Guild Wars 2

Download WSplit. Throw it up on a second monitor, or just leave it on your desktop while you play the game in full screen, and have a start/pause hotkey. Problem solved.

There hasn’t been one of these in awhile, so I figured I’d give it a shot. I will start forming a party for the tour at 1:00 PM U.S. Eastern time on Sunday, November 9th. Anyone is welcome to come, provided you’re on NA, and provided you meet the following expectations.

I expect the following:
- Know your class. This includes having melee weapons, and knowing what they do. We will melee everything, including Lupi, with the possible exception of Melandru (so make sure you have at least one ranged weapon you can equip if needed).
- Teamspeak 3. A microphone is not necessary, but you need to be able to connect and listen.
- Powerful potions of undead slaying and 66% chance life steal on critical food (e.g. Candied Dragon Rolls).
- A good attitude.
- You have watched Brazil’s Lupi Guide. Adapt what you learn to your class. If you have the time and interest, it may be helpful to find melee solo videos of someone who is playing your class, but this is in no way required or expected.
- If you are joining us for Path 4, you have watched this trio melee melandru video. This in case we have a Guardian in the party, and thus are going to attempt to melee Melandru.
- If you are joining us for path 2, you have watched 0:55 to 1:12 of this video. Knowing the general route of the spider skip will help speed things up in the event we do not have a thief, and thus cannot simply stealth past everything as a group.

We will be doing the paths in reverse order (4, 3, 2 then 1). If you, for example, only need path 4 for your Dungeon Master title and don’t want to do any other paths feel free to leave after the path(s) you care about, as there will possibly be people waiting for the additional paths.

If you are interested, post here, or send me an in-game mail message. Please indicate your experience level with Arah in your post or mail message, as I will attempt to prioritize less experienced players over very experienced ones (who might still want to come along for fun).

If there’s a lot more interest than there are available spaces, I may attempt to stream the tour. My twitch is twitch.tv/zuistreams.

I’ll happily kick your tank/healer nonsense from any 49 fractal group I am a part of. People like that are a reason why attempting to pug higher level fractals is an absolute nightmare some of the time, and most clearly apparent when any of the “harder” fractals is rolled. The best support is someone wearing damage gear, because they deal damage and can still do useful support via intelligent skill usage.

Skipping is not an exploit. If you’ve ever played certain dungeons, it is very obvious that some mobs are meant to be skipped or otherwise optional to kill. How is this an exploit?

Line of sighting mobs is not an exploit. It’s a necessary consequence of the programmed AI behavior. In any event, it’s almost always much faster to fight them out in the open where they spawn, and this is what good groups currently do. How is this in any way an exploit?

People survive in damage gear because they use active defense. They use control effects on mobs so they don’t do anything while being burned down. They use blocks, such as Aegis from a Guardian. They use dodge. They use reflects and projectile absorption skills. Stacking does basically does not do anything to aid in survival. All of the trash that is skipped is trivially easy to kill wearing full damage gear, but just takes additional time that is not worthwhile to spend in order to kill it.

What are these exploits you’re talking about? Did you report them to ANET? If you think they’re actual exploits (like stacking or skipping), you should not be discussing them on the forum or anywhere else, but instead reporting them to exploits@arena.net (but please don’t, because that’d be entirely moronic and wasting the time of staff at ANET to actually read such nonsense… And I think you know that, otherwise you wouldn’t be talking about them on the forum because it’s a violation of the terms you agreed to. Only email ANET if you know of an actual exploit).

archdemonXIII.7063:

Zui.9245:

Astralporing.1957:

Serophous.9085:

When running:; Equip condition cleanse, equip stability. Done

Still is extremely annoying. Especially as those mobs can spam cc faster than i can recharge condis (which means a lot, as my condi cleanse is quite good), and some of their cc’s seem to go right through stability (you can quite often get immo’b 1s after popping a stability, for example).
Granted, it’s not enough to actually kill someone prepared, but it is annoying. And in the end does not add anything really valuable to the content.
(notice, i am speaking specifically about the Labyrinth here).

This is entirely a learn to play issue on your part.

Immobilize isn’t prevented by stability, so being immobilized after you pop stability is entirely expected if you fail to avoid the source of immobilize. Learn how the game works.

