Guild Wars 2

kitten man. Your post does not make much sense, atleast when given no context.
You should start off your post by telling your overall goal or argument of the post. And then follow with math and argumentation. Instead I get thrown into tens of random terms that just calculate something.
’ take armor and divide by power, this is oPA. If you now take this and multiply this by 4% conversion constant and divide by 4 you will get normalized armor coefficient’
Nothing wrong saying that, however it doesn’t provide anything.

Are you trying to say that:

k*PROD(1+Attack_Mod) x (1+SUM(Defender_Mod) )x Power x Weapon / (Toughness + Defence)

where Attack_Mod are stuff like 10% bonus while in fire, 5% against burning and 10% while inside 600 range. PROD is product (Pi).
Defender_Mod are stuff like -33% protection, -10% signet of judgement and 5×1% vulnerability (5 stacks). SUM is summation (sigma).
And I put k as the skill dependant coefficient, like 0.85 for fireball.

AKA modifiers on attacker are multiplied and modifiers on target are additive.

For example me fireballing this guardian (using things mentioned above):
0.85 x PROD[ 1.1, 1.05, 1.1]x (1+ SUM[ -0.33, -0.1, 5x 0.01 ] x 2000 × 1100/ 3000
0.85 × 1.2705 × 0.62 x 2000 × 1100 / 3000 = 491 Hit

Are you saying this does not hold true?
If you say it’s correct, then what is this topic about?
If you say it’s incorrect and ingame direct damage against normal npc and player characters does not follow this formula ( don’t get hang up on the modifier part if you didn’t know, that is how they work as far as I have tested).
Then I would REALLY love some show, or proof, or atleast abit of tease, pix. About a case where the damage does not follow the well known formulations.

Seriously present your case first. I’m not going to even go into detail and try to understand the mess you wrote. If you don’t first give a reason (show that something is wrong with current knowledge) and then present yours. I do think the burden of proof is on you here.

What if I told you, you could change it up by just useing the same staff bunker spec with all it’s amazing traits for team and self support, with very high base values.
But just gear yourself with all berserker or berserkervalk trinkets. PVT armor or throw in berserker on shoulders/gloves/boots aswell.
You start blowing people up.

Or did I understand wrong? Was it that you were bored and stuck on the 103030?

quenoz.3859:

ladies and gentlemen, i present to you a video of poor XxX getting blobbed massively by all the 15 or so TUP we had at that time! http://www.twitch.tv/quenoztv/c/3169308
….

Oh no the traumas, that fight. I’m watching this epic battle unfold infront of me (0:25, bay side, FGS) while enjoying my daily sweetroll.
At 3:00 gandara raid charges and single me out sitting down on the side. I felt hated, I didn’t sleep much that night…
However I’m relieved to see my death got avenged soon after.

Last time I checked swapping stones for oil, and 100 power food for 100 prec version will balance out the max buffed zerker quite well. Atleast better than the power. Without crafting assasin stuff.

it’s great. As long as you understand to use it as a supporting kit to something else.

ImProVocateur.5189:

From a game engine efficiency view, the number of calculations per hit is enormous using any of the equation presented in this thread. It would seem more likely that a large data file has arranged arrays of hard numbers to facilitate the construction of an equation that has, at most, two multiply/divide operations. What are people basing these equations on? Did the devs disclose the actual equation used? Additionally, was that equation confirmed to be implemented, as opposed to a simple data set that works like a decipher array to generate the equation values?

From a game engine efficiency view sure. Not that I know of such (but not that I’m not interested )

But the equations reproduce the correct numbers in every situation and surely they were thinking with equations when balancing the combat damage system. So I don’t quite see your point? What difference it makes how it is done in the engine, we just need the abstraction, the input and result.

I do agree with OP. However I think this attacks the problem in the wrong place.

So instead of buffing the downed state I would recommend straight up stat boosts on the alive combat state. Mayby inversly scaleing on the WvW ranks. Starting from +300 on all stats decreasing on every rank you gain.
Also I think it would be clever to tie this up to the numbers in your close proximity. Meaning you would get greater boost, the more people around you. This would guide new players to the essence of world versus world. Which is to move around the WvWvW map with as many people as possible and build close relationships with every stranger you play with. Something that guilds could never provide.

