Did we all forget that we can be part of multiple guilds at a time? Rep one guild for loot per week then switch back to farm for your small guild until you unlock the content.
This isn’t rocket science, use the tools the game provides.
The game also provides tools for determining who in a guild is not representing. Oh, and there’s this other tool for kicking players from guilds. When used in conjunction, it means leechers beware.
What do you think the odds are that large guilds are going to be paying particular attention to their guild rosters over the next few weeks and implementing a policy of no moonlighting in other guilds? Pretty high, I’d say.
Best o’ luck.
you are missing the point… even if u manage to gather all the influence how on earth will you finish the missions scaled for groups of 10+?
If I didn’t misread, I read somewhere that random people can join you in your guild events. As far as I know, almost everyone in this game will jump into an event infront of them :P.
Groups are still of 5 people, no where enough for you to organize a guild. It’s not like you can organize a raid of 25 guild members. Everyone would just be split into groups of 5 due to the current system. So when you’re doing your guild events, I’m sure people are just going to walk into it and help you…
What I read was that anyone can jump into a guild activated mission as if it were just another dynamic event. Their reward would be that same as for completing a DE, a few silver, some XP and some karma. They would NOT receive any of the currency that could be used with the new guild vendors, nor any other benefit that the sponsoring guild would qualify for.
Exactly, so ppl will probably not help u at all if they aren’t getting the same rewards.
I know i wouldn’t, why should i do the same amount of work if not more than the ppl who activated the mission to gain less rewards others?
Just do enough to qualify for the daily events achievement. They are just events like any other. Don’t go out of your way for them.
I find it amazing that people can be given so much amazing free content and complain about it. People are making it seem like 30k influence is impossible to get.
First of all, you can pool together money and buy the influence to buy any of the missions you want.
Second of all, the fact that you cry that you have to choose which ones you get and expect to get them all immediately is pathetic.
Lastly, these missions finally reward large guilds for all the hard work they have put into organization over the past 6 months. New guilds will have to take time to get the influence for missions and that is totally appropriate.
First, buying your way to Tier 5 AoW is still flushing your influence down the toilet for many guilds because PvP is at the bottom of the priority list. All that effort for rewards you won’t use. Yippee.
Second, I don’t know what the hell you’re talking about.
Last(ly), scaling is major component of the PvE content in the game. Scaling should have been applied to guild missions as well so that smaller guilds would have smaller rewards from completing smaller threat missions. And in case that isn’t clear enough, that means bigger guilds would get bigger rewards for accomplishing tougher missions. Sinking in yet? Try this now — the gating should have been scaled as well so that smaller guilds could unlock the lower difficulty missions in relatively the same time frame as larger guilds unlock the higher difficulty ones.
You know, you don’t need a Ph.D. to work out an equitable solution for the entire game community, just a modicum of common sense. Unfortunately, that seems to be in short supply with ArenaNet at present.
The influence requirements are ridiculous. Stop trying to turn what should be a fun time for the guild into a grind and poorly placed time sync.
I thought it’d be okay if I can participate with other people’s Guild Missions, it might have been fun with a little bit of reward (I wasn’t expecting the full reward as if I was in a Guild, but I expected a little something for my efforts). BUT NOW THEY SAY THERE ARE NO REWARDS FOR BYSTANDERS!? Even after saying they were!?!??!?!!!!
What
The
Kitten.
If you participated in the event to take the bounty down, you will immediately receive your personal reward for guild bounties for that week and your guild will receive completion credit for that target.
This makes it sound like any player participating will get 50 silver, the rare drops and a personal guild commendation, but only the guild that kicked the event off will receive a guild merit, correct?
No, you have have to be in the guild with a mission active. Sorry for the confusion, I wrote the whole thing from the perspective of someone who is trying to run a mission.
You’ll be rewarded — silver, XP and karma.
Don’t spend it all in one place.
10 people is a very good size for a Tier 1 bounty mission.
<facepalm> so no thought about the small 2-5 man guild? It seems that the better game content is now exclusively for huge Zerg Guilds. My guild currently has 3 active members and we will not have a chance to play this premium part of the game until after the servers are turned off. And no, we are not buying gems to pay for influence to get the good stuff. <facepalm, laugh, shakes head>
That’s not a guild. That’s a party. You’ve got plenty of content designed for you.
Oh? Ever hear of Destiny’s Edge, the most storied adventuring GUILD in Tyria? — 5 members.
That was ANet’s creation by the way. They introduced the concept of viable 5-man guilds, not players.
technically 8 if you counted snaff, that wolf and mr. sparkles.
I’m almost certain that regardless of who has valid points to bring to the table or not, when an update causes your community to rip and tear at each other’s throats like this……..it’s a bad update.
So that would put most updates in the history of gaming in the bad category right?
When I start getting the influence bonus for soloing with my pet, I’ll agree to Garm and Sparkles. Until then, I’ll give you six.
RIP my small guild of friends who won’t ever see the content.
Any 400+ member guilds recruiting so we can hang around and not communicate even a little bit? And actually be able to access the content that should be available to everyone?
Lots of recruiting going on. The Guild forum is starting to fill up with merger offers and requests.
you are missing the point… even if u manage to gather all the influence how on earth will you finish the missions scaled for groups of 10+?
If I didn’t misread, I read somewhere that random people can join you in your guild events. As far as I know, almost everyone in this game will jump into an event infront of them :P.
