-Mike O’Brien
Because we can’t be angry about both?
Or at least some of you.
If content is too short and easy, people complain.
If content is too long and hard, people complain.
And yes I am referring to the elite specializations, the mastery system, etc.
Please make up your mind on what you want.
Golly! It’s almost as if a massively multiplayer game…. has multiple people, with different opinions playing it! That couldn’t possibly be the answer, right?
Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.
Since this has come back onto public radar recently, I’d like to take some time to better inform people about what’s what about the “no valid path to target” error and shadowsteps in general.
-Why was “no valid path to target” added as a mechanic?
The quick answer is that it wasn’t, contrary to popular belief. A message informing players about it was added, but shadowsteps failing because of an invalid path has been a thing since game launch. Read on to learn more about what is actually going on behind the scenes when this error message appears.
-What is a shadowstep?
A shadowstep is a teleport with validation on its destination point. This validation is only there to prevent exploits and has no other lore reasoning or whatnot.
As an aside, despite what skill text may claim , most “teleports” are actually shadowsteps. An actual teleport, such as what happens when you use a mesmer portal, does no validation.
-How does validation work?
Pathfinding is performed between your current position and the target point, using the same mechanism that AI uses for navigating. Specifically, this uses “navmesh”, which is derived from collision data (terrain, objects, etc that you can run into). Navmesh is automatically generated and represents the places where it is “safe” for NPCs to walk. Essentially, more complicated pathing tasks (“will I fit between these two rocks?” and so forth) are precalculated so that finding paths for NPCs on the fly doesn’t cost too much.
Speaking practically, shadowsteps make use of the navmesh for validation because it is the most reliable option that isn’t absurdly expensive. Still, it is the case that generated navmesh sometimes leads to results which can seem surprising. For example, you can get a valid path from the ground to the rooftop of the Kyhlo tower because of a walkway that wraps around the building, but can’t find one from the ground to an elevated rock because the sides of the rock are too steep. This apparent discrepancy is unfortunate but an inevitability of how the system works.
-When does this validation happen?
Some skills which will perform a shadowstep are flagged as needing to perform a path check on cast. When the client asks to activate such a skill, the server will do pathfinding to the target point first, before any activation costs are paid. Should pathfinding fail, the skill will be canceled and the “no valid path” error message will be sent to the client.
Additionally, for all skills which shadowstep (not just those that are flagged), this same validation will occur when the shadowstep action itself fires. The purpose of this validation is to stop exploits, whereas the previous check (if there was one) is only there to minimize player grief. It is important to note that, as shadowstep actions are driven by skill scripts, this later validation will happen after skill activation costs are paid.
Generally, for skills which preemptively path check, the second check should only fail for non-instant skills, and only when the delay between checks allows you to move from a valid position to an invalid position. Thief shortbow 5 in particular is the key offender here, given that the skill is used often and the missile has flight time.
As mentioned, not all skills which shadowstep will perform the preemptive pathing check, and there is some reasoning for why this happens or doesn’t happen. Broadly, skills which the user directly activates to perform a shadowstep, such as Blink, will do a path check first. It is expected that players would prefer to keep such a skill off cooldown if it’s going to fail anyway. Flipover skills, such as Shadow Return, do not path check first. Players may want to clear out the flipover skill right away, which would be hard to do if pathing kept failing.
Also, for skills with preemptive path checking, if you attempt to use such a skill which also happens to be a stun break while you are stunned/knocked down/etc, it will fire regardless of pathing success.
-Why does my shadowstep give me a path error now when it used to work from this same spot?
To help answer this, you should first know that there is fallback behavior for shadowsteps which uses what’s called “straight-line” pathing, should normal pathfinding fail. Basically, the pathfinding engine will go in the direction of the target point until it hits anything and then will stop immediately, so you end up with a really simple path that has just two points. Because of the easy failure condition, this is quite unreliable, as the path may go decently far or just a few inches, depending on what the navmesh looks like.
The straight-line pathing fallback was used by all shadowsteps before preemptive path checking was introduced. As a result, there were certainly times when you would fire your shadowstep and, despite not quite reaching your target point, still move some reasonable distance. However, this fallback behavior was as likely as not to move you a very short distance, and still at full skill cost of course.
Skills which preemptively path check will no longer do this fallback behavior, as pathing would pretty much always succeed, defeating the purpose of checking ahead of time (technically speaking, straight-line pathing almost never fails).
-Why doesn’t the shadowstep ground target marker go red when pathing will fail?
