Guild Wars 2

What Anet doesn’t seem to get is that bunkers are a symptom of a problem, not the problem itself.

Any non-thief non-bunker may as well run around naked in spvp. If you aren’t speccing for bunker, it’ll take the same amount of time to kill you with or without armor.

There’s no point to going for a balanced build, because when a 1-2 skill combo can do 12-18k damage, everything that isn’t bunker is glass cannon.

There’s nothing wrong with this model per se, but unless you’re one of the 3 bunker classes or a thief/mesmer, you’re pretty sol.

Gilgamesh.2561:

What does a bunker engineer offer that a bunker/support mesmer doesn’t plus more? The mesmer can assist between two points easily while bringing allies.

Oh….over 1k health/s from elixir gun +elixir infused bombs, significant AoE damage and control through bombkit and rifle or p/s, the abillity to self-rez and aoe rez teammates, 100% uptime for 100% endurance regen, and the ability to dodge ~5 times in a row? Oh…and the ability to kill off all the mesmers clones in 1-2 aoe attacks.

Arc.9374:

A ton of knockback to bounce people around clocktower and make uncapping it ridonculously difficult.

Also what he said.

You know, just like we discussed in the engineer forums the other day =P.

Nox Aeterna.2965:

If this event does not show you that Nexon got more than a “little” say on what Anet can or cannot do , then i dont know what could.

Because good skins = good items. Right.

I’m a fan of the jumping puzzles and the mini-dungeon. Also the costume brawl is fun.

SanguiniusChan.6032:

Riel.2160:

SanguiniusChan.6032:

This game has the biggest bevvy of whiteknights for it, I swear.

AN are big boys, they don’t need you to roll in and say “It’s your fault you gave them your hard earned money trying to have fun and didn’t have any”.

Truthfully, I’m not mad that I gambled and lost. I’m mad that the odds were set so high. After 30-odd Black Lion chests with keys I bought and dozens of mad king chests, I got nothing at all. I thought the point of the halloween events was to have a good time, and I wanted to kick a little fun AN’s way for doing it.

My mistake was hoping I’d get anything fun out of it. There’s nothing fun about opening so many crates and boxes and getting nothing of value. Then crafting all those fangs and kitteny things I made to get a single “major sigil of night”. The mechanic itself was absolutely foolish.

I’ll put the analogy to something younger people can understand. Can you imagine Christmas being fun if the point was to open 40 presents, with only one in a million chances of getting anything but string? Oh, but at least you can knit your own sweater from the fuclkoads of refuse you got. Two hours of disappointment later, your family and friends say that if you give them all your string, you can open a few more things and get colored string. Now you can knit your own themed sweater, provided that you care enough, can knit, and don’t mind it coming out more like a glove that’s likely the wrong size.

All I wanted out of it was a little fun. It didn’t have to be this way.

WTH? last sentence of yours All I wanted out of it was a little fun. It didn’t have to be this way
first you got free horns
2 costumes another head 4 guaranteed minis if you decided to spend money on event

you got new events mini dungeon costume brawl new chain quest that barely started and you are complaining about what? 5 rare skins? that is your idea of fun?

Nah man, nah. You’re missing the point.

The event itself is certainly fun in places. If nothing else, walking around and seeing the world decked out for Christmas is refreshing. Going to my kid’s pageant is refreshing. Getting to spend time with my family is fun, and hilarious.

I’m just saying: There would be loads of hurt feelings if part of Christmas was gambling over presents. I’m saying that when I bought fifteen keys, I was trying to have a good time. Instead I got an average amount of disappointment, compounded by a system designed to give me further disappointment.

That’s what didn’t have to be this way.

Thing is, with the new change, you are guaranteed halloween themed items, and mats needed to craft the more rare skins.

What you aren’t guaranteed is getting the best halloween items, but that’s the way it works in all mmo’s.

Yoshihito.5928:

Taihaku.8412:

So people complain about not winning at the lottery so Anet listens and gives another chance for people to win the lottery but this time include halloween crafting mats and valuable materials and people STILL complain? NOTHING besides making the skins accessible to everyone will satisfy you people.

Ghostwhisper.7921:

this isnt what was advertised PERIOD we have tons of reason to still complain… yeah i got halloween tonics now instead of mystery tonics … would i spend 50$ on tonics???? no way in hell. am i spending another dime on this game if im not refunded for my 50$ in keys no way in hell. you may think its all fine on your patch of grass looking at me on my patch… i dont so go kitten off

NEVER did Arenanet say that the black lion chests had a 100% chance of having a skin. How on earth is this false advertising.

The only reason I was excited for the Halloween event were the skins, especially the Greatsaw Greatsword Skin. But after the crap they pulled, I’m not supporting their company anymore.

New PvP tourney system. 30 new dynamic events. 3 New jumping puzzles. 1 new mini dungeon. So you werent interested in the pvp or pve aspect of this game, only the skins? (and this is ignoring the craftable skins, the scavenger hunt, and the costume brawl)

So do you just play this game to collect skins o.0?

AcidicVision.5498:

Lol at OP troll. Dude got one of the rare pauldron skins and mats he can sell or craft with. More valuable than practically anything you could get out of a black lion chest.

On top of that, all mad king items, with exception to the rare crafting mats were Halloween themed. This is exactly what people were originally expecting from the BLCs.

There is nothing to legitimately complain about anymore. People were upset they bought keys for Halloween stuff and the only event stuff in the chests was super rare. So they added a new chest to give us Halloween stuff. The problem was solved, but I can’t say everyone that was initially spurned by buying keys will ever jump to buy more for another event.

This. You got halloween items, 100% guaranteed. You didn’t get the best halloween items, but you got halloween items.

Op knows how to use his brain…honestly you can get the greatsaw for 30 key’s worth of gems—>gold atm.