You should be avoiding nearly every condition placed on you. This is very easy via some combination of movement skills, swiftness, intelligent player pathing, and dodge.

I’d say it’s entirely a learn to read issue. Missed point in bold.

Yes, there should be a challenge. That challenge shouldn’t be enjoying the content.

I didn’t miss his “point” that he finds trash skips annoying.

But open world trash skips are so insanely easy you can only consider them a challenge if you’re extremely bad at the game. It’s only possibly annoying if you are very bad at intelligent player pathing, dodging, using your movement skills, self-buffing with swiftness, and using stability/condi clears/condi immunities as appropriate. And given how easy open world trash skips are, you can eliminate about half of that list and still breeze by without any kind of issues or possible annoyance.

His point was “It’s annoying, but I do not know how to play the game”. My point was, “This is a learn to play issue”. My point still stands, and your point is wholly irrelevant because you failed to consider my reply in the broader context of the discussion.

Astralporing.1957:

Serophous.9085:

When running:; Equip condition cleanse, equip stability. Done

Still is extremely annoying. Especially as those mobs can spam cc faster than i can recharge condis (which means a lot, as my condi cleanse is quite good), and some of their cc’s seem to go right through stability (you can quite often get immo’b 1s after popping a stability, for example).
Granted, it’s not enough to actually kill someone prepared, but it is annoying. And in the end does not add anything really valuable to the content.
(notice, i am speaking specifically about the Labyrinth here).

This is entirely a learn to play issue on your part.

Immobilize isn’t prevented by stability, so being immobilized after you pop stability is entirely expected if you fail to avoid the source of immobilize. Learn how the game works.

You should be avoiding nearly every condition placed on you. This is very easy via some combination of movement skills, swiftness, intelligent player pathing, and dodge.

Lindbur.2537:

Would someone like to direct this bunch to Arah?

Already did. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/So-TIRED-of-being-a-rag-doll/first#post4526605

rollnburn.6273:

Get out of my dungeons I don’t wanna “look” for people that are trying to rip me off my money. YOU want to charge people for letting them into your party? Sure form you party outside the dungeon. If I want to earnestly look for other players I don’t want to find parties that will kick me if I don’t pay their fee, seriously this is a problem. Let us live you petty thieves preying on naive newbies.

Dungeon sellers charge people for completing the entire dungeon path, with zero participation of the buyer required, and minimal time of the buyer required. This is a service worth compensation. If you don’t want to pay in exchange for the service, just don’t join. Advertising a legitimate service is not an attempt to rip you off, just like a car wash hanging a sign saying they’ll wash your car for a certain price isn’t some attempt to rip you off.

Dungeon sellers aren’t charging you a fee for you joining their party. They’re charging the fee for you joining the party and getting the end boss reward without you having to participate in any way. If you don’t pay, they will kick you, just like any group that advertises with specific requirements will kick you if you do not meet those requirements.

Dungeon sellers are not “stealing” the gold of anyone. This is a voluntary transaction both parties think is fair. Otherwise, they wouldn’t be making the transaction.

Dungeon sellers do not prey on “naive newbies”. I sell a fair amount of Arah, and nearly all of the buyers have over 3k AP (in fact, about half of them have more AP than I do). Some are buying for Dungeon Master, and are doing it because they don’t want to do the dungeon, or because they haven’t been able to complete it with a group after many attempts. They’re happy to pay the price. Some are buying tokens for skins they want, or so they can get Dungeoneer. Again, they’re happy to pay the price. If they weren’t happy to pay the price, they wouldn’t voluntarily join and pay.

We already have difficult trash runs in dungeons (read: Arah). These trash runs are very significantly harder than anything in the open world. If you’re failing trash runs in the open world, or even struggling with them a tiny bit, this is a learn to play issue.

The currency exchange function change was almost certainly not done because players found it too confusing, or it was too complicated to use, or any similar reasons.

It was done to encourage more players to purchase additional gems. It’s all about the gem store revenue. They don’t think you’re an incompetent idiot. They think you’re a wallet.

It’s probable they did bounce around some other reasons for doing what they did, but these decisions get made based off of increased revenue potential, and everything else just serves as a means of trying to justify why it’s a good change overall.