Groups are still of 5 people, no where enough for you to organize a guild. It’s not like you can organize a raid of 25 guild members. Everyone would just be split into groups of 5 due to the current system. So when you’re doing your guild events, I’m sure people are just going to walk into it and help you…
What I read was that anyone can jump into a guild activated mission as if it were just another dynamic event. Their reward would be that same as for completing a DE, a few silver, some XP and some karma. They would NOT receive any of the currency that could be used with the new guild vendors, nor any other benefit that the sponsoring guild would qualify for.
here’s my question to you AND Arenanet…. They advertised this game as being different from what you’re used to in other mmo’s right?
They said they’ll make the game fun for even casual players so you would be free to “play how you want” right?
They are making this new content unattainable for small guilds unless they cave and disband in favour of larger guilds that have obviously been playing WvWvW so they would have not only art of war but all other guild upgrades maxed out.
If they can scale dynamic events based on how many are participating, why not the guild missions?
Mind you, I’m not saying make the difficulty uniform through all levels but at least play smart and make the goals attainable by small guilds also. Do they think a majority of their servers are made up of 500 man guilds?? The minorities will inevitably become larger than the perceived majority, only large guilds will be able to play the content so only they will remain, and when they have completed all, they will stop playing until the next expansion.
My point is, they need to fix this colossal mistake before it spirals out of controlJust to add my 2 cents… Hope it’s worth something lol.
You don’t need a guild of 500 man to even get AOW5 or the influence needed for it. Lol, my guild of 8 man (usually 5 active max since we do activities in groups of 5), have no issues with this whatsoever… We even have 8000+ influence just sitting there right now and I have no idea how we got it since we’ve been busy with real life lately. Maybe all those random dailies and weekend gaming counted for something…
The point is, if you got an active, closely-knit guild of 5 man, you should have no issue with this at all. Sure, it’ll take a month but what’s the rush? The point is to enjoy the game and right now we’re not feeling gated.
If guild bounties were too easy to get, then won’t you have a rinse and repeat cycle of “Play content quickly, finish, stop”? (Not that the guild bounties are hard to get in the first place…)
And most guilds, if they had a choice, would be sinking that influence into Art of War last (if at all), because the other tracks are far more useful to them. If it weren’t for guild missions, I bet that track would continue to be the least invested in by a huge margin. Now ask yourself why that is, then realize what a colossal waste of energy it is to unlock Tier 5 of the track for many.
It’s a small minority for whom PvP is an overriding priority. They are the ones who are getting rewarded for unlocking that track. Everyone else who would find the influence better spent elsewhere, is getting shafted because all their other plans have to go on hold, so they can diligently work at flushing the next 50000 influence they get, down the toilet.
Stupid design is stupid design and this is STUPID design.
10 people is a very good size for a Tier 1 bounty mission.
<facepalm> so no thought about the small 2-5 man guild? It seems that the better game content is now exclusively for huge Zerg Guilds. My guild currently has 3 active members and we will not have a chance to play this premium part of the game until after the servers are turned off. And no, we are not buying gems to pay for influence to get the good stuff. <facepalm, laugh, shakes head>
That’s not a guild. That’s a party. You’ve got plenty of content designed for you.
Oh? Ever hear of Destiny’s Edge, the most storied adventuring GUILD in Tyria? — 5 members.
That was ANet’s creation by the way. They introduced the concept of viable 5-man guilds, not players.
Does SoB work at all? I haven’t been able to get to work with either my dual dagger Thief or my dual pistol Engineer. I also read on the wiki that it won’t work on two handed weapons at all. Haven’t bothered to test it since I’ve wasted enough money on these gimpy things already.
Just used a kit two days ago. I wish I’d known these changes were coming so I could have put it off until today.
I’m surprisingly pleased by the profession balancing. Was expecting more of the same Warrior >>>>>> everyone else.
Being able to view an item on the TP before purchasing it is extremely welcome.
No interest in PvP so no comment there.
Waiting to see about the new Flame and Frost stuff.
Not going anywhere near guild missions.
yes, but why SHOULD being in a mega guild be better?
Because its MORE people putting in collectively MORE effort which should be rewarded with MORE rewards.
Why should your 15 people’s worth of effort get the same rewards as a guild with 45 people’s worth of effort. Are you 15 people some how MORE SPECIAL so that there effort should be worth more?
You want the same rewards for less effort. That doesn’t even make sense.
Who the kitten is saying they want the same rewards for less effort? Holy crap the density of this thread is like lead.
They want COMMENSURATE rewards for their efforts. And for that to happen, they need COMMENSURATE access to the content! It’s so simple a child could grasp it — just none of the children here, evidently.
Screw it. I’m done sparring with the willfully obtuse, especially when anet is clearly in your corner. Do carry on with your purple Kool Aid tea party.
LFGuild that will be running Guild Events. Don’t care for your name, rep, members, association, play style, ts3, mumble, age, if you are friends irl, where you are from, etc etc. I simply want the reward. I will attend the event, rep, and leave. You wont see me till I want to farm the next event for rewards.
Good guilds will use the guild missions for community purposes. Good guilds that used to organize guild events that are not only for material rewards, you know guilds that are in this game for fun, will just have another “tool” to further that goal, to build a strong community. Sure people that will only join to get rewards will be there, but good guilds have ways of dealing with those.
It’s called forced representation. Expect to see a lot more of it in the following weeks.
And they added Precursors to the drop table for Guild Missions . . .
an even bigger carrot to entice people to join larger guilds.