I like bbq ruffles. But the op does have a point.

jule.3289:

question : In alchemy I’ve always played with the master rank and put the trait point 10 “Cleaning formula (409) throwing or consuming elixirs removes conditions from those affected”
I’m quite sure before the halloween patch it used to remove all the condition.
But now it only remove 1 condition.
I might be wrong. Just asking?

You aren’t wrong, it has actually been that way for about 2 weeks though. Prior, it did remove all conditions.

Ronin.5038:

With the changes that ANet has been making, i should probably remake my engineer to be a dark skinned scottish man with an eyepatch.
ANet just really wants us to be demomen rather than engineers.

Can we…..can we get this as an option? I would play through all of the story missions and dungeons again If my charr engineer had a deep scottish accent. A kilt would be cool too.

A few individuals mentioned pve, and grenades.
The thing about grenades (and bombs) is that they scale very well with both power and condition damage. You get the best of both worlds.

Bomb kit, along with the proper defensive traits is amazing in certain dungeons and events. I’ve kited bosses and entire rooms with a modified tpvp bunker build while the rest of the team wiped. Grenade kits do awesome damage against stationary targets. The issue grenades have is that it is very difficult to get them to do 100% damage against a moving target, because the area where the 3 independant aoes for each of the 3 grenades overlap is actually quite small (diameter of 100 units, guesstimate). Outside that area grenades do 2/3 or even 1/3 damage. Bombs, on the other hand, do full damage regardless of where your target is in a given area.

Granted, the moving targets issue is much less of an issue in pve than pvp. But yeah, for pve use Grenades or bombs (or both) for offense. Both rifle and pistol get outclassed by bombs and grenades because bombs and grenades scale with both power and condition.

Edit:
As to flamethrower, get the best damage gear and traits for flamethrower in isle of the mists. Shoot the heavy golem and time how long it takes to kill. Switch to any other weapon: rifle, pistol, grenade, bomb. Run the best build for those against the heavy golem and time how long it takes to kill it. You’ll find that flamethrower looses to all of them. I’ve done the above multiple times and flamethrower tends to loose by a fairly large margin. Shame really….

Tbh, I’m not a huge fan of the system, I just don’t see why it’s such a huge deal compared to the fun of the new events, new jumping puzzles etc But the system is probably sustainable. And it is a fashion show, and I don’t care much for fashion shows aside from spending a couple of g on dye. I’ve also been fortunate in that I’ve gotten in on things at the right time and made good moves with my gold.

The system also funds further development, and if it is sustainable, we will see more real content as a result. I actually like that idea a bit more, more jumping puzzles, dungeons, and pvp for me.

CaptSlate.6205:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

I have neither the time nor the inclination to go that in depth in my analysis. However, I will say this. If the price of the GS stabillizes at or below 25g, in this high demand environment, the system will work just fine, because it is then accessible to most of the player base and supply is meeting demand.

But again, isn’t this whole ordeal in relation to what will happen to the market place NEXT, not what is happening now? Why 25g is that some magic number? I admit that 25g seems like price point that would be accessible to a group of people with the resources to achieve such a price point, however, what about people that cannot achieve this price point in the next 14 days or how ever long the event runs? Are these people expendable, are they to be laughed at for attempting to achieve their goal of getting the item they wanted via “legit” means ergo those means set forth by Anet and not the player market?

25g is the pricemark for many high end (in terms of appearence) sub legendary exotics not precursors to a legendary weapon e.g. the Charrzooka.

Tbh, the price of ‘event’ items tends to go down with time, not up. Look at Gw1 miniatures, the early miniatures were cool and worth tens if not hundreds of ectos in some cases. They were relased on a yearly basis on the characters birthday. Early ‘rare’ minipets, such as Rurik, became worth significantly less with time as compared to later ‘rare’ minipets e.g. Shiro, Destroyers, Aatxes, etc.

Once the novelty wears off, the price goes down. What we’re seeing is a glorified digital fashion show. Most mmo’s have it these days. I used the Charrzooka as an example earlier. At one point they were commonly traded at 98g. Now they are traded at 23g.

I have neither the time nor the inclination to go that in depth in my analysis. However, I will say this. If the price of the GS stabillizes at or below 25g, in this high demand environment, the system will work just fine, because it is then accessible to most of the player base and supply is meeting demand.

spencerharrison.8136:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Derek.9254:

i ahve to be extremely lucky then : / i guess thats the RNG for you. I opened 70 chests got 1 of each of the shoulders, the one handed sword skin, and 2 scythes which made me get like a 10g profit. My first 50 chests i got absolutely nothing then i got 2-3 in a row with items.

Reality is more people are like you than the whiners in the thread. One has only to look at the average basket value of the new items after release to confirm that.

spencerharrison.8136:

Again:

To the people making elaborate arguments to the effect of – “You should avoid the RNG and go to the trading post!”

The trading post market only exists because of the RNG being fed en-mass.

I’ll say it again for clarity. Warning, there will be caps.

THE TRADING POST MARKET FOR THESE ITEMS IS DEPENDENT ON THE KEYS BEING PURCHASED TO UNLOCK THE CHESTS IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Sorry. But this doesn’t need to become a zombie lie. The RNG system rewards vultures on the TP, and punishes people participating and purchasing. This is bad business on Anets part.

If the items were so damnd rare, I wouldn’t be able to buy a onehanded chansaw for 8 gold. Reality is they’re dropping in sufficient quantity to maintain a low price.

lol

You’re not even listening. Cost isn’t the point.

Let’s switch this up: What is the motivation to unlock black lion chests in the future for people that weren’t satisfied with this experience? I can say for sure I WILL be taking YOUR advice and sitting on the trading post next time these items come out. I absolutely will NEVER tangle with the RNG again. Work smart not hard right?

