Guild Wars 2

Archangel.5942:

Question for some as well: Why are you searching for a new main when HoT releases— after all, the spec and new weapon is only an option to use, not a meta.

TL;DR: Try not to assume anything and think fresh^^’

I’ll ignore the rest and answer this: because I want something fresh. Calling storms, AoE, support is all something we already have. I highly highly doubt that any offhand can bring something new that the focus or dagger doesn’t do already. Just like this patch where nothing new, exciting or different has happened for elementalist, so too is the idea (to me and what I can envision happening with Warhorn) of warhorn boring and just keeping the status quo of us being AoE and support oriented.

Sword had me excited because it can be something like the thief playstyle. Single target, no real cleave, assassinate in melee with blinks and evades to get in and out using elemental magic with elemental themed finishers (like running through your enemy with a blade made of lightning or exploding the sword blade in the enemy). Farting more AoE’s and support is the same old same old, just a different name. Might as well stick to staff as nothing will dethrone that king of AoE’s.

draxynnic.3719:

Updraft has a blowout, but it also serves as a retreat skill similar to Phase Retreat. It’s both.

I’ve played every profession up to 80, and while I’ve referred to skill lists to give objective evidence, my observation comes primarily from experience: dagger/dagger elementalist, especially coupled with Lightning Flash, is in my experience the most mobile thing around that isn’t a thief.

Even if we were to consider that the mesmer can match it (which doesn’t match my experience playing both professions, but for the sake of argument, let’s take it as given), that still makes the elementalist at the top of the non-Thief pack.

(Warrior I may have underestimated – that’s my least-played profession.)

All that said, a sword mainhand for the ele likely would involve a lot of mobility and invulnerable frames in order to survive, particularly if it had no ranged options (dagger can always switch to Water if they need to take a breather). However, I don’t think a mobility playstyle for the elementalist is filling a gap, since it’s already one of the most mobile professions. A meleementalist, on the other hand, is something that’s not really practical to do at the moment short of Conjure Lightning. (Which I think may have been nerfed in the recent update – they were certainly talking about nerfing Conjure Lightning and Conjure Frost.)

Again, Updraft may move you, but it isn’t a mobility skill. It’s not it’s actual use even though it has evade frames. it is used for the blowout but has a displacement attached to it. Also, I don’t think mesmer can match Elementalist in sheer mobility,but then again I don’t think it should. Mobility isn’t supposed to be something every class should have at the same level as each one has its strengths and weaknesses. Mesmer has low cooldown blinks, stealth, clones (it confuses people sometimes), invulnerability, and higher health (we can also add in weapon swap, but that’s debatable as ele does have 4 attunements). Elementalist Dual Dagger has boons, heals, mobility and CC. Different strokes for different classes and that’s how it should be.

Now, in this discussion I would like to seperate the different builds and possibilities the weaponsets that elementalist have. Dual dagger IS mobile, however it’s also mainly played as a bruiser spec (or even a bunker) so it can take the damage. I don’t think this spec needs any help in that department, or in any department really. It’s solid, it works and is in a great spot. Though your ranged argument is… strange as no one realy uses water to “take a break” and auto in water. But all in all, the spec does what it should. It’s a bruiser/bunker and does that to a great extent and doesn’t really need anything.

What I, and many others hoping for sword, want is a burst spec. The current burst spec is Scepter with either focus or dagger. It’s a niche spec, not run a lot due to the fact that other classes out class it in both damage and survivability and group support. It’s easily shut down and the damage is lower (though still respectable). Lightning Flash in this spec ceases to be a mobility utility and becomes an offensive utility to land burst and the damage is not really there. Sword is where we hope(d) would bring in a melee assassin burst playstyle that we would love to have on the class. Mobility and evades in this case would just have to be the survival tool for that spec, but the request is for a burst spec primarily. And yes, I’d trade a ranged option and have sword be completely melee (real melee, not D/D melee) for a burst spec that depended on evades/mobility.

Also, no neither conjures were nerfed and Ice Bow was buffed in the end.

Mordeus.1234:

Snip

So this was my point exactly. There are many different interpretations, lore examples (real life and in game) of different versions of what “Tempest” could be. We shouldn’t attribute anything to the name till we learn more. A for/against warhorn or sword should be based on the things we know. While I dislike warhorn and am absolutely against the idea based on the whole blowing animation and skins (plus, I love swords in this game), I’m fully aware that it could bring interesting things to the class the way that they introduced the melee staff for Revenant. I just have little to no faith after 3 years of watching them slowly destroy everything I loved about elementalist. The issue is we don’t know enough, hell we don’t even know if it IS warhorn till they show off the elementalist preview.