I can imagine that getting chain crowd controlled by organised teams is one of the most discouraging moments for a new player. I know it was for my wife atleast. She was very dissapointed when she had to drop Elemental and conjure weapon skills which were serious part of her Elementalist summoner roleplay character that she enacted, for silly stunbreakers and stability skills.
Thusly I would think it would be fair for all WvW players under rank 50 to get 1s of stability for every crowd control that hits them. It won’t stunbreak but it will stop the nasty chain CC that we all hate!

The -% condition duration meta that rose to popularity during the summer was already a step into the right direction. It really helped alot of people. I can understand how discouraging it must be to get snared in the back of your swarm without endurance because you double dodged perfectly in the first engage while popping all your utilities, perfectly on cooldown.
Combination of Melandru runes and -condi food allows the heroes to passively defend against not only condition damage but all snares and cripples too by -65%, warriors often run with I think -98% on the latter. Which is truly amazing. These passive defences allow the skilled players to prioritise their valuable APM on constant AoE looting and spamming their utilities on cooldown. Instead of actively using them in clever moments, how boring would that be.

Hopefully Anet listens to our suggestions.

Elvicof.8263:

Zumos.2056:

NaqbiCmR.3086:

I apologize for the way this was handled by my guildies on the forums i wasn’t on when these posts happened they should have kept it in whispers and ill deal with that matter i promise
…
Simple Apology from your side would be nice for the description. Let us put this behind us like adults .
…

If anyone should apolagize it’s you,

Didnt he already apologize or do I read something wrong

Unfortunately it’s not a apology if it followed up by a insult.
“Simple Apology from your side would be nice for the description. Let us put this behind us like adults .”

If I get blamed of doing something that I have not done. I sure would not be apologising for defending myself.

There is nothing worse in life than bullshaite. And gj WBC for valiantly pushing it away.

ImProVocateur.5189:

OP,
I have enough characters to do damage testing between classes. A couple of months ago it felt like the ele was taking far too much damage for 3.2k armor, which was my spec at the time. I did damage testing in PvP practice area, WvW and PvE. I can tell you with conclusive evidence that there is secret code that manages damage, and that, at least for the ele, armor does not mitigate like it should. That sucks because ele already has the worst survivability.

Oh, btw, my untraited guardian base armor (2.2k if I remember right) had the best damage mitigation efficiency. It worked better than my ele at 3.2k. I was shocked and disappointed, but I was glad my earlier impression was validated.

Could you share these conclusive evidences please? Contact me ingame or mayby private message? I would definetly appreciate knowing if they have changed skills without telling.

The weakness of Air auto is (atleast supposedly) explained for you can use the #2 in combination with it. With 20% reduced CD you can throw one #2 for every channel.

Can’t say I have seen any variance that I could not explain.

The dmg is always very varied depending on many variables, because of Tornado, wide area it hits (many different type of targets), food proccing 200 power, if I’m in group with guardians I got 20 might, if with staff eles and necros I got 3 might. 20% boost hitting at 33% health, bloodlust, orbs, guard killer and staff eles often have high crit damage (or should have).

One normal/unlucky meteor dropping on yourhead is no insta wiper. It’s modifier is the same as Air #2, and almost same as Eruption.
But that
1.3*1000*2000/2600 = 1000 damage tickle hit from a freshly entered Ele turns into a
1.2*1.3*1000*4800/2600*2.3 = 6600 wiper crit from the same guy with 10 might and all the WvW and food passives, with 80% crit dmg, against a 33% hp target.
And they only go up from that.
I know I’m just pulling numbers here but my point is the damage can vary alot because of the long channel, buffs change.

