Guild Wars 2

People should look at the number of hits before posting damage done.

But I do believe the skill itself needs some balancing. If it’s going to steal boons, it should deal damage or at least that amount of damage.

But basically if you don’t boon stack, you need to dodge/block/invul and AE your brains out. They are pretty annoying and sometimes really hard to deal with due to the constant evading and stealthing (at least for a condition build). They are not unbeatable however.

But I state again, it needs some balance tweaking for sure.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

It’s not easily avoided, the fact that it is slow makes it very hard to avoid. Use Deathshroud 3 to buffer it.

I would have to disagree, but that doesn’t make me right. When I use it as a gap closer it doesn’t hit it’s target nearly enough, so I always use it at close range to bleed/chill targets for the most part. I still attempt to use it as a gap closer but as I said, doesn’t land as often as I feel it should. It has trouble with some hills, easily LoSable and at range can be dodged (in my opinion) almost as easy/easier than a Warrior’s Boa. Although I will admit I have been hit many a time with a Boa.

The projectile speed doesn’t need a bug speed boost but definitely a minor one due to it’s habit of being easily avoided.

The only reason I meniton using it as an escape tool is because, since it can be fired without a target, it will be used like this regardless if my idea should come into play. It would be silly not too if you actually needed to get away. My main focus is giving it two separate purposes though. Single target ranged or gap closer/PBAoE. If they didn’t want it to be an escape tool, all they would need to do is make it require a target. It would still be highly useful.

Iceflame.5024:

Chesire.9043:

I actually think it would fight nicely onto Spectral Wall due to it’s animation. But I’m hoping for a good slot in the condition tree. Also hoping SW has it’s blast finisher radius increased/more reliable. I love getting me some Chaos Armor procs.

Well it is reliable in the middle of the wall, the more important part would be to fix the issue where the combo field expires early when you take spectral attunement.

I don’t know. I always try and place it in the middle while standing on the wall and it’s about a 50% chance to actually get anything besides portection from it. It may be due to the duration bug smetimes but not that often. Sometimes I’ll even start the fight with the combo so there’s a chance to get it off again after the other player heals or cleanses or in the middle of team fights. Even doing this it seems very unreliable for whatever reason.

As for burning, I am somewhat excited about getting it. I, however, have to agree with others in some regard. I would love to have a poison that ticks closer to burning damage just for Necro’s via a trait. But that also means we still have bad condition variety to cover our bleed stacks. So I’m torn as well as I’ve been doing, though, without burning I would still almost rather a stronger poison.

The sad part is, which either condition, Thieves can cleans them immediately with a short cd heal that stealths them. So I’m skeptical regardless until I see the product in action.

Single target long range projectile that chills on impact with the projectile being something that the Necro can fire and choose when to teleport to it making the effect an AOE around the necro as a secondary effect. Both are guided by the target since the projectile is homing BUT it offers both a ranged and an ae option as well as serving the purpose of being a gap closer and escape opiton. All without being be ground targeted.

Not to mention it’s easy to avoid and neutralize. Necro coming at you? Dodge the chill effect. Necro trying to escape? Get in front of the projectile and cut him off.

Works perfectly assuming the speed is increased slightly. I could live with the homing bugginess with that type of fix.

I actually think it would fight nicely onto Spectral Wall due to it’s animation. But I’m hoping for a good slot in the condition tree. Also hoping SW has it’s blast finisher radius increased/more reliable. I love getting me some Chaos Armor procs.

Totally new sounds interesting. Wonder if we’ll also have the most or still get shafted with it?

Lopez.7369:

I have a bad feeling it won’t be in Curses or Soul Reaping, which would make it unreachable, but I’m cautiously optimistic.

I dunno. I still use Soul reaping. Love me some DS stomps.

I agree and disagree. Since it’s set in stone that it will never be ground targetted again, I don’t like that it’s so easily avoided. I think the projectile needs a speed increase but not a large one. I agree that it needs better homing as well and less pathing issues. Increased range would be nice but I’m not sure it’s needed. Usually if someone is outside it’s range, we’re in a situation where it would be wise to just let them go or we should LoS them to lure them closer.