So, maybe tanky gear increases the effect of active defenses. Immobilize lasts longer. Reflects last longer. Blocks take more hits. Blinds can effect multiple attacks. Tanky gear is still suboptimal in nearly every situation ever, which is everywhere it’s still currently suboptimal. All you’re doing is making low skill easy mode even easier to be an unattentive player wearing tanky gear. Since your active defenses are much better, you need to worry less about appropriately using them. This isn’t a compelling choice, or an interesting addition. It’s utterly useless, and counterproductive to helping players take off the training wheels that are tanky gear. (And the PvPers will thank you for making bunker builds, which lead to such compelling, engaging, and skillful gameplay, insanely more effective)

Maybe, instead, tanky gear decreases the cooldown of active defenses. Great idea, you say! Except now, all active defenses are more spammable. Most fights are too short for this to ever matter, so for those, you’ve done absolutely nothing at all. Some fights are long enough where this could help. Except, you’ve just now made those longer fights require less coordination among team members. Good job with that. Again, you’re not creating a compelling choice, or promoting good gameplay here. You’re making it harder for people to take the training wheels off.

Remember, one of the core design philosophies of GW2 is that you can complete all content in any gear. Which means you’ve got to allow content to be completable by someone with zero additional passive defense above baseline, and no ‘bonus’ active defense.

What kind of compelling, interesting choices do you imagine tanky gear could actually provide in a game with the core design philosophy that GW2 has?

maha.7902:

I really would prefer to have toughness and vitality play a role in our active defenses though, and to have healing scale up a bit more. I feel it would add avenues of growth for further encounter design in the game’s future, and promote the likes of Soldier and Nomad gear from ‘safety net’ and ‘useless’ respectively (in popular perception) to ‘path of mastery’.

And just why exactly should gear stats that let you afk eat hits be the optimal gear for anything?

Is soaking hits more skillful or more interesting or something? Like idk, I feel if you go full glass you should be rewarded accordingly, which this game does, or like what every MMO does where you run the very bare minimum of tanks and healers necessary. A really basic example is that the first dungeon in ArcheAge is something you can clear with three DPS but sure, you can use a tank + 2 DPS or whatever. But if you can handle it, 3 DPS is cool.

Everybody knows standing there and tanking hits because you’re afk, too lazy to use active defense, or clueless as to the mechanics is far more skillful play than having to know the mechanics and use active defense while attentively playing. Since tanking hits in this manner is vastly more skillful than the alternatives, it should definitely be more rewarding.

I feel this video clearly demonstrates why non-damage gear is more skillful than anything else out there: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNMltxyvAvo

I mean really, look at that. It’s sped up (and a bit dated), but since the fight took about 35 minutes real time, there’s a LOT of possible room for mishap. For example, he could have fallen asleep, or the “1” key on the keyboard could have ceased to function from all that repeated pressing, requiring some fast reaction to clicking the “1” skill instead before complete disaster.

#Nomads4Lyfe

Unskilled players still get Arah tokens without path sellers. They join LFGs, and leech, and/or they spend 2+ hours on a simple path 2, and do it repeatedly, or they do sPvP (where pseudo-afk leeching is PERFECTLY FINE). Anyone can get any dungeon skins with absolutely zero player skill.

All dungeon runners do is let people get their tokens faster, let them get their dungeon master faster, and most importantly, keep them out of groups where they’re probably not wanted. (And to be fair to buyers, some of them could be perfectly welcome in a good group, but just have way more gold than time).

In return, they actually get an appropriate reward for their skill and effort. It’s a fair trade, and one of the areas of the game where skill is actually appropriately rewarded, in a game that often rewards content requiring zero skill equally or better to having actual player skill.

I’d buy it 3 times to get the 3 classes I don’t have at level 80 there. Cheaper and less painful than craft leveling, or swapping at the end of a dungeon. Every aspect of the game I actually like to play, level either doesn’t matter at all (sPvP), or you better be level 80 in good gear (Dungeons, Fractals, and WvW roaming); the entire rest of the game is a giant time sink, which was fun the first few times, but isn’t something I ever want to experience yet again because the fun value per time is too low, and there is no more novelty value in it.