Forestnator.6298:

coglin.1867:

…

Because engi has tons of explo finisher (it seems like u don’t use them for some reason) which give us reatliation in a light field. And this is totally kitten because no one needs 3 seconds of retaliation. A water field would give AoE-healing with an explo finisher. But this is not the problem, the problem is: light field destroys any combofield+finisher for this 10 seconds. No fire bomb + explo finisher for AoE-might. No healing turret + explo finisher for AoE healing. No poison grenade + explo finisher for AoE weakness. It’s just an annoying field vor explo finishers which blocks everything for 10 seconds.

And there you go, that is exactly the reason why they do not want to give engineer such a simple source of waterfield. Because we have so many blasts.
Obviously we have healing turret, but to use the water field you have that slight sacrifice of having to use your #6 healing skill, mayby when your party needs it and not you. Same with the ranger heal.
Making the light field to heal same, but faster, that would be a nice reasonable boost idd. But not the waterfield.

I would advertise All elixir with Coated Bullets as more of a WvW utility+AoE spec.
Some aoe condition removal and buffing. Great condition removal and buffing on self.
And Toss Elixir R for getting that scrub commander up who got downed, that is something not many classes are able to do. Usually only warriors. Will also have aoe stability on Throw elixir B next patch.

And you can swap the build for 10/20/0/30/10, or 10/30/0/30/0 to get those elixir throws to remove boons.

I don’t know exactly what do you mean by “PvE” here. But yeah I can see this being great tagging those massive temple or some champion events with big zerg. When there is 20 mobs in a single spot. Piercing attacks hit atleast 10 targets, might be no limit.
But for dungeons, or anything without alot and ALOT of targets, pistol simply does not do anywhere enough dmg. Just wanted to say that cos you made a silly mistake of comparing pistol dps to nade dps, I know you weren’t serious.

But with utility in mind and using it in only massive AoE fests when you want to #1 #2 chillax. Iz gud.

We charrs get this cool skills “Hidden pistol”, that toolbelt skills hits hard, and does feel very bad kitten , fits the pure pistols feel here.

Let’s just get these out there so people are able to properly flame each other for blobbing.
Blobbadon’s Mouth, Blobalation, Blobbers’s Sound, Blobber’s Hold, Fort Blob, Far Shiverblobs, Blobbingworld, Blobbing Lake, ummm Zergingonur, Zergash, Blobdara.

Haha, idd.

It’s all fine and good if someone uses a certain attunument “75%” of the time. Like lets say Fresh Air burst DPS Scepter Dagger or DD, constantly juggling in and out Air. Or 20-30 fire Staff Ele sticking in Fire as long as it is possible – only damage required.
This kind of play just isn’t what people are talking about when they say “single attunument”.

“Is it possible to make a build so you can specialize in only one attunement… And also perform good in PvP and WvW??? "
Nope. If someone tells you can, he has very low standard of “performing good”.
You are able tag along sure, let’s say with some D/D fire, decent direct dmg and perma burning 2v1. Or fire staff in a 60vs60, but let’s be honest it doesn’t matter what you do with so many people around you.

I just cannot understand why would you want to play elementalist pvp with a single attunument. I recommend rerolling, really. No need to nerf yourself like that.

Haha, well I do not think your match up is what is of the best type. Referring to
BP, IoJ, CD and FG, DH, SF match ups. Those were the first 2 posted in this topic.
Firstly I’ll say, I do not play in US, I have though. I do not play in Gold or Bronze league, I play silver league EU.

I am reffering to the first 3 links in the topic:
http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups/map/1039
http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups/map/1040
http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups/map/1035
I just found funny how the bronze ones were linked as how the matches should be. When the objective spread tells about very passive and boring gameplay. Gold league match up objective spread tells about the actual healthy gameplay from objective point of view.

How the objective spread is in these match up is very common for low tier match up. It is exactly same in lowest league of EU aswell, where I have played. As I am watching the maps for these 2 match ups I see noone having objectives on enemies borderland, and noone has anything from the enemy in EB either.

This is very common in the lower tiers where they have people just for 1 border and EB. They stack their own border and make sure they have everything in there, and all 3 servers do the same. Result: everyone ticking 1 full home border and their own side of EB, equal points, rarely venturing to raid the enemy lands. And this happens for majority of the ticks, obviously there are other caps here and there, but this is the equiblirium fluctuated around-
These 2 match-ups just perfect examples of this.