I’ve seen this suggestion come up a few times, and this is actually how preemptive path checking was originally intended to work. Unfortunately, navmesh data is not included on the client, and as such the only way to get the necessary information to color the ground target marker would be to continually poll the server. Having the server respond to client polls and do a bunch of pathing calculations on demand would be too expensive and too vulnerable to lag to be considered a good solution. Also consider that one of our ground targeting options, instant ground targeting, would have no marker to color in the first place.
The best compromise was, as mentioned, to flag skills which will perform shadowsteps as needing to do a path check on cast, and to have those skills stop early before costs are paid. This way players are at least not punished for the state of the navmesh, which they cannot see.
-Are any changes planned for shadowstep behavior?
As mentioned earlier, for skills which do a preemptive pathing check, there is a second validation which happens when the skill actually executes, and this second check can fail if you manage to move to an invalid spot in between the two. The first check will not allow a straight-line path fallback, as that would defeat the purpose of checking for a valid path ahead of time. However, currently if the first check happens, the second check also will not allow a straight-line path fallback. This means that if the first check passes but the second fails, skill costs will be paid but no shadowstep of any kind will occur. This is a bug and was never intended, and so is being fixed for Heart of Thorns release. The reasoning is that since costs have been paid, even a small shadowstep in the target direction is better than nothing at all.
I get the feeling that a lot of people are being overly paranoid. When the devs say “you can’t dodge it all”, I think they just mean the standard dodges that come base on every class.
Thief and Daredevil dodging are on a whole other level.
#1: We have weapon dodges, which is one dodge every 4 seconds going by initiative cost.
#2: We have 50% vigor uptime with either trickery or lolcrabatics.
#3: We have skill dodges in Withdraw and Roll for Initiative
#4: Signet of Agility’s active is 2 more dodges every 30/24 seconds.
#5: We have movement skills that move us out of danger zones.
#6: Now starting with daredevil, we get an additional dodge.
#7: Daredevils have the best endurance regen in the game, especially with brawlers tenacity. All physical skills give 10 endurance, including the 12 second block in bandits defense. That endurance is all worth about 4 seconds of vigor.
#8: Renewed Vigor gives up to 85 endurance every 16 seconds.
#9: Steal gives 50 endurance every 30/20 seconds.
#10: Daredevil dodges aren’t like other dodges. Other classes dodge to avoid damage, and don’t do damage while dodging. But with Bounding Dodge and Lotus Training, our dodge skills maintain damage, costing us relatively little.
#11: If we go defensive, the combination of escapists absolution and Unhindered Combatant menas we can’t be soft CCed into a damage patch.
#12: Staff Mastery can regen 2 endurance per initiative, which while miniscule still contributes.
#13: Our greater dodge bar means we have more endurance capacitance. Any “burn phase” or damage-less downtime has the ability to benefit the daredevil 50% more than any other class.
#14: This isn’t pertinent to dodging, but don’t forget that stealth is the best aggro management tool in the game. Should we ever want to stop focus fire on ourselves, we just blink out of existence.
Thief and daredevil dodging isn’t just “better” than other classes. It is exponentially better than other classes. It also isn’t the only survival tool we have.
Re: Dash update!
The original reason we had removed the extra distance on Dash was that we lacked the tech. Since that post, it’s been resolved. Thus, the distance of Dash is back, with a fervor. Now you’ll travel a full 450, up from the 360 previous (~300 base dodge), while moving at a faster-than-running speed. Swiftness duration increased to 10 seconds, up from the 8 we talked about originally.
This thing’s about solid movement, so we’re going to push it in that direction for this BWE. Please check it out and let us know how you feel about it. The animation’s going to remain as your character’s run for now.
We are aware that this new distance will cause some de-sync in synergy with Shadow Refuge, but feel that the open-field movement capability for daredevil needs to take precedence over this abliity. note: You can still dodge from edge-to-edge and remain inside the field, but it’s pretty tricky.
This is what many have been waiting. Ignore the nay-sayers because there is less synergy with SR. There are 2 other dodges to use there. Variety is what’s needed and this new dash is great step forward and a good step in making the meta more varied. Shadowstep, SR and speed boost being pretty much mandatory really sucks. Dash can now efficiently free up slot where speed boost was (hello swiftness!) and shadowstep, cause dash will hopefully be close to mobility shadowstep provides.
