Guild Wars 2

The biggest issue I currently have with my thief is that stealth can be countered “passively” by spamming channeled abilities.

If I go into stealth, after a ranger start his channeling skill (rapid fire), he can deal the full amount of dmg even if he does not see me. Same goes for mesmer GS#1 (there, max range seems to be heavily buggued) or Elem Scepter Air#1.
Mesmers clones (staff mostly) have the same ability to “track” you in stealth because the velocity is low.

The main argument here is usually :
“He started his attack just before/at the same time you enter stealth”.
And so what ? When I attack somebody who goes in invul-mode (0000 – block – mist form, etc) they are invulnerable, and I can start the attack before, it doesn’t matter : they are invul at the time the skill land, period.

Why should stealth be differently processed ?
I full agree to take dmg from AOE because that’s the way to counter stealth, but mono-skills that require a target should no be able to land on a stealthed target.

My 2 c€nts rant of the month.

What: Thief’s stealth
Why: I cannot see where he is but clones & pets can still attack him. Why could they do better than me ? My channeling skills also track him, but I want to be able to fully attack him while stealthed without wasting my precious AOE CDs.

What: Thief’s skills that benefit from position (back)
Why: They dish out too much damage and they are mono-target skills.
According to the meta, high-damage skills should be restricted to AOE with at least 180° radius and with no positioning required, for obvious high facerolling skill purpose.

Hype.8032:

Jon, Mesmers can trait phase retreat down to a 6 second cooldown and it functions the same as our sword #2 return currently. Please consider delaying or canceling this sword nerf until other changes are ready to compensate for the loss of effectiveness. Please consider the effect of this change on build diversity. Thieves are very weapon limited and 2 sets will be affected by it.

Thank you for your time.

This.
I didn’t see [Phase Retreat] getting a cast time.This is exactly the same skill than IR. Why would it be OP on a thief and not on a mesmer ?
Furthermore, mesmer has a real stunbreaker on weapon skill (Sword 3) which does teleport & stun break (much more difficult to use this way, I admit).

If you are balancing professions, either Phase retreat should have a cast time or Sword 2 should remain instant as it is.

Some points I’ve been thinking about :

Attunement Recharge
Why should attunement recharge begins upon leaving the attunement ? Why not upon entering ? This would add a lot more flexibility, reducing our dependency on Arcane trait line and will be the same as other classes (weapon CD begins upon swapping, they have only 2 swaps but the recharge is slightly quicker).
This would be powerful, but I think it does not reduce the interest of Arcane line and Fresh Air trait, just a sort of QoL improvement.
EA and swap buffs will have the same uptime so no big deal here, but it’ll be a bit more forgiving towards swap timing which is a main concern for this profession.

Dragon tooth
The after-cast is terrible. I would love to see a slight decrease in damage, but an after-cast far quicker. Now, this skill must be use either to force a dodge, or on rooted/CCed players, which is pretty inconsistent with it’s short cd.

Some issues seemed to be overlooked :

Healing Signet
This skill is clearly over the top right now. Other passive healing options (Elem, Thief) does only heal when attacking.
Why ever putting a full passive healing option on the profession with highest armor & health pool ? Why giving them the option to heal passively while blocking, 000ing, running away ? This leads to more passive play, and actually warrior is already the passive king (full passive heal, auto-stab, auto-0000)

Dhuumfire
I did not see any tweak (understand nerf or deletion) of this trait. Even necromancers recognize that it’s over the top, especially when combined with Terror.

JonPeters.5630:

Opportunist
This trait was wildly overpowered. I there was a 15 point minor for any other profession that basically read: "Reduce cooldown of all weapon skills by 33% [….]

Sorry but I really don’t understand ! Was the trait bugged somehow ?

Even at 100% crit, you would need 3.3 hits/sec to gain 1ini/sec.
Fastest thief attacks are multi-hit ones

• Unload = 8hits/2sec = 4hit/sec
• PW = 8 hits/2.75sec = 2.9hit/sec
  Then D/D:
• Dagger auto = 4hits/2sec = 2hits/sec.
  All others skills generate far less hit/sec (because of cast time/ini cost)

Are you nerfing this trait solely because of PW and Unload ?

