Guild Wars 2

Ok. In exchange, I expect the following to reveal a Thief:

1. Successful blocks (duh)
2. Burning effect (flame = bright)
3. Nearby pets (hounds have good sense of smell)

Those make sense from a lore perspective.

Inb4 Thief players posting a wall-o-text on stability, condition, Warriors, RF, and nerfs.

After like 6 posts of back-and-forth exchanges, there is still not a single build mentioned/linked.

Melee attacks have no weight, maybe except for Warrior’s Hammer F1.

“Dodge” is a glorified invulnerability frame as others have pointed out.

Deep down, the combat is still a pew pew auto attack, tab targeting; however, ANET did a decent job disguising it.

AoE skills instagib Thieves.

L2P

/s

I /laugh when a fully stacked Thief died to my up-leveled Warrior.

Two reason:

1. He/she/it died with a Thief
2. Lol look at what Anet has done to Warriors

Unfortunately, you need to employ the same tactic against Thieves.

“Predicting” is an euphemism for guessing, which is another way of saying “whack-a-mole”

Thieves in this thread = true Scotsmen.

No true Scotsman would take advantage of the current initiative system!

Wahhhhh please don’t change my profession.

In WVW, can you handle losing to other interweb strangers? Do you like them stomping on your corpse?
If the answers are “no”, pick Thief.

Best case scenario: you are 1337, you pwn everyone with skillz, and you tell everyone on the forum to L2P.

Worst case scenario: you run away on low hp.

^Confirmation bias and self-fulfilling prophecy will do that to you.

I’d rather see a new ranged weapon.

Holy rifle? lol
Longbow? Meh

Change the scepter!

I love seeing nick beards’ true colors in these type of discussions.

It’s not OP if I personally play that build/profession. The burden of L2P is on you. Huehue

Rengaru.4730:

Sir Kaboomski.1508:

If you practice you could probably get used to knowing where the thief will land at the end of the leap and anticipate it. If you have ground target skills thats where you want to put them unless you can begin a channel on the thief before the heartseeker ends and applies stealth. If you do this the channel will continue to hit while the thief is stealthed.

The thing is, you have to waste an AoE to get rid of the blind first, and after that the thief could be anywhere so good luck with that.

“Working as intended. Thieves are suppose to be the elusive profession. Otherwise, they’d be Warriors in medium armor. Read the description.

PS: I have personally killed thieves EZ because I L2P"

Back-pedal with me guys!

12th letter
Second number
16th letter

Galsia.4102:

Stealth Thieves Still OP

Bad Players Still Terrible

I see you are a GW2 prodigy.

Oh wait… Thief, Warrior AND Engi

urieldhynne.2743:

godz raiden.2631:

Yeah, thieves need to have all of their viable builds toned down so they have no viable builds. That’s the definition of balance!

-There is no balance in this game at all.

-Your viable build is a trololo build.

-I faced a lot of VIABLE thief without stealth spamming.

You want perma invisibility, that is all.

I predict you will receive the following types of replies:

- L2P
- Ad hominem
- Redirecting the topic to Warriors

Gorani.7205:

Of all the abilities listed here stealth stomping is by far the superior variant.
As long as downed state is such a faulty game mechanic (you lose target, can’t see conditions on you) it enhances stealth even more.
We need some sort of “reveal” ability for professions beyond “Sick’em” (which was introduced later, btw) and “Unveiling shot” + “Stealth disruptor trap”.

Those abilities are called “L2P” and logical fallacies.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Get use to my friend, and unfortunately is the same people that creates the same hate thief topics.

Anet will never change drastically the mechanic because they have of course real good players that test all for them and they know that this mechanic is not op.

I agree with you, is just toxic for this community to keep making the same threads, moderators should delete all the complain threads and create only one. but for real.

Can’t argue with logic.

Logical fallacy that is.

I think GW2 can use a Demon Hunter:

1. High burst capability
2. High active defence and mobility
3. Spammable skills and stealth
4. Ability to guarantee critical damage

Oh wait…

Bowflex.4502:

This thread is getting stupid.

And you have been so useful /s

I’ve personally given countless great arguments, counters, build suggestions and justifications that have been dismissed or ignored, by the original poster, fortus.

Not really.

It’s clear everyone will just have to agree to disagree. This thread serves no purpose because no matter what you tell him, his childish and narrow minded mind is set.

Pot calling kettle black.

