Guild Wars 2

I would leave any auto targeting off, there are times where I purposefully drop target so I can leap of faith away. If it auto targets anyone I would leap BACK into the fray instead of away to safety.

Totally honest, I don’t listen/read tutorials. They are commonly not paced at the level interaction that I like.

Side story but associated, learning varries between individuals. Some learn by Seeing, Listening , and Doing (in general).

So those that are good at learning via being shown what to do or listen to instructions probably cope well with the NPE to some degree.

For some of us that learn by dumping all the parts on the floor and discovering how they fit together for ourselves, the NPE is constricting and confusing.

IN every game I don’t read instruction books and look at guides and walkthroughs before i play them. I jump in and “see what I can do”.

I am constantly experimenting/theory crafting and one useful thing that I took out of the hammer build provided is the idea of on swap burst.

I don’t feel that the only viable hammer build is what is being proliferated right now, and I also don’t feel that hammer can normally withstand the pressure if you camp it too long.

What it does provide is quick 1 hit burst damage on a low cooldown (mighty blow). Mighty blow can do 3kish damage and combine that idea with the trait Glacial Heart for a chance of an extra 300-800ish damage.

I took that idea and tried to expand on it with on swap Sigil of Hydromancy. this can easily proc about 1k damage on crits, and crits quite often. Add onto that Sigil of Fire for about 800 damage.

3000 + 800 + 1000 + 800 = 5600 damage every 10 seconds on weapon swap. Do a couple of burst hits and some CC, then swap back to your primary weapon. I have been sticking to greatsword as primary to continue the ae damage burst chain, but sword or scepter or perfectly fine too. I just feel they lack damage and/or mobility/control.

Lately I have been combining hammer with hyrdomancy and intellect to better guarantee crits, fire is so-so, but you get the idea.

Oh man the PR push for metabattle is strong with you, I mean props for pushing your creation, but I duno if you really have to patrol every forum to make sure anything said about metabattle is responded to.

It is a good centralized resource to use as a starting point, but not often do I think anyone should solely use what is explicitly posted there.

Open world zerg farming is so forgiving, if someone “needs” a guide on how to press 1 with staff then go ahead and follow it, but for the most part it is extremely unnecessary to try to squeeze out these sort of optimalities in such an event.

But hey, play your way.

Best I would suggest is bloodlust cause you will kill lots of things stacking quickly, swap to maybe a staff with swiftness on kill and fire on crit (more chance of tagging more mobs than just staff 1 alone). Beyond that trait how ever you like.

The only way to really do it wrong would probably be build a condi staff setup. I’m sure someone may argue that one with permeating wrath or something but w/e I won’t continue.

I take it back you could also build full cleric and fail, cause you might not do enough damage to get credit for kills. So maybe people can do it wrong :p

“Interesting” is the correct word, effective is the other word. They do “ok” but I still feel they need a slight push for refinement.

Old accounts were apparently grandfathered in, but you are still level gated on new characters to some degree, new accounts apparently are totally restricted by this New Player Experience and the majority of the feed back was an overwhelming NO, yet it hasn’t changed in the last year.

I hate it, but I admit I have seen a post in the past saying they liked it so…meh?

Guardian Virtues are almost worthless unless you trait them.

Might + Blind +Vulnerability = VoJ

Condition Cleanse + Burst Heal + Regeneration = VoR

Block + Protection = VoC (stability and/or burst heal if you trait for it, but not many do)

VoC is probably our most situational and least well utilized active virtue.

VoJ gets plenty of useage, and VoR has good group utility.

All of the above synergize extremely well with self healing via Altruistic Healing if you are in a group environment that needs it (wvw)

The passives are really unflattering and I feel they should be given a second look

I think it is thematically appropriate and hope it stays, it isn’t a faster kill per say, but more fun for sure and “relatively” safe…although you still saw them get downed…

Awesome either way, love the vid!

Honestly, majority of groups I am in doing dungeons everyone is stacking and not moving very far. Boss attacks are sparse and animated, so standing still and waiting for a dodge works perfectly fine.

