Guild Wars 2

Leo G.4501:

petyr baelish.9675:

Why waste your strongest defensive cooldown in order to channel a spell that’s not worth casting at all?

Also, way to nitpick at the details leo, you never let a chance to make a remark pass. Even if it’s trivial and besides the question. Keep it up! Glad to see you didn’t get bored of it after all this time.

Perhaps you didn’t read what I quoted? It was talking about being unable to use Obsidian Flesh with Air Overload. So tell me, is using Obsidian Flesh with Air Overload impossible or not?

All depends on if we can swap elements while channeling an Overload. Thematically, would make sense to not allow it while mechanically it exists.

I like the breaks, but the negative effects can go bye. The overload already has enough drawbacks.

His video shows incompetent foes and a good player playing with them, but sure lets go with OP.

Yes please! I’d love to be able to craft my Storm Wizard weapons as I too saved my coins deciding what weapon I wanted to craft.

Trait is bugged, has been since the trait re-work.

Some good resets there. Very nice. Build is almost identical to my own, it’s fun to use. I have a preference for Fresh Air sometimes over LR. I’ve got a 800 less health,100 less armor, and 3% less crit, but 324 more power and around 10% more ferocity.

The 2v1 on those warriors was funny to watch. “HRNNNG HUNDRED BLADES THE MIST FORM”

Good job! Music is awesome too.

tenklo.6104:

U do know those are post to hard to solo. And I quiet obvious that he was running beserker…so as a glass cannon ele they have no sustain….and two of the attunment are for support. And really the whole tempest roll looks for support…which I love…the dragon hunter was a big let down….was a support gaurd

Svanir and Chieftain aren’t hard to do solo for the competent PvP player and he wasn’t running Zerker. First one might have been Maurader, second one looks like hes using Clerics or something with healing power but no Vitality.

Either way, neither are difficult to kill solo, even with a Zerker amulet.

Jordo.5913:

easy, don’t vote for one…if you don’t prefer one, then you can just close out and not vote at all

And this is why the poll has bias. I’m done trying to explain why this is the case. Either learn some basic polling requirements or be prepared to have skewed and not relevant results.

Because he’s right and the forums know he’s right.

On a more serious note, it would be nice to see someone who actually understands the class to show off the elite specs. Watching Grouch demolish Chieftain with ease was more impressive than the showing of anything else. Watching Karl get interrupted while overloading twice and nearly dying (500hp) was more embarrassing than anything else. That and Rubi’s comments of “That’s so devastating” and watching 4 hits of 400 per target was nothing more than a /facepalm moment.

This goes for the other stuff to, most of the devs who tried to show killing Svanir/Chieftain almost died themselves (they even joke about it on stream) and I think it would be better to show something like Grouch demolishing rather than Karl nearly dying.

Killyox.3950:

Ask friends for stability? Guardian shout, rev IR and so on ? No class should have everything at all times. There is cost to everything cost for being powerful is having no stability for this effect. Because of that the effect is stronger. If they gave it stability they would also make it weaker because of less interplay and less counters.

I actually agree with you, if the Overload was stronger than just using your normal abilities.

maddoctor.2738:

Making the Overloads do as much damage (or healing, or provide movement impairing conditions like cripple etc) as you would do without using an overload is what is needed to make overloads usable. Otherwise, combined with the serious drawback of being very long channels, I don’t see them used in any situation

They should be more effective than what you can normally do, not just equal otherwise there is still no point to using the overload due to the risk of the channel. These abilities should be way more powerful than anything we can do in 5 seconds to justify the 20 second lockout & 5 second wait time & danger of channeling a skill.

Considering your post looks like a shameless plug for your stream, you shouldn’t be suprised.

Look at metabattle for your best build. Here, I’ll do it for you.

http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Elementalist_-_Staff

Not a bad breakdown. I don’t think that many leaps are necessary, but it’s good.