As for the don’t want to give everything to all the classes, I humbly disagree. This elite specializations is a way to blend classes the way GW1 did with dual class so yes, I’d like to see things get blended, but in a balanced and interesting way. I think a Elementalist mixed with Warrior could be really cool if done well. Imagine that it had no weapons at all, but every time you swapped attunements you “summoned” an elemental weapon of some sort (not the current conjures) or went all Avatar style with it being martial arts with elemental powers. Lightning punches and Earth ground kicks that had some elemental effects like a wall of earth being projected forward from you. Could be cool. This blending is a pseudo way of creating new classes and such and I’m all for it.

Orpheal.8263:

lol, these skills that you mean, are nothing….
Not something that I would expect from a specialized Summoner that is able to call for supernatural elemental powers of catastrophal degree.

What the E-Spec would create there would be of much bigger environmental size.
Think of the Glyph Storm Skills with like at least 5x the size, affecting huge areas, that have also positive/negative effects for allies/enemies in the environment, while standing in that area.
Powerful storms, that take their time to be called, and once they get unleashed are massive influences on the battlefield that support allies or debuff enemies inside them, while also dealing damage over time.

Also skill names can be anytime changed to prevent confusions.
That Glyph of Storms can be anytime renamed and changed for example to Glyph of Elements and get its effect changed to somethign else, than simple AoE skills, but more something, that helps the Ele to become also better at support with that Utility in the bar in general than to let of once every ridiculous 48-60 seconds a little aoe based on your attunement lol
That glyph was always a very underwhelming skill and never competed at all with any of the way more useful utility skilsl anyways.

Some of the other Skills that you mean simply can get renamed…
Firestorm from Fiery Greatsword for exampel can be renamed to “Fire Rain”

Lightning Storm from the conjured Hammer can be simply renamed to Invoke Lightning, this way we would get also a nolstalgic GW1 skill name back.

The Ice Storm from the conjured Frostbow can be simply renamed to “Frost Hail” and all is good and no storm connection in there anymore

So your vision for an elite spec… is exactly what we have now… but with channel times and everything is bigger. Great, glad we got that out of the way. Also, no thanks. No PvP’er wants to hear the sentence " that take their time to be called" and in PvE… well that’s the reason that zerker was king. Time wasting is bad, channeling is unwanted. Already Ether Renewal isn’t used because of channel times, Meteor Shower needs to be casted VERY carefully if you’re using a staff bunker, Glyph of Storms is rarely used in PvP anyway due to cooldown and it’s non targeted function.

A Tempest doesn’t have to do with “calling” things, you attributed that to the name yourself. The elementalist can be the tempest itself meaning it would be unstoppable, a force of nature, therefore I state that it will be a greatsword specialization. See how silly that sounds? When you attribute things to a name without knowing anything, any conjecture can be made. Tempest can be literally anything. It can be a stormcaller, it can be the storm, it can be a waterspout, hell it can even be a teapot. We don’t know, so let’s not attribute anything we don’t know just yet to a name.

The only thing we do know is that it’s called tempest and might use warhorn or maybe sword or maybe a banana. As far as I’m concerned, warhorn is lame. It’s an offhand that we don’t need if it’s AoE or support as we have that in spades. We fart AoE and support, we don’t need more. Warhorn is visually un-aesthetic to me and I don’ t like it. It can however have great skills, but we don’t know what it can bring. I’d prefer sword because I think it can bring the playstyle I believe the class is missing which is a melee assassin burst playstyle with blinks and evades as it’s source of defense.

So yea, most likely he was running Diamond skin which just nullifies your conditions unless you can keep them below 90% health. It’s a hard counter to all condition builds. If you have no power attacks to do enough damage, then yea, you’re up a creek with no paddle.

Zalavaaris.5329:

Hey everyone, so im a very tanky necro player who usually kills who I fight (unless im severely outnumbered) I last a long time and my dots usually eat through whoever Im fighting. I was running around in WvW and came across this ele that I figured would go the same way. Not sure what it was about him but I never saw him drop below 95% health. I have ZERO idea how but it was pretty funny and almost embarrassing to watch. Now, im not one to yell for nerfs or anything but I would however like to know what it was that I was fighting and how do I beat it.

It is quite possible that this elementalist was running Diamond skin which makes them immune to conditions when above 90% health. This type of elementalist normally also pairs this with water so they can have a plethora of heals to keep themselves above 90% so you were hard countered most likely. Were the conditions doing any damage to them? Or not really? That’s the best way to know if they’re running that build. Best bet is to attempt to lower them below 90% and then bombard them with the conditions before they can get above 90%.

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm, I just tested it out by self-comboing a Shocking Aura with Lightning Hammer 5+2 and it didn’t give people around me the aura…hope it’s a bug.

