Guild Wars 2

Just wait till bg gets another 10 na guilds, 15 Sea/oceanic guilds, and about 30 euro guilds to transfer. Then they will show everyone what they are made of.

Random matches everyone. Think about what that means. Unless we want weeks of boredom punctuated with one or two good matches then everyone needs to work to even out servers, and not just groups of 3.

If this is legitimate, and you insist on ‘t1’ then go to jq so there is at least some hope of keeping the match balanced. If you are looking at the long term health of the game then please give serious consideration to DB, TC, or FA. Honestly I would say FA. The random matches are going to continue to suck until we get at least the top 6 or better yet 9 servers on equal footing.

(On SoR btw, and while I know our Sea and Oceanic guys could use the help, SoR ticking 400+ 24/7 against bg and jq would be boring for everyone.)

Quells.2498:

SoR: Please bring your “A” game next time. You might not mean it as an insult but I want an honest look at what “T1” is about. Don’t worry, you can’t break us.

to that same point…

TC: Where the hell were you? We knew we’d likely lose but I know that this week was like half our actual strength.

How can you ask us to bring our A game when TC won’t bring it’s A game. Thing is I saw huge improvement from the TC that did come out this week. Your players melted last friday, but last night you guys were certainly tougher.

Get the people on TC who sat out this week some confidence. With your full force you can put a nice dent in any of the t1 servers.

For SoS, don’t get discouraged. Population is not something anyone can really control. I really hope you guys get mixed with servers on your level this week. (by level I mean population only).

Liquid.9672:

pot.6805:

salluks.6017:

why is all BG in this thread anyway??

don’t they have their own thread. missing us already?

And still funnier after knowing that you yourself posted in the BG/JQ/DB thread.

Funniest part for sure.

It’s a free country. People can post where they want, especially when those posts are on topic.

You mean the topic of Blackgate the massive blackhole server which consumes and annihilates guilds and is the pit of despair consuming players by the score, doomed to wander hopelessly in the desolate wasteland of obscurity versus the Sanctum of Rall the shining beacon of strength and courage whose very presence infuses people with hope and joy? You mean that topic?

Was that over the top? I can never tell.

Sophtspoken.9062:

LOL Black gate is so screwed when anet fixes zergs

If you mean casual zergs with no direction or leadership then yes. If you mean the guild zergs which are organized all the way down to who has what skills then no. The organized guild zerg is simply the strongest weapon in wvw at the moment. If Anet does change that then you can be assured all those guilds you are trying to insult will change to the new meta and continue winning.

Chris.3290:

Hickeroar.9734:

Rackhir Tanelorn.9123:

They just introduced new PvE Content and Minis…. almost all the Maps around LA just went into Overflow on TC

Yeah, I feel that our WvW population will be somewhat….lacking…the next couple days.

ANet! Grr.

If it makes you feel better, I think SoS isn’t going to take advantage…or will we?

Seriously though, I see that IRON isn’t interested in dragon coffers, or are just really motivated to cap everything so they can get to them. +510PPT on a day new content was released? I admit, Canach was a snore; but even I took a day out to check it out.

SoR has a sizable population that never sets foot in pve.

Sovereign.1093:

^ I don’t know what to say. I’ve fought viz for a very long time being an EU original. They are quinticentially a whole new level of extreme. On the other hand, having fought SOR, it might be an even match as both servers are extremely good.

That would most likely be a week of boredom for both servers. Prime times don’t match up. Given the fact most sea/oceanic seem to have gone to na servers I would guess na would win by virtue of coverage but who knows. I still think Anet would have done better to just have world servers instead of the split. WvW would be healthier over all.

The price of doing that would be slower connections for some people not sure if thats a good trade off or not.

Keep in mind the most probable match remains SoR/JQ/BG. Actually with the gap between t1 and t2 increasing this week its even more likely.

With as many people as BG has crammed on the server the fair weather population has to be massive. When they do start winning again they are going to see record breaking queues.

Just a thought I had looking at the current matches. According to the scores things are going as expected. The problem is the raw score, as we all know, pretty much just reflects coverage. However, if you judge the winners and losers by the change in Glicko rating you get a different picture.