I’d add to work Overload numbers as well though. Air damage up, Fire damage up, water healing up and earth needs a large blast at the end for heavy damage. Otherwise even with your changes, they’re still not worth casting.

tenklo.6104:

Water overcharge says hit me u must

That’s 4 words.

phys.7689:

Raif.9507:

phys.7689:

Raif.9507:

Jordo.5913:

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

You forgot 3 options:

• I do not have a preference
• They -=ALL=- suck
  and
• Who cares? I won’t know until I can actually PLAY THEM?

I prefer #3 on my list….

You have to be hyped about at least one of them so far, unless you strictly play one class in the base game.

Biased survey is biased. You need to include the “I have no preference” or “None”. I play quite a few classes (and main elementalist) and so far none of them are preffered. They are all “meh” to me.

And no, you don’t have to be hyped about any of them so far.

Thats not biased thats a non vote.
If the point is to find our which is most prefered, prefering neither is irrelevant to the question

It is relevant to the vote because it is a preference. Not including a none option means that people who did not prefer one, will now choose one swaying the actual poll giving more votes to something that did not should not have gotten it in the first place.

For example – a person prefers none or they are all equal to them in their mind. THere is no choice for said person to vote in the poll, therefore they will either randomly pick one (not a true vote) or abstain from voting (loss of collection) or “just pick one” because they have no choice. All of this leads to a biased vote that is not accurate.

If the point of the poll is to be which is a cool profession, then yea none should be an option, but the point is literally which do you prefer.

If i want to find out if more people prefer blue or red neither is not useful information.

Someone voting necro isnt saying necro is awesome they are just saying out of what ive seen necro is best.

And that is where bias comes in. For someone who prefers neither (this is an actual thing) or prefers them all equally will then choose red or blue when they actually prefer neither (or both). This leads to one of the choices receiving a false vote, skewing the data and making the poll irrelevant. In your case of red/blue if I didn’t like either and I prefer green, then I would have to choose, creating a false data point. If you do NOT include my vote or remove the vote from the data set, you create selection bias.

This poll at this time means nothing until there is no bias, it is representing false data.

This thing blows

It doesn’t have to be the new DPS meta. My suggestion boosts any skill, including heals. 10% skill effectiveness increase after overloading an attunement. Gives the damage boost some are looking for but can also work for support builds.

Kidel.2057:

I don’t know what you’re QQing about. Ele is already the strongest class in the game.

What the hell. Can do power builds, condi builds (incinerator 11k burn per second), full healer builds, 1vs30 build, and now even Guard.. ehm.. Tempest.

It’s jack of all trades and master of ALL.

Please show me this 1v30 build, I am intrigued.

grayskull.2367:

Just wrong air overload procs something like 15 Vulnerability and hits 1k hits for 8 hit that homes in on targets, what stream where you watching?

Did you… not understand what I wrote?

• 1.2K damage per tick
• Around 10-14 ticks
• 6 seconds in between each overload with fresh air (cast Overload -> leave air > return to air > wait 5 seconds to get overload > cast overload = 6 seconds)
• 5 second channel

I didn’t mention the vulnerability at all. What I was getting at was the potential 10K ish damage over a 5 second channel is not worth channeling it when you can do much more with Phoenix and other chained abilities.

6 second interval between casts of Overload + very weak 1.2k crits over a 5 second channel with what looks like a total of 10-14 hits wants a word with you.

Fresh Air crits for way higher and does more damage with other abilities.

Laraley.7695:

People complaining about the fact ele got 4 churning earths that allow you to move? Okay.

I can’t tell if you’re pro or against this, but I’d rather not have any skill remind me of Churning Earth.

phys.7689:

Raif.9507:

Jordo.5913:

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

You forgot 3 options:

• I do not have a preference
• They -=ALL=- suck
  and
• Who cares? I won’t know until I can actually PLAY THEM?

I prefer #3 on my list….

You have to be hyped about at least one of them so far, unless you strictly play one class in the base game.

Biased survey is biased. You need to include the “I have no preference” or “None”. I play quite a few classes (and main elementalist) and so far none of them are preffered. They are all “meh” to me.

And no, you don’t have to be hyped about any of them so far.

Thats not biased thats a non vote.
If the point is to find our which is most prefered, prefering neither is irrelevant to the question

It is relevant to the vote because it is a preference. Not including a none option means that people who did not prefer one, will now choose one swaying the actual poll giving more votes to something that did not should not have gotten it in the first place.