Please also sell a personal story skip for another 1000 gems. Pick random options. Don’t even give us any rewards. I don’t care. I’ll buy that too, please. Or just let me get rid of the annoying green text otherwise, and make the ability to enter Arah and other dungeons account based not character based. Thanks.

Mesket.5728:

Zui.9245:

Mesket.5728:

Zui.9245:

Mesket.5728:

theguildless.1386:

Mesket.5728:

Shield warrior is OP, how many other infinite blocks for 3 seconds on 20ish seconds cooldown are out there?

Since you asked:

Shield Stance is a 3 second block on a 30 second cooldown.
Gear Shield is a 3 second block on a 20 second cooldown.
Counterattack is a 3 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.
Riposte is a 2 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.

*Works if you are not within melee range of an enemy.

While Counterattack and Riposte do not work exactly like Shield Stance does, it will accomplish the same thing in many scenarios, with the benefit of having a much shorter cooldown. This is one reason why it is worth considering using sword off-hand instead of shield.

Thanks for prooving my poing… only a few skills compare to shield warrior and not all of them are infinite block.. riposte and couter attack its only 1, sucks as a block skill so it only leaves engie shield comparable with warrior. (guardian focus and elem arcane shield are on a 3 block counter which also sucks).

I don’t think your point was proven. Riposte is a multiblock. In fact, it’s impossible for it NOT to be a multiblock when fighting a giant, because of the standard skill lineups that all giants seem to share…

Your argument stops when you are surrounded by melee.

First, not really if you can intelligently kite …

you missed the point right there… better keep the original post in mind instead derailing just to keep the argument alive.

“Second, are we not talking about soloing a giant with nothing else around? Because I’m pretty sure that’s what we’re talking about in this thread.

Which if these giant attacks spawns adds, much less adds that melee? Throw Boulder? Stomp? Stamp (Double Stomp + Punch)? Roar (Weakness + Fear)? None of the above?"

Thanks for taking a snippet of my post out of context, and then trying to pretend like I’m not paying attention to the context of this thread, when I’m actually pointing out how invalid one of your statements about riposte not being a multiblock due to melee attackers is from within the context of this thread (and also outside the context of this thread, too).

There seems to be no point in any further discussion here.

Mesket.5728:

Zui.9245:

Mesket.5728:

theguildless.1386:

Mesket.5728:

Shield warrior is OP, how many other infinite blocks for 3 seconds on 20ish seconds cooldown are out there?

Since you asked:

Shield Stance is a 3 second block on a 30 second cooldown.
Gear Shield is a 3 second block on a 20 second cooldown.
Counterattack is a 3 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.
Riposte is a 2 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.

*Works if you are not within melee range of an enemy.

While Counterattack and Riposte do not work exactly like Shield Stance does, it will accomplish the same thing in many scenarios, with the benefit of having a much shorter cooldown. This is one reason why it is worth considering using sword off-hand instead of shield.

Thanks for prooving my poing… only a few skills compare to shield warrior and not all of them are infinite block.. riposte and couter attack its only 1, sucks as a block skill so it only leaves engie shield comparable with warrior. (guardian focus and elem arcane shield are on a 3 block counter which also sucks).

I don’t think your point was proven. Riposte is a multiblock. In fact, it’s impossible for it NOT to be a multiblock when fighting a giant, because of the standard skill lineups that all giants seem to share…

Your argument stops when you are surrounded by melee.

First, not really if you can intelligently kite during the time you’re blocking. Virtually every melee attacking mob in the game is absurdly easy to kite and take zero hits from.

Second, are we not talking about soloing a giant with nothing else around? Because I’m pretty sure that’s what we’re talking about in this thread.

Which if these giant attacks spawns adds, much less adds that melee? Throw Boulder? Stomp? Stamp (Double Stomp + Punch)? Roar (Weakness + Fear)? None of the above?

Mesket.5728:

theguildless.1386:

Mesket.5728:

Shield warrior is OP, how many other infinite blocks for 3 seconds on 20ish seconds cooldown are out there?

Since you asked:

Shield Stance is a 3 second block on a 30 second cooldown.
Gear Shield is a 3 second block on a 20 second cooldown.
Counterattack is a 3 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.
Riposte is a 2 second* block on a 15 second cooldown.

