Guild Wars 2

Ralkuth.1456:

Spartacus.3192:

Huskyboy.1053:

Because it only costs 10 energy and has no CD. In other words, it’s spammable to no end.

Incoming Rev nerf, changing energy cost to 30 with 10 s CD.

While we’re having this discussion can we nerf Surge of the Mists again just to be extra sure?

Ok but let’s put alacrity on it to make it balanced!!

Because it only costs 10 energy and has no CD. In other words, it’s spammable to no end.

Hot Boy.7138:

i don’t think i’ve faced a bunker rev yet. And i really don’t know much about rev’s in general. How are they surviving?

They’re able to decap and eventually fullcap against a 1v2. 1v3 maybe not. So it’s not just holding the cap, it’s actually fullcapping under pressure. Most people don’t play them because they’re not meta and quite boring, but they’re super effective against power comps.

I have played my last 3 games against a duo both playing bunker rev… it’s nearly impossible to beat unless you stack 2 condi necros minimum. I’ve been playing them in unranked so I don’t care that much at the moment, but this could be a big issue in ranked. It goes for really any bunker build, but 2 bunker revs invalidate a power-based team, whereas bunker guard does not.

Anyways this is another example of where class stacking can become a huge problem, as the strengths of some builds are magnified when there are two people playing it. This really isn’t the most difficult issue to fix.

These changes, especially QoL changes to the lobby, are wonderful. We don’t always get what we want, but I’d say that Anet is making a strong effort to make sPvP better and keep it fresh. Thanks and I hope you guys keep up the effort!

bluri.2653:

flow.6043:

bluri.2653:

lmao you seriously need to get better. Ele/Nec is prolly second strongest duo in spvp atm. As much as i think posi is mental check his youtube that guy plays vanilla nec SOLO and does wonders with it. When he duo with ele he easily reaches top20 in EU

Top 20 can be easily reached with any duo.
Also, as opposed to other classes, the necro elite spec is only an upgrade in PvE, but in PvP it’s really a sidegrade. So doing well with a core necro isn’t a big deal either.

Now here’s the irony in your post:
You’re basically saying the issue is l2p instead of with the class, and regarding almost every necro thread on this forum I would agree with you.
But the fact that you mention Posi as your benchmark for how well necro could be played does reflects the underdog-ness of the class.
I’m not saying Posi is bad, but think about how many more good players you could name that main other classes. And how many of those you’d consider to be a more valuable team asset.

Anyway, the good ol’ “ele – necro duo” argument is about as lame and ignorant as all the complaints about how weak necros are.

Ok, show me. Get top20 at end of season. Why does it reflect the underdog-ness of the class? Posi barely plays this game and hasn’t for months and streams some core necro and absolutely demolishes people because he actually can play. Also the reason I use him as benchmark is because he actually has footage of him playing which no other necro has.

How is this argument lame? That nec-ele duo is one of the best duos. And also the best 2v2 in the game?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj-XQizU4oBtCc4yBck5emA/videos
https://www.twitch.tv/posisn/videos/all

His point is that necro can’t fill a role as an individual. Ele can bunker a point, though 1v2 will have trouble on Mender’s. It’s an all-around support that offers heals, protection, swiftness, and offers medium offensive support in the form of chills, shocking aura, and air overload. So basically Auramancer has its uses both 1v1 and in XvX. Necro doesn’t have very many good 1v1 matchups, and if you spec for better 1v1 capacity (power necro) then you lose your effectiveness in teamfights, which is really the only place that necro fits in.

To put that in D/P thief terms: you can decap, +1 low targets, and win 1v1s against necro, rev, and power warr (the latter takes too long though). You have 2 general roles in a match plus 2 good 1v1 matchups, and can escape bad ones. How does necro compare in terms of its role flexibility and survivability? It’s an underdog because all necro builds are shunted into the same team-dependent role in combat (DPS and damage sponge in group fights) and aren’t able to dictate the match through superior rotations.

You’re not using scepter? The projectile moves slowly but its DPS is high once the orbs start to connect with the target.

flow.6043:

mighty meak.6387:

and i heal and i heal and i heal moar
but w t f
i am alone
no one helps no loves
1vall
i die no win

huluobo.7036:

Die Die Die no skill no score
Lose more than win
F1 has a fart

I see you’ve been trained by the master.

The last screen comes from w t f skyham truly he is the protégé

SaltAndLight.4652:

So I got my boots bursted off of me the other day in unranked sPvP, and it was probably somebody on here that did it. I wish I had taken a screen shot, but I didn’t.

I was at nearly full health and playing a D/P thief at the time.

They were using GS and hit me with the following, everything critically hit, dmg is approximate from memory.

Power Lock – 1K
Mirror Blade – 3K
Mind Wrack – 5K
Mind Wrack – 5K
Mirror Blade – 3K
Mind Stab – 3K
Spatial Surge – 2K

I’ve tried replicating the damage in the PvP Lobby using the power shatter build on Metabattle, but I’ve come nowhere near these numbers. What am I missing?

Helseth has a video (outdated but still shows the burst) on his youtube channel.

Dirame.8521:

shane.3647:

saerni.2584:

Hi, welcome to the forum.

What build do you use? Glad to provide constructive feedback on how to fight this thief once I get some background info.

Thanks for offering some input. I run a vanilla ranger. I know vanilla builds are inferior and Anet wants everyone to run the same meta builds but I enjoy my build. I was just about to break through Gold when I encountered this cancerous thief.

