Guild Wars 2

sephiroth.4217:

TheOpethian.4329:

Mesmers are scary but are not easy to play in the least bit, anyone who thinks they’re a face roll class has never touched one.

Mesmers are a faceroll class, even before the PU buff. I made 3 of them. They are the most forgiving class in terms of making mistakes coupled with high damage spikes from stealth.

It is possible to down other classes without ever leaving stealth. Not even a thief can do that, and they are meant to “excel” at 1v1 and stealth.

They do suffer doing damage in a team fight.

So why don’t they make Chronomancer a teamfighting class rather than a king of 1v1 like Mesmer already is? Durrrr, HELLO.

Ithilwen.1529:

Ok, in response to that; I find Chronomancer interesting.

This close to the long-awaited release of HoT I doubt that anything short of a nuke would implement concept level changes to Elite Specializations. There simply isn’t enough time. My guess is that Ranger elite is still very much in flux as are others.. making it a race to release day.

The problem is Chronomancer just adds even more to what the Mesmer already has where other classes mechanics alter.

When you play Tempest, it plays much different than Elementalist.
When you play Reaper, it plays much different than Necromancer.
When you play Daredevil, it plays much different than thief.
(I have no not tried Berserker yet)
When I play Chronomancer, it plays exactly like a Mesmer and it is definitely the most underdeveloped elite class. Why don’t F1-F4 skills change? Every class has their mechanics altered, Chronomancer just gets more.

Ithilwen.1529:

@ronpierce

First, I don’t agree. In ranked PvP, Mesmer is at least as challenging to play as any other class.

Second; There is an odd fashion among certain Mesmer players to ask for nerfs and try to make the class underpowered. I suppose this stems from pride in those of us who suffered for years being underpowered and almost a guaranteed kill for a thief.

That fashion does the class a huge disservice

Lyssa knows, ANET needs no encouragement at all to nerf Mesmer. I realize that it’s fun to be an iconoclast and to call for nerfs to make the class harder , ( and thereby increase the prestige of winning as a Mesmer ), but it’s really not appropriate.

-edit- There also seems to be a group that believes in asking for nerfs as a defensive measure. They fear that if we should ever start doing well, we’ll be nerfed into the ground.

It’s not about nerfing the mesmer, it’s about taking Chronomancer and make something interesting.

So did ArenaNet just run out of creativity? Or did they really desire super Mesmers…

Krysard.1364:

In fact tempest is op with arcana, cause you can give perma protection to your teammates :p

EDIT: I dont consider tempest op, but is strong, of course

Tempest and Arcana is a really stupid combo. Arcana rewards swapping attunements to combo off them, Tempest rewards waiting to use the overcharging.

The literally work against eachother. Then again, you can run Water, Arcana and Tempest if you really don’t want to do any damage.

Konfu Schnibli.9807:

Bye Guild Wars.

I am an adult now, that just recently bought HoT, to revive the good old GW1 PvP-glory.
My nostalgia and the similar names raised my expectation, that there was a chance for that but Anet flipped its design priorities.

Ah yes, nostalgia.

Let us forget Sway, Smiteway, RoJ Spike, ranger spike, palm strike, RoA way, spiritway, shoutway, signet assassins, hero battles, ele ball, discord spike, spamming /stuck, body blocking under bridges and the 90% skills in the game that are completely and utterly worthless. So worthless you even forget their entire existence.

Hell, here is a test for you GW1 vets, tell me ANYTHING you remember (without googling it) about the skill Spoil Victor. It can be anything from it’s skill type or what profession even had it.

Yeah, lets just forget ALL of those yeah? Clearly, GW1 PvP did a lot right?

Seriously, wtf ArenaNet. Cold Shoulder and Blighters Boon combo is Water Magic 2.0

I called it last beta how OP they are, they actually got nerfed and the Elite still does nothing.

Also, what idiot uses Arcana with Tempest? XDDDDD

Dahkeus.8243:

Stopped reading OP at Mai Trin. That fight is awesome.

It’s so boring. Lure Mai Trin to blue sparkle field 2-3 times then destroy her 25% health.
Rinse, repeat.

Misguided.5139:

While you are right that the Mai Trin fight is based around a gimmick, I’m not so sure that makes it bad. I kind of like that fight to be honest (which I know makes me a weirdo). I actually think that gimmicks can make the fight interesting and unique (Thaumanova Anomaly or Dredge Powersuit, e.g.). Gimmicks can certainly be overdone, but they aren’t all bad.

As for the Molten Bosses, I’m honestly not sure what you see in it. It isn’t a particularly interesting fight to me.