*Works if you are not within melee range of an enemy.

While Counterattack and Riposte do not work exactly like Shield Stance does, it will accomplish the same thing in many scenarios, with the benefit of having a much shorter cooldown. This is one reason why it is worth considering using sword off-hand instead of shield.

Thanks for prooving my poing… only a few skills compare to shield warrior and not all of them are infinite block.. riposte and couter attack its only 1, sucks as a block skill so it only leaves engie shield comparable with warrior. (guardian focus and elem arcane shield are on a 3 block counter which also sucks).

I don’t think your point was proven. Riposte is a multiblock. In fact, it’s impossible for it NOT to be a multiblock when fighting a giant, because of the standard skill lineups that all giants seem to share. The duration of Riposte is long enough to block anything you could possibly want to block from a Giant; the extra duration of shield block thus does not matter at all. Shield 4 is totally worthless versus a champion or legendary mob. Sword 4 is not. Sword is clearly superior, and there is absolutely no reason to ever run a shield for the block in PvE unless you’re already also running offhand sword, and need even more blocks.

Furthermore, the person you’re responding to forgot about Shelter (same cd as shield block), and Guardian’s Focus Block (36s cd traited), the first one being actually infinite, and the second being effectively infinite when fighting a giant.

You wouldn’t ever run /Shield when fighting a giant. You’d run */Sword, and Greatsword. And by "", I mean “Axe”, because it’d be stupid to run MH Sword or Mace.

Malediktus.9250:

Sounds like you are unlucky. I didnt have any duplicate yet and I am at 12/19 skins now.

It’s not luck. It’s probability. Managing to get 12 unique values out of 19, when you sample the whole pool of 19 every time, is quite improbable in its self. To say nothing about how rare it is to actually get a fractal skin in the first place.

Chameleon Dude.1564:

Haishao.6851:

Clearly we need to learn to play so you should take your sword/shield warrior and come solo the legendary giant in dry top to teach us.

If it weren’t for its timer and the abundance of players interfering, it’s very likely possible. Just don’t get hit.

If it just has the standard lineup of attacks that every single giant in the game has, it’d be trivially easy to solo on Warrior, or on Guardian, or on Thief, or on really any other class to be honest. But NO WAY would you run Sword/Shield on Warrior. You’d run Axe/Sword + Greatsword. Additionally, there’s no way you’d run Sword/Shield on Guardian… Shield? I mean SHIELD? REALLY? I’d imagine Guardian would be running either Sword/Focus, or Mace/Focus, although I really doubt the extra block from mace would even be needed and sword damage is clearly superior (but no way would I use Sword 2 for the 10% chance to miss… lol… nor would I trust sword 3 to actually absorb “Throw Boulder”…).

Stooperdale.3560:

How about putting some rare encounters (bosses) into fractals 41-50 but each boss can only occur in a specific fractal with a certain instability present? For example, the svanir shaman could be replaced by an icebrood shaman when the frost attack instability (47?) is present. Give players a good reward for killing five unique bosses and a top tier reward for getting every one.

I accept this will be one of those frustrating tasks that will take a long time just to find the rare encounters but fractals are meant to be the repeatable end game content for the dungeon community. It would be an achievement to get this done.

The only reason it’d be hard is because of RNG fractal rolls, it’d take a very long time on average. If you’re going to redesign rewards, you need to start from a place that doesn’t build upon the kittenty RNG that’s already there, because if you do, all you get is “Oh yay… more kittenty RNG”.

I’d rather like to see things that are more along the lines of “did something genuinely difficult” and not “spent a lot of time”.

Does this bug relate to the gem store? Does it relate to the Living Story? Is it an exploit? Is this something that people who buy gems with real dollars might actually get upset over?

If the answer to all of the above is “no”, then ANET will almost certainly never fix the bug. They’re ANET. They don’t fix bugs. Instead, they ignore them. This is so close to accurate that calling it an exaggeration would its self be a bit of an exaggeration, and it’s just plain sad.

Did an Engineer pick this up and swap kits, or did the person who picked it up use some kind of consumable that counts as a bundle (presumably, also bugs the hammer like a kit swap)? Did the person with the hammer possibly disconnect?

