Guild Wars 2

phys.7689:

Heres the thing.
Regardless what you want for endgame, this game does not have much of it. regardless what you want for endgame, this game does not expand/refine/renew itself.

I think the endgame best developed and scaling in trading post pvp. You consistently get more progress, going as far as you like, it consistently renews and changes itself. And getting more money in shorter periods requires you to go further in depth.

Now sadly i am not the type who will enjoy that type of gameplay even though i can do it.

But lets say you like exploring, the game offeres very little new exploration comparitively, and not much for truely mastering the map.
I would add mini quests and events, timers and stamina based exploration events (end game for explorers)

lets say you like setting up community events, a political/social system where people can throw events, while getting good at it gives them access to more event related tools/uses/etc

regardless of what you are talking about, what you prefer, the endgame for it is generally fairly shallow.

And there are ways to expand open world endgame AND expand instanced dungeon endgame. Keep in mind the purpose of dungeons was SUPPOSED to be to appeal to the audience who were looking for a challenge. Just because you like open world, doesnt mean they should abolish, simplify or give up on dungeons.

As far as vaynes belief in the majority rule, its a bad idea to appeal to the majority to the exclusion of every one else. The best solutions appeal to a broad range of groups, or you create different solutions for different groups.

Just because 51% of the people buy angel cake doesnt mean its a great idea to make a business that only sells angel cake. you are giving up 49% of your customer base to appeal to angel cake market. Now this doesnt mean they should get rid of angel cake either, it probably means they should create systems that better adapt to the needs/desire of the customer overall.

What you’re saying here is very easy to say. However you don’t know how big the majority is and neither do I.

However, there are some demographics that if you cater to them you will ruin the game for your main demographic. Let’s say they added open world PvP. You’d certainly lose me as a player. I have no interest in it. Moreso the type of people attracted to that playstyle are people I’m not particularly interested in hanging out with generally. It would take the fun casual aspect of the game away and replace it with something very different.

Moreover there’s not one group of people asking for stuff. There are many. Working on doing something for each of those groups will take away what you can do for you main group. If Anet priorities PvP, WvW and dungeons and raids, they’d have to put a lot of time/energy, money and man hours into it.

And I believe most of those things don’t really help the core player base. If that is the case (and that’s if, I don’t really know, but I assume Anet does), then taking that amount of resources away from the main thrust of development would be more harmful to the game than helpful.

It doesn’t mean those parts of the game shouldn’t get any attention but it does mean that the content coming out for those times would take longer. We know for example that a new PvP game type is currently being worked on. But it’s going to take longer than it would to come out with the PvE stuff, because, in theory anyway, less people are interested in it.

Even if it’s the case that the people interested in those others things have left, putting it in won’t necessarily bring those people back. You have to work toward your strength to keep the primary population.

And a majority in this case doesn’t have to be 51%. It just means more people are playing this than anything else. Let’s say 45% of people are playing open world PvE/living story, but the other 55% are divded between RPing, playing the auction house, PvPing, WvWing, running dungeons, and minigames. each of those groups might encompass 15% of the player base.

Making stuff for everyone in enough quantity to please everyone is very easy to say. It’s not so easy to pull off, however.

The answer is no, they can’t add the characters you ask for in the next update. Updates are planned long in advance for one thing, so if they started now you wouldn’t see those characters for at least six months. The story they currently have going was probably planned out more than a year ago.

And it’s not really that interesting or good an idea anyway.

It is bad game design. There should never be a time when failing an event is more profitable than beating it.

Except for the freedom of people who live in like, I don’t know, Oceanic countries to find other people to play with in the open world at the hours they play. Because before the April 15th patch, I stopped playing my prime time altogether, because there was no reason to play. Why wander the zones alone? Didn’t matter what server you were on splitting up everyone made it a poor MMO to play…certainly for me. I don’t play MMOs to solo.

And while there were occasionally people to be seen even though I don’t play MMOs to occasionally see people. It’s all well and good if you live in the US, but not so good for Australia, New Zealand anyone who plays from Asia.

We have more freedom now. So do people in the US who work weird hours or are awake weird hours.

People on different servers used to have to guest to get stuff done and complained about it. What about their freedom?

Freedom is a funny word. Everyone assumes because changes were made that takes away their choices, it means that everyone has less freedom. Well some of us have more freedom.

Smith.1826:

Whoops, wrong term. Meant ‘target lock’.

Well I played a hunter and a shaman, and tried some of the other professions and if you’re not doing melee, the combat is night and day.

Smith.1826:

Vayne.8563:

Smith.1826:

??? No clue what you’re on about, but /shrug

How can a static combat system feel close to an active one? That doesn’t make sense in any language I know.

Well for starters, I don’t find WoW entirely static. Maybe it’s a YMMV thing, but playing a Warrior tank was always a very active and satisfying experience in managing mobs, threat, and mitigation.

I’m not going to argue that GW2 isn’t more “active” than WoW, but it’s still grounded in familiar MMO gameplay. Bodiless blocking, skills-on-the-go, and other common MMO mechanics (fears, roots, invisibility i.e. stealth) are features I’m all too familiar and tired with – all on top of a standard MMO control scheme. I can sympathize with it being “the standard” but I’m getting a bit irked with having to hold the RMB for so long.

100% personal opinion: Being able to use skills while moving seems a bit counter-intuitive in a game with autotargetting…

Most decent players switch auto targeting off though.

It has to be too weak, if it stacks with food.

One of the problems Anet had was that people were barely looking at the traits page. I think they wanted to get people more experience with dodging, conditions, boons and such before adding traits on top of it. They also wanted more end game progression. A lot of people sort of felt like they stopped progressing.

Frankly I think they went about it the wrong way, but it’s not really that bad. It is, however, does require you to go out of your way to do certain specific things.

For a newcomer it introduces them to different parts of the game they might have never tried, though. That’s the upside.

Plenty of downsides too though.

They posted they were taking a break from the CDIs while they were flat out with the china release. They did say they would be back.

The problem I’m seeing over and over again, is two fold. People think we need millions of people to make a viable game and people are overestimating the amount of people who really think about their gameplaying experience. Plenty of people playing Guild Wars 2 have never even heard of Wildstar. They get a game, they play the game they’re basically happy.

Niche groups tend to be more vested in the game and thus are a louder voice on the forum. RPers, PvPers, Raiders, those who like challenging content. Traditionally none of these demographics are the main demographic, who are people who just sort of show up and do whatever.

It means games can last a long long time without catering to special interest groups. And I’m by no means saying they shouldn’t have stuff for everyone. I’m just saying that most of those groups overestimate just how badly the game would do if everyone who played like them left.