He wants to be able to pvp with a pve build on any class and not run Into any issues with the highest single target burst damage dealer in the game (the thief)

I’m sorry if you missed the entire point of the thread. Oh well, can’t expect much from a macho forum warrior.

Not only is this purely silly, it voids all of his arguments. Despite what he may think.

Glass canon thieves don’t run into a match and go 20 and 0 on kills. They die more than they kill. If you have to be running around as a glass cannon clothier and get 2 shot that’s your problem. You’ve already said that outside a thief you have no problems, so statistically you’re already doing better than the thief as a glass cannon build.

But please keep posting new threads crying about how awful your experiences are. I’m starting to enjoy it.

I’m starting to enjoy the irony too.

P.S my main is an elementalist. Over 2000 hours clocked. I also play my engineer a lot more than my thief. I have zero problems with either.

Hmmm, another salient point to this conversation. /s

Then again I don’t try to play my ele in a pve spec and or gear. I’m not stupid, or silly enough to complain when it doesn’t work.

“Disagreement = complaint”

- “If you nerf stealth, we will be left with no defence!!11!!”
- “Why don’t you fix Warriors first or PU Mesmers first!”
- “L2P”
- “Stealth is working as intended… L2P”
- “Stealth trap”
- “Stack toughness” <—— HAHAHHAHHAHA
Pick one, or all of them.

OT: this thread is so ironic. There are better places to commence circlejerks:

1. Reddit
2. Thief forum

"

- “If you nerf stealth, we will be left with no defence!!11!!”
- “Why don’t you fix Warriors first or PU Mesmers first!”
- “L2P”
- “Stealth is working as intended… L2P”
- “Stealth trap”
- “Stack toughness” <—— HAHAHHAHHAHA
Pick one, or all of them.

"

T raw.4658:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

T raw.4658:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

T raw.4658:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

T raw.4658:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

T raw.4658:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

And again you take the easy way out.

What’s it called if you repeat the same action (aka counter arguing this same topic) over and over again expecting a different result?

If you aren’t willing to do so, don’t bother to post in the first place.

You’re trying to kill an extremely enjoyable fight for me.

ofc I’ll say something

I’m not trying to kill anything. I’m trying to promote skillful play by pointing out mechanics that don’t reward skillful play and even punish it and presenting a possible way to remedy that.

You start posting on this thread, insult me, post volumes worth of ad hominem (which you then claim is a fake latin phrase), and then avoid actually debating me on the issue at hand to the point that I begin to doubt that you actually have an argument behind all of your mindless personal attacks. Of course I’ll take issue with that.

In your ignorance you will be killing skillful counter play that currently exists. You’ve been told repeatedly how this is so. You keep choosing to ignore said counter plays and continue posting to destroy it.

You also wanna incorrectly use kewl latin phrases hoping that it will deceive people into believing your idea is something more than redressed rubbish. This also seems to be your tactic of choice when an informed person (Me) pulls your card and calls your bullkitten.

I’m liking the new appeal to the mods because I’m a mean poster tactic you seem to want to take as well.

You need to follow the ToS on these forums honestly.

First your idea is spam. We’ve all read this thread a hundred times already.

Second you’ve obviously didn’t search the forum since w/e info you need to tell you why your spam idea is bad for the game has been posted a bazillion times already.

Ad hominem is a technical term, which is by now so far dissociated from Latin that understanding what I mean by it can be likened to understanding the meaning of “P.S.”, which is an abbreviation of post script, another Latin term. It’s pretty common, to the point that I’m shocked that you think using it is an attempt to make my calling you out on doing it sound prettier.
Here’s a few links: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ad-hominem.html
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ad%20hominem

More importantly, you tricked me into thinking I had actually posted something within the last month that could remotely imply that I thought thieves were OP, because there was a point in time where I legitimately thought that and posted moderately frequently on it. Turns out the last post of that nature was on February 25th, when I said that stealth was bad for the game in it’s current implementation, five pages into my post history, and I don’t remember you being around on the forums then. That makes this the first comment I’ve made on thief balance in close to two months, and I have not once claimed that thief was overpowered at any point in this thread.

So actually, every single time I have claimed that you were using ad hominem arguments in this thread I have been wrong. Ad hominem arguments, while still fallacious, are at least truthful.

Wow…..I think you should delete this one mate.