Mai Trin fight is handled all wrong. Mainly because it provides a massive problem (Mai Trin is immortal) and only a single solution. There is absolutely no reason to harm Horris and honestly Horris and Mai Trin don’t act like a team.

Horris doesn’t buff, shield or even interact with Mai at all. Mai’s immortal shield isn’t some gadget or ability Horris is using, it’s just an immortal shield.

That is why it’s gimmicky, it exists not for challenge but because it’s to easy without it. Forcing players to take damage before engaging with Mai Trin. Instead of having players fight both boss while they work together and play against their advantages.

One thing that plagues Guild Wars 2 dungeons is mechanical gimmicks. When something is designed to be artificially harder, even though it makes little sense.

The reason why this is important because ArenaNet has designed it right (See Molten Bosses) and designed it terribly wrong (See Captain Mai Trin)

When I read the article, it boasts about pushing players to it’s limits which is cool but it says nothing about actually difficulty.

In fact, ArenaNet has difficulty wrong. In the article, it states that it wants to force players to think outside the box and bring things to handle the content coming.

WRONG.
WRONG.
SO WRONG.

First things first, how do you design difficulty? Designing difficulty is very easy actually, making something harder is NOT based on numbers or mechanics but rather allowing the player to make mistakes.

—hoW ToO miSTAkE—

Mistakes in its core, is difficulty.

The more mistakes a player can make, the easier the content.
The less mistakes a player can make, the harder the content.

So when you have 5 zerker warriors face tanking the boss, it’s not entirely that the boss isn’t doing enough damage, but rather the warriors are not getting punished for making mistakes. They can get hit and keep going.

There are two kind of mistakes.

• Unable to stop the problem (like getting hit)
• Unable to fix the problem (like no conditions removal)

This is VERY important. What I am afraid of is; there will be a boss with 5,000 toughness and the best way to defeat it is to spam conditions. See, that is NOT difficulty, that is a gimmick. Instead of challenging players ability to handle problems, they are given a problem to solve, thus in its core removing active combat.

If you want bosses to push players to their limits, you must give the bosses problems that THEY create. Allowing players to react to them. That is by far the biggest issue with Guild Wars 2 combat is that there is only ONE best reaction, raw damage. Enemies offer absolutely no points of weakness, no reward to punish the ENEMIES mistakes. You can make condition users feel more helpful not by giving a major boss 5,000 toughness but give the boss the chance to gain a super shield of sorts. You have a chance to stop the shield and everyone is rewarded but if you fail, gains a bunch of toughness until its shield breaks.

—How NOT to create a gimmick—

This is ultimately what separates gimmicks from bosses is the rules you set for the fight and giving the players an option to react.

Alphard, Serpent of the Waves and Captain Mai Trin are a perfect examples of terribly designed bosses in their own unique way. Alphard is immune to conditions, for no reason. Has a super attack that annihilates everything but can be stopped by a wall. Captain Mai Trin would be unstoppable but Horris, instead of being supportive with powerful AoE attacks, flat out gives you the ability to defeat the immortal captain.

Okay, so, those are gimmicky because they are badly designed?
WRONG.
WRONG.
WR-okay, yes, but lets examine deeper.

They are challenging, yet, they do not punish mistakes.

This is a prime example of bigger numbers does not equal bigger challenge. A party success is based on how well they can avoid 1 attack. For every problem they give, there is only ONE solution. Only one answer. You can punish players for not responding properly but when you reduce the right answer to only 1 thing, it feels simple and boring.

ArenaNet raid designers, I cannot stress enough how vital it is to understand challenge and your article is hinting that you might not fully understand it. The Molten bosses were amazing but Mai Trin was 99 steps backwards.

I can go on and on about designing bosses ideas, but there is a very good chance this long article will be read by no one. Lets hope the importance is at least understood.

Cynz.9437:

source?

nvm found it… as he said it won’t be just nerfs…. the right way would be to tone down defensive capability of fire trait line and maybe buff tempest in some way….

Tempest is significantly more powerful than D/D ele.

I swear to God I was the ONLY good Tempest player -_-

I stated this before but -

ArenaNet this is how you fix ele’s

Take the condition removal from Water Magic, put it into Earth Magic. There is absolutely no reason for Diamond skin to exist, just put Cleansing Water into Earth Magic.

BOOM! Problem solved. You can no longer get high recovery and condition removal in a SINGLE trait line. So now-

• You can do very tanky with Arcana, Earth and Water, but now you lack the damage from fire.
• You can have high recovery and damage with Fire, Water and Arcana, but lack strong condition removal from earth.
• You can have strong condition removal and damage with Fire, Earth and Arcana but lack the recovery from water.
• You can have all three in Fire, Water and Earth, but lack the extra power and recovery from Arcana.