That doesn’t grant you shocking aura, it’s a daze on your hit. You can only get Shocking Aura from the dagger air mainhand, the Tempest Defense trait in Air magic and the Arcane Resurrection trait in Arcana. These are the combo effects granted from Lightning Fields:
Blast – Area Swiftness
Leap – Dazing Strike
Projectile -Vulnerability
Whirl – Brutal Bolts

draxynnic.3719:

40s versus 30s for Blink.

However, elementalist having a low-mobility build doesn’t alter my point (and, in fact, an offhand weapon is more likely to influence the mobility of scepter builds than a mainhand sword will…). As I listed last page, a dagger/dagger ele has four reposition options, and elementalists can completely load up their last four slots with mobility options (including taking a conjure to use the mobility option on the conjure) if they choose.

Not saying this is a GOOD build, but other professions have to make compromises for additional mobility as well.

Additionally, mesmers having probably the worst options for speed boosts among the classes (very few options for Swiftness and no option for a permanent 25% boost from a trait or signet) means that even if they come out at about the same ability to teleport around, their mobility outside of teleports is less (unless they take Traveler runes, in which case they’re not taking another set).

At the bottom line, the elementalist dagger/dagger set, especially when combined with traits and utilities, is, in my experience, probably the most mobile viable build in the game that isn’t a thief build. So I’m really not seeing how ‘elementalists need more mobility’ is a reason to bring in a new melee-oriented weapon.

(I recognise that there are plenty of others, but I’m really not seeing how anybody can say that the elementalist lacks mobility, unless the measure of comparison is the thief.)

You listed updraft and Mist form as a mobility utility. Updraft isn’t used for re-positioning (that isn’t what it is, it’s a CC, it’s a blowou.) and mist form is an invulnerability. That’s like saying Elixer R or the guardian heal Shelter is for mobility. And no one in PvP will take Air signet as it is very lackluster and will not give you anything that your traits already do, especially since the removal of Fire Aura on signet use was removed.

I am not arguing whether or not the elementalist needs more mobility, I was just pointing out flaws in your points and offering information from someone who actually plays the class and isn’t reading things off of a wikipedia list. Dual dagger is very mobile, it should be and no one would argue that it needs more mobility. The only thing in that regards would be the change to RtL as it no longer needs the hit/miss cooldown thing, but that is a slightly different discussion.

Mesmer, while it has no option for a permanent 25% speed boost like the Signet of Air, does have a plethora of blinks, stealth (as short as it is) low cooldown invulnerability on weapon sets and is a higher armor class and health pool. It doesn’t need the extra mobility that the elementalist needs as that is what it survives on. Mobility, heals and boons over stealth, blinks, higher armor and health Different survivability mechanics for different classes are what make them unique.

Now if we look at the Scepter burst builds they lack one thing that a sword would definitely add over (what I believe) warhorn can add and that is an evade/blink style of play that is no longer dependant on protection, regen and healing. Such a fighter with the low health and armor that an elementalist has would have to depend on in combat mobility (style thief) as it would have no stealth (stealth on ele in any form would be way too OP).

Also, warrior using Sword/anything is almost as mobile with 1 skill. Add in Warhorn for them and it’s very mobile. “Nike” builds in WvW are very common for roaming warriors and are impossible to catch.

Laraley.7695:

No.

/15 no’s

/more no’s

Who/what are you no’ing to? Warhorn? Or what I wrote?

draxynnic.3719:

Granted, scepter/focus elementalist without mobility utilities can be a bit lacking. However, this would then be the player’s choice to take a low-mobility option, not a shortfall of the profession.

Just going to focus on this bit here, Lightning Flash isn’t used for mobility in the Scepter/X setup, its used for making sure your Phoenix lands properly. It CAN be used for mobility, but it’s mostly not used for that and I’m quite sure the cooldown is longer than Mesmer blink.

rotten.9753:

There’s only one thing warhorn could bring that ele is lacking and that’s probably a viable condition build with unavailable conditions like poison (acid rain?). Though I hate conditions builds.

I agree, conditions are boring in this game, there is very littel “skill” involved to conditions (in my opinion). Just spam them all and forget. Plus, condition gearing is just… borked. Power at least has a trade off, if you want damage you give up vitality and toughness and healing power to be truly effective. Conditions can go toughness/condition damage/vitality if they want and be very effective and super tanky.