Then as I compare it to the third post, which seems to be the highest match-up,
JQvBGvSoR I see totally different objective spread. Every server has multiple objectives on every map, fluctuating around the standard: every server has their own in every borderland and EB, like briar/refuge/bay.

So there are 2 ways for equal match up from the scores here. The lowest league one:
- all servers stack max players for their home border and cap it to the full with little opposition. Once this is capped they think about moving to another border. The standard situation is: all 3 servers have home border fully capped and own side in EB.
The highest league one:
- All servers have a presence in all maps. Everyone tries to hold their own corner of the borderland while poking forward from there. Resulting in more fighting against opponents instead of just holding homeborder against nothing and having such overwhelming force in homeborder + siege preparation.

I do not think anyone can say the lowest tier equibilirium is the healthy one here.

And NO I am not talking about blobbing, zerging, gvg, necromancers, warriors, permastealth thieves, arrow carts. I am talking about the general PPT metagame that is obviously shown in these 2 very different styles.

glyph of storms in fire and FGS #5 fire storm hits, umm well I say atleast 10. Possibly unlimited. They are exellent way to get yourself killed by Retaliation.

Kitten hell, why are people arguing about it. WHO CARES what was GW1 GvG, who cares about GW2 GvG. Those are just names. Absolutely no need to argue about such. Man introduces ‘hey we got this community driven event in PvP. Alot of people dislike sPvP because lack of different modes so we trying to create a new one! Try it out, everyone is welcome!’ – paraphraseing obviously.

And people respond by arguing about their idea of gvg size? You people make me sick.

Good luck have fun

In a close range situation a good necro who knows his fear locks will probably win.

I use 30/10/0/20/10 condi nade/FT/EG. And with that setup you overcome necros by
- Start with some max range nades. The worse, even average necros drop some marks infront of you cos they think you are gonna push into them. And scepter skills won’t reach.
- Max range really helps against stuff like Signet of Spite. They often just pop it early, but then you can disengage! You will not survive close if it hits you.
- Quite soon you will have to push closer to land your CC or better nades. Staff skills are easy to dodge because of obvious cast time. Make a human female necro and learn the animations, especially for some of the killers like corrupt boon, signet. I like to dodge during my push to close range after the max range nades, and then Acid Blast my kitten out once on top of the necro. They might miss a ground target like that.
- Do not overstack (duration) your condis, mainly poison and burning. Their heal will remove all of them, no matter how long. So don’t use pistol #2 if you already used Poison Nades, or EG #3. Reapply as the drop off.
- Drag it out (abit)! You can die very fast against a fearlock, but if you die with using your turret heal just once, you probably didn’t give your all. Your goal is to use Healing turret twice, and only let necro heal once (they drag it out closer to 33% HP always, you should be using way before)!
- Consume conditions is one of the few healing skills that are easy to interupt. Lately I’ve been really good about interupting it, and that basicly wins it for me. If necro is below 50%, and you are doing good 4+ condis on him, he will heal very soon. Get the CC lock going! Condi pressure → Throw shield daze →DPSDPS moving closer → flamethrower KB interupt →DPS DPS → Shield KB → profit.
- For me the fights are always one sided (against better necros)- Either I get totally destroyed by a fearlock and signet (no max range, no disengage → death). Or I get the starting right and I follow it up with CC lock under 50% hp interupting all heal attempts. They don’t get the ball rolling as easily if you control how the opening goes but you can die in seconds if jumped/cooldowns.

GvG and wvw would be quiiiite different if -40% didn’t exist. And +40% too for fairness. Melandru alone is fair but it’s the combination.

I qued for piken last weekend, got pop yesterday night. The ques are fine.

Dunno why this 5 ele group but perma swiftness and protection is nearly achieved by two 30 arcane eles doing attune spam rotation. Which is perfecty reasonable for 30 arcane DDing and might stacking. I would much rather have 2 of those than 5 of signet spammers :P. Caps the fury too ofc, unless others are doing single attunement.