Or, alternatively, a carrot to entice people to work on their smaller guilds rather than take the easy way out.
Also, Precursors are supposedly available out of any loot draw which can drop Exotics.
Not likely. Players ALWAYS tend to take the path of least resistance. That’s human nature and it’s going to manifest itself with a vengeance in the case of guild missions. This is because we aren’t comparing the easy path to the hard one, we’re comparing the easy path to the AREYOUkittenINGSERIOUS! path.
Yeah my guild just blew a lot of gold and 30k influence to get to art of war 5, and we still need to wait a week to train it up.
Not happy.
Just curious, but why weren’t you training it up prior to the announcement of guild missions? Or if you were, how much of a priority was it for you?
Blacklight, most of us are totally wanting the guild missions. Especially us PvE guilds. The issue is they put it in Art of War at Tier 5 which was exclusively WvW track until 4 or 5 days ago. Those of us that don’t like WvW were not leveling it up. Why would we if we don’t do WvW? So now we are having to scramble to unlock a track we had zero interest in til now. I hope that clears it up for you. Do you see the disconnect for some of the players here? Why should PvE guilds have to unlock Art of War stuff to do PvE stuff? The reasons that Izzy gave weren’t really thought out well either. ArenaNet is basically telling the PvE only guilds that they are giving guilds that do everything a headstart to PvE access simply by way of them liking content that PvE guilds don’t like. It makes no sense. If it was really the way that Mr. Cartwright was explaining and they wanted it to be challenging for EVERYONE to get, they would have made a whole new tier for Guild Missions.
Look at my post history in this thread. I’m vehemently opposed to this guild mission system as it’s been described, for precisely the reasons you stated. I was curious if cesmode was in a similar situation.
(edited by Blacklight.2871)
His GW2 content is why I’ve been subscribed to his channel for the last few months. Been enjoying his other vids too, even when I have no interest in the games he talking about. Entertaining guy and generally on the money with his criticisms and compliments.
Yeah my guild just blew a lot of gold and 30k influence to get to art of war 5, and we still need to wait a week to train it up.
Not happy.
Just curious, but why weren’t you training it up prior to the announcement of guild missions? Or if you were, how much of a priority was it for you?
Taunt is a mechanic used by weaker systems to make mobs dumber than they already are. AI behaviour in this game uses several different variables to govern their decision making. Taunt arbitrarily overrides those decisions by forcing it to chase after someone for absolutely no reason.
Want to get a mob off a downed player? There are several methods available in the game to do just that, many of them mentioned in this thread, and none of them are cheats. Taunt is a cheat. It’s smart for a mob to wail on a downed player because taking them from downed to defeated makes them that much harder to revive and pretty much removes them from the fight. If you want them to stop doing the smart thing, then work for it. The tools are there.
Keep in mind your Toughness isn’t going to help you against condition damage. If you’re dying by fire and can’t get enough condition removal to take care of it, consider investing in Vitality. Basically, the only armor you have against conditions is health. More of it will give you a better buffer and may give you the time you need to dispatch your mobs.
10 Characters with 4 × 80s and a Thief on the capping threshold.
Favorite to level: Ranger
Least favorite to level: Mesmer
Favorite at 80: Mesmer
Least favorite at 80: Ranger
Starting a new Warrior now to go with my existing sylvari one because I didn’t have an asura character. Figured I’d go with the ultimate faceroll profession to make the trip to 80 as easy and painless as possible. When I finally get around to making a charr, she’ll be a faceroller too (unless something miraculous happens and profession balance ever gets implemented).
She’s a queen during wartime. The people like to think their royalty is slumming it with the rest of them.
You’re a lowly peasant, centaurs just burned your farm to ash, and now you’re speaking to the queen about it. Which would you rather see, a queen with perfectly manicured hands, golden slippers, and an extravagant gown? Or a queen with callused hands, dirty feet, no shoes at all? Which one appeals to the hardworking man more?
Given this is probably what he sees everyday, whenever he looks at his wife (don’t forget the bad teeth), I’d say he’d go for the silk over the burlap. Of course, every girl in Kryta seems to be a supermodel so it’s hard to say.
I love it how the main point of my argument has been forgotten because of something i said at the end. Ok admittedley joining a bigger guild isnt the best alternative for someone who is part of a very small guild. BUT IT IS A OPTION. And considering anyone can join in with the content as soon as it kicks off, there are other options for experiencing the content.
MY MAIN POINT THOUGH, is that small guilds cannot have everything their own way, just like large guilds cannot either. You make sacrifices because of play style and as Anet have stated again and again, there is a whole games worth of 5 man content out there, but nothing at all (apart from rubbish open world bosses) for larger groups to play.
The funny thing is i hear you all spouting about large guilds like they are null from problems. There are disadvantages and advantages to each type of guild (im actually a member of a few guilds, including a larger wvw one and small casual friends one).Think about it like it was WOW. You know for a fact that to do any form of raid your 5 man guild will either have to
- recruit more
- play with another guild or group
- miss out on the contentAgain ill say; YOU CANNOT HAVE EVERYTHING.
And it’s hard to ignore the fact that raids were specifically left out of this game because of their exclusionary mechanics. The tough content is restricted to small groups, which are easily maintained — OK, try to keep up here — by SMALL GUILDS. See the magic?
Pretty bad example to use to support your point.
Not sure how many ways this needs to be said (smoke signals and hieroglypics are next) — small guilds don’t want EVERYTHING, they just don’t want to be shut out of EVERYTHING.