For example – a person prefers none or they are all equal to them in their mind. THere is no choice for said person to vote in the poll, therefore they will either randomly pick one (not a true vote) or abstain from voting (loss of collection) or “just pick one” because they have no choice. All of this leads to a biased vote that is not accurate.

Jordo.5913:

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

You forgot 3 options:

• I do not have a preference
• They -=ALL=- suck
  and
• Who cares? I won’t know until I can actually PLAY THEM?

I prefer #3 on my list….

You have to be hyped about at least one of them so far, unless you strictly play one class in the base game.

Biased survey is biased. You need to include the “I have no preference” or “None”. I play quite a few classes (and main elementalist) and so far none of them are preffered. They are all “meh” to me.

And no, you don’t have to be hyped about any of them so far.

The issue isn’t just ranged instant interrupts, it’s dodges and interrupt spam in general. The radius is so small that Guardian GS 5 can reach in and interrupt without getting hit, warrior hammer can just ignore it as it doesn’t do enough damage to make one wary of entering it and so on. Also, I’m going to go out on a limb and say dodges interrupt the cast too, so if you ever need to dodge while casting, it’s gone. 5 seconds is a lot to go through without dodging.

If the radius was bigger and there was more of a threat to entering the AoE of the overload, we may have something indeed. Air overload was ticking for barely more than lightning whip so it’s not too much of a threat, same with Fire. If you see a tempest Overload it should be a “I don’t want to be near this” type of thing, not a “Well, it’s not too much more than eating a lightning whip to the face w/e lets go”

I’d also like to see interaction with things like SoR (maybe make it so per tick of overload you get healed). I have a D/D build in mind with Tempest/Air/Arcana or water that could be interesting but the overloads aren’t just htere yet. Very close, but need a little more work on numbers and cast times. I was hoping that the Lucid Singularity would provide some stability (maybe a pulsing 1 stack per 2 seconds) so it can help cover it.

Also, the Water overload is pretty undwrwhelming and nowhere near worth it. Blackbeard did a great analysis of it right here that shows just swapping in and out of water is better than using the overload itself.

All the numbers need work and should go hgher and/or offer something else than what they do currently. As it stands, staying in an attunement to channel the overload isn’t worth it above doing standard rotations. Best example is water, there isn’t 5 seconds worth of action in Water for D/D for you to stay there to channel it. You have almost 2 seconds of just auto attacking till you get your Overload and needless to say, water auto is terrible so you’re just doing nothing effective for 2 seconds instead of swapping out to continue to be effective.

nearlight.3064:

Raif.9507:

Why do people assume that Overload air is spammable… is a 6 second window between each cast considered spamming an ability? Do you really want to spam back to back 5 second channels in PvP? Seriously?

Yes that is what I’d consider spammable (much like mantra heal on mesmer is spammable) and I think it would work because fresh air means you never truly have to fear interrupts. Whereas other builds will likely cover overload channels with cantrips, fresh air doesn’t have to, even if it gets interrupted with powerblock fresh air will just let it do it again and again and again. You also will probably trait it for shocking aura if you go this route so you’d have absurdly high uptime on it, and its a powerful defensive effect.

I feel like a Cele air/water/tempest D/WH (or D/D for extra frost aura share) build could work in this way. The rythms of the fresh air rotations and channels could account for the lack of arcane. It does sound a bit gimmicky, and there are probably better support options within tempest that are less spammy, but I think the build is sound in theory.

You need to complete the channel to get the shocking aura. Have fun attempting to finish that channel and not die before you do. At this time, the only overloads that I can see one being in an attunement long enough is Air and Fire due to lightning whip spam and burning speed/drakes breath. I don’t think the build is sound, but it has an interesting idea behind it. The overload needs that “crap I don’t want to be in this” feel and the damage it’s doing right now doesn’t have that feel. If the Overload (Fire/Air) is made into something that would make enemies in melee actively attempt to NOT be in it, then we can discuss this being a possible build.

Right now, the damage just isn’t there and what the Overloads offer isn’t anything different than what we currently can do anyway.