Going by the raw score the winners are SoR, TC, DB, CD, EB, DH, IoJ, and SF. Going by Glicko the winners currently are JQ, SoS, SBI, CD, AR, NS, FC, and ET. Because despite coverage and population differences those servers have performed better than expected. Given the population disparities and the fact that no one has come up with a workable way of changing that, maybe the best way to determine winning and losing weekly is to go by the change in Glicko.

While I would love to see the servers all balanced and competitive, i have played enough of these games to know that just is not going to happen. So while waiting for some miraculous event to balance all the servers maybe we are better off determining who is winning by the change in rating and not by the final scores.

Seems the gap between t1 and t2 is only growing. SoS is bleeding points from TC and FA. If the same thing keeps happening we may be stuck with each other for a very very long time.

I dunno, I rather enjoy watching 50 man zergs trying to hide behind a little hut or broken wall. Just pretend you can’t see the massive red name tags and then make sure you act shocked when they jump out so you don’t hurt anyone’s feelings.

I think the problem is that the one server that was arguably strong enough to advance in rank got kicked back down. Ehmry Bay got shafted by the rng but hopefully they will get their shot next week.

Aurust.8961:

1. Maguuma

Supposedly they have a strong NA with very skilled players. I think SOR NA can give them a run for their money…..

2. Tarnished Coast

Its always fun to watch a bunch that are always so preachy about being cheerful to their opponents when they are winning, and to expose them for what they really are when you mercilessly annihilate them….

Throwing in DB,TC, or FA might spice things up for the weekend but anything below t2 is likely to be a yawn fest for SoR. The difference in coverage and participation is just too large. Even low rank servers with strong NA are not gonna come out all week if they are looking at a solid wall of t3 fortifications.

SoR will be better of staying with JQ and BG. Interestingly, if SoR, BG, and JQ fight for a few more weeks the gap between T1 and T2 may just get larger as T2 bleeds points to lower tiers.

From a WvW perspective. Make all mace attacks instant. Trying to land a melee ability with a cast time in wvw is a pain to say the least. The lack of a gap closer is also a serious liability.

Doesn’t matter what system you use. The only way to get balanced matches is to get the player base to spread evenly among all the servers. Make no mistake the player base is as much to blame as Anet. From the first week with HoD, JQ, and every stacked server since then. Even now servers which are showing FULL status are trying to shove players in sideways.

Anet deserves some blame. You shouldn’t be able to transfer to full servers at all or it should cost twice as much. Bottom tier servers should have free or at least drastically discounted. There should be rewards for fighting as the underdog. Right now everything from the scoring system to class design punishes you for trying to fight outnumbered.

However, its the players that have the final decision. There really isn’t anything anet can do short of forcibly moving people that will make things more competitive. No one forced the player base to stack on a few servers. Look at all the most recent guild transfer posts. Are we trying to funnel players to servers that need them? Nope it’s all JQ, BG, DB. Servers that have full populations.

Anet can alter the transfer system to funnel players to servers that actually need the population, but it is up to the players to actually spread out. No system you come up with will result in balanced matches because the player base as a whole does not seem to want balanced matches.

Burl.9567:

I hope the hilarity that is ensuing on the EU servers happens for NA as well. Some servers are in two tiers or they are fighting themselves.

That might actually be fun. SoR vs SoR vs SoR.

Awesome. Have different servers for each map. Forget 2 v 1 we could have 8 v 1.

The new system just introduces a random element. It does not guarantee a new match every week. However it should prevent the same match up from lasting a month or more.

I am putting my money on the only change in North America being that Ehmry Bay gets slapped back in T5. It would just be too epic if the new system prevented server movement it’s first week out.

kRAVen.4195:

Fingers crossed for the SoS CD and EB matchup that we earned glicko wise. Its been 2 months of this same CDvsSoSvsSBI battle. If this new random gives us the old matchup i think some are going to go insane.

Gotta admit it would be funny if the only change in NA was for EB to be kicked back down to t5 again.

salluks.6017:

in EU the top 3 tiers haven’t changed and they are way more imbalanced, so its likely the same servers will fight this week too.

The new system just introduces a small random element. The most likely match up remains SOR/JQ/BG.