I just hope this gets properly balanced so we don’t get stuck in animation after the evade is gone. Distance traveled needs to happen in the time when evading is active like on regular dodge, and if that’s the case then you’ve nailed it
Ever since the launch of f2p it has been impossible to sell dungeon paths for lower level dungeons (AC, CM) without tons of new players joining without reading the LFG.
These said f2p players can’t send gold or items to someone, so they are not even able to buy a dungeon path.Selling dungeon paths is something that is acknowledged and allowed by Anet, so I think there should be filters that prevent certain people from joining groups.
This doesn’t only apply to selling dungeons, but also to normal LFGs which frequently get joined by low level f2p people, even tho the LFG specifically asked for someone thats level 80.It would at least be reasonable to prevent people from joining your group after they have been kicked once, since I had people join my party over and over after being kicked repeatedly, making it impossible to let other people that have genuine interest join.
F2p ruined a big part of this game for me, and I find it sad that people that play this game for free negatively influence people like me, and lots of others, that payed 100+ euros for it
The bold is what needs to be addressed. Yes, Anet does allow people to sell dungeon paths however they have said they do not support it. You see if you “buy” a path from someone and they don’t give you the path than that is your own loss. Anet won’t help you. The same goes for if people join your LFG but can’t pay. Anet does not support the selling of dungeon paths and will not change anything to support that idea. Sorry dude but you are out of luck. You have to either deal with it or move on and do something else.
Impaling Lotus should not proc while in stealth. A lot of what makes a thief slippery is evading in stealth. Proccing without being revealed is too much.
I was looking forward to including Impaling Lotus into my condi build, but getting revealed for dodging while stealthed makes it impractical. (not even going to mention how clunky it currently is, even if that’s fixed, Impaling Lotus is a hinderance).
If you look at it from a real life scenario, if you’re entering stealth, you wouldn’t use an ability that would give you away until you were ready.
Hey all,
Let’s start using this thread as the place for feedback, so it’s more centralized. That being said, thanks for all of the constructive feedback! It’s been fun watching a lot of thieves bounding around today. As this is beta, there’s always some kinks to work out. Some notes on the dodging mechanic:
We made a few changes to the system in order to alter your dodge ability. While it’s behaviorally accurate, it doesn’t seem to feel as great when dealing with latency. We’re looking into this and hope to be able to resolve it so that these dodges feel as good as your normal dodge.
We’ll be keeping watch (and playing) over the weekend.
PSA: There’s an issue we’re tracking that if you attempt to use your Daredevil dodge abilities while Dazed, you won’t dodge and you’ll lose the endurance anyway. We aren’t able to fix this for the weekend, but a fix is in the works.
-Karl
I have more things then you, (permanent merchant, airship pass, royal terrace pass, home portal stone etc) then you, and Even to me it doesnt bother. Keep the top bank tab clear. Send all your items there, reveive on other char, set, takes like 3 min.
Why is there always one person who doesn’t want a quality of life improvement?
I haven’t got any of those items yet it makes perfect sense.
Even further items like that should be accessible on an account wide menu so no swapping at all is needed. Just let people get the full benefit without the hassle.
Please note: Our studio — and that means our entire development team — is located in the United States, in the Pacific Time Zone. We work very hard to synchronize as many things as possible, but beta weekend events are best organized around the times that our development team will be able to devote as many hours as possible to testing, in-game observations, forum tracking, feedback reviews, and even possible on-the-fly changes. (The latter is not likely, but it has been known to happen.)
In no way do we want anyone to feel distanced by the hours chosen, and we do apologize if the hours are somewhat inconvenient for someone (although with a test that runs for a couple of days, surely not all hours will prove to be inaccessible
). For practical purposes, the hours selected are the best possible for the team developing this game for you, and we ask for your understanding of that fact.
This is not a preview, early start, or sneak peek. It’s a test. <— said in my Admiral Akbar voice, and if you get the reference, kudos to you! 
(edited by Gaile Gray.6029)
I do not understand these threads. “My family and I have played thousands of hours, but we feel ‘cheated’ because the person who is joining now plays the core game for free or pays just the one fee for Heart of Thorns.”
Let’s consider another type of purchase, that of DVDs. FotR was $30 when it came out on DVD. You now can get all three chapters of LotR for less than $20. But the person who buys now lost years of viewing pleasure because he didn’t own the video at release. LotR is shown for free on television, but that doesn’t negate the value of purchasing the DVDs, for those of us who chose to make those purchases. Imagine showing up at a DVD retailer and saying, “This movie is now free. I want money off another title.”