I really cannot figure out how many hit/sec I’m throwing (no parser/no combat log export) but as I do not play S/P or P/P I can feel that I’m far from hitting once a second…….
I only have ~50% crit => 0.5*0.3 =0.15 = 15% chance to proc Opportunist (6.67 hits needed) With the fastest attack I can use => Dagger auto (2hit/sec => 1 ini every 3.3 sec => 1/3.3 => 0.30 ini/sec)
0.75 + 0.30 ini/sec = 1.05 ini/sec.

And the new ini regen is now 1ini/sec permanently.

I really don’t understand the theorycrafting behind this nerf, unless you want to tone down the trait because of the new regen (1ini/sec vs 0.75/sec) but in this case, the trait was not OP previously.

If my theorycrafting is shaky, feel free to enlighten me, I really love numbers ;-).

JonPeters.5630:

We are increasing base regen by 33%. This is basically equivalent to a patch notes that says: “Warrior: Cooldown on all weapon skills has been reduced by 25%.”

Wait…..the warrior has cooldown on weapon skills ? Is that a balance nerf ? [Sorry I could not resist]
Except that another class have 2 separate sets of cd (elem has four, but longer ones)
And BTW, they do not use their cds when underwater, but the thief still uses the same precious resource : initiative.

Initiative rework

I feel a little bit anxious about the change to ini because I can forecast a resurgence of good old HeartSeeker spam. I know that HS has been nerfed already, but quite honestly, I think the skill should be toned down slightly by lowering the dmg done for the >50%HP portion. The skill has a skill coefficient of 1.0 and I think it would be great to nerf it to 0.7 or maybe 0.6.
Of course, the two other portions should not be affected, I think this skill is meant to be a finisher, and it would be a great improvement towards smart gameplay to render HS spam utterly useless.

Boons

I must admit I do not understand the previous nerf of Larcening Strike (1 boon vs 2) and I was expecting a move towards boons available to us. We were told that the thief was lacking boons options and to make up for it, we get LS. Few months later, LS is nerfed but we gained no additional boon.

With the nerfs to vigor uptime and Infiltrator’s return I would be glad to see a move in that direction, because we are the only profession with no access to stability or protection, and very limited access to speed. Moreover, stealth does not make up for our lack of stability, and I feel really weak and more punished by CC than other classes.

Basilisk Venom

Sorry to be direct but this skill is utterly unreliable : unlike every other stun, this skill do not cancel animation and the target sometimes continues his animation (movement) resulting in “Miss Miss Miss” because the target is not considered at range.
This is our only stun, an elite skill and has a short stun duration. I would be grateful if you can look into it.

Infusion of Shadow

Tweaking is really great !
I was fed up of thieves abusing BlackPowder/Smoke Screen with Heartseeker to gain high stealth duration.

Daendur.2357:

really ? 5 heartseekers in a row ? 3.75 seconds without any reaction ? lol

btw 0.27*2 = 0.54, not 0.56

In fact, my tests show a coeff of 0.2774 i.e 0.28 for this skill. And 0.28*2 = 0.56 (Sorry for misleading rounding)

And I guess he was under haste when spamming, coupled with the initial stun from BV, it was really quick. Anyway, the lag was horrendous, it took like 4 sec to switch attunement, I never ever have experimented such a lagfest.

@Ghostwolf : thank your for your constructive feedback. I don’t play D/D anymore, this set is lackluster because of the successive nerfs you mention. Instead, I play D/P with S/D as a switch.

I think I would have gladly died to the CnD->BS->HS combo evoked, as it involves at least good positioning/awareness.
I usually don’t die to HS spammers, as they tend to spoil their ini leaving them useless.
However, I still consider HS could be slightly toned down, for the >50HP% stage only, but that’s my opinion and I can accept that it’s not a top priority on the “OP skill” list.