Hmmm, can I resist the temptation to make a new thread complaining about the changes and how they will ruin WvW. Oh well if someone hasn’t made one I am sure it will be up soon. Hope Devon has a good therapist.

The borderlands have a great deal of unused space. Between the ridiculous placement of the home spawn and the skritt and centaur areas you have a large area which is not being used.

Not much could be done about eb unless you ditch stone mist. Could be fun to turn sm into a ruin. Remove the gates and just put in 5 claimable circles. some around the outside and some on different floors.

I can understand them being careful if they are afraid the new system will result in bad match ups. however i think many were looking forward to a bit of a shake up from the same matches we have been playing for the past several months. I don’t see why they can’t just manually set the matches this week. Mix up t1 and t2, t3 and t4 and so on.

That way we get new matches and they get another week to perfect the new system.

Fuzzion.2504:

I wonder what next reset will bring with the introduction of randomisation

The most likely result will be our three servers playing each other again.

First step is to remove ALL waypoints. No more teleporting zergs. No more taking north camp, and 10 seconds later have 70 people defending briar tower. No more spamming waypoints to get in during the defense reset. Best way to defeat a zerg is to make it a losing proposition to have everyone on the map moving in a herd.

Sorry your logic fails in several ways. For example you assume everyone plays the same amount of time each week. SoR could just as easily have the highest number of wvw population playing 18 hours a day. JQ and BG could have an average of 2 hours per person. Then both JQ and BG would actually have a higher percentage of wvw players than SoR.

Bottom line is that most servers, if all pve players went to wvw, could have queue’s 24/7.

uberkingkong.8041:

I just received word that EMP left JQ to DB is that so when SoR knocks BG out of T1 JQ will have ties with DB via EMP so they can take out the behemoth SoR. They decided to goto DB once they heard words of talk between SoR and the IRON BEHEMOTH from EU and that this is the only way to stop the BEHEMOTH SoR brought to the NA. I’m very excited and cannot wait for DB to take BG spot because we need to take the behemoth out and teach him his place and that NA is no place for a EU BEHEMOTH. Its great timing as well because the living story should be over and done with so our numbers will be fierce and mighty SoR will be nothing but an insect compared to us with this great timing.

So, I guess the word of the day is BEHEMOTH.

It’s pve. Equip greatsword, hundred blades.

Dayra.7405:

Peetee.9406:

Without constant representation the system will give erratic ratings, a server like Maguuma may lose by 300k to an SoR/JQ and comeback the following week to crush HoD by 300k.

Totally wrong. To take up your example: Currently Maguma has 327 rating points less than JQ and 377 rating points less than SoR.

Should that match be really rolled (which is highly unlikely) it will end in a disaster for SoR and JQ, Maguma will easily get +100 rating points out of the match just by reachng a NA primetime score of 230:230:230 and 0:345:350 at every other time.
The only match with a rating difference of >300 that currently exist is EU-T9 and you see the score Blacktide needs to reach against both other servers to get poor 50pts http://mos.millenium.org/servers/view/12/

We don’t let JQ or BG have 230 during NA prime time, why would we let Maguma? Just Kidding. Sadly I don’t think that many people will care that they are gaining in ranking if they are being slaughtered in game.

I would say give this system a chance to work. The deviation can be changed later or they can even revert it back to the current scheme.

Not sure how often Anet can explain that this first change is only to evaluate the accuracy of the ranking systems. SF and Elona both proved that the ranking system was not accurate. Using this new system will hopefully correct those problems. After a couple of weeks when the rankings are more accurate the deviation can be changed.

People are getting too caught up in the unfortunate examples used in the explanation. Those examples are from over a month ago and include a server which imploded.

Things will change within a few weeks I have no doubt. Pugs, casuals, and pver’s have more impact on wvw than alot of people like to admit. Most servers have the population to fill up wvw 24/7, it’s figuring out how to get them out in the field that is the problem. Right now iron has provided a nice rallying point for SoR. As a result many casuals, and pver’s are flooding into the borders. This will fade a bit in time.

It’s up to JQ and BG to figure out how to get your servers out to fight. The people are there and I hope you guys find a way to motivate them and knock us out of first.