When ascended gear came out, a lot of people left this game. People who felt really REALLY strongly about vertical progression, and not having it in game. For a month or two, things looked really bleak and it started to pick up again. Of course, many of those people never came back—but some did.

People left for Neverwinter and came back. They left for ESO and came back. They left for Rift and came back. They left for Wildstar and came back. Not everyone, but enough people for this game to remain viable for a long time.

There’s always another game around the corner, but the percentage of people that jump from game to game is smaller than one would think. Guild Wars 2 will survive the WoW expansion from what I’ve seen probably the two new sandbox games coming out. Pretty sure it will survive EQ next too.

Because it’s offering an experience none of those other games are, and there are enough people who like that experience. Not everyone moves experiences just because one game does something better.

I couldn’t deal with the questing system in ESO or Wildstar for example, even though I really wanted to like both of them. To be fair, I liked Wildstar a whole lot more than I liked ESO..but it still felt too linear for me.

This game suits my play style and surely I’m not the only one to share this play style. If there are enough people who play like me, niche or not niche, the game will continue to do fine.

If you’re in a niche this game isn’t catering to, it’s probably not likely to start now. Other niches may get a token bit of content, but it’ll never be enough to keep them long term. Because no company can provide everything to all people.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

I wouldn’t worry, though if we want to insist ANet gets the verbiage exact when they say stuff, we should endeavor to do the same.

I’m not worried. But I’m not the one who’s insisting that Anet get their verbiage exact. That’s sort of my whole point all along.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Vayne.8563:

But my point still stands. You have to troll through an awful lot of what they said about the game to get to the point where you believe there would be no vertical progression…particularly since vertical progression existed in the game at launch.

You mean “trawl” through, not “troll”.

I do. lol Must have been freudian.

There’s definitely been a shift in MMOs over the years. Server communities were on the way out as soon as WoW introduced dungeon finders that were cross server. Smaller games still have them, but in any game you can openly guest in, there are probably fewer and fewer people who remember the old days.

Today, in my opinion., most socializing is done within guilds. I socialize in mine all the time. The mega server doesn’t affect that.

If my statement is correct (and it’s probably not for RPers at least), then you’d be more satisified with the megaserver. I get most of my interaction from my guild.

But I still see plenty of people saying ty in chat for being rezzed, at least on the US servers. And map chat happens a lot more now than it did before the mega server in a lot of zones.

What they said was they always intended to include another tier of gear. What they didn’t say was that it was meant to be as hard to get as ascended became. That’s Anet doing what they often do…overcompensating.

But my point still stands. You have to troll through an awful lot of what they said about the game to get to the point where you believe there would be no vertical progression…particularly since vertical progression existed in the game at launch.

I’m not denying that Anet changed directions. They made adjustments based on the fact that after launch they felt exotic gear was too easy to get. They have to ride a balance between easy to get and giving people something to do. Frankly I think they got the balance wrong. I’ve never been in favor of ascended gear.

But by the same token I’m not looking at what was said a year before launch as gospel. I genuinely believe this wasn’t a core focus of Anet. It was something they discussed sure. But it wasn’t their driving force. If it happened to be a player’s driving force, those statements would carry a lot more weight than they’d carry in the minds of most people.

The weapon itself has a recipe, which according to the wiki is currently disabled. You can’t get the recipe from the forge at this time. I don’t know the truth of it but that’s what it says.

There are also two other recipes involved in making the weapon, including the gift of spiders. That gift is something you can forge and likewise that recipe is, according to the article, not available.

The article is referring to the three recipes used, two of which are not the final recipe.

Ashen, let me put it another way. Every day every person says thousands of things, some very serious and some very casual. Even in an interview, they’re addressing a question. They’re not making THE selling point of the game. It’s like a side show.

If I told my wife in a conversation that I was going to stop by the shop on the way home and I didn’t get to it, it wouldn’t be a big deal. Even if she expected me to. Reasonable people just think, okay he forget, he didn’t get to it, he got delayed, the shop was closed. And she might say, you know you didn’t go to the shop. And I say well yeah, I didn’t. Life happens. I got distracted. It wasn’t like this great major promise.

The amount of time someone spends talking about something pre-launch is the amount of importance it has to the game’s main philosphy. If the game is hard core raiding game, the company will push the game AS a hard core raid game.

There are fans out there who are very very attached to the whole no vertical progression thing, period. So attached to it, even a single sentence from an interview becomes this enormous thing. But I saw all the same interviews and yes, I wanted no vertical progression. I just saw how much they talked about it and I realized over time, it wasn’t that big a deal TO ANET. It wasn’t foremost in their thoughts. The words they said about it WERE casual. They were talking about an ideal. That’s a goal. It’s not an official blog post. Even if it were, if someone mentions something once in an official blogpost (ie dyes being account bound), it’s not lying to change it.

Colin didn’t say he never said this. But his later comments could easily have been made without even thinking there was something different to what he said before. The idea or concept that it was easier to get exotics than they’d planned is not mutually exclusive with what was said earlier.

You’re holding the devs to an impossible standard if you think they can parse every word and every sentence. It’s not possible for any human. If you honestly look at your own life, you can easily see how those sorts of things can get misinterpreted.

From your posts it’s obvious you’re a smart guy. When you really look at it, how can you believe this was some core point of such importance to Anet that they didn’t dare change it?

It was VERY important to fans who feel the way you do. So important that extra weight got applied to the statement. I did the same thing. Exactly the same thing. I believed the very same stuff you believed from that statement.

But I’m guessing less than 5% of the fan base ever saw or heard that statement when it was made. And I’m guessing Anet didn’t have the same importance associated with it that we did. They were just going to stop on the shop on the way home.

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

My point in all of this is not that changing the game is in any way dishonest or a lie. As I said before, saying something to the effect of, “we tried X, wanted it to work, it didn’t, so we had to change it,” is one thing. I may not be happy that X, a huge part of why I bought the game, didn’t work (may even feel that they didn’t give it enough of a chance) but I run a business and know that not everything works out how you originally planned.

Denying that X was ever intended/expected is something else entirely in my opinion.

You’re still not getting what I’m saying. People tend to talk casually. They talk about intentions all the time. Even WHILE talking about that, there’s more than one person that works at and designs a game and not everyone is always going to be on the same page. Anet had an IDEA of what they wanted to do and discussed that idea.

Now months and months later (I’m pretty sure it was more than a year) after countless conversations, Colin doesn’t remember that interview specifically. It was ten minutes of his time at a convention during which he talked about what he was going to do, what he aimed for. And sure, that’s the general idea.