It’s that simple -_-
I got 4,000 hours on my ele, listen to the ele mains and freaking NERF ELEMENTALIST.
(And make Earth, Air and Fire traits grandmaster traits more fun while you are at it)

It can get worse!

• Dhuumfire terror necromancer. Complaining about ele’s? When Dhuumfire first came out Necros were literally unbeatable. Super tanky and could melt anyone with any build in seconds. Pre-nerfed Dhuumfire introduced a new tier in profession ranks, God Tier.
• Turret Engi, they fixed the turret bugs! But kitten , this was annoying as hell. So much CC and just painful, utterly painful to play against.
• Stun bug, a whole meta revolved around this bug, allowing stuns to last a whole second longer than they should.

but the most painful meta of all goes to…

Immobilize stacking!!! Not only you could get 15+ seconds of immobilize it also introduced the bug of if you get immobilized in the air you are stuck in the air and prevented from using any skills. No one asked for it, no one wanted it but we got it.

Unbalanced, unwanted, not fun and bugged, all in one! The immobilize stacking (pre-nerf)

https://youtu.be/aRYMjNT5uTY

Who the hell in the development team thought that was a good idea? Can I have his job please? I promise I can do way better. Say what you want about the other painful metas, the buff to immobilize is by far inexcusable.

Manifibel.8420:

So Cbomb lets say they add a mechanic that randomly target the person with the most Vitality. If everyone is zerg it can hit someone importaint like a PS warrior and kill him in zerg gear.
This would maybe make people thing about having a more tanky person in the run.
Or what about this. Some aoe attack will land on the ground somewhere. In order to not die here. You have to all run there and stack before it hits the ground.
The attack does x amound of damage. For every player standing in it, you take some % damage split between the people in the aoe.
If no one goes there, it will just deal the x amound of damage to everyone.
Depending on how much damage the aoe does to start with, it will make you have to have someone able to soak a lot of the damage, like a necro DS, or Ventari gear and use protection, frost aura and stuff like that.
I hope to see some really well thought out mechanics.

Shortly after the release of GW2 mobs used to target the squishiest target at almost all times. That was a major hassle but eventually ArenaNet implemented their own AI system.

The way the AI works is it’ll pick targets with certain attacks. It doesn’t matter too much if the target is ranged or melee, it can use ranged attacks on someone melee or walk over to do attack a ranged player, for example as soon as the fight starts the AI rolls a dice.

• Attack 1 – Player 3
• Attack 1 (Clone) – Player 4
• Attack 2 – Player 3
• Attack 2 (Clone) – Player 1
• Ranged Attack 1 – Player 2
• Ranged Attack 1 (Clone) – Player 5

While some attacks will hit other players, they are actually a clone of the same attack with a different target. If you ever wonder why the boss is ONLY picking you for its most powerful attack, it’s because it is literally only picked you.

However it also has what I think is “AI reset” if walking over to your target to do a melee attack is taking to long or if your target constantly goes invisible or simple just evading so much, it’ll roll the dice and pick new target for it’s selected attack. I’m not sure if it resets all the targeting or is it just that single one but I believe it only resets the selected attack.

• Attack 1 (Clone) – Player 4 -> Succeed? -> No -> Reset target.
• Attack 1 (Clone) – Player 3 -> Succeed? -> TBA

I believe the AI resets when a player goes DOWN (not die) but it will attack the player. Minions and clones can also reset the AI but it appears it is harder to hit that threshold.

_

Either way, it is very possible for the AI to have all it’s focus on the tanky targets as long as your team does not take any damage and you tank the damage. At the start the AI will randomly select everyone but eventually it will take priority of all it’s attacks to a single player like so

sinject.4607:

it’s literally impossible to win against a competent d/d ele on thief, shadow arts can only force a stalemate but lacks the damage needed to kill it, even with executioner. you can literally outplay the ele everywhich way and still only hope for a stalemate (which requires a lot of stealth uptime and lucky improv procs, which by then you’ve lost the point entirely)

the stupid amount of passive burn damage (lots of 800~ ticks easily), passive blinds, passive might stacking (it’s incorporated in their dps rotation, doesn’t inconvenience them at all to stack 20+ stacks of might), stupidly high passive sustain, and stupid high base damage of d/d weapon skills makes them impossible to deal with. fire grab can hit, and usually does, harder than or as hard as backstabs.

honestly last time celestial was a the issue (ele/engie/war) i was all for nerfing the professions using them instead of the amulet itself. at this point, i just want to see the amulet removed entirely. nothing good has ever come from it, it’s been by far the most corrosive thing in pvp for years now and has only lead to overpowered builds that completely dominate and shape the meta for all the worse. it should be abundantly clear by now that an amulet that has 30% more stats than all others will never be balanced when there’s builds that are capable utilizing every one of those stats. it’s just basic math.