I use it the same way you mentioned however in that I prepare my attack bursts for when I teleport to them. The fact that it’s easily avoided can mess up an entire rotation quite quickly just with a simple strafe or dodge.

What I would like as an added feature though would be to have us teleport to the max distance regardless if it doesn’t hit anything OR once it has been cast have a secondary ability come up that allows us to teleport to where ever it is at that point in time, making it’s effect AoE around us. It would be harder to land than a ground target ability but would still be highly useful for nay build. I just don’t see that happening either, sadly.

Pendragon.8735:

DS 5 is supposed to be a ‘new’ condition though, doubt it would also do burning, prob be OP then.

Totally new or new to necro’s? That’s my concern.

Burning damage on Necro is just amazing. I’ve tried many ways to include burning in my build without success simply because the damage is a lot more direct than any other condition. It just makes me think of how good the poissibilities are. Chillomancers with burning, Terrormancers with burning. Now I don’t have to stand in Ele and War AEs to get burning, I can apply it myself.

I would love it if Jagged Horror is replaced with a burning proc. That means one kitten minor is gone, everyone can find a place for it since it’d only be a five point minor AND all of our other traits are open for much needed changes.

I’ve been fighting the idea that this patch could show promise, but I think I’m getting a LITTLE excited with what I’m reading here. However I’m still expecting these trees to see changes that do little to nothing to help us out. I just can’t shake the feeling that the changes we’ll get will be stupid ones that no one will even use because they’re still worthless or require to much sacrifice to acquire.

You could be like Necro’s and have no place at all in tournaments, even with our most viable tournament build (also see: Warriors). Mesmers are in a great spot right now compared to other professions. They have the same problems every other profession has, except they are less severe and have a lot of other things that actually works for them.

I can tell a world of difference between my Necro and my Mesmer. Mesmers have near null reason to complain at the games current state.

I hope they also make our stun breakers worth having on our bar. I find Plague Signet both useful and annoying in sPvP and it’s unusable in good portions of WvW.

Overall the patch has me more worried than optimistic.

Bas.7406:

Chesire.9043:

I can’t seem to get the video to produce any sound (even though everything else is working fine). So I’ll just ask here:

Was anything mentioned along the lines of our horrendously long kitten cool downs?

Yes they mentioned they want to increase our ability to use the conditions we have by speeding up the activation times, and I took it to mean that meant cast times or cooldowns.

If that is how they worded it, that sounds more like they will just allow us to cast/attack a little faster and really doesn’t mean anything will come off CD any faster than it does now. That worries me quite a bit actually as quite a bit of our utility skills do not warrant the CD’s they have attached to them. But thank you for responding.

I probably won’t get my hopes up much about this patch and may even take a break from sPvP for a bit until I see the changes. The last few days have given me a lot of frustration with my Necro.

Was there mention of an ETA for the patch?

flow.6043:

Alright, seems I got confused by the skill description.
So… does the “whenever you are struck” part also apply to the boons, or do you automatically get them with the armor?
If it does apply, does an attack trigger both a boon and a condition? or just one or the other?

And does this:
“This does not apply when the Chaos Armor effect is granted from a combo field.”
“Chaos Armor never grants protection when struck.”
…mean that necros can never get protection with it?

See below…

Iceflame.5024:

Flow, I think mesmers have an ability called chaos armor or one that gives them chaos armor. That ability is taken as base for the description and I take it they get protection when they activate it.

When anyone gets chaos armor form a combo field they can get all those boons and inflict all those conditions, it just requires enemies to attack you.

Chaos Armor is a Mesmer skill from their Staff. It comes from Staff 4. The skill gives protection when used as well as a bubble effect; the bubble causes enemies to give themselves conditions and give the user boons (protection, regeneration, or swiftness). It should be noted however that protection is not given by Chaos Armor provided by blast finishers until you are hit by an enemy—and even then it’s a random chance between those three buffs.

The skill is actually quite powerful and I wish we had better/more ways of giving it to ourselves on Necro as I adore it on my Mesmer.

