Guild Wars 2

CutePicsHunter.7430:

Sagat.3285:

They like rng in specs too much it’s lame and hurtful system. Surprised no MMO never got rid of it. Even power specs would be improved if there was no rng but just pure reward,who likes an rng balance,winning or grinding by it??

And I’m the one who is against even just critical hits… I liked that example of HoTS where they desided to remove them and give item for 1 hit with 200% damage every 10 seconds.

prokittenil

Oh, those kittens are everywhere. Meant to be pro© until.

It’s common sense. Do you want it to have that much effect on your damage output or success rate? Back in C9 I used to hate maxing Freezing Shot but it would only freeze 1 out 5 times or my warrior’s grab not critically hitting despite pvp max crit rate was 70 and I had 60. Little faults and RNG eventually start to bug you like a splinter in your head. You asked your self:“I did everything right where is my proper reward?”.

CutePicsHunter.7430:

Ghotistyx.6942:

But lets not get carried away. People like to think RNG is some form of polio. I don’t have a lot of issues with the traits we currently have, passive or not. Traits and traitlines are designed to both give active effects, and passive effects. You can build both towards enhancing your strengths, or reducing your weaknesses. Any form of competition will have people trying to maximize their strengths and minimizing their weaknesses, so why do we complain about it in Guild Wars 2? People complain about the noobtube, but its by far not the most effective weapon. If you get into a fistfight, are you going to complain about someone that consistently blocks your left hook? Or what about someone who can just shrug off your blows passively?

Incorrect comparsion. Fistfight is not a “game” that is supposed to be balanced. Fistfight is not a game that is supposed to have build variety and counterplay against strong skills and traits. Some strong traits has no counterplay and can’t be predicted. Well known examples:
1)Incendiary Powder. Very overpowered trait that inflicts 4+ seconds of burning on critical hits. Critical hits = RNG, if you’re not using intelligence sigil. So, it randomly inflicts 4+ seconds of the strongest damaging condition in the game (fear with terror trait is too specific to count). Enemy player can do nothing about it – if he will dodge or block this trait just won’t prokittenil he is hit with critical attack.

He will get that burning no matter what he will do.

2)Any other on-crit-conditions. Why? Because it becomes impossible to be sure that by using certain condition-cleansing skill that removes 2 conditions you will remove that burning and poison from you, because if you will suddenly get vulnerability/bleeding above that from RNG passive trait proc, you will still have burning on you. It will only work if you’re using cleansing skill with instant cast and will be in the middle of the dodge roll. Yes, by using dodge roll to prevent applying 1 stack of vulnerability from RNG.

At least, all minor traits with on-crit-conditions should be removed, so the player will be forced to chose such trait from the other adept/master/grandmaster traits.

Exact minor traits:
Engineer’s Sharpshooter.
Elementalist’s Flame Barrier, Weak Spot.
Warrior’s Precise Strikes.
Necromanser’s Barbed Precision.
Mesmer’s Sharper Images.

They like rng in specs too much it’s lame and hurtful system. Surprised no MMO never got rid of it. Even power specs would be improved if there was no rng but just pure reward,who likes an rng balance,winning or grinding by it??

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

Stop trying to counter me and share your way of creating diversity in pve.

Why do you need a diversity in auto attacks? Because that’s the content we’re getting with HoT. An open world content where diversity is already achieved. Just ask people on map chat on any map. There’s plenty of diversity there. Stop focusing on the abandoned content where the small toxic minority dwells.

Do dungeons have some of that diversity,how is HoT not open world,are they putting the old content in a coffin? There is diversity in AA btw and open pve is majority but is it quality? All mmos that listened and promoted casualization failed eventually, even those who started challenging(not hardcore) only reason WoW is still a thing is because it’s a blizzard franchise, they have fans from other games like diablo and wildstar. BDO dropped in charts and population despite those pretty graphics,look at The Order 1886.. All those games have 1 thing in common you believe they would be different than the failures before,start great,turn around on their original fans,fail,create more hype for the next possible difference.

Just let them confirm what kind of pve content they want to promote with words or content and I shall stop and maybe wait for next expansion. I do wonder what are they looking up to.

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

Toughness for power,vitality for conditions which are useless in group pve,but what actually stacks conditions on you constantly enough to bring pvp like cleansing. You could argue power/toughness condi damage/vitality precision/heal …ferocity overlaps. Toughness is useless vs condition and vitality is very inferior vs direct damage.

Again only 2 ways,create pvp like encounters or gut down crit. If you oppose give me your way. It’s not like crit is a good mechanic anyway.

Sorry but vitality works against direct damage perfectly fine. Nomad’s gear provides so much passive defense you can go afk with your auto attack turned on and still kill a boss.

If you want to facetank damage you need more stats than just toughness. Would a tank work without a healer in a typical mmo? No.

As long as heal are enough toughness+healing+dodge is enough to “tank” direct damage. Back to topic look at pvp, there is variation there that’s the best example of what pve should be like,already posted the only 2 solutions. If they don’t care I just need them to confirm that we will have that version of “challenging” content so I can stop being in those threads and maybe wait for next expansion.

