Guild Wars 2

Lets keep this PvE-centric please.

Elementalist in PvP is a whole other can of worms where stuff like roles, cooldowns, telegraphs, and cast times starts getting coming into play. I don’t remember the last time I actually hit someone with Dragon’s Tooth or Lava Font in PvP.

Suddenly a Thief opened on me! I proceeded to push buttons but found myself in Vapor Form…huh? Why am I in Vapor Form? Oh, I’m using downed abilities…which means I already died.
But that’s another story for another time :P

Carighan.6758:

You share the base health with Guardians and Thieves btw, and the base armour with Mesmers and Necromancers.

While you are indeed the squishiest profession as you combine low-tier HP with light armour, the concepts aren’t unique.

As such, if one were to buff, say, the low HP tier, that’d make Guardians more durable.

This isn’t about buffing tiers, it’s about buffing specifically Ele’s (mainly survivability).

Thieves have stealth and a metric ton of evades/mobility, Guardians have blocks/invuln + heavy armor and some of the best group support in the game.

Mesmer and Necros…I think we all know what compensates for their lack of armor. Mesmer survivability in PvE is one of the best in the game simply due to class mechanics.

(oops double post)

reikken.4961:

<snip>

Focus? Hahahaha.

I think this guy forgot that Ele’s can’t switch weapons in combat like Warriors, Guardians, Thieves or Rangers.
Maybe if we could then it would be a different story.

Richo.3081:

I disagree with this… you get invulns, projectile absorb, heaps of dodges, arcane shield (3 blocks + can proc more damage)

Its a high risk high reward class, I think its fantastic

1) There are no Invulns on any damage weapons, are you talking about Cantrips?
2) Projectile aborb makes us switch attunements and lock ourselves out of doing damage for 13 seconds
3) “Heaps of dodges” – that’s Vigor, i.e. Renewing Stamina. It’s a misconception that Ele’s have “extra dodges” when they really don’t, they have to trait for it.

None of this is even remotely comparable to Mesmer clones, Thief stealth, Guardian blocks/invuln, Warrior base stats, etc.
A Warrior in my gear will have almost 20K health + higher armor and that is nuts.

juno.1840:

Staff ele brings a lot of versatility to a team

No, bringing versatility and support is the job of guardians, warriors, engineers, mesmers, etc. They do that drastically better than Ele’s.
Staff Ele’s bring damage and a ton of it, so it’s best to build on our strengths and maximize damage (i.e. stay in fire attunement). All this talk about “brain power” is irrelevant, this is about what gets the job done best.

I hope we’re only talking about PvE btw. PvP is a whole other story.

As an Ele in full exotics + ascended I have 11.8k health, 1800 armor and no powerful defense mechanics even remotely comparable to what the other 7 classes have. The healing from water attunement is absolutely pathetic and it locks me out of my damage tree for 13 painful seconds (my own class mechanic hurts me).

I would list out all the defensive stuff that other classes have built-in (i.e. they don’t have to trait/slot for it) but there have been like 10 other threads that already did that.

Ele’s have have no room for error and get literally two-shotted by bosses/elite mobs.
In PvP….well, we already know about that.

All I want to know is what Elementalists are supposed to get in compensation for having the lowest health and armor in the game. There are no tanks or healers in GW2, no aggro/threat tables so in theory everyone should have the ability to survive attacks.
But how the hell are Ele’s supposed to stay alive when mobs take off 60% of their health in 1 hit, sometimes 80-90%?? Dodging doesn’t cut it, especially for attacks that you can’t see coming.

What was the design philosophy with Elementalist health+armor, especially in PvE where mobs deal flat damage?

juno.1840:

Disagree on the “don’t bother switching attunements”. If you want to be the worst ele you can be at level 80, then by all means follow that advice. However you should learn to play smart, and then practice playing smart. Leveling is the training ground to learn the smart behaviors. Otherwise you get to 80 and do the same stupid stuff and your team mates think “this is the worst ele ever”.

juno.1840:

I’ll make sure I never run a dungeon with you — an ele that stays only in fire attune is not an ele I want in my team. You can play that brain-dead style if you want, but you are not doing your mates any favors.