What he said later wasn’t denying that was the idea. He was saying if you listen, that the idea really didn’t work. There’s a very fine line between saying that it was too easy and we didn’t realize it would be that easy and saying and MEANING that it was too easy for players to do that.

This isn’t Colin coming out and insisting I never said that. It’s not what happened here. You’re taking a casual conversation during a single interview and a defensive posture at another interview and trying to make them directly contradictory. This isn’t a court. He’s not self-editing very well.

What I got from watching that video was that getting exotics was even easier than they thought it would be, and they didn’t want it to be quite that easy. I believe that, as with many things, Anet overcompensated with ascended weapons, but they simply wanted to make sure they didn’t make the same mistake again.

Essentially what was a hot button topic for you and others like you was a side thing for Colin. It was an idea he may have liked when he said it during that interview, but that doesn’t mean it was so vitally important to him, like it was to you. You’re taking a single line from an interview as gospel. It probably wasn’t.

That’s on you, not anyone else. It’s very likely that Colin when he said that had every single intention of doing that. But it’s not unlikely that that intention wasn’t a major factor in driving the game forward. You’re assuming he did everything with that goal in mind. I’m not. I think fans were far more vested in that line than Anet ever was. I was one of those fans. I believed it would be like Guild Wars 1. That’s the real issue here.

Now a year after he says the first thing, without the great emotional attachment to it, someone asks him a different question and he answers it. He’s not denying he ever said that. Indeed he hasn’t said anything about denying it.

But if this thing is said in one interview at a convention was a major gaming point you’d think it would have appeared in other places like, I don’t know, their website? Their FAQ? Something other than a single interview.

This isn’t something they based their game around, even though that one line was something fans based their expectations around. That’s how I read this. He wasn’t talking like someone who was contradicting himself. I’m sure he doesn’t even remember saying that first bit. That’s how projects like this tend to work.

snip

A media interview used as part of the marketing campaign for a product is not a casual conversation.

The game launched with essentially (for the most part) what was discussed in the interview. Not a casual conversation about what they might like to do, a description of what they did. A description of a very important part of the game design, a fundamental philosophy of the game.

Vayne.8563:

But if this thing is said in one interview at a convention was a major gaming point you’d think it would have appeared in other places like, I don’t know, their website? Their FAQ? Something other than a single interview.

Hmm, the supposed clarification of the manifesto isn’t on their website, FAQ, etc. Does that it isn’t relevant ?

Relevant to a specific conversation not relevant to claim this game was advertised on this point. It was a point in an interview. The manifesto clarification was issued to address confusion on a specific point. It’s relevant to that point. Relevancy is relative.

Cloud there are plenty of nice people in game. You should try hanging with them> Because there are ZERO online games that don’t have idiots playing. If you quit every game because it idiots you’ll never play an online game.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

My point in all of this is not that changing the game is in any way dishonest or a lie. As I said before, saying something to the effect of, “we tried X, wanted it to work, it didn’t, so we had to change it,” is one thing. I may not be happy that X, a huge part of why I bought the game, didn’t work (may even feel that they didn’t give it enough of a chance) but I run a business and know that not everything works out how you originally planned.

Denying that X was ever intended/expected is something else entirely in my opinion.

You’re still not getting what I’m saying. People tend to talk casually. They talk about intentions all the time. Even WHILE talking about that, there’s more than one person that works at and designs a game and not everyone is always going to be on the same page. Anet had an IDEA of what they wanted to do and discussed that idea.

Now months and months later (I’m pretty sure it was more than a year) after countless conversations, Colin doesn’t remember that interview specifically. It was ten minutes of his time at a convention during which he talked about what he was going to do, what he aimed for. And sure, that’s the general idea.

What he said later wasn’t denying that was the idea. He was saying if you listen, that the idea really didn’t work. There’s a very fine line between saying that it was too easy and we didn’t realize it would be that easy and saying and MEANING that it was too easy for players to do that.

If that’s the case, then that’s what interns and before-interview briefings are for. Pre launch interviews are advertising. This is not some little company, this is a company that spent many millions of dollars producing a product. They can and should be held to a higher standard than Joe’s Hot Tubs. Believe it if you like, but this defense makes them look like amateurs.

Assuming the questions were given to them first, which doesn’t always happen. No a single line from a single interview doesn’t qualify as advertising even if the interview qualifies as promotion.

No one hangs onto words like fans. But devs use words more casually. No one can interact with fans on a casual basis at a con and get every word right, or even remember what they said a year later.

In court, if you tried to say it was false advertising a lawyer would say look at the thousands of hours we talked about the game. Look at one single statement in one single interview at a con. It’s meaningless except to you and people like you. It’s not a core promise that this is how things will be period. It’s an idea they had that they liked and would have probably kept if the experiences with the game bore them out. But even with that said, saying that we didnt’ expect people to get weapons as quickly as they did doesn’t make the first statement a lie. It was too easy, even for what they expected. They had a casual idea of where they wanted to be and it wasnt’ met. It’s not science it’s art. It was too easy to get the weapons according to what he expected, probably even when he gave that interview.

The problem here, for me, is you’re trying to make it look like someone said something vital, central to the game for them, and then went back on their word without a word. To most people, who never saw that interview btw (and I guarantee you most didn’t) the second interview explained everything perfectly.

If it was such a big deal, so central to the game design we’d have heard a lot more about it. We did hear it briefly maybe even a couple of times, but it wasn’t a guiding force for them. That sentence took on far more meaning to you, because to you it was vitally important.

That’s why people invented casual guilds. Though you could also advertise your own casual groups on the LFG. But thanks for letting us know.

munkiman.3068:

Vayne.8563:

munkiman.3068:

What i was saying is the majority don’t scale well at all. Besides once people find event that actually scales to champ spawns, anet nerfs it to vet status so they don’t drop the bags, leaving those vets as the same DPS sponge while not rewarding as well. That’s always a bonus.

There are actually people that enjoy being challenged and pick lower pop servers once they find out how trivial events become with 50+ players chewing through them. Now, they don’t have that option.

GW was a game that didn’t get destroyed by less people being around. But, i can agree with what you’re saying. Regardless of that, this solution was pretty game destroying for a good number of people that really wanted a community and a sense of server pride. Something which now can only exist in WvW, a game mode all about servers, completely stripped away from the rest of the game. Some pro…

Sure there are always people who enjoy being challenged but do you really think those people are some kind of majority…because I sure don’t.

I also think about it from the other point of view. I used to do events in the open world in zones that didn’t have a lot of people. Some of those events were really really annoying. Protecting 4 houses from krait before they destroyed them. 1 person would have had a tough time doing that. Even a couple of people. Not enjoyable to me at all.