Stop trying to counter me and share your way of creating diversity in pve.

ODB.6891:

Sagat.3285:

ODB.6891:

Sagat.3285:

hybrid.5027:

I like how people are trying to solve the zerker “problem.” News flash: it’s not a “problem.” Glass cannon builds are the end result of a game with active defenses and classes who are self-sufficient on healing. Period. This is not only not a problem, it is actually a good thing and a step forward in MMO design.

If you really want to nerf zerker, introduce new content so challenging that the bad players who wear zerker and get carried by their DPS have to take off the zerker to survive. But be careful what you wish for.

OP mobs will change nothing,only way is either player like encounters(anything a player can do so should a mob) or removal of crit and improvements of condition cap.

I’m fairly certain that the only things mobs do not have in their toolkit of abilities in PvE are dodges and smart positioning. As far as removal of crit goes…if that’s okay to remove a core stat….then I guess that means its equally fair to remove toughness?

Sure 3 dps stats while 1 for the rest,genius even!! Again only 2 ways, look at pvp and wvw zerkers,also stop with single boss encounters, I need the devs to confirm what type of pve they want so I can stop…

Btw the toughness response had nothing to support it..core stat…sure.

Are you seriously going to argue that toughness is not a core stat of this game? Are you seriously saying that toughness is not a core component of survival gear? Anymore than crit or ferocity are core stats of dps gear? You have lost all objectivity and credibility if that is your assertion. Survival gear has 3 stats too….that work just as much in unison as dps stats work in unison for dps gear. What you guys seem to have a problem with is that your survival stats work for a different goal than dps stats work for. Dps stats work to kill mobs. Survival stats work to keep mobs from killing you. How is this a problem…when you consciously and intentionally choose your stats in this game. You don’t accidentally click to get a full set of survival stats anymore than you accidentally click to get a full set of dps stats. You get exactly what you were trying to get…why get mad about achieving your intended goal?

The point of my comment about removing toughness was to illustrate the hypocrisy of you mentioning removing critical damage. Clearly I hit a nerve with that, or you wouldn’t be making a completely ridiculous assertion that removing 1/3 of the stats from your gear choice was not equivalent to removing 1/3 of the stats from my gear choice. I think both choices are equally ridiculous and would achieve equal effect. It would go a long way to removing the safety net from survival gear and it would significantly reduce the speed clearing advantage of dps gear. Neither would be a good choice, as they both would significantly diminish the reason why people choose these respective options.

What it sounds like is you guys are wanting a GW2 uniform. Sounds like you want everyone in celestial gear. That is the only compromise that makes sense. Any other alternative is biased against one extreme or the other. Not that the presence of extremes are bad…since both extremes still get the same rewards…with more variety…which is what you guys profess to want.

Sure…

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

Sure 3 dps stats while 1 for the rest,genius even!! Again only 2 ways, look at pvp and wvw zerkers,also stop with single boss encounters, I need the devs to confirm what type of pve they want so I can stop…

Btw the toughness response had nothing to support it..core stat…sure.

Survivability has 3 stats as well. The very opposite of berserker’s or assassin’s gear is nomad’s.

Toughness for power,vitality for conditions which are useless in group pve,but what actually stacks conditions on you constantly enough to bring pvp like cleansing. You could argue power/toughness condi damage/vitality precision/heal …ferocity overlaps. Toughness is useless vs condition and vitality is very inferior vs direct damage.

Again only 2 ways,create pvp like encounters or gut down crit. If you oppose give me your way. It’s not like crit is a good mechanic anyway.

When people say mostly doom sigil users are celestial, why stick to only meta builds? I can’t remember the last I didn’t equip that sigil on condi war,or condi shatter mesmer even condition guard. Energy goes for necro and shatter mesmer as well,stop referring to only meta builds when making discussions like these or is because it affects the meta build you are using…?

NoTrigger.8396:

Sagat.3285:

ODB.6891:

Sagat.3285:

hybrid.5027:

I like how people are trying to solve the zerker “problem.” News flash: it’s not a “problem.” Glass cannon builds are the end result of a game with active defenses and classes who are self-sufficient on healing. Period. This is not only not a problem, it is actually a good thing and a step forward in MMO design.

If you really want to nerf zerker, introduce new content so challenging that the bad players who wear zerker and get carried by their DPS have to take off the zerker to survive. But be careful what you wish for.

OP mobs will change nothing,only way is either player like encounters(anything a player can do so should a mob) or removal of crit and improvements of condition cap.

I’m fairly certain that the only things mobs do not have in their toolkit of abilities in PvE are dodges and smart positioning. As far as removal of crit goes…if that’s okay to remove a core stat….then I guess that means its equally fair to remove toughness?

Sure 3 dps stats while 1 for the rest,genius even!! Again only 2 ways, look at pvp and wvw zerkers,also stop with single boss encounters, I need the devs to confirm what type of pve they want so I can stop…

Btw the toughness response had nothing to support it..core stat…sure.

there is a reason PvE is PvE and not wvw or pvp.

and btw, wildstar had bosses in adventures that act like “players”, or i should say monkeys. and you know what? they were easier than the normal bosses and all what their “dodging” did was making the fight longer than needed and extremely anti-fun and boring.