The hours in Guild Wars 2 that your family has enjoyed—very likely the thousands of accumulated hours—are not without value. They are not, to us, without cost. The 40 major updates we have made to the game that you have been enjoying for three years each add significant value to your purchases: Wintersday festivals that a new player will never be able to attend, major in-game events they’ll never see, drops that were only available to you, as a veteran player, during a limited period.
The position in the first post has been put forth by different people and successfully dispelled time and time again. OP — Please know that we greatly appreciate your support. I encourage you to make whatever purchase decision is best for you and your family. But please never forget that all you have gotten for each of your purchases does have value, in the overall view of things.
(edited by Gaile Gray.6029)
They have the player character voice actors back for HoT!
NOW is the time for Monty Python and the Holy Grail style coconut shells in the gem store!
Sylvari male: "Steady old friend… " Clip clop… clip clop….“Easy now…”
*someone casts speed buff nearby
Sylvari Male: “At a Gallop!” *Faster-Clip clop- clip clop- clip clop!"
We would literally throw money at you Anet.
While I do understand why A.net is actively trying to capture new players, giving existing players a character slot as a “loyalty bonus” seems near insulting. Even if they just gave us $10 worth of gems it’d be far far better. Just my two copper of course.
Well, keep in mind that it took a full scale player riot picked up be the media to make ANet give away 1 character slot with the expansion.
Now, sending gems to everyone updating to HoT might affect gems-to-gold market too much, but …
what would be nice is if ANet give all the current players a special currency we could exchange for some of the things new players receive with a brand new gw2 package. I’m not asking for the full value of 5 char slots, bank slot and material slot, but at least something equivalent to 40-80% of that.
For example, when an existing account upgrades to HoT, the player receives Loyalty Tokens (LT) that can be spent to get
- 2-4 new character slots, or
- 3-6 bag slot expansions, or
- 3-5 bank expansions, or
- 2-4 material storage expanders, or
- an exclusive mini of Colin Johanson or Gaile Gray, or
- a combination of the above, then spend the remaining LT to buy
- transmutation charges, or
- spirit charges, or
- some other useful stuff to make sure LTs aren’t wasted
This way the players would be in control of what they get, and I’m sure, 95% of the players will be totally extatic about the deal, praise ANet on their generosity, and HoT pre-purchase will go way up right away.
The idea is that if ANet wants to be fair to what they sell with HoT to new players as well as old ones, they’d have to make it
- totally fair: give veteran players an equivalent of $40 in virtual goods
- understandable to get more profit: give a $30 equivalent
- totally greedy: give a $20 equivalent
- insulting: $10 equivalent
- cause a riot: give nothing, a $0 equivalent
What really happened is ANet started with giving $0 extra value for upgrade, got a riot on their hands, then made a community address and promised to give everyone who pre-purchased HoT a char slot. Apparently, the most vocal players on the forums were Ok with that deal. Some players are still unhappy, but at least there is not that many active rebels here
No. That there is entitlement. It’s disappointing that it’s now expected that companies have to provide free bonuses with any of their products otherwise they’re labeled as greedy or out of touch.
1/10 valid complaints, 9/10 nitpicking.
I realy enjoyed this event!
Yes there were some nasty PvD parts in it, but even those I liked, due to there was a lot of time to find out good portal spots, so it never get boring at all.
I havent been at WvW some time, because you always saw kitten op pro guilds running on their own and sitting anywhere on map useless, only move to fight some other guild and say they do “GvG”, which I think should neither be done on regular WvW maps nor on primetime, when maps got queues.
So this event brought back some of the old WvW feeling, where you try to defend/attack a castle for serval hours trying to finally get in. (Ok, just the feeling, due to sadly only few ppl tried to defend and got the skill to do so, but when, it was awsome!)
I hope one day WvW get back to be played around teamplay and objectives, not killing and flaming others.
Please more of those events!!! (maybe a tournament,2 weeks event, repeat?!?)
“All Is Vain Golem Train!”
But, seriously, I enjoyed the golem fun and extra fast rank progression from the ktrain. It was a nice break from the ‘seriousness’ of WvW.
Can’t wait to get back to that seriousness though… so yay for reset!!
I had a good time roaming around with my guild, focusing on destroying all of the enemy golems thay we could. We would often bait them to locations in which we had prepared siege. It was great fun.