It may be the target is the max number of people that can receive the Fire Aura…

Why do people assume that Overload air is spammable… is a 6 second window between each cast considered spamming an ability? Do you really want to spam back to back 5 second channels in PvP? Seriously?

Enter air > wait 5 seconds to get Air Overload > cast Air overload (5 seconds) > swap from air to something else > cast something to get a crit > swap back to air > wait 5 seconds to get Air Overload > cast Air overload (5 seconds)

Total of 6 minimum seconds between casts. I doubt you can swap to another attunement while casting the overload. Most likely will cancel it as you’re no longer “in the correct attunement” and it’s an attunement specific skill.

OneKlicKill.4285:

morrolan.9608:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

I’m simply baffled by how they completely redid the guardian elites, and some mesmer utilities and elite yet didn’t even touch our useless Tornado.

Not to mention how they completely redid some engi kits but did nothing for our scepter.

But they gave us support. They even said on stream they want us to fill the support bruiser roll we’ve never been before for 3 years and better at than everyone else at. They clearly know things about scepter/utilities/trait-lines that you don’t that actually makes them viable, we just haven’t figure it out yet. Didn’t you see the skill and understanding of the class when he almost got overloads off multiple times on cheiften? Then that time he almost died showing how great WH and tempest is in BUT HE DIDNT DIE DID HE. We should trust the Ele design team they know what they are doing.

I see what you did there and I like it.

Navzar.2938:

Fresh air tempest might also be viable later on to spam it’s overload

For the damage shown on stream + needing 5 seconds to get the overload prepped I highly doubt it can compete with staff.

Sifu.9745:

@ Raif Very nice, i like it, ty
But this is dungeon only build, right?

yes this is meant for PvE. You can use it for WvW if you do a few small changes though. In water you would take the top line in each spot (Soothing Ice, Soothing Disruption and Cleansing Water) for survivability. You would take cantrips instead of the normal Frost Bow/Glyph of Storms/Signet of Fire.

Vizardlorde.8243:

you dont need to go into Water to use Ice storm (Ice bow #4)

No, you don’t NEED to, but with the above build you’re missing out on damage modifiers for using Ice Storm (20% damage to vulnerable foes while in water). This is why the ’rotation" is to use Meteor Shower > swap mid cast to water > Ice Storm while in water so both abilities receive the damage modifiers from Water.

I’d say combine the master minor and GM minor and create a new GM minor – After overloading an attunement your skills are 10% more effective (heals and damage modifier).

The go to staff build pretty much stays in Fire for the majority of the fight. You occasionally use other attunements, such as Air for using Glyph of Elemental Storms or Water for using Frost Volley (#4 on Frost Bow) or the occasional heal. You occasionally go into Earth for the Magnetic Aura, but you’re almost 90% of the time in Fire.

Here is the build from Metabattle – http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Elementalist_-_Staff

The link also explains rotations and stuff.

I’m more curious… why post this here and not ask him directly? Also, why not just… form your own opinion?

ronpierce.2760:

Gotta love the 180s though… All you had to do was wait 4 days…

Curious where you see a 180. Most people saying Tempest is awesome now are the same ones that said it previously….

Your argument is compelling.

FrownyClown.8402:

Tempest may offer different ways to cleanse conditions so you may not need water attunement at all.

FTFY. So far all we know is that the Water overload cleanses conditions (we don’t know how many) and that the heal cleanses some (don’t know how many). For all we knnow it will cleanse 4 between these 2 on long cooldowns.

Kodiak.3281:

Thread so old it’s a new necromancer minion.

Still better than necromancer shouts.

nearlight.3064:

Laraley.7695:

nearlight.3064:

Laraley.7695:

So they gave ele might and burn – already an issue and has plenty
cleanse and rege – already an issue and has plenty
Protection and cripple – first is an issue and has plenty

Yeah, this is so new. I mean seriously, ele totally doesn’t have that. It brings a completely new stuff to the class. I knew I didn’t have to wait to know this is gonna be bad.

Edit: Oh yeah and boonsharing, ele totally cannot do that.
And kittening shouts. Why? Just why?