Celestial is a pretty weak amulet. Until you add 25 stacks of might.

Hell, I’d be using Soldiers, Clerics or Sentinels on my ele if might stacks went beyond 25.

_

We complain about conditions but boons are in an even worse place than conditions now.

Ravenmoon.5318:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Signet Necro.

Realistically, get rid of Cleansing Water. As an Ele main, I can do without it easily.

_

Replace Diamond Skin in Earth Magic with Cleansing Water (call it, Cleansing Earth) and now Ele’s cannot have high damage, high condition removal and high recovery. They can only pick 2 of the 3.

Problem solved.

Send your CV to ANet.

CV?

Ayrilana.1396:

Staff wielding guardians in full ascended nomads. I’ll trait for condition removal and support my party with heals.

A bit overkill but when you got 9 other people to keep alive I can see that. Bring a hammer in your second weapon set and spam your auto attacks for a constant stream of protection and healing from the trait Writ of Persistence.

So far every dungeon boss in Guild Wars 2 can be beaten under a minute with the exception of a handful of them (and fractal bosses).
Making Berserker the easiest and fastest choice for farming those dungeons.

However we’re going to assume Raids are nothing like those dungeons. That bringing berserker on your guardian isn’t going to allow a faceroll through the dungeon. So you bring support or some tankiness? Well, yes and no. The ideal raid team is to have an answer to every problem and what exactly you should consider when going with a raid team. We are going to assume ArenaNet is going to focus on the following:

• No skipping! We are all used to this. In fact, it’s a big reason why players can run through Arah with full beserker gear. You can just skip all the potential threats.

• We can’t stack! One of the easiest ways to deal with enemies is to stack and cleave anything that walks near you to death while using blind to kept your self basically untouched. It would not surprise me that ArenaNet gives foes powerful cleaving attacks, punishing the 10 players thinking they can run through as a ball of death.

• It attacks so fast! Lets face it, 99% of enemies (and ally NPCs) attack like they are falling asleep. While their attacks are deadly, you can avoid it without trying very hard. We are going to assume the enemies are going to hit much faster. The faster the enemy, the harder they hit.

• OH !@#$ the conditions!! How much condition removal do you take? 0? 1? Yeah, assume the worst.

• God kitten we can’t stop it!! It’s charging a super attack? Surely with 10 people you have enough CC? Probably, more like hopefully. Assume the bosses need 10+ CC abilities to stop their ultimate attacks. Since the new CC system is based on CC prowess and not amount, taking 2 thieves might not do the trick for 10 people.

• It’s healing its allies?! Why not? Players can do it, so can enemies. Got to have a quick plan for those pesky healing.

• It can dodge, teleport?!! I mean legit dodging and not the lolwut graveling dodging, having snares, CC (slows? Hopefully…) will stop pesky mobs from dodging everything you got while dishing their own.

BONUS AREA——

What to ALSO assume (but also we hope this is NOT including)

• Bad mechanics. Did you know Captain Mai Trin is immortal? In fact, her ‘ally’ is the only reason why she can be stopped. Assume bosses have a gimmick where players must attract to a certain point on the map where moving 10 players can be a hassle. When in doubt, portal them or leave food to where you want to be.

• Immunity to certain mechanics. You know that Alphard, Serpent of the Waves is immune to conditions for basically no good reason, it’s because his ultimate attack actually kills him if he has any confusion. Assume (but hope no) ArenaNet are giving enemies immunity because the enemy would be too easy because of X mechanic.

• Immunity to reflection and blocking. This is the same issue as above, enemies become to easy when they can be reflected to death. Once again, the problem isn’t the reflection it’s that they have NO other means of attack. Bring reflection and projectile destruction but assume it can fail against certain enemies.

That being said, instead of listing ideal builds I’ll list two and have you guys post what you think would be helpful for the new raid content.

Raid build theory crafts:
Soldiers/Sentinel Minion Master.
When it comes to taking hits like no other look at the necromancer. Because Life Force is ~80% of your health bar, building high vitality can net you nearly 60k health (including full Life Force). To make things even more awesome, life force gain is by PERCENT, in other words, the more health you have the bigger life force you’ll get. Not to mention the life stealing granted from minions, minions removing conditions from you AND Unholy Martyr to remove them from your allies. This is incredibly helpful for a massive condition spike. While you can go Nomads necromancers are not the beast support for healing, go tanky and still hit hard.