In open world, there is normally so much zerg going on that I don’t have to dodge overly much, and if I do get downed I either spawn and run back or someone typically will try to revive me if it isn’t too dangerous. Again attacks are normally pronounced and you learn to dodge the right animations/timing.

Just because a boss is looking at you does not mean you have to immediately have to run away.

Also, since threat is so fickle, people have given up on trying to “tank” things….but if things are TRULY as dire as you make them sound, a lot of people would love to be able to “tank” and that is something they would die to have (get it they would die cause we can’t tank…yet).

I edited my link, I had the wrong article originally but that page details the extent of agro mechanics that the community needs to understand.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Aggro

That was beautiful man….tear

Watching replay now at

http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/633875031

orng logo did a great job, but I noticed how often abjured was able to focus fire tage down Some awesome ring of warding group kills though!

To put a slight positive spin on the lack of weapon customization, in GW1 you normally chose skills that complimented the weapon you used. A simple example is, why take a bunch of hammer abilities when you were primarily wielding a sword and shield?

After that you had a bunch of “utility” skills to fill up the skill bar, as there are probably only 2 or 3 weapon skills of choice on your bar that were consistently used.

I only played GW1 for a very short while, so maybe further into game development the above scenario is less true, but I see GW2 as streamlining the choices the player has to make in an attempt to lessen the often complained about skill clutter of useless skills and builds (which we are still ailed with today, but much less than GW1’s hundreds of random skills that were never really used).

Now this streamlining does feel restrictive and lessens personal choice and flavor, which in turn makes me often feel like there is only one or two good builds, but it (in essence) accomplishes what player knowledge used to do for GW1. Which is prevent you from taking skills that do not work well with your current weapons.

Still, a little bit of variation WOULD be nice, so that it feels like I am out smarting my opponents and it was due to my superior strategy and build knowledge.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Kal Spiro.9745:

OH NOES! RNGESUS SAVE ME!

RNG is RNG?

Not sure what you want. Some people don’t get anything, some people get everything. Welcome to the outliers.

Nothing in computer programming is truly RANDOM.

That’s a misconception. RNG is the illusion of randomness.

Everything is the illusion of randomness. If you know all the variables nothing is random.

“Nothing is true, everything is permitted”

You solved the internets!

Exedore.6320:

CMF.5461:

This is seen and utilized in WvW but never utilized in sPVP.

Cause it sucks…..Why does it suck?

Staff doesn’t suck. It’s actually pretty good.

The problem is that support guardian builds just don’t work in sPvP right now.

Instead of cherry picking, go back and reread original intent of conversation. Not talking about support but area pressure denial, specifically for sPvP point team fighting through damage, not support.

The problem with conditions and staff is that majority of condition sigils are single target, and staff’s “strength” is multi target, so you would want a multi target sigil which will be torment on crit, and bleed on swap.

torment by itself will not stack high enough to matter, bleed on swap defeats the idea of area denial through ae pressure cause you have to swap in and out of staff to maintain the bleed and 3-6 bleeds by themselves are….meh?

Vulnerability on symbol is a nice idea to utilize but at most you get 4-5 stacks of vuln on targets in symbol (if they even bother to stay in symbol) and a long cooldown before you can symbol again on staff.

The auto attack is great (sans effective damage) and the orb fire is decent (except slow and buggy, so unreliable)

The idea of staff as an area denial/pressure weapon is nice, but it just is not/will not happening. I mostly wanted to bring up the idea and discuss it to bring attention to the lack of effectiveness it has which could encourage adjustments in the future. Instead of being satisfied with it providing might as a support weapon and mindlessly tagging zerg ae pve loot bags, it develop into an effective area weapons for either support and/or offense.

I think team work and coordination can be applied to both wvw and pve map completion.

Some areas may require extra effort and assistance from other friendly players, others you can just run to it yourself.

You may die a few times to pve mobs cause of too many mobs trained on yourself or a champ or event in the way of a skill point or poi, but if you get more allies or wait for the event to clear, you can get it later.