I dare you, go read through my post history. I guarantee you, you will be unable to find a post that says there is a problem with thieves outside of this thread until page five.

Shouldn’t have posted this either mate.

Lets get a close or let this one die due to proposal getting exposed.

You shouldn’t have posted that, bud.

Guess what is more toxic than stealth + back stab in-game? Thief apologists misdirecting discussions on the forums!

Bowflex.4502:

You can’t balance a game to the lowest common denominator, or for people playing on subpar connections, competitive play just doesn’t work like that.

And referencing rogues in world of Warcraft, and their combo points is moot. Because their burst is ambush, which has no warning, and requires no combo points, and with shadow dance is useable out of stealth. Even more so, rogues can sit in stealth till they choose to come out, not just from melee or steal range, for the most part like in gw2.

I’m all for a discussion, so long as the points being raised are factual, and not biased.

Quick question, how do you think thieves feel about other thieves hitting them that hard? Considering our lower health pool? We aren’t immune to it either.

Now between stealth range, steals range, seconds you can effectively spend in stealth, aoes that are ground targeted such as necro marks, or ele fronts, knock backs, blocking mechanics, traits that make you unable to take a percentage of your health in one hit, new gm traits, like the ele’s that make them uncrittable, the key bind or ability to about face, the fact that 99% of thief openers are done after the steal, and before the cloak and dagger, or after the blind powder, and after the heart seeker….

Thieves don’t run around IN stealth and open with a backstab, unless it’s some cheese build in wvw, but that’s a different thing altogether.

Yet you’re still saying there’s. NO counters. At least acknowledge or argue the ones that are brought to your attention, rather than dismiss them or ignore them completely.

“It doesn’t work” isn’t an argument. Because many non thieves disagree with you.

You are only content if someone agrees with you.

Lol, can’t believe you have the audacity to say “You are only content if someone agrees with you”.

Ahahaha

Excuse me, I love a good irony. Thanks.

Zero Day.2594:

oZii nailed it there /thread

How cute.

Bowflex.4502:

To quote areanet on their last class sum up

“Thief
Thieves are the masters of mobility, stealth and high single target damage. They can be very fragile if you counter their stealth with area of effects or large stacks of conditions, but they trade this fragility in order to have some of the highest burst damage in the game. They are able to help allies through traps, venoms and the mobility to flank most encounters.”

Tldr; l2p

Now go read the other profession descriptions.

Go read the “manifesto” while you are at it.

TL;DR: you are making BS claims based on, well, BS.

Bowflex.4502:

Klonko.8341:

As a main ranger, i find really frustrating that cloak and dagger works on pets… its like a free stealth mechanism on top of the already OP F1 they get when stealing from ranger.

Is it only me or it is a problem for everyone?

You can’t be serious right. Why the kitten shouldn’t we be able to CnD your pet. This whole thread is absurd.

If your pets able to attack me and be targeted I should be able to use any skill I want on it. This thread HAS to be a troll. No one can possibly be this kittened.

Oh…yeah
Your pet shouldn’t be able to keep attacking me after I stealth.

You are serious right? Why shouldn’t pets be able to attack you after you stealth? A well-trained war hound can detect your stinky butt in stealth

Oh yeah… troll/defensive response from Thief #420

Clones, pets, minions, other players, guards, and NEUTRAL CREEPS. In WvW, you have ample of options to CnD mid fight.

Cast time on Shadow Refuge? Boo-freakin-hoo. Compare that to any skill from any other class.

Stealth combo hard to execute? Don’t worry, you still have initiative. You aren’t severely hindered by cool-downs, unlike EVERY OTHER CLASS.

Hmm… you can’t execute stealth combos? I’m sorry, you are just showing your inexperience as a Thief player.

ANet should ditch the whole initiative system for a day. Let’s see what happens to Thieves when they have regular cool downs.

Dog.1472:

I will at least give Fortus credit for being a very determined person. No matter how many months go buy it’s always the same QQ. I just hope I’m not the only person who notices all of these thread are made by the same guy.

Anyway as always yes thieves can be countered. There are other people who explain how easy it is to do, please read their posts. All we have here is one guy who refuses to to change his own playstyle and adapt to others.

I’ve noticed it is the same Thief players who are wilfully ignorant/arrogant when it comes to any constructive discussion revolving their precious class. They don’t contribute anything to the discussion rather than spewing “L2P” nonsense and regurgitating the same “counters” which have been debunked numerous times (please go read them).