Pistol Whip Berserker Daredevil
We’re going to assume the worst when it comes to mobs, punishing stacking at every instance. That said, pistol whip is an amazing shutdown, not to mention fantastic for evasion and escaping via sword teleport. It’s super handy for high damage and probably the safest use for berserkers. If you plan to bring your glass thief, assume your role needs to be focusing down threatening targets.

What build ideas do you have in mind for the new raid content?

Signet Necro.

Realistically, get rid of Cleansing Water. As an Ele main, I can do without it easily.

_

Replace Diamond Skin in Earth Magic with Cleansing Water (call it, Cleansing Earth) and now Ele’s cannot have high damage, high condition removal and high recovery. They can only pick 2 of the 3.

Problem solved.

You are talking to the developers that made Diamond Skin and Stone Heart.
And they wonder why no one uses Earth Magic traitline.

_

Proc’ing traits are not the issue by design, it’s the sheer lack of creativity.

_

Just look at Powerful Synergy, look at how little went into it’s design.

Powerful Synergy: When you activate a leap combo finisher, it activates twice.

Warrior only has 1 combo field, on it’s longbow and guess what? Fire Aura’s do NOT stack in anyway. Meaning that the trait is completely useless if the warrior is alone. BUT IT GET’S BETTER! There are 9 combo fields in the game, because Auras do not stack duration, this trait only affects 4 of leap finishers, none of them on warrior!! (Minus dark leap, because 6 seconds of blinds vs. 3 seconds is still not beneficial.)
This is a grandmaster trait.

Here is an idea if you want to reward leap finishers on Warriors.

Powerful Synergy: Leap finishers are also blast finishers. Reduce the recharge of skills that leap by 10% for each nearby ally.

_

But hey, some of us has 5,000 hours of pure playing, what do we know?

GrandHaven.1052:

Soooo now the problem is being sidestepped, well done ANET>

Guild Wars 2 will NEVER be an Esport if ArenaNet ignore their own rules. Let alone let bugs be a problem.

Weapon stowing exploit has been a issue for nearly a year now. Why not disable the hotkey option in PvP? Because, abusing a bug is clearly Esports.

Talking to a Mesmer:
“Swap classes, your clones can rally the enemy.”
“How?”
“It’s a bug.”
“Huh? Why?”
“… GG”

Ugh, how can people be so… stupid?

If there were to change 1% critical chance equals 20 precision, that means at 1,200 precision players will get ~4% critical chance increase.

If that was to happen, the inherit 4% chance to critical will have to go away. Which, I am perfectly okay with. How does someone with absolutely 0 precision have a chance to get lucky?

_

There is a lot that needs to be done with the critical stat line. In my opinion only player attacks can critically hit and not traits, runes or sigils. This would allow ArenaNet to safely buff a lot of stuff without getting into that 1-shotting Chill of Death bullkitten Necromancers had last meta.

I’m pretty sure they listen, but there is a difference between listening and not caring.

Orangensaft.7139:

nice change

not sure why they removed the PvP tutorial though…

it took like 3 minutes
and knowing how finishing works and what capping points and rezzing downed players is in this game would be useful for people who really enter PvP the first time

Pressing F should be obvious and at the beginning of every match the announcer flat out says, “capture points”

The tutorial was completely worthless. Not to mention with Stronghold coming capturing points will be irrelevant for that (and courtyard).

_

I was hoping for ArenaNet to introduce a REAL practice mode in replacement instead of just getting rid of the randomized hotjoin button altogether.

Solori.6025:

So let me get this straight.

Top players are now running 3-4 ele comps.
It takes either a really good cele necro or 2-3 people to kill and ele.
And we still have no nerf to the class…

AND

Tempest got buffs.

GG

WTF, why are they buffing Tempest? Are people so bad at ele they had no idea how to play Tempest right?

Was I the ONLY good Tempest player?

God kitten , nerf ele’s so the good ele’s can actually shine.

Donari.5237:

Would the guild bonuses work? Your beta alts can’t rep the guild.

Buy at the Guild Commendation Trader.

I thought I should share a quick list on how to get the most (or unique) experience from the upcoming beta events.

• Throw your ascended armor, accessories and legendary weapons into your bank before the event.
  Since your bank is merely a copy, go ahead and store shareable gear. It is better than the exotic armor provided.

