Guild Wars 2

Why are people trying to defend this? It is clearly broken or something is scaling wrong. I was hit for 10k+ on a bunker guardian earlier by iwarlock. That damage was not possible pre-patch. This is like rangers trying to defend 20k drake attacks when pet were scaling messed up…

The food in question;
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Koi_Cake
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rare_Veggie_Pizza

Dee Jay.2460:

We’ve had multiple threads about exactly this issue a number of times even weeks before the patch.

Yes, I have noticed this as well, in fact I think I may have borrow the +20% bleed idea from someone else. However, if enough of us voice our concerns here we might be able to get a developer post and eventually someone to look into the issue. Also, thanks for all the constructive responses!

So I know it hasn’t been long since the patch and recent balance changes, but it doesn’t take a genius to realize that + duration foods were extremely overpowered before the critical damage changes and are even more so now.

As someone who has played every class I find these foods a must on practically every condition build leaving little room for diversity. Anet has previously stated a philosophy of toning down “apex predator” builds; well +40% condition duration foods are now the apex predator of consumables.

I suggest converting the + duration bonus from a general duration bonus to a condition specific bonus (such as increase bleed duration by 20%). This makes total sense considering sigils that give duration bonuses only offer 10% increases in duration which demonstrates how out of proportion the +40% bonus from food is.

These changes would also somewhat offset the critical damage changes in wvw which would please many people by the looks of the forums.

It would be interesting if turrets followed you around like ranger spirits although I highly doubt this will ever happen.

This trait isn’t bugged and never has been; it restores 15 endurance (50% of your endurance bar) when you land a burst skill and has done so since launch. I don’t think anyone believes this trait should only restore 15% of endurance when sacrificing all your adrenaline and adrenaline related benefits.

At the very least this trait should restore 25% of endurance, although I think it’s fine as it is now honestly.

Barely visible on my Asuran character. To me the halo needs to have size increased, the positioned made higher, and be centered over top of the head.

I love seeing Riot here making excuses about numbers and NPCs, meanwhile they run from any fight that isn’t 5v1. Nice video Joe!

This thread is so over dramatic. Mesmer as a class is fine. PU gives crazy protection up-time, phantasms deal way too much damage for being AI, GS has amazing ranged dps. I’m doing fine on my mesmer in pvp.

For PvP I agree 3 seconds is enough burning (2 seconds was fine actually). However, for PvE (and WvW to some extent) the extra duration is very nice “burst” for condition builds. Burning is vital because things die very fast in these modes and necromancers often wont be able to stack enough bleeds to do decent dps in these situations making the 4 second burn very useful to me.

I saw that in the next balance patch Dhuumfire will be modified so that life blast will apply burning for 3 seconds with 10s CD.

Does this mean the trait will be getting a nerf in duration? (as it is currently 4 seconds in wvw and pve)
If so this seems like a little too much much. I’m fine with application coming from life blast, but nerfing the duration as well seems like too many negatives to warrant dhuumfire still being a grandmaster tier trait. I’d suggest keeping the duration at 4 seconds if the application will be bound to life blast as it will be much more difficult to proc the burn every 10 seconds under the new conditions of the trait.

Will the upcoming changes to berserker gear only effect PvE or will it impact WvW as well?

Please Anet make adjustments to mobs not the berserker items themselves. I have no problem with making PVE content more challenge for berserker players, but nerfing the stat combination itself is not the answer and is unfair to those who have full berseker items. Also, I really hope this won’t effect WvW as conditions are already too strong in PVP and any further nerf to zerk would kill many builds.

PU adds way too many passive rewards to a class which already heavily relies on passive play. It really isn’t hard to kite, stealth, or block while AI fights an opponent for you. Far too many mesmers here defending what is clearly over the top. I personally don’t need this crutch to be successful versus other players and would be happy if it was reverted.

Reward chest was a joke, enough said.

I would disagree mesmer has a high skill cap. I don’t think kiting while AI controlled minions output damage is difficult or takes skill. Unfortunately most mesmers are running such AI dependent builds these days since shatter build are no longer popular. It is definitely one of the best 1v1 classes though due to clones, stealth, and AI damage.

Please revert the changes to immobilize stacking or at least give us the option to choose which condition is cleansed first.

Omnitek.3876:

Is that why everyone plays d/p perma stealth? Because it is harder and less forgiving?

By that logic, warriors are the hardest class to play because I see a million of them! /rolleyes

Your statement makes very little sense. I assume you are suggesting because you have seen (anecdotal evidence) more people playing D/P it is easier to play? Just so you know this in a fallacy and I would suggest you make sure your own statements are sound before you questioning the logic of others. /rolleyes

Anyway, people play d/p because a 10k backstab will always be more rewarding than slowly trolling your opponent to death from range. D/P also annihilates inexperienced players which can be very satisfying. The main advantage P/D has in my view is the ability to pressure from range and remain outside of random AoE/cleave damage. Sneak attack has a range of 900 in comparison to backstab which has a range of 130. Also, condition duration in wvw is out of control; anyone can get +50% duration and 170 condition damage from food + crystal buffs alone. Show me an equivalent food for burst power builds.