But guess what?

That means less chests being opened, and less items. Less items means higher prices. So you’re argument on the basis of low cost is self defeating.

Ok, I’ll play your game.
a) Fewer chests being opened —> rare items dropped from those chests become more valuable because supply decreases with respect to demand.

b) Drops from chest worth more —> better payoff matrix —>more people open chests because of potential for increased rewards

c) More people open chests —>more rare drops & more people screwed by RNG

d) More rare drops —→rare drops become worth less.

e) Rare drops worth less/people disapointed —→ lower payoff matrix —>fewer people open chests.

f) go back to (a).

All such systems have an equilibrium point. Hours after release, we’re nowhere near said point. However:

In a high demand environment cost is a direct indicator of rarity and drop rate, and for items a few hours old, all but the GS and the staff are very low in price for completely new items.

In case anyone is wondering, the current price of the GS is at a min of 46 with an average of 48-50 * . Compare to guys claiming 60 or 70 hours ago.

• Source: http://imgur.com/6IuLy

Derek.9254:

i ahve to be extremely lucky then : / i guess thats the RNG for you. I opened 70 chests got 1 of each of the shoulders, the one handed sword skin, and 2 scythes which made me get like a 10g profit. My first 50 chests i got absolutely nothing then i got 2-3 in a row with items.

Reality is more people are like you than the whiners in the thread. One has only to look at the average basket value of the new items after release to confirm that.

spencerharrison.8136:

Again:

To the people making elaborate arguments to the effect of – “You should avoid the RNG and go to the trading post!”

The trading post market only exists because of the RNG being fed en-mass.

I’ll say it again for clarity. Warning, there will be caps.

THE TRADING POST MARKET FOR THESE ITEMS IS DEPENDENT ON THE KEYS BEING PURCHASED TO UNLOCK THE CHESTS IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Sorry. But this doesn’t need to become a zombie lie. The RNG system rewards vultures on the TP, and punishes people participating and purchasing. This is bad business on Anets part.

If the items were so damnd rare, I wouldn’t be able to buy a onehanded chansaw for 8 gold. Reality is they’re dropping in sufficient quantity to maintain a low price.

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

spencerharrison.8136:

To the posters insulting people who bought keys and expected an item:

We aren’t talking about the US economy or housing market. We’re talking about a stupid video game where people want to run around with a pumpkin rifle. Based on colorful advertising and good faith, a lot of people paid some money with the understanding that doing so would give them a “chance” at those items.

That “chance” is being proven to be aggressively small. Different people came into this with different expectations, but I do think its safe to say that the cost of keys, coupled with the tiny percent chance of a skin, equates to a more cynical policy than fans of Anet anticipated.

Fair enough. Lesson learned. Personal responsibility also means licking your wounds and moving on. Those that feel they got misled, will be less likely to give Anet cash like that on impulse.

In my opinion, that’s bad business for Anet, and less fun for the players who weren’t so lucky. It didn’t have to be that way, and I don’t think there is ANY harm in lambasting Anet for this mess. They can, and should do better by their players.

The chance isn’t aggressively small if most of the items can currently be bought for less than 10 gold, especially given how everyone seems to want these items and thus the demand is inflated.

Only 1 Item, the greatsword, costs significantly more than that (55 gold). People wanted a chainsaw greatsword. That want overcame their restraint, and many of them spent with their credit cards to buy keys. That’s a lack of responsibility.

Every single other weapon costs about as much as a decent skinned exotic in terms of gold. Every. Single. One.

Its a classic case of demand outpacing supply, in this case for one particular item. This led to many making bad decisions. We can pity them, but it is no one elses fault but their own.

In the meantime, the scythe staff skin is currently going for 40g, I am sure those “10g” and below items were skins people don’t want, or simply don’t exist. But thank you for skewing one small fact to try and suit your flawed portrayal of a larger picture.

Current Prices (1:39 am October 23):
The Chain sword (one handed) is 8 gold (and falling). No one wants a chainsaw sword. Nope. No one.
The Rifle is 5 gold.
The Shield is 20 gold.
The dagger is 8 gold. No dagger thiefs out there, mhmmm.
All 9 of the shoulder pads (3 of light, medium, and heavy) are all worth 5-10 gold. No one wants spikey skull shoulder pads. Nope, no one.

Yup, I REALLY skewed it. Those drops must be SO rare, to be worth less than typical “cool skinned” exotics.

Reality is this: The greatsword is used by Guardians, Mesmers, Warriors, and Rangers. 3 Of those classes have very popular greatsword builds.

Staves are also used by Necros,Guardians, Mesmers, and Elementalist. Again, higher demand.

Basic supply and demand. The drops are fine, judging by market prices of say…the one handed chainsaw. Demand is skewed toward the items used by most classes. Common sense.

Oh look, there goes the price of greatswords hitting 60g.

You nailed the issue on the head btw, thank you for supporting our argument – the supply is pathetically low.

The greatsaw did not spike to 60 at any time during the past 15 minutes. I’ve been monitoring it. It went 55—>56—>54—>55. It is currently 55. Nice exaggeration on your part though, please continue.

Not for the 15 minutes you were looking at. Look at the listing prices of the Greatsword.

But 55 gold, my, that is a bigggggggggggggggg difference /sarcasm.

Once again, thank you for supporting our argument that the halloween weapon skins are ill-conceived.

2 Lowest greatsaws are at 52 gold and 41 gold atm. Keep talking mister sarcasm.

source: http://imgur.com/NfpDa

So there was 1 person who undercut everyone else by 10 gold. I should thank that person, not Anet.

Once again, thank you for supporting our argument, that the players have to band together to play the system.

Oh wait, its the same players who have to purchase off the Gem Store first. Sorry but no dice. Anet still wins woooo /fanboyism

You’re totally right. The fact that speculators bumped the price up to 78 gold an hour and a half a go and the fact that the average price currently is 52 gold means nothing.