To be honest though, I don’t have an idea on how to make conditions more interactive, their very nature is they need time on a target so it’s always going to be a fire and forget. Plus, everyone and their grandmother farts conditions just by turning left so there’s just an overabundance of them as well…

Leo G.4501:

Sword can be very awesome and interesting if done creatively. I’m all for creative modes of play which makes me rather confused when people keep pressing for ele sword main to just get a cleave weapon. I mean, yeah, sure ele doesn’t really have a specifically “swing and cleave” type of weapon but that’s hardly a playstyle. Necros got a cleaving weapon not because they needed a weapon to swing and hit multiple foes, they got GS because their AoE was limited. Elementalist isn’t limited on AoE at all. They likely have more AoE than any other profession (I’m learning about engi and they seem pretty good at AoE too) so introducing a melee cleave is only to pander to a specific attack style, NOT a play style.

I once made a suggestion for a sword off-hand for ele that kinda sorta made a ‘trapper’ out of elementalist since ele doesn’t have anything like traps/marks to work with. THAT is the way people should be looking at weapons and specs, at least when we’re trying to add to a profession’s capabilities.

Most people who want sword (like myself) see sword as a possibility for a bursty, evade/blink type of assassin. More of a “I see you there, you’re going to die” type of all in playstyle that the thief and mesmer have that depends on evades and blinks for survivability, not regen, protection and heals. Scepter has a form of this, but it’s ranged and it’s still mixed if taken with focus with tons of utility which is why it’s not as powerful as mesmer/thief burst.

D/D is more of an in your face, tanky/healy type of melee brawler and this would make it more interesting, at least I think it would be an interesting take on the elementalist. A mage melee assassin.

Alekt.5803:

Weren’t the auto-attack chain datamined already? Words are “cut”… Seems like sword to me.

This was a few months ago and they were removed in the last patch.

Shinji.2063:

Glenstorm.4059:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3bd5jw/update_revenant_shield_and_sword_skills_changed/

Looks like the Ele sword skills have been removed.

Nothing’s confirmed obviously, but this looks like another nail in the sword coffin

So bummed right now, still holding out hope but the creeping despair is starting to get to me that we are getting a lame warhorn.

There’s always revenant…

thewaterguy.4796:

It’s sad by I have to be honest, “tempest” suggests calling storms, and what better way to “call storms” than with a warhorn right guys?

Focus can do it just as well, there is plenty of fantasy lore about using focii to concentrate upon to bring up storms. Same with swords and other artifacts. The sword actually features in many places as a focus for calling upon magic and performing magical feats.

Inexplicable.4165:

.

Also, do you really think that because of this thread the devs will be like ‘Oh, we’ve been working on this spec for a year, but they clearly don’t like warhorns, so let’s just scrap everything and start over.’ Grow up.

Apparently so, they did it with sword as they played with a sword concept. Also, yes I do hope they would. This is the debut of their new elite specializations and to bring a lame warhorn as the elementalists first weapon is in my opinion a bad move. It isn’t a highly wanted weapon on any class, it’s relatively meh in looks and animations (personal opinion). All this calling stuff up means channeling (if that is hte way they will go) sucks for PvP as you will get interrupted. If it’s AoE, it brings nothing new to the table, if it’s utility it is in competition with focus. If it has channeling AoE it’s in copmetition with staff and will be useles in PvP where you’re just asking to be interrupted.

There is possibility that ANet can do something interesting, skillwise. If someone other than Karl where in charge of it. That doesn’t combat the lame animations and bad skins (again, personal opinion) that will prevent me from using it.

Leo G.4501:

rotten.9753:

Leo G.4501:

That aside, you just make a list that ranges from pure bias to downright making crap up.

That’s a very logical argumentation. Please, maybe make your own list of how a decent weapon warhorn could be so we can be convinced.

How about your put your forum boxing mittens away and save them for someone your minor league? I don’t need to win an argument where no argument is to be had. The fact of the matter is, we don’t know what skills a warhorn would even have let alone if we’re even getting warhorn at all. So what basis can you begin an argument on? That warhorn skins looks ‘poopie’?

Yep, and the animations look like crap (the whole bringing the warhorn to your face part). Argue all you want, it’s personal taste on skins and animations.

Sword mainhand
single target burst or cleave
blinks/evades
reliable damage
NO WARHORN

It’s definitely hit/miss. The ultimate RNG. I started with 2250 gold and 612 ectos and after 500 tries with the ascended Destabilized Ectoplasm I ended up at 5800+ gold and 1800+ ectos. The ups and downs were insane, went down as low as 800 gold left and shot up to 5800.

I had to stop, was too much for me.

Supreme.3164:

Leo G.4501:

Heh if you guys are just going to quit ele or even the game just because they didn’t implement the weapon you wanted (and not taking said weapon off the table), then it’s hard to say but I doubt the community would suffer losing you.

At least wait to see what it offers before raging. Sure, be upset, but to quit? Wow.