That’s the way the system appears to be designed now. And not only that, this system actively compromises their ability to grow by making membership unattractive to many a possible recruit. This system throws everything into the laps of the larger guilds and not only excludes many small guilds from even STARTING the new content for weeks or months, but inhibits their prospects of further growth. And it’s not just a matter of getting new people on board, but even keeping the ones you have.
This isn’t difficult to grasp. Consolidating the community into a handful of mega-guilds is NOT a good idea. Not sure why so many can’t wrap their grey matter around it.
Are the guild rewards from guild missions so utterly mind-boggling that everyone in small guilds will be required to join larger guilds?
Does not getting the ‘guild rewards’ from the ‘guild missions’ cut you off from the rest of the game?
I’m not sure exactly what people are complaining about. You can join in other guilds’ missions in the open world for personal rewards.Maybe in a year your 3 person guild won’t be able to make a guild castle?
Good, I think.Anyways, carry on.
If guild content is put in the game, why in the world would guilds ever want to experience it? I mean, how kitten logic defying is it, that guilds might want to come together as a group (small or large) to take on content designed for guilds to take on.
Where is it written that the only reason to ever do anything in this game is when there’s a hope of significant payoff? You realize that some guilds (and yeah, they actually do this!), make up their own events for their members, just for the laughs? No tokens will be earned, no laurels received, no gold lining pockets, nothing like that. And sometimes, gold will leave pockets because they do incomprehensible stuff like buying boxes’o’fun and leaving them out for anyone to play with. I swear to GAWD I’ve seen it happen!!
I’m sorry you’re so myopic that you can’t see why small guilds might want to experience content designed specifically for guilds, without a major payoff to be had. You must live in a very listless world, under a very grey sky. /sympathy
one neat thing they could do in my opinion, is create a special “pvp world” that you could guest on, but not transfer or start on
these worlds would have open pvp similar to the one found in wvw, however, you’d be able to attack everyone on the world, not just people from other servers
The mechanics of the world would have to be rewritten to change it from a cooperative game to a hostile game. Now when you realize that ANet wouldn’t even agree to an “official” RP server because they weren’t prepared to spend the resources to support it, exactly what are the odds they are going to actually redesign their game to allow for one, single official PvP server?
If the answer isn’t self-evident, I’ll give you a hint: ZZZZZZEROOOOOOO!!!!
Cooperative PvE. That’s this game. Other games do it differently and all power to them. No one is stopping anyone else from playing those games.
How would it make sense? There are no playable races or factions that want to kill each other at the moment. Nightmare Court, Sons of Svanir, Inquest, etc. have no interest in saving Tyria, not to mention you fight all these people in your personal story. So when you wonder if Anet is considering something like this I don’t know what heck you’re talking about.
I believe the Nightmare Court wants to save Tyria from the dragons. They just don’t want to do it under Ventari’s laws. Which still doesn’t change the fact that all the systems in the world right now support a cooperative game experience. Making the world PvP means rewriting and rebalancing all of those inter-related systems. That means it ain’t gonna happen.
Too bad most legendaries look pretty crappy. The mystic forge uniques look better. The only legendary I really care about is the dreamer on my ranger for lols. The legendary rifle and bolt are pretty cool. Twilight is ok. The rest is just meh. The mace I can’t take seriously, especially since each hit makes fireworks sounds.
Out of the mystic forge uniques, there’s a crapton that look better:
All the mists themed weapons (vision of the mists, spirit links, abyssal scepter, etc etc)
Jormag’s breath
Foefire’s essence
The Anomaly
Volcanus
The Dreamer was the one weapon I would have chased after if I were going to go after a legendary. But since they turned it into some sort of a lame reject from Pixie Hollow, there’s not really anything I’m that interested in. Certainly not enough to ever bother wasting my time in WvW to attain.
I love it how the main point of my argument has been forgotten because of something i said at the end. Ok admittedley joining a bigger guild isnt the best alternative for someone who is part of a very small guild. BUT IT IS A OPTION. And considering anyone can join in with the content as soon as it kicks off, there are other options for experiencing the content.
MY MAIN POINT THOUGH, is that small guilds cannot have everything their own way, just like large guilds cannot either. You make sacrifices because of play style and as Anet have stated again and again, there is a whole games worth of 5 man content out there, but nothing at all (apart from rubbish open world bosses) for larger groups to play.
The funny thing is i hear you all spouting about large guilds like they are null from problems. There are disadvantages and advantages to each type of guild (im actually a member of a few guilds, including a larger wvw one and small casual friends one).Think about it like it was WOW. You know for a fact that to do any form of raid your 5 man guild will either have to
- recruit more
- play with another guild or group
- miss out on the contentAgain ill say; YOU CANNOT HAVE EVERYTHING.
And it’s hard to ignore the fact that raids were specifically left out of this game because of their exclusionary mechanics. The tough content is restricted to small groups, which are easily maintained — OK, try to keep up here — by SMALL GUILDS. See the magic?
Pretty bad example to use to support your point.
Not sure how many ways this needs to be said (smoke signals and hieroglypics are next) — small guilds don’t want EVERYTHING, they just don’t want to be shut out of EVERYTHING.
That’s the way the system appears to be designed now. And not only that, this system actively compromises their ability to grow by making membership unattractive to many a possible recruit. This system throws everything into the laps of the larger guilds and not only excludes many small guilds from even STARTING the new content for weeks or months, but inhibits their prospects of further growth. And it’s not just a matter of getting new people on board, but even keeping the ones you have.
