Nah Moa is on the chopping block next for sure.
We hit the phase where Mesmers know how to play but people still haven’t learned to play against mesmers, so for some reason ANet decided it was time for big nerfs that are dramatically affecting PvE as well.
Devs don’t post here. The only argument against fixing Mesmers are “Oh they’re a PvP class PvE doesn’t matter.”
The nerf was a big deal for PvP but it was mostly warranted. However it hit PvE even harder. I doubt anyone will run a staff now if they care about power level.
“Then play a Warrior to experience the “supposed” Warrior bias that you advocate here, Rhyno. Play anything that isn’t 100B spam, which is a tiny percentile of available Warior builds, but which happens to smear entire profession with crap and give it bad reputation. Regardless, I just got trolled by extremely WRONG skill tooltips again in game. Duh."
Advocating warrior bias? All I pointed out was that Warriors were untouched, check the past two patches if you don’t believe me. I’m not sure why you just got really defensive.
When we were all joking about nerfing either the GS or the Staff so we’d only have 1 viable weapon set, ANet took it literally?
But seriously, anyone arguing that these past two nerfs were insignificant are out of their minds. They were arguably needed for PvP, and really crappy for PvE. ANet obviously can’t handle balancing PvP and PvE right now, so split them.
Also Mesmers are FotM? Look at this forum earlier this month where I was arguing with dozens of people that Mesmers weren’t underpowered in PvE, now we get dumped on twice in a row? It’s like ANet wants me to be wrong.
Don’t be surprised when Moa Morph gets nerfed either, just a heads up because that’s what’s coming next.
Does anyone else find it funny that the only guy here who thinks it’s fine is the warrior main? The class that was untouched? Classic.
I spent more than a month explaining to people that Mesmers aren’t that bad in PvE, no they get nerfed dramatically twice in a row and I’m not so sure anymore. Rangers got a nerf to one of their most satisfying skills, now they feel sluggish. It reminds me of the IAS nerf in Diablo III that kitten off everyone.
F2P? What is that supposed to stand for, because GW2 is clearly not free.
The game is good with potential to be very good, I wish we’d stop having these “everything is pefect lalalala” threads along with the negative threads. Focus on constructive criticism please.
Some intern at ANet doesn’t know what a millisecond is. Maybe it’s the same guy that wrote all the horrible tooltips littering the game. It’s like nobody there has heard of spellcheck.
So we literally have one viable PvP build now?
No point to replicate it in PvE.
This is almost the exact build I used to use in PvE, it’s good but far from the best.
I didn’t think it was the best in PvP either but now I’m going to re-examine it. I ran it while I wasn’t very skilled, it’s clearly better than I thought. That’s some really impressive burst. I was also running with condition damage which was an error.
I posted a very similar build right after the game came out. In fact it’s almost identical except for 30 points in dueling instead of illusions. That was also because I was using the pistol as well as the focus.
The reception was pretty bad because at the time everyone hated any build that involved shattering, preferring instead to just afk with their phantasms up.
My only other comment is the sigil choice. I thought I tested it and found that the sigils of energy do not stack. Am I wrong? Even if they do stack I find that when I swap I’ll typically have somewhere around 25% of my energy remaining. Two sigils will cause you to clip some of your energy no matter what. Not a huge deal though.
Use both, if you aren’t carrying both you are kittening yourself. I can’t even think of a dungeon where 1 is always better than the other all the way through.
If we’re talking about sPvP, it’s preferential but I prefer the pistol.
Also the “sudoku” vs “seppuku” thing is an old joke. Also Origami instead of Harakiri.
Feedback to tag in DEs? Why do I even bother posting in these threads…
It is an instant cast…if they are ranged mobs, you will hit them all. It costs you absolutely no time to use. Why not use it?
It doesn’t work in every situation, but it works in plenty. I think that is the rub with people and mesmers…there is no one tactic that you can just apply to every situation. You have to do different things. I couldn’t tell you a formula I use to tag mobs in DEs, but I can tell you that when the DE is over I have tagged nearly all of them.
Look, please just don’t comment on this any more until you have tried farming DEs in Orr. Feedback does nothing when mobs don’t attack a single time before they die. If you’re tagging stuff with feedback, you aren’t where the issue is.
You said DEs, you did not say DEs in Orr…perhaps be more specific?
Also, on my server DEs in Orr usually aren’t mobbed, but I’m on a lower population server.
I have no desire to educate you any further, go read one of the dozens of threads on this issue instead of being willfully ignorant and trying to argue with people over something you clearly aren’t aware of.
Feedback to tag in DEs? Why do I even bother posting in these threads…
It is an instant cast…if they are ranged mobs, you will hit them all. It costs you absolutely no time to use. Why not use it?
It doesn’t work in every situation, but it works in plenty. I think that is the rub with people and mesmers…there is no one tactic that you can just apply to every situation. You have to do different things. I couldn’t tell you a formula I use to tag mobs in DEs, but I can tell you that when the DE is over I have tagged nearly all of them.
Look, please just don’t comment on this any more until you have tried farming DEs in Orr. Feedback does nothing when mobs don’t attack a single time before they die. If you’re tagging stuff with feedback, you aren’t where the issue is.