Nope, the price isn’t falling at all. Not one bit. Why I bet tomorrow it will be at 150 gold.

It’s not at all like the price of a new coveted item released only hours ago is dropping more than 10g/hour. GG, fellow fanbois, we’re toast. This man is onto us.

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

spencerharrison.8136:

To the posters insulting people who bought keys and expected an item:

We aren’t talking about the US economy or housing market. We’re talking about a stupid video game where people want to run around with a pumpkin rifle. Based on colorful advertising and good faith, a lot of people paid some money with the understanding that doing so would give them a “chance” at those items.

That “chance” is being proven to be aggressively small. Different people came into this with different expectations, but I do think its safe to say that the cost of keys, coupled with the tiny percent chance of a skin, equates to a more cynical policy than fans of Anet anticipated.

Fair enough. Lesson learned. Personal responsibility also means licking your wounds and moving on. Those that feel they got misled, will be less likely to give Anet cash like that on impulse.

In my opinion, that’s bad business for Anet, and less fun for the players who weren’t so lucky. It didn’t have to be that way, and I don’t think there is ANY harm in lambasting Anet for this mess. They can, and should do better by their players.

The chance isn’t aggressively small if most of the items can currently be bought for less than 10 gold, especially given how everyone seems to want these items and thus the demand is inflated.

Only 1 Item, the greatsword, costs significantly more than that (55 gold). People wanted a chainsaw greatsword. That want overcame their restraint, and many of them spent with their credit cards to buy keys. That’s a lack of responsibility.

Every single other weapon costs about as much as a decent skinned exotic in terms of gold. Every. Single. One.

Its a classic case of demand outpacing supply, in this case for one particular item. This led to many making bad decisions. We can pity them, but it is no one elses fault but their own.

In the meantime, the scythe staff skin is currently going for 40g, I am sure those “10g” and below items were skins people don’t want, or simply don’t exist. But thank you for skewing one small fact to try and suit your flawed portrayal of a larger picture.

Current Prices (1:39 am October 23):
The Chain sword (one handed) is 8 gold (and falling). No one wants a chainsaw sword. Nope. No one.
The Rifle is 5 gold.
The Shield is 20 gold.
The dagger is 8 gold. No dagger thiefs out there, mhmmm.
All 9 of the shoulder pads (3 of light, medium, and heavy) are all worth 5-10 gold. No one wants spikey skull shoulder pads. Nope, no one.

Yup, I REALLY skewed it. Those drops must be SO rare, to be worth less than typical “cool skinned” exotics.

Reality is this: The greatsword is used by Guardians, Mesmers, Warriors, and Rangers. 3 Of those classes have very popular greatsword builds.

Staves are also used by Necros,Guardians, Mesmers, and Elementalist. Again, higher demand.

Basic supply and demand. The drops are fine, judging by market prices of say…the one handed chainsaw. Demand is skewed toward the items used by most classes. Common sense.

Oh look, there goes the price of greatswords hitting 60g.

You nailed the issue on the head btw, thank you for supporting our argument – the supply is pathetically low.

The greatsaw did not spike to 60 at any time during the past 15 minutes. I’ve been monitoring it. It went 55—>56—>54—>55. It is currently 55. Nice exaggeration on your part though, please continue.

Not for the 15 minutes you were looking at. Look at the listing prices of the Greatsword.

But 55 gold, my, that is a bigggggggggggggggg difference /sarcasm.

Once again, thank you for supporting our argument that the halloween weapon skins are ill-conceived.

2 Lowest greatsaws are at 52 gold and 41 gold atm. Keep talking mister sarcasm.

source: http://imgur.com/NfpDa

Look, I get that some people got kittened by the RNG. That happens in all games.

With the exception of the 2 items used by the largest number of classes, these items are remarkably low in cost for items that were released mere hours ago. In most mmo’s I’ve played (Runescape, WoW, War, EvE), whenever something is released, it is massively overpriced initially.

Oct 23, 1:52pm PST, greatsaw available for 43 gold. Screenshot taken if someone wants to see it. The price of these items is simply too volatile atm, and is massivley inflated.

So, Judging by the less volatile items, The single handed chainsaw, for instance, which has dropped from 12 gold to 8 gold, the items aren’t that rare. And the speculators for the greatsword will get bored as no one buys their product over the next few days.

My prediction is that the greatsword will stabilize at 25g within 1 to 1.5 weeks, roughly the same level of say the charrzooka.

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

spencerharrison.8136:

To the posters insulting people who bought keys and expected an item:

We aren’t talking about the US economy or housing market. We’re talking about a stupid video game where people want to run around with a pumpkin rifle. Based on colorful advertising and good faith, a lot of people paid some money with the understanding that doing so would give them a “chance” at those items.

That “chance” is being proven to be aggressively small. Different people came into this with different expectations, but I do think its safe to say that the cost of keys, coupled with the tiny percent chance of a skin, equates to a more cynical policy than fans of Anet anticipated.

Fair enough. Lesson learned. Personal responsibility also means licking your wounds and moving on. Those that feel they got misled, will be less likely to give Anet cash like that on impulse.

In my opinion, that’s bad business for Anet, and less fun for the players who weren’t so lucky. It didn’t have to be that way, and I don’t think there is ANY harm in lambasting Anet for this mess. They can, and should do better by their players.

The chance isn’t aggressively small if most of the items can currently be bought for less than 10 gold, especially given how everyone seems to want these items and thus the demand is inflated.

Only 1 Item, the greatsword, costs significantly more than that (55 gold). People wanted a chainsaw greatsword. That want overcame their restraint, and many of them spent with their credit cards to buy keys. That’s a lack of responsibility.