In any event, it’d be nice if ANET were to take Cliffside out of the rotation until they fix the issues with it. Or just swap Cliffside and Volcanic, since Volcanic doesn’t have issues like this, and is IMHO way more fun than Cliffside ( and also quite uncommon ), so that even though Cliffside still has issues, it’s at least not an insanely common fractal given that it (appears) to roll much more frequently than the other possibilities (even not accounting for the fact it can roll for second OR third… it seems more common for second than battlegrounds/uncat/snowblind/furnace, and it seems more common for third than dredge/volcanic for sure, and about tied with atherblade if you didn’t roll cliffside in the second fractal).

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again: All ascended gear should have stat swapping. All ascended gear should have Sigil swapping and Rune swapping. Legendaries should not confer any advantage than they were originally stated to, that is, they should just be a really cool skin and that’s it.

Casmurro, that video… Wow… I just don’t know what to say.

#1: The boss only reflects projectiles when he has the reflect buff up, not during the entire fight phase; you are correct that the icon for this buff looks like protection. This occurs after the boss attempts to pull players on your team. The “White Flash” attack quickly follows, so get ready to dodge, or if you’re playing Guardian and you can give Aegis, do so.

#2: You want to hit the left and right switches in the room, and then hit the center switch. The switches apply the immobilize condition. Any condition cleans or condition immunity (used before hitting first panel) will do.

Jerem has a good list. In addition to GrimmR’s addition to it, I’d like to add that Guardian also has “Time Warp” (Offensive tome #4 skill. Then drop without using any of the other skills).

I haven’t experienced this particular bug in SE P2. Maybe it’s new, but probably not. There’s another progress blocking bug in this path, which is extremely frequent to trigger, and which ANET is certainly aware of. I wish you the best of luck in getting your DM title, because unless you’re extremely lucky, you’re in for a lot of SE P2 pain before you successfully complete it once.

However, this is a bug. ANET doesn’t fix bugs. They ignore them, unless a miracle occurs, or they relate to LS or the Gem Store. In the event a miracle does occur, you almost need another miracle for the fix to actually fix what it’s supposed to, because it’d be way too hard for them to actually ensure their fixes work or something.

No, just because this is a progress blocking bug in a fundamental content area of the game doesn’t mean anything. Entire professions (see: Mesmer) have a vast array of bugs with their fundamental class mechanics/skills. ANET obviously does not care.

The rares and exotics you get in fractals don’t have an average gold value to make fractals much more worthwhile than dungeons.

The chance at getting ascended box with actually usable stats is low enough that you’d be better off running fast dungeon paths and then doing some world bosses so you can eventually craft your ascended gear that has non-trash stats.

If I were to do this, I’d probably ask all the players some pre sign up questions that give a hint at their skill level / competence, and score them say out of 100 (some being fairly short answer, some being more open ended… but not too many questions). Also note guild membership of players. Scoring will still be somewhat arbitrary, but with a few decent quality open-ended questions, you can probably get people closeish in terms of their actual ability level.

Then write a program that matches non-guildmates up together in such a way as to create teams that are roughly even in terms of ‘score’. Throw in another criteria for at least 1 streamer per team. If multiple optimal team comps are found, have it pick one at random. Or add some other things to factor in, like class compositions. Just make it quick and easy to write the program given the data.

Those are your teams. It’s the only way to more or less put everyone on an even playing ground, and it’s way better than just random teams with not much more work. Instead of ‘who got the better players’ (which will still be a factor), it will be more like what team of randoms is capable of best working together to accomplish a common goal. I think this could make it actually fairly competitive, and fun for all participants who are up for such a thing. You might get a team of 2 fantastic players and 3 mediocre ones, but they might be competing versus a team of 1 above average, 3 average, and 1 mediocre player. Who can complete their path first? Who knows.

I’d probably say that ability to use mumble/ts/vent should be a requirement. Both listening and speaking. Otherwise, you’re just not going to get players willing to collaborate fully with their teammates. Maybe full exotic (rare? ugh) gear or better with non-terrible stat/sigil/runes, too (could accept less than ideal and just score lower, too). Maybe some questions as to their opinions on certain tactics to disqualify them, too (i.e. “if your team decides to stack to line of sight something, are you okay with that? what if your team decides to skip some mobs?” kind of deal).