All we have are Thief players who refuse to give up their abusive playstyle in return for more gameplay variety that will benefit the whole community.

Big Tower.5423:

Thief are left useless this patch, i personally lost 42% damage rendering my thief completly obsolete. Shelved my thief and rerolled engi.

A cheeser stays a cheeser. Good job!

- “If you nerf stealth, we will be left with no defence!!11!!”
- “Why don’t you fix Warriors first or PU Mesmers first!”
- “L2P”
- “Stealth is working as intended… L2P”
- “Stealth trap”
- “Stack toughness” <—— HAHAHHAHHAHA

Pick one, or all of them.

Waffler.1257:

EvilSardine.9635:

It’s pretty sad how effective 5>2>1 is. You can be a horrible player and do pretty kitten decent when ONLY doing this combo. You can literally do nothing else except the combo above and kill most classes.

Just because you get owned by thief players doesn’t mean they are OP, go make a thief and l2p please. Thief class takes a lot of skill to play correctly so most of the thief players are really good, which is why people complain about them a lot.

What kind of mental gymnastics is this? A new acrobatics trait? Gee, Thieves are polluting the community in-game and out-of-game!

If you want the happy-go-lucky circlejerk, go on Reddit.

Please don’t change stealth. I need my cheese.

Thanks.

- Pro Thief.

#lolL2P

Play Thief. Join blob gate. Be a master ruseman, level 99 tr0le.

/laugh
/laugh
/laugh

Forget about winning because ANet empowers the dairy farmers.

Just roll a Thief yourself and have fun doing nothing.

Which cheese class could I play if you nerf mah stealth?

Don’t be so dense. If stealth is tweaked (nerfed), other areas of the Thief will be upgraded.

As it stands, stealth is a convenient crutch for Thief and, to certain extent, Mesmer.

SirDrygan.1823:

get killed by a thief? no problem. Respawn, run back with a zerg, and mow him over….

ok, seriously, stop whining about thief…. thief by definition is a class that uses stealth and running away…… if they want to use that to their advantage, that’s their right, since it is in their skill set….. nothing kitten wrong about it…..

but the kitten wrong about it is the insane healing which is absurdly OP……… other than that, nothing wrong with thief………

I wonder which dairy farmer class you play.

You can beat thieves if you are Jean-Claud Van Damme. Check my sig.

In WvW, pick the dude/dudette who can go invisible (and often). That’s the ultimate crutch. True, a Guardian is tanky, but you’d still be a sitting duck that takes 2 or 3 more hits.

Same tune in every thread involving Thieves.

“OP needs to L2P”

Thief.

No aegis. No protection. No good condi removal/stability. 24/7 nerf.

Needs to play perfectly. Stealth is 2EZ2counter.

Initiative management > cool down management.

Waahhhhh

Le Thief. You don’t have long range burst in the most traditional sense. You can cover a long distance in a short time to stabbity-stab-stab.

hihey.1075:

Oslaf Beinir.5842:

It is quite popular; the most forgiving toon when used in glass cannon next to warrior due to reseting fights effectivly, good access to evade, high mobility, stealth, teleports, unseen burst with no cooldown except revealed’s and because stealth itself can be traited and improved to grant 100% crit chance, condi removal, aoe blind, regen and increased movement. not all builds could combine that into a single build and still have crazy burst but boardland bloodlust, sigil stacks, consumables, guard buffs could compensate pretty well for that. unlike warriors who will outrun u and could see laughing at your petty attempts to chase them but at least u know they’re gone while a thief could leave you puzzled where they might have ran to, in which direction or if they even ran at all only for them to strike out of nowhere with the upper hand. D/P is the most popular and forgiving. it offers all the surviveability a thief needs built into the set. I personally dont mind them when they’r alone but if they got a partner then I’d just find an ally, npc or run away somewhere.

i used to run ele and ranger in wvw but those two are thief baits so i stopped. I once ate a 9k cloak and dagger+ sigil of fire proc+steal and my ele was downed even before the actual backstab could hit me. i have an easier time with mesmer warrior and engi. if you want to stand a chance against them run bunker ranger with apothecary but the good ones would just run away.

You really have no clue on how thieves work. Typical post of WvW baddies who don’t know anything about the game and still write WoT to try looking cool and experienced.

You must be a beacon of credibility with all that 1337 toons and a group of buttbuddies.