I agree that it can be frustraiting when a heartseeker spammer is at the right place at the right time. But all classes have elements of facerolling. […..] It’s just something to accept, that every noob can’t be outplayed at anytime.

This is sadly true, I must cope with that, for the greater good, but still, clueless noob player downing me tend to drive me up the wall.

First of all, let’s get some fact straight :

• HS vs Auto-attack : Base coeff for HS is 1.0 whereas dual-strike has a 0.27*2 = 0.56 coeff
  Moreover, auto-chain does not leap and has a really narrow attack angle.
  Sword auto-shot is slower, and does not track your target (and the 2 first attack have a coeff of 0.8)
• LS is a chain skill : you must use FS before to gain a small window to use LS => comparing a 5-ini skill chain to a 3-ini one is perfectly irrelevant (and BTW, i am really disappointed by LS nerf from 2 to 1 buff)

• @Ghostwolf : your opponent had a really bad build .
  When I was roaming, using the old 25/30/0/0/15 build, I could easily reach 3k+ crit with HS above 50% HP on glass ennemy.
  Even with my actual build (2600 armor) I would not let a thief spam HS on me, that’s too dangerous.
  For example, see the screen below, taken earlier this week on my Elem (2670 Armor)
  And yeah, he killed me using HS spam, but the tremendous lag this day prevented me from reacting quickly enough.
  If he can reach 3k+ on a target with 2600+ armor, how much would he do against your build with 1980 ? Would you let him spam HS like you did ? I don’t think so.

• I don’t understand your reluctance with my proposal : if nobody use HS above 50% because it’s so inefficient, how would a small nerf of its coeff (like 0.7 instead of 1.0) affect you ?

• Keep in mind that I’m not satisfied with the thief in his current state, but this is not a reason to tolerate facerolling or skills over the top : we are no warriors.

Hello all,

I mainly play a thief but I don’t understand the “balancing” strategy of the class.

I think [Heartseeker] is still a bit over the top : too much damage for an autotarget/leap skill.
I think it would be better to tone down the damage of the skill before 50% health to prevent the 2222 spam to death.
As a finisher skill, it would make sense that the skill do very few damage before 50% but still maintain its current scaling with HP (2 stages, >50% and >25% HP).

I find mandatory to keep the leap portion of the skill, because it’s a useful gap-closer or combo-builder for D/D or D/P builds.

I really feel ashamed by HS spammers, it can be countered but still, I find this skill too powerful for a 3 ini skill : too rewarding for poor gameplay/skill.

I don’t understand why nerfing situational/high-ini/high-cd mechanics and still promoting HS spam : it really increase the hatred towards thief, contributing to make it look like a spamming low skill class.

“Trinity ? Nahhh we need to go deeper "
“Being dead preventing you from skilling ? That’s so 2011 !”

And now A.net proudly present it’s new strategy :

“Testing patches before release ? Everybody else does that, too mainstream for us”

Imagine than this update was to open WvW league system : no point in trolling A.net, they’re doing themselves really better than anyone.

AgentChaos.4932:

i guess you didnt see the vs blob in kd bl earlier. its a common sight for vs so i didnt even bother to take a screen shot

Don’t get me wrong : I despise all blobs, especially those from my server.

However, be honest here, all servers (at least in kitten tier) have blobs, why saying it’s a “common sight” for VS when ALL servers do the same thing : herding players spamming their auto-shot again & again ?
Or maybe you think that the mighty SFR wins thanks to efficient and organized roamers/small groups scattered around the map …….Sorry to dispel this dream Sir ;-)

I was just expecting the Bloodlust update to alter blob supremacy but in fact, it doesn’t change anything. Still expecting something from A.net, my bad.

