Guild Wars 2

AsmallChicken.9634:

The most competitive matches occured between the #9, 10, and 11 ranked servers (shocking right?)

But you understand that the 9, 10 and 11 servers would have never faced each other under the old system, right? And the power gaps weren’t as clearly defined as you remember. The 7 server was repeatedly beating the crap out of 8-9, the 10 server was repeatedly beating the crap out of 11-12, and the 13 server was repeatedly beating the crap out of 14-15. There was always one too many servers at the top of the ranks, that had too much coverage for their tier and imbalance the tiers below it as a result.

The matchups were also deadlocked in many cases, leaving the servers matched together on the losing end to die because servers could not move up or down. The former 10 server is now 7, where it likely belonged for months. And while they are in a bad match this week, if the old tiers existed they never would have gotten there. Also there is likely no real 9 server that would have balanced that match. The 3rd server would be a permanent whipping boy.

Look at the 12-15-17 server match. AR and IoJ are matching fairly well with SBI, with AR holding PPT leads on multiple occasions. Knowing full well what AR is capable of, that 10k lead SBI owns is by no means a safe bet for victory.

From what I see, this system is cleaning the stagnation and spreading the points to where they should be quite rapidly… In short order the variation could be tightened up and we could see the most competitive matches we have seen in a long time.

Ralathar.7236:

Looks like we are in the exact same position AR and BP was.

Sort of, except we are loving it! Thanks for the fun fights FA in our BL this morning. Taking garrison back was good times. We aren’t use to having that kind of army to push through. Mags BL today has been a blast too. That kitten zerg got the drop on us a couple times, and I find that impressive considering you were a larger group than us. You guys move fast and we have to be more on our toes with our area scouts.

Mattjavelin.5164:

Now guys its not our fault why we PVD and its surely not any of your faults too why we PVD…. we PVD because theres noone at all or barely anyone.

We understand. In this matchup it is expected. We only have a very small oceanic presence, probably just enough to hold up in an old T4 battle. We aren’t built to match you… Yet :P

meep.2601:

this must be some sort of glitch. isn’t ebay only allowed to play against bp and AR? i’m going to submit a bug ticket

best post so far. :p

So glad to be fighting you guys on Mags again! You guys always seem to bring out the best fight in us. We encountered our first 70ish man FA zerg in EBG this evening, we haven’t seen numbers like that for over 3 months being stuck in T5… reminded us that we have to bring our A-Game again, thanks for the wake up call.

L Step.8659:

If you leave it is like it is now you just have 3 very unhappy servers and it just ruins wvw for them.

This too… if they are in separate matches the servers facing them will likely have a lot more fun than the one facing the two.

In the end, it can’t hurt to try it… it can’t be worse than what they already have.

Placing them both in separate matches against 2 stronger servers might actually help a little bit… Both stronger servers, unless they come to some kind of agreement about the 3rd, would have to worry about the other pressing their borderlands as well, so they couldn’t just concentrate all their forces in one spot. It just might be enough to open the door to FoW or Vabi forces being able to hold a keep or two in their own BL. This, in turn, could spark some more interest in WvW if even a glimmer of hope is seen by their servers populations…

It’d be worth a try to force the system to split them for a week or two in my books. ANet has already manipulated the system to break stale matchups in the past. They injected extra points into T8 NA to break that stalemate after 13 or 14 weeks, why not at least try to help these two?

I’ll be optimistic… last week we beat all odds and got the same matchup. That means we are all REALLY GOOD at getting an uncommon roll. So this week that means that if we all do that again, we get to go our separate ways.

If it doesn’t happen I do think we should stage a 6pm protest on the Matchup forum to see if ANet will do a re-roll. They broke the system by injecting points into the T8 matchup to force a new result when SF had been stuck there for 13 weeks draining all the fun and the life out of that match, so precedent has been set. They should be willing to do the same for us. Agreed?