Same with wvw, but the opposing mobs are player controlled, and the events are keep captures. It requires “more” help than 1 or 2 other people though, and it “feels” more vindictive because a person is killing you and not an emotionless machine.

So if you get over the fact that a “player” killed you and view the death as simply another setback (don’t take it personally), then it is pretty much the same thing. The stigma is that pressure that someone else out there made a conscious decision to attack you. Is that bad? That IS what the environment is structured after, and npc mobs will attack you on sight as well.

Death is death, just keep at it and try again or with more allies.

Now if they come over and try to tbag you or camp your body, then they are just jerks and that aggravates me…but letting that get to you mean they were effective in what they want to do (bullies), and you just need to either man up and beat them at their own game (not always productive) or learn to shrug it off and move on because feeding into it just fuels the hate on both sides (more productive). Mature decisions people, mature reactions.

Just to re-emphasize, I was talking about staff in a damage oriented perspective as area pressure through offensive capability.

You don’t have to actually pvp to get any of those, a healthy wvw match up will have ebbs and flow of who owns what points, so log on and check it consistently. Also if your server is out matched then the next match up will adjust for that.

ALSO who is associated with which team color changes from match up to match up. It will take time, but I did my world completion with almost no wvw at all. If we didn’t own a point I didn’t’ bother it. I think I karma trained with a group once or twice just to get a keep or two, but for the most part I solo ran.

Sure I died and got ganked, some fights I came out on top, but mostly I avoided conflict and just did my thing. Worst I ever had it was in the wvw JP, but that is it’s own map now and I almost never see anyone in it camping jumpers.

Well when you watch strong PvP team fights, the stronger point AOE team tends to win out. By pressuring a point with wells, grenades, arrow barrages, meteor showers, and null fields/choas storms.

That leaves out warrior, thief, and guardian for the most part (thief and war have some range aoe ability but nothing I fear overly too much).

Guardian’s ranged “aoe” is smite which is a strike for strike hit that has reduced damage with more targets in area or, staff.

Thief can spam some poison fields and cluster bomb damage to help contribute. But are limited by initiative somewhat.

Warriors have combustive shot and arcing arrow that help provide burst/might for everyone else but then they don’t have much.

So like warriors, guardian can at most get off an empower and a symbol/staff auto attack to help the aoe point combat, but they are not contributing very much past that.

Notice it is the two heavies that are supposed to be melee oriented? I guess that is by design. After that analysis I guess I am “ok” with the lack of AOE pressure we put out for those point fights…..we do have books though, which are perfect for that……just that cast time and cooldown though, it could work a bit smoother.

But for “competitive” play in spvp, do you think it could ever have a slot as an offensive area pressure weapon? With or without revisions to the weapon skills?

Your number 3 seems like a doable thing Ragnar. The new revenant skill that creates a line and pulls enemies into that line could translate into similar code for the orb flying down a line and healing allies in vicinity of the line.

The lack of vertical targeting is one I forgot, that you both pointed out, good call.

Guardian staff has unparalleled group support and a huge AoE cone, that can apply heavy pressure against a whole team of enemy opponents. This is seen and utilized in WvW but never utilized in sPVP.

Cause it sucks…..Why does it suck?

There is no burst damage or any special mechanics that make it difficult to play against, and we are often better off going for single target melee dps to down someone instead of trying to utilize our built in AoE.

Is staff too slow? Should it hit harder? Does the orb need to be fixed so it is not so buggy and maybe track targets? Should it heal better even without healing power? Empower not enough? Line of Warding easily avoided?

What is missing from staff that it isn’t seeing much play outside of mostly ignored bunker builds now?

Personally I hate staff. Yet I see how great a tool it can be in WvW, so why does it fall so flat in sPvP?

If anyone picks staff it is done and a cleric build, but how would you utilize the AoE pressure in a dps build? Can you think of feasible play builds or would staff need buffing/tweeking to make it effective?

Thoughts?