• Don’t forget to craft the runes that are not provided!
  Wonder how a Dragon Hunter is like when, going Invisible with Runes of the Trapper? There are a number of runes that could provide interesting combo’s with the new elite specs, just make sure you have 6 in bank.

• Save those Bonfires and Gnashes Toy Boxes!
  At least, till the beta event.

• Buy some Guild Banner Flags!
  Remember your bank is just a copy, meaning you can share bonuses with non-beta characters. Buy some flags for everyone to enjoy! Now, this can also be done during beta but it’s one of those things of DON’T FORGET TO

• Feasts and Stations.
  With the trading post is closed to beta characters, so don’t forget to store your food sharing options in bank! If you got your Warrior sitting on 100 Feasts of Omnomberry Bars or a Sharpening Stone Station, put it in bank, I know your WvW players would love to have a constant supply of powerful buffs throughout the beta weekend.

zapv.8051:

The people that are suggesting you get to pick are really funny. That would make most conditions builds useless because damage would always get removed first. Last in first out would give ample play and counterplay to both sides, and would be the best option imo. Anything where you could prioritize damaging conditions would be broken.

In my opinion skills should offer temporary condition resistance that weakens the effects of specified conditions rather than pure removal.

As I stated before, the mechanics of conditions are fundamentally broken, depending on what the opponent is using can mean either an easy victory or an impossible uphill battle. There really is no middle ground between the two because the prowess of conditions comes from only 1 stat, meaning that conditions must be balanced AGAINST power, ferocity and precision.

On top of that balance act you have order of removal, in order to kill your opponent you must constantly apply your most powerful condition which means it is FIRST to be cleansed.

There is issue number 3, cleansing is instant and powerful. If you have a condition that deals 5k damage over time getting cleansed before the first tick, that basically equals a 5k BLOCK.

Because of those three mechanics, conditions and power can never truly be balanced for all classes.

So you got to work with what you got I suppose. I personally not a fan of working with a broken mechanic.

aggelos r.5387:

I read a lot that ele is OP, i dont know about this always when i find an averege level ele the most times i win (yes maybe some skiils need a bigger cool down), but mesmer is out of the world permand stealth with clowns that can hit you when in stealth and OP damage

Phantasm Berserker can shred 5k easily against tanky targets.
Phantasm Berserker can deal 0 damage in team fights.

Mesmers have… various problems across the board.

I’m still not happy with ranger owls dealing 5k damage with their active. I get it, they were getting blow up by burning but giving them 150 stat boosts across the board TWICE was not the answer.

Exedore.6320:

x indigo x.6981:

“For generic condition removal, the most recently applied condition or conditions will be removed first.”

Source: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition

Which was wrong for probably a year or more before the June 23rd patch.

The mechanics of conditions are always backwards.

• In order to do a lot of damage, you have to stack a damaging condition.
• The damaging condition can be removed in a single cleanse.
• So you must cover the damaging condition
• But when you try to do more damage, the cleanse order will be the condition you are trying to stack.
• So just throw as much as you can and hope for the best.
• WTF

It’ll come when the cele necro nerfs come.

x indigo x.6981:

“For generic condition removal, the most recently applied condition or conditions will be removed first.”

Source: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition

No kitten Sherlock.

But what if the most DAMAGING condition would be removed first. Sure, that 4 second of blind on ya is pesky but that 6 stacks of burning is a more serious threat. Despite blind being the most recent condition, condition removal will remove the biggest threat.

Would that put conditions in a better spot?

_

I personally think it does, however, it would be even BETTER if you put conditions into impairing and damaging categories. Instead of just removing any condition, you can limit traits to target certain conditions types.

That will allow threatening conditions to be removed easier BUT limit the amount of raw condition removal.

I believe you cannot use the Mystic Forge Conduit in the mists either.

In my opinion, not a big deal.

instead of application order, would that improve condition mechanics?

This wouldn’t be an issue if GW2 wasn’t trying to be an Esport with a small PvP community.

Saiyan.1704:

I feel the same. They should represent more on certain build specializations rather than… “Turn into a block of ice at 20% health”
… like really? lol

Seemed like a good idea.
…
3 years ago in beta.

I am a little saddened by the design of a lot of Sigils and Runes, I feel like a lot more thought could have gone into them.

style.6173:

Nova Stiker.8396:

style.6173:

@OP:

Bad idea.

I still don’t get why people want to discourage people from playing PvP. That is a bad solution.

The better solution is… wait for it…. wait for it…. ANET to actually introduce matchmaking that works.

New players don’t need matchmaking, they need to understand game mechanics.

