Guild Wars 2

If we can only move while casting shield 5.

I have always wanted you… the loot bags.

“L2P”

- Cheesing Thief

Elaboration:

“L2WhackThinAir”

I saw this warrior afk in WvW. I was auto attacking him with Mesmer staff. Literally no damage dealt.

What is cooldown? What is target? Where is this instagib ability?

Zero Day.2594:

Eloquence.5207:

You can see Warriors coming at you. Warrior attacks wildly telegraphed. Try again.

Thieves can expect no negative outcome in a fight. It’s either: you win or you retreat safely.

So… you’re saying you’ve never seen a dead thief before?
(Every single class/person can disengage from a fight and ditch.)

Warriors are the poster boy of GW2. See: WvW loading screen.

When in doubt, pick a warrior. You might not be the best of the best in every situation, but you certainly won’t be the worst of the worst.

You can see Warriors coming at you. Warrior attacks wildly telegraphed. Try again.

Thieves can expect no negative outcome in a fight. It’s either: you win or you retreat safely.

I’m sure every profession has a method or two to disengage and escape. I know it still boils down to positioning.

By “sticky situations”, I mean scenarios where it is 1vX. Who has the highest chance of retreating, or scaring enemies away? Who can effectively deal with a havoc group raining down conditions and damage on you?

Guardian can survive the initial onslaught. You may stand your ground(no pun intended) and cleanse conditions. However, once the skills go on cooldown, it’s likely over. No foot speed to run away. The non-targeted leaping ability has 600 range only. You are likely to be kited in an attempt to fight back.

With Mesmers, things are easier especially with a PU build. Conditions will still screw you up if you don’t escape the combat zone soon enough.

Warriors are obviously juggernauts.

I’m not familiar with Engis, but I’ve tried to chase one down once. Who know how many boons he had up through the entire chase.

I’m not familiar with Eles either. They can play around with 20 skills, so there’s got to be something for every situation. Is this only the case for D/D Eles? I was hoping a caster.

“L2whack-a-thief scrubs”

Give each profession more options to reveal stealth, and/or give visual feedback when stealth players are hit (damage, bleed, burn, etc).

1337 thieves won’t be affected since they have uber high skill ceiling already. #MLG

1337 thieves don’t require constant stealth as a crutch amirite?

Eggyokeo.9705:

Snow leopard ftw

ranger.

for initial disengage
Short bow 3 + lightning reflexs turn and gs 3 on recharge
and then there is the 1h sword a pain to get use to but great at disengaging
fall damage trait produces a soft cc, so i escape alot by running of a ledge then using gs3

Enlighten me please. I don’t see many condi removals.

Once again, give the players some kind of feedback when they deal against stealth. Otherwise, “whack a thief” is not a very entertaining game.

Necro and Engi can spread teh plague.

Ele can feel important via attunement dance.

Rangers feed loot bags.

Thanks for the replies.

I was thinking about Ele because I want to try a profession who can spam AoE damage from the back line. D/D Ele wouldn’t fit that criteria.

At least Warriors can pew pew with long bow >.>

Disclaimer: I will not play a Thief because I want to retain my dignity.

As title asked, which profession is best at handling sticky situations. Who can conveniently 1. cleanse conditions and 2. escape/survive/fend off groups.

Here are some of the professions with which I am more familiar:

1. Guardian
+ Heals and active protection skills available
+ Many condition removal traits
- Long cool down; susceptible to lock down even after the initial condi removal
- Too slow to run away; short range gap-closers

2. Mesmer
+ Illusions will distract your opponents
+ Stealth available
- Limited condition removal
- Limited swiftness; no “leaping” skills other than blink (takes up utility slot too)

3. Ranger
+ Your pet can draw some attention away from you
+ You can dump all the nasty effects on your pets
+ Lots of swiftness available
- Not too many active condition removal
- Ranger

On paper, it seems like Engi and Ele are good against opponents who chain conditions (chill, cripple, immobilize, etc.) on you. How do they perform in practice?

Thieves (or anyone else) won’t like it when their crutch is removed from the game.

Let us see damage numbers when we hit them in stealth.

6 non-thieves had to spend 20 minutes whacking thin air on top of a keep in EB. HUrr durr stealth rez the mesmer. Now it’s time to catch 2 invisible rats.

Morfedel.4165:

I’m curious… how would you do stealth differently?

Just throwing ideas out there.

In other games (not necessarily MMORPGs), stealth comes with a fade-time.

Stealth usually has some type of direct counter from skills/items. The current stealth disruption trap is just silly.

Certain condition/debuff should interrupt stealth. It’d would be hard to do this in GW2 because AoE skills everywhere.

Dahkeus.8243:

Do you prefer fast-paced gameplay with an emphasis on positioning and movement or do you prefer more tactical gameplay with an emphasis on choosing the right ability for the right situation?

