Another possibility is that the condition Fear goes on a target with stability, it just doesn’t normally do anything.
This allows Terror damage to work normally as well as other traits such as Target the Weak. However, the control aspect does not operate on someone with Stability (the important part of the boon)
TLDR: You should still be feared with Stability on, it just doesn’t interrupt or disable you. This would be the ideal change.
Yeah, individual skill is something that DB (including myself) needs to work on.
To be fair for those calling DB a bandwagon server, I will totally agree with you. We never did ask for people to join us, they just did so. Yes, it has turned out well in our favor, but I won’t deny Dragonbrand has become a bandwagon server. Hopefully, when we start losing, they won’t leave us for the winning server.
In any case, unfortunately this week you won’t see much in the way of tactics other than siege placement from us. Why? We don’t need them. It’s well known that Dragonbrand has had superior SEA coverage over almost all of the other NA servers. We always have. Now we have the NA presence to match that.
In Tier 2/1, however, our coverage isn’t an advantage, it’s what lets us stay in the game. In that situation, our tactics become far more required to do well. Against servers without that kind of coverage, we just don’t need smart tactics.
This isn’t to say we aren’t using good tactics, but our numbers do make it difficult for you to notice the maneuvers and coordination as you just see a sea of “Dragonbrand X” coming your way.
<—Dragonbrand since headstart
Would be nice if they removed Foot in the Grave and re-implemented Shade. That would certainly solve our “chain-CC’d into oblivion” issue without giving us more stability/vigor.
I actually already have stow weapons assigned to ] because I didn’t like running on my hind legs all the time as a charr.
Spectral Wall I have learned is a very useful skill in dueling situations, but placement of the skill means far more than any of our others. Placing it in the friendly zerg is probably more useful, given the ethereal field and long-lasting protection for those that recognize it for what it is. In objective taking situations, it may get swapped out, though it is handy to drop in an opened gate. Oddly, this skill, while stationary, does far more in a mobile fight than a stationary one in my experience.
Spectral Grasp, however, is a sure way to pick someone to die in ZvZ. In both of these cases, swapping for Epidemic is very much in the picture (especially if I land Dark Pact and immedietly follow up).
The problem with staff is, as you already mentioned, the fact that Greater Marks is just so necessary for it to be useful and I don’t want to give up Last Gasp or Furious Demise. If we had 10 more trait points, I would drop dagger/warhorn in all likelyhood and use staff instead.
As for using Givers, it’s so that I have universally doubled condition durations. I could probably make do with only 90% duration, I just like having the max possible duration. If they don’t cleanse, they are sitting for a very long time and if they do cleanse, I can usually just re-apply it.
Another strategy idea I’ve had is to pop Spectral Walk and Locust Swarm, use Dark Path to dive into the enemy zerg, follow it up with Life Transfer, possibly drop a Daze, the pop back to my start (the return function of Spectral Walk isn’t removed by death shroud).
And yes, condition clear is indeed a concern for me. I have half been considering a Sigil of Generosity/Purity on the dagger just to at least give something more than my healing skill.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Tooltip isn’t bugged as the cast time is indeed .75 seconds. The fire rate Jon mentioned also includes the .5 second aftercast delay.
Not saying it’s any good, just saying the tooltip is accurate.
In what universe is that .75 seconds?! Try to time the yellow cast bar and tell me that’s 0.75 seconds. What is “aftercast delay”? Do other classes have it?
Most skills have an aftercast delay. Only instant-cast skills do not (save a couple, like Corrupt Boon and Wall of Reflection). During that period, no skill (other than those same instant-cast skills) can be activated. GW1 had them too.
And yes, the yellow bar is .75 seconds to fill.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Tooltip isn’t bugged as the cast time is indeed .75 seconds. The fire rate Jon mentioned also includes the .5 second aftercast delay.
Not saying it’s any good, just saying the tooltip is accurate.
Yes I tested that both in PvP and on MoBs
That’s not what he asked. Did you just look at the tooltip or did you mouse over the condition icon on the enemy’s status bar/count the seconds? The tooltip won’t change, but the actual duration will.
Knight’s Gear prioritizes Toughness, so being squishy will not be happening. For WvW, the build is meant to do all right in both zerg and solo situations.