Wolfheart.1938:

How do you propose that people resupply then? I mean, if a big group can’t hit a camp…

Anyways, as a roamer on vizunah you really have nothing to complain. If you were on any other server maybe…

I just find utterly stupid that “objectives” does not scale up in 3W although it is largely used in PVE and the devs mention it as a strength of their game.
A kind of “constant-time” line or something that prevents large groups of people facerolling small objectives, making zergs less efficient.
Imagine that camps scales with people involved : NPC would have more HP, deal more dmg and the time needed for a 40+ group would be almost equal a small group taking the same camp.

And why would I not complain as a roamer on VS ? I don’t care about VS blob, I tend to avoid them as much as enemy ones. SFR used to have roamers but for this 2nd week, I’m seeing more well-stacked zergs than roamers…….
But you want to be n°1 and that’s the only way to go : I hate A.net for this “mechanic”, not players.

Interesting how SFR stopped whining about the Vizublob recently : I think they got a bigger one for themselves right now, so that’s ok.

BTW, below a screen of the SFR taskforce dispatched to secure hell of a difficult objective : hero’s camp.

As a solo/small group roamer (<5) I find myself really fed up and I have few options left :
- wait for the league and hoping to be against servers that have solo/roaming groups
- transfer to a low-tier server to avoid the “wannabeen°1” blobs
- Or most effective solution : “Start” => “Config Panel” => “Programs” =>"GW Uninstall : YES" and try to find a game that really promotes skill over pure numbers.

Promoting small group fight is the goal, isn’t it ?

Then, why are the 5 point so close to each other? Why not spread them out at each cardinal point of the map + 1 on the middle island ?

I forecast massive zergtempest on the bloodlust event.
At the end, they listen to their playerbase : “if you cannot beat them, join the blob”.

In the 23rd july patch notes

Healing Signet (Passive): Reworked the formula that this passive heal uses. At level 80, this skill goes from 392 healing per 3 seconds to 467 healing per 3 seconds with 1500 healing power.

Almost everybody knows that in fact, it heal for about 400 every second.
I didn’t see any tooltip correction in the recent patches notes, is the amount of healing really intended ?
Thanks.

sinject.4607:

No counter? You mean D/P or S/D isn’t a counter?

D/P is going to be though, as it requires a lot of ini just to keep BP up, not so much room for trying to burst with BS.

S/D => come on, the dmg are lower, the war can regen faster than you can burst.

Tankiness (double EP + block)/ decent dmg with GS/hardest CC with a ridiculous cd/ still great mobility with GS => a little over the top right now.
[/quote]

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

No.
All these ideas do is give tools to the players that want to grief by putting us over the limit.

If you really want to suggest something to reduce the tendancy for players to group, you should be looking for a positive suggestion, not something like this.

I totally agree with that.

The best solution would be to create an incentive for players not to blob : ATM blobbing/zerg/outnumbering is the way to go because it’s a win:win situation => faster, less risky, and faceroll-proof.

Rather than directly nerfing the blobs/zergs, I would rather see a way to motivate small groups : if you cap an objective solo or with few people, it’s obvious that you deserve more than when you do with 40+, spamming the 1 key. ATM, reward are the same, which utterly encourage blobbing.

Two options here :
1. Adjust the reward (WXP, karma, gold etc) with the number of players aka if you solo cap a camp, you earn full reward, a little less with 3+ players, lesser with 5+ players and so on….You can understand that if you cap an objective meant for a group (like a camp) with an intersellar-blob, you earn nothing, which is the point (no pain, no gain theory).

2. GW2 was proud of his scale-able events : why it doesn’t apply in 3W ?
The point here would be that a objective has to offer the same difficulty : if a zerg come to a camp, the NPC have more HP, hit harder etc…
The dev team knows how to do it for open-world content, I really don’t understand why they didn’t apply the same mechanic in 3W.

The 2 options proposed create an incentive for smaller groups without destroying the gameplay for the more casual players that like large-scale battles, their progression will just be longer which is pretty fair IMHO. (less pain, less gain theory again)

I was expecting calculation, excel tables, some figures at least……just a video, really ?