Aarean.5398:

Hope some guilds see the senses to join JQ. Hot competition of jq vs sor and iron made a mistake going to sor and just killing the chances of balance considering its been fairly stable sor being ahead by far for weeks now. Sor will stay ahead till some guilds get bored or others move to jq. All coverage aside the score is perfect proof of the current imbalance in the grand scheme

Rewriting history a bit. SoR had the weakest coverage of all 3 t1 servers. No one could foresee that JQ would start bleeding guilds. At the time Iron made the choice SoR was the best choice as far as balance is concerned.

Kryyg.8576:

Well according to the T2 thread, BG is getting BT, VK and a bunch of the other FA guilds.

Should be interesting next week.

Took a peak and my understanding is that those guilds are transferring to DB not BG. Seems DB is still stacking up.

My predictions for next week are that JQ and BG pull out everything in order to remain in t1. Given the population advantages, they may succeed in pushing out SOR if they can convince the massive pve populations to participate for the whole week.

T2 I think will go in a land slide to DB. They have spent the last few weeks farming and will come out hard to push into T1. TC might be able to beat them but I think TC has developed an irrational resistance to ever advancing to T1. FA is a bit of a darkhorse. They have the talent but not the population. If they pull a ton of overtime they might pull an upset but that would set them up to be butchered in T1 the next week.

This assumes a new ranking system that allows weekly movement. For all we know it could take a month to move tiers under the new system.

LetoII.3782:

The call has gone out, before the new patch and the end of this matchup TW would like to make one final “clash of the titans” battlefield. GM’s head over to guru to be part of it.
Let’s make a fight worthy of YouTube.

I suggest a round of rock em sock em robots. Set a time all 3 sides make as many golems as you can and have a golem only battle.

DevonCarver.5370:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ll have a blog post going out before the release that walks you through every detail of how it works with examples. The goal is to get you more variety in match ups, while avoiding match ups against worlds way outside of your current tier so it’s not too crazy.

What Colin said. This is a complicated enough change that we can’t explain it in a little blurb like that. So hopefully the blog post will make it all clear.

Complicated. Guys sporting events have been around for thousands of years. Winner advances loser doesn’t. Why mess with what works?

Oh well, hopefully the complicated part only applies to tie breakers.

Congratulations to everyone on SoR. I also hope all three servers continue working together to keep t1 highly competitive. The goal should be to have all three servers end the week within a few thousand points of each other.

Space.8053:

didn’t RiOT transfer like 2 weeks ago? Surely you could see that the ratings gap from T6-T7 was huge and also that the number of guilds to challenge you would be few and far between in that tier?

1 up 1 down would just mean servers yo-yoing up and down with a server sandwiched in the middle not moving anywhere. The extremes would be even greater.

For example next weeks US T2 on a 1 up 1 down would be on current scores:

JQ
TC
Maguuma

You would expect JQ to win massively and move back, Maguuma to come 3rd by a long way and move down again and TC to stay T2.

Both systems have their faults, 1 up 1 down isn’t some kind of holy grail that will save wvw boredom.

Possibly true but which is worse? Your scenario where you have a blow out one week, or the current scenario where half the servers have been getting blown out for 10 weeks or more. I would rather a system of win one week lose the next than lose nonstop against the same server for 10 – 15 weeks straight.

WoDan.4079:

Anyone else notice the sudden lack of 2v1, etc, complaints this week? Oh yeah…the usual whiners have moved-on to gloating.

Did I just enter the twilight zone? Pretty sure BG has a monopoly on the 2v1 complaints.

Best solution in my mind is to alter the controls on siege. Get rid of the ground target. Push forward to shoot farther, and back to shoot shorter. The weapon fires when you press the fire button, no more power up silliness. Gets rid of the zoom advantage on arrowcarts and then you adjust the range if it’s firing too far. Do this for cats and trebs and you no longer have the silly 5 cats pressed up against a wall.

Doubt that will happen but I think it’s the best solution.

VOLKON.1290:

Fuzzion.2504:

This thread is getting interesting.

We have ppl saying BG is dead, JQ is dead and then we have DB folk hijacking the thread.