“also stop with single boss encounters”

k, and then? do you think multiple bosses at the same time would change anything? no. good players would still kill them in berserker gear.

PvP like encounters…players are not hp sponge,I don’t I have ever seen 5 zerkers beat other 5 mix and match easy,you called PvP boring..,players are responsive,you deny that that 3 dps stats are not currently unbalanced and again players are not hp sponge. Are you a 100% pve player?? I can’t see the pride.

Edit: You think what we have now is fun? What’s your definition of fun…??

Mayama.1854:

We already had that with warriors one shoting zerkers at max range, I dont think we need it again. It was a plague.

Wut? People couldn’t dodge it?? Rifle war was OP??? The game doesn’t only have zerker,it’s only 1 stat combination out of many and the new specialisation is not called thief so whatever weapon they go with it will fit them.

Lock the heal and elite,make 5 utilities per legend. Surprised many are asking a system similar to what we have now which is a failed balance, Revenant is the best designed class so far.

ODB.6891:

Sagat.3285:

hybrid.5027:

I like how people are trying to solve the zerker “problem.” News flash: it’s not a “problem.” Glass cannon builds are the end result of a game with active defenses and classes who are self-sufficient on healing. Period. This is not only not a problem, it is actually a good thing and a step forward in MMO design.

If you really want to nerf zerker, introduce new content so challenging that the bad players who wear zerker and get carried by their DPS have to take off the zerker to survive. But be careful what you wish for.

OP mobs will change nothing,only way is either player like encounters(anything a player can do so should a mob) or removal of crit and improvements of condition cap.

I’m fairly certain that the only things mobs do not have in their toolkit of abilities in PvE are dodges and smart positioning. As far as removal of crit goes…if that’s okay to remove a core stat….then I guess that means its equally fair to remove toughness?

Sure 3 dps stats while 1 for the rest,genius even!! Again only 2 ways, look at pvp and wvw zerkers,also stop with single boss encounters, I need the devs to confirm what type of pve they want so I can stop…

Btw the toughness response had nothing to support it..core stat…sure.

hybrid.5027:

I like how people are trying to solve the zerker “problem.” News flash: it’s not a “problem.” Glass cannon builds are the end result of a game with active defenses and classes who are self-sufficient on healing. Period. This is not only not a problem, it is actually a good thing and a step forward in MMO design.

If you really want to nerf zerker, introduce new content so challenging that the bad players who wear zerker and get carried by their DPS have to take off the zerker to survive. But be careful what you wish for.

OP mobs will change nothing,only way is either player like encounters(anything a player can do so should a mob) or removal of crit and improvements of condition cap.

Rozbuska.5263:

Please stop making thread like this there is no chance they will made some radical change before HoT so this is pointless

Huh? Have you heard of stability/defiance change??

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

We are not fighting one single hp sponge player. They are multiple of them capable of taking care of their own and are not all alike. What current pve has multiple bosses and not 1 boss+9 million trash mobs??

You misunderstood. The guy I was responding to was claiming conditions are fundamentally imbalanced because power damage has 3 stats while condition damage only 1. I find this conclusion wrong because conditions work in pvp and there’s no difference in stats in there, you still have 3 stats for power damage and 1 stat for condition damage.

My response is still valid. Only way of making conditions useful in pve is either creating pvp like encounters or fixing the cap or gut down crit chance/damage. Does 3 stats for power and 1 for EVERYTHING else sounds good to you? At least players are responsive and not brain dead. No full tank,heal or condition but we have to create a full dps .

ODB.6891:

Sagat.3285:

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

Are you saying pve should be a walk in the park or some kind of daily grinding ??? I didn’t mention open pvp in pve nor npc trainer mobs. Elaborate on your statement I don’t understand … You want pve to be a tag along spam fest please explain .

They will adapt like they always do stop thinking they need training wheels pve can be challenging as well. Can a 100% pve player tell me what is your comfort zone???

No, I’m saying that pve players expect from pve something else than pvp-like gameplay, e.g. bigger numbers, usually only one boss fought at the time, winning most of the time (instead of ~50%), etc.

#fail

Challenging group content huh? Can a dev confirm this is the direction the pve in this game will take so we can stop trying, just end it now and be honest.

#wrong #win

Rotten is correct, the objective in PvE is to win 100% of the time. That’s the entire point of the speed runs people flock to forums to cry about…to win and do it quickly. I’m 100% sure non zerk also wants to win and do it fairly quickly….they just want to do it in their comfort zone, with extremely low chances of failure…hence the safety net stats. I also draw this conclusion from their constant attempts to slip into those few runs that are still posted as zerk only or speed runs. Its amazing that all of this zerk hate originates from something this simple. This massive desire to “hurt zerk” as was so aptly phrased in a previous post. Someone previous even correctly summed this up, that the only place the zerk meta even exists is in “developer abandoned content”…dungeons and fractals. Yet, you constantly see threads out there specifically wanting to punish players for playing with berserker gear. Since the new content we are talking about is all open world, why does it even matter to you all what any specific player is wearing? It would be a more relevant issue if we were still treating fractal 50 as the hot content in the game…or even if fractals were the source of the game’s best rewards now…neither is the case.