DPS is something that has to be calculated by dividing the total dmg done over a set period of time by the aforesaid period.
The period has to be as long as possible to ensure data steadiness.
What is shown here is burst dmg, not DPS : without a parser/appropriate tool, DPS is not something visible, it has to be calculated somehow.

GW2 is not very min/max compatible : no combat log export & no IG dps tool => they don’t want us to calculate DPS let alon comparing classes.

Furthermore, thief is using here D/D which is a mono-target weapon whereas warrior dps mostly come from GS which is multi-target weapon
=> IMHO warrior has greater DPS (pve-wise) and by far…..

Please, stop whining about thieves whining about other players whining about……….about what in fact ?

Hurtappl.6405:

t I already have good timing, make correct positional changes, and am aware of my surroundings!

For a thief-player, those are mandatory, for other classes, they’re are optional.
If a thief does not hit from the back, he’s not gonna win (exception : condition build).
Other classes tend to have AOE-based skilled, with a wider range or distance skills locked on target.

I don’t say that thief is the hardest class, I chose to play it myself because I have the feeling that the learning curve is higher than my others chars.

Hi there,

I have a issue with stealth : how the hell am I skilled with target-based skills when I’m stealthed ?
Best examples are channeled skills : elem (arc lighting) and ranger (rapid fire) : I take damage even when stealthed before the skill begins, I suppose it has to do with server lag : player still can target me and press the key while I’m stealting, and that’s okay but why the skill continues to deal damage WHEN I’M STEALTHED, even when moving ?

This is really annoying, because of damage ofc, but also because the skill reveals my position and I therefore lose advantage of stealth.
When a player uses an mitigation skill (mist form/endure pain/ aso…) that player don’t have to think whether their ennemy launched the channeling slightly before or even after their invul : why should thieves ?

Stealth should drop target and also stop incoming skills : if they can’t see me, they cannot shoot arrow/lighting at me either, that seems pretty straightforward to me.

I also have the feeling that skill lag has worsen lately.
I was used to have lag when approaching a big zerg (in BP generally) but now, I have lag even in 2V2 situation, with no zerg involved in the area.
I find it totally 4ssinine, because I remember playing games with far more people involved (AION for exemple, with 600 vs 600 fights) and having very little lag.

I was not expecting to feel like I miss culling => it was messy, it made me rage sometimes, but at least I could use more skills than my 1…..

Lag is currently THE game-breaking issue for me, I tested several VPN, did some optimization on my line, but heck, no improvement at all (and no latency on other games/web-app, I have like 30ms steady everytime).

Come on, ANET, stop developing the new quaggan backpack or new troll pet and just fix this, this game deserve better.
And please, dont evade the question, you communicate about almost every bug in the game, trying to muddy the waters is not the solution, I think 3W-only players like me need to be reassured and not blatantly ignored.

Thief is broke ?

They shoud reduce Steal CD : more stealing, more money => thief is not broke anymore.

I’ll try to stay as objective as possible, but as a thief, I can admit some mechanic are a little over the top, but stealth is not one of them.

I can only advise you to play a thief for a while, to understand the mechanic, they way of thinking and their weaknesses. Stealth is the only way for thieves to avoid damage, they have no access to an invul skill, block or protection and at the time is mandatory for dmg-purpose. Thief tend to have low HP pool, and therefore, further nerf would shut down the class.

Don’t forget that thief is the only class with a “energy” system aka initiative : that’s why switching weapons is not as efficient as other classes and this tend to make them keep one weapon set => build variety is greatly reduced.

IMO HS spam should be tuned down a bit, but AFAIK, the class is pretty balanced now with the usual DMG vs Stealth/Regen/HP tradeoff.

What is really annoying with the “OMG nerf Thieves” thread is that they forget that all thieves are not samely built/specced :
=> a “troll” build can indeed perma-stealth and be a PITA to kill but will have very little killing power
=> A GC-orientated one can dish out high burst, but have low-HP and will melt quickly even in stealth.