This isn’t difficult to grasp. Consolidating the community into a handful of mega-guilds is NOT a good idea. Not sure why so many can’t wrap their grey matter around it.
I was just wondering about this on Saturday night while 100%ing Black Citidel. I wasn’t in BWE so I didn’t know there was actually stuff going on in them at one point, but I was thinking it’s kind of silly to have to instance in to a part of the city that’s really no different than the rest.
The only thing different in the BWEs really was that you collected seeds to make dyes, and gave them to an NPC in your home instance to grow them. And you had to come back the next day to collect the dye.
Needless to say, that didn’t survive long in the beta. I don’t think it even made it to BWE2.
I thought it was account based too. Then I saw a level 48 asura with the gold star, hanging out in LA. Now I’m not so sure. I just can’t see how this would be done on any character lower than the mid to high 70s.
The home instance was one of those cornerstones of game design that people took an immediate interest in. It’s description made it sound quite inventive. Somewhere along the way though, the idea died and it became a bit of a joke. Almost none of the plans we’d heard about ended up being implemented and it become nothing more than a place you had to go to a couple of times as part of your personal story. It really didn’t change according to your actions at all, and nothing about it reflected the uniqueness of each character.
Sadly, people with a Hall of Monuments tend to find it a more personalized experience than their home instance, and the HoM was dedicated to a player in a different game, who has been dead for more than two centuries. This makes the home instance a rather significant failure.
Maybe they’ll do something with it in a couple of years.
On of the major problems with this whole situation (imho) is accidental bleed/burn/poison stacks by power builds.
On my ranger, mesmer (need those clones on dodge so stuff bleeds), and thief it doesn’t matter how I gear myself I’m putting out bleeds here and there. They might be crappy 40 damage bleeds but they are going up. Unfortunately this means that whether I like it or not I’m hurting real condition build’s dps potential.
Since so many power/crit builds can throw up conditions at ~50% effectiveness compared to a full condition build without actually trying while still putting out full power/crit damage levels it means that condition builds bring even less to the party.
There’s pretty much a guaranteed net dps loss by having a condition build double the damage of your groups allotted conditions but bringing less than 50% of the dps of a power/crit build.
As far as I understand it, you aren’t hurting anyone else because it’s your stacks that are going to get dropped, not their’s. If they are running a dedicated condition build, their damage per stack will be higher, which will override yours. Your condition damage will only register if no one better is also stacking their’s.
It’s still useful if you’re on your own or with a small group because your stacks will still be registered. In big group events though, it’s guaranteed that the little extra DPS you’re bringing to the table is never even going to land on an enemy, because condition dedicated characters will be monopolizing those 25 stack slots. The really sad thing though is that those dedicated characters will also be nullifying each other’s damage by competing for the same 25 stacks. Meanwhile, pure power-crit builds can wail away unhindered by stupid, arbitrary mechanics.
Just imaging the outcry if suddenly, there was a limit on the number of melee blows a mob can register per second and Warriors had to start competing with each other for the chance that their attacks are actually registered or whether they are simply ignored. When Warriors start seeing silver medals for participation, the rage might well throw the world off its axis
But hey, there might be a silver lining to that: no more dungeon groups consisting of four Warriors and a Mes.
I love how the forum replaces swear words with kitten… lmao, brilliant.
It’s bad. Half the time I don’t even bother with the word I want to use and just type “kitten” on autopilot. The other half of the time, I’m actually thinking “kitten”.
Kitten sad.
But wait! gw2 has another option, you guys can join multiple guilds so if really want to be part of a high tier guild mission then you could all join a larger guild and play the missions together anyway. Ok so it wont buff your own guild reputation (which is something that i cant really see small and casual guilds caring about) but at least you got to have fun and do some content that wasn’t designed (unlike anything else in the current game) for 5 man guilds.
Overall, id say this entire argument is ridiculous.
Spoken like someone who has never belonged to a small guild, where every tier unlock is a cause for celebration and where buying guild bonuses is a strategic decision because you have a finite supply of influence. Unlike large guilds who can unlock several tiers of something within a few hours of letting their throngs loose to do whatever the hell they want, small guilds need to focus and work to achieve these goals. Large guilds can do it without even a second thought and without any concerted effort whatsoever.
Sacrificing your influence to the gaping maw of a large guild’s pool instead of into your own guild’s tiny reservoir is significant and ensures that you’re little guild will stagnate and die. Yeah, nothing to care about there.
Overall, I’d have to say your argument is ridiculous.
Well, from a technical standpoint, Just looking at the names of each tree Art of War is actually a fairly logical place to put something like a bounty hunt, at least it makes far more sense than Architecture, Politics, or Economy.
Again though, gating pure PvE content behind a PvP track that yields ONLY PvP rewards isn’t just questionable, it’s asinine. There are a lot of PvE only guilds out there that simply have no use whatsoever for that track. If anything, it should be gated behind a track that every guild would have a need to invest in, like Architecture. Sure, there’s no other rationale to link guild events to this track, but the same goes for Art of War because there’s nothing in it that you can use to accomplish these activities. The rewards are for a separate mode of gameplay altogether.
As far as I’m concerned, ANet chose Art of War (a track that’s already more fleshed out than all the others) specifically to get guilds to invest in it. Then once they’ve invested, they’ll be more inclined to use the rewards they’ve been forced to work for, by becoming more involved in PvP. Instead of making PvP more attractive, so that players would be more inclined to try it based on it’s own merits, they are trying to coerce players into it by ensuring that they must put in time and resources to unlock a series of PvP rewards, just to access the PvE content beyond.