As you progress and start gaining traits, check out the Ranger forum and take a look at Faux’ RRR build. It’s centered around the rangers incredible ability to stack regen and maximize the usefulness of the pet. I think its a play style you will enjoy, and even without quick twitch access to all of your skills it can be very forgiving even in PvP because of its survivability.

As a gaming mouse, I personally use the Corsair Vengeance mouse… 9 buttons positioned around the thumb in a circle provide quick access to my 2-0 keys, and the 2 additional buttons next to the right mouse button are programmed to swap pet and trigger the pet special ability. Middle mouse button (wheel) swaps weapons, and the only thing I really have to do on the keyboard is dodge, jump, tab, target and recall pet when needed and spam F to pick up loot bags… none of which needs more than 1finger really.

Good luck in your adventures!

Tobias Steele.2071:

1. Fort aspen wood
2. Ebay.(been saying for ages how they could take us, bring it on)

Really be happy with anyone between tiers 2-5 except dragonbrand.

I am guessing you are from SoS because we have been dying to fight you guys. I don’t know if some of our people have been talking trash in threads I didn’t see, but most of all we just want the chance to try. I don’t believe any from our main guilds would be so bold as to claim victory over an unknown opponent, but we feel like we belong in your league and we just want a chance to test ourselves.

1: SoS – they look like they are a great test for us. Would love to see how we stack up, and I would really appreciate observing some former T1 tactics. Bet there’s a few tricks to learn.
2: Yaks Bend – best fights I can remember us having in T4 was them. We’ve gotten bigger and better since we last squared off, I think we could actually press them this time instead of it being as lopsided as it was last go around.

Faux Sheaux.6179

We have three guilds that can pull those numbers. Last time I was scrutinizing TS, I saw 70 PK/Para in the PK channel, there were 60-70 GH+Company in the GH channel, and FTF had around 60 as well. Our TS was over 300 players online, all active in WvW.

It’s cool to hear PK also has that activity. I wasn’t sure what their numbers were like until now, but I knew that both GH and FTF often have 100+ players online at night. So that makes at least three guilds that can pull those numbers (not counting PvE guilds that might decide to become more active in WvW).

I can’t wait for new opponents ;(

I’m pretty sure that triple digits for reset was a first for us, but when we’re amped up for something, ya I don’t see why that couldn’t happen any reset. EBay’s ‘big 3’ are really focused WvW guilds. I know there are lots of guilds out there that have 300-500 members, but to have 3 guilds like that who’s members all tend to put WvW first makes for a great backbone to our server. I really love our community and how we work together.

If Para, IMTL, VS, Spe or anyone else are ever able to step into the “4” spot, it sure would be nice to have 1 main guild and 1 support guild per borderland assignment. Sometimes I have wet dreams about sekz quadrupling their numbers and running in 4 squads all over a BL… don’t judge me.

We were so optimistic going into this Friday’s reset because the odds were very much in our favor. I think we’re all just feeling like no matter how good the chances are for a fresh match, they are worse than they were last week, so it’s almost a foregone conclusion that we are drawing that same straw.

I really hope that it swings us into another match because the level of excitement pre-reset was huge. Our guild had over 100 people online waiting to storm the castle. We maintained a good level of activity anyways, but the reset really did pull the wind from our server’s sails.

Here’s looking to next reset, and “may the odds be ever in your favor!”

Tobbygnome.6793:

One suggestion i can make for this issue is to make the Bags of Loot the same as regular material bags of loot you get from mobs, which will be automatically looted into your bag. This idea would also eliminate bag clutter as the bags would stack just like regular material loot bags, allowing you to open them whenever you wanted so you don’t waste time selling a bunch of blue/greens after every 2-3 fights. Finally if you have no room for anymore bags, then and only then would the bags of loot drop on the ground the same as they do now.

- Tobby

I very much like this idea. Good one! I generally get my bags for the most part, but I hate having to spam F while moving and doing other things. It’s really distracting sometimes. And I have missed a couple of chests because they dropped after I was downed, those are frustrating.

A full pass at traits is something I’ve been hoping to see for quite some time. What are the chances we see a longbow change/fix at the same time?

