it gives 5might?! total fail imo. it should give protection 5 sec or whatever to further enhance your defence with 20/30 points into chaos.
or make another interrupt trait in chaos (defence one) and merge 5might and 3sec quickness in duelling grandmaster. whatever all the interrupt traits just seem a little off…
and scepter oh dear the scepter. now it cannot be used as a power weapon anymore. so give it a freaking damage condition on autoattack, otherwise it will always be total fail. (you know how much damage youre doing versus a target that evades the block and mitigates confusing images? zero)
really want to play something different than shatter mesmer but it just is not worth it.
IC replacement just nails the coffin
Time to move on to another game just as soon as one is available because Anet just couldn’t give a hoot.
Your post was well put Pyro but i very much doubt Anet will give it a second glance.
I fully agree with Pyroatheist. This patch has brought us nothing but massive nerfs and minor bugfixes that should have been fixed much earlier.
To me ArenaNet wants to promote build diversity by destroying build diversity.
Regarding Mesmer build diversity, ANet’s intention can be summed up as: ‘GO SHATTER OR GO HOME’
For Mesmers this patch has been the biggest failure since this game launched in my opinion.
(edited by Aveneo.2068)
I feel like the immortal mesmer and other high retaliation builds suffer immensely from this. Retaliation is their highest source of damage…. You probably can see where this is going now.
I was very excited for this patch. I dreamt of not having a single useless trait, all useless ones got reworked and what came out of it was a beautiful and deeo game where you could spend hours just over thinking which traits to out in each slot.
they messed up
Right now all theyre doing is forcing us to take other useless or semi usefull traits because the very usefull ones from the past were made not very usefull…
They literally said they were not goin to nerf much…
they lied, this patch is mostly bad things for the mesmer and they decreased build diversity instead if increasing it.
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