World completion (that’s an explorer’s goal if ever there was one), the quest for legendaries (legendary skins, at least), and monthlies (no PvP this month, but every month prior). These examples of short and long-term game goals have three things in common: 1) none of them provide PvP-specific benefits, 2) they all require PvP involvement, and 3) they all failed to make PvP more attractive. Add one more to the list with guild missions.
The old philosophy was let people play they way they want. That goal has more than fallen flat now. The actual philosophy seems to be: Play the game you want to play it — so long as that involves PvP. I hope the minority that this sentiment caters to is a significant minority. Is it enough to offset so many others you’re just kitten off now?
Please don’t be intentionally dense, they obviously mean “Use the playstyle you want” when they say “Play the game your way!”. Meaning that every form of damage should be equally viable for any content. Condition damage is clearly absolutely nothing close to that vision seeing as how any 2 condition damage builds attacking the same mob will be stepping on each other’s toes and rendering any more condition damage players absolutely helpless.
If fact burning alone can be maintained PERMANENTLY by any ONE warrior/guardian/elementalist easily rendering any burns after that essentially 0 dps. It really is the worst offender of conditions being bad in group situations.
Your insulting behaviour is just you belittling yourself and does nothing for your argument. The argument I have for your statement for use the playstyle you want is that you as a player can use that playstyle. By no means does that playstyle have to be open ended or unlimited and by no means does it mean it also should be as such when playing with other players with the same playstyle.
It’s not a question of using a build that’s open-ended or unlimited, it’s a question of using a build that’s viable. Conditions, in group situations, especially large groups like those running around in Orr, are not viable because a large percentage of their damage is outright ignored by the game engine. It’s even possible for all of a character’s condition damage to be ignored because it being supplanted by other, slightly higher, condition stacks. For that to happen only requires two or three others running condition builds in the same fight. When some fights have 30+ participants involved, it’s not hard to fill that stack cap. That translates to a lower contribution during the fight, and the possibility of receiving a lower reward that isn’t commensurate with your actual damage output.
I’ll still use condition builds while leveling because I do most of it solo or with one other friend. At 80 though, when most of my activities involve large groups, I switch to pure damage. It’s the only way to ensure I keep seeing gold contribution awards. It’s also nice to know that game isn’t simply ignoring my efforts and that all of my damage is registering.
Conditions are broken. They’ve been broken for ages. It needs to be addressed.
I must be missing something in this discussion. how do 5 man guilds not have all the research done at this point? I joined a guild 2 months ago and have contributed 15,000 influence to my guild in that time. Even if you have a 5-man guild, if you formed near the start of the game you should have earned around 200,000 influence by now assuming you haven’t spent a single gold to buy any extra.
Also why can’t these small guilds join a bigger guild and do the events as a 5 man group within the big guild while they work up the research in their small guild? I mean that is the entire point of being able to join 4 guilds at once isn’t it? I’m in a smaller guild but i’m also in a 400 man guild and we have 300,000 influence just sitting in the bank. Just run with your friends in a larger guild and earn the rewards there until you can finish the research in your small guild.
Or…
make smaller guild missions for small guilds as well as large for larger guilds, with appropriate rewards for each case. Gate them in a lower tier, where as large guild can get right to a higher tier in a guild track without much, if any difficulty . Folks love to throw the word “progression” around in MMOs these days…
well, there ya go!
Yeah, there used to be this little thing called scaling that GW2 was known for. I guess that got left on the design floor sometime post-launch. At least it doesn’t appear to have made it into the design discussions for guild events.
I must be missing something in this discussion. how do 5 man guilds not have all the research done at this point? I joined a guild 2 months ago and have contributed 15,000 influence to my guild in that time. Even if you have a 5-man guild, if you formed near the start of the game you should have earned around 200,000 influence by now assuming you haven’t spent a single gold to buy any extra.
Also why can’t these small guilds join a bigger guild and do the events as a 5 man group within the big guild while they work up the research in their small guild? I mean that is the entire point of being able to join 4 guilds at once isn’t it? I’m in a smaller guild but i’m also in a 400 man guild and we have 300,000 influence just sitting in the bank. Just run with your friends in a larger guild and earn the rewards there until you can finish the research in your small guild.
While you splitting your time running events with your 400-man guild, you 5-man guild isn’t progressing at all. You realize that right? So if your goal was to build up your small guild over time until it had the influence to open the events that the larger guild has, you aren’t going to do it.
That’s the point. Yes, you can (theoretically) join a larger guild for their guild-based content, but that is going to do SFA for your little group. And I say theoretically because I expect those larger guilds are going to crack down on membership and force representation all the time. You won’t even be allowed to moonlight with your smaller guild. That’s what’s going to kill those little groups.
As for paying 75ish gold to unlock the PvP track — kitten that. That’s the biggest and most egregious money sink ever, if you don’t kittening PvP! I would say it was fair if it went into something that everyone would find useful like Architecture. Show me a single guild that couldn’t use more storage space. It has nothing to do with PvP or PvE, therefore excludes no one based on the game they play. If they really wanted to be fair and NOT interfere with how a guild chooses to improve itself, the gate would be based on nothing more than total influence earned. It should have nothing to do with the way it’s spent because it’s nothing but an arbitrary gating mechanism to start with. The unlock requirement should be just as arbitrary.