Call me crazy, but I personally wouldn’t want to see zergs eliminated. I am not really a zerg player, my brand of WvW commanding favors small groups in tight communication and guerilla tactics, but if you scaled it down to the point where we were seeing groups of 10 attacking towers, sieges would be slow and defense would then become less strategic. One or two people should easily be able to fend off even 15 players indefinitely with basic siege placement knowledge, especially in a fortified tower. 25-50 people protecting siege and supply lines forces much better response by the defenders as well as a more organized and ‘epic’ defense.

Throwing 2 rams down on a door and ninja capping a tower before anyone can show up is good strategy, but I would never want to see WvW reduced to just that. WvW is meant to be big.

We were slow to respond, no excuses. It’s not up to EBay standards what we did this morning. Homeland defense before all is the MO and we didn’t live up to it.

We were just experimenting in EBG, but that should never take precedence. Lesson learned.

KStudios.2850:

.

And yet I still see “Commander-gaps” all over the place at times, or opposite instances where there’s three Commanders on a map at one time lol. I have more than once thought about the nacho hat myself. I don’t imagine I’d ever be one of our “greats,” but think I’d be more than capable to keep us afloat until one of the above mentioned folks showed up lol. Only drawback would be my inability to be more than ears on TS.

3 commanders on a map is not a big deal as long as they are talking to each other. No commanders seems,to happen a fair,bit in the EU primetime, or on NITEs watch because we only have so much love to spread around.

Haha, ya I was just the first reply… I’m not sure what happened to the OP. It was someone from SF complaining about his own server attacking the weaker opponent. I was just explaining why, strategically, they might be doing that.

Fxncy.2398:

Quite a few people (not guilds) left to ebay. We also lost commanders to higher tiered servers like dragonbrand. No hate to any servers or players, but it is true. only reason I will leave AR is if we are stuck in this match-up for another 5+ weeks. Sadly the ratings are all messed up, because servers that were lucky to move up tiers get extra rating even when doing bad.

Props to you for sticking it out as long as you have. I do feel really bad for you guys because it’s really tough to stay motivated when you feel like it just doesn’t make a difference. Hopefully after this week you guys get a good negative roll on the RNG and can kick kitten and have some fun.

We have 3 or 4 ex AR players in our guild now. They have been good additions. No commanders, but EBay isn’t too short on commanders anyhow. Talking to some that left AR I can understand why they left. There’s nothing wrong with AR as a server, you guys just got caught above your depth for too long. Some players wanted a taste of that ‘bigger’ feel of WvW clashes that they started to see, and with EBay poised to move to new matches it does make some sense for those to join something they can observe vs rolling the dice on something you don’t know at all. They are welcome here.

AmphibianX.7042:

I am having a hard time counting the votes, but so far I have counted around 50 votes for #1
I think something like this should have been better.
http://poll.pollcode.com/7dnrz

I tried to do a tally, but it’s hard as you said. This is what I have based on people who actually cast numbered votes. There are some that are obviously opposed to #2 based on their responses to others votes/comments, but they never did mention a number explicitly, so they could very well be 4. I also didn’t comb through for duplicate names, so if someone voted twice for something then they got counted twice.

1. = 4
2. = 47
3. = 12
4. = 17

I don’t actually understand what option #3 is, but a couple of other posters referred to it as WULD, so that’s how I counted it.

If your server is trying to gain rank points it generally translates into a better point gain to have a huge win over one server than to spread the love around…

Sweet, another thread about the same thing! Let’s all copy paste our replies from other threads quick…

Givers weapons are a nice touch, but toughness isn’t what I’m going for. Rangers are not great at shedding conditions, and toughness doesn’t negate conditions. I own a full set of exotic rabid gear and I’ve tried it in varying degrees in conjunction with a regen build. While fun, it doesn’t accomplish what I am trying to accomplish.

There are gear lines for just about every other stat combo you could want, I’m just suggesting they fill in this gap and give another option.