Every single other weapon costs about as much as a decent skinned exotic in terms of gold. Every. Single. One.

Its a classic case of demand outpacing supply, in this case for one particular item. This led to many making bad decisions. We can pity them, but it is no one elses fault but their own.

In the meantime, the scythe staff skin is currently going for 40g, I am sure those “10g” and below items were skins people don’t want, or simply don’t exist. But thank you for skewing one small fact to try and suit your flawed portrayal of a larger picture.

Current Prices (1:39 am October 23):
The Chain sword (one handed) is 8 gold (and falling). No one wants a chainsaw sword. Nope. No one.
The Rifle is 5 gold.
The Shield is 20 gold.
The dagger is 8 gold. No dagger thiefs out there, mhmmm.
All 9 of the shoulder pads (3 of light, medium, and heavy) are all worth 5-10 gold. No one wants spikey skull shoulder pads. Nope, no one.

Yup, I REALLY skewed it. Those drops must be SO rare, to be worth less than typical “cool skinned” exotics.

Reality is this: The greatsword is used by Guardians, Mesmers, Warriors, and Rangers. 3 Of those classes have very popular greatsword builds.

Staves are also used by Necros,Guardians, Mesmers, and Elementalist. Again, higher demand.

Basic supply and demand. The drops are fine, judging by market prices of say…the one handed chainsaw. Demand is skewed toward the items used by most classes. Common sense.

Oh look, there goes the price of greatswords hitting 60g.

You nailed the issue on the head btw, thank you for supporting our argument – the supply is pathetically low.

The greatsaw did not spike to 60 at any time during the past 15 minutes. I’ve been monitoring it. It went 55—>56—>54—>55. It is currently 55. Nice exaggeration on your part though, please continue.

Pikafan.3792:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

spencerharrison.8136:

To the posters insulting people who bought keys and expected an item:

We aren’t talking about the US economy or housing market. We’re talking about a stupid video game where people want to run around with a pumpkin rifle. Based on colorful advertising and good faith, a lot of people paid some money with the understanding that doing so would give them a “chance” at those items.

That “chance” is being proven to be aggressively small. Different people came into this with different expectations, but I do think its safe to say that the cost of keys, coupled with the tiny percent chance of a skin, equates to a more cynical policy than fans of Anet anticipated.

Fair enough. Lesson learned. Personal responsibility also means licking your wounds and moving on. Those that feel they got misled, will be less likely to give Anet cash like that on impulse.

In my opinion, that’s bad business for Anet, and less fun for the players who weren’t so lucky. It didn’t have to be that way, and I don’t think there is ANY harm in lambasting Anet for this mess. They can, and should do better by their players.

The chance isn’t aggressively small if most of the items can currently be bought for less than 10 gold, especially given how everyone seems to want these items and thus the demand is inflated.

Only 1 Item, the greatsword, costs significantly more than that (55 gold). People wanted a chainsaw greatsword. That want overcame their restraint, and many of them spent with their credit cards to buy keys. That’s a lack of responsibility.

Every single other weapon costs about as much as a decent skinned exotic in terms of gold. Every. Single. One.

Its a classic case of demand outpacing supply, in this case for one particular item. This led to many making bad decisions. We can pity them, but it is no one elses fault but their own.

In the meantime, the scythe staff skin is currently going for 40g, I am sure those “10g” and below items were skins people don’t want, or simply don’t exist. But thank you for skewing one small fact to try and suit your flawed portrayal of a larger picture.

Current Prices (1:39 am October 23):
The Chain sword (one handed) is 8 gold (and falling). No one wants a chainsaw sword. Nope. No one.
The Rifle is 5 gold.
The Shield is 20 gold.
The dagger is 8 gold. No dagger thiefs out there, mhmmm.
All 9 of the shoulder pads (3 of light, medium, and heavy) are all worth 5-10 gold. No one wants spikey skull shoulder pads. Nope, no one.

Yup, I REALLY skewed it. Those drops must be SO rare, to be worth less than typical “cool skinned” exotics.

Reality is this: The greatsword is used by Guardians, Mesmers, Warriors, and Rangers. 3 Of those classes have very popular greatsword builds.

Staves are also used by Necros,Guardians, Mesmers, and Elementalist. Again, higher demand.

Basic supply and demand. The drops are fine, judging by market prices of say…the one handed chainsaw. Demand is skewed toward the items used by most classes. Common sense.

There is a gaping hole in this argument, friend.

None of these items would be available for purchase were it not for many of the people complaining in this thread. The market for gold buyers is ONLY available on the backs of keybuyers. Period. There is not one without the other.

The trouble is, the two are clearly not equal in terms of investment and result.

Obviously, waiting and buying it with gold is a better choice. But if everyone did that, there would be no items. So all the clever patience and responsibility in the world wouldn’t make those skins pop up on the auction house. What did? A bunch of players dumping money into an RNG that is obviously more stingy than most anticipated.

We’re both clearly on different sides here, but I think with clear eyes it isn’t difficult to see the problem here. The challenge for Anet is how to improve this system in the future to reward players who take the initiative and invest in them rather than those who sat on their hands and then ridiculed.

That’s just not true. If they were so rare, then all of the above items would be much more expensive. They aren’t. The people that got nothing complain the most. The people that got multiple drops sell them on the market. The RNG is not kind to all.

spencerharrison.8136:

To the posters insulting people who bought keys and expected an item:

We aren’t talking about the US economy or housing market. We’re talking about a stupid video game where people want to run around with a pumpkin rifle. Based on colorful advertising and good faith, a lot of people paid some money with the understanding that doing so would give them a “chance” at those items.

That “chance” is being proven to be aggressively small. Different people came into this with different expectations, but I do think its safe to say that the cost of keys, coupled with the tiny percent chance of a skin, equates to a more cynical policy than fans of Anet anticipated.