I just want to hear it from them so I should always underestimate the word “challenging” from them in context or not, not the only thing I will ignore but stop trying to fool people be kitten honest.

So for everyone to speed run through pve you create 3 dps stats,an environment for them to dominate and impair other stats? Good show! Might as well end this thread, all I need is a red tag saying :“Yes this is what we want and will promote.”.

rotten.9753:

Tevesh.1265:

The combat system is fundamentally imbalanced.

Power VS condition damage blance is never there. Power damage has 3 damage stats that scale off each other multiplicatively, they have all the % based damage boosts and vuln as vell. Conditions have one stat (and precision condition procs are not a thing despite what anet think), are unaffected by % boosts or vuln and are capped as well.

Tell me why conditions work in pvp then.

We are not fighting one single hp sponge player. They are multiple of them capable of taking care of their own and are not all alike. What current pve has multiple bosses and not 1 boss+9 million trash mobs??

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

Are you saying pve should be a walk in the park or some kind of daily grinding ??? I didn’t mention open pvp in pve nor npc trainer mobs. Elaborate on your statement I don’t understand … You want pve to be a tag along spam fest please explain .

They will adapt like they always do stop thinking they need training wheels pve can be challenging as well. Can a 100% pve player tell me what is your comfort zone???

No, I’m saying that pve players expect from pve something else than pvp-like gameplay, e.g. bigger numbers, usually only one boss fought at the time, winning most of the time (instead of ~50%), etc.

#fail

Challenging group content huh? Can a dev confirm this is the direction the pve in this game will take so we can stop trying, just end it now and be honest.

rotten.9753:

Sagat.3285:

If a player can do it so should a mob, enough with the single boss encounters as well. Unfair??? I tough pve was supposed to be a challenge we are not talking mobs like the pvp npcs but everything a player can achieve like condi tank,AoE leech,boon reaper,tanky AI,dodge,parties etc. As long as crit exist to multiply damage it will be superior because of the condition cap,lazy way would be to make multiple uncritable bosses.

It’s either player style or gut down crit potential.

Yes but pve players don’t play pvp because they don’t want to leave their comfort zone. Now, if you bring pvp into pve you just make their world miserable.

Are you saying pve should be a walk in the park or some kind of daily grinding ??? I didn’t mention open pvp in pve nor npc trainer mobs. Elaborate on your statement I don’t understand … You want pve to be a tag along spam fest please explain .

They will adapt like they always do stop thinking they need training wheels pve can be challenging as well. Can a 100% pve player tell me what is your comfort zone???

Windsagio.1340:

People would hate PvP style enemies, if would feel unfair if the computer were both smart enough to be effective and had full open access to the player skills at player cooldowns.

If a player can do it so should a mob, enough with the single boss encounters as well. Unfair??? I tough pve was supposed to be a challenge we are not talking mobs like the pvp npcs but everything a player can achieve like condi tank,AoE leech,boon reaper,tanky AI,dodge,parties etc. As long as crit exist to multiply damage it will be superior because of the condition cap,lazy way would be to make multiple uncritable bosses.

It’s either player style or gut down crit potential.

Lifestealer.4910:

Sagat.3285:

Zoltreez.6435:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Zoltreez.6435:

the ONLY way to make Zerker less viable is Nerfing it or buffing all the other stats ALLOT.

i mean i don’t think there is any way to balance Fights where zerker is less effective.

Lets say you make the fight hard for zerkers and thx to this ALL the other builds are even MORE weaker on that fight. i mean if those zerker players who block and dodge perfectly at the right time dies fast what chance a Soilder Knight Clelic have ? they will survive ONE extra hit befor die while doing waaay less dmg ?

On the contrary, it’s quite easy to make fights where Zerker is less effective. Tequatl and triple trouble husks are both examples of where Zerker is not top dog.

On a better note, look at PvP and WvW. Zerker is rather unpopular in both because the risks associated with using it are much, much higher.

so basicaly the only way to make them less usable is to make every single boss in game uncritable ?.

thats bad in my opinion there needs to be another way.

As long as crit chance/damage exist as raw damage multipliers there is no other way. It’s a bad mechanic anyway, remove ferocity and crit chance ability to create extra damage, crit chance may remain but not as a raw damage multiplier but rather stat to trigger effects,make power more important then it becomes easier to control dps and dots potential. Of course the condition cap is still here but it’s not like propositions haven’t been made on that.

Its also a good way to butcher thieves and mesmer with that change. Those classes NEED zerker to even do any respectable damage, all other gear stats will result in them being unable to fill their own roles.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/PvX-Discussion-about-stats/first#post4838291

I main a thief btw. There should be no gear stats combos just gives us freedom. Who can prove it’s balanced to have full dps combo but no full tank,heal or condi and expect stats to compete properly??

Zoltreez.6435:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Zoltreez.6435:

the ONLY way to make Zerker less viable is Nerfing it or buffing all the other stats ALLOT.

i mean i don’t think there is any way to balance Fights where zerker is less effective.