LostBalloon.6423:

1. is better than #1 as it allows servers to not be stuck in their tiers, but it breaks the competitiveness, makes ranks too volatile.

Losing when winning by a blowout doesnt make sense. Use the ratings and standard deviation + rand to generate matchups, no problem. But use something else, more stable to determine actual ranks, maybe treat it like a sports season. Or reward the winners of the matchup with something.

Losing rating points while winning matchups is exactly what is needed to fix the lower tiers. Ratings outside of the top 5 or 6 servers almost all inaccurate, and the artificial gaps created by the last system can’t be corrected unless you can steal points from higher rated servers. That is this system actually working.

fishergrip.4082:

The only reason people are saying 2 is because its only been out a short while. The old system was far better for making balanced matchups.

Go look at the recent history of T3, T4, T5 and back a ways on T8, at the servers who have been locked up tight in inescapable unbalanced matchups, then say that again with a straight face.

With all the variety of gear available I was a bit surprised when I had a build concept I wanted to try out but couldn’t find the right stat combos to pull it off properly. I had wanted to play a high crit condition build ranger to maximize benefit of the trait that applies bleed on critical hits. Easy enough to do if you want to build a glass cannon and stack power as well, but not quite possible when you want a high HP pool as well which is something I feel like I need in WvW. Would it be possible to fill this gap in stat combos?

Wrong thread…. Danger of multitasking on your phone

Jinks.2057:

Welp after taking reset night off it seems some Ebay commanders are getting back into it…….

Addicts gotta get their fix man!

Current random system (2). I’m in T5 and am extremely disappointed at this weeks match, but it was a 6.4% chance based on the math snowreap did for our server. If we got unlucky, we got unlucky and most people in this tier are mad because we had actually done enough to get a new match without the system change. If it happens again next week then I might cry foul, until then I believe that giving everyone the prospect of new fights is an excellent idea. We can’t get accurate ratings without match variation.

I’m dead set opposed to WULD systems though. I hope they never implement that unless they can magically balance populations.

Hey guys, don’t be too upset about the match. Our tier and T1 are the only ones that didn’t change this week… So the system did work! We just got really unlucky. Everyone else got some really cool matches. Its only a matter of time until we get a taste of that sweet action. At least we get different colors? We can get some different strats in EBG.

So guys, fight clubs all week? Forget the capping… We’ve all been there done that and bought the tshirt.

Mortalitas.9710:

Roo Stercogburn.9671:

Mortalitas.9710:

The change is being made because the majority asked for variety and to fight different servers. I could care less who we fight as long as its someone new. If we lose well, we lose if we win great. This change is for the better if you don’t like the change no one is forcing people to play the game. I like it thank you Devs and Bring it.

Might want to think that through some more. Might want to try being in an extremely unbalanced matchup.

You mean like running over Kain and Yaks bend for the last month?

Or running over the same two servers for 3 months straight? People who caution against this system bringing uneven matchups seem oblivious to the fact that many of us have been stuck in perpetually uneven matches for as far back as we can remember. Apparently that was better because it didn’t affect them. Now that it might from time to time we need a better solution… :|

Sirendor.1394:

They’re updating it atm it seems. And btw, I saw people from my server who were marked as invaders and we were fighting ;O

Sweet! I wish there was a way to do that whenever you wanted. So much fun could be had.

Dovgan.8605:

Have to say, met some fine people on Ehmry Bay over the last few million weeks, have enjoyed stirring up it’s trolls too(by the way you guys have WAY too many for one server). I believe players who post they want a good fight that are on Ehmry honestly do, but also doubt that this tenacity is felt by the majority of it’s players. If it were they wouldn’t have sat on the smallest of the three servers in this tier for the last few weeks. Not saying it happened in the BLs(although maps would seem to agree) but having the two larger servers constantly hitting the smallest server definitely reduced the numbers of players on ARs maps even more. I’m sure a troll will key in on that, good for you.