Also, Runes of the Mesmer do not combine well with the sigil (I.E., they don’t, at all) plus the Runes would remove my 100% condition duration.
The build is not, however, a power necro. It is primarily a condition necro, but with the non-damaging conditions. Crit damage is useless without Precision (and/or Fury, oth from Curses) to deliver said crits. As an aside, it’s not “+100% chill duration”, it is “+100% condition duration.” Fears are doubled too.
Signet of the Locust is fantastic. I currently run it all the time. However, between Warhorn and Spectral Walk (traited for both), movement speed is not an issue, and Spectral Walk gives me a stunbreaker. Flesh Wurm is likewise useful as a stunbreaker.
I am quite experienced with necro and its weaknesses (long cast times and slow projectiles are annoying, but not insurmountable).
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Well, the class with the lowest amount of self-combo potential is the Warrior (they only have a single fire field tied to the Longbow). Highest potential is probably the Guardian (two weapons that can self-combo, plenty of other fields) or Elementalist.
While I agree that we could use more finishers, it is honestly rather low on my concern list.
If you get used to combo, you won’t ever say that again. Learning to use combo field is one of the funniest thing in this game.
My secondary is a Hammer Guardian that spams blast finishers in the fields. Usually just getting retaliation, but I do appreciate the power of self-combos.
I’ve been working on getting Frostfang (still got a ways to go) as my first legendary (casual player, so yes, it is taking me a while). As such, I’ve been working on a build to use it in. I decided on a condition duration build to capitalize on the Sigil of Ice the weapon has as well as the other conditions we can get with relative ease.
The focus of the build is both WvW and PvP. I will post a version for each game mode that makes rather small changes to compensate for what is and isn’t available.
WvW:
Weapons: Frostfang, Givers Focus (sigil undetermined)/Berserker’s or Cleric’s dagger (sigil of Blood), Giver’s Warhorn (sigil of paralyzation)
Beserker’s Spear (Sigil of blood), Giver’s Trident (sigil of fire?)
Armor: Knight’s armor, 2*Lyssa, 2* Mad King, 2* undecided (likely Melandru or Monk/Water)
Precision/Toughness/Power ascended gear, Beserker’s backpiece. WvW vital and precise infusions on all gear.
Traits: 30/20/0/0/20.
Spite: Reaper’s Might, Chill of Death (Or Spiteful Talisman, since it will be fixed), Axe Mastery (likely swap to Close to Death, but the build is meant to showcase Frostfang)
Curses: Chilling Darkness, Banshee’s Wail (possible swap to Spectral Attunement)
Soul Reaping: Unyielding Blast, Spectral Mastery
Healing/Utilities/Elite: Consume Conditions, Spectral Grasp, Spectral Wall, Spectral Walk/Flesh Wurm, Plague
Foods: Superior Maitenence Oil, Rare Veggie Pizza
All condition duration is doubled, lettingg Chills really make an impression and vulnerability to stack up really high. As a bonus, Dark pact lands a 6 second immobilize on a target. Swapping a skill for Epidemic could make this particularly nasty. Plague becomes terrifying for small groups as anyone caught by it for the entire duration suffers 40 seconds of chill. 20 seconds of “can’t hit, heal, or run” is pretty potent, especially when the “can’t heal or run” lasts for twice that duration. General play is to chill and vulnerability stack, swapping to Death Shroud for some Life Blasts. If the situation is favorable for it, Dark Path in and swap to dagger. Pop Locust Swarm and stick on the target. If focused while in melee, pop Plague to disable the group.
PvP: As above, though prefixes, consumeables, and Ascended gear are removed. Runes are replaced with 2 Lyssa, 4 Lich. Condition duration is only +50%.
Sigils are replaced with Energy on the Focus and Hydromancer on dagger.
So, with Banshee’s Wail, Wail of Doom becomes an AoE 4 second daze I am strongly considering Spectral Attunement in WvW and Banshee’s Wail in PvP. Any suggestions for how to improve on the build or tips for playing it?
Well, the class with the lowest amount of self-combo potential is the Warrior (they only have a single fire field tied to the Longbow). Highest potential is probably the Guardian (two weapons that can self-combo, plenty of other fields) or Elementalist.
While I agree that we could use more finishers, it is honestly rather low on my concern list.