Lets say you make the fight hard for zerkers and thx to this ALL the other builds are even MORE weaker on that fight. i mean if those zerker players who block and dodge perfectly at the right time dies fast what chance a Soilder Knight Clelic have ? they will survive ONE extra hit befor die while doing waaay less dmg ?

On the contrary, it’s quite easy to make fights where Zerker is less effective. Tequatl and triple trouble husks are both examples of where Zerker is not top dog.

On a better note, look at PvP and WvW. Zerker is rather unpopular in both because the risks associated with using it are much, much higher.

so basicaly the only way to make them less usable is to make every single boss in game uncritable ?.

thats bad in my opinion there needs to be another way.

As long as crit chance/damage exist as raw damage multipliers there is no other way. It’s a bad mechanic anyway, remove ferocity and crit chance ability to create extra damage, crit chance may remain but not as a raw damage multiplier but rather stat to trigger effects,make power more important then it becomes easier to control dps and dots potential. Of course the condition cap is still here but it’s not like propositions haven’t been made on that.

Harder mobs will change nothing even if they are OP by design. It’s common sense but if you want to put it to the test be my guest.

They might do something about it in HoT but I think they would have announced it it’s a pretty big thing just like water combat. I still don’t understand why they created 3 dps stats and expected other stats to be worth getting,there is too much difference they should see it by now. I can’t see them creating pvp like encounters in pve they are still going with the single boss fights.

They read forums but I am not sure what are their priorities and caring factor, some issues have been here since beta. Waiting on HoT and more interviews to know how they want the game to progress .

Shiyo.3578:

VodCom.6924:

• Buffing or reworking traits : Which ones and (again) in order to fulfil what goal ?

Venoms and traps for thief, especially venoms not basilisk, extremely weak and not worth using. 1s of chill x3? 1s of vuln x3? Remove venom share and rebalance venoms around only the thief having them applied, shadow arts is already the most bloated tree in existence, no reason for it to have SO many good traits while a tree like acrobatics doesn’t have anything past 3 points.

I run trap thief in wvw with Runes of Trapper it’s effective , if it wasn’t for that I wouldn’t have noticed traps were here, it took a rune to create synergy between them and SA it’s just wow.

If might stop affecting condition damage,percentage effects of conditions turn into numbers like vulnerability reducing toughness instead of increase of incoming damage and player can decide how much condition they have the stack cap would be no issue.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/PvX-Discussion-about-stats/first#post4836252

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/PvX-Discussion-about-stats/first#post4836252

As long crit exist no matter what the encounter it will not happen unless they slap non critable mobs everywhere which is the same as removing it

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/PvX-Discussion-about-stats/first#post4836252

CarbunkleFlux.6582:

I just don’t agree with needlessly removing options.
But it’s clear we’re not going to agree on this matter, so I’d rather agree to disagree.

No options will be removed they will transform while others are being created, it’s not a reduction process.

CarbunkleFlux.6582:

There are loooots of very competitive games, MMO and otherwise, that work around the inclusion of crit to a benefit (League of Legends being notable), so there is evidence of it working in practice and of its viability as a build concept.

I mean, if taking crit out of the game is good for it? OK, I’ll devil’s advocate you there. We lose those weapon sigil options, but dps becomes more of a steady stream.

But I don’t feel the same way about condition damage at all, so regardless of one’s stance on crit there isn’t any good reason to just take that build option away altogether.

It’s creative but creates imbalance if main purpose is more dps.

Edit: you can also trigger effects with just on hit,on swap,on certain skills,on heal,elite ect.

CarbunkleFlux.6582:

I don’t feel it’s a bad mechanic, especially with all the On Crit % weapon sigils that enhance it.

What makes it a bad mechanic to you? The spike damage? Or the fact that you have to build it for it to work?

Ferocity is the stat I don’t really get O_o. Having Ferocity, Power AND Precision just spreads your stat allocation to thin…

It’s a chance like system that can’t be really controlled and a simple multiplier for pure dps ,it creates an unreliability in specs that invest in it,it’s also the reason mmos end up in a dps fest. GW2 made it creative but it’s still the same faulty mechanic. No one can prove it’s balanced.

CarbunkleFlux.6582:

Merging condition/precision with power would result in something completely impossible to balance. You’d pretty much have to neuter any and all condition damage and gut the crit chance gain to make it work.

The end result is just less build options. Now you would do power for everything instead of choosing between an ailments build vs. a crit build vs. a straight power build.

Since we’re throwing around suggestions for discussion, here’s mine:

Problem: Condition damage sucks in PvE w/ large groups. Control conditions too easily available to everyone. No reason to go anything but zerks.

A: Damage conditions are stacked on an attacker-basis, not a target basis (IE- every attacker has their own stack).
B: Damage conditions can crit.
C: Lower base damage on conditions, w/ condition damage ramping it up more (but not as much as now, since they can crit).
D: Control conditions have a low base and scale w/ toughness, League of Legends support style.
E: Boons have a lower base and scale w/ healing power. In addition, healing power needs to scale a little better. Not by that much, but enough that it feels worth it to build the stat. It really doesn’t right now.
F: Some inherent condition resistance that stacks as you’re carpet bombed on conditions by different attackers. It affects duration of control conditions only and resets after a while.