Unless you are competing for money, guardian bunker and guardian meditation dps will work sufficiently for general play.

watch the video, he “sometimes” puts burn on spirit weapons, sometimes he does not and picked torch cooldown reduction instead.

Honestly, the spirit weapons are minimal in the build, its the burn damage that is the passive killer.

Majority of the spirit weapon skills can be dodged/kited and for the most part he was not activating the “burst” abilities on them in his videos but letting them passively auto attack (no damage).

What he did do good was utilizing gap closer to weapon swaps to apply conditions. To win vs him you simply have to burst harder than his conditions can tick and/or forever kite him.

Majority of his burn damage was from close range torch ticks and purging flames. Two fairly easy things to avoid/cleanse.

Clicking to Keying

fine, you taunted it and it will turn and walk to you or auto attack you for 3ish seconds.

Are you going to:

A) stand there and take the hit?

B) avoid the damage and move/dodge when it swings at you?

After 3 seconds then it goes right back to what ever it was it was doing with no realistic agro control. It may or may not continue to attack you but do you still want it on you?

Currently no one is taking any amount of drastic hits anyway so taunting it off…well no one, does pretty much nothing (new fight mechanics may ask for taunting since they made it though).

Also, we don’t know the cooldown of the taunt so maybe it is once every 30 seconds for 3 seconds…you “tanked” nothing in the end.

The biggest advantage of taunt is the prevention of special attacks. This could be used to stop incoming death attacks and buy players some extra time to get endurance to dodge another big insta death move.

Also many have mentioned the possible application of confusion making targets auto attack when they don’t want to. That is interesting as a way to encourage smart application of confusion, but PvE mobs auto pretty slow (this may be up for change in new content).

I apparently was wrong about the guardian image. I found this gem and I guess I should rethink my perspective of spirit weapons, burning, and staff…..

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Guardian-Burn-damage/first#post4808977

No words, maybe we should nerf spirit weapons and guard condi builds. I’m sure that will help the imbalance a lot.

Would the term ironic be applicable that every guard applies burning but it is arguably the least class defining thing we bring to the table? That is what I was poking fun at.

I mean if you want to champion that banner then go ahead.

I understand it is just marketing, but it still makes me lol…or frown I dunno, mixed emotions.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-the-master-of-the-mists/

Maybe after 2 years I should let it go but….

Revenant: The Master of the Mists

This is a key part of the class that enhances the look and feel of gameplay as a revenant; you won’t feel like a guardian with its flames or a warrior with its physical attacks.

Do you guardians “feel” like burning and flames define your gameplay and look?

Thaddeus.4891:

CMF.5461:

Factor in actual combat scenarios and yes the build I proposed will drop behind drastically. BUT I feel it is one of the better options to take while building for survival.

It certainly better than what cletiscake proposed, but that doesn’t make the build you propose good. Its lackluster in DPS, have less resistance than an Hammer build. The only thing it have better is the sustain, which is not good in this game.

If someone want to have a bit more surviability the best choice is always active defense. If you want to sacrifice a bit of dps for more resistance or for more sustain that’s ok. But when you sacrifice a lot of dps for both resistance and sustain, you end up with well a bad build.

Go back and read the OP, he is not asking for a zerker build, and go back and read many of my bottom lines how I encourage dps builds over survival builds.

You are barking up the wrong tree telling me how ineffective survival builds are, but you are also blind to what is going on here. You are trying so hard to push the meta in a place that is not asking for the meta. You are telling me that what i posted is a bad dps build when it is “not” a dps build but a survival build for a man who asked for a survival build.

I am not the one running the build I proposed, I run full zerk and use my virtues consistently. Yes I posted that build, no I don’t run it. I am trying to help a player who asked for a specific thing with specific requirements. Not regurgitate the meta

I run meta and encourage others to do

But you see a non meta build and you start build bashing without thought or reason.

Stop think, breath, preach somewhere else.

30% in one attack should reflect roughly 30% in a complete rotation if both attack patterns mirror each other (which they wont because zerker builds would not use staff and greatsword).