Yeah that sounds harsh, but if DPS was your only role, then why are you playing a staff ele?

Err Staff Ele’s do some of the highest damage in the game second to only LH build. I think you’re confusing different builds…D/D or S/D + Evasive Arcana (30 Arcana) is where attunement switching is useful, it’s a more more defense/support oriented builds.

But with a typical 30/20/10/10/0 (or similar) staff build, it’s all about staying in fire and nuking massive damage. You shouldn’t be switching attunements unless it’s an absolute emergency. All it does is lock you out of your main role (damage) for 13 seconds which is an eternity.

I’ve occasionally been in groups where if I go down the damage on boss HP seems to come to a grinding halt, almost like I was doing most of the damage :P

I wish this game had DPS Meters

Every class is OP in Skyhammer!

(except elementalists obviously)

It really all depends…are there Warriors or Elementalists in either team? Then you’re bound to see flame wars, either because the Warrior is facerolling or the Elementalist is being a free kill (more than they usually are I mean).

KarlaGrey.5903:

Funny how no even considers the blame could lie with the game servers…because pvp-specific lags were never a thing in GW2, rite.

Funny how you missed the part where OP clearly stated he was having unstable internet for a few days.

Who goes 30 points into Arcana with a Staff in PvE?
Don’t get me wrong, EA “works” with pretty much any weapon but you’re only sacrificing a ton of damage by not putting 30 points into Fire or Air instead.

Prysin.8542:

Ele’s got quite a bit of defensive utility in PvE. Sure zerker may prove hard to use at high level PvE/endgame content, but if using the right weapons and the right attunement, you can get away quite nicely.
Scepter dagger allows for some defensive play, and some hefty DPS. Using cantrips and glyphs you can increase your survivability by a lot. Some conjurations, such as the hammer and icebow give you even more survivability as the utility they offer can allow you to retire to a less dangerous spot. Sure some professions will forever have a harder time then others, that is how any MMO game is, with or without the trinity balance system.

You mean trait + slot skills for full survivability and sacrifice tons of damage? Yeah every class has that option, except that some classes like Warrior, Mesmer and Guardian can get away with full zerker+ damage traits/slots and survive with class mechanics or base stats alone.
If Ele’s trait/slot for damage + wear full zerker they get insta-killed for miss-timing a single dodge, or insta-killed during corner/wall stacking. Having 11k health + lowest armor is not even funny.

I recall playing Mage back in WoW and how many sheer survivability tools I had at my disposal…Blink to move easily around danger zones, shields/wards to absorb damage, frost spells to AoE freeze and kite stuff, Invisibility to leave combat, etc. A squishy class but equipped with tons of versatile tools, now THAT was a mage class.

Elementalist meanwhile is a joke.

Such a minor quality-of-life suggestion can sit at the bottom of the priority list. Fixing the class as a whole comes first.

I have absolutely no idea what was going through ANet’s minds with a 70% health difference between the lowest and highest classes…in a game where the tank/heal/dps trinity isn’t supposed to exist.

Definitely Staff.
Lowest health/armor + no base-defense mechanics = not optimized for fighting in close quarters. Staff lets you keep your distance and deal massive damage.

You DC’d twice during solo queues (almost guaranteed loss for those teams)…and you let it happen a 3rd time within 3 days?

Dishonorable fully deserved. As someone else said, a DC or a quitter have the same result on the team.

Charlie.1726:

Because…

Bad Warrior > Bad Other Class
Good Warrior <= Good Other Class

That would explain why so many top-tier teams are running warriors (some with 2 warriors)!

Oh…wait…

Rednik.3809:

Looks like you never even tried zerker staff ele. Ele can outdamage EVERYTHING, any class and any spec, and this is on top of crazy bursting potential with frostbow+FGS and ridiculous might+fury stacking.

Speaking as an Ele, that damage comes at the cost of needing support from heavy classes. Otherwise in any stacking situation Ele’s get 1-shotted and they are likely to go down before anyone else in a typical fight/speedrun. There’s basically zero room for error with 11k health + 1800 armor (full zerk gear).

nicknamenick.2437:

If they give all classes same health and armor you should also give warrior protectio / stealth and all the other crap..