Obviously, there are balance issues to work out—especially with carpet bombing damage conditions in PvP. I have no real ideas for that. But I think something along these lines would go a long way to addressing the issues outlined above.

Not merging more replacing,no more RNG crit chance/damage. It’s bad mechanic that’s the point of replacing it.

Issues: condition cap,poor stat scaling,universal optimal zerker meta, crit RNG mechanic, pve rewards system, pvp balancing, lack of customization,attached stats to traits lines,traits.

Goal: Fixing ^ and ease up class balance.

Currently you are not dps if you are not using crit chance/damage. First crit is bad mechanic it really on chance which is terrible a burst player(PA) will worry if the attacks he wants to crit crit while others(PB) will simply play a tankier spec but use intellingence sigils,have fury uptime, use condi etc. Also 3 stats doing the same thing clearly imbalance while others use 1,you can’t build full tank/healer/condi but you can for dps.

If you are worried about not having enough stats don’t! Crit chance/damage removed+condition duration merge wih C.D+removal of attached stats to traits= large customization. Your spec will not change you can simply reinvest in stats but will improve because you control it,remember free stats, support and control specs can rivalize with damage stats. Conditons with numbers are more group friendly and players can control mobs better,might will not longer affect it since you can just keep investing in malice condition stacking fixed.

There shall be a cap to how much you can invest in one stat around 1800 and how much points in general to prevent wild outs and anarchy. Group way, as a power player you don’t have to take other stats if you know you won’t need and another player can provide it for you, you could max power+malice(or a little bit of boon duration). Malice would increase how much armor your vulnerability decreases etc. This would only create celestial(with all stats) specs only if you are trying to solo group content.

You decide what fits you it’s an improved customization.

Thaddeus.4891:

1) This could create huge balance issue. However choosing which of the 3 stats you want while not change the ratio between those could be a good idea.
2) No it doesn’t create imbalance. Do you see the game as imbalanced? Its a possibility that could have been use from the start of the game, but I don’t see any advantage of one choice over the other. It’s different way to looking at it and since we already have one system, switching it would be a huge process for almost no return. Lot of work for almost nothing.
3)This game is based around anything can work but there is setup more optimized than other. You change would force ppl into certain role and would limit diversity. Everybody would need a minimum amount of boons duration, healing power, etc. Leaving less place for diversity.
4) Again a change without any significant result.

Problem solved?
1) Player skills is directly rewarded right now and I fail to see in which way making stats work differently would change increase the involvement of skill in the game. Mechanics do that, not stats.
2) Yes. More stats diversity will make possible to focus more on what you focus. That’s your point 1 that I partially agree with.
3) It would be decreased and what you see as diversity would only be forced upon the player. You would absolutely need healing power or you can’t heal you, you would absolutely need boons duration to have fury and might, etc. That would not increase diversity that would only force ppl to use some stats and limit what they can do with the stats they choose to use.
4) Not really at all. Balance is far more complicated than that. It would change how the game play, which would make it imbalance. Then the staff would need to work to make the new system balanced.

1. is backed up #2,3 &4.

#2,3,4 This is not a solo rpg, even in co-op it would work, if you can’t do others will it gives other people purpose,promotes grouping,friends and guilds. If you don’t want to deal damage with boons just invest more in power which creates the zerker feeling even without crit chance/damage. If poison decreases healing power instead of percentages it becomes group friendly because it would stack,same case with vulnerability that would decrease armor. Worrying of cap not anymore might wouldn’t affect condis anymore and condition players could invest more in malice(mix of condi damage/duration) creating a sinister style condi without crit chance/damage. No pain no gain, how much you want to improve the game = how much you are willing to work on it.

I have yet to see other solutions mentioned either from them or other players on those topics. I am glad you criticize but also contribute/reform on how reach the goal.

As long as crit damage/chance remains and conditions are percentages instead of numbers there will be no balance. Other stuff has well but the funny thing is you can be full dps with 3 stats doing the same while for tank/healing/condi you can’t . The first mistake was the dps and solo play favoritism.

Crit chance/damage remains=optimal zerker for life.

It’s funny how we can’t build full tank/healing/condi but you can for dps,3 stats doing the same while 1 for others, sure great balance. No matter how many changes they make zerker with crit will always be optimal unless they slap non critable mobs on you which is lame I would much rather have them remove those two if they are looking to improve stats customization if not just say it already.

Lorgus.6148:

If you could chage stats around at will, as per your point 2, the entire crafting system would have to be changed, as currently different materials result in different stat combos.

Also point 3 not only sounds non-feasable, but goes directly contrary to your claim that "PvE diversity is increased ". If everyone had to invest in boon duration to recieve boons, healing to recieve healing etc. then all classes would result in a hodgepodge mish mash of every stat. Kindof like the celesial pvp meta at the moment.

In short, I don’t think this would be a very good idea, and I highly doubt anet would implement it.