This is one of those ’don’t hate the player, hate the game’ things. We like AR, you guys are fun, but this matchup was stuck and there really was only one way out. Glicko awards a higher modifier for your win the bigger your lead is, making a huge win over 1 server more valuable point-wise than a good win over both. We needed larger rank point variation to get out, and as much as it wasn’t really fair, giving AR a beat down was this tier’s ticket to a new match. You guys will recover as soon as we are out of the picture, I’m sure. Good luck in your next matchups.

BrimstoneAshe.5043:

Khayoss.2019:

So after defending north camp in AR BL just long enough to take it for point tally, 2 of the AR that took me down jumped on my corpse and laugh a bunch of times.

Just wondering… when all you own in all of WvW is 2 camps, 1 at home and 1 in another BL, and you didn’t even cap it in time for the point tally, is that really the time to be corpse stomping? :|

I’ve had people from [pk] do it to me. Perhaps they have as well. Maybe they were just returning the gesture?

It wasn’t the action I was questioning, more the timing and circumstances. If you faceroll me you’ve earned the right to dance on my body, I won’t ever take issue with that part of it. But this was kind of like a linebacker tackling someone for a loss and then celebrating the play while his team was down by 40 points…. if you watch MNF, I was making more of a C’mon Man! observation. :p

Anyway, good luck with your next opponents guys, enjoy the new fights and I’m sure we’ll see you again soon with the new random matches when they come out.

So after defending north camp in AR BL just long enough to take it for point tally, 2 of the AR that took me down jumped on my corpse and laugh a bunch of times.

Just wondering… when all you own in all of WvW is 2 camps, 1 at home and 1 in another BL, and you didn’t even cap it in time for the point tally, is that really the time to be corpse stomping? :|

LAD Infinitum.1675:

Noice.8730:

Good game guys. Thanks for the Guild vs Guild fights [WFD], [Soul] and [War]

Right back at you, Noice and FTF!

Just saw the videos from your fights, looked like good fun!

And Friday 6pm PST if you’re on an NA server

So according to our resident statistician Snowreap, there’s a 6.1% chance of this matchup occurring again come reset. Of all the possibilities, this is the single highest percentage matchup. Amongst the other possibilities, not as likely. Guess we will have to see….

Wouldn’t it be kind of funny though, in a sick ironic way, if we all stepped through the portal on Friday night to see the same matchup we already have? :p

You guys know that there’s about an

I saw this on the NPC class forum, guards aren’t happy about these infusions…

Veteran Guard.9111:

ANet has NO CLUE what it’s like to guard doors in WvW. First players get access to 10 levels of buffs specifically to do damage to us, and 10 more to defend against us. Now they get ascended infusions specifically to counter us? Talk about OP!

Players get all the buffs, while patch after patch rolls out with no guard improvements!

I can’t wait till ESO comes out so I can switch, I heard from a friend in beta that NPC’s in that game get buffs all the time…

Draygo.9473:

We get a rares worth of silver in every chest.

I mean the devs can remove the silver and put in the guaranteed rare if that would make you happy right?

Rare = chance at ectoplasm, so I’d rather the rare than the silver.

What an amazing video. Fin stuff to watch, thanks for sharing.

As a long time opponent of Borliss Pass, I offer this observation: Their server is in need of strong organizational leaders for their WvW presence at all NA daytime hours moreso than additional numbers. Their population is heavily pug/casual in appearance and organization. If a strong willed WvW guild or set of commanders were to transfer here willing to put in the work to organize and train the existing population and promote/lead cross guild coordination, BP could conceivably make an entrance into the tiers of more dedicated WvW servers in a very short period of time.

Most dailies can be done in less than 10 minutes. The other day I actually logged in 4 minutes before the dailies reset and managed to get my laurel, so I don’t get what is holding people back.