I realize that CC is probably the answer but I couldn’t land a single CC on this guy. He just dodged and evaded and stacked more condis until eventually I was out of clears and just melted away.

Hmm, attacking from Range when you’re 1v1 is almost impossible unless you intentionally give them the point. And even then they could just keep dodging.

I think the best thing is to use Greatsword. The GS 5 when used at the appropriate time can knock a Thief out of his rotation. Also taking the Hyena pet, and the Smokescale. Why the Hyena? because it can summon a second hyena that also has a knockdown. The more chances you have for unexpected CC, the better you will be at beating the condi thieves and thieves in general really. I would also make sure to have “Protect Me” and the trait Beastly Warden in Beastmastery. It works incredibly well and from any range, it is also an unexpected CC that can change the tide of any fight.

Yeah you do allow them to decap the point while you attack from range (unless you’re DH). If you land your combos correctly and kill them in less than 10 seconds then the decap was worth the time. Dying on point just because you don’t want them to decap is a bad choice, they’ll just fullcap while you’re respawning.

Coliseum has the “confetti” floating around that your computer has to process. I think it’s a nice effect but it does increase the load on your CPU, by how much I don’t know.

Reaper Alim.4176:

kin korn karn.9023:

Ithilwen.1529:

A better approach would be to play relying on your own strength and ability.

What a septic, pointless response, and just completely wrong. He’s not asking to be carried; he’s trying to find people to team up with, and you’d be smart to do the same in this “clownfiesta.”

With all of the blatant win trading trading and trolling going on. I’d have to say this guy here, know what he’s talking about.

Also if win trading get out of hand again this season. I’ll also recommend you forming a alliance of players to win trade with. Of course this is to only stay competitive in this clown show, with the other groups of match manipulators.

2017 in GW2’s Ranked League motto…. “May the better cheater win!”

Going solo is not a better idea. At all. Win trading is only relevant in ranked games, where individual games aren’t monitored and streamed. It would be quite difficult to put together a team of competent people to progress through an automated tournament only to give up when facing the people who paid them to lose. Also win trading doesn’t keep people outside of the top 250 or even the top 150. This guy is nowhere near that ranking so win trading is not a concern for him even in ranked.

Both of you have failed to accomplish much in sPvP and compensate by whining on the forums and trying to bring other people down with you. That is abhorrent, this person is trying to learn and have fun in GW2, a game which most people on this forum actually enjoy. You’re not doing him a “favor” by convincing him that it’s not worth it.

daw.4923:

unless you cant hit it bcs range vs thief
unless you cant hit it bcs blinds vs guard
unless you cant hit it bcs 4x fear in row vs necro
or you cant hit ravenant with anything bcs dodges blinds and blocks.

“ravenant”

Yeah so anyways you should NOT be losing to necro. DH yes, thief absolutely yes, rev is a stalemate in conquest but you should be able to eventually win with signet of might → Headbutt into Crystal Hibernation.

Aeolus.3615:

Mace/shield sward/focus is wath i was using in pvp as well, and still use on WvW.

Well DH trait “hunter fortification” helps condi cleanse but w/o meditation or more condi cleanse ur a easy target IMO.

When i played condi builds, guardian and DH not runing meditation + traps, even nowadays they are easy to kill.

The best support in this game is the damage stacking, all we can have for support are the virtues or some heals on blocks, but still it is easiers to get carried with damage output builds + medi based.

I could criticise ANet for their tons of pvp mistakes, but this is not the topic.

The only condi build that poses a serious threat against Mender’s DH is condi reaper with their unblockables and boon corrupts. Maybe condi rev but that’s still easier to handle. Anything else is quite manageable.

I’ll consider using Force of Will over Pure of Voice. For the most part, I don’t find it hard to keep my necro’s health topped off when using Signet of Courage, I don’t need more heals unless he’s being focused hard.

I did switch to my DH build yesterday and am liking it better, it gives me more bunkerability. That’s irrelevant in a 5-man but is useful in duo queue because it gives me more role flexibility; occasionally the necro will go plus a fight somewhere and I don’t need to follow, yet I can’t adequately hold a point with my core build. I used mace/shield sword/focus instead of staff sword/shield and am loving it, mace’s extra blocks and aoe protection improve sustain significantly. Also the extra blocks from Shield of Courage and Fragments of Faith allow me to more easily play Mender’s instead of Knight’s.

Hi guys,

I’ve been theorycrafting a support guard build for a while now, and have been testing it in unranked with a Plat power necro. Here’s the current build I’m using: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAW8el8AhmhY9QwTIQTEH+DFOGuhfwGAd7DkTiK8CB-TZxHABwfQA8Z/BlfCAGXGAgLAAA

Occasionally I use Paladin over Knight if I expect a condi-heavy team. The build mainly revolves around coordinating (using voicechat) with the necro, when he gets low on health he can revert to shroud, and I can use the elite signet as he leaves shroud to full heal him. The signet has the added bonus of healing everyone to full, including myself. We can sustain 2v3s for a good while, though I’m finding that I crumble under serious focus. I could probably sustain longer with mace, but since the necro isn’t glued to my hip, sword gives me far superior mobility to catch up with him when he goes to challenge or defend a point. It also is much better to help supplement his burst with sword 2 -> sword 3.