Factor in actual combat scenarios and yes the build I proposed will drop behind drastically. BUT I feel it is one of the better options to take while building for survival. Going pure knights as suggested by many for entry level is actually even more of a dps loss and gains no vitality, which gains you almost no survival with toughness alone. The other survival build posted before mine also was a dps loss (but with much better survival stats, yet without sustain mechanics).

The build you posted will do more damage, but offers almost no sustain and encourages virtue usage. It also has no sustain mechanics, and I feel the OP will want/need sustain…maybe I’m trying to sterotype him too much and I should give him more credit than that…but no virtue usage

Having him use signets such as judgement (only real survival signet anyway) is “ok”, but the up time of active is not strong enough, and passively I don’t feel it is enough. I like your idea of hammer though, but not sure if the OP will take it.

I think in the end we can all agree that the OP should just learn how to play zerker meta, but trying to give options.

I’d have to agree that hammer is the best passive gameplay the OP asked for, but he also asked for gs/staff, thus I tried to supply that. (he also said it was not mandatory so that is flexible).

I also wasn’t trying to build a “zerker” build, so of course its a terrible “zerker” build, what I tried to do was work within the realm of dps meta while providing him something “tankier”….even though I repetitively mentioned it is more often than not, not worth investing into.

And the comparison zerker build was an average zerker, I did not include sigil of night more as ease of translating damage in changing conditions. Although majority of dungeon ARE night, it is known that night and force are typically taken.

Also, slayer potions….not an option on build calculator and you are really pushing into speed run territory, which is obviously not the OPs cup of tea. So stop trying to showcase the most optimal of optimal.

I was not taking into account virtue of justice active, as the OP specifically asked to NOT use virtues. So that wasn’t taken into account for either build and tried to avoid traits into it as he wasn’t using them anyway.

Unscathed contender with the OP will have just about a zero percent uptime I suspect, but I may be wrong… I opted to not try to sugar coat it for him though.

I also mentioned that I only factored in one weapon attack and not a rotation, weapon swapping and proper use of cooldowns will vastly increase damage as I mentioned way prior to the additional posts, the numbers are not there to show actual damage, but stat effectiveness in maintaining “dmg” while increase of toughness and vitality (survival stats), also utilizing altruistic healing to maintain life. Survival stats without replenishment of life will net you no real survival. The idea is to take a hit while being able to recover from damage.

The only thing you really did is give him a zerker build with a hammer and found him a “steal” on a cheaper rune set than scholar.

If anything take the build I provided and throw a hammer on it (WAY better for AH anyway with a hammer versus GS). Then you get the 20 something percent damage reduction from armor and 33% from protection. All the while replenishing health with symbols. To maintain decent damage rotations, drop staff and swap to GS for cooldowns then camp hammer auto attack till greatsword cooldowns are ready again.

I factored them in, I’m not talking about damage modifiers but a rough estimate of actual damage done.

For the sake of trying to show my work:

Damage done = (Weapon strength) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (target’s Armor)

Average damage = Base damage * ( 1 + Critical Chance * ( Critical Damage – 1 ) )

Zerk raw damage on whirling wrath with Average Crit Damage (ACD) modifier for crit/crit chance (not assuming 100% crits)

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQNAR8dlsApUo9CxQI8DNR8Ql7Y8i2+BtQlBQDA-TBCBwAGV+JRJI29Hwp+DgLCQKdDJM/F4JAQKA9UGB-e

ACD /Scholar/Fiery Wrath/Radiant Power/Force/Zealous Blade/Power of the Virtuous

3018 * 1.6 * 1.1 * 1.1 * 1.1 * 1.05 * 1.05 * 1.05 = 7440 damage

Proposed compromise build I posted (with 5 self might stacks):

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQJARWlsApUo9CxQI8DNR8AVZAaAmP5/XfkYcDA-TBCBAB8o+DuKBB4SA0iugi2f4BzfIp8LgnAApAoYZE-e

ACD / Fiery Wrath / Zealous Blade / Force

3004 * 1.43 * 1.1 * 1.05 * 1.05 = 5209

5209 / 7440 = 0.70

or 100% – 70% = 30% less damage

Feel free to point out errors, as I’m sure I am capable of making mistakes. I did not assume 20% more precision from fury, but with it, the loss of damage is lessened…BUT both builds are capable of having fury in a party so I did not want to assume it as a strength.