P/D is by far the easiest to play and most forgiving thief setup. It’s like playing a PU condition mesmer; pure troll.

You can run s/p, but doing so you will be putting yourself at a fair disadvantage compared to any of the other thief weapon sets. Unfortunately this disparity will only grow after the December 10th changes.

If you want an easy mode build just play p/d; it’s very forgiving and fits in well with the condition spam meta most groups are running.

If you like a challenge and are able to drastically outplay your opponent s/p is just barely doable currently.

ahuba.6430:

mesmer damage doesn’t come from AI lol!

This is so obviously untrue. Even in shatter spec you ideally allow the phantasm to perform 1 attack at least before shattering.

ahuba.6430:

phantasms are a worse, harder to land version of backstab lol!

Yes, because it’s so hard to land a skill that has 1200 range!?!? And this is in comparison backstab which has a range of 130 and doesn’t even prioritize your selected target.

Glad you posted this. Have to agree completely with Jumper when he says “I don’t know what you plan to gain by destroying S/D and completely burying the already dead S/P, but these sets need buffs, not nerfs.”

So the goal of the patch is to force thieves to run D/D or D/P? Makes no sense.

Also, I think it’s hilarious one of the balance team stated that “the change to initiative regain baseline is a huge buff to ALL thief builds”. Haha, do they even play the class? It most definitely won’t be “a huge buff” for S/P (an already sub-par set) due to opportunist, kleptomaniac, and signet changes.

Very good idea, I support this suggestion!

I feel this set is really under performing currently due to the number of negative changes it has seen;
Pistol Whip: Reduced damage by 15%
Quickness: Reduced from 100% attack speed to 50%.
Sigil of Paralyzation: Fixed a “bug” that caused stuns to round up to the next second.
and now…
Shadow Return on Sword. Renamed to Infiltrator’s return. Added a 1/4s cast time.
Critical Strikes 15 – Opportunist. Increased trigger chance to 50%. Increase cooldown from 1s to 5s.

Can we get something more than reducing the after cast by .25 seconds? Seriously that won’t help at all. I like playing S/P, but I can hardly see a point now with all the changes. It would be nice if the stun was increased at the very least or bring the initiative cost down to 4. Anyway something need to be done to this set it’s such a shame it’s going to become a casualty of the S/D nerfs.

Mesmers rely heavily on AI driven damage. It really isn’t that hard to let your clones apply bleeds and phantasm damage while you kite and use stealth/deception/invulnerability. On top of this the class has so many stun breaks it’s silly (not counting phase retreat which has a ridiculously low CD). I can’t believe people think mesmer is a difficult class, it’s comparable to spirit ranger or minion master in terms of skill in my opinion.

theory.3580:

Mesmer is one of the hardest classes

You’re joking right?

Well I doubt results of some simulation in which the methodology is extremely fuzzy especially since there have been numerous others who have posted more clear work with contradictory results. Overall, S/P and P/P will be hurt by this change a lot and they are some of the weaker sets as it is now anyway.

If we get enough response they will hopefully look at the thread and maybe reconsider their decision. I encourage as many to post here as possible. We must be heard!

Jon (or any Anet staff),

Please reconsider the proposed changes to opportunist. This trait encourages thieves to stay in combat which is apparently what you are trying to accomplish in the December 10th patch. Moreover, destroying this trait with a 5 second ICD hurts so many builds which aren’t d/p or s/d (what seems to be the main focus of your warpath). So please don’t change this trait or at least don’t make the ICD 5 seconds; that’s totally unreasonable.

Mostly good responses so far. I hope someone from Anet sees this thread and can provide an answer for everyone.

The other pressing suggestion I have for the balance team would be to look at the mesmer/guardian vigor on critical traits which allows these classes to maintain near permanent vigor. Modification of these traits only seems fair in light of the removal of other classes access to “permanent vigor” in the upcoming December 10th patch; especially considering these traits only require a 5 point investment.

Was it intentional to make the mesmer skill decoy (and trait desperate decoy) ignore the reveal debuff? This seems unfair to me and I would like to see it changed in the December 10th patch.

Make the reveal debuff apply to mesmers already!

S/D, close thread.

I don’t have any trouble with stun warriors when using d/p or s/d. I agree with OlllllO shadow shot is your best option in these fights to keep up and blind and maintain pressure. Also, poison field from SB and the steal taken from warriors does nice poison application countering the healing signet; just don’t get skull cracked while spinning.