I did overreact …this much I can admit, I may be disappointed but..in case we do get warhorn, I’ll check first hat it has to offer before passing judgment

I know I over-reacted, I just don’t really care. I dislike warhorn and don’t even want to see what it has to offer because the animations of using warhorn bother me.

Call me crazy, but it’s just how I feel. I may just end up not using and ignoring Tempest altogether if it is this way, or I may just leave. You may not miss me, but I’m sure my guild and friends will.

1. Did not play it.
2. Played against it, felt fair only if they actually missed (dodged, invuln, aegis)
3/4/5. Yes, if it is fair. Melee skills should be from actually missing in melee range (dodged, invuln, aegis, maybe if really close such as <50) range skills should on all whether hit or miss. At this time save randomly moving/waiting for stealth to run out/randomly dodging/flailing around I feel (have always felt since launch) that there is little counterplay to attacking from stealth. There needs to be some form of compensation though such as a very short reveal timer, no reveal but a loss of stealth or a refund of initiative.

I would love to see stealth become something tactical to use and have some form of counterplay

Eaglebach.7593:

If we follow the logic of this thread, then some class must have that “Ascended warhorn” as its new weapon. Eles need to suck it up and take one for the team..

No thanks. I don’t believe in taking one for the team when it can be easily avoided in this case. No class wants warhorn and ANet isn’t being forced to create a warhorn specialization as there are more weapons than classes. So far, no class has received sword as it’s specialization so there should be no reason to be “stuck” with warhorn.

PlatinumMember.5274:

They fixed rtl?

By fix you mean reduced the cooldown/removed the dual hit cooldown? Then no, but Air Training reduces the cooldown of RtL to 13 hit/26 miss so it’s ALMOST like having old RTL back. Almost.

Supreme.3164:

So be it!..if it must be warhorn, then I’ll go howler instead than bolt, cheaper and still good looking in my opinion and the dye combo still suits my tastes.
At the very least we can say that warhorn will be mostly CC/burst based

I doubt it, and I’d still be unhappy. The whole animation of bringing the warhorn to your characters face and blowing for an affect is just… I hate it. So much.

Fuzzion.2504:

My warhon can slash and thrust and do incredible damage to cotton candy!

Completely thought this was going elsewhere.. dirty mind.

1. Datamined skills are mostly placeholders for dagger skills, could have been a scrapped idea.
2. First sword looks like it may be the Shiro Tagachi sword. Neither of the swords shout out “Tempest” as much as that warhorn does.
3. Shield may be the Revenant Elite Spec shield (Glint).
4. It’s all speculation. Both sword and warhorn.

Autumn.8043:

I totally agree. I was super excited when I saw that Sword Elementalist was actually a possibility, I’ve waiting a long time for it. My heart sunk a little yesterday when I read that Warhorn may be on the table. Please Anet.. just no, go back to sword.

I had to log off and go to bed. I’m still upset at it TBH that it might be the case. Sword had me all excited to no end, and this ruined it (will ruin it if it’s true).

Autumn.8043:

Sadly most of the data-mined sword skills were placeholder dagger skills, so it’s perfectly plausible for them to have decided to scrap that idea and go with Warhorn instead.

Which hopefully they’ll scrap as well. Debut of awesome new system for introducing cool updates to classes and they go with the most boring weapon (not even a real weapon tbh) in the game that has the worst skins and animations.

Way to hype it up. Warhorns blow, don’t go with it.

Grimreaper.5370:

You guys are rediculous! This morning I was doing 25k with scepter/focus burst, play less forum wars 2 please!

Aww that’s cute. 25K burst, did no one sneeze in your direction?

Yay! More AoE that we didn’t need! And warhorn! The worst, most visually neglected weapon in the game with terrible skins and animations!

But we got Elemental Attunement as a master so at least we got that going for us. Right? Right?

TBH when I saw the datamine I was happily plugging away making the bank on the new ecto gambling. I saw the picture of the supposed Tempest warhorn, logged out and went to bed super upset.

If we get warhorn, I’m pretty sure that I’ll ask for a refund on my HoT purchase. I despise warhorn animations and design (and the idea of using it as a weapon) altogether. Not threatening or whining, but I’d just not have the desire to play my elementalist anymore and that’s pretty much the only reason I play the game.

If it’s a warhorn I will be seriously upset. That literally would make me just want to delete the character as it’s just stupid.

Yes, I know, we know nothing about the spec, I don’t care. I hate warhorns on all the professions I think they’re a stupid weapon all around

No to all of that. Hell no. The amount of “no” to all of that is no divided by 0.

Aidan Eighthrain.8612:

RIP Obsidian Focus. You fought well but Mesmers got Protected Mantra baseline, so…

The balance team doesn’t know what to do with or how to balance the elementalist. This has been showcased through the entire length of the games life when you look at the pendulum like changes of the class from super OP to super UP.