1. takes from #1 with the removal of crit chance/damage and attached stats to traits the player receive a large pool of stats to control and personalize. A power ranger could simply invest in other stats to make up for what he wants or simply focus purely on burst with/without conditions. This doesn’t really affect spec because you can just invest back crit chance/damage and condition duration are no more.

Every class is kind of already mix match because you don’t need much stats to have good healing/boons etc. base healing is strong but scales poorly,boons stay long even without duration, only mix max is withing the raw damage stats. While they didn’t allow full tanks/condi etc to be possible full dps are possible. The system would improve burst specs and create others. A tank player could use intelligence sigils with fury up time to do good damage,a similar scenario is air/fire sigils. While a zerker vs celestial struggles if attacks are actually crit right and thinks he should do more damage than cele. New system would be zerker has full control of his output and is properly rewarded for it.

Support specs/traits etc would gain a boost. A symbol healing(example) guard would be more useful/wanted and the healing would be based on his healing power same way venom share works. Damage specs would gain a boost they would gain the ability to control their condition/raw damage ratio and put to better use defensive/utility stats they find unneeded. Traits would be improve as no stats would be wasted when making a spec, a trickery power wouldn’t waste his points on condition damage unless he wants to control and take advantage of them.

Overall it’s fixes condition stacking in pve,improves diversity in all 3 modes,gives players wide scale choices and customization,creates more reward as skills goes up. There is really nothing wrong with it but you can also gives your opinion on how to reach the same goal.

I have concepts about the direction stats should take since there is constantly issues all over related to it from all 3 modes.

1) Players have been asking for specific stats combo with gear and quality of gear. Why not change how stats are given? Transform all stats on gear in stats points and allow us to add and minus it to our basic stats.

2)Stats doing the same. Why have power,precision,ferocity and condition duration/damage? It creates imbalance,,limits playstyle in all modes, led to multiple on balance that still go on right now. Following #1 I propose a merge of power with precision/ferocity and condition duration/damage.

3)Stat role. You wouldn’t benefit from a effect without investing in the stat affecting. A player with no healing power would receive no healing,one with no boon duration would receive no boons. This wouldn’t limit support as if the player needs it he would spec for it and would share/receive with/from others that do the same. Another reason is the inferiority of recovery/body defense since you can out skill yourself to not need pve wise, this system would interest high skill players to invest in it,it’s not forced as they already spec for 3 greedy stats to get what they need.

4)Boons and conditions. Change percentages and put numbers. Poison would reduce healing power,vulnarability would reduce toughness,this makes conditions more friendly game and encourage synergy. Mobs would have healing stats attached to them. Fury would be change to next skill does X extra damage,might should no longer affect conditions as they create the cap.

Problems solved:
-Player skill is directly rewarded, a critical stat(s) result in RNG like system which is never good
-Instead of having basic stats players open to others. Ex: A burst player may choose to invest in power+malice+boon duration , focused on directed damage amplified with control/weakening conditions and offensive boons instead of worries of crits.
-PvE diversity is increased
-PvP balance is improved and eased

Discuss,criticize,give me your opinion on stats and customization.

Specific class roles are toxic it’s no different than trinity. All roles should be available to all, I tough it was when I first saw the game but nope,even when they give you the options, those are broken and affect player base.

I see it differently stats>class. Who here can prove crit chance/damage are balanced? 3 stats doing same thing while others 1.. prove to me it’s balanced. Imagine a “zerker” spec with power+malice(condition duration+damage)+ boon duration using weakening and controls condis+offensive boons to deal burst instead of basic damage multipliers. Crit=" Oh no this doesn’t crit, I don’t crit enough to activate this,oh no my crit damage is useless since I have low crit". Who here likes that and can prove it’s balanced even a dev any of them? I DARE YOU.

Those two need to go,stats with gear/traits need to go as well then open customization in pvp. Of course it would need rework of boons,condition applications/system, traits,sigils etc. but isn’t it required? Have fun debating about celestial while little zerkers don’t get proper burst, the current system is based on chance, my proposition would result in setup>reward no bumps in between. They know their game hopefully and if they want the population to come back after every balance patch/expansion then that’s their choice and a bad one.

The signet d/d spec is a gimmick. You just told us why you picked thief lol.Flashy melee and mobility seem like d/d cantrip ele imo, why does every class has access to all stats,sigils and runes?? Traits on top of it too and again thief is not probably getting rifle the specialisation is ,if it really does then it fits for them.

We got people playing SB / p/p , trap stealthing ,venom sharing, stealth soloers.. not sure when and where was that signet build with d/d ever meta lol. Just admit you want copy and paste of some game rogue,just don’t specialize, thief is still thief play it how you want.

We are speculating here,melee rifle was not compared to d/d anywhere,if it all about damage why do we have support,control,escapes,recovery.. ? Bring your signet build to Silverwastes,WvW and mid tier pvp lol.

Simon.3794:

i don’t know why people want rifle, it’s like they forgot what is a thief and reason they pick this class..

Are you saying thief should only weild d/d and zerker gear with signets? Thief is a general term which assasin is in,as well as rogue,scout etc. Don’t limit yourself to other games, I am tired of the copy and paste of classes across mmos. Why would they give us traits,gear stats,sigils etc. available to all..?