Fair enough. Lesson learned. Personal responsibility also means licking your wounds and moving on. Those that feel they got misled, will be less likely to give Anet cash like that on impulse.

In my opinion, that’s bad business for Anet, and less fun for the players who weren’t so lucky. It didn’t have to be that way, and I don’t think there is ANY harm in lambasting Anet for this mess. They can, and should do better by their players.

The chance isn’t aggressively small if most of the items can currently be bought for less than 10 gold, especially given how everyone seems to want these items and thus the demand is inflated.

Only 1 Item, the greatsword, costs significantly more than that (55 gold). People wanted a chainsaw greatsword. That want overcame their restraint, and many of them spent with their credit cards to buy keys. That’s a lack of responsibility.

Every single other weapon costs about as much as a decent skinned exotic in terms of gold. Every. Single. One.

Its a classic case of demand outpacing supply, in this case for one particular item. This led to many making bad decisions. We can pity them, but it is no one elses fault but their own.

fellyn.5083:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Ah, just let the people in this thread wallow in their misery.
“Woe is me, woe is me, I can’t get that one cosmetic item!”

GW1 had FoW armor, Vabbi armor, and the like which were much, much harder to get. To say nothing of Crystalline Swords. So yeah, GW1 had ‘absurd’ cosmetic items as well.

How many hundreds of ectos did a gold Crystalline Sword cost in GW1? Yeah exactly.

Reactions to this event on other media (e.g. reddit) and in game are overwhelmingly positive, so with that I’m done with this thread.

Difference being that people didn’t spend real money back then. Hard to believe that has to be pointed out.

Any of the items are available for in game currency, even the greatsword everyone wants is dropping in price, back down to 55 atm. Everything else is at or near 10 gold.

You can buy everything for gold, much less gold than the cost of a legendary or even a charrzoka for most of the items.

You don’t have to spend a single Penny.
Hard to believe that has to be pointed out.

Kirrund.2654:

You guys don’t have patience. You’re all too busy rushing off to gamble your money away instead of waiting to see what the event unfolds. For all you know, upon completion of a phase, you get to choose a single permanent skin of your choice.

But guys the world revolves around me! I didn’t get what I deserve!

Come on, seriously. Act like responsible adults.

Edit: And no, everyone had a fair shot at them. You all had the same fair shot as other people who got their skins.

Gambling is gambling and chance means exactly that. Remember that. Stay out of casinos.

This, and honestly you can get, and will be able to get Every Single Skin after the event for gold, and less gold than a legendary at that.
——————————————————————————————————————-
Seriously, I think Arenanet assumed people with access to credit cards had a bit more restraint, control, and common sense.

Ah, just let the people in this thread wallow in their misery.
“Woe is me, woe is me, I can’t get that one cosmetic item!”

GW1 had FoW armor, Vabbi armor, and the like which were much, much harder to get. To say nothing of Crystalline Swords. So yeah, GW1 had ‘absurd’ cosmetic items as well.

How many hundreds of ectos did a gold Crystalline Sword cost in GW1? Yeah exactly.

Reactions to this event on other media (e.g. reddit) and in game are overwhelmingly positive, so with that I’m done with this thread.

A handful of people complaining on the forums. Every lion’s arch on every server in NA has been overflowing for hours with people having fun.

So much bad word of mouth is gonna happen.

tomlin.8204:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

If you had spent your 20,30,50 dollars or more on gold instead of keys you would have enough money to afford just about anything in the game.

This is so completely and utterly false. Do you have any idea at all how much gold you get from 20,30,50 dollars? Do you have any idea what the most expensive things in game cost? Have a look before replying.

At the current exchange rate over the last 30 minutes, you will get 16,24, or 40 gold. Most expensive item is chainsaw greatsword at 33 gold and dropping.

And this isn’t as high as the peak exchange rate.

Completely and utterly false, right bra * roll eyes *.

If you have the gold or the money to open 40 chests, you have the gold or the money (at the current phenomenal exchange rate) to buy any skin you want on the market.

Common Sense FTW?

matt.8960:

ReginaBuenaobra.6953:

You are not guaranteed to receive a rare item after opening a Black Lion Chest. You have a chance to get a unique/rare item. Some people are luckier than others. The Halloween skins are tradeable, so if you aren’t able to get them in a Black Lion Chest, you can obtain them on the Trading Post.

Thanks for letting us know up front the “chance” was so low. That’s definitely revolutionizing the industry. And not only do we not get any kind of warning on the futility of our efforts, but we get a nice semi-snarky reply from a moderator to boot.

Typical tactics of the cash shop games.

Cash shop games? These are skins you’re “paying” for, not stats. Le sigh.

Likewise, you guys realize there are at least 3 “free” custom skins available, as well as a number of craft able custom skins?

There are non-gold intensive new skins and items for everyone.

If you had spent your 20,30,50 dollars or more on gold instead of keys you would have enough money to afford just about anything in the game.

Also, multiple new events, and new jumping puzzles, and more to come over 3 more ‘acts’ isn’t fun?
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Update-Notes-October-22-2012
They added a lot in this patch. You just have to be smart with your money/gold.

The point is, you can get any item you want except the chainsword for 5 gold (chainsword is 11 right now). 99% chance you wont get any item you want for 5 (or 11) gold worth of keys.

Mkalafut.1273:

Yep, the joy of randomized festivities in a “fun” event. The only people having fun here are the people who are going to buy out all of the skins and own the market themselves.

Had actually thought about doing this, but decided to go for the RL karma for helping people after realizing my own stupidity after buying 30 keys.

I’m just going to leave this here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/halloween/Cash-Gems-Gold-Skins

You’re welcome.

The gold/gem exchange rate is temporarily quite high. The drop rate of skins is abysmal.