Aquatic slayer can be done while capping a node. Ambient slayer can be done in about 30 seconds at the spawn area of either enemy servers borderlands before leaving the guarded area. Vet slayer is done in a camp and a couple control points. Champ slayer, event completed type ones are fast in any kind of group. And if you are crunched for time the crafting one is a great fallback quick at citadel, takes all of 1 minute to zone, run and craft 10 of anything. And sometimes you get lucky with laurel vendor or karma spender ones. Laurel vendor zones you to LA for a few seconds before returning to WvW, karma can be done with upgrades to structures and camps, or if you are in a rush you duck out of WvW for less than a minute, WP to Orr and buy one box from karma vendor and then return to game… Gathering can be done in EBG just outside spawn in just over a minute. Mystic forge is awesome if you already make sup siege, but if you don’t have the supplies you quickly grab 20 of the cheapest blue dyes on the trader and toss em in. Costs 12ish silver and takes a minute or two.

No WvWer should ever miss a laurel. You can do everything while running your normal activities, and if a day passes where you can’t check a box there are several options that you can wrap up your daily with that will take 1 minute or less EACH. If your team can’t spare you for 2-3 minutes before logging after a night of raiding to wrap up your daily then you need a more supportive or supported team.

LostBalloon.6423:

The reason I complain is the “random” factor in the whole thing. Think about it, its not about winning or losing, but having interesting matchups, with us bleeding rating points (yes, ratings do need to be fixed, but the ranking system is broken from its core), we might end up close enough for the randomness to match us against a server from tier 4 by the 2nd week of this new system.

That just wouldn’t be fun for either side.

Ok let’s look at an extreme case then. Sanctum of Rall, under the new system has about a 5% chance of facing Maguuma, a T3 server in week 1. While that is incredibly low and extremely unlikely, lets say that happens. The two servers have roughly a 400 rank point difference under the current system, which means that SoR should be able to blow the doors off of Maguuma without even getting out of bed in the morning.

A similar matchup pointwise that I could find was Blacktide (1081) vs Fissure of Woe (684) vs Vabbi (481) in T9 EU. In matches where Blacktide won by roughly 220k points they lost in the neighborhood of 17 ratings points – more due to the fact that Vabbi was a 600 underdog than due to FoW’s 400 point difference. Matches where Blacktide won by closer to 400k they actually gained significant points (30+).

So bringing this back to T1 vs T3, if SoR somehow drew the short 5% straw TWICE in the same week and got matched with Maguuma AND Kaineng, they would likely have to win by somewhere in the neighborhood of 260k to break even, and failing to do so, but winning by 200k or so would net them a loss of less than 20 points. So:

1) If the matches are closer than that, then the gap between T1 and T3 servers isn’t as wide as is claimed.
2) If SoR loses points by winning in a blowout, the amount of points from a single matchup would not be significant enough to drop them down from 1st place, let alone putting them in danger of being paired with a T4 server.
3) If SoR wins, but somehow loses a massive chunk of ratings because they could only clear say a 100k victory, this emphasizes point #1 (that there is a gap, but it’s not as big as perceived). It also probably drops SoR to #2 overall temporarily, and increases the odds of the same matchup happening again from 5% to a little over 8%, which is a far cry from being likely to face a T4 server in week 2.

Bottom line, a T1 server would have to barely beat a T3 server to lose enough rank points to be facing a T4 server week 2, if that happens then they deserve to be facing the T4 server because they clearly aren’t as good as they think they are. They would have to have the most unlucky roles of the RNG twice in a row, two weeks in a row when drawing opponents.

So, why worry? If T1 servers are as good as they think they are, worst case scenario is that they will lose 20-30 points here and there in the extremely rare overly imbalanced matchup that is drawn. If they aren’t, then this will simply give everyone else a shot at competition that is closer to their level than they have been allowed to know by the current system. Either way, the points needed to balance the middle of the pack floats down to where they need to be.

LostBalloon.6423:

The big issue with the tier 1 and why we complain about the change is that if we end up against a T3 server (potentially even T2), the matchup just wont be fun, the gap between T1 and T2 is enormous. I think only DB would have a shot at being competitive. and even then, they seem to be struggling agains TC and FA…

And as of 2nd week, with our ratings drastically dropping due to the change even if we wipe the floor with you guys in the lower tiers, the chances of getting even lower servers will increase.