People took 10k from backstab and then see a godmode thief trolling 10people, they come here and say : OMG, thief have huge burst and still have high-HP/mitigation power……..

@Stramatus : if a single thief can kill 3-4 people of the same group and stomp them, sorry to say it but that’s clearly means you have a build/skill/coordination issue.
I can 2v1 sometimes, but often I tend to reset fight because I cannot finish them.

Trying to nerf or penalize Zergs directly (via a debuff) is not the option as it would be difficult to implement/regulate.
I think that what 3W need is a major incentive not to zerg and this can be done with a reward modulation/readjustment of the existing system.

Let me explain :

• same reward for capping a camp in solo or in zerg
  Why capping a camp alone (or with a small team) is not more rewarding than capping it with a full zerg ?

I don’t want to earn more WXP/karma, I find it high enough, especially since the last patch, I want the zerg to gain less, even not at all.

This would need a slight revamp of the reward system : each event has a sum of points (WXP/karma/gold) that can be distributed.

• If I solo-cap => reward pts/1 for me.
• If I am with 2 mates : reward pts/3 for each of us.
• But I am with a zerg (which is very unlikely btw) comprising N facerollers : then reward pts/N for each of us.*

Pretty straightforward, no ?
In fact, it is just a readjustment of the already implemented system : Gold/Silver/Bronze reward which is tremendously charitable.

• same reward for kills in 1v1 or 40v1 : I do 800 with leeching AOE or do 99,9% dmg => Same reward !

For kill WXP, it is a little more complicated, as I understand that support-orientated players are not able to dish out heafty dmg while still participating…..
But still, why is it possible to gain WXP with a single auto-shot on a DS player ?

I think that a cap of 20-30% of dmg should be required to obtain a reward. And yeah, that will make full-well necro cry like babies, beastmaster ranger too, but I don’t care.
In fact, Anet already reduced the dmg cap to “tag” a ennemy, this was a step in the zerg direction….

TL;DR version :

A system like that is based on skill/risk ranking : doing something solo/with few mates is harder and riskier than doing the same with 20 players: higher skill, higher risk = higher reward.

Such a change would not obliterate zergs, but at least, it would deprive them of their goal : farm points as fast as possible, with minimum risks and minimum skill.

My 2 c€nts.

bladie.5084:

working as intended, it’s been like day since prelaunch. The step that has a limit is shadowstep in utility.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infiltrator's_Strike
No limit

Because it’s been like that for a long time is a pretty frail point ; it may have not been spotted/looked at/prioritized by the dev team.

“Shadow Return” (2nd skill of IS) clearly states IG a range of 1.200 as well as the wiki http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow_Return

If it was intended, why it is not the case when using the skill “normally” i.e with a target selected ? In that case, return range is indeed 1.200 backwards in the direction where the white ring was dropped.

Using the skill without a target clearly deprives you of the gap-closer, the root effect and the skill damage, but as a trade-off of an unlimited range tp skill (and stun breaker).
No offense to the dev team, but such a complex mechanism would contrast with all other skills in the game, which tend to be pretty straightforward.

So, intended or not, I really expect a clarification : if it is really intended, the tooltip should be corrected.
If it’s not, and that’s I believe, you know the drill……

I mainly play a thief, I know the trolling power of the skill, I just don’t want the thief profession to take advantage of a skill bug/exploit.

Sword : Infiltrator’s strike/Shadow return

When using infiltrator’s strike (2 with sword) with no target selected, the skill allow players to Shadow Return from far more than the stated 1.200 range.
In fact, in flat ground, the range is almost unlimited : you can go as far as you can in the 15 sec duration of the return (I’ve gone far more than 3.000) and still you can use SR to return to your initial location.

I do not think it is “working as intended”, but I really expect a official response to make it clearer whether it is intended or not, and if that’s the case, maybe a tooltip correction.

When using infiltrator’s strike (2 with sword) with no target selected, the skill allow players to Shadow Return from far more than the stated 1.200 range.