Record a long enough cycle with Poison→ Freeze → bleed → main. Count how many times you used each skill and total time. Add up all their co-efficients and divide by time.
Calculate base DPS value with c*p*w/a, using the total c per time. Make sure to add in couple of different might, 10 and 20 say, and fury with what ever uptime., foods and everything. Also use couple of armors, like 2200 and 2800. Add in, or should I say multiply in possible traits and vulnerability.
Sum this with DPS of perma poison and few chosen different bleed stacks. You can think about burning too.
→ repeat calculation part for each gear set
→ use excel table

“My utilities work just like they say in the tooltip” said no engineer ever.

This post inspired me to do some fooling around with turrets againg, Accelerant-Packed Turrets the only thing that makes em viable for pvp purposed.
On a side note I noticed that Rifles Jump Shot is bugging atm so that it gives 3, in a way, AoE vulnerability per each dmg tick. Vulnerability attacks so often bugged like this, like guardian blind vulne was.

In other words if you jump and land on 5 guys with Jump Shot, they all get 25 vulnerability instantly, 3 per each hit. So 4 gives 24.

Well firstly people need to realise how to you use conjures. You most often not supposed to stick with it to use full charges. Use what is necessary and then drop it.

I’ve long time occasionally used Frost bow in wvw guild raids, even in the easy win GvGs. You still use your trusted Blink+Arcaneshield, or mist/armorofearth what ever, but often there is room to innovate in the third one for any spec.
You can mix one in when you think it as a utility replacement, if you know what I mean.
If it’s going easy and enemys are numerous but getting melted get double cantrip and frost bow. If it’s hard, next patch you can even try something as mad as double cantrip + earth shield, think the #4 pull was getting range increase, and #5 is still like a mist form type. Use those couple good skills and drop it, like it was arcane wave or arcane shield.

And not talking about meta changers here…

Condi ele will obviously become a more viable option for wvw fooling around and roaming. You won’t need 30 arcane cos you can fill in the dead gaps between burning and bleeding with conjures.
Dagger/focus, drakes breath → frost bow #5 & #4 → drakes breath → earth shield bleeds stuff like that. Giving the burst bleed stacks 10+ that eles have never had.

30 fire fury blaster gets another reliable blast+fire field with fire axe, if #1 was AoE it would brilliant but I’m not sure if I see room for this, unless just for doing 1-2 blasts.

You can mix in one conjure for any spec. You don’t need the charge increase most often. Thats for PvE LH spammers.

Don’t know if I should laugh or cry. Prolly both at the same time will do.

haha wtf, chemso ftw

You are not making sense :P. Whats wrong? You mean the nerfs? Yea bummer we hate em too. I tought you were talking about something hidden stealth nerfs. And I don’t see such between that video and current, around same build same power.

FTs strong point definetly comes with high might stacking setups. You can even throw in boon duration runes if you use elixirs and battle.

Not quite sure what you were after here. You mean just arcane wave stealth nerfed or everything?

I don’t say they definetly have not nerfed something on ele. But firstly the arcane tooltips have always been off, as they didn’t use correct weapon damage and such. I remember something that the tooltip used to show around the 150% damage cos it always crits. Anyway not sure about the arcane as I said.

But if you say the weapon skills have been nerfed? If you can name a skill that you think has been nerfed, it’s simple to just compare the coefficients now and beta for weapon skills to determine it.

EDIT: went and did the same kitten, arcane wave did the same 1.3k as he did on dummie.

You say you haven’t played for a year, so I will judge and help that in mind (aka standardish and general tips, instead of something experimental).