That being said, the weaknesses of core guard under pressure make me wonder about how DH would fare, and I’ve been thinking about playing a build like this: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAW8en8ABFdi1DBeCB0EhlKiSe2z9fHbACgIIbDOv0D-TZxHAB+s/A8HEAAuAAK/EAkvMAA

Fragments of Faith + Hunter’s Fortification replaces the need for a condi clear, and gives me more bunkery sustain. The extra stability is pretty important. Shield of Courage beats Virtue of Courage every day, and F1’s CC is very nice. Generally the reduced signet CD trait is unnecessary unless we’re making a series of bad plays, so the loss of Radiance isn’t a big deal.

I’ve found that overall support guard rivals other supports for utility, as with the Signet of Courage it has as good healing as ele (though the healing is more bursty) and with Mercy and Protective Reviver its rez potential is second to none. And of course bouncing people off point with Sanctuary + Shield 5 allows for quick, assured decaps even with 2 people there. Anyways, let me know what you think, especially as to whether the core or DH build is better.

Phineas Poe.3018:

Drakhar.1389:

I think pve players underestimate the amount of people that would have played pvp constantly if it was supported. As bad as the support was, many pure pvp players (myself included) stayed and played pvp exclusively for a long time.

As someone that is a member of a very old and large PvE guild, and as someone that previously managed said guild for years trying to get the general guild population interested in PvP and WvW, I can tell you that, without a doubt, most PvE players have absolutely zero interest in PvP not because of how it is “supported” but entirely because (1) it’s a competitive game mode and they’re not interested in that and (2) they have developed unhealthy playing habits and motivations that don’t align with good game design in the first place.

Season five was a very nice uptick in activity, but it really wasn’t sustainable because they weren’t in it for the PvP: they were in it purely for the ascended gear. And the second they obtained that ascended gear, they were gone.

Every day I’d log into Teamspeak during season five, I’d always reach out to someone in the guild and ask how they were enjoying PvP, and if they’d likely stick with it. Pretty much every time I’d ask they’d answer, “I’m doing this until I get my legendary backpack done.” These aren’t people that actually enjoy PvP in any capacity; they’re there only because the carrot on the stick is enticing enough to stick around—they have absolutely zero interest in the game mode itself. And the second they catch the carrot, or the second they realize the carrot is just a little too out of reach for them or the stick is just too long (as it was in season six), they flee back to the Royal Terrace in Divinity’s Reach and crash each others’ FPS through stacking as many auras as humanly possible as a form of entertainment.

And more to my second point, Ethereal Guardians and other PvE guilds are full of people who are literally willing to grind Molten Duo for hours on end, literally the most boring thing to do in this game, just because it’s the most profitable thing to do in this game. These are people who would literally watch paint dry if it made them 20 gold an hour. These are people who ALREADY stand in one place and auto-attack dragon elbows just because it gives them a chance for ascended gear.

These are not the people ArenaNet needs to be marketing PvP to, because these people aren’t all that invested in the PvE side of things too much either. The community kicks and screams just at the implication that people can inspect whatever gear they’re wearing when clearing a raid wing or a T4 fractal. They don’t take even PvE seriously, so what makes you think they will ever take WvW or PvP seriously?

I literally have to bribe my guild members with gold and rewards just to show up to an in-house.

Honestly, thanks for this perspective. A lot of PvPers don’t understand this at all. Even some people who are good at PvP are like this too tbh.

Zintrothen.1056:

The solution to condi defence isn’t to buff already necessary skills like staff 4, but to buff weaker legends like Dwarf and Centaur. One or two more traits could be good too. Staff is fine as is because it’s also AoE. There’s nothing low impact about it.

Skills like Axe 4 and 5 will need longer cast times if you want them to be stowable, making you vulnerable to interrupts. Also, axe 5 is stowable, but not after it’s been cast. If you want it to be stowable after the animation begins, then it needs a half second of casting and then another second or so of animation casting. Once you’re beyond that, you’re stuck with a full cast.

If FoL gets no cast time but is unusable during CC, then the same should apply to the warrior skill that does the same thing (but with a shorter CD because revs get two healing skills). I would be fine with this change honestly since it’s a heal skill with a different kind of counterplay. The only problem comes when a rev/warrior can just run into a massive fight and heal to full with ease because nobody’s just going to stop attacking for 3 seconds all because a rev/warrior used a heal skill. Plus condis heal for the duration, so a condi profession would have almost no counterplay.

Shield 4 has a longer cast time because it’s AoE. It’s far from low impact, just like staff 4. If that skill gets a shorter cast time, then I sure hope they do the same for ele staff skills, especially considering that shield is actually an elite spec weapon.

Ok first you’re making a number of loose statements and then not substantiating them.

Shield 4 has a longer cast time because it’s AoE

Where have you heard this rationale? Has a dev said this? If we’re going to be comparing to other professions, mesmer has multiple aoes that have 1/4s casting time. I don’t understand why you think aoe = long cast. Your point about axe 5 is well-taken, but I already understood that. Yes it would need a longer cast time, and that’s worth it to have a dodge-inducing animation on it in my opinion.

As to your point about FoL needing counterplay, it already has counterplay. It’s called don’t attack the rev. You say it’s bad that a rev can “run into a massive fight and heal to full” but a rev can’t heal outside of a massive fight. That’s the difference. Leave the rev alone in combat and they can’t heal. It’s much harder for a rev to heal than it is for a thief or mesmer, which are frequently compared to revs in terms of their role in pvp. FoL is a great heal when you’re fighting NPCs; as I mentioned, this is a sPvP-related thread, about meta legends.