Feedback to tag in DEs? Why do I even bother posting in these threads…
GS + Sword/Focus
GS: #2 and #4 are the bread and butter, #5 can push mobs out of AoE
Sword: #3 when they are running through you, #1 as you run beside them.
Focus: #5 stays up and finishes his whole attack even if the target dies, drop it in the front of the group
This is pretty much all you can do. It’s enough to tag 100% of mobs in a lot of events in Orr. There is absolutely nothing we can do for stuff like penitent path.
We have NO good AoE that we can just spam in anticipation of mobs, and for phantasms we have to actually wait for them to spawn which is really lame.
For the 500th time, the complaint about mesmer AoE is in regards to DYNAMIC EVENT FARMING.
We have 1 weapon set that tags mobs acceptably, GS+Sword/Focus and it just BARELY gets the job done.
How about instead of nerfing mesmers, they fix the dungeons.
It’s kind of like taking an exam where you happen to know all the answers from a TV show you saw the night before, then instead of improving the exam, the proctor punches you in the face and kicks you out.
It’s a mixed feeling for this. I’ll consider this as a bug fix as well as a nerf.
Personally, I feel that this “fix” is needed to make it such that the skill is not overpowered. Ranged mobs have practically no chance against it before the “fix”. This just makes it overpowered.
On the other hand, by not fixing the other phantasm to put it in line with this trait and thus leaving this trait useless as well as introducing a new bug that leaves the iWarden with a longer attack delay kinda puts me off.— oot
For those who say Mesmers don’t have good AOE to tag mobs, this just means you haven’t played enough.
You have Chaos Storm, and iBerserker to AoE. You can trait Illusionary Persona to do a self-Mind Wrack to tag mobs. If you have your illusions out, just send them over to Mind Wrack to tag. Sword1,2 also have a small AoE (although it only hits 3 max), so does Trick Shot for pistol.For dungeon AOE, Chaos Storm, Null Field, Time Warp are actually very good support AOE because of the combo field.
lol Chaos Storm for tagging mobs, good joke.
We’re talking about dungeons and soloing, your build doesn’t matter at all during DEs and large bosses. Just run full magic find.
Highest DPS in a vaccum is mathematically Rampager’s armor, which is why I suggest it for PvE. I’m guessing the people arguing for Beserker’s are either focusing on PvP or haven’t checked the numbers much.
Yes, Mesmers can do reliable condition damage because bleed is the heavy hitter for condition damage and mesmers can pile it on.
Anyone that thinks this was a “fix” to phantasmal haste or the warden simply doesn’t understand how the skills worked or work now.
ANet was notoriously awful at fixing bugs while being blind to balance.
Bug fixes effect balance, period. Balance needs to be considered when making changes regardless of if they are touted at “fixes” or not.
I love all the people stating that the nerf was warranted while completely ignoring the argument.
Literally the only half logical reason for the nerf is that some bosses are horribly designed, and just stand still spamming a ranged attack. Guess what, that’s kitteny dungeon design. Don’t crap on our best DPS skill and best (debatable) utility because the dungeons aren’t designed well.
It’s 40% from food, not 16%, and the bonuses are almost certainly additive, not multiplicative.
““Rhyno: Whatever, I’m just quitting the Mesmer until ANet learns to balance again.”
So you’re playing a class that is deemed one of the 2 best classes and you’re QQ-ing it’s not balanced. Go play ele, you’ll quit the game, not just the class :P*”
I stuck with the Mesmer while the entire forum complained that they were underpowered, learning mechanics, explaining why they were fine, discovering builds and teaching other players. This nerf is an unwarranted kick in the balls for PvE.
To everyone calling it a bug fix, I made two points:
1) A bug fix can still be a nerf or a buff, dramatically changing the balance of the class.
2) All they did was add a flat delay, so if it was a bug fix, the “bug” was that they accidentally entered in the wrong number for the skill delay? Yeah ok. This was a bandaid fix to something that wasn’t widely considered overpowered.
iWarden wen’t from a great skill keeping Mesmers viable in dungeons to another underperformer. For ****s sake, it stands still.
I’m also not sure what elementalists have to do with this. We know elementalists are weak, but they weren’t just dramatically nerfed. I’d be confused and annoyed if they were just nerfed too.
(edited by Rhyno.7084)
Whatever, I’m just quitting the Mesmer until ANet learns to balance again.
Nowadays you need weapons and armor that bleed blood and shoot out flames to appeal the 2edgy4u grimdark crowds.
Are you guys ANet shills or something? The most destructive and cancerous disease an MMO can have is a player base unable to correctly identify its flaws. Everyone plugging their ears and closing their eyes when presented with legitimate concerns should be ashamed.
I am 100% sure that shattering does not count as “death” or a “kill.”
It’s people like this that drive up the price of red and black dye.
The exact same kitten just happened to me, I actually checked your links to see if it was my party.
We did Forward→Forward on TA too.
That happens with a lot of the phantasms. Cast one when you’re slightly out of range and it just goes on cooldown too. That’s an especially goofy one. Just don’t let me cast the spell if I’m out of range.