Started playing this build in WvW, easier to play than a stun warrior I must say and more effective. I was able to win duels right away, only necromancers give me some trouble but I could easily outmaneuver them so it isn’t much of an issue. Overall, I still feel this build is too strong (especially with perplexity runes) considering how easy it is to play.

decoy (4s), torch offhand stealth(4s), mass invisibility(6s), veil(3s), desperate decoy(4s)…
21 seconds of stealth potentially.

“Not sure what you mean by “stealth through reveal” as I have never seen that happen to me or anyone else.”

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Decoy
“Applies a distinct Decoy effect that is different from normal stealth. As such, it can be used while revealed and can be active at the same time as regular stealth, but will not stack in duration.”
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Desperate_Decoy
“Grants stealth for 3 seconds regardless of revealed. "

I barely visit these forums and yet from past experience I have learned not to take anything sorrow posts seriously. The guy just posts nonsense and argues with people; just ignore.

Strongly against the vertical progression system to be introduced in the upcoming patch.

Yes sure, everyone can lose; however, if you are playing the best 1v1 class in the game and are losing consistently it’s a L2P issue. Many great tips have been left for the OP but they don’t seem to want to accept they haven’t been doing these things or have been doing them wrong and instead would rather keep griping about the damage they are taking. I’ll rephrase; if you are a skilled mesmer there are very few classes/specs that should be giving you trouble 1v1. Thus, I encourage you (OP) to reread what has been posted.

Mesmer is by far one of the strongest pvp classes, if you are playing mesmer you really shouldn’t be losing 1v1s in WvW or Spvp to any class (except maybe healing sig/banner/condi warriors). Generally for thieves I’ll go invisible right after they get into steal range or (if using d/p) wait until they drop their blackpowder and then pop my invisibility. Your phantasms should easily melt the thief once you avoid the initial burst, retaliation and confusion also melt thieves – use this to your advantage if you get pressured. The block on the scepter is another tool which can directly counter backstab builds and seriously hurt the thief. Mesmers also have access to the second most amount of stealth in the game on top of all the clones which they can produce which makes it very difficult for a thief to pin down a well played mesmer. I have a thief and a mesmer both played extensively in wvw and pvp and mesmer is by far the stronger class in every aspect except for mobility.

Threads like this just give people more of a chance to whine and be angry on the forums about thieves. By posting all this stuff you just going to encourage more heavy-handed responses by Anet. Just ignore comments and threads that are so obviously uninformed.

Atherakhia.4086:

None of this is true but the first line where you said the class is dependent on stealth. And I play a thief…

Oh so I’m lying? What isn’t true? If it was up to you Anet would just dumb their game down endlessly. This is why the meta is in such a bad spot as it is; uninformed QQ. I’d gladly duel you on any class I listed and we’ll see if you still think your d/p thief is OP. PM me.

If you remove stealth from the thief the class will just devolve into a less viable version of the warrior or guardian. Stealth is easy to counter I really don’t understand why people are still complaining about it. The best strategy is to deny the thief stealth. People have already learned how to do this with CnD (long, telegraphed animation) and it can be done against d/p as well by standing inside the blind AoE (limiting the amount of stealth and costing the thief a lot of initiative). If the thief does manage to attain stealth your auto-attack or any AoEs work wonders to prevent the incoming backstab. I suggest playing a thief to understand the mechanics/mindset, after I did that I rarely die to a thief when playing mesmer/guardian/warrior/engie (can’t speak for other classes as I don’t play them). In fact it becomes one of the most predictable and easy to counter classes in the game.

I actually tried your P/D build (and others) and quiet liked it Travlane. I played around with it for a while and was pleasantly surprised; however I still feel like D/P is better for me. Really hate the lack of AOE and uselessness in zergs with P/D. I think if we got a burning shot (which was mentioned on a state of the game stream a while back) the set would be as viable as D/P. Also, make it so Ricochet is 100% to bounce rather than 50% and we would be more useful in zergs.

Pistol/Pistol and Pistol/Dagger are both underwhelming sets. P/D is weak at best and is more of a spec to run if you never want to die. If body shot was made into a burning shot instead P/D might be viable.

Sorrow go post somewhere else, every time I see you commenting it is disagreeing with someone, and its never anything positive or constructive. Find something better to do than argue with people on GW2 forums.

Please fix this issue.

Good luck fighting in zerg battles with a thief, the skill lag will decimate you if you try to run in behind enemy lines. Yes other classes have to deal with this, but it hurts thieves worst since they rely on evasion and quick escapes through skill usage to avoid focus/damage. Also, the only attack that reliably works (in a timely manner) during zerg fights is the auto-attack, and auto-attacking as a thief is pretty useless in a zerg. This may be different on lower tier servers.

I play guardian and engie mostly in pvp, not thief. Despite this, I think thief has been adjusted to the point where there is pretty good balance to the class as there are counters to the spike DPS play style; toughness being part of it. I don’t feel the same way about the current condition/fear meta and I play two classes which have very good cleansing capabilities. The only effective way to counter two necromancers on a team right now seems to be to run two better necromancer players on your own team.