In fact, in flat ground, the range is almost unlimited : you can go as far as you can in the 13 sec duration of the return (I’ve gone far more than 3.000) and still you can use SR to return to your initial location.

I’ve seen a lot of thieves “abusing” this bug, and I’m sure I will be hated for bringing this to light, but I want the game to be balanced and not biased by skill exploits.
The skill does not need a nerf, just a simple fix to make it do what is stated and nothing more.

I do not think it is “working as intended”, but I really expect a official response to make it clearer whether it is intended or not, and if that’s the case, maybe a tooltip correction.

“Elems: we are fine, leave us alone !

DevTeam : Come get some !"

[img]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/4773/nerfhammer.png[/img]

As usual, I’m more for the “fix before, nerf after if needed” kind of approach.
Culling needs a fix, and thieves are not the only concerned, I am torn into pieces by invisible players everyday and they’re not thieves…..

And if you want to increase the “revealed” system by a crazy amount, do the same for block, invul and so on …….Yeah the player is still on screen, but takes no damage unlike stealthed characters…..

And why all the hate revolves around thief ? Mesmers can do almost the same (with longer cd, I admit, but a combo involving Decoy (with IP) + Mind Wrack can be as devastating as a thief opener if not worse….

Downed-state : game mechanic that allow facerollers to continue facerolling when dead.

More seriously, stomp animation is way too long : it should be substancially reduced. Being immobile for 2sec + interrupt + 2sec is way too much. Yeah I can use stealth but it doesn’t help with cancel, and I have no access to the stability buff. And even if I had, why should I use a skill to be able to finish someone already dead ?

This mechanic obnoxiously favors larger number at the expense of smart gameplay.

As previously stated by others, downed-state largely favors some classes and gimp others which is another source of imbalance. Balance is already something difficult to achieve, so why complicate things further ?

If TTK is the main issue, a slight increase in HP bar should be fine.

My 2 c€nts.

This is not a bug, it’s the last mesmer skill in downed state : “Phantasmal Rogue” which does double damage from behind. The problem is that the phantasm pop in your back and skill immediately, so it almost always does double damage.

Being hit for 8k by someone “already dead” is plain stupid, and this should be tuned down quickly.

I have posted another thread because I didn’t notice this one. My bad !

I wanted to expose my opinion (and also the POV of my mates by the way) concerning downed state in 3W.

For me the current way it functions make it too powerful to be enjoyable :

• Many discrepancies/imbalances between professions
• Always favors high numbers
• It’s not fun

For example, damage for using skill 1 are far too variable between classes (Throw Rock vs the rest ?). Some classes (Mesmer, Warrior) have great down-state abilities, whereas some have few/none (elem = free stomp)
Damage should be balanced between classes.
Pets : why pets classes can have such an advantage when downed ? Their master is downed, they shouldn’t attack !

Another point : you can be canceled almost immediately when stomping. Why ? I think no interrupt should be available at least 5s after getting in down state. You should be able to kill somebody and stomp him immediately flawlessly. Same applies for teleportation/vanish.

My advices to fix this

• No cancel/TP/vanish available immediately (5s delay should do it)
• Stomp animation is too long : should be reduced by 50% at least
• Pets summoned before downstate should not attack (free dmg for pet users)

I just want to improve the gaming XP, and at the moment, downed state is a real PITA in 3W and something really frustrating for me.

I know that the downed state is required in PVE but I think it’s currently too powerful right now in PVP situation. You almost can’t win a fight when you’re outnumbered because of instant rez/cancel and that’snot fun for me.

Moreover, just by speeding up stomp animation, it’ll grantly improve small scale fights while changing almost nothing for big zerg one.

Feel free to discuss/comment.

Churning Earth : tooltip states that it is a hold & release skill => obviously not the case. The cast is really long (longest of the game !?) and therefore making it difficult to land.

Fire Grab : I have a lot of “miss” with this skill, maybe because I hold RMB when casting to be able to face the target. Really annoying though, cd is pretty long.