Some of the events where you had a couple of centaurs come in and you then wait for the next couple of centaurs. Those events were meh..until you had a group and you had a steady stream of centaurs coming in. The event was much better with more people. It wasn’t harder alone…it was just more boring.

Even without champs, far more chances at getting a drop because you’re tagging far more mobs. You can’t really expect me to believe most people want less rewards…that they’re happy with the rewards from just the event itself.

More bags means more mats. More mats means more money. I’m pretty sure most people want more money in this game.

I personally like opening the bags with linen and stuff, or salvaging drops for hard wood, soft wood, iron…anything really. Even copper is useful.

Doing events on servers now provides more money than they did on slower servers. I’d say most people are happy about that bit.

It’s not that the majority enjoys being challenged or that content needs to be harder. It’s that the majority of events are trivialized (read boring) and that unless you’re running in full zerkers, tagging, you’re not going to get much from these events.

I’m not sure what game you’re playing, but most events don’t add mobs, they add hp to the current set of mobs and maybe increase their damage output slightly. People don’t get more loot when you toss more people at these events. Fix the events is the solution to boring and/or frustrating events, but that’s a much bigger issue and one that certainly is more pronounced tossing more players at them.

Most events are really not fun and certainly not anymore rewarding to me.

I’m playing the non meta events. Like yesterday when I was playing in Sparkfly Fen, just doing events. Risen attack Hylek villages that sort of thing. That’s what I was doing yesterday. I get far more bags from those guys than I did in the old days. Some of those bags contain linen. Some of the weapons or armor that drop has platinum or hard wood when you salvage it. It’s definitely more profitable when I used to be.

Ashen.2907:

My point in all of this is not that changing the game is in any way dishonest or a lie. As I said before, saying something to the effect of, “we tried X, wanted it to work, it didn’t, so we had to change it,” is one thing. I may not be happy that X, a huge part of why I bought the game, didn’t work (may even feel that they didn’t give it enough of a chance) but I run a business and know that not everything works out how you originally planned.

Denying that X was ever intended/expected is something else entirely in my opinion.

You’re still not getting what I’m saying. People tend to talk casually. They talk about intentions all the time. Even WHILE talking about that, there’s more than one person that works at and designs a game and not everyone is always going to be on the same page. Anet had an IDEA of what they wanted to do and discussed that idea.

Now months and months later (I’m pretty sure it was more than a year) after countless conversations, Colin doesn’t remember that interview specifically. It was ten minutes of his time at a convention during which he talked about what he was going to do, what he aimed for. And sure, that’s the general idea.

What he said later wasn’t denying that was the idea. He was saying if you listen, that the idea really didn’t work. There’s a very fine line between saying that it was too easy and we didn’t realize it would be that easy and saying and MEANING that it was too easy for players to do that.

This isn’t Colin coming out and insisting I never said that. It’s not what happened here. You’re taking a casual conversation during a single interview and a defensive posture at another interview and trying to make them directly contradictory. This isn’t a court. He’s not self-editing very well.

What I got from watching that video was that getting exotics was even easier than they thought it would be, and they didn’t want it to be quite that easy. I believe that, as with many things, Anet overcompensated with ascended weapons, but they simply wanted to make sure they didn’t make the same mistake again.

Essentially what was a hot button topic for you and others like you was a side thing for Colin. It was an idea he may have liked when he said it during that interview, but that doesn’t mean it was so vitally important to him, like it was to you. You’re taking a single line from an interview as gospel. It probably wasn’t.

That’s on you, not anyone else. It’s very likely that Colin when he said that had every single intention of doing that. But it’s not unlikely that that intention wasn’t a major factor in driving the game forward. You’re assuming he did everything with that goal in mind. I’m not. I think fans were far more vested in that line than Anet ever was. I was one of those fans. I believed it would be like Guild Wars 1. That’s the real issue here.

Now a year after he says the first thing, without the great emotional attachment to it, someone asks him a different question and he answers it. He’s not denying he ever said that. Indeed he hasn’t said anything about denying it.

But if this thing is said in one interview at a convention was a major gaming point you’d think it would have appeared in other places like, I don’t know, their website? Their FAQ? Something other than a single interview.

This isn’t something they based their game around, even though that one line was something fans based their expectations around. That’s how I read this. He wasn’t talking like someone who was contradicting himself. I’m sure he doesn’t even remember saying that first bit. That’s how projects like this tend to work.

I dont’ remember old versions of novels I edited a year ago. I don’t have room in my head for what I originally intended. Not unless it was a major plot issue. Side points that I changed…three, four months later, it’s as if they never happened.

I sort of agree that there should be more concrete ways of getting ascended gear than just crafting. This seems like an oversight to me. I’m not really sure of the reason for it.

stale.9785:

Ranger is the red-headed stepchild of the professions. Despite the sword auto being hopelessly broken, we’re going to have to live with it. It had an interesting progression though.

Players: Ranger sword auto roots us in place!

Devs: No, it doesn’t.

Players: Really, sword auto roots us in place.

Devs: Well, it shouldn’t, and if it does, we’ll look into fixing it.

Players: Sword auto STILL roots us!

Devs: We’re working on a solution.

Players: Sword auto is Still causing issues!

Devs: It’s a feature.

This really made me laugh.

On topic: OP, I can dodge while chopping unless I’m lagging, which does happen in my neck of the woods.

munkiman.3068:

What i was saying is the majority don’t scale well at all. Besides once people find event that actually scales to champ spawns, anet nerfs it to vet status so they don’t drop the bags, leaving those vets as the same DPS sponge while not rewarding as well. That’s always a bonus.

There are actually people that enjoy being challenged and pick lower pop servers once they find out how trivial events become with 50+ players chewing through them. Now, they don’t have that option.

GW was a game that didn’t get destroyed by less people being around. But, i can agree with what you’re saying. Regardless of that, this solution was pretty game destroying for a good number of people that really wanted a community and a sense of server pride. Something which now can only exist in WvW, a game mode all about servers, completely stripped away from the rest of the game. Some pro…

Sure there are always people who enjoy being challenged but do you really think those people are some kind of majority…because I sure don’t.

I also think about it from the other point of view. I used to do events in the open world in zones that didn’t have a lot of people. Some of those events were really really annoying. Protecting 4 houses from krait before they destroyed them. 1 person would have had a tough time doing that. Even a couple of people. Not enjoyable to me at all.

Some of the events where you had a couple of centaurs come in and you then wait for the next couple of centaurs. Those events were meh..until you had a group and you had a steady stream of centaurs coming in. The event was much better with more people. It wasn’t harder alone…it was just more boring.