I honestly think Kaining is fairing much better against Maguuma and Yak’s than they would against SoR, and according to the example they gave, it could be a potential matchup. pitting #1 server who is winning by a lot for the past weeks against the other T1 servers against #7 will be a boring blowout.

And “winning by a lot” does not mean JQ and BG are bad or dont have the coverage for 24h a day. Even them against Kaining would be a blowout. T1 NA is really another game.

I understand that, but you also have to understand that your situation isn’t isolated or new. The gap between Tier 4 – including EBay at the top of Tier 5 – and the rest of Tier 5 is probably close to as big as the gap between Tier 1 and 2… and we have been living that “no fun” situation week in and week out for 3months now with no way out. The only way to even this out is to have opportunity to steal points from higher rated servers instead of lower ones. That inherently means that some higher ranked servers are going to have to win some landslides but lose points to lesser competition just like we have already been doing. Its the only way to fix us and those like us.

In this system, you’ll have a week now and then where you don’t have a lot of fun, but we will actually have hope of having a fun challenge for the first time in months. What you are complaining about seems like a dream come true from our side of the fence.

I understand the frustration of losing points by winning the match, we’ve done that many times in our current matchup already. But I still go back to that point that many tiers are too far apart in points and that is an artificial gap made as a product of the system they currently use. The points have to come from somewhere to bring them back in line to where they really should be. It can’t be only from the servers directly around them because that’s what we’ve already been doing and it hasn’t worked sufficiently.

If #1 wins but loses points to #8, and then #8 wins but loses points to #14, the points are then available in that mid range to even out those inaccuracies. If #1 wins vs #4 and stays even in total rank points, that doesn’t actually help down the chain.

The artificial gaps have to be bridged, and like it or not the excess points float to the top, so they are going to have to come back down. Eventually, the extra points SF was given to break the NA T8 matchup also have to be removed from the system too, where do they come from if SF can only ever face very closely ranked opponents They will never win or lose enough to allow for the adjustment without sending them way down the ladder again.

That big variation, I believe, is a necessary evil to establish who exactly is close to your power range, because if we limit that down right now I doubt that it will give enough variation to allow the points to flow to where they need to be. Adjusting it later will likely be necessary, but not until we’ve fixed the holes that currently exist.

Manual adjustment may be a quicker way of doing it, but I don’t know how accurate that could be. It’s best to let it play and see where everyone lands.

Handin.4032:

But with the current statistics, in fact, theres a smaller chance of you getting a match “in tier”, than out. You’re right, a T4 server could equal probability of facing a T3 or T5 server, as well as a T2 or T6 server. So, the T4 server might finally get to have a win, but what about the other server? Or, how would the T4 server feel if they went against a T2 server? It might be a different person server, but it probably won’t be much happier for them. The current statistics make it acutally fairly likely for a match up to be a blow out, its just whether or not you’re the server dominating, or being dominated. Their new method actually, statistically, CAN work out well, with a better range ~-0.5->0.5. This would ensure that you can still fight outside your tier still.

You’re statement that "With these new system you have the same chance to get a weaker opponent, than you have to get a stronger opponent. " forgets one important thing: what about the weaker server? If people are concerned with blow outs, they have to look at the matches as a WHOLE, not just “what will my server get.” Yes, your server might be a lucky one, and be rank 8 and face a rank 12 server. SO, what about the rank 12 server? The matches must be looked at as a whole to determine the fairness, especially when using the glicko server. It would be drastically unfair for a rank 4 server to face a rank 8, by pure chance, and lose enough rating to drop to rank 5, even if they win. This however, is a possibility under the new system, with the current parameters. I repeat this again, a server should NEVER be punished, especially not be losing a rank, etc, for winning and doing well, ESPECIALLY when the matches are purely random, and out of their control. If they tweak their parameters, it should allow that the tiers already in constant blow outs face new people, but also make it so that the matches are still somewhat balanced (3rd place T4 verse 1st or 2nd place T5).