For about 20usd or12g, if you want the chainsaw, or 5g or less for most other things, you can get any item that you want.

You don’t need to buy 200 keys or spend 50 dollars and 10 gold on keys. Just search the item you want, and buy it from a player for gold.

You’re welcome.

Also, things will probably get more expensive, as the market saturates with gems, so you may want to hurry.

“A fool and his money are soon parted.”

But then there’s the equally true adage:

“Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.”

I rather doubt people will buy keys on future holidays.

Deleted, forum bug prevented editing above post earlier.

It’s the question of condition damage, power, and crit damage. There was a very thorough, well researched, and detailed post about this in general a while back.

Thing is, pistols scale linearly with condition damage gear. That is to say that if you have + x condition damage gear, your abilities will do:
[total condition damage]=[normal condition damage] + [scaling factor]*[x]
where scaling factor depends on the condition (bleed, poison, burning, confusion).

Rifle scales geometrically with power and exponentially with crit damage. That is to say if you have power y and crit damage modifier z, you will get:

[Total damage]=[base damage] * [some scaling factor] * [y]

Since rifle can easily be traited and geared to give over 50% base crit (over 70% with fury), we also look at crit damage values, which scale with both crit damage z and [Total Damage] calculated above :

[Crit Damage]=[Total Damage]*exponential([Base Crit Dmg]+[z])

To find the estimated values of [Scaling Factor] and [Base Crit Dmg], you’ll actually have to do some digging in the general forums.

Important conclusions from above. Since [Total Damage] scales geometrically with [base damage] as does [Total Crit Damage] implicitly through [Total Damage], [base damage] is extremely important. Rifle has roughly double the base damage of Pistol. Further, abilities like scattershot have another multiplier on top of that.

What this means is that at level 80 with massive attribute gains from traits and gear, rifle scales much better than pistols because all of rifle’s multipliers are geometric or exponential, where as pistols main scaling comes from condition damage which is linear. Yes, pistols scale with power and crit damage as well, but horribly compared to rifle due to roughly having half the base damage.
————————————————————————-
DISCLAIMER: The above analysis neglects the effect of toughness. Toughness has a low geometric scaling effect in decreasing damage (compared to the high geometric scaling of power), but toughness does scale geometrically as well. Condition damage ignores that reduction. So a high toughness low health target (like most guardians, and some builds from other classes) may in fact die faster due to conditions. However, this is the exception rather than the rule.

All of the above also explains while flamethrower starts out awesome at low levels, and becomes much worse at higher levels; poor scaling.

Generally, the ability to hold a single point against at least 2 individuals (preferably more) for a prolonged (>1.5 minutes, preferably longer) period of time.

The whole point of ‘bunkers’ is as follows. You have a 5 man team. 2 of them are bunkers, the rest are roamers. Once your team captures a point, you leave a bunker on said point. Your roamers go and capture more points. Enemy roamers come over to capture previous point. Bunker holds enemy team long enough for friendly roamers to come back and save the point.

In prolonged bunker vs bunker fights, which can happen, the bunker with more knockbacks usually wins because the repeated knockbacks allow one of the bunkers to actually take the point while still fighting the other bunker.

Atm, the best bunkers are Guardian>Engineer>Elementalist. Engineer bunkers (typically revolving around bomb kit) are popular because they can generally beat a guardian bunker in terms of knock backs, and maybe even kill the guardian (because engi bunkers, unlike guardian bunkers, can actually kill stuff…slowly). As such, an engineer bunker has an easier time taking points. However, engineers generally have much less survivability then guardians when it becomes a 3v1 as compared to a 2v1, but the knockbacks help and so it is possible, but difficult, to survive long enough for the friendly roamers to arrive.

In the OP’s video, there’s nothing bunker about it. He barely spends any time on a point, spends most of the video kiting off-point and bursting people down. That’s a roamer, by definition. And his video shows a decent pub-stomping roamer, to be sure.

That’s not a bunker engineer. That’s a power-crit (your highest rifle damage is around 1400) rifle-toolbelt (static discharge+skill selection to maximize single target damage) build for pub-stomping (lack of stunbreaker, in a decent tpvp match the first warrior or thief you encountered that had a stun would have dominated you in ~3 seconds).

There is not a single element of bunker engineer in that video.

Now, it is a decent pub-stomping power-crit rifle-toolbelt video, but it is no bunker.

Metalripper.5406:

Those two are possibly the worst classes for WvW, I know people will come in here and refute me, but it’s likely because they haven’t played any of the other classes.

The necro, necro attrition builds are incredibly effective simply because WvW is skewed to burst damage. Minion masters don’t fare well in large battles because so much aoe is being thrown around, and Conditionmancers are somewhat effective, but any enemy worth his salt will have ways to cure conditions..

Engineer- Lots of people say a power/precision rifle build is good, but I don’t see it being anywhere near as effective as other classes. the one thing they can do really well is sit on top of a wall during a siege and chuck nades on the enemy’s head, but they are nearly useless in open area fights because of their hilariously long travel time.

This person has no idea what he’s talking about. As an engineer you don’t run an out of date glass cannon rifle build in wvw, you run a grenadier build which gives you infinitely spammable AoE at a range of 1500, making it one of the most useful classes for attacking/defending keeps and towers.

Useless in the field? Engineers have more CC than any other class, and much of it is AoE cc. Lemme guess. You thing AoE knockdowns, freezes, stuns are useless in wvw too?

Actually, its kinda funny: “Minion masters don’t fare well in large battles because so much aoe is being thrown around.” Guess which 2 classes have the best ranged aoe in the game: elementalist and engineer.

What you fail to realize is that AoE will kill said thief, regardless of invisibility/culling/rendering issues.

Invisibility != Invulnerability.

Since shadow refuge has a finite area….spam aoe and win?