NOTE: (damage on build calculator shows differently than when I use gw2wiki damage formulas, not by a drastic amount but it does differ slightly)

Also, while the “stats” are close, the attack rotations will also drastically drop your damage as you stop to channel Empower and you lose weapon swap auto attack dps from sword. Again, just saying any of the above is less than optimal, but optimal isn’t what the OP asked for.

Well, he plays a thief and he does not know how to disengage/kite apparently. So I’ll let him figure that one out.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQJARWlsApUo9CxQI8DNR8AVZAaAmP5/XfkYcDA-TBCBAB8o+DuKBB4SA0iugi2f4BzfIp8LgnAApAoYZE-e

The above build should net you something around 15-20% less damage than a full zerker build but with the added benefit of 3k armor and about 6k more life. (if you factor in 5 might stacks and 20% more crit with fury active. If not it does about 30% less than a zerker)

Cletiscake’s build has much more survival in raw stats, but lacks boon reapplication to make use of Altruistic Healing, as well as it does about 50% less damage than a pure zerker build (another 30%~ less than the one I threw together up top).

You can try both to see what you want more, damage or survival. I will try to reemphasize that active defense and zerker are the better way to go, because there is no tanking in this game and you can still be 1-shot in defensive gear.

Also I want to point out, while you said that you do not want to activate your virtues, by not doing so you are missing out on some crucial capabilities.

VoJ with justice is blind, renewed justice, blind exposure, and inspired virtues makes for some amazing survival in multi target combat with lots of things dying around you. Tons of blinds and tons of might stacks as well as ae vulnerability (utility, survival, and damage rolled into 1)

VoR traited with absolute resolution can be critical in clearing 3 conditions from 5 allies in 1200 range, this can be amazingly clutch on some bosses and helps your group survive, let alone it does a “decent” group heal.

VoC is mostly good on passive to allow more self blocks, but if you rotate your retreat and VoC you can help your group maintain dps without dodging for 2 extra rotations.

Again, I suggest you learn the “meta” way of doing things and maximize the guardian class mechanics. It can take you much further than you can with building tanky alone.

lol 10k+ burn dmg? You are fighting the guard for 30+ seconds then and you don’t have any answer to a 300 dmg burn?

duration not intensity

I like the idea and initiative, also I have experimented with valk ammys as well in the same mind set as you (gain survival/healing power while maintaining damage).

That said, one personal opinion of mine is that while you have good return on life via AH, the initial burst can still be a bit harsh, condition removal often lags behind regardless of pure of voice and soldiers. Possibly swap pure of voice for Force of Will to make up for the loss of vitality on Valk amulet?

The other issue I have is that there is a huge loss in precision, which make the valk amulet much less effective. I know you have on swap intel sigil, but when I was trying to theory craft a build I tried to make up for precision via radiance and possibly 1h strength.

It loses a ton of vitality though, so maybe intelligence is enough? Or maybe swap to Lyssa or Pack runes?

Healing power has a much lower effect on AH anyway, so maybe go soldiers amulet and keep pure of voice and soldiers runes? As you are not critting a ton anyway.

Just food for thought, don’t know if its better but more ideas. GL!

PvE is primarily a dps meta, conditions and pure support builds are mostly ruled out by game mechanics as far as “efficiency”. You can still run them but majority of the player base sees them as less optimal.

So you should be fine by following Obal’s sticky post.

Well, the spreadsheet assumes no stats/traits/gear taken and simply increases in power and/or precision.

Any damage modifiers you take are available to both sides, thus if get a 10% mod to one, it can easily apply to the other, letting the numbers still “move together”.