I dont know why but people feel like a subscription based model is all good no evil. Truth is every model has its pros and cons. Sure with a sub model they can probably put all the skins in the game but they’d need to change things so that people are discouraged from taking breaks. In traditional MMOs thats achieved through gear threadmills and making sure that people fall behind if they stop to effectively discourage stopping. Further more it would add substantially to the game’s cost which for some would be a problem.
What OP say is true, no sub is not being done as a favor but it surely is more favorable to a sub in my opinion. The reason for that is actually mentioned by OP himself.
“ONE of the benefits was unlimited transfigures, does that appeal to you?”, “How many more would be converted by endless make over kits thrown on?”, “Recovering your runes and sigils?”
All these suggestions have on thing in common and that thing is also a major issue with the subscription model, they all make you pay for things you will not fully use. sure for some people unlimited transmutations / makeovers etc would be something they could use but I have no doubt for the majority of people a couple of makeovers a year if even is more then enough. Even less with transmutations some will never need to buy one because what they earn by playing the game more then makes up for the usage. Even if you go above I bet for the majority of people buying the transmutations / make over kits they need would be far cheaper then a sub. So paying a sub would essentially mean overpaying for stuff that people will not ultimately use. (I got unlimited transmutations but only needed 2 ex)
The same thing is ultimately true with Subs. Subs make sense when you’ve got tons of time on your hands. If I pay a sub and get to play 8hrs a day thats a great fair deal. When I was younger I ever ran 3 subs at the same time during summer holidays a few times but I could get my value out of what I was playing. Now that I am older free time isnt easy to come by. There are weeks I barely manage to spend 8hrs playing for the whole week never mind every single day. Thats when sub models start to seem problematic. I still pay $15 a month but I am essentially playing a lot less. Its a lot harder to justify $15 a month when you’re just playing 2 hours here, 1 hour there and a few days when you dont even login at all simply because its starts to feel you’re paying for stuff you’re not using and even though $15 a month isnt a fortune when there are other more necessary expenses, like say upgrading your kids room, you postpone to the subsequent year because you don’t want to stress your finances you have to question if “wasting” money on things you’re mostly not using (8hrs a week vs 60+hrs a week surely feels that way) is the right way to go. Whats even worst though is if you decide to stop you’re essentially throwing away all the money you have ever spend. Like the longest game I subbed to was EvE online, I think I spend close to $1200 on that game yet today I cant enjoy a single cent of that $1200 I spend unless I fork out another $15 and then another $15.
A good cash shop model like that employed on Gw2 is a different story though. It allows me to control my spending without loosing all value of what I have already purchased. I only have to pay for what I am going to use. I am not going to buy 1000 transmutation stones and by the time Gw2 closes down I would have 950 of them left for sure, I can simply buy what I need, when I need and that makes a whole lot of difference.
We won’t be getting offhand sword anytime soon because main hand pistol/dagger (small) + an offhand sword (big) will look weird as hell.
Notice how the Mesmer can use pistols and offhand sword but in exchange cannot use main hand pistol?
As for the Spear, please take note that the weapon is highly evasive so the trait makes sense for it. Also it seems ANet said that no underwater weapon was coming for land usage.
Nobody at ANet said the specialisatios would get different weapons. In fact, it’s highly unlikely already since it seems Revenant gets a Shield which Mesmers get too. Also, Elementalists just got the same utility types as Necromancers, Shouts.
Well, Arenanet haven’t exactly gone out of their way to instil trust in their playerbase.
- They said they would do a patch every two weeks to adjust balance in light of the huge balance patch. Have they? Nope. Have they even mentioned anything about it? Nope.
- They haven’t released any statements regarding the wvw, or even acknowledged it.
A simple statement here or there would quell the playerbase immediately. Have they bothered to? Nope. Their silence only further angers everyone.
This is a good example of how some people have extraordinary expectations, which are bound to lead to disappointment.
I removed this poster’s name, because I don’t want to single them out in particular. They aren’t crazy for having those expectations, even if I think they are unrealistic. They aren’t alone, either. Some players hype themselves into a frenzy about a particular issue that should be fixed or a feature that should have been added ages ago, and sometimes with good reason.
Me? I try to have fun with the game as it exists, bugs and all. Turns out: I can have a lot of fun, even if it would be ever so much better if these other things came to be true as well.
It’s not the community in general, it’s just already disgruntle players with grudges against the company/devs. They are exceptionally bored at the moment so any little thing sets them off on a rant. Just remember those who post on the forums are a tiny portion of the player base and it’s human nature that it’s easier to complain than praise.