Even without champs, far more chances at getting a drop because you’re tagging far more mobs. You can’t really expect me to believe most people want less rewards…that they’re happy with the rewards from just the event itself.

More bags means more mats. More mats means more money. I’m pretty sure most people want more money in this game.

I personally like opening the bags with linen and stuff, or salvaging drops for hard wood, soft wood, iron…anything really. Even copper is useful.

Doing events on servers now provides more money than they did on slower servers. I’d say most people are happy about that bit.

Phoenixlin.8624:

I really want a blocking function in this forum to prevent myself from permaban when I see a Vayne post.

After months, I finally find myself in a Lion’s Arch where majority were Desolation players. Then, game kicked me out the login screen and when I returned, I was with French/Germans. Thanks for the hilarious fix.

It’s okay mate, I feel the same about your posts. However, I’m not talking about Eu. I really can’t since I’m on an American server. So I’m only qualified to talk about my experiences on US servers.

I’m sure Europe has very legit gripes against the megaserver.

OP, while you’re there, farm a couple of herbs, or maybe even try to get a foxfire cluster and make your money back. A single foxfire cluster sells for about 30 way points now. Or you could do 2 events while you’re there and get some karma in the bargain.

Smith.1826:

??? No clue what you’re on about, but /shrug

How can a static combat system feel close to an active one? That doesn’t make sense in any language I know.

I remember being rooted when using most skills in WoW, except the handful of instacast ones. That’s all. You’re saying the combat is similar and it’s definitely the first time I’ve ever heard it.

It’s night and day to me.

Smith.1826:

Vayne.8563:

Smith.1826:

Vayne.8563:

I remember being rooted in WoW quite frequently. I’m pretty sure I played other professions though. But saying my profession didn’t root me, when pretty much all the other ones did isn’t really representative of the game.

I can’t recall any melee classes/specializations putting any emphasis on rooting. If not then especially not now. Maybe enhancement Shaman? Wasn’t much a fan of them though, so I don’t know much about the specialization.

Maybe I didn’t use melee professions. But no one ever claimed WoW had active combat. Ever.

Er, is there a point where I said it did? I did say that GW2’s combat feels closer to WoW than any other action RPG, and “skills on the go” helps in driving that feeling home for me.

When I said no one said it, in the two years this game has been alive, when active combat threads come up and people point it out as a difference to WoW, I’ve not seen it contradicted an I would have. That’s what I’m saying. Obviously you’re saying it now. lol

munkiman.3068:

Vayne.8563:

Yep, it’s absolutely a solution. Right now, no one can say they’re on their home server. No one knows how many people from their server are on their server. Which means everyone is basically on even footing in PvE.

That’s a solution for people who didn’t want to guest (there were some of those) and people who felt they owned their server and guesters were ruining it for them.

I’m much happier this way. I think it was a good move over all, because it creates less of kitten and them situation in PvE, which was happening more and more.

How is taking the option away to be on a lower pop server, while still having the ability to go to a higher one when desired, a positive solution? Some people had issues with guesting on winning servers, so take everyone options away. Some solution. It’s not anymore even footing than before either, since you have very little control over what shard your placed in.

More complication and less convenience , i just don’t see that being a positive thing.

Sadly, this is probably the easiest way to fix these pros for people that think they are pros. Realistically, now scaling is even more of an issue for everyone, instead of just high pop servers, not much of a pro there either. It’s actually more frustrating for players that try to get event completion, but have a hard time doing it since 50 people are steam rolling the popular events, which is only compounded by the now, static schedule for world events.

While it does “fix” guesting, they could have also done that, with the existing “Join in” option in the party menu.

I’m glad you like it, but i still think your in the minority. It may work better for solo veteran players, but it mostly complicates, frustrates and inconveniences almost everyone else.

Scaling isn’t something people want? I find that a bit strange, considering many events when they scale provide champs which people seem to want. Are you suggesting less people want to fight champs? I find that hard to believe.

People in MMOs particularly seem to like seeing other people around. It’s a validation for many of them. Do you know what kills MMOs faster than anything? Not seeing people. You don’t see people and you go around saying oh, there’s no one playing. That’s what kills lots of MMOs.

How many people have you seen post on something like reddit or here, saying I’m thinking of coming back but are people still playing.

Keeping in mind that only the most populated events have the kinds of problems you’re talking about anyway, I’d say it’s mostly win.

But yes, I do believe more people would rather see an event scaled up than not.

Smith.1826:

Vayne.8563:

I remember being rooted in WoW quite frequently. I’m pretty sure I played other professions though. But saying my profession didn’t root me, when pretty much all the other ones did isn’t really representative of the game.

I can’t recall any melee classes/specializations putting any emphasis on rooting. If not then especially not now. Maybe enhancement Shaman? Wasn’t much a fan of them though, so I don’t know much about the specialization.

Maybe I didn’t use melee professions. But no one ever claimed WoW had active combat. Ever.

I’m pretty sure when GW 2 talked about active combat, if that existed in WoW, I’d have heard about it by now on the forums. I remember having to stop to use skills in WoW. But I probably didn’t do a boatload of melee.

munkiman.3068:

Vayne.8563:

Amethyst Rose.4367:

lordkrall.7241:

You are making a bunch of rather massive errors here.

1: Not everyone on those 48 pages dislike it.
2: Not everyone comes up with valid arguments and mainly just say that it sucks.
3: Mostly the same people keep writing over and over and over and over and over again in the thread, rather than new people coming into the thread.

Most of the posters seem to be against megas, and the ones for megas basically just have one “pro” which is “Maps are no longer barren” which is a con to a lot of other players and not a problem before megas for a lot of servers. If you feel that most anti-mega people just say they suck then you clearly have not read this thread at all. There has been such a litany of complaints (which I won’t relist… you will have to actually read the thread this time) and countless suggestions of how things could be improved. Sure there are reposters, but there are more reposters on the pro-mega side than anti-mega.

It’s not the only Pro.

One of the big things that ruined the Marionette fight for a lot of people was not being able to get onto their home servers. They had the big word overflow on their minimap. There were quite a few complaint threads about it. Being on your home server was seen as superior to being on an overflow, even if you had tons of people from your server on that overflow.

People felt disenfranchised by guesters. Not one or two people. A lot of people. That’s all gone now. You dont’ have everyone guesting to the three busiest servers all the time, because there’s no need to. It solves problems for people already playing on those servers.

How is megaserver a solution to any of that? Now you’re always in an “overflow”. At least prior, there was a separation and you could feel a sense of server pride on success. There is a lot to be said for separating people into manageable numbers, over trying to toss a bunch of randoms into an organized group. Now, that is reserved for only the most dedicated guild groups that spend over an hour to setup, taxiing and organizing. Megaserver only convoluted the problems with prior overflows.