If we get more mobility skills, I really feel that they should require a target like Dark Path does. The reason why is that it stays with the devs vision that necros shouldn’t be very mobile, but should be very difficult to escape from.
Of course, they could just double the travel speed for Dark path and I’d be happy.
Had another idea for both a new condition and a DS 5 ability.
New condition:
Torpor: Abilities and actions take 50% longer to complete. (Fixed magnitude, stacks in duration, increases effect duration with % condition duration.)
Sounds nice, but this is not Necro at all! This is Mesmer. You just created Fustration.
Actually, closer to Faintheartedness.
If this condition did make it into the game, it would highlight the long casting time issue with necromancers so we might actually get some re-balancing done there. I can deal with suffering for a month or two to get some real buffs that we definitely need.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
They just fixed Greater Marks working with Staff Mastery.
that was faster than expected.
So, they can fix bugs in no time. If only they wanted to fix the others…
Not entirely. This time, they knew that the offending code had to be one of the few lines they changed in this past patch. Much shorter time to locate it and fix the issue. The others, there is more code to search through to solve the issue. Programming can often be a kitten.
HOLY MOTHER OF GRENTH!!!
Dwayna
What about daddy, do we go with the human artist or the undead dervish that wouldnt allow us to rez theory?
We know daddy was mortal, so that rules out Dhuum.
1. Traits merged (Reanimator+Protection of the Horde (though PotH can just be scrapped entirely and I wouldn’t care), Quickening Thirst+Dagger Mastery, Signet Power+Signet Mastery, Greater Marks+Staff Mastery)
2. Casting times for many skills reduced (especially life blast and Epidemic)
3. Siphoning to scale with healing power.
True enough. Even so, half the complaining I see about minions in WvW seems to be from folks that don’t recognize that they are no good in ZvZ and objective control (towers, keeps, and SM) situations, since they keep commenting that the minions die instantly. At least necros have the option of swapping for different utilities in that situation. Rangers don’t.
If you’re going into Curses, it’s for one of two reasons: either the Precision or the Condition damage. Given the number of on-crit effects that help a condition build, investing in Precision is a good move anyway. There’s a reason Rabid gear is so popular for necromancers.
As an aside, minion builds of any type will never work in WvW because of the massive amount of AoE. This is not a coding issue, this is an issue of recognizing the environment and adapting to it. Rangers have it way worse than necros in WvW because so much of their class’ power is wrapped up in the pet that dies before doing anything.
My persoanl suggestion on Protection of the Hoard is to replace it with something like:
Deadened Flesh
Gain Protection for 4 seconds on exiting Death Shroud
Still keeps in line with a “reducing damage” trait and is actually useable by all necro builds.
I could see it getting abusive with Near to Death for nearly perma-protection. However, that requires a minimum of 45 trait points to pull off what Hammer Guardians can do by just auto-attacking. Just food for thought, but it might be handy.
I think it should teleport behind the target and give a 1 second fear (scaring them toward the necro). The delay would ensure that it’s still not really any good for an interrupt, but it can help keep people from escaping the necromancer. I don’t believe minion conditions inherit any benefits from your traits or equipment, so even Terror-mancers wouldn’t make them super powerful.
Plus, it fits the name “Haunt” soooo much better.
Full of Life: Actually, 90% is a MUCH better time to get Regeneration. We aren’t at full, so the healing doesn’t go to waste, but we also have enough health left that we actually get the full benefit of the boon (assuming we don’t jump into death shroud, but that’s a different issue altogether). At 50% health, we will probably die before we get the full benefit, and definitely before we get the trait to trigger a second time in a fight.
Vampiric: 25 health per hit is pretty much crap, but it does add up given how many multi-hit skills we have (such as Life Siphon, Ghastly Claws, Locust Swarm, wells, the kittenloads of AoE, staff 1) Small amount, but it can be useful. I’d probably give this a D+, but only because it doesn’t scale with anything at all. Otherwise it would be a C.
Ritual of Life is pretty handy, since Well of Blood is the strongest healing skill in the game and is AoE. The version from this only ticks 6 times instead of 11, but it is still a very good support trait (and Ritual of Protection also applies here, giving whoever you revived the best situation to get back up in). I still rarely choose it due to preferring other traits, but in WvW, I strongly suggest trying it.