Why are we discussing Time Warp like it’s not a huge AoE?
I’m a little confused by these threads when they get posted over and over and over. Are you saying that there SHOULDN’T be a way to distinguish clones from the mesmer if they’re just attacking? How could that ever be balanced?
Staff and pistol are garbage for tagging mobs, I can’t even tag in some events with great gear using those weapons.
Do what Effusion said but don’t shatter the iWarden if it’s hitting something even if it’s target died. It will finish out his attack before it pops.
Mind Wrack, one, two or three clones? Crits? (... and other shatters?)
in Mesmer
Posted by: Rhyno.7084
Marxo.3829: It’s defiant iirc, and yes stripping 3 stacks of it is awesome when you have someone with good single target CC.
The relative damage numbers are going to look like this:
1: 200 damage total (200 damage per)
2: 320 damage total (160 damage per)
3: 435 damage total (145 damage per)
So just scale up those numbers for whatever damage you are doing.
So like with more damage I get
1: 1780 damage total (1780 damage per)
2: 2740 damage total (1370 damage per)
3: 3600 damage total (1200 damage per)
So a 2 clone shatter does 150%-160% and a 3 clone shatter does 200%-220% of a 1 clone shatter.
All this shows is that you shouldn’t summon a Phantasm to immediately shatter which we all already know.
(edited by Rhyno.7084)
The pulling effect is very consistent and the point isn’t damage. iDuelist does more damage than the Warlock once you count bleed, and iWarden does even more damage than that.
You just have a poor understanding of each weapon’s utility and damage. Do some dungeons at level 80 or some PvP and you’ll see why the offhands are too good to ignore.
You’re also basing basically all of your analysis on what seems good and what seems like it synergizes. You also keep saying general things like “all sorts of conditions.” No. It just applies bleed and burning for damage. 2 conditions. Everything is finite here. You don’t need to generalize when it’s just 2. Mesmer condition damage is from confusion and bleed. Burning is a side-note, and the off-hands apply bleed much better than either 2H weapon.
He is playing pve so its pretty rare for a bit AOE to even occur.
Oh my god what game are you playing?
All you did was list all the weapon abilities and call them amazing. That’s not really an argument. The Sword+Pistol or Focus wins in the DPS category for AoE and Single target respectively. The staff does not “staff apply all forms of debuff and buff to yourself,” I’m not even sure what you mean by that.
The pistol and focus gets you more bleed stacks from Sharper Images too.
You’re just not going to end up with the “best” build for anything while ignoring the off hands.
Ignoring the off-hands is a huge mistake. It does not translate well into PvP or late game.
The only take away I got from this is that you aren’t good at LoL.
Nobody is “fooled” by clones in PvP… that isn’t their purpose. They don’t even have offhand weapons and they stand still lol
Gotta love the 2edgy4u gamers now adays that aren’t satisfied unless they can use atleast two guns at once.
I understand. You don’t so I’ll draw you a picture.
You really can’t wrap your head around the fact that nobody is saying a stun isn’t worse than a daze? You aren’t effectively gaining a stun. You are gaining a 50% chance to immobilize. Even if you do an entire build based around it, you’re going to end up immobilizing them for maybe two seconds during an exhaustive combo.
If you want to waste slots on that go ahead. It’s under performing relative to other traits which is why it was brought up.
Mantras are garbage for the sole reason that it’s just not viable to be channeling them in combat. Yes, you can cast your mantras while channeling the others, but if you do a mantra cycle you aren’t using your weapons, and they take up all your utility.
I’ve used 4M when soloing but it’s honestly just idiotic for dungeons.
The other issue is that the actual cooldowns on some of the Mantras feel really long. I just don’t like the idea of out of combat preparation skills at all.
My tip is that there isn’t really much here. Tell me if I’m missing something.
Chaos Storm, Magic Bullet, Sword Offhand, Mantra of Distraction, and Diversion right?
Magic bullet is out because it’s the 2nd target, Chaos Storm is random, Mantra of Distraction and Diversion are on huge cooldowns.
So what’s the point?
I’m still pretty sure the OP was joking.
The only build exchangeable between PvE WvW and dungeons is power/crit GS/Sword+Focus
If you’re refusing to use the focus don’t worry about your build. Just do whatever you want.
I'm seeing a lot of sadness about Scepters. Here's a 101 on them if it's a weapon you've never really used.
in Mesmer
Posted by: Rhyno.7084
If you want to hit F1 on cooldown, any weapon will get you there. If you’re using any clone-producing utility skill, the clone-on-dodge trait, or using the cooldowns on both weapon sets, you can hit F1 and F2 on cooldown. The scepter needs to bring something special to the table, and it just doesn’t.
Uh, the goal isn’t to use F1 on cooldown, I’m not sure what gave you that idea. The idea is to be able to use your shatters constantly without sacrificing fresh phantasms.
Summoning an iWarden and an iBerserker to get an extra two seconds of invuln is a big sacrifice. Dropping two quick clones instead, so you can drop your phantasms right after is much, much better.