Anyways, your response was mostly just to tell me that rev doesn’t really need changes even though condi rev continues to be low-tier in pvp. I like the idea of buffing non-meta legends, especially Jalis, but if you’re gonna pop in here then how about giving some specific suggestions?

Vena.4276:

Sword 3 is stowable.

My bad you’re right, I took that off the list.

Euthymias.7984:

TheHolyPug.8314:

I am not sure what Stowable means as far as spells

Its basically cast-cancelling them for fakeouts.
You stow your weapon during the skill’s activation. Part of the animation plays, but the skill itself doesn’t go off and instead goes on a brief ICD of a couple seconds. This lets you throw it out again shortly after an enemy dodged in expecting that skill to actually hit.

Exactly. You’ll see high-level players like Kronos use this with Chaotic Release. I also use it with Jade Winds from time to time but people are less likely to dodge that one.

Euthymias.7984:

Some aftercast shaves would be nice, and having Sword 3 being cast-canceled would be cool.

I’d also like to see Sword 2 actually focus your selected target instead of splashing multiple things so that it can be a “burst”. It already shares a similar CD to Trueshot, but unless you’re practically inside the enemy, its nowhere near as strong when minions/pets/clones/other players/mobs (or even objects) are nearby.

Yeah I’m kinda split on this. Honestly I despise attacks like True Shot, just a big ol smackdown on a low CD. I think precision strike is in a good place in sPvP, though the objects thing needs to be addressed.

Well like I said, Rev is still clunky. Btw are you playing power rev? It’s not as bad as condi rev in terms of clunkiness and lack of stows.

This is a sPvP thread, relating to meta builds and Legends

I’ve been trying to put my finger on why this is for a long time and in my view, it comes down to 3 things:

1. Lack of stowable high-impact attacks. Jade Winds and Chaotic Release are stowable, which is wonderful. However, Axe 5 isn’t stowable, nor is Axe 4, Mace 3, Staff 5, and so on. That’s most of them though.
2. Long cast times. This is actually useful with stowable skills, but bad otherwise.
3. Excessive aftercast. The most conspicuous is Axe 4; I get thrown a bit past my target too. But Unyielding Anguish is a bit offender also, it needs at least .1s aftercast shaved off of it.

Why this matters
Stowing important skills, like Blurred Frenzy, True Shot, or Chilled to the Bone, is what makes 1v1s and 1v2s interesting, which is quite relevant in the upcoming 2v2 game mode. Aftercasts are a hidden but highly impactful part of your effectiveness, as you basically have to memorize them in addition to casting times in order to calculate whether you can/should use this skill at this time. Aftercasts should be minimized for all skills across the board imo, or they should be indicated in the toolip. So to list out some specific changes (this won’t necessarily be comprehensive):

1. Mace 3 must be stowable, and aftercast shaved down. Since autotargeting was removed there needs to be compensation in the form of stowing. This is the majority of condi rev’s “burst” so we need some ability to guarantee its landing.
2. Axe 4 just needs to be reworked in general. The end destination of the rev is just odd; I find this works in my favor since my opponents are confused about where I end up, but that’s not the purpose of the skill. It would be nice if, rather than being a projectile, this were a fast-extending, piercing, frosty line extending from the rev. That way it could be stowed before it hits the target, you can’t really stow a projectile once it’s thrown.
3. Axe 5 could be stowable. I’d love this but it’s not necessary.
4. Unyielding Anguish should be stowable. It’s a very high-impact skill if you land right on top of someone, and very energy-consumptive. That’s the type of skill that should have tells and be stowable. Especially since Mallyx lacks a scary, stowable elite like Shiro and Glint have.
5. Shield 4 should have reduced casting time. It’s already a small-impact defensive skill, I don’t understand why it’s 3/4s? Anet please explain that. 1/4s would be appropriate, even 1/2s would be a big improvement.
6. Burst of strength needs cast time reduction and slight aftercast shave. It’s a melee range attack, it seriously can’t be a 1s cast time. 3/4s is appropriate, if you’re expecting it then you can dodge the second part of the attack.
7. Staff 4: again, small-impact defensive skill, should have a lower casting time and aftercast. It’s super conspicuous at the moment yet is mostly used when the power rev is under condi pressure; throw me a bone here Anet.
8. Facet of Light should have no cast time, though shouldn’t be usable when you’re CCed.
9. Sword 4 should have no precast. I’ve been headshotted by thieves twice while activating my block. Yes you read that correctly. I might be wrong but I don’t think Warrior Shield 5 has a precast before the block takes effect, I’m sure the same is true of Thief’s Bandit’s Defense.

This is a sPvP thread

So I just got done dueling 2 top-50 DHs. One playing burn, the other playing standard meditrapper. I lost every duel. I got close on the burn DH, not even on the meditrapper, aside from forcing him to use his elite. I was using axe/shield GS with demolisher amulet, otherwise meta. What should I look for in order to win?

KaporHabakuk.6219:

I guess its a matter of playstyle,i rather take extra stunbreak+stabil with lower RS CD and lower RS decrease while in shroud,it playes well,and is funn.Thou i was mainly pointing out,if someone got trouble with CC,there you go,pick that nice trait and life is easier.

You certainly have a lot of faith lol. I’ll be around tonight if you want to test that versus warrior.