I can’t seem to get the video to produce any sound (even though everything else is working fine). So I’ll just ask here:

Was anything mentioned along the lines of our horrendously long kitten cool downs?

You would be an easy kill for the new fotm boon stealing thieves. They’d eat your buffs and turn them against you and if you didn’t DS you basically lose your damage sponge. At least that’s what I think of when it comes to anything boon related.

That build is really stupidly OP. I hate how long Anet lets these things run-a-muck.

Been getting this a lot today. It may be due to server latency or a bug; I’ve yet to pin point it myself. I do notice that all of my utility skills don’t show up on my bar for a full 1-2 seconds at times.

The blast finisher is definitely buggy. Has about around 45-50% failure rate (possibly higher). It is very unreliable but I wish so hard it wasn’t as I really do love my some Chaos Armor. I still have it on my bar because it gives me some much needed defense in my condi build and I just quite honestly don’t see anything else worth using in its place.

Just one of the many bugs Necro’s have to endure. How we manage to even down anyone is a miracle in itself. I hope, though, that Anet eventually fixes it or gives us access to Chaos Armor (Spectral Armor would be awesome for it).

I can’t speak for minions however. I don’t like MM builds. The only minion I run with is FG and he gives me enough headaches.

Well Lich Form already gives buffs to stats so I don’t think they would do that. The only downfall to Lich is stability being corruptable (which I find funny).

If DS is going to be our class mechanic it needs to be flexible enough to use as an invul (more base life pool AND/OR easier to gain for condition builds) or it needs to have more effect on us while we use it. Even as it is, the few buffs we do have last no time at all really. You have to DS Stomp people just to be able to use our only steady source of Stability. This alone makes me shake my head when I see guardians/rangers with 20s+ of stability (guardians can really keep it going).

I don’t think it’s asking for a lot considering how long our utility CD’s and such are.

Evan posted in another section of the forums about a hotfix tomorrow so this may come with it, but we’ll be waiting another month to see any changes towards the class itself—if at all.

Just a theorycrafting question towards the community, should Anet decide to give us some attention.

I’ve been wondering if it would be OP to have all of our DS buffs (Might/Fury/Stability) put into our trait lines as 10 point minors? All of them. Might stacks in the Spite, Fury in Curses (where it is but as the 10 point not the 20 point), and Stability in Soul Reaping.

I’m honestly not sure what we could have in Blood/Death Magic as regeneration/protection respectively seems way too OP to have up constantly but it gives me the feeling that these lines need something in them. What would you guys like to see done with DS?

I personally really love it, also, if #2 was ground targeted again. I feel it would improve every builds mobility by a large amount (I dare say almost solve them given it’s low CD) which would allow more attention to be given to our utility skills.

What are your thoughts?

Navzar.2938:

No cast time, so it can’t be dodged

Stopped reading the entire thread at this comment.

Corrupt Boon has about a 50% chance to fail entirely for no reason. Doesn’t have to get blocked, doesn’t have to be evaded (which it can be)—it just fails. Ask any Necro that runs it.

The same goes for Epidemic. Our best utility (or rather, our only useful ones) fail THAT much just because. When Anet decides to fix this then I might call it strong skill, but until then calling it anything that even hints at OP is just a joke.

Andele.1306:

Elvahaduken.3609:

please kittening buff us sharp + nerf mesmers to the dam ground

Now now we are a coin toss flip away from mesmers, we should rather join forces with them cough was Necro/Mesmer in GW thus biased and smack guardians and eles for being boon whores.

You forgot Engi as well.

Sprawl.3891:

No public test server ftw

I’ve actually posted in the suggestion forum that a PTS would be highly beneficial to this game with no support from the community. The posts just got buried under rather pointless and redundant threads.

The Necro community makes me think of the big business world community during a stock market crash or right after losing millions over night. We’re just one fine hair away from jumping out of the top floor window of Anet central.

Then resurrecting each other for a Necro-Army that’s riddled with bugs and demands more changes.

I wouldn’t mind different pvp ratings for different professions.

IE: I may be kittening amazing on my Necro but suck balls on my Mesmer. I would like ratings for each to reflect this. Isn’t a big issue, just something I would like should matchmaking ever become anything but a joke.