Idk I found it pretty fun at least it’s something different
The whole thing (and Anet response) is an insult to people who play WvW every week and have made the game mode what it is.
I’m not really insulted so please speak for yourself.. I play every day, not every week, and even played every day during this boring event. Some how, unlike many, I found ways to make it fun..
This is only a week long event, so it really isn’t the end of the world. Some people really need to lighten up and learn it is only a game.
Participate in the ONE WEEK event or don’t. I shouldn’t be surprised that people are saying such things but I still am.
I’m just gonna repost this here for those who keep stating “It’s only 1 week”:
Do you really think people are mad about just the golem event? It’s not only the event, it’s that the golem event is a tipping point, the last straw for a lot of people. It’s that the WvW pop feels that Anet doesn’t care about them, the game mode, and is just straight up ignoring them. They’re mad that the president of the company thinks that there aren’t people who ONLY play WvW, that WvW players are really just confused PvE players. They’re mad that there are bugs that have been around for years, and no decent updates or changes to the system.
I get what your saying about a tipping point. I want to see changes in WvW but I also know it wont happen this way. This is how you drive a bigger wedge in.
Constructive criticism is necessary.
I know next week all these angry posts will cut in half, and the next week will be gone. Perhaps you will all get your wish and there wont be anymore events at all ever.
People have so much trouble with change. If this had been approached with open minds it could of been a fantastic event. How dare they put effort into making fun short term changes to mix things up in wvw so that the tons of complaints that nothing ever happens in wvw can finally be heard.
It can swap slots 6-10, where everyone else can swap 1-5. HOWEVER….
Everyone else can customize 6-10. Revenant can’t customize 1-5.
Ergo, lower customization.
now for the weapons
generally i would either remove all energy costs from weapons because i don’t like that you have to decide to either use a utility or a weapon skill because of energy management or leave the cost but remove the cooldown of the skills, having both energy cost and cooldown is unnecessary.
Staff
Auto Attack: i like the AA of staff a lot, great animation and visuals. the damage needs to be higher though, a lot.
#2: my least favourite skill on staff by far, i avoid using this as much as i can. low damage for the casting time, waste of energy, hard to use, 2nd skill another long casting time and only 3s weakness.
what i suggest: make this skill a 1x block (like ranger gs 4) and if you block an attack you smack the enemy to cause weakness.
#3: best revenant skill. cooldown reduction to 8s :P?
#4: needs to be castable while moving and with a lower casting time, 3/4s i’d say.
#5: good skill, can be hard to use sometimes. why not add some evade frames? would fit the mist animation.
Hammer
my least favourite weapon, too slow and too clunky, no kiting potential for a ranged weapon.
Auto: needs to have a 3/4s casting time. i know it’s a 100% finisher but still.
#2: needs increased damage. to add kiting potential: adds a pushback (not a knockback) the closer the enemy is to you so that it’s also worth using this skill at close range and to gain some space between them and you. pushback is not a cc but just a displacement, you push them away from you, the closer they are the more they get pushed back. i wonder if that’s possible with the current engine.
#3: i like this skill, could be a bit faster, 1s instead of 1.25 making it evade or invulnerable while using it would certainly help as you eat all the damage when you pass through stuff :/
#4: the skill is fine, as usual, to make the weapon not so clunky, casting time to 3/4
#5: casting time is way too long, you can just walk out of it, the animation is also big enough that a 1s or 1.25s casting are justified, i mean pin down on warrior is less visible and with 3/4s casting time and is 100% dodgeable. i understand that this is an aoe but 1.75s is way too long.
Mace
mace in general is fine but needs some tweaking and QoL improvements.
Auto: needs more direct damage, around 30% increase.
#2: this one is difficult.. either make it wider, it’s too narrow or increase the burning duration so that it’s actually punishing to stand in it. increase the burning to 5s instead of 2s. casting time 1.25s? this needs to be 0.5s and not 1.25s.
#3 very inconsistent skill. to hit a double blast it is required to turn up the camera, possible with all leaps, to shorten the leap but with this skill it happens way too often that the character just leaps in a random direction. also needs 30% damage increase.
Axe
the concept of the axe is very cool. imo this is a hybrid weapon, usable by both condition and dd but the damage numbers need tweaking and the axe is in need of QoL.