KaporHabakuk.6219:

actually,necros got stability in the spectral tree line,one DS/RS you can get stun break and stabil,with traited DS/RS we talking about 6sec CD on stun break with stabil.not bad at all

Technically that’s true but power necro loses a ton of damage by taking that trait. Necro plays Death Perception because otherwise shroud hits like a limp noodle. Landing RS 5 is a huge part of power necro’s burst if it crits; if not then it’s not that scary. At that point you should just play another class, even with that trait necro still has no blocks, invulns, not even vigor. Defensively it’s a trainwreck, better to trait for extra damage.

Cynz.9437:

Huskyboy.1053:

Cynz.9437:

Erzian.5218:

Silv.9207:

necromancer can’t win a single 1v1,

That’s a lie, necro beats engi and support ele. It just loses vs the other 6 classes.

and warriors…. just saying~

As for discussion, it is pointless to type anything it seems, people just read what they want to read and if they see what they can’t accept or can’t provide proof against it they just dismiss it with various irrelevant excuses or continue to claim same crap without any actual facts (e.g. necro has weakest dmg in game…. based on what exactly? Or they just go on about thief when the discussion is not even about thieves but the fact that necros HP pool gives them more time to react compared to low HP classes like thief/ele/guard and there is reason why those classes have dodges/blocks and necro doesn’t -_-‘… but noooo we would rather twist the words for the sake of flaming).
Bottom line, i don’t think necro needs buffs. We don’t need more powercreep. Elites need more nerfs /thread.

I’m on NA, feel free to bring your necro against my warrior any day. Warr versus necro, even with 50% lifeforce, is still a really imbalanced matchup.

I don’t need to xfer to NA for it, i have seen plenty of necros soloing warriors in my matches.

Yeah I’ve seen thieves solo DHs before, in fact I’ve done that myself. The issue there is that I’m average and the DH was below average.

Reasons why necro loses to power warrior:

1. Cleansing Ire and Berserker Stance negate condi necro
2. Mace 2, Shield 5, and Endure Pain give enough sustain to approach power necro and tank its stronger attacks
3. Necro has no stability outside of shroud aside from its very obvious blockable elite, and warrior has mace 3, shield 4, headbutt, skull crack, and skull grinder to constantly take advantage of that lack of sustain.

Nobody really cares about random instances of necros outskilling bads, that can happen on any class versus any class. Structurally necro is built to take a beating and warrior is optimized to 1v1 against slow enemies.

Cynz.9437:

Erzian.5218:

Silv.9207:

necromancer can’t win a single 1v1,

That’s a lie, necro beats engi and support ele. It just loses vs the other 6 classes.

and warriors…. just saying~

As for discussion, it is pointless to type anything it seems, people just read what they want to read and if they see what they can’t accept or can’t provide proof against it they just dismiss it with various irrelevant excuses or continue to claim same crap without any actual facts (e.g. necro has weakest dmg in game…. based on what exactly? Or they just go on about thief when the discussion is not even about thieves but the fact that necros HP pool gives them more time to react compared to low HP classes like thief/ele/guard and there is reason why those classes have dodges/blocks and necro doesn’t -_-‘… but noooo we would rather twist the words for the sake of flaming).
Bottom line, i don’t think necro needs buffs. We don’t need more powercreep. Elites need more nerfs /thread.

I’m on NA, feel free to bring your necro against my warrior any day. Warr versus necro, even with 50% lifeforce, is still a really imbalanced matchup.

SarahGobbi.2319:

Literally…. damage for some professions is off the roof and CC makes some matches unplayable…..

Literally:

CC
CC
CC
CC
CC
dead

No where near enough stability/cc breaks to cope with it.

So are you going to tell us what you play, what you were playing against when this happened, etc.? Or are you just here to trash GW2 on the GW2 forum and do nothing to improve? People will help you do better if you let them.

Nah I pvp and pve a lot. If my last location was HotM then usually that will be my last recorded location, and I’ll load into it from character select. This is a pretty new issue for me.

When I move my character from Lion’s Arch to Heart of the Mists then go to character select, it often records my character’s last location as LA, and when I load that character it takes me to LA instead of HotM. I have not yet seen this issue with loading into HotM from other PvE areas.

Sly.9518:

Again it’s just not speed if you actually read what I posted I never said Cast time didn’t impact it, but animations do since you see them more through all of the particle affects flying around, and good thin I have never been below G3 in any of he seasons.

And again you were trying to Say revenant doesn’t have the biggest Telegraphed skills, show me a skill that is more telegraphed than Chaotic Release or Drop the Hammer……

Yeah I’ve been playing hammer lately for fun and even people who aren’t familiar with the weapon still dodge Drop the Hammer. In fact all hammer skills are easy to predict and dodge aside from the autoattack. But Unrelenting Assault and Mace 2 + 3 are also quite easy to see and dodge. Staff 5 isn’t that easy to dodge if you’re in melee range, but rev’s weapon skill rotation is so easy to predict that you just know when they’re going to use it subconsciously. That last part is what makes Rev much more “telegraphed” imo; low build variety and relatively few weapon choices.

You mentioned the pull specifically. Firstly, just sit back and wait for the pull. At your level, many people will throw it as soon as you’re in range. The animation is pretty obvious if you’re ready for it, prepare to dodge.

If he lands the spear anyways, there’s a short period of time where you can prepare to hit your stunbreak. Put your finger on the key and press it as soon as he pulls you. If you do this successfully, at that point you can go on the offensive.

Animism.9803:

Huskyboy.1053:

Which meta are you referring to, 5v5 comp or solo/duo queue comp? DH was not fringe at all in the top 250, Thermite made it into the top 10 with his symbolic build. Meditrapper was very popular and now maybe not so much. Mace GS burst was also very popular and now is decisively much worse. S7 meta will definitely be different. As for tournament comp nobody really knows yet, considering only one team has signed up and probably even they haven’t decided what their comp is yet.