Bloodthirst should be re-evaluated as it works with Vampiric, Vampiric Precision, Vampiric Master, and Vampiric Ritual traits as well as Life Siphon (dagger 2), Life Leech (downed 1), Signet of the Locust, and Deadly Feast (Spear 3)
Transfusion is also a great support trait, since it heals nearly 3k to each ally in an area (292*9, subject to normal AoE cap)
I must be the only necro that actually likes Reanimator. Fast enough to get in and land a hit or two, durable enough to soak a couple of skills, and I’m a male charr so I don’t get annoyed by dumb lines when it dies. Also lives long enough to get between fights in most cases (save WvW where most minions are useless).
Plus, the minion AI is VERY predictable and easy to control. Bhawb and Bas did a very thorough overview of how their AI works. Since I watched their video, I’ve never had issues with minions standing around (Flesh Golem being the only exception, but I can force him into the fray anyhow).
And for the last time: Reanimator DOES NOT KEEP YOU IN COMBAT. This was fixed literally months ago!
Umm, weakness lessens the power of the target’s non-crits, not yours.
Withering Precision should always be swapped to underwater, since it is pretty handy there (lots and lots of multi-hit skills, and Lingering Curse is no good there). Weakness is generally a handy condition anyway (since it limits dodges in PvP and is good damage mitigation in PvE).
I wasn’t commenting on it as a source of damage, just as a source of life force. All I was refuting is that a condition build will only get 2% life force every 10 seconds when in reality, they will be getting at least three times that amount.
Some examples: the standard scepter/dagger condition build for necromancers only has a 2% life force generation every 10 seconds, making generating LF on these builds woefully inefficient. Increasing that to 2.2% contributes nothing. Period.
Although the tooltip doesn’t state it, Feast of Corruption is 2% life force +2% for each condition on the target. You can actually generate life force at a pretty good rate, given that just using scepter/dagger (no utilities, sigils, foods, or death shroud) you can get bleeding, poison, cripple and weakness on your target, so Feast of Corruption generates some pretty good life force (10% with just those, 11% with Gluttony).
Whats about the 40sec cooldown. Thats long.. and spectral walk gives me more mobility and lifeforce if you used right and still can safe me.
Consider that said 40 second cooldown is still 8 seconds faster than a traited Spectral Walk. You can trait it down to be 32 seconds as well.
Ignore those folks that say necro minions are useless. The AI has been drastically improved and they are now actually quite reliable (save Flesh Golem who still takes a bit longer to get into the fight). Two single-target hits will get all of your minions attacking that target quite well. People trying to initiate with Wells, Grasping Dead, Life Transfer, and Unholy Feast are the ones that have issues with the minions not responding, but that’s because the minions don’t know who to attack. Initiating with a couple of auto-attacks (or, surprisingly, a mark) get them to be very responsive.
That said, minions other than Flesh Golem and Flesh Wurm are still quite useless in WvW, but all pets are there due to the ridiculous amounts of AoE flying around.
Apparently the bonus damage that was added to spinal shivers on boon removal doesn’t work if this trait is taken as well, i haven’t done any testing personally but just the fact it’s half working, it’s just not worth taking at all.
They actually changed the sound on reapers touch as well, but didn’t even touch the broken trait.
No, they fixed the bonus damage for boon removal on the trait in the April patch.
So, since it seems people didn’t catch this detail the first time I said it: only Necrotic Slash. Just the first move in the auto-attack chain. This would avoid pumping up life-force that you get from Necrotic Stab and Bite (2nd and 3rd in chain).
Skills generating life force fill a percentage of your life force bar, not a percentage of the damage dealt.
It’s Dredlord. He doesn’t know how to be constructive from what I’ve seen.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Threat calculations vary from mob to mob, but in general, they target those with high armor, low health, and high damage. This is why Guardians can actually hold aggro so well, but it also explains why the Bone Fiend almost never escapes aggro (high armor, high damage, low health minion).
Try testing them in Heart of the Mists where the WvW bonuses don’t apply.
I would have if there was a PvP version of the rune.
Well, thx though… learned something again ^^
Never bothered with vampiric skills outside of the mists before.
I was referring to testing the traits, as the rune procs those.