Guesting now does nothing, servers have no identity in PvE, so basically the pro here is what? People can still leach on “winning” shards accept now it’s not server based. Hardly a pro.

Yep, it’s absolutely a solution. Right now, no one can say they’re on their home server. No one knows how many people from their server are on their server. Which means everyone is basically on even footing in PvE.

That’s a solution for people who didn’t want to guest (there were some of those) and people who felt they owned their server and guesters were ruining it for them.

I’m much happier this way. I think it was a good move over all, because it creates less of kitten and them situation in PvE, which was happening more and more.

Amethyst Rose.4367:

lordkrall.7241:

You are making a bunch of rather massive errors here.

1: Not everyone on those 48 pages dislike it.
2: Not everyone comes up with valid arguments and mainly just say that it sucks.
3: Mostly the same people keep writing over and over and over and over and over again in the thread, rather than new people coming into the thread.

Most of the posters seem to be against megas, and the ones for megas basically just have one “pro” which is “Maps are no longer barren” which is a con to a lot of other players and not a problem before megas for a lot of servers. If you feel that most anti-mega people just say they suck then you clearly have not read this thread at all. There has been such a litany of complaints (which I won’t relist… you will have to actually read the thread this time) and countless suggestions of how things could be improved. Sure there are reposters, but there are more reposters on the pro-mega side than anti-mega.

It’s not the only Pro.

One of the big things that ruined the Marionette fight for a lot of people was not being able to get onto their home servers. They had the big word overflow on their minimap. There were quite a few complaint threads about it. Being on your home server was seen as superior to being on an overflow, even if you had tons of people from your server on that overflow.

People felt disenfranchised by guesters. Not one or two people. A lot of people. That’s all gone now. You dont’ have everyone guesting to the three busiest servers all the time, because there’s no need to. It solves problems for people already playing on those servers.

Yep that’s the interview I remember. What he’s saying is that they didn’t prepare for how easy it was to get exotics. It was too easy. And yes, I know what he said the first time.

But I think it’s quite clear that what he said in the magazine in an interview was meant to mean that yes, it should be easy to get stuff at max level and here he’s saying they made it TOO easy. That is judgment on what was originally planned.

Only someone who is looking to try to catch them out would consider that a lie. In fact, it says a lot more about the person trying to catch them out than Colin.

I read this, very simply as what they originally did wasn’t working and they changed it. Which is exactly what I thought.

Now, he said something in a previous interview before launch that was an intention. That intention WAS in the game. That intention didn’t work. It didn’t work because it was too easy to get, whether they intended that to be the case or not.

Taking a literal 100% truth from a single sentence in an interview shows inflexibility.

In theory, you could get full ascended gear BEFORE level 80 in the current system and that they hadn’t counted on.

You’re just trying to find holes here. It’s easy enough to understand what he’s saying and see where he’s coming from. Lawyers and politicians dissect sentences to try to catch people out.

If you can’t see what was meant by this, then there’s not much else to talk about. I’m glad you posted that so everyone can see it and make up their own mind.

NewTrain.7549:

Serophous.9085:

I think New train is proving our points exactly ATM. No matter what Anet does, say, implement, unless it fits his narrative exactly, then anet will be chided and yelled at for not meeting THEIR expectations. If they say they will try to do something, it is taking as being written in stone, and if they don’t follow what was written, then they beat anet with said stone.

And again we have someone who jumps into the conversation blissfully unaware of what’s being discussed. Good job there!

Vayne.8563:

I don’t think a company would so obviously lie, no. lol

Someone doesn’t read the news then. I wish I had your level of naivete when it comes to corporate America.

Either Colin is the super smart deceiver you think he is, or he’s like just a guy. A super smart deceiver wouldn’t say one thing publicly and then say a completely different thing publicly after. That makes no sense. Corporate America liars tend to be smarter than that.

Colin says something in an interview. It’s a casual comment discussion an ideal. Maybe during that time they talked about 2, 3, maybe 10 different iterations of what would be in the final game. He did say later that they’d always intended to add another tier of gear to the game. That may be true AND the first statement may be true.

The difference is, Colin isn’t sitting there like a lawyer trying to remember everything he ever said. He’s talking casually. That’s it. You can talk about Corporate America all you want. But in reality, that usually refers to like Apple, Microsoft and Coca Cola, not Arena Net and Joe’s Butcher.

You claim I’m naive. You’re jaded. The truth is somewhere in between. Colin issued two statements at different times that don’t directly contradict each other. When you apply the second statement to ascended gear AS IT EXISTS IN GAME NOW, it might very well seem like a contradiction, but you have to make the assumption that intending to have gear means the same thing as having the same acquisition method. Some of don’t make that assumption. You’ve chosen to. It’s nothing more than an assumption though.

Serophous.9085:

I think New train is proving our points exactly ATM. No matter what Anet does, say, implement, unless it fits his narrative exactly, then anet will be chided and yelled at for not meeting THEIR expectations. If they say they will try to do something, it is taking as being written in stone, and if they don’t follow what was written, then they beat anet with said stone.

There will always be an unreasonable minority. It’s still not an excuse to shut everyone out.

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

You still don’t get it. It was an interview in a magazine, pre release. Now, it might very well have been that when ascended gear was first talked about, it would have had a different acquisition method. We simply don’t have enough information to make a judgement on this.

I worked in editing for a long long time and I’ve seen this kind of thing happen again and again. Not once or twice. It happens all the time. People say stuff, write stuff, and a year later, their memory of what was said, written or yes, even intended has changed. There are many MANY studies on memory you could look at if you want.

But you’d rather believe some theory that states that a guy who knows he said one thing deliberately contradicted himself. Do you think that’s more likely?

No, you still don’t get it. What was said in the Eurogamer interview is near exactly what was released with the game. The notion that by level 80 everyone would have the best statistical gear. They clearly didn’t “forget” that idea because IT WAS WHAT WAS RELEASED. This has nothing to do with memory or forgetfulness. You know it and I know it. If you’d take off your white knight armor and look objectively at the situation, you’d see memory plays no role in this.

And do I think it’s likely that a company would lie in order to try and placate their customer base? Absolutely. You think that’s a rare occurrence or something?

Behellagh.1468:

@NewTrain Was it Colin or another poster from ANet who said he didn’t say that? If it was someone else then they may not have seen that article. Like I said, they need someone to track what was said when so these types of situations do occur in the first place.

And just to be clear, their “lie” was the denial, not the addition of Ascended.