Do you get why warrior dont get any of these???
Indeed they have heavy armor and high health.

But protection on light armor decrease more damage compared to heavy armor without..
Guardian does have protectio. Also but they get a low health pool.. And if both are low you have many other ways besides protectio. Or other boons to evade damage.. Incl stealth and clones / pets etv blocking things.

Umm…Healing Signet. Have you heard of that skill? The longer the fight goes on, the more health the warrior regenerates. In a typical fight I can end up doing well over 35K+ damage to a warrior and he’s still alive thanks to Healing Signet! I can’t interrupt it, it’s constantly ticking while he’s busy spamming all his DPS/CC abilities.

I’ll take that over stealth or clones ANY DAY.

Rednik.3809:

And i dont know why everyone says ele lacks survival.. Maby thats true in group fight. But in duel they can be very VERY good.. Ofc nobody would agree with me because warrior have it all!! Just lol people.. just look at warrior! Single target. No stealth no endless boons no pets/clones or teleport or any of the crap that other classes have.. Warriors are slow.

“No blah no blah no blah” hey here’s an idea, how about telling me why every top-tier team is running with warriors? Because warriors apparently bring nothing? Y’know, besides being super tanky against both direct damage and conditions, bringing lots of CC and solid damage.
People aren’t kidding when they say that Warriors have the best mobility in the game, they really do:

You’ve taken both Ether Renewal and Cleansing Wave, seems kinda overkill when just Ether Renewal on it’s own is enough to keep you healed and cleansed (if you play smartly).
That will let you drop points into Air for some key damage traits like Bolt To The Heart and Arcane Lightning, along with a big jump in crit damage.
When you’re in actual fights, consider swapping Signet Of Air with Signet of Fire or Conjure Frost Bow.

Stick with mostly Berserker gear (some Cavalier pieces allowed) and keep your build as damage-heavy as possible. Ele can deal extremely high damage, put that to good use.

My first recommendation would be to go with defensive slot skills – e.g. Arcane Shield (blocks), Glyph Of Storms (earth), Lightning Flash (getting past obstacles, emergency escape), Signet Of Air (faster run speed + blind), etc. Obviously it varies from situation to situation, use whatever you think will help you survive.
Slot Ether Renewal for healing since it has an extremely short cooldown + ultimate condition cleanse. Occasionally staying alive can come down to a matter of just delaying your death till Ether Renewal comes off cooldown, not to mention conditions in PvE can hit insanely hard with long durations.

If you must trait for more survivability, nothing beats Renewing Stamina (Arcana II). 6 secs of Vigor on a 5 sec internal cooldown! As long as you’re damaging something you will have Vigor and can just dodge dodge dodge all day. Dodging is your best survival tool.

Emberspire (and Combustion), both go very well with my “red” theme :P

IMO when Skyhammer starts, everyone (regardless of profession) should be given 1 ability bar with the same abilities + 1 elite. The abilities will be as below, none of them will have a cooldown except the elite:

1. - “Blast Of Skill” – knock all enemies back by 400, radius 300
2. - “Pull Of Skill” – pull your target to you, 1500 range
3. - “Fear My Skill” – fear all enemies within 300 radius for 3 seconds
4. - “Skill Sniper” – knock back your target by 400, 1200 range
5. - “Anti Skill” – Grant stability to allies for 1 second
6. - (Elite) “Positioning Matters” – Make the ground beneath all enemies vanish for 1 second. 5 minute cooldown.

Then release 5 more maps just like Skyhammer….e.g. Lavahammer (fall into lava), Gravityhammer (fall upwards), etc.

I think this will really bring PvP back to life and fix all problems with the game.

Yup, seems legit.

Theundersigned.4761:

I experimented with a couple faces to try and make them unattractive and/or unique…

<attachments>

Oh god kill it with fire :S

“It’s impossible for this to happen” – you said that in the very first line so I’m sure you only spent all that effort typing it up for giggles.

If you were a developer during alpha suggesting “hey, how about trinity?” you would’ve most likely been fired…because GW2’s biggest strength is that it’s NOT like WoW and a completely different experience, that was one of the primary design goals.
Just stepping back from all the balancing specifics (forum noise!) and looking at GW2 as a whole, it dared to be different from WoW in huge ways and absolutely succeeded.