#4 idk if i’m doing something wrong but when i throw this skill at a target i never get the final damage hit but only the pass through damage. the pass through damage needs to be higher so that it’s actually worth throwing through as many enemies as possible. what also needs to happen is, make it a “noscope” skill. i wanna use this without having to click on a target, like so many other skills in the game
casting time from 0.5s to 0.25s
#5 nice skill and awesome animation, higher damage please
i’d say around 50% more direct damage.
(edited by Jekkt.6045)
during the 3 days of the revenant i tested the class with different builds in all PvP modes, in 1v1 fights and in actual matches. I am a longterm PvP player from eu with close to 7k PvP matches and i found the idea of the revenant very interesting but sadly the class didn’t turn out as good as i hoped it would. i will review the class in PvP and add my personal comments and suggestions for the devs, and hopefully they will read them
the builds i used had different roles, some more serious and some more trolly:
1. marauder hammer backliner, jalis/mallyx
this one definitely packs the highest single attack damage numbers but is essentially the worst build/weapon for pvp.
this build/weapon is more or less designed to stay at range and freecast on enemy players with auto attacks and skill 2, for a burst you dive in with skill 3 and on impact you switch legend for the explosion above 50% energy.
this works okayish if the enemy team lets you freecast. the damage is mediocre and the weapon is slow and clunky.
as soon as the enemy starts to come at you, be it thief or whatever comes your way, it’s over. you don’t have any survivability nor disengages. hammer 5 is way too slow and the animation way too big to serve as a disengage and even then you have no gap closers or swiftness if you don’t land your hammer 5 into your lightning field first which will definitely take too long for a disengage. kiting is practically nonexistent here, something that is essential on everything that is ranged.
2. Celestial mace/axe frontline jalis/mallyx
on paper this build is very strong. on tests against golems i managed to stack 22-25 might stacks with double blasts and battle sigil.
the damage, although i had that many might stacks, was also just mediocre, the poison (usually 3 stacks) was ticking for 150-200, the torment for 350 (5 stacks) without moving, and the burn (2 stacks) for 650. the auto attack crits on it were around 500-1k depending on the skill and mace #3 was hitting for about 1.5k crits.
now you might think that’s not too bad right? the problem is that actual enemies don’t stand still, interrupt you or just don’t stand in your fire field.
the build can be kited very easily and will deal clost to no damage anymore. even if you taunt them it does not make things better especially because the taunt costs 50% energy which is way too much.
the survivability, thanks to vit/heal/toughness components of the celestial amulet, was a bit better but still subpar. celestial builds usually bring loads of sustain, shoutbow ele and engi are very hard to take down but that’s not the case for revenant.
the only time this build is good is when you have a condition opponent whose condis you can copy and if he doesn’t bring any condi cleanse.
again, a very slow build with no disengages and a weakness to cc which is very bad.
3. cleric staff ventari/jalis support
with monk runes and some ventari traits you can get close to 50% outgoing healing which is nice and allowes you to heal allies for 3k+ at the cost of 25% energy.
the problem here is that you yourself are not tanky at all and if they focus you it’s over in an instant. you can maybe stay alive in a 1v1 but of more than 1 players focus you it won’t end well for you.
the main problem for this is, you are constantly using your energy for allies to support them so most of the time you won’t be sitting at 100%. if the enemy lands a big burst on you you can heal yourself for maybe 4-5k at best and then your energy is depleted leaving you with nothing. you lack a real heal like for example shelter from guardian which is awesome to negate damage and heal yourself. if you get cced you don’t have a stunbreak in ventari so you need to switch to jalis, a stance that won’t support allies really that much. what you do in this stance is more or less heal you with your healing skill, kite a bit if possible and block stuff for 2s.
if you’re not dead by then you try to get back into ventari to repeat the whole process. usually you are dead though because your only defensive skill is a 2s block on 10s cooldown, no cc appart from the tablet explosion which even has a casting time so you can’t even move it to you while it explodes.
4. Sentinel decap revenant ventari/mallyx staff
more of a troll build but it doesn’t work that well because even in sentinel you are rather squishy still without much active defense. the decapping is also just mehish and doesn’t work as well as on engi because a perfect staff #5 is not that easy to land and unyielding anguish is pretty inconsistent in where it teleports the enemy.
5. Marauder Staff jalis/mallyx
this build is the build i had the most success with during the 3 days of testing. now don’t misunderstand me, it’s still very weak but at least it has potential.
i used the marauder amulet with staff and pack runes, energy hydromancy sigil on the weapon.