What we have now is a reward catered to PvPers but presented to the whole community, ostensibly because PvP otherwise sucks and ANet needs some way to shoehorn more people into it, whether they want it or not. Might even work too since who wants to be reminded of all that wasted money or effort in unlocking a tree that they never use. The fact is (and it is a FACT), that far more people are interested in PvE than PvP and ANet knows this, proves this is an attempt by them to push players into PvP by forcing them to invest HEAVILY into a PvP only reward track.
Bloody social engineers. There is no corner of hell hot enough…
1. Get other screenshot programs
2. Install them and use them
3. ???
4. ProfitBut seriously, GW2’s built in screenshot quality is horrible, I would stop using it and get something else if I were you.
Edit: Bad grammarz
During the beta, there was an option for high resolution screenshots as well. Nice little feature I used continuously. Gone now though.
By the way, I got that message two weeks ago myself.
The whole small guild vs large guild argument isn’t the point, though for some reason a lot of people are focusing on it.
Many people (rightfully) expected small guilds to have easy access to the introductory missions, average guilds would have easier access to intermediate missions, and the mega-guilds would have easier access to the high-end missions.
This could have been done by starting the research at say Level 2-3 of something, then the next step up in difficulty would require Level 4 of something, and finally the massive missions would require Level 5 of something. To gate everything behind a level 5 research is what people have an issue with, especially the WvW track. This hurts small guilds which have not invested in AoW as well as future guilds that will be starting fresh.
Well said Toxyn.
I agree entirely.
Except… I will express one cautionary statement. We don’t know that everything will be gated behind a tier 5 upgrade… only that the first content available is gated as such… and that guilds with these upgrades already completed, or nearly completed in this tier will have access to the new reward system for a good amount of time before the rest can catch up.
And we can also extrapolate based on this and his statements that it will take literally months to unlock the 5 types of guild missions… also assuming costs are tuned for large guilds only due to being in a tier 5 wvw tree… that smaller guilds might take a year or more to do the same.
That is unless we want to blow a Legendary worth of gold to get there…
Tell me again what incentive any player has to belong to a guild that isn’t 50 concurrent players or more?
Most big guilds will have more things maxed out as is so more then like you will find a guild on your server that doing these runs on day one. Newer guild and small ish guild will need to put in the work that big guilds who been arone for some time have already done. How fair would it be to these larger guild that have been here for a long time and not been the types that just come and goes as they please?
Side note for all the complains that are coming out will any one here say thank you if it works out? Just to come to the forms and only complain about things and not to say “i was wrong” seems a bit well wrong.
If this had been structured properly, big guilds would have been rewarded by being able to quickly unlock further content, while small guilds would have at least had something to work on while they go about the long process of unlocking everything else. The way it’s set up now, small guilds will see nothing new, potentially for months, because it’s all gated DEEPLY behind a PvP guild track.
That’s stupid design. Stupid.
Hopefully this isn’t actually how it has been designed and the truth was lost in translation somewhere along the way. Punishing small guilds and ramrodding them into larger ones because it’s the only way to see any guild-centered content, doesn’t do anyone any favours.
bull kitten.
A 1sec, 450 burn on each tick would actually balance the auto attack’s dps quite well as well as make logical sense that you are set on fire regardless of how long you stay in the jet stream, additionally requiring competent players to avoid the attack. in this way, regardless of how long you stay in the attack, you burn for 1sec after.
That’s 10s of burn (10 ticks @ 1s burn/ea), for a 2.25s (accurate?), channel. That’s approximately 20s of burn for every two FT blasts. How is that not OP for a completely unmodified, skill 1 auto-attack?
If I’m not calculating that right, let me know where I’m off the rails.
you are off the rails because each tick is less than a second, and it only refreshes duration it doesn’t “add” duration. this is why it is so important to make sure that a cond duration build achieves the full extra second (or 0.65 for some conds, as cottage has pointed out).
As such, if a foe stands in the fire for the full 10 ticks, they still end up with only 3 full seconds of burning, not 10.
Thanks for clearing that up. Makes a lot more sense now.
bull kitten.
A 1sec, 450 burn on each tick would actually balance the auto attack’s dps quite well as well as make logical sense that you are set on fire regardless of how long you stay in the jet stream, additionally requiring competent players to avoid the attack. in this way, regardless of how long you stay in the attack, you burn for 1sec after.
That’s 10s of burn (10 ticks @ 1s burn/ea), for a 2.25s (accurate?), channel. That’s approximately 20s of burn for every two FT blasts. How is that not OP for a completely unmodified, skill 1 auto-attack?
If I’m not calculating that right, let me know where I’m off the rails.
That’s not Arenanets fault, that’s the markets fault. Also, if you don’t know how to make money with a craft, you’re doing it wrong. I’ve made 80% of all my money (not including my lucky Perma Black Lion Trader) with crafting.
The market is a complex system governed by a set of rules. It reacts within the restrictions of those rules. The rules were put in place by ArenaNet, therefore anything wrong with the market is ArenaNet’s fault. However, they can also claim credit for anything right with it.
OP: Crafting with a 400 skill can be profitable. You need to pay better attention to the costs of your materials and the going price for items. Don’t make things where there are already a ton on the market, or things where there is no demand. There is room for decent profit there.
Prior to that, crafting is just a means of exchanging gold for experience. You can find places here and there, especially post 350, where you can make a bit of cash, but there aren’t many. Use crafting to purchase levels. That’s it’s only effective use until you near the skill cap.