That’s an interesting way to glorify thieves lol.

Suddenly Thieves players don’t dodge.

Zacchary.6183:

LordByron.8369:

I think you should post this in thief forum and ask them …. good thief players (those you can t kill) will explain you are wrong.
Expecially for www some called this build a paraphrase of “beginner friendly”.

It isn’t beginner friendly. The low HP and Armor means that the player does not have any room for mistakes. Most of their traits and stat allocation will be focused on damage so they wont have very many survivability traits, if at all.

Since thieves lack decent healing and condition removal, killing them is a matter of who hits the hardest first. A little bit of situation awareness and timing will go a long way.

Pop stealth. Create separation. Healing + condition removal.

Who is going to spot you, let alone chase you?

A you a troll/bully irl? If yes, play Thief.

Re: PU Mesmers

A PU Mesmer (20/20/30/0/0) does not have the burst, CC, or chasing capability to down you or put you in critical condition in a short session. They thrive on a passive/defensive usage of stealth. Clones destroyed? No damage given. Staff and Torch phantasms are relatively weak in terms of killing power. Do Mesmers have convenient access to speed boost while in stealth? No. Do they have condition removal? Yes, just the one from Torch (30 or 24s CD).

Re: Thief

One Thief is manageable by certain class setups. Trolled by a group of Thieves? Alt-F4. Manageable means: you don’t die, but you won’t win.

Is it still 20/20/30/0/0?

I’ve fought a PU mesmer that pops confusion every time a clone dies, so I’m guessing it’s something on the lines of 10/25/30…

Is it worth giving up shorter torch cd and condi removal for confusion?

Running 0/5/30/30/5 with lots of shouts at the moment. My party and I can survive quite well.

Still struggling on the offensive side. I feel like all of my control skills (aside from scepter 3) are too predictable. Both the cool down and cast time are so high. Even when I do manage to land them, my opponents have easy access to escape skills.

I’ve noticed anything in this game that is related to an AI is at least half stupid.

Maybe they should just dumb it down. Every spirit weapon stays near you, and will strike your vicinity periodically. The bow would of course shoot something afar.

“Guardian’s-super-holistic-healing-signet” :P

Serious guess: healing symbol.

What happens when you CnD a clone?

Travlane.5948:

Ironvos.9014:

While people are saying a thief cant do damage while in stealth.
The mesmer can also not do damage to a thief while he is in stealth.
All our skills require a target and we have no aoe, shatters require a target aswell.

So, if both thief and mesmer are stealthed, noone can damage eachother.
If only thief is stealthed, noone can damage eachother.
If only mesmer is stealthed, thief can still damage the mesmer and mesmer can damage the thief.
If none is stealthed, both can damage eachother .

again…another person that this coversation is over your head. its not about thief vs mesmer. its about stealth. and how much dmg each can do while in stealth. mesmer can do lots. thief can do none. problem? yes.

How much damage? Not enough to put you in critical condition.

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

For zergs watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0fxuoJGdGs

For roaming, it all comes down to playing to your builds strengths. It sounds to me you are going for an AH, tanky build, reliant on boons for sustain and POV for condi removal?

I have tried many builds. For PvE I can get away with something like 20/30/x/x/x. I can dish out damage while maintain a healthy rotation of protection skills. For WvW, anything works to be to be honest. Almost anything I do is beneficial to the team.

I’m having trouble finding the right traits and weapons sets for roaming. I’ve tried a build where I grabbed as many retaliations as I could. Let’s just say it sounded better on paper lol.

Maybe I am too used to professions that can kite. I find myself dying quite a bit with Guardian in small 1vX or small clashes in WvW. In zergs. I want to L2P, please show the way.

My problems with Guardian:
1. Low mobility. I must win a fight or scare people away (in that case, I wouldn’t be able to chase after them). Escape is not an option because:
2. Long cool down. I can survive the initial onslaught from my enemies with protection and aegis. However, once those wear off (and they do wear off quickly), I am pretty much a sitting duck. Physical attacks I can deal with, but condition damage are troublesome; especially with my low health pool (even with armors and traits I cap out at ~20K HP).
3. The window of opportunity to burst my opponents is quite small. I feel like I lose a lot of damage and boon because my opponent can just dodge out of symbols.

How do you sustain as a Guardian? Are they better healers in groups than they are by themselves? AH heals for like 70. Symbol heals ~150/pulse. Virtue ticks for 100/s. Dodge roll heals for ~150. I feel all these healing abilities are easily negated by both burst and condition damage, given that the Guardian is always in the thick of a battle.

TL;DR: Guardians are claimed to be nearly immortal (even if they don’t skill people), but I can’t seem to achieve that.