Wow, I’m actually even more disappointed than I was.

Like I’ve said countless times before the elementalist is such a well rounded profession that it wasn’t in any dire need of anything new unlike the necros with no cleave that got a GS. Yes the burst builds suck, but thery’re not a huge weakness to the overall viability of the profession since we can just run them.

Why don’t people realize that the overcharge mechanic adds a new and potentially gamechanging way to play ele isntead of just dancing though attunements as rotations?

Its a new playstyle whether you like it or not.

Okay, I’m really in a bad mood, but could you stop fanboying ANet so much? You’re the only one I keep seeing defending it. Just look at it. It does exactly what ele can do already, but it has a kitten mechanics. What’s good about it? Why would you take this over attunement swap which does exactly the same and doesn’t lock you in one attunement?

No point arguing with you, you’re gonna keep saying how awesome it is. Well, there you go. I know the skills and I’m even more disappointed. Happy now?

I just like pointing out the weak spots in other people’s arguments. I like arguing, it’s fun for me. And I like the elite spec for many reasons so it gives me something to argue about.

As for fanboying the devs, being a dev is a lot of work and stress.. They deserve to be recognized for their hard work in making this game better and newer and fresher.

But I’ll back off for now since you guys are pretty close minded about everything. Really the gw2 forum is just a haven for negativity. If you go anywhere else, Whether in game or reddit you’ll see that the people that are approving of tempest far out numbers those that reject it.

You guys are a vocal minority. Just be open minded as we get more info and when we eventually get to play this for real, and you may actually turn out to like Tempest, even if it wasn’t what you hoped for.

Just because they’re a dev, doesn’t mean they walk on water nor cannot make mistakes when designing something. They should be critiqued over their work and if a dev makes consistent mistakes they should be called out on it. Work is work and you should receive feedback, both positive and negative.

Positive – overload mechanic is interesting
Negative – long cast times and no real way to protect the cast is bad for Pvp and needs to be re-looked at.

And most people are saying the Tempest is interesting but still have concerns over its viability in different game modes, not an overall “hey that’s awesome” and will wait to judge but it sounds cool. Big difference.

Reddit tends to be a hivemind and anything not saying ANet is doing the right thing and is awesome is instantly downvoted to oblivion. I wouldn’t use it as a proper source for seeing how people are reacting to Tempest.

And the forums tend to have a higher chance of actual balance discussion and theorycrafting more so than the GW2 reddit.

Kodiak.3281:

PlatinumMember.5274:

All I can say is: #believeinkarl. I think he has earned it.

I’m with you man! Karl’s reputation with the Elementalist community is 100% earned!

Ya know I mentioned this on Reddit and was downvoted to oblivion. IDK why they just didn’t #believeinkarl with me.

And to top it off, Mesmer Mantras go on cooldown the second you channel them where as the Overload when you channel it will go on full cooldown, completed or not and will lock you you out of attunement.

I’d rather that. Plus stealth.

TheFamster.7806:

I’m pretty sure you don’t play pvp or if you do not at decent level. Basically in a pvp match with people who actually are competent any major channeling skill will be interrupted in no time. Not everyone plays at the lowest skill ceiling.

I’m pretty sure your sarcasm meter is broke there, might want to get that checked.

What’s a scepter?

Drayos.8759:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pvp, the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

how do u even know that is the case without any insight of the specc? Lol. Ur Just making stuff up now and throwing at the fact he does not have a Sword, lmfao you have no idea what will and will not counter it til the preview goes live.

Reaper will be SLow as hell and shut down by merely being ranged and capable of kiting, people will still be using it in pvp and it prolly still work in a way, Just because ONE proffession counters it, doesnt make it useless Everything NEEDS to have a counter.

It’s not 1 counter, its multiple. There are a ton of interrupts in the game that are spammable and on low cooldowns. Mantra of Distraction is just 1 that has no cast time or animation, but there are plenty of others in game that are on meta builds that will make the Overload something you want to use sparingly and only when you’re sure you can get it off.

Avead.5760:

oZii.2864:

we are doomed

/sarcasm

There will be cries we are op after the livestream I’d bet all my gold on it

Definately..i can already see the NERF TEMPEST threads post friday.