Don’t get me wrong, holy trinity is one of the best concepts ever with a big list of strengths…but it also has some weaknesses, nothing is perfect. I got tired of it and wanted something different, so here I am playing GW2.

DaliIndica.9041:

Wintel.4873:

ArenaNet already said that one of their long-term goals is letting players use the same gear for PvE or PvP….but I have no idea how they will do this.

In PvE you have to spend actual gold or time/effort into getting skins, runes, sigils, etc. But in PvP you have unlimited access to all that stuff, so if you wanted to completely revamp your gear you’d just hop into PvP, grab some skins/etc and then hop back out into the normal world. It would be ridiculous.

Riiiiiiight, so you can buy gems, convert to gold and get good gear. But thats skilled. In PVP if you want tiger gear say then you will have to get to rank 40, should only be about 1500 matches give or take.

Its odd you know, the way the pvp and pve crowd view each other. Like spoilt children that deserve a good smack. “OH NO HE GETS GEAR ITS NOT FAIR, IN THIS GAME OF PRETTY MUCH ZERO SKILL I WANT ALL MY THINGS TO REFLECT HOW LONG I HAVE BEEN PLAYING THIS ONE MODE AND THE OTHER MODE CAN GO TO HELL WAHH WAAAAH”

I’d back off on the assumptions if I were you, considering I put 90% of my time/effort into PvP and maybe 10% into PvE.
Yes grinding ranks takes a while, but that’s not what I was talking about. Once you have achieved a certain rank you can keep crafting endless skins, literally MOUNTAINS of PvP gear and crafting materials get thrown at you for winning matches. This is not something that happens in PvE to the same extent.

You also completely glazed-over the issue of runes & sigils. A set of divinity runes currently costs 48 gold to get in PvE (and I’m sure it’ll keep going up), while in PvP it’s all FREE. Trait resets are free, sigils are free, etc.

Transferring gear between PvP and PvE comes with a whole list of questions/concerns that need to be addressed first.

KyreneZA.8617:

Wintel.4873:

8/10, very nice look but I’m not a big fan of the hairstyle :P

Bet you’re not looking forward to the eventual re-skinning of the Flamekissed set, are you?

ANet said that they will refund Flamekissed buyers who aren’t happy with the changed version, so either I get my gems back or I end up with a set that looks even more awesome. It’s a win/win
I do agree it was pretty dumb designing a set that looks like a superior version of Human T3.

Ele’s just need more survivability, that’s all. They have the lowest health/armor and have no base survivability mechanics like stealth or clones. Not helping is how telegraphed so many of the abilities are with long cast times, and many flat-out useless abilities (scepter autoattacks, shatterstone, etc).

Build diversity is also terrible…you either play some kind of half-baked bunker that is vastly inferior to anything else, or full-glass where you get 1-shotted. Being forced to slot Cantrips just to postpone dying by a few extra seconds just feels pathetic.

The class just doesn’t make any sense in SPvP.

AC explorable is harder than any other explorable dungeon, except maybe Fractals.

I’m not kidding.

I play Staff Ele and Rifle Engi and I have no complaints about the upcoming sigil changes, bring them on :S

Nerf to FGS into walls? Never!

8/10, very nice look but I’m not a big fan of the hairstyle :P

ArenaNet already said that one of their long-term goals is letting players use the same gear for PvE or PvP….but I have no idea how they will do this.

In PvE you have to spend actual gold or time/effort into getting skins, runes, sigils, etc. But in PvP you have unlimited access to all that stuff, so if you wanted to completely revamp your gear you’d just hop into PvP, grab some skins/etc and then hop back out into the normal world. It would be ridiculous.

Engineer, obviously. Technology is adorable :P

thefantasticg.3984:

Wintel.4873:

Am I missing something here? How is the heavy vs light balance at higher level dungeons (e.g. Fractals)?

Yeah. It’s called using the right tool for the job. I’m not going to use my monitor to put a nail into wood, I"m going to use a hammer. It just makes sense. It’s dumb to think that a light armored toon can “tank” like a heavy armored toon.