Two things. First, your argument appears to assume that the current rankings are correct, which I strongly disagree with. Ehmry Bay, according to the current rankings, is and has been for 3 months a “Tier 5” server. The 14th and 15th place servers combined cannot compete directly against us and the matches are all extremely lopsided, and while we win every week, we’ve been trying to close a near 200 point gap by facing the same servers over and over again which is practically impossible to do. I wondered often if either of the T6 would be closer than our current opponents? Old system, we’ve never been able to find out…

I wouldn’t be so arrogant as to proclaim victory against any T4 server we may face, but to say that they would walk on us just because the system says we are a tier below them is wrong because the ratings produced by this system are wrong. Because of this, and other cases similar to ours, I wonder just how many servers are far better and far worse than their current rank dictates.

Second, I can speak for the potentially weaker server that we relish the chance to be the one having it’s doors blown off by a “tier 3” server should the perfect storm of random numbers line up. For 3 months we’ve wanted to have another shot at Yaks Bend. They may be tier 3, but we feel like we are closer to them than we ever were before… We’ve also wanted to test ourselves against SBI for many months now, but have never been able to because of the rigid tiered system. The SBI, Yaks, EBay match that the promo spat out had us all drooling. If we lose, we lose. But it’ll be 100x more fun than winning without trying. Losing to Maguuma by 90k was infinitely more fun than beating Anvil Rock by 180k.

I can’t remember what your signature said, but I am assuming you are an NA T1 or T2 player? Those seem to be the ones most opposed to the change. The tier differentiation in those top 2 NA tiers does not hold true across all tiers, many are much closer than you can know looking at the numbers on MOS. They should all be given the chance to see how they truly stack up.

I’m not a math whiz, so I could be off on this, but here’s how I understand the glicko2 system. It’s a closed system in that there are a finite number of rataings points to be distributed. All servers started out even and were tested against eachother to form the matchups we currently see. This is the deficiency of the system as well though, because for a server to advance they have to take points from somewhere. When faced with the same servers over and over and over, they can only come from one place.

That’s why new (“illegal” in this systems terms) points had to be added to artificially resolve the locked matchup in T8 NA, because insufficient points could ever be gained by any server to actually move out of the match. Similar cases happen in other tiers, but can eventually even themselves out over time because one server can completely give up and over the course of several weeks be overtaken by a server in another tier… also not a very acceptable option.

The points being ‘hemoraged’ from the top tiers in case of not winning by enough are not necessarily a bad thing then, because points have to come from somewhere to bridge the gaps and provide accurate representation to the servers that have been skewed and locked into inaccurate rating brackets by the current system.

I think for people to get their heads around this new system we all have to stop talking about tiers though, because as of May 31st tiers cease to exist. WvW then becomes a laddered battle between #1 and everyone else in a system – something that glicko might actually be able to support accurately.

As the stats above show, the chances of those top tier servers facing uneven matches aren’t that high anyways. They are most likely to keep facing similar opponents with the occasional server that is in over their heads. In those instances, if they dominate as they are supposed to, then the ratings will stay roughly the same… even if they lose a few points it will make no difference in the grand scheme of things.

I have heard that arrow carts solve any problem posed in WvW. Try that yet?

GuardianOMS.8067:

Together We Are Terrible [WvW] on Maguuma. It is a parody of Together We Are Unbreakable [WvW] on Kaineng.

Of the servers we have played I always thought Maguuma was the king of troll guild names. You never knew who you were going to run into playing them so +1 to this one and the many others they have fielded.

I also enjoy Dolyaks only live once [DOLO]

Hoping for dev feedback on a specific question? How long in advance will we know what our matchup will be next Friday? We need a bit of time to organize which guilds will be going to each BL at reset, and a lot of that is opponent specific discussion.

If we had 30-60 minute heads up we could hammer it out, but we don’t want to be sending our most defensive and zerg busting focused guilds into blue BL hoping to defend homeland against an overwhelming force only to discover we are green and we are facing a lower tier opponent where the firepower could have been put to a different use.

If that’s been answered I apologize. I missed it.