PS. Waha is not moving from JQ. And yes he is in [ATM]

The problem isn’t DB highjacking the thread, it’s DB actively trying to recruit JQ guilds away and then deliberately trying to sabotage our own recruitment efforts. When you consider how pathetic that really is you have to hope people can see beyond the sunshine DB is blowing up their butts to the real types of people they are.

Really dislike this kind of thing. JQ needs time to reorganize, they don’t need other servers stirring up controversy and trying to split them apart. In short DB needs to stop being kittens.

Taras.4367:

Ive must of missed something how did SoR become this? if i remember correctly few weeks ago they had troubles staying in tier 1.

Not sure where you got this idea. SoR has always had a strong NA. Now instead of starting NA time slot with a low ppt SoR is coming in with high ppt and upgraded fortifications.

As for staying in T1, none of us are in any danger of slipping out of T1 thanks to the ranking system. JQ is currently in third but worst case scenario they have 3 weeks to turn it around. Realistically, they have up to 10 weeks to get things back in gear. Consider that after this week as long as they stay within 50k of the first place server next week they will actually gain points.

It takes a true server meltdown to drop out of t1 or a server has to dominate t2 with some 300k victories. So JQ and BG are taking it easy this week Glicko will barely even notice.

I have to admit Burnfall has a point. This is a purchasable item intended as a counter to a class mechanic. Not sure this is a great precedent. What comes next? Special Items to strip all buffs from guardians and elementalists? A trap which can immobilize warriors specced to ignore roots and snares? A device that puts a giant flaming arrow over the real mesmer and stays visible even if the mesmer stealths?

covenn.7165:

Aarean.5398:

Why are guilds leaving or in rumor of leaving jq. Theres not balance issue anymore. Jq is the weakest of t1 and any guild leaving it is just avoiding losing. Anyone else not seeing the score trend?

Score trend or not, it is just a phase. Before moving to SoR last year, I was on JQ initially…. and I know for a fact that the server is solid. They will be back kicking on teeth in no time.

True. However this is where Glicko is killing servers. WvW populations are never static. All servers go through up ticks and down ticks. Glicko is far to slow to respond to those needs. JQ could use a week or two in t2 to regroup and reinvigorate. A couple of weeks ago it was SOR that could have used a t2 vacation. A month ago BG was on the ropes and could have used a break. At the same time servers like DB and Kaineng should get shots at t1 when they are riding a wave of success and not be forced to atrophy in a tier they are too strong for.

The other problem is exemplified by the success of SF after getting out of t8 jumped up to t6 with some impressive wins. Meaning they were ranked behind servers they were stronger than. Last week Viz Square was all but declared unbeatable, and this week they are losing to Elona. It’s been so long since we played anyone but each other that for all we know DB could wipe the floor with all of us.

Would love to see DB move up. Keep in mind it has been 10 weeks or more since t1 has changed. We simply can’t be sure how t1 and t2 stack up right now. Take a look at the Euro servers. Last week people were all but declaring Viz square unbeatable and this week they are losing to Elona that moved up from t2.

Glicko needs to go. Kaineng deserved a shot at t1 and should have gotten it. DB deserves a shot as do TC and FA. The fact is with Glicko it is perfectly possible that DB, FA, and TC are all now stronger than BG, JQ, and SOR, but we will never get to find out.

( Yes, I realize the T1 servers are likely stronger, but I don’t think everyone realizes that huge queues are gone even in t1 and the outmanned buffed makes a frequent appearance for all 3 servers.)

Ugh new terms. So can anyone tell me what the difference between a zerg and a blob is?

The main problem is the cast times. Far too many warrior skills have cast times or root you in place. Thing is pvp and wvw is all about constant motion. Anyone standing still is toast. Add in server lag and it becomes very difficult to land many of our skills. Melee skills should not have a cast time. If they root you in place then there needs to be a complimentary skill on the weapon that immobilizes the opponent so you can set up the hit. It is hard enough to stay in melee range of some classes with high mobility, warriors don’t need the added pain of cast times and abilities that root you in place.

Why not just remove the pve crap from wvw. Those mobs serve no purpose and detract from pvp.