I believe it procs when you first hit 90% and if it is a long drawn out battle it will go off again as long you are still below 90%, that is when the internal cooldown finishes.
This is correct. The trait is fairly handy in long battles.
I tested it in WvW and Cursed Shore, the siphoning amount was the same.
It would be. WvW bonuses apply in PvE and WvW. Try testing them in Heart of the Mists where the WvW bonuses don’t apply.
I tested it with 20 points in Blood Magic (Bloodthirst + Vampiric + Vampiric Precision)
A regular attack will get you 41 hp, Vamp Prec 55hp (don’t know why wikipedia says 38/51).
You’re not counting the WvW bonus healing effectiveness, which does apply to the necro traits.
Not that I approve so much of necromancy of this magnitude, but…
Stealing boons would be amazing…. but it is already a really good skill. I think the justification for it not stealing would be that it chills in addition to the removal and bonus damage. You can hope though.
How did you get stealing boons from his post? He wants Spinal Shivers to be unblockable.
Probably because the OP says “It should steal them and be unblockable”.
Grasping Vines is more closely parallelled to the Ranger elite (they have similar mechanics, and Grasping Vines was actually stronger back in Beta). Still strong, but this time actually weaker than the closer skill (though as it’s utility vs. elite, perhaps not a fair comparison).
Hidden Pistol is more similar to Quick Shot (Ranger Shortbow 3) and is by far inferior (twice the casting time, longer recharge, can’t be used on targets behind you, no Swiftness, shorter range)
Hounds of Balthazar is worse than any of the similar elites (Warband Support is on par with Thieves Guild, but has longer recharge). Flesh Golem is permanent and tankier with a great active, Spirit of Nature is tankier and has great abilities (including the active, but not limited to that), and Thieves Guild spam damage, blind, and pulls.
The others, I will agree with you on, I suppose. Become the X is most similar to Juggernaut, but because Juggernaut sucks so badly, the skills by virtue of being decent are way better.
Tornado would be good if the damage radius was at least as large (if not larger) as the knock-back radius. You can still use it to be extremely disruptive.
Since Elixer X is random between Juggernaut and Tornado, it’s not good, but that’s because the other two are not good.
It should be noted that Radiation Field is the ONLY racial skill that is superior to the profession skill it most closely mimics, which makes it odd in its own right. Not saying that CPC doesn’t need a buff (Very much it does), just that Radiation Field is an outlier.
I, for one, would like to see the cloud pulse each second (currently it pulses once every 3 seconds, making it pretty worthless) and have something in it that plays up the CORROSIVE part of its name. Damage, boon stripping, blindness, or even vulnerability, I don’t care, but something needs to be there to say “Hey, this is more than just nastier than normal poison”.
Most power builds want 15 in Curses anyway, not just for the precision, but also the Fury on Death Shroud.
I could deal with it having a chain, though (1 second blind on the last hit would be sweet and give the axe an actual role), or cutting down the cast time for the skill to 1/2 second from its current 3/4 second.
Just throwing this out there, but the downed #1 is what I would like to know on regarding healing scaling.
Timing for me is best between 8 and 10 PM EDT. Would love to get in on some all necro runs after I did a 4 necro/1 ranger Honor of the Waves run a while back.
Quite the disruption against zergs, isn’t it? Even better now that Chilling Darkness works with it.
Ah, what I forgot to mention: As a necro, you don’t need to be a glass canon to deal high damage.
You also don’t need to take the power/crit route for it.Please elaborate. Are you referring to the Rabid + Undead/Centaur/Afflicted/Krait setup when you say you don’t need to go the power/crit route or are you referring to something else?
Minions can do pretty significant damage, so that may be the route he’s referring to.
Not what I would recommend, necessarily, but it is at least an option that many classes don’t have (Rangers are the only one that can really out-do necros with that style).
I always pop the Mark of Horror when I’m in Lich Form just because 5 bodies from one skill is quite handy.
Eh the projectile doesn’t go over 1200…I can’t hit the ice wall in front of Jormag with it, while I can with Mesmer GS#1.
That ice wall is not a good indicator since the targetting on it is janky. The staff 1 has a max range of about 1400, but anything beyond 1200 range won’t trigger the auto-attack chain, so you would have to mash 1. It is, however, quite useful in the harpy fractal.