As far as traits, your damage modifiers are Fiery Wrath, Radiant Power, Elusive Power, Unscathed Contender. All of those are obtainable, but normally only 1 or 2 are taken at a time, as it is a loss of damage or utility to spread out to all of them at once.

So normally you will have a 1.1 * 1.1 = 1.21 damage modifier from traits alone.

In PvE Scholar has been shown to be the clear and consistent choice, so you can add another 1.1 to the formula (1.1*1.1*1.1=1.331)

Force/night are the obvious choices, but to make it simple I’ll just assume Force as it is an all around increase and not dependent on day night cycles (1.1*1.1*1.1*1.05=1.39755)

After that you can apply the 1.39755 to the already averaged out crit chance/crit damage modifier per each cell in the spreadsheet.

All of those damage modifiers are also not heavily dependent on power or precision and if anything FURTHER the fact that power will be the heaviest weighing factor on increases to damage.

It is a lot of numbers, but with the available gear combinations and stats available, power will always win out over precision in equal proportions when choosing armor.

UNLESS you are gaining so much precision that you jump 15-20ish percent in crit chance, power is the clear choice. But you should never run into that scenario unless you are wearing level 1 gear and just now upgrading to level 80 gear or something to that effect.

After that, normal gear/trait/meta theory crafting can be assumed, which we already have a thread and stickied discussion for. The OP simply was asking what is better when picking gear of equal value, power or precision? I am 99.99% sure it is power after looking into it.

Slammed together a spreadsheet trying to visualize the power versus precision debate using base damage numbers and formulas from the wiki to determine power, crit chance, and so forth.

A real “quick” hodgepodge of code that may or may not have some human error involved in copy and paste, so I’ll link a googledocs as well so people can see how/why I got numbers and maybe input their own to tailor it to themselves.

For the rest I am posting a JPEG showing the table for quick reference.

End summary is, it is always better to get power over precision, unless you are jumping to up 380+ precision over 95ish gains in power.

I used 95 as the increments in power and precision simply because it made the crit chart end on a nice even 100% crit chance, so I made the power increases match that so they move together in even units.

I also just threw in the first attack from Greatsword auto chain, so “Strike” is the weapon attack coefficient utilizing basic greatsword weapon damage.

Ferocity decreases the gap in power and precision, but power still beats it out unless you are getting around 3675 ferocity………not possible, so ferocity does not change the picture realistically.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1maXUTsbH_Rx8JYf5DitlQgVCyIR5Xu6PURy7A_ubcIs/edit?usp=sharing

yLoon, the core issue here is that you feel guardian is balanced, while others feel it is not. So any suggestions to enhance guardian abilities to you is seen as making us over powered.

While to the others it is trying to bridge the gap that they feel are behind other classes currently.

So you will never agree and you are always putting down the others suggestions.

As far as giving a compromise, I suggested that without a target, JI could act as a 500 meter blink forward blink, and with a target it would act as a 1200 meter teleport as it currently does.

I do not feel ground targeting is the answer because it creates a clunky mechanic which hinders the natural flow of melee combat and running/moving/turning.

Ranged classes have an easier time placing ground targeting effects because of the field of view being wider and more visibility range versus the isometric top down view of melee.

With your build shanks:

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQNAsdRlsApSoFCxXI8DRR8Ql1YY7H0CVHANwjiDA-TBiAABWqE8alfAcCAiWfgO7PUt6POcIAG4JAQKA/UaB-e

DmgMod 1.631322
Hits 7
BurnDmg 957
DmgDone 5035
Burns 957
Total 5992

If we assume 2 ticks of burning with an easy trait swap from Powerful Blades to Radiant Fire, we get 1914 damage in burning bringing you up to

Total 6949

Didn’t mix up links, that was the point. The condi builds lost over 1000 damage, this was the “closest” thing to zerker damage….pretty much just zerker gear/traits.

The rune changed and the weapon sigil changed to provide 2 burn ticks, everything else was obtainable for both builds without sacrifice.

Just noticed your build, will run rough numbers now. Stand by.