To be fair, it’s a complex class and changes to it make the class undergo such pendulum changes, but they still just have shown time and time again that they just don’t know where they want to take the class.

Laraley.7695:

Hm, yeah. That was exactly my thought. They buffed some stuff that didn’t really need a buff, but I doubt they read the ele forums. There have been suggestions for a long time:

Increase radius of heals, since most of them are just too small > they decreased SM
Improve elites > No word about elites
Improve scepter and AA > didn’t change one thing about scepter
Create wider build diversity > locked eles into traits and skills even more

And this goes on and on. I find it funny that in many trait lines there are barely three traits I would consider taking. While people are happy about EA being a minor, I wonder why they didn’t actually add some good trait to Master in Arcana. Elemental Contingency is just plain bad and Final Shielding is not much better either.

Also, this:

Ride the Lightning: Movement speed adjustments no longer affect the intended travel distance.

is just hilarious. Shows how they know the class.

I read that in the notes and just facepalmed IRL. I just… I don’t even… words.

I’d add to the list that RTL is untouched regardless of the fact that the reason it was nerfed in the first place no longer exists.

None of our weapon skills were touched… which sucks.

CETheLucid.3964:

Funny how none of those things ultimately succeeded in removing Ele from the meta, and they were nerfs… but you’re comparing one of the best buffs the Ele is about to get to those times?

Do I have that right?

Uhh… they did remove ele from the meta at that time. ANet had to reduce the amount of boons a S/D thief could rip in off of you and had to change the stats on the Celestial amulet to bring ele back into the fold.

This isn’t one of the best buffs ele has gotten, this is preserving the ele builds that exists (sans signet auras) in the new mastery system. The only good thing coming out of this is the reduced attunement swaps, no ICD on Fresh Air and maybe blinding ashes depending on how the ICD works (per target or in general).

Mattmatt.4962:

That’s why i added a translation bro ^^

Ah, I must have misunderstood your sarcasm then. Maybe if we make a big enough uproar they might change it, but I have barely any faith in Karl. They haven’t even given a reason as to WHY they won’t change it unlike back when that nerf was introduced.

This is just stupid, that livestream was a joke. They could have saved tons of time by just posting the respective patch notes in each forum and then having that particular dev just answer some posts here and there where they could.

CETheLucid.3964:

Raif.9507:

The only thing I’m missing is RtL. Once that get’s un-nerfed to a 25 sec cooldown 1200 charge, I will be ecstatic. That’s literally the only thing left that I have issue with.

It’s officially forgiven in my book. This more then makes up for it.

No it doesn’t, it’s not even close. The reason for the RTL nerf was because it was a movement skill that ignored chill/cripple/swiftness/super speed. People complained that save for immobilize, there was no counterplay. All movement skills now will function like the old Ride the Lightning and here we are with this kitten, half working Ride the Lightning.

CETheLucid.3964:

BlackBeard.2873:

Overall:
- The class was saved from being deleted by pvp, but still needs some works on its skills and lack-luster trait options in many lines. Every line has some great choices, but there are also many false choices that, to anyone experienced, are worse in just about every situation.

Do you really believe that? That elementalist was at any point something that was so terrible in PvP that it was in danger of being “deleted”?

Because I’ve got rangers insisting that they’re the pariahs of PvP.

My experience must be atypical as kitten. But hey at any rate, glad to hear you’re impressed with the changes.

Yes, it was at one point. Back when S/D thieves ripped more boons off than they do now, elementalist was pushed out of the meta so hard it was amusing to watch. Same thing when they changed the healing co-efficients of some of the healing skills.

This is no different. The elementalist wasn’t “saved”. It was preserved. No really awesome new builds have emerged, Blinding Ashes is still meh if it isn’t an ICD per target. Old builds (most of them) were generally preserved, auramancer was made to be a little better (save that 20s ICD on the frost aura trait).

Mattmatt.4962:

Ele got nerfed cause it didnt get upped.
I agree with you, nothing changed for ele, while other class got power creeped to heaven.
Not even to mention nerf to vigor which is one more indirect nerf to ele cause its the class with the highest uptime and who needs it the most

Ride the Lightning: Movement speed adjustments no longer affect the intended travel distance.

Translation:
Go kitten yourself, we wont revert the unjustified nerf, that would be balancing ele

What’s funnier is that movement speed adjustments never affected Ride the Lightning in the first place which is why the skill was nuked from orbit. Now all the movement skills will be like this. Double standards ftw.

Josh Davis.6015:

Sorry for the delay. Enjoy.

ELEMENTALIST
Skills

• Ride the Lightning: Movement speed adjustments no longer affect the intended travel distance.