I could argue that until you are rank 20, you DON’T have a grasp on PvP. Even if you have 4,000 hours of WvW, sPvP is a whole different beast altogether. Heck, I’d lock players out of ranked till rank 40. Sure, that will take a month or two of PvP but if you are players PvPing for two months, those are your dedicated players, those are you players that WILL be doing ranked.

_

The fact is, people trying to get past the PvP lock to play ranked, WILL be playing ranked. I see it more as a goal than a restriction.

Wow. You really don’t get it. People only learn by playing. Who cares if they play in ranked or unranked?? Matchmaking should put people together who are at similar skill levels.

So, essentially, unless you are really low MMR, you have nothing to worry about.

You just don’t understand, let me spell this out.
There are a LOT more PvPers with 100+ games than there are with >10 games.

Guild Wars 2 PvP community is SMALL. I fight an Abjured or Apex premade at least once a night, I assure you that if this game had more hardcore PvPers I might never see a premade ‘pro’ team. I am a great Elementalist (getting better at thief and mesmer) but I don’t have the time (or sanity) to play enough to have 10,000+ games under my belt like most pro teams do.

You can walk into Heart of the Mists, ask everyone how many games have they played. I bet you’ll find 2 people that have under 20 games.

style.6173:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Can I get that on Tornado please? Tornado already takes 4 seconds to do anything (1 second casting time) leaving the elementalist extremely vulnerable and all Elementalist elites are pretty horrible.

I can understand Rampage concept being an unstoppable force of nature but why is it infinitely better than an Tornado, an unstoppable force of nature?

This is huge everyone! The day when eles come onto the PvP forums and ask for buffs.

You want a tornado buff? Sure, how about we also remove your ability to stack burns and might? Ele needs a TON of nerfs before there is any discussion around just straight buffs.

We are going to need a lot of buffs when we get nerfed

Seriously though, the Tempest elite that didn’t do anything, you just activate it and nothing happens, was more helpful!!! At least it triggered runes and traits.

Supreme.3164:

trunks.5249:

Krysard.1364:

trunks.5249:

blubberblasen.3901:

it was the hidden elite skill from ele, because all elite from ele are op, like all skills with zero recharge.

1/4 cast time : “go to the forum and cry how OP all of the ele skills are” zero recharge.

… ah.. again .. anti ele thread..
… for your information: condi Ranger is lame, play melee ranger.
or l2p

what are you talking about crying? i said the guy was impressive.i just wanted to know what he did.has for melee vs condi ranger that’s a matter of a persons play style. no reason to be trolling on a legit question on a thread

Dont care about him, and as said, he was probably using Diamond Skin, bad luck there :/

yeah everyone has said diamond skin i just don’t know why that guy thought i was crying OP

Regardless of your intentions, the majority of ele players feel rightfully on the edge, we all know that the gw2 devs are incapable (unwillingly?) to properly balance their game and therefore most professions end up with 1-2 PvP worthy builds at any point in time.
That one build will be ofc the center of the nerf/buff cycle promoted by “active forum discussion” typical of every MMO; you must realize that as soon as you mention D/D in your thread for whatever reason..you will soon receive visit from people with blood in their eyes and white foam on the sides of their mouth…don’t take it personally

I remember when the cele meta just started, I was using 3 cantips for condi cleansing, allowing me to make a lot of stupid mistakes.

A month later, I started to realize how much cheese was carrying me. Unable to understand certain escape tricks, using skills badly like Earthquake whenever in a fire field, Updrafting on recharge, missing Burning Speed and Ring of Fire.

I wasn’t really punished for those mistakes.

Yet, this one necro got kitten, challenged me to duel him with HIS mirror build and I just laughed. I watched him make every mistake I used to make, running the same cheese I used too.

_

I think I was the ONLY skilled Tempest in the beta. I would run into every fight and just start wrecking because I understood the core mechanics of every skill and how vital it really is to hit your skills.

I want the cele ele meta gone because players have NO idea how to play ele, they use their skills on rotation, whether the skills hit or not.

The biggest issue with Elementalists is their lack of punishment, it was exactly what was wrong with Engineers last meta. You could just eat attacks, miss attacks but recover completely.

Can I get that on Tornado please? Tornado already takes 4 seconds to do anything (1 second casting time) leaving the elementalist extremely vulnerable and all Elementalist elites are pretty horrible.

I can understand Rampage concept being an unstoppable force of nature but why is it infinitely better than an Tornado, an unstoppable force of nature?

style.6173:

@OP:

Bad idea.

I still don’t get why people want to discourage people from playing PvP. That is a bad solution.