- Both of your build variations work. I prefer the variation 2 from traits. But the standard would be 0/10/0/30/30 (1 | 3, 9, 11/12 | 5, 6, 11 ). Does make you better support aswell. If nothing else, I really recommend taking Renewing Stamina from Arcana. Nothing beats vigor.
- For armor Celestial definetly works great for standardish D/D ele! You can even throw in boon duration runes if you want. Great way for roaming is for example half of your items or less Celestial (like 4-6 Celestial jewellery, or chest/legs/head). And then you use rest of the items and food/weaponstone to balance out that low Power, and might stacking (remember power is da best stat).
- So personally I prefer direct damage approach with nice touch of condi and healing. Rather than condi+ healing approach with little direct. Simply because we don’t have high bleeds nor poison, nor confusion, so…

Yeah haha this is like roaming heaven. So many people constant action. Truly epic match up so far. Guys accept VII GvGs! So it’s not just roaming we do here!

Time to say kittens for orbs and start gvgs againg. Unofficial skrims too if orbs are problem. Let it start here.

Well the modifiers are multiplied, not added. So that list is actually ~2.54 total modifier, +154%. My guess is no cap, but only Lava Tomb brings it past that 100% anyway.
You don’t have to worry.

Burning is king idd but that is overkill

6 different sources of Burning with 103% burning duration? Cmon, overkill much, it still does not stack intensity.
Outside of that insanity, sure cool.

shhh, don’t tell him about melandru runes and lemongrass food. Or else we will have a 3.9k armor, condition immune monster running rampant in the wvw fields.

Haha, well this would definetly be fun.

It is very common in WvWvW for all classes to stack up bloodlust/corruption/perception and then swap that weapon out for other sigil. Due to stacking problems on proc sigils people (atleast big part of the top guilds who know that they constantly get kills) often use Stamina (endurance refilled with kill) on atleast one of their weapons.

However I would say if that class already has perma vigor, or using Energy sigil, or some other method of regularly filling that dodge bar. It’s probably better to use Sigil of luck over Stamina. So for 2 weapon engineer with vigor kits I say it’s definetly worth trying after kills stacks, over Stamina.

I’ve been sharing this around lately quite abit, but let me write in here too. That the obvious best solution from practical, roleplaying and gvg purposes is simply:

Orb buff is claimed from the orb by channeling into it like Skill point. (it’s captured and escorted to a keep like previously)
If you don’t want it, you don’t take it. Also makes the orb cooler – artifact from which people can draw power from. Why have it as a boring sudden zone wide buff. It should prolly have charges too so after 500 taken buffs it resets.

Don’t like the solutions. Better solution is obvious:

Roleplay value:
Orb is capped, epicly escorted to the keep, in there it is placed on the Orb platform where everyone can come and channel the power of the Orb into themselves. (like channeling to a skill point)

Aka, Orb buff is claimed by interacting with the orb. Done…

thats not 100% boon duration build, that is 40%+ magic find build!

Fiery Greatsword can now be cast while moving.

Lol why all spammy hate. Atleast hate for a better reason, not “haha second”.
Grats, at 250k your account gets deleted with game over on the screen. Thats why sacrx quit.

haha, well props for having the balls to try making introductional video when not being from one of the top5 combat guilds. Being the target audience yourself.

Saying those step texts out loud with generic korean or russian accent cracked me up tho. "use combo field, such as “blast!”

I’m sure there is one guy recording in every guild. And it needs to be posted public only if requested, within a week from the request let’s say. Failure to provide it disputes the matches. This request should be exception not the rule.
That makes it 6 days left to provide video.

Thx for the song link. Made my day.

I would expect them only giving stat boost on the ascended, not weapon damage. That would be too much .

kitten , our topic got moved againg so I just want to create it againg so we can continue the discussion.

I’d like to get back to the Agg vs EP WvW fight. It was brilliant how aggression had their Arrow Carts just setup in the back on the wall, while the rams where just tightly packed in the middle.
But then EP came and built two Ballistas in the flank and just sniped Agg arrow carts down and after that their rams were easy to pick off in the middle.

I’m really looking forward to some real wvw guilds to start properly utilizing Trebuchet play but I am worried on the upcoming cow shot buffs draining supply. If you get drained all the time you can’t drop arrow carts, and intelligent Arrow Cart placement was pretty much the only skilled thing left in wvw.

Am I just tripping or are my worries real?