Im personally interested in knowing more about the elite.It seems so bad !25% for 1 abilitiy for an elite????Even if its an aoe.
Unless it can be stacked and like 4 elementalists can fully recharge 1 ability of each or something like that? I think i dont really understand how this skill is supposed to work and what will its purpose be.

If it stacked that would be crazy. I imagine it will work like Ele casts Rebound → Ele casts Glyph of Storms → Cooldown is now 45 seconds instead of 60.

KaneZ.4910:

The utility skills are uninspiring I think, not enough “wow” when I read about them.

Eye of the Storm! – The tempest will call the storm down on nearby allies and himself, breaking stun on anyone affected while granting superspeed.

That’s pretty awesome in my eyes. Stunbreak for your team + superspeed? Yes please!

Those overloads better be awesome because getting locked out of your attunement for 20 seconds is brutal. Does it go on cooldown if you dodgeroll? Can you cast instacast things while overloading? With the amount of interrupts in PvP this is not only going to be situational, it may even be suicidal.

VodCom.6924:

Nighty.9721:

Ah… no, warhorn skins are bad.
And the weapon itself lacks appeal.

Your opinion man.

Personnaly I could use some variety : I’m sick of seeing GS/swords/staves all over the place.

Time to give the underdog weapons some love.

Short bow wants a word.

dsslive.8473:

And as i responded to you earlier, i believe, you are free not to use it, there is still more to enjoy from the new spec

but it doesnt mean warhorn is a bad addition, just not what some people would have wanted or were hoping for .

Looks are one of the most important things about my characters and i have plenty characters i have use a weapon because it looks great with the overal look even if its not the best weaponset the burdens of creating the perfect look ^^

Anyhow, can’t wait to find out what the weapon will offer and the spec in general.

Any addition is good, but it has to be a something worthwhile for it to be healthy for the game. Adding content for the sake of adding content isn’t good if it isn’t something that is worthwhile. It becomes a waste of resources if it isn’t something used.

That said, we need to actually see Tempest before it can be said that it isn’t something worthwhile.

dsslive.8473:

the fun of a weapon comes from its skills and how its used. .

Subjective, I like looking at my weapon too and if it doesn’t visually appease me (skin wise and animation), I won’t use it even if it’s OP and has interesting mechanics. I wouldn’t use focus till I could make Anomaly as I just couldn’t stand the eyesore that most of the foci are to me.

I don’t mind the handicap though, the more challenge the better. I will agree that we need to wait to see what it offers though, but I can say that there’s an 80% chance I won’t use it solely based on that.

Atlas.4509:

I’m not going to argue against the ascetics of the warhorn since that is so subjective. It sucks if you aren’t a fan of it from that point of view so hopefully the next elite specialization will be more to your liking.

What I would like to discuss, is the idea that another off hand is a bad choice because the dagger and focus are already good options and the current main hand weapons feel lackluster in comparison.

If their goal is to provide further build diversity with these Elite Specs (which I think it is) then they need to be very careful about which weapons they add and when they add them. Adding a new main hand weapon that clearly outshines the current choices would be counterproductive to their goals, because everyone would just be running that weapon all the time. By giving us another (hopefully good) option for off hand, that will actually create more interesting choices for us, as there shouldn’t be one weapon that is always superior.

The current mainhands aren’t bad, dagger mainhand is very good and scepter only needs tweaks to bring it to par. In PvE though, they are very behind staff as far as damage which is the main issue there.

The problem with creating an offhand that is support is that it has to compete with the current crop of offhands that are already very very good and cover a wide variety of support options. So either it will have to bring something you can’t get at all or it won’t be considered or it will completely outshine the current ones and you won’t take them any more.

The problem with creating a damage based offhand is that there will be no survivability as the current crop of mainhands we do have are mostly damage oriented.

Offhand in general for ele is pretty well covered and a tough crowd to compete with as most things are covered and has the same issue that you mention with creating a mainhand. Mainhand however, still has 1 area that isn’t covered, a true melee weapon (max 240 range) so that is where a future weapon can be placed.