Would be nice if they had a shorter leash in sPvP. Everything else I’m fairly OK with. Beating a Ranger on my Necro is a rather challenging thing to do currently; especially in those Hot Join Hero matches since they usually get back up about the time they go down.

I have been meaning to ask this since the start of the thread but keep forgetting; so here it is:

Ele, Mesmer, and Thieves all have better mobility than the Necromancer (even Warriors have better mob than us); they also have (excluding the warrior) teleports that are stun breakers as well as on weapon skills with fairly low CD’s (Ele RTL isn’t really a teleport, but that’s besides the point). That being said, given that Necro mobility is so garbage and DS can be drained so fast—how does having DS2 a ground target skill make it OP?

I can understand that maybe a 12s CD teleport/chill/bleed can be annoying as hell if we can move anywhere we want BUT I don’t see it as being OP in regards to how it works now. To me it just seems more of a logical way of doing it and it would be leaps and bounds towards giving us mobility ESPECIALLY considering how hard Life Force is to gather for some builds (conditionmancer). Not to mention that LF can drain extremely fast in certain situations and we start out with zero anyway in sPvP.

So I ask: How would that be OP and/or why is not being considered by Anet? It worked this way before launch, why not revert it now that the Necro population is circling the toilet faster than the sPvP population? I would GLADLY take that over a totally new one in DS5 and it would be so much easier to implement than a new skill.

I run condition build and I enjoy fighting MM builds sometimes.

I tend to load golem down conditions (along with everything else as most are AE) and then Pandemic them to death. Afterwards the enemy necro is free reign. Just keep swapping conditions with them and every time they bring up pets, Pandemic.

Otherwise I lose. That pet damage is no joke. Plus those glass cannon dagger MM’s hurt if you can’t bring those pets down fast.

I’ve never run the MM build myself though. Glad to hear it works!

Iceflame.5024:

Chesire.9043:

I used him yesterday in some matches, actually, and he was rather handy but I never had to actually use him in the few games I played. It was nice to be able to port whenever I wanted though. The only problem I have with it is the cast time.

You talking about the cast time to place the worm?

Yeah cast time to place him. Pre-combat it isn’t an issue but if you forget to place him and need an escape mid-combat it can be problematic as that 1s cast time takes FOREVER.

I used him yesterday in some matches, actually, and he was rather handy but I never had to actually use him in the few games I played. It was nice to be able to port whenever I wanted though. The only problem I have with it is the cast time.

Bhawb.7408:

The only way to guarantee two ticks is to have 2 seconds or more of duration. However if you are properly using terror (applying a condition first for the extra damage), anything around 1.5-1.7s should be enough.

Sums up the thread. Same thing I said, I just didn’t go into as much depth.

/thread gg

Pendragon.8735:

Arcane Thievery removes 3 boons, gives them to you, and gives 3 of your conditions to the enemy. Definitely better, but it does have a 45 second cooldown, a bit over twice as long.

That’s fair so far, but here’s what’s not, it has a 1/4 second cast time, while we are stuck with the usual Necro ponderously long 1 1/4 second cast time. Ridiculous.

Arcane Thievery takes up a utility slot as well, where as the skill in reference here does not seeing as it is a weapon skill.

I do agree that Nero skills have insanely long cast times as well as CD’s, however.

Arganthium.5638:

First, fear doesn’t tick, it’s a constant effect. Either way, I see what you’re trying to say.

Yes, you need 100% condition duration, assuming that the fear lasts a base 1 second.

He’s talking about the damage Necromancers can get from fear.

To answer the question, yes 100% duration = two fear damage ticks; assuming they don’t use a stun or have the condition cleansed.

Tip: Mesmers Feedback is amazing; use it

Mesmers have this amazing utility skill called Feedback. Most of us know that it blocks ranged attacks and is cast on targets. What some people don’t realize is that if your targets runs out of the bubble (most likely in sPvP) you can run inside and still get the benefit of reflecting projectiles. This is also a recommended combo field to generate Chaos Armor by leaping through it or giving your allies CA by way of blast finishers inside the bubble.