Also: druid isn’t tournament meta? I’m surprised to hear that. Ele/necro/engi/thief is meta and has been for a whilr, what do you think the 5th is?

I’m referring to 5v5 meta because this is a 5v5 competitive game mode. Team comp has been determined.

Thermite climbed high for a variety of reasons, most of which were because of the general ineptitude of players to counter his far push.

… and because his DH build supported his strategy. Off the top of my head, Saiyan was in the top 30 at one point at least, Luck Slayer finished at around 60, idk how far he climbed. There are undoubtedly others, Thermite was only one example. Man tatas probably finished high-ranked too.

There’s nothing wrong with caring about 5v5 comp but that’s not really what Anet “balances” around since Esports is officially over. Their revenue model is dependent on people’s continual engagement in the ranked seasons, which is why we saw the overhaul that came with S5. If they’re maintaining interest/outrage in playing ranked during the season then in their eyes the patches are working as planned.

Animism.9803:

Huskyboy.1053:

But would not shaking up the meta have been as interesting? Would yet another patch that barely changes anything be causing people to shake up their tournament comp as much as this one did?

They didn’t shake up the meta. DH/warrior/druid were on the fringe in a 5v5 team comp in the first place. Now they are just completely out.

If anything, the patch just reaffirmed the meta while make some changes which were good but otherwise screwing things up.

Which meta are you referring to, 5v5 comp or solo/duo queue comp? DH was not fringe at all in the top 250, Thermite made it into the top 10 with his symbolic build. Meditrapper was very popular and now maybe not so much. Mace GS burst was also very popular and now is decisively much worse. S7 meta will definitely be different. As for tournament comp nobody really knows yet, considering only one team has signed up and probably even they haven’t decided what their comp is yet.

Also: druid isn’t tournament meta? I’m surprised to hear that. Ele/necro/engi/thief is meta and has been for a whilr, what do you think the 5th is?

If there’s no thief, and you put some cantrips on your utility bar, you might be able to make that work.

Animism.9803:

Huskyboy.1053:

Balance patches are 100% about changing things in a way that interests us, not about making the game more balanced.

LOL statement of the week.

For someone criticizing another’s criticism of terribly thought-out arguments, this is really a step in the wrong direction.

You just took the literal meaning of a word and completely redefined it. Who made you the end-all be-all lexicographer?

Also, you do realize that the two aren’t mutually exclusive, right? They could have made the meta more interesting without disrupting the previously established balance by buffing skills/traits that were not commonly used.

I didn’t come up with the phrase “balance patch.” I would definitely call this most recent patch an imbalance patch if I wanted to be facetious. And yeah you’re right that they could’ve changed things differently. But would not shaking up the meta have been as interesting? Would yet another patch that barely changes anything be causing people to shake up their tournament comp as much as this one did? Drastic changes fits Anet’s needs better than minimal ones so long as they don’t chase a large portion if the playerbase away.

Skittledness.5106:

It wasn’t an ESL scale tournament sure,but considering we haven’t had a tournament in almost 8 months people have been waiting for a opportunity to make a team and compete.Now for plenty of the people who don’t multiclass they’ve been essentially left out a new developing scene.

Is this really a problem? People who want to play on a team should all multiclass to some degree.

IRL example: some of my friends have a soccer team and invite me to play a pickup game with them.

Scene opens in the school’s cafeteria

Friends: Hey want to play with us? We’re looking for a defender.
Me: I only play striker.
Friends: You won’t play defender though?
Me: I can, but I don’t want to.
Friends: Well dedicated strikers got nerfed, we only have defenders, midfielders, and of course a keeper.
Me: I ain’t playin wichu

Curtains drop

Things change and that’s part of what keeps this game engaging. I guess it’s an issue of personality but I don’t understand people who value stability (the concept not the boon) over novelty in a videogame.

This is a sPvP thread

Instead of chipping away at this trap’s damage over and over, why not make it only trigger when someone is CCed over it (I.e. pull, knockback, or launch)? It’s the classic example of why DH is a bad design for conquest: ToF gives area denial, forcing people to dodge a passive thing laying on the ground (why??) and also hurts people teleporting in and out. It produces an effect similar to immobilize since it dictates where your character can and can’t step for 6 seconds; either you’re stuck inside and have to deal with DH’s melee-range attacks, or are stuck outside and can’t land your own melee attacks. It gives far too much control over your enemies for a trap on a 30s CD.

Instead, why not buff the damage back up but require a CC? That helps Meditrapper’s and Symbolic’s burst while preventing the undeserved side-effects.

Can anybody link the post about the leak? The only thing I know about is the months-old reddit thread that says nothing about rev

Luclinraider.2317:

Has anyone else noticed this?

Not only were DPS moves on almost every class nerfed into the ground while condi’s were buffed…..but I feel like everyone I fight just has 20+ seconds of Prot running….making DPS even weaker.

This is especially bad with Necro’s and Hunters….I dunno what changed but they seem to have prot up constantly in 1v1’s…..making my physical hits land for about 800……when I have 60k life to eat through against necros’….making my skills hit for 800 seems like a lost fight….

For necros, power necros run Spectral Armor, which gives protection and gives LF when you damage them. They also have a passive version that procs at 50% health. Just LOS and don’t attack until you see the protection go away.