Wouldn’t they tell us or is it coming out randomly like the stability change??

Revenant are better designed to any of the base classes. All skills are designed to work with that legend and playstyle and have controlled effectiveness. Other classes… got to worry about this being UP with that,that being OP this, the QQ on this, the QQ on that,this sigil is making this op so my build get nerfed instead of sigil and a cycle again and again. After +2 years of release,classes still have inner issues do we want to them to make same mistake then wait every 6 months for a chance of accurate balance..?? As long as the utilities are legends based from 3-5 I’ll support it,swapping skills between legends no sir.

I know classes from other games that mix lance/sword with rifle, not impossible that it has melee potential. Stop relating thief with ninja/samurai and whatnot it even differs in many ways from other look alike classes in other games.

Think this :

If it were to happen they would tell us I believe, all that’s changing seem to be the mechanic not actual traits. They should be busy right now,wait like 2-3 months after HoT if it doesn’t happen there ,it’s simply not going to happen. I struggle to believe how you cannot improve inferior traits and skills, it should be obvious if not time should have made it by now. Forum specialist may be the last step to proper in class balancing.

Hopefully this thread gets heard “properly”.

Necro already claims that spot bruh,just because some don’t want to use us much vs cele didn’t mean we couldn’t handle them too and we are not thief food on our boon hate specs.

You are not making sense. What is thief counter mesmer??

Like shattering? There is a bunch of shatter builds out there other than zerker such as healing,condi,boon share. Assuming you are talking conquest since we all love it so much, bring mobility try to focus mostly cap points and avoid fight you wouldn’t win or just run a lockdown build or don’t try to roam.

I associated longbow with conditions does the theme prevents that or is it the range which I don’t remember mentioning? Does the theme prevent guardian to be “selfish”? I disagree on the snorefest comment,every class can do everything properly(not now) just how and what they give up for it. They are very slowly and vaguely making this,mesmer heal boost on interrupt,support venom thief but again very few content or crap build,do not tell me there is no crap traits,skills etc within all professions.

A pile of crap builds up to crap even in garbage costume. They made the classes they should know,do know,will know what they created and decide where they are taking it. Isn’t this a fantasy mmo or are we limiting our selves to other games or reality?

Type of person complaining war should only face tank,can’t remember last mmo where a similar class could heal with shouts,have warhorn or even apply torment…

Wish my thief could do the same… Good video tough.

A OK.8276:

Sagat.3285:

A OK.8276:

thorsonwong.2805:

I think the biggest speculation for the Guard Spec is Longbow, and I do /not/ want that at all. There’s this part of my brain that just never sat well with heavy armoured classes using archery. A mage with a greatsword and plate armour? Sure, that’s awesome. A knight with a longbow? Nonononononon, leave that to the rogues! Give us a rifle, if you’re going to go with 2H ranged! :P

But I’m sure I’m alone in this.

I was with you man, I originally thought rifle would be cool for a guardian but a bow makes more sense to the theme. I also like the short bow to switch it up from warrior, maybe get some extra speed attack from ranged?

I’m not a fan of a torch for warrior . How does one who does not specialize in magic use a torch in battle? Maybe a Sapper with gun powder or something? Get some extra burst and cc on the warrior. OK I’m starting to like it now…. I might be on to something.

I’m hoping there is dual weild daggers in the Warriors future. Making a dagger off hand would be ok too but warriors are supposed to be weapon specialists, dual welding weapons should be a must. They may save this for the next round of specializations Which would be cool With me.

Must it be every weapon? War has duel axes,maces and swords.

Yeah make sense to me. Being good with a weapon that could be potentially a main hand weapon only in your offhand? Your not trying hard enough to be a weapon specialists.

Would agree if they had MH dagger already but nope I don’t get it ,every weapon in game so far could fit all classes just need to be creative. No GS on any form of revenant plz!!!

A OK.8276:

thorsonwong.2805:

I think the biggest speculation for the Guard Spec is Longbow, and I do /not/ want that at all. There’s this part of my brain that just never sat well with heavy armoured classes using archery. A mage with a greatsword and plate armour? Sure, that’s awesome. A knight with a longbow? Nonononononon, leave that to the rogues! Give us a rifle, if you’re going to go with 2H ranged! :P

But I’m sure I’m alone in this.

I was with you man, I originally thought rifle would be cool for a guardian but a bow makes more sense to the theme. I also like the short bow to switch it up from warrior, maybe get some extra speed attack from ranged?

I’m not a fan of a torch for warrior . How does one who does not specialize in magic use a torch in battle? Maybe a Sapper with gun powder or something? Get some extra burst and cc on the warrior. OK I’m starting to like it now…. I might be on to something.

I’m hoping there is dual weild daggers in the Warriors future. Making a dagger off hand would be ok too but warriors are supposed to be weapon specialists, dual welding weapons should be a must. They may save this for the next round of specializations Which would be cool With me.

Must it be every weapon? War has duel axes,maces and swords.

For some reasons I want them to not even consider Shiro so bad…