It was Colin making both statements. Not a case of one hand being unaware of the other. And yes, the lie was the denial the Eurogamer interview statement occurred, not the addition of ascended gear.

I don’t think a company would so obviously lie, no. lol

Blude.6812:

Karizee.8076:

Games with gear treadmill endgames NEED expacs, they wither and die without them.

GW2 doesn’t have that problem. Since they give us new content every 2 weeks – new zones, new dungeons, new stories, new maps, new features, it keeps us playing.

Again it does not keep “us playing” (only you and others that like it it), some , including myself, do not keep playing new areas other than to finish the story in a incredibly short time and don’t bother with the ‘new’ area again.
You may not be leaving and you enjoy the new cycle—-others don’t like the way it is evolving.

And as always the question becomes how many others. I feel this way so enough people will leave…that’s what you…and the OP are saying.

But you don’t know the numbers. No one does. Not even Anet. It’s just a guess on your part.

I suspect we’ll have an expansion next year, not this one. When China is a year old or so.

The two statements aren’t even directy contradictory. One said we had another tier of gear planned before release but didn’t release it. That doesn’t mean that tier of gear wasn’t easily attainable. Shrugs.

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.

snip

Obtena.7952:

Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.

How exactly is “best statistical” up for interpretation? It’s not. It has a very distinct meaning. You’re talking out your kitten and it shows.

The simple answer is that people’s memories aren’t perfect. That’s the simple answer. I added detail because these answers were given very briefly by different people in different interviews who may very well have different memories and interpretations. That IS an answer.

snip

When the question was asked, Anet wasn’t sitting there with notes. They were depending on memory. I’m not sure at one point during the interviews you saw them pull out their filing cabinet to answer the questions. They answered interview questions and two people gave different answers. Were they both lying? Was one lying? Did one have a memory lapse? Did they have different points of view? You don’t know. It’s very easy to say people are lying. But it’s just as easy to not remember the orders that events occurred a year later. I suppose that’s never happened to you, but it’s sure happened to me.

So you’re saying that when Colin gave that interview he forgot ANet’s whole design philosophy regarding BiS loot? He had a memory lapse about one of the key points of the game? Really? Or maybe you’re suggesting that later when when ascended gear was announced they forgot they originally had a different design philosophy. They forgot they had worked FOR YEARS on one system of obtaining BiS only to implement a different system. That doesn’t sound ridiculous to you? Come on. Take off the blinders and be realistic.

I think someone is blind here and I think its’ not me. BOTH statements were made during interviews, but ONE predated the first. So when he said the statistical highest gear in the game to a magazine interview, it is entirely possible that at that point, that was the intent. The second interview was given much later. It’s entirely possible that he didn’t even think of that magazine interview when he said it the second time. That is to say, after the magazine interview, they discussed having a higher tier of gear and the situation changed. You’re saying he lied. I’m saying the time differential between the two interviews is enough for the situation to has changed.

Situations change all the time and memory isn’t 100%. An article was written that dyes would be account bound. At launch they weren’t. Did that person lie? Now they are.

Taking two points of view many months apart and trying to say that you were lying during the first doesn’t really say anything except that they’re different. When he said we always planned to have another tier, he might not have been thinking about the original intention at all. Because in his memory at that time, that was his recollection.

I’ve written novels where I’ve forgotten an important detail between the beginning and end of the novel, over a very short period of time, a matter of a few months. Did I lie to myself?

snip

I honestly can’t believe you’re attempting to make excuses for this kind of behavior.

You still don’t get it. It was an interview in a magazine, pre release. Now, it might very well have been that when ascended gear was first talked about, it would have had a different acquisition method. We simply don’t have enough information to make a judgement on this.

I worked in editing for a long long time and I’ve seen this kind of thing happen again and again. Not once or twice. It happens all the time. People say stuff, write stuff, and a year later, their memory of what was said, written or yes, even intended has changed. There are many MANY studies on memory you could look at if you want.

But you’d rather believe some theory that states that a guy who knows he said one thing deliberately contradicted himself. Do you think that’s more likely?

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.

No, you really didn’t. You obfuscated quite well, but never addressed the actual issue at hand. I once had a grad school professor tell me, “if your answer to a simple question is a page long, you’ve admitted you don’t know the answer.”

Obtena.7952:

Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.

How exactly is “best statistical” up for interpretation? It’s not. It has a very distinct meaning. You’re talking out your kitten and it shows.

The simple answer is that people’s memories aren’t perfect. That’s the simple answer. I added detail because these answers were given very briefly by different people in different interviews who may very well have different memories and interpretations. That IS an answer.

Not sure why you’re bringing memories into this when ANet’s words are clearly documented. No need for memory when it’s written down and time/date stamped.

When the question was asked, Anet wasn’t sitting there with notes. They were depending on memory. I’m not sure at one point during the interviews you saw them pull out their filing cabinet to answer the questions. They answered interview questions and two people gave different answers. Were they both lying? Was one lying? Did one have a memory lapse? Did they have different points of view? You don’t know. It’s very easy to say people are lying. But it’s just as easy to not remember the orders that events occurred a year later. I suppose that’s never happened to you, but it’s sure happened to me.

So you’re saying that when Colin gave that interview he forgot ANet’s whole design philosophy regarding BiS loot? He had a memory lapse about one of the key points of the game? Really? Or maybe you’re suggesting that later when when ascended gear was announced they forgot they originally had a different design philosophy. They forgot they had worked FOR YEARS on one system of obtaining BiS only to implement a different system. That doesn’t sound ridiculous to you? Come on. Take off the blinders and be realistic.

I think someone is blind here and I think its’ not me. BOTH statements were made during interviews, but ONE predated the first. So when he said the statistical highest gear in the game to a magazine interview, it is entirely possible that at that point, that was the intent. The second interview was given much later. It’s entirely possible that he didn’t even think of that magazine interview when he said it the second time. That is to say, after the magazine interview, they discussed having a higher tier of gear and the situation changed. You’re saying he lied. I’m saying the time differential between the two interviews is enough for the situation to has changed.

Situations change all the time and memory isn’t 100%. An article was written that dyes would be account bound. At launch they weren’t. Did that person lie? Now they are.

Taking two points of view many months apart and trying to say that you were lying during the first doesn’t really say anything except that they’re different. When he said we always planned to have another tier, he might not have been thinking about the original intention at all. Because in his memory at that time, that was his recollection.

I’ve written novels where I’ve forgotten an important detail between the beginning and end of the novel, over a very short period of time, a matter of a few months. Did I lie to myself?

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

NewTrain.7549:

Vayne.8563:

Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.