RabbitUp.8294:

I’m not going to bother replying to you anymore. It’s clear you are too stuck on the hipster mentality, where good skills are brainless, bad skills are underappreciated and people just don’t bother enough.

Just wait for when and if guardian gets that healer/support spec and see how not even that build will bother ever using SoC in its current state.

> “not going to bother replying”
> replies

You guys can just, yknow, disagree respectfully. The skill has a great active effect, it’s 1200 range lol that’s the size of mid at Foefire. And the passive effect works well for the guardian if not for the team. It has its uses, let’s just agree that it’s a viable option if not a no-brainer.

Cynz.9437:

Headshot deals 5 dmg and applies 1/4 sec daze, it already costs 4 ini which is a lot for the spell that can’t be used while being stunned and applies such short cc. Take a guess why trickery is mandatory and thieves camp AA? Because they are ini starved and you want to effectively (due to absurd amount of blocks, blinds, stab, invuls etc. flying around) increase costs of the spell which will affect core build. Why?

You also want to give core mes alacrity? Really now?
You want straight out buff core rev?
And you want to buff core war. Why?
How about we nerf elites first before we starting buffing core builds?

Notice the trend. All your suggestions involve buffing other classes while nerfing thief. Biased much?

I think he’s trying to point out that giving back initiative for actually landing your skills was a big ol buff that thieves didn’t need. Otherwise I agree, these extra buffs would be ridic.

CrAzY.3275:

I want to know how warriors can just stand by and not be more vocal about this GAME BREAKING TERRIBLE change for power warriors. I am not even close to a warrior main…. but this NEEDS to be discussed more.
HOW. can we possibly be okay with..
GS 3,5
axe f1
sword 2
hammer f1
shield 4
rampage’s 2,3,5
physical skills
and w/e else all being completely trash and useless with quickness…
On an Axe shield/GS Ramp build that is 7 out of your 17 weapon skills including rampage DO NOT DO ANYTHING WITH QUICKNESS?!
We have a GRANDMASTER TRAIT for HIGH QUICKNESS UPTIME that is now USELESS on half our weapons?! Once again, are warriors seriously okay with this?

Username checks out

Cynz.9437:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

The only ways to avoid PI is to do nothing or to use uninteruptible skills/stability (if the thief hasn’t steal up). Avoiding headshot and avoiding PI is not the same. Headshot alone doesn’t do much if it doesn’t interrupt, so using defensive cds just to avoid hs is basically a waste. Not doing anything isn’t an option though, because then the thief can just autoattack you to death, which means, you need uninteruptible stuff (or enough sustain to heal through the dmg) in order to deal with PI. It requires counterbuilding, because counterplay is very limited. Which makes it such an unfun mechanic to play against (doesn’t neccessarily mean it is op though).

There are a lot of unfun mechanics in game (6 sec reveal on nearly instant spells that you somehow supposed to predict, passives, random invisible procs, attacking while blocking/being invulnerable) and yet there are still there.

Then start a thread about why we should get rid of those, I’m listening. What nobody can understand about you is this “well if I can’t have fun then nobody can!!” attitude. If something is low-skill and very unfun, let’s get rid of it. For the record I played symbolic DH last season, I am not really afraid of PI thieves on that build. Shards of Faith just needs to go imo, I use it but I could live without it.

bluri.2653:

God these PI discussions are always so hilarious. I love this certain one “let’s put PI on 5 sec CD! It won’t be spammed then!” You can still headshot and still interrupt theres just no damage this existed Pre HoT and was used the same way, so what part is the part that is considered OP? The damage or the interrupt? Since we already got tuned on the damage in this patch included no air/fire.

Anyway seeing this thread is like full popcorn let’s go lads

It’s the damage. It wasn’t used as a damage source pre-HOT so idk why you’re saying it was used “the same way.” PI triggers on autoattack rupts kitten , were thieves really doing that pre-HOT? I just tested it yesterday with a friend, I was playing condi rev, he was hitting 1.7k-2.1k per PI proc. Skills that disable and deal heavy damage aren’t so great for the game, which is why Skull Grinder got a huge damage nerf and Smash Brawler was also nerfed (to prevent spamming of primal bursts). The difference there being that Skull Grinder was never actually spammable just low-CD; Headshot is spammable.

Yeah it’s annoying to be interrupted if a thief cleverly predicts what I’m doing and interrupts important skills then that’s my bad, and that was reasonable pre-HOT. PI introduced damage but didn’t increase the thief’s risk; sit at range and spam the skill and what are revs and necros going to do about? Slowly die.

Also why are you bringing up sigils? That’s relevant to thief’s damage but is irrelevant to this thread or PI. You’re a great thief dude, why not advocate for where PI’s damage could be moved to instead of just defending the status quo?