Retribution 2-3-2
Corruption 1-2-2
Invocation 3-1-1
this build actually lets me deal burst damage with staff 5 and weaponswap. i can more or less oneshot the light armor golem every 20 seconds. after the burst there is almost no damage except from the auto attack that crits for 1k and is dangerous because as mentioned many times, revenant is very squishy.
what i noticed is that the healing skills are very weak when playing this. they don’t heal enough / are on a too long cooldown and it’s very hard to refill your health during a fight.
now that i covered all my builds i would like to go over the legends and the weaponskills
Jalis:
Soothing Stone (heal): generally this heal isn’t bad by design but it does not heal for enough, the cooldown is too long. for consistency: give this heal a flat 4 to 5 seconds of retal no matter how many conditions it removed. the healing needs to be increased to around 6.5k and the cooldown lowered to 20-25s.
Inspiring Reinforcement (stability): good for stomps and cc heavy fights at the cost of a limited area for you and the team. the problem with this skill: it takes like a second until it actually starts pulsing stability (after the animation ended). what i suggest is that stab starts pulsing after you casted it, not when the “road animation” ended.
Forced Engagement (taunt): by far my least favourite skill on jalis. it’s slow, clunky and costs way too much. what i suggest: energy cost down to 25-30, casting time to 1/2, speed of the chain needs to be increased, i mean come on, it’s a 1s cast and then after 1s the chain leashes out finally?
Vengeful Hammers (flying hammers): not a bad skill, it kind of “marks your presence” and is intimidating. the problem is the casting time. make it instant or 1/4s.
Rite of the Great Dwarf (elite): costs too much, too long of a casting time for only 5s. either you decrease the activation to 1.5s max, or increase the duration to 10s. energy cost from 50 to 35, revenant is in need of stunbreaks anyway.
Mallyx
the problem with mallyx is that it’s actually only strong if you face an opponent that applies many conditions. against everything else it’s mediocre at most and you cripple yourself more by using your utilities.
Empoering Mysery (heal): my least favourite heal by far. the skill is too inconsistent and like a worse version of consume conditions. what i suggest: increase the healing of it to around 6.5k, the casting time down to 1s and the cooldown to 25s. instead of healing more for every condition on you, make it apply resistance for 2s for every condition on you.
Banish Enchantment (boonrip): a good skill if you want to rip stability or annoy boon heavy classes. energy cost is fine.
Pain Absortion (condi transfer to yourself): also fine imo, maybe the casting time could get toned down to 3/4 and the energy cost to 30 (from 35).
Unyielding Anguish (displacement): a good idea but – imo – very inconsistent in the way it works… what i would suggest is that the field teleports the target back out in the same direction where the target entered the field.
Embrace the Darkness (elite): too long casting time. needs to be 1/2s so that you can react to condi burst as fast as possible.
Ventari
the tablet needs to auto summon when you attune to ventari and only needs to be resummoned with Project Tranquility when you made it explode before.
another problem with ventari is that it’s just pure heal, except for regen from trait there are no boons at all. the reason why bunker guard is good is because he is a mix between heals and boons (and because he is actually tanky).
Ventari’s Will (tablet move) needs to be instacast without the casting time. it’s too disruptime for your own gameplay.
Natural Harmony (heal) this skill is fine imo
Protective Solance (bubble) the upkeep cost needs to be adjusted from -8/s to -7/s because it is very crippling to support + keeping this up. something that also needs to change is the cooldown after disabling the the skill, it has a 5 seconds cooldown which should be removed to allow upkeep flashing, the upkeep already has a 1s cooldown so i see no reason in having the 5s afterwards.
Purifying Essence (condi remove): energy cost too high, would tone it down from 35 to 25 and make it instacast without the 3/4s casting time.
Energy Expulsion (tablet explosion): remove the casting time but leave the 2s explosion delay. this skill should synergize better with moving the tablet so that you can move an exploding tablet into enemies. i suggest removing casting times on ventari in general so that you can multimanage tablet + staff skills, this will result in a very high skill ceiling.
(edited by Jekkt.6045)
This build is so much fun, especially against squishies. This build has no survivability, but thankfully it doesn’t require that you get in close with anyone, and it still has massive damage output. I’ve turned games around very quickly by nuking people my team is fighting from the outer edge of places like the clocktower in Khylo. Just watch out for other thieves, if any D/X thief sees you before you see them, game over.
The build:
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=VhRRV;1Rw-a0I5R-Fd0;9;4IJM;0148256137;4Lom6W;1G3G3G3G3a0S
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