So I’m curious, do you guys read your patch notes previous to releasing them? Ride the Lightning was never affected by movement speed. It was THE reason for the 20 hit/40 miss cooldown you introduced. It was originally the only movement skill that ignored chill, cripple, swiftness and super speed and people complained that it was impossible to stop. With the update, this will no longer be the case, all movement skills will be like this.

Please remove the hit/miss function as it is TERRIBLE and just make it a static 25 second cooldown or introduce that mechanic for all other movement skills. This double standard being introduced for movement skills on classes is ridiculous.

The only thing I’m missing is RtL. Once that get’s un-nerfed to a 25 sec cooldown 1200 charge, I will be ecstatic. That’s literally the only thing left that I have issue with.

TheRandomGuy.7246:

Sigmoid.7082:

E3Drinking game:
Take a shot every time you hear :

• Soon
• When its ready
• Numbers aren’t final yet

Good way to kill yourself in 10 minutes after the start.

10 minutes? You’re optimistic.

With this change, there is no reason for the dual cooldown of RtL to exist anymore. The reason it was introduced in the first place was because it was “deemed” not possible to play against due to it not being affected by slows.

Bring RTL cooldown to 20 seconds for a 1200 charge!

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

Raif.9507:

Xillllix.3485:

In the new trait lines Air has lost all it’s synergy and so did Arcana unless you use the arcane skills buffs.

It’s like 95% certain eles will be running Fire-Earth-Water just because of the aura synergy between the 3 trait lines, and because of the huge nerfs to the other lines. Basically, goodbye build variety, everyone will be running the exact same build depending on weapon choice.

And this is different than what we have now how exactly? Now it’s Water/Arcana for PvP and Fire/Air for PvE that everyone is running. It’s just shifting to another line since no one knows how to actually balance this class.

We are now entering the tick phase, where we’ll be UP till they change something again and then we’ll enter the tock phase where everyone will cry that we’re OP.

The difference is that ele is at least somehow viable now.

You probably are the only person saying ele is just viable and somehow “going to be replaced by Warrior”, even though most people will agree ele beats warrior in every game mode.

I know I know, you’re an Ele main who afraid Ele get nerfed, I get it already. That’s why you keep on trying to make Ele seems to be under-powered. People in the Warrior’s forum is doing the exact same thing right now too. Guess those “Meta King” classes really afraid losing their status so bad.

Actually, hes’ not the only one. Shoutbow warrior is replacing ele in sPvP and the changes that were proposed (no longer relevant due to Anet stating they changed a lot from the reveal) would have cemented that replacement. In PvE, both Warrior and Ele have places in the top tier, so no one was worried that Warrior would replace ele unless Icebow/Lightning Hammer was completely decimated. Even then, staff fire builds are doing well enough that they would have a place in the meta.

Mayhem Maelstrom.9562:

Oh, I see Overwolf is releasing them on its website. Excellent. All I needed. Thank you.

Overwolf is a separate platform for apps, you just download that program (www.overwolf.com/download) and then head into the appstore. You cannot get them from any other place and need Overwolf to run them.

BlackBeard.2873:

There is a huge discrepancy in the approach to balancing classes, most prevalent in eles.

Look at mesmers…Every build is pigeon-holed into taking Illusionary Persona to make their class mechanic work and to have some measure of base survival, so they make it baseline. Then, they offer great choices in many different lines for the base class functionalities (you can focus on interrupts/control, burst, stealth, and conditions).

Now look at eles…Every build is pigeon-holed into taking Elemental attunement to make thier class mechanic work and have some measure of base survival, so they…make it harder to get. Then, they create many choices that are lack-luster and are all over the place in regards to class functionality (eles are adept at boons, heals, and…honestly are all over the place with blind-spam, immunities, random condition traits despite condition builds being unviable for eles). They even go so far as to force many traits based on auras, spread all over the place (among every line) while giving very little access to auras…This would be like spreading guardian symbol traits among 4 different lines (they are mostly focused in 1), and only have symbols on their weapons 2x every 30s – it just doesn’t make sense. Auras are too scarce to have so many traits dedicated to them spread out all over the place, and with greater access to them from passive procs than even weapon-skills. They are making the class SO MUCH MORE PASSIVE it is pathetic.

Karl wants to pay ele and it’s too confusing ATM. That is why it’s being made passive /s

Fade.1743:

Raif.9507:

Mantras? Definitely not. Too long of a cast time and mesmers would have a fit the size of Texas if they made them instacast or shorter casts. Deceptions/Tricks on the other hand would fit in great with the main hand sword as it could give elementalists access to much needed mobility/evades to pull off a true melee weapon.

Umm…two things:

1. You’re supposed to cast mantras before combat to have them ready. They activate instantly once readied…so idk wtf you’re going on about with cast times.