Wow

Such vigor

Many initiatives

Pyroatheist.9031:

Eloquence.5207:

Liston.9708:

Some classes and builds are better for those small groups. I don’t roam enough to know myself, but mesmer’s with all their dang clones seem to have fun in small groups.

Too slow, they are.

Get a focus swap, centaur runes, traveler runes, trait blink, learn to effectively do phase retreat jump swaps…mesmers can be exceptionally fast.

I hate weapon swaps. I also hate the idea of spending my life savings so I can be on par with other professions in terms of mobility.

No direct stealth nerf is needed. Give every profession convenient ways to reveal stealth. Stunned? Reveal. Dazed? Reveal. Null field? Reveal. Burned? Reveal.

On the flip side, how would you kite a Warrior in the first place? The ones I’ve encountered on WvW shrugs off conditions like nothing. Maybe it’s the food…

Liston.9708:

Some classes and builds are better for those small groups. I don’t roam enough to know myself, but mesmer’s with all their dang clones seem to have fun in small groups.

Too slow, they are.

Whenever I try to do the “small group” things like roaming, escorting yaks, and defending camps, I ended up getting trolled by thieves and/or warriors.

Zergs? Blob vs blob. Great fun >.>

May I trade my Guardian scepter for your thief short bow?

messiah.1908:

i think the main issue is mesmer can go stealth while doing dmg and have 3 clones so hard to choose which to hit first and being punished with more conditions and thief just cannot
the issue who which is better depends on player level and not on stealth alone

also the basic 20,20,30,0,0 build of mesmer can give mesmer 2 stunbreak with decoy and blink, 2 condition removal with trait cleansing conflagration and have perma vigor, and regeneration, aegis and protection thus why everyone going after that PU build and know and admit its cheesy

check mesmers forum

I will offer a tip that Thief pR0z used to give me: L2P

Yeah, the build can be annoying, but a dolyak could run away from PU Mesmer (or mesmers in general).

They can’t chase you.

But how useful are you in a karma train?

I’m tired of seeing my bags run away in WvW. I hear Warrior bros have good mobility, so that’s a good start.

What build would your recommend for CC? I’m not necessarily looking for hurrr durrr stun-gorilla build. Ensnare, cripple, or chill will work too.

TL;DR: please suggest a build that can provide excellent mobility and reliable CC.

ps: a Cool down > 40 seconds would not count as reliable.

Travlane.5948:

Qaelyn.7612:

Thief and mesmer is all I’ve played so far. And yes, mesmers are a pain in a lot of ways.

But I spar a lot with people who can absolutely tear me apart. It’s all gameplay experience. With mesmers success depends on learning to read the tells and pick the player out from among the distractions. Practice doing that by watching behavior and even spectating other fights.

BS. mesmers enter stealth and RARELY RARELY RARELY EVER get revealed. they are also in stealth a good 60% of a fight. this is a condi spec but still. bs.

Torch stealth: 30 (24) seconds CD
Decoy: 40 s CD
Veil: 90 (72) s CD
Mass invisibility 90 s CD

The last two skills are probably used during initiation or escape. It’s not like a Mesmer can “kitten kitten BACK STAB YOU FOR 7K” and get away with minimal to no risk.

Mesmers have to use their stealth much more strategically than thieves. Thieves? Pffft.

style.6173:

Saying strongest class is not really the best question since each class has different builds that are stronger than others.

To play along with the thread though, the strongest 1v1 class is mesmer.

Build?

I’ve read the skill descriptions on Necromancers, and it seems like their swiftness skills all have 30-40s cooldowns. Besides, I already have a tough-to-kill character with my Guardian.

Currently I am debating between Thief and Warrior. The Thief obviously excels at its niche, and that is high mobility and single target burst. The Warrior isn’t too shabby as it has quite a few options for leaps, and a passive MS boost trait. Plus, the Warrior is more versatile in other regards like zerging and team-play. My worry is that a Warrior might be too similar to a Guardian.

For those who say Mesmer, what build do you use?

http://www.gw2armor.com/

I don’t think there is a “dress-up doll” out there, but that site gives you a pretty clear idea of what each armor set looks like.

Fistful Of Bacon.3046:

I would actually suggest an engi, they have insane amounts of snares, cripples, blinds, pushes, pulls, etc. While still applying lots of good dps condis like confusion, poison, bleeds, burn, and also doing decent physical damage if you prefer it.

Engis look quite difficult to play. It’s like an Elementalist on crack.

Kuduka.3860:

You should try a necromancer

While I do like to inflict all the nasty conditions on my enemies, necros do have one major flaw which I hate: slow travelling speed.

I have actually leveled a Necro to level 20, but I found the weapons awkward to use (probably because I’m too used to having a reliable burst option).