Not only does this utility help against ranged attacks and generate CA for you and/or allies, but it’s usefulness doesn’t end there. You can cast it on downed opponents for the following uses:

Thieves – Reflects all of their downed attacks which can be quite strong.
Warriors – Reflects their attacks AND their interrupt, making them easy stomps.
Engineers – Reflects their first interrupt (and I think down attacks) making them much easier to stomp.

When traited it can also be used to blind every class in an attempt to cause their interrupt to miss but this applies to all glamours, not just Feedback.

Found this while doing AC earlier. I only had the first level of traits unlocked. With staff equipped I changed Greater Marks to Staff Mastery, this caused staff 3 (Chillblains) to grey over as if it hadn’t been learnt. Killing foes does not give any experience towards unlocking even though all other staff skills are unlocked already; obviously the skill is unusable in this state.

I’ve repeated this several times in various locations in the PvE world but haven’t noticed anything similar in PvP. I have provided a screen shot.

HiSaZuL.2843:

General assumption is that all the “invisible projectile” skills shoot it at targets feet, so if there is any kind of elevation in the way it will more often then not hit floor and fail putting it on its full cd.

Faaaaaaaaail. Who at Anet thought this was a good idea?

If you like the way the Necro feels, you could play a condition spec Mesmer.

The only problem with these two suggestions is that Thieves and Mesmers are played by everyone and their moms so you will lose that unique feel that you had playing a Necro (at least I feel more unique with it).

I’m hi-jacking this thread for a question.

How is Plague Signet in WvW? Are there just so many cripples/chills/immobs going on that it just gets more annoying than useful?

I think we need better access to more conditions besides bleeding for starters. I can pretty much keep poison and bleeding on a target throughout a fight so it makes fighting every other class easier, especially bunkers. The only problem is, even though I have the HP and counters to some of their skills—they have shorter CD’s than my counters and a better access to boons that offer mitigation to my damage whether it be raw or condition.

Then you take into account that aside from non-staff guardians, every other class has better mobility than us as well; even a Warrior using GS 3 and 5 (although we can shut that down rather easily) they can still move around faster OOC than us granted in short bursts and now have ways of dealing with immob/cripple/chill besides condition cleansing. (Note: I know it isn’t much as I played War before Necro, but it is a step in the right direction for them)

I think Fear is fine as is.

Siphoning needs tweaking number wise, Pet AI is still fubared (Golem doesn’t even participate in fights sometimes), wells need to be looked at (Mainly Power and Corruption should be combined into one to be the opposite of Mesmer NF) and some of our CD’s need to be shortened.

Do this and give us some mobility and we’d be in a very good position I think.

I am posting this again, since it hasn’t been mentioned (that I’ve seen) in the following months after my previous post on the subject. I think a PTS for the community to log into and test new additions to the game alongside the devs would make leaps and bounds towards improving game updates and bug fixes before they go live.

Prior to live updates players, either selected by the devs or open to the whole community, could log into the PTS and test upcoming changes before they are put on the live servers. The community has shown that we have A LOT of testers that thoroughly investigate bugs that have arisen after updates or even those that have plagued the game since beta. I don’t find it fair that their intelligence and desire to improve the game goes wasted and unused before sometimes game changing updates are implemented which required to be fixed immediately without much thought as to how it will effect the game or the update that was just put into play.

There are, of course, advantages and disadvantages to this however.

[u]Disadvantage[/u]

Players could easily get burnt out on or learn ways to abuse these new updates before they are ever put into the live game. This could be detrimental to a game that offers a f2p business model. That’s why I feel that player/tester selection should be chosen by the devs themselves; even this has it’s potential to effect the game as leaks and such could still be an issue if they were concerned about them.

A PTS could also slow down development or implementation of updates and changes to the game. More people testing and finding more bugs takes more time to fix and test, sometimes spiraling into a never ending circle of fix one thing break another. I think the potential to improve the game, however, far outweighs this.

A competitive edge could also be a problem in a game that has wanted to be seen as an e-sport with pvp. Testers could leak numbers, builds, etc. and give competitive players a step up on the competition before the changes are even made.