2. At least for PvE the main Mesmer mantras are the healing one, the cleansing one, and the stun-break/AE stability one. (I don’t remember the names really.) Again, I take everything from a PvE standpoint because I hate sPvP and don’t do enough WvW. Also the majority of the playerbase is PvE oriented so that’ll have more weight than the other two.

My suggestion is to give us long range damage and/or condition options. These would not overlap with the main mesmer mantras as those are support mantras. Not only that, but also Mesmers would have stronger mantras regardless due to having more specializations with traits to improve them. Essentially, what I’m saying is comparing my idea for mantras is like comparing Reaper shouts to Guardian shouts. Two different beasts. (Yes, they can be compared but fewer similarities).

As for mobility, yes, I agree. But I don’t think it should come from utilities. I think the mobility should be baked into the Sword (or w/e melee weapon we get). This is because making it a utility would allow D/D to get an entire slew of mobility while it has good enough. I’d agree that yes it could have more…however…let’s remember the playerbase…and that nerfs come from the lowest common denominator.

1. Umm in PvP you don’t really want to charge anything so… IDK what wtf you’re talking about. In PvE it makes 0 difference yes, because the encounter doesn’t start until you decide it to start so you can pre-load them just like you do with stacking might/fury.

2. I think about everything from a WvW/PvP PoV and hate everything PvE and I think that it’s more important so everything needs to be balanced from that perspective because…reasons.
/s

PvP balance concerns have long overruled PvE balance concerns for pretty much the entire length of the GW2 lifespan. Get used to it, things get nerfed/buffed because they’re OP/UP in PvP and rarely do they get balanced for PvE. The very few times things get “balanced” for PvE is when the ability in question breaks PvE (i.e Fiery Greatsword, upcoming nerfs to Frost Bow and Lightning hammer, etc).

And no, we don’t need any more ranged options, you have a plethora of ranged options from Staff and most of the current damage oriented utilities. More ranged damage options are not necessary at all. In PvE, Elementalist is fine. It needs no help in that respect at all save whatever unknown nerf is coming to conjures. Even then, staff elementalist builds will become better after this patch.

What IS necessary however, is love for the melee elementalist who has 1 option currently to do anything in those game modes you despise so much. Utilities that are actual utilities and not damage are needed way more than damage utilities. Teleports, evades, shadowsteps would go a lot further to help the class than more damage utilities. You want damage utilities, you got the Arcane skills and some glyphs.

As far as conditions are concerned, the class also doesn’t need too much help there either as it has access to a good amount of conditions already. The existing traits for condition damage need a little re-working to make them a little better such as guaranteed burn/bleed on crit, but we already have some decent working condition builds that are also getting a wee bit stronger with the upcoming patch.

The only aspect of the elementalist that is being made weaker in this upcoming patch (and is currently relatively weak to competitors) is that of burst elementalist. Be it through losing the majority of what makes Scepter Fresh Air builds great, or the fact that we just dopn’t have the inherent utility to survive in combat while being so squishy. The best way to bring this up is through actual defensive utilities that assist in living and have the “supposed” main hand sword bring the damage.

Laraley.7695:

Raif.9507:

Xillllix.3485:

In the new trait lines Air has lost all it’s synergy and so did Arcana unless you use the arcane skills buffs.

It’s like 95% certain eles will be running Fire-Earth-Water just because of the aura synergy between the 3 trait lines, and because of the huge nerfs to the other lines. Basically, goodbye build variety, everyone will be running the exact same build depending on weapon choice.

And this is different than what we have now how exactly? Now it’s Water/Arcana for PvP and Fire/Air for PvE that everyone is running. It’s just shifting to another line since no one knows how to actually balance this class.

We are now entering the tick phase, where we’ll be UP till they change something again and then we’ll enter the tock phase where everyone will cry that we’re OP.

The difference is that ele is at least somehow viable now.

I wasn’t talking at all about viability. I was talking about how we are forced into certain lines now, and will be forced to do them later as well.

Xillllix.3485:

In the new trait lines Air has lost all it’s synergy and so did Arcana unless you use the arcane skills buffs.

It’s like 95% certain eles will be running Fire-Earth-Water just because of the aura synergy between the 3 trait lines, and because of the huge nerfs to the other lines. Basically, goodbye build variety, everyone will be running the exact same build depending on weapon choice.

And this is different than what we have now how exactly? Now it’s Water/Arcana for PvP and Fire/Air for PvE that everyone is running. It’s just shifting to another line since no one knows how to actually balance this class.

We are now entering the tick phase, where we’ll be UP till they change something again and then we’ll enter the tock phase where everyone will cry that we’re OP.