Sly.9518:

Huskyboy.1053:

Well you claimed that being interrupted by headshot was avoidable 90% of the time; now that you admit PI hard counters revs and necros, that leaves 78% of the remaining classes. Ofc there are certain builds that are also hard countered by PI but I wouldn’t say that they’re meta. Well below your 90% threshold. And remember that we’re not talking about thief, we’re talking about a single thief trait countering over 20% of the meta. Good debating with you though, try to keep it factual next time.

sorry I can’t help with critical thinking as well as playing the game for you

Hey man thanks I appreciate the apology.

messiah.1908:

hi guys

so ventari got (some call it a buff) unique change to his elite

now it aoe cleanse 1 condition for every 10 nrg you lost

downside – you remain with 0 nrg….

so its strong aoe cleanse combine with purifine essence which cleanse 3 condition aoe

so i dueled a bit versus condi warrior and mesmer.

yes it strong cleanse

BUT

you must prepare your rotation right

you cannot spamm it in pvp like we used too as now the kb to control point is bit useless cause you have now 3 different reason why to use the skill and 0 nrg left to self sustain

1. heal fragment on poiny – i wish ppl would notice them common 1.8k heal each
2. condi cleanse (mainly versus necro and now revenenat torment aoe) – 240r so ppl need to be near the tablet so again area observesion
3. kb ress stomp, control point

the zero nrg minimize your decision making alot as its hard to build nrg and when you use it you probably must change legend to gain 50% nrg back

the trick here is to survive without nrg till you build 30% back

to do so you must practice. save endurance so you can dodge twice when needed. use blind with staff, evade with sword 3,

or choose your other legend right

mallyx – versus high condi pressure and good boon removal and aoe effects
jalis – aoe reduce dmg (condi also) , stability mainly
dragon – panic botton with heal skill and boon sharing – can be problematic if enemy stop attacking you. but if you codi bomb you will heal nevertheless

so after ele got nerfed a bit , not that it would change their meta build at all

no water sigil or renewal – so less healing
5 more secodn on healing skill
1 sec less in armor so less free stomp or ress by ele.
but better elite skill which can heal about 5k if you take fatal dmg

if we compare rev to ele now:
revenant has now better way to handle aoe conditions versus the ele ( but 240r… versus 600r ele shouts)
rev has better healing burst 240r versus 180r ele heal skill or shout 600

rev still got less sustain and no panic bottons like ele do

so does the healing, blind can sustain revenant more when all classes got bit less dmg and sustain ????

i took ventari/mallyx – had fun with it. mallyx now offer more wyas to pressure with mace 2 poison so even with no condi dmg i got about 1k condi dmg from tormemt, poison and burning on point so overall more dps.
i took ventari/jalis – nice ress/stomp ability with 70% less dmg taken and stability
i took ventari/ dragon – for me big no. ppl know how to handle dragon skills and you can share boons might swiftness regen and protection with others legends and thier heal skill is better

so what you guys say

should we give ventari another try or not?

Yea! Although I’ll be playing condi rev.

Sly.9518:

Huskyboy.1053:

Sly.9518:

Huskyboy.1053:

Sly.9518:

messiah.1908:

again the problem is PI spamm…..
put cd to it 5 sec and solve any problem

PI only procs if you get interrupted, something that in 90% of all cases is completely avoidable….

This is a thoughtless response, and there’s no way you can prove it. Headshot with PI counters a few builds outright; necros and revs get destroyed by it due to long casting times on skills, and in rev’s case the inability to respond at range. Meditrapper is somewhat countered by it once cooldowns are exhausted, but that’s more just its lack of sustain. Very easy to interrupt F2.

PI needs a short ICD, like 3 seconds. Getting multiple stacks of it because you mashed a button is low-skill, idk why you’d defend that.

One hint Revs do have a few counters to PI through Hammer projectile Hate Staff projectile hate, Blocks, Infused light, their ability to gain stability, and all those can be used at range, never yes they can get rely by it but they can also pump out decent stability if they don’t play like potatoes, and they are essentially a giant meet sponge, it could use more shaves , it just received pnentoday let’s see how the Meta settles first though, since right now everyone is running around like chicken little screaming the sky is falling, so sit back and take everything with a grain of salt till it settles.

And again counterplay exists for Projectiles which the main offender is Headshot which is a projectile.

Did you really just list a heal skill as a counter to PI? “Yeah this does damage why don’t u just heal ok.” Heal skill =/= counter. Honestly dude I barely play thief anymore but if you’re in NA I’d be happy to duel you while you play rev (power or condi) and let’s see how you do. Staff has no “projectile hate” except maybe staff 3? Headshot is 900 range so you can stand outside of staff 3’s blinding projectile’s range no prob. Thief is a flat out counter to all revs aside from hammer lmao, and even hammer’s projectile block is only in front of them. It’s not like engi’s hammer 2 or bulwark gyro toolbelt skill.. And I notice you say nothing about thief vs. necro.

The thing about necro is that it can do quite well in 1v1s if they have lots of LF to start, especially power necs. Wanna guess the one meta build that still counters necro no matter now much LF they have?

I’d really like to hear your motivation for these weak responses. You’d lose to me, a below-average thief, while playing those builds simply due to PI. It’s inevitable.

If only the game wasn’t designed with Hard counters in mind, and oh no two out of 9 classes might have difficulty with Thief, the sky is falling… like I said everyone is overreacting. And yes I listed counters available to the class that stop HS and PI you just don’t want to except them for what they are can be used for that’s not my problem and I can’t play the game for you, sorry.

Well you claimed that being interrupted by headshot was avoidable 90% of the time; now that you admit PI hard counters revs and necros, that leaves 78% of the remaining classes. Ofc there are certain builds that are also hard countered by PI but I wouldn’t say that they’re meta. Well below your 90% threshold. And remember that we’re not talking about thief, we’re talking about a single thief trait countering over 20% of the meta. Good debating with you though, try to keep it factual next time.

Pyriall.1683:

Psssttt ^ this guy doesn’t want his broken thief builds touched.

Eh I don’t think D/P is broken. PI’s damage isn’t bad, it’s just spammable. That damage should go elsewhere rather than being tied to interrupts.