The better solution is… wait for it…. wait for it…. ANET to actually introduce matchmaking that works.

New players don’t need matchmaking, they need to understand game mechanics.

I could argue that until you are rank 20, you DON’T have a grasp on PvP. Even if you have 4,000 hours of WvW, sPvP is a whole different beast altogether. Heck, I’d lock players out of ranked till rank 40. Sure, that will take a month or two of PvP but if you are players PvPing for two months, those are your dedicated players, those are you players that WILL be doing ranked.

_

The fact is, people trying to get past the PvP lock to play ranked, WILL be playing ranked. I see it more as a goal than a restriction.

So why is stowing weapon a hot key in PvP?

This is the first I heard of this.

Yet, I am super happy for this <3

_

I just had a match at the start ranger and necro ran far from mid. Because they didn’t see the enemy team.
The enemy team mind you, had 3 MESMERS, maybe one of them has mass invisibility?! I watched two of my team mates run from mid point, leaving me absolutely dumbfounded.

Ironically, the kitten stupid necromancer had Champion Phantom, clearly a title he doesn’t deserve.

This seriously needs to be addressed.

#Staysaproblemfor6months

I found the solution to fixing the queue timer for all players that has high MMR!

Don’t do any unranked or ranked for a month or two.

That will allow your MMR to drop considerably and get into matches. I went from a 15+ minute wait on peak hours to a 7 minute wait on peak hours

Now to enjoy my next 5 unranked matches then it’s back to long queues…

Lettuce.2945:

Talyn Sneider.1825:

Ok, I’ve had it with all the hate…so I’m gonna address some of the accusations being throw around against eles and hope this helps people appreciate were not monsters but players.

On this past weeks I’ve been playing conquest and dueling against pretty much every class out there, my skill level is normal (not an ubber player, so i can represent every elementalist jumping on the hype train, and so you know ele is my main since forever). In this weeks I’ve been insulted, accused of cheating, received rude comments due to asking for practice vs experienced players (God forgive u ask to practice defensive moves while playing D/D)..and even so I came here so I can at least try to separate fact from fiction:

1) Eles are OP

Yes we are, at this moment we have (always had great sustain) and we also manage to deal tons of damage (burning) and also we shine in team fights and can drag fights on points as we see fit.

2) Burning damage is OP on ele

Yes it is, would love to see it reduced (less burn stacks so we don’t destroy condition based builds), we shouldn’t have so much dps as an attrition class

3)Eles have too many sustain

STOP! NO just no…this game is already fast and furious enough…we need some classes to be able to be on point and not melt in 10 seconds flat to a spike…we and guardian bunkers are needed and have a role to play…what we shouldn’t have is sustain and DPS.

4)Eles require no skill, u just need to learn to learn combos and there u go

Are u kidding me???? u need to keep track of cooldowns know when and where not to skip rotations to avoid/deal a spike and return to optimal rotation, u need to manage the smallest health pool of the game knowing that when you’re spiked u have about 10 seconds to react or your dead…I don’t ask for u guys to love eles but this is just wonkers…until the latest balance patch we were considered one of the hardest classes to play and no one contested this…balance patch hits and we no longer take skill…righttttttt

5)PU mesmers and stealth regen thiefs that say that healing on ele is cheesy….

Come on guys…seriously? Seems to me there’s no difference in outhealing while kitting or disappearing and regen health as you need thus resetting the fight.

6)D/D eles win every duel…

Not true at all but we can drag fights so reinforcement come and thus turn a 1vs1 into a team fight…that is our ROLE. Several matchups are pretty bad for us:

PU mesmers
Shatter mesmers
Berzerker thiefs
Berzerker warriors
Condition and celestial necros

If they know what they are doing they are able to out pressure the ele forcing us to play for time, eventually in a 1 vs 1 duel they will gain the upper hand.

7) Warriors on duels that complain when an ele ports to safety in a duel

Ok…I can see where u come from If i stand there in your face u can kill me
faster…but…ermmm hope you don’t take this the wrong way, against you guys we need to kite…and hit when there’s no pressure on us. That is kinda the standard, mesmers do it, thiefs do it…why all the hate when an ele does it too? I also have an warrior and when i face an enemy that doesn’t port and kite i get annoyed because i know that isn’t a good duel, and if I’m dueling i want to fight good players so i can learn.

Cheers and have fun

The moment you listed as berserker thieves as a counter to ele was the moment you lost your credibility as a good ele considering you hard counter them.

A good thief will always beat any ele in a 1v1.

I stated on the front page good ideas to revamp the PvP experience. Doubt a dev would read it though