No, you really didn’t. You obfuscated quite well, but never addressed the actual issue at hand. I once had a grad school professor tell me, “if your answer to a simple question is a page long, you’ve admitted you don’t know the answer.”

Obtena.7952:

Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.

How exactly is “best statistical” up for interpretation? It’s not. It has a very distinct meaning. You’re talking out your kitten and it shows.

The simple answer is that people’s memories aren’t perfect. That’s the simple answer. I added detail because these answers were given very briefly by different people in different interviews who may very well have different memories and interpretations. That IS an answer.

Not sure why you’re bringing memories into this when ANet’s words are clearly documented. No need for memory when it’s written down and time/date stamped.

When the question was asked, Anet wasn’t sitting there with notes. They were depending on memory. I’m not sure at one point during the interviews you saw them pull out their filing cabinet to answer the questions. They answered interview questions and two people gave different answers. Were they both lying? Was one lying? Did one have a memory lapse? Did they have different points of view? You don’t know. It’s very easy to say people are lying. But it’s just as easy to not remember the orders that events occurred a year later. I suppose that’s never happened to you, but it’s sure happened to me.

hazenvirus.8154:

Vayne.8563:

One of the things that makes this different from tab targetting games is that you can use skills without targeting anything. Most of them anyway.

Glorified tab targeting game. As in the mechanics have hardly improved over current tab targetting games. They added skill activation without a target, but that is hardly ground breaking conisdering most tab targetting games had aoe spells and movement abilities that didn’t require targets. GW2 mechanics are very similar to WoW, but with anytime skill activation and no cast time, yet they don’t move much beyond games like wow. Interactions between player and npcs is about the same, they did add a universal dodge though.

We end up with a game that is easier to play and more fluid than standard tab targetting, but lacks the depth of an action combat game. How often is the ability to move and attack useful in most pve dungeons? Stack stack stack. For a game that one ups traditional mmos with more fluid mechanics it sure leaves a lot to be desired with meaningful combat encounters.

Yes, I know all about the stack thing. If only dungeons were like, I don’t know, the main focal point of this game. They’re not.

When I’m doing dynamic events in Orr or other places, I certainly don’t stack. But you know, dungeons are dungeons. Older content that allowed stacking and zerging.

A lot of the newer content is actually anti zerg and some of it is anti stack.

I don’t particularly like the dungeons in Guild Wars 2 anyway.

It’s implemented fully.

Also there are no raids. The most useful all round professions seem to be guardian and warrior, but aside from a few min/maxers and speed runners, most people don’t really care, even though speed runners might tell you differently.

This game isn’t WoW. The people who treat it like WoW care. Everyone else plays what they want and has a good time doing it.

Demonts.4593:

If this games keeps the players who hate wow the playerbase will be so small better hope for expansion or games dead end of story.

Proof? Of course not.

More people hate WoW than like it. WoW hate is so prevalent it’s not funny. If you can’t see it, you haven’t been looking.

And it’s not JUST WoW. It’s the amount of games that copied WoW and haven’t found the same success. There’s a reason WoW lost six million subscribers since its heyday.

Why do people make statements like this? There’s not only no evidence for this, but you know, there are probably as many people who hate WoW as who like it. There are entire sites dedicated to people who hate WoW.

At it’s height WoW had 12.4 million subscribers. That’s not a lot of people when you consider how many gamers there are total. I wouldn’t give a plugged nickle for the new WoW expansion, even if it were free and there was no monthly charge.

Now that doesn’t mean Anet will or won’t announce an expansion, but I think there are plenty of people playing this game who don’t like WoW at all, and probably wouldn’t play it under any circumstance.

Smith.1826:

Beldin.5498:

Smith.1826:

And I find the amount of movement in GW2 to be just as non-immersive. More importantly, it’s what makes the game feel closer to WoW to me than any other action game or RPG.

Ehhhmmm .. what ? The movement makes you feel like a game where everything
roots you … why other games that root you are better than a game that roots you ?

I can’t remember anything that ‘rooted’ me on my War in WoW, maybe Slam pre-Pandaland. Otherwise it was disco-time.

I remember being rooted in WoW quite frequently. I’m pretty sure I played other professions though. But saying my profession didn’t root me, when pretty much all the other ones did isn’t really representative of the game.

However, you’re not wrong in likely static combat better than dynamic combat It is, after all, only a matter of taste.

I think some dev probably put it there to troll us. lol

I agree Guhracie. This is one issue that could have and should have been addressed ages ago, even if it’s just to cut down on service tickets.

Smith.1826:

Vayne.8563:

Smith.1826:

GuildWarsPlayer.5608:

Smith.1826:

I’m not a big fan of the ’attacking on the go. Otherwise it is indeed fluid and satisfying, but…

Curunen.8729:

GW2 camera and targeting is still kitten.

Hopefully by GW3 they can drop this archaic targeting/camera system for full action combat. I’m not asking for a TPS, but manual aiming of skills, soft lock targeting of skills (such as mass effect did with powers) and so on. I’m aware ESO has this, but I’ll wait for that to go f2p/b2p before trying it.

I agree with this. I wish I didn’t have to ‘mod’ it to play more like this. Neverwinter has spoiled me in this regard, it controls and plays real well for an ’action MMO".

NeverWinter is also another example of being rooted while attacking.

Are you saying it’s a bad thing? Because it’s a big part of why I found it’s combat so satisfying. Making the right call between attacking or moving can be very rewarding.

Another good example of being ‘rooted’ while attacking are the Souls games, Dark Souls and Demon’s Souls. A great example is the Monster Hunter series, going so far as to not rely on a target lock, leading to an interesting skill ceiling as seen in these few vids here. (may contain foul language, though).

I’m saying it’s a bad thing. lol

I’ve been in real fights in my life and not moving while doing stuff is how you get hurt. Just saying.

But that’s just my opinion of course.

To bring it back to videogames, I’d say it depends on how it’s handled, such as shooters having a difference between ‘running and gunning’ and standing still to take careful shots. Dark Souls 2 broke some ‘new’ ground for itself in being able to shoot while moving, but it’s balanced out by having an increase in draw speed while doing so.

Flinxe.1623:

No one seemed to ever mentioned Dragon Nest. It has the most fluid combat system from the action mmo genre. It has an overall better combat mechanics than guild wars 2 but it is instanced. The developers however are making a sequel which will make it open world while retaining the combat system

Sadly, aesthetics are a pretty big point for me when it comes to MMOs, and the overall look of it is not the most appealing. But I have seen some people play through it, admittedly does look kinda fun.

Speaking of Nexon games, is Hurk released for Vindictus yet? I wanna look into that now…

I am bringing it back to video games. Having to stand still while fighting just isn’t at all immersive to me.