[u]Advantage[/u]

As I already stated, it lessens the possibility that bugs go unnoticed prior to a live update. More testers means more data and more data means better results. Better results mean a happier community and a more stable game play environment for everyone both in PvE and PvP. Balance changes are noticed easier, responded to faster and fixed accordingly as devs already have the numbers.

Another advantage is that those that get bored with the game but still wish to have something to do can log into the server and help test things themselves, but this is only if the devs make it public rather than a selective thing.

Although I haven’t listed a large list under the advantages, I think a more balanced game with less bugs outweighs most everything. I personally have never implemented a PTS but I have seen it work successfully in past MMO’s that I have played as there were far fewer bugs with updates and expansions. As such the game play was more challenging and fun for everyone, even those that tested it. It was more rewarding to do things without having the chance to rely on bugs; and if there were bugs left they were fixed faster and thus the challenge to find a new way arose again.

Anyway, it’s just a thought and it may not go anywhere. But I do think it is something that should be considered.

BobJoeXXI.2493:

I can’t believe that it takes a video to actually make the developers notice the problem. This bug has been announced for about a month now and probably known about for longer.

I’m not sure if it was the video, but rather the depth of the testing on the communities part to show the proof of it all. Of course this is just speculation on my part.

flow.6043:

Chesire.9043:

Right click switching my target or clearing it all together when I try to pan the camera.

Use the option “Promote Skill Target”.
This way the target stays locked in when you turn away your camera.

I have that option checked and have for a while. Doesn’t help.

But thank you.

It’s a pretty darn good utility skill. I’ve been using it in my spvp build and have decided to keep it on my bar (mainly because I don’t like the Well alternative); nothing else seems like a viable replacement. At least for my build.

I’ve been doing rather well. But thus far there are two things that get me killed on my necro more than anything else:

1) CB randomly missing for no reason (or being dodged, which is fine)
and
2) Right click switching my target or clearing it all together when I try to pan the camera.

Would be nice if they fixed these two issues. Does anyone use anything else in a Condi/Fear build that I’m not aware of? I’m still pretty new to necro but it’s a little more fun than my Mesmer main I’ve been playing since Beta.

That sounds like a kitten way making a skill.

Thanks for the input though. I was not aware is that messed up.

Has anyone noticed this skill acting strangely in spvp or anywhere else?

For it to be unblockable it seems to miss.. A LOT. Even when people aren’t dodging and are just standing still. Maybe it’s just my awesomely poor timing.

I hit a downed guy earlier with HB for 15k!

I think it was an ele or a thief; one of the squishies. Sure, he was downed and couldn’t really do anything, but it was still awesome to see one that high in spvp.

I’m not really full glass cannon build either though, and I’m sure those builds could get even higher on a downed squishy, I just wanted to fit in and share.

Still reading but wanted to point out something I noticed, you have Opportunist in there twice under Arms as 1 and 10.

With condition/might stacking you can get around 800 per burn tick and Arching Arrow hits pretty hard then also. The trick is to stay within your field and use like Ottohi says. I’ve been using it since before the last patch as I just started War a few weeks ago it works very well. Best way to optimize bow is either with high crit rate or high condition damage (from my experience).

I’ve found, though, that fire shield is very useful unless you have the HP and such to soak up the damage required to get the might stacks. Best method would be to do this early and use Sword 2 to proc it so you’re not using a utility that you may need later in the fight.

I’ve been running Shake it Off and Great Justice in sPvP with soldier runes for my power build and it’s (so far) the best condition management I’ve found without sacrificing that final utility slot for SoS and I’m playing around with Precision signet right now. The only drawback to my build that I’m honestly displeased with is that while having to use two utility slots to manage conditions, I have very few CC options and don’t get many chances to land my HB burst.

Would be nice if our elite signet had passive condition removal or boon removal with a short CD instead of the Adrenaline gain. Warriors have so much Adrenaline gain right now it’s ridiculous. Or Rampage drumped all conditions and either elite made you immune to Cripple/Chill/Immob for it’s duration (or a short duration in the case of the Signet).

Just a few ideas to spit ball without much thought into them.