A heavy class can do roughly the same amount of damage as a light class while having significantly more survivability, assuming both wear full zerker gear. If that doesn’t look unbalanced to you then I don’t know what to say.

Exedore.6320:

A vocal minority full of irrational hatred and blind followers. Skyhammer forces you to care a lot about positioning. People don’t like to adapt; instead, they blame the map.

There are some issues with skyhammer. The breakable glass could be cut down a bit more, specifically those half-panels at A and C. The skyhammer control room is too easy to AoE spam. The areas for points A and C and the control room are a little too small for ranged classes to play effectively.

So you bring up those huge glaring issues/flaws with the map, yet you tell people to adapt and stop blaming the map? Self-contradiction or just logic fail?

Glass panels at A + C and Skyhammer control room (including Skyhammer itself) make up the 95% of the complaints about that map.

I can’t believe people are still spouting nonsense about positioning. With certain classes like Engineer or Thief as long as you’re within 1000-1200 range of a glass panel, I can pull you into it (and you will fall) regardless of your position. Don’t even get me started on how stupid it is to fight a Guardian or Engineer in control room.

Rhalas.4167:

Im a staff Ele, too. But I also carry a scepter and focus for such situations. If you pigeonhole yourself into one weapon then you will die.
Sorry bro, I dont intend to be mean but you cant
hammer a nail with a pin cushion, adapt and use the tools appropriate to the situation.

Hmm I have S/D both with bloodlust for fast stacking, but didn’t think to use Focus at all! Forgot how much defensive stuff Focus has. Thanks, it’ll help as far as running-past-enemies goes.

There’s still the issue of getting killed in corner zergs though, can’t use S/F for that because staff is awesome and most of the time I’m using a conjure (FGS or frostbow).

Hi there, recently I decided to take a break from from Engi and return to my Ele for some pve/dungeons. I play Staff 30/30/0/10/0…soz I know 30/20/10/10/0 is better, but I die way too often to comfortably stay within 600 range of my targets. Full exotic zerker + scholar runes, some ascended stuff like rings/amulet/trinket.

I admit that I’ve basically got almost no PvE experience outside of dungeon story/exp modes, so I’m having a bit of trouble in groups which decide to simply RUN PAST everything and corner-zerg bosses.

The first issue is running past mobs. I see Warriors and Guardians doing it with ease, hardly losing any health and fantastic mobility, but as I try to stay close to them my health simply runs out. If I eat even 1 CC/cripple I’m dead. ~11k health is basically 1-2 hits from any elite mob, what am I supposed to do??

Second issue is corner-zerging bosses. Again, my health simply vanishes to standard boss/AoE attacks. I summon FGS and go butter-nuts with that crazy awesome damage, next thing I know I’m downed and being a burden on the group.

People may say “well dodge”, except that the heavy classes barely seem to even NEED to dodge and I don’t have infinite stamina, it’s just a matter of time before I get hit and insta-killed.

What to do

Eric.1672:

Why does everyone hate sky hammer? Im not trolling. I mean there were BGs in wow that I couldn’t stand….but there is a large amount of hate in-game against hammer

Some classes are MUCH better at abusing that map’s mechanics than other classes. Since fighting on point A, C and Skyhammer all revolves around “who can make the other guy fall off”….so some can equip themselves with multiple knockback/CC abilities just troll the hell out of classes that don’t have such abilities.

Hi there, I’m have only recently started completing story & exp modes of most dungeons over the last few weeks. I play an Elementalist.

One thing I have noticed right away when looking for groups is that stacking the “heavy” classes (Warrior or Guardian) seems to have no downsides and only benefits, while stacking light classes usually becomes a big problem especially when trying to speed-clear.
In fact there seem to be entire Warrior-only groups clearing dungeons in full berzerker gear, it’s crazy. While I can do extremely high damage (especially into walls/corners), it comes at the cost of getting 1-shotted by virtually anything that looks at me funny and spending a lot of time in downed state.
I’ve also seen Guardians and Warriors do amazing things like mass-pull groups of enemies and just tank all that damage, if I tried to do something like that I would die instantly.

Am I missing something here? How is the heavy vs light balance at higher level dungeons (e.g. Fractals)?