It is weird too that they force pve players in wvw for world completion.
It’s weird that they force PvP players out of the mists for world completion.
The vast majority of the content of the game is PvE. The PvP stuff is miniscule by comparison. Can’t imagine why they would require you to do PvE related activities in a PvE-centric game.
As for the OP, the PvPers are unfortunately correct in that flagging for WvW doesn’t work. The point of those zones is open PvP and allowing you to pick and choose when you want to engage in it defeats the entire purpose of the game model.
But you can always just squat on a WvW slot and wait for locations to be opened up before you go to them. Let your “team” open the way to your objectives. It’s a bit of a waste of time, but any time spent in the Mists is a waste of time, if you’re just there for map unlocks. This way, you aren’t constantly paying for repairs and waypoint revives, and you’re also not providing free entertainment for anyone on the opposing servers. Might also be worth doing it on a low level alt. Haven’t tried it myself, but I’d assume that even if you got tagged, the costs would be negligible.
Please remember that when GW1 first launched, it wasn’t as amazing as people think it is now.
Many many patches later do you have the gem you all hold near and dear to your hearts.
I thought it was amazing at launch. I still think the Prophecies campaign is pretty amazing.
GW2, even now, is also pretty amazing.
ORGH The amount of whine and WOE is me is over the top.
Everybody sit down and relax this is what we know.
1. There different events that have different difficulties and need for numbers. Bounty was a Multi-zone event so chance’s are you will need to be in a BIG guild for it to work.
2. The different events size might coincide with different levels of the tree. A 5 man event will need tier 1 and 20 man event needs tier 5.
3. There is no talk about it only being in the Art of War tree. Only that the Bounty one will be in that tree.
4. It is something to work towards. It is a thing that will take effort and planning from your guild. IT is not meant to be a easy way for you to get loot. Yes your 2 man guild will have a hard time doing things and that is why there is the multi-guild function.
5. It is a very short passage so keep your impotent nerd rage in check until we actually know the entire picture and stop being so dam reactionary.
6. The people complaining about having to go into the wvw tree when they don’t wvw. I have to do kitten Dungeons for my monthly and Fractals for ascended gear.
IN the end relax and let’s see what happens before you blow the top of your head off in pure anger.
It’s a PvE game. That’s where 90% of the content lies. If you didn’t want to do PvE content, you shouldn’t have bought a PvE game.
Why are some of you complaining so much? Ye, it caters to some more developed guilds more than others at first. It gives guilds a reason to rank up their stuff. You could make an argument that any type of content benefits certain types of people. Its like saying Explorable gear isnt fair because it caters to level 80’s. This is an MMO. You cant expect ease of access to everything. The progression is necessary for the game.
Plus, most of the small guilds nowawadays have just started out anyways. Which is not very smart knowing the game has been out for around 6 months. You have a very low chance of recruitment. Plain and simple, people dont want to join small guilds of 50 people or less, even if it is active, you only see around 10 people online at most. Its much more preferred to a lot of players to join a large active guild where you regularily see 30-60 people online at once. Thats just the dynamics of guilds so don’t complain about that.
As far as I can tell, plenty of people prefer a smaller guild atmosphere because they have no interest in being just another cog in a giant machine. So long as the guild remains active and there are people online to play with, size is not an issue.
Prove me wrong.
EDIT: By the way, the most famous guild in Tyria is Destiny’s Edge, which consisted of six original members (including Snaff). Wonder how long it would have taken them to get that tier 5 PvP unlock, seeing how busy they were fighting dragons and all.
(edited by Blacklight.2871)
If this helps reduce the number of ridiculously small guilds, and medium sized guilds with poor representation, then I am all for it.
Game has been out for 6 months. If your guild has not researched all the tiers by now, regardless if your guild is PvE only, then stop building all those useless MF banners and enforce rules of representation to get the influence to do research. If that is not to your liking, then stop whinging about being gated from content.
The clue is in the title of the game, people, and seems Anet is looking to consolidate the player base. I say this is about time …
Two rather foolish assumptions here. The first is that everyone who plays the game is a PvP enthusiast. Patently false to the point of absurdity. Second, everyone who is playing the game now and all their guilds, were around at launch. Again, absurd. Perhaps you work at ANet where such ridiculous conclusions seem to be at home.
But I did want to thank you for promoting a spirit of fascism within guilds. Your recommendations for guilds to crack down on representation and stop building the the guild items THEY find the most valuable, is most welcome.
A total fail on two counts, both mentioned many times above:
1) requiring ANY of the guild trees to be at level 5
Even not-so-small guilds may not have level 5 in anything if it doesn’t unlock something they’ve seen having a value until now
2) using the PVP tree when many players/guilds never touch PVP content
Fine, you want to encourage PVP but using a huge stick like this won’t do that, it’ll simply turn people off.
This is probably the reason they’ve gated off the new content this way — to encourage players to be more active in PvP. It’s probably the same reason that monthly achievements were dependent on WvW participation for so long. In the real world, this is called social engineering.
Despite what the defenders of this are going to say (it’s optional — you don’t have to do it), this is just another example of ANet failing to live up to their own design philosophy. “Play the game the way you want to play it” rings pretty hollow when it’s become clear you’re supposed to play the game the way THEY want you to play it. And that includes PvP.
Lacero Omni, here’s a pile of karma for you. You can’t buy anything with it, but you can trade it in later when you really need it.