DreamOfACure.4382:

In GW2, stealth only lasts 2 to 5 seconds per cast and limited by cooldowns and initiative, which is a good balance.

The above should be true, but it isn’t. Odds are, unless you’re on the least populated bracket, you’ve seen (or more aptly, not seen) hordes of ‘invisible’ enemies in wvw. I’m not going to go into detail on that subject, there are tons of details on the general and WvW subforums about the phenomenon. Sufficient to say, under certain conditions the server doesn’t tell your client to render players, and only informs your client that your character is taking damage, or shows you damage numbers from AoE on targets that your client hasn’t rendered.

Why is this relevant?
For whatever reason, after going invisible, and then coming out of invisibility, the server does not inform enemy clients that they need to render your character for a certain time. In practice, this means after leaving invis, you have 5-10 seconds (sometimes more) of added invis.

So what is initially 2-5 seconds of invis ends up being 7-15 seconds of invis for all intents and purposes. Moreover, during the additional time the invisible character can attack you, backstab you, etc. and unless you have aoe, there isn’t a kittenhing you can do about it. This also happens in spvp, but less often, and usually the render delay is lower.

The good news is engineers can abuse this too thanks to cloaking device. Someone immobilizes you (quite common in wvw and spvp), after it wears off (or you break it), you can spam nades, stomp, drop bombs, etc. If you haven’t been rendered. Quite hilarious in wvw tbh. It’s quite awesome to see the entire enemy zerg ignore you while you are among them bursting someone down.

Turrets scale with level, so a turret from a level 80 is much, much stronger than a turret from a level 40. However, they do not scale with attributes.

Use a keyboard macro, many computers these days come with software pre-installed for custom keybind macros, also very easy to find the software online. Just have it record a successful “interrupt,” and you’ll be able to do it whenever you want by pressing a single button. That’s what I do.

LameFox.6349:

It really says something about your ‘elite’ skill when you prefer getting only half of its effect to the full thing.

This, really. Imo Elixir X should just give stabillity + health buff for 15-20 seconds or simply stability + protection.

That bug is soooo much fun tbh, makes cloaking device our second best trait after grenadier. Someone in enemy zerg immobilizes you in wvw (this is practically guaranteed), and even after it wears off, you can wade through the entire enemy zerg for 5-10 seconds w/o getting noticed.

Also useful in spvp, as immobilizes are quite common there as well.

Rocket turret is pretty sweet tbh. Overcharge it immediately on deploying, you get two 2 second AoE knockdowns spaced 4 seconds apart. That, in and of itself, makes the turret almost worthwhile. Add to that the AoE damage+AoE burning damage (granted, neither scale with power or condition damage), and your looking at a bit over 2000 total damage per rocket every 4 seconds.

Granted, the 60s cooldown on both the turret and the toolbelt are significant downsides, but imo, having double aoe knockdown + decent damage on a 60s cooldown is worthwhile.

Net Turret is nice, especially given that 3/7 classes don’t have dedicated immobilize breakers, but I prefer rocket turret due to its decent damage + cc combo, although net turret has the better toolbelt imo.

Durzlla.6295:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Durzlla.6295:

I would personally not use Elixir X if they took away the random elite skill effect… the main reason i use it is because of how much control it provides me for 20-25 seconds, i mean cmon, rampaging brute is now activated like 75-80% of the time now because people were complaining that 50/50 wasn’t fair for an elite skill, pretty easy to go into a fight going “Oh i’m going to use it for brute” and then be pleasantly surprised with the better control and damage tornado skill.

If it were just +Health and Stability for 15 seconds that’d not only be a nerf, but that’d probably also butcher it and make it the worst elite skill in the game…

Odd, considering that most users of elixir X used it pre-nerf when you could end the transform prematurely and keep the +stabillity for duration. Arenanet nerfed that, so obviously it wasn’t underpowered.

And now an exploit exists to do something very similar. Still, thank you for contributing your opinion.

Oh no no no, stability is quite a nice boon!! I’m saying AS AN ELITE SKILL it’d be nearly worthless, as a utility skill? Yeah that’d be nice, but as an elite skill i want more bang for my buck, and having super amounts of CC for 20-25 seconds every 96 seconds is a lot of bang for said buck…

Right, and I’m saying as an ELITE SKILL, elixir X saw most use (and was nerfed thereof) when you could get JUST stability and not be forced into brute/tornado.

Again, to reiterate, it seemed (from my limited sample size of engineer streams, pvp videos, guides, and those engineers I met in game) that elixir X was most popular when people could avoid brute/whirlwind and just get the 15 seconds of stabillity. Now that there’s a thread about another way to avoid brute/whirlwind (and It will be nerfed, I guarantee it), I thought I’d pose the question.

I certainly think 15 seconds of stability (with +health or some other defensive measure) would be a better elite than the current state of elixir X. There seem to be at least a few individuals of the same opinion currently, judging by the contents of the thread I linked in the first post.

I could be wrong though, just thought I’d get it out there.

Durzlla.6295:

I would personally not use Elixir X if they took away the random elite skill effect… the main reason i use it is because of how much control it provides me for 20-25 seconds, i mean cmon, rampaging brute is now activated like 75-80% of the time now because people were complaining that 50/50 wasn’t fair for an elite skill, pretty easy to go into a fight going “Oh i’m going to use it for brute” and then be pleasantly surprised with the better control and damage tornado skill.

If it were just +Health and Stability for 15 seconds that’d not only be a nerf, but that’d probably also butcher it and make it the worst elite skill in the game…

Odd, considering that most users of elixir X used it pre-nerf when you could end the transform prematurely and keep the +stabillity for duration. Arenanet nerfed that, so obviously it wasn’t underpowered.

And now an exploit exists to do something very similar. Still, thank you for contributing your opinion.