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

this is working as intended.
warriors are meant to be fast.
what is the problem?

do you remember that warriors have no direct access to:
- stealth
- illusions
- death shroud
- pets
- minions
- protection, aegis

warriors are balanced and not overpowered, it has been more than a year since launch, please accept that already.

So you conveniently forgot that Warriors have:
> Best base stats in the game
> Best passive heal in the game
> High armor (heavy class)

They fact they are frantically merging threads means they are at least aware of this one, and purposefully avoiding answering to it.

Oh well, as players all we can do is keep bumping this thread up or making more threads. We are powerless to do anything else, besides completely ditching SoloQ and using TeamQ (it’s what I’m doing).

ArenaNet, please remove this godawful excuse of a PvP map from Solo Queue. Either that, or change the map mechanics (no more insta deaths from falling). Make another platform just below the Skyhammer level, so falling off will mean you have to run back to the fight instead of dying. Also the Skyhammer cannon does EVERYTHING at once (massive damage, knockdown, can’t be dodged/blocked) and needs a nerf in at least 1 of those aspects.

Faster cast time on AED would be an excellent start.
It’s far less risky than tweaking with the numbers/mechanics of it.

Next thing you know, they move Renewing Stamina and Elemental Attunement to grandmaster tier and change Diamond Skin health threshold to 50%.

……to improve build diversity.

Pfft that’s nothing compared to what Engineer can do. Engi can have Rifle knockback, Battering Ram knockback, Bomb AoE knockback and Toolkit #5 (1200 range pull) all in one build since those are slot skills. Basically if one fails then you have 2-3 others to follow it up.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

ah well played my fellow guild member!

by the way, this is not broken, and is working as intended.

people need to learn to play the maps properly.

Fixed it for you:

people need to learn to re-roll the right class for Skyhammer

Now take your wisdom somewhere else.

Elementalist abilities are far too telegraphed and slow-casting. While it works out excellent for PvE (massive AoE damage, fields, etc), everything falls apart in PvP where it’s all about trying to hit mobile single targets that move randomly.

Something needs to be done with Staff, Scepter and off-hand Dagger abilities…at least half of them revolve around creating fields (or telegraphs) which an enemy can simply WALK AWAY from, they don’t even need to dodge it!

A few examples:
> Dragon’s Tooth – needs to be ground-targeted and have it’s landing-time cut by at least 30%. Seriously, how the hell are you supposed to land this on enemies when they have enough time to walk away from it even after getting hit by Updraft / Earthquake?
> Lava Font – needs an instant “first-tick”, currently even if you create it directly on a moving enemy (or ahead of them) it’s possible for them to take 0 damage from it.
> Shatterstone – cut exploding delay to 1 second.
> Churning Earth – this ability takes risk/reward to extreme levels. Crazy cooldown, crazy cast time, crazy risk, crazy damage. It needs to be made castable on the move and have it’s cast time lowered. To balance it I’m fine with getting the initial spike damage lowered.
> Earthquake – cast time lowered
> Fire Grab – cast time lowered
> Ride The Lightning – make the cooldown 20 seconds again (flat, regardless of whether it hits targets) for the love of god.

Mind you this won’t exactly fix the class. It still has sustainability issues, build diversity issues and godawful slot skills (besides Cantrips).

salt and pepper.4738:

ELE IS FINE. you can play s/f, s/d and d/d. If you cant you are just to bad, no offense.

the real problem is other classes are slightly to strong and to easy to play.

“Poverty-stricken countries are FINE. They can learn to eat dirt and drink sewage, if they can’t then just too bad, no offense.
The real problem is that developed countries are too rich”.

^ That’s roughly how much sense you made.

Any Ele build, obviously.

You’re forced to manage 4 attunement cooldowns and 15+ ability cooldowns regardless of your build.

5 sec base cooldown between attunements pls

I did Solo Queue up till rank 30.

Then I started Team Queue and never looked back. It’s better in every way, but you should be well affiliated with your prof/build and map tactics.

1) No skyhammer
2) NO SKYHAMMER
3) More gold
4) More rank points
5) More organized teams
6) Haven’t really noticed a difference in queue wait times
7) NO KITTENING SKYHAMMER FOR THE LOVE OF GOD