I’d probably restrict the tournament to non-buggy paths that pugs can more often than not handle. And no Arah story. It’d kind of suck to watch say, CoF path 3 where both teams are wiping repeatedly during the 5 waves of mobs and simply cannot progress further, although the voice chat and non-terrible gear requirements might make CoF3 well within the average group’s capability, so it’s a bit of a gamble. Could always add an ‘after N wipes, the team with the furthest progression wins or if tied, they rematch on another path’. Or heck, instead of RNG paths, you could have each team pick a path, and then have a third (deciding in case of a tie) path picked by RNG, and just make it so that for their path selection, each team can only pick a certain path once.

How would I do it?

I’d accept that rewards cannot be perfectly even across all game modes. I wouldn’t even try to make them even, because it’s a foolish task that will necessarily either end up in nonsensical reward levels (like we have now when comparing many various dungeon paths) that scale extremely poorly with both time and difficulty, or you’ll end up with a spectrum of reward that has relatively more reward either at the easy, or hard difficulty end.

As for whether or not easy or hard content should get more reward, I’m still going to go with hard content. Why?

First, it promotes an incentive for players to expand their own boundaries in the game. This is a time tested strategy in every single game. Even “easy” games that only offer single player have a difficulty spectrum increase as you continue playing. Part of the fun is your own growth as a player, whether you know it or not, even if that growth isn’t all that significant.

Second, it is less likely to mess with the game economy. If you have to have a reward spectrum, you should offer the greater reward to the smaller player group. If you do otherwise, you end up with a kittentier economy. From a player POV, the economy for the large portion of easy content likers (assuming they’re large) won’t be much worse if hard content gets better reward; it will be noticeably worse the other way around. This fact is especially perverse if you have a system like GW2 does, where to best compete (not just complete) for the fastest times on the hardest content, you really ought to have ascended gear, and the best way to get that gear currently is to play mindless easy content until you can’t take it anymore, and then keep at it anyway.

Third, if you really have to have a rewards spectrum (and you do), your options are between rewarding players who are just showing up, and players who are showing up and also putting in considerable effort. To give players putting in more effort less reward simply because they put in more effort is ridiculous. It’s like saying that Bob’s showing up to work on time and leaving on time but is really just putting time in while doing an acceptable but mediocre job, but Jim is showing up on time and leaving on time, and doing a fantastic job while continually improving his abilities and taking on new responsibilities. Would anyone suggest that Bob ought to be making more money than Jim? Would anyone even suggest they ought to make the same amount?

Basically, what I’m saying is that rewards should scale with merit as best as possible. This means both that you get more rewards for more time played (possibly capping at a point), and also more rewards for actually doing something worthy of getting more rewards (read: hard content). Hard content by definition merits better rewards than other content.

Ohoni.6057:

But let’s say an activity takes 20 hours of failure before you get it right but that after about thirty hours of practice you can clear it 100% of the time. Let’s say you then spend another 80 hours playing that content. If the rewards are even double what one would get for an “easy” activity, then over the course of those 100 hours you would earn a total of 160% the rewards of someone running the easy content for the same amount of time, even if the first bit you’re making nothing.

I think that if content is designed with a steep learning curve, such that you can fail it dozens of times before completing it once, but that you can fairly quickly get it to about 100% success rate, then it should only have a large one time reward, a big prize to say ‘hey, you made it," but not something you could then farm infinitely. Liadri is a solid example of this, you get a title and a mini, but they weren’t so foolish as to have it produce a sellable, repeatable mini that people good at Liadri could farm Liadri for.

Now, if content is designed so that it’s always risky, so that even the most skilled guilds that “have it on farm” still fail half the time, then the rewards can account for that and be 50% or more higher than normal, but there should never be a state in which you are getting bonus rewards for something that you have made easy for yourself though practice.

So your suggestion is to make sure that hard content isn’t repeatable for rewards. Meaning people who want hard content unable to get any reward for replaying their content. While people who like easy content can spam “1” all day, every day, and still get rewarded. When people ask for hard content, they’re not just asking for the content. They’re asking for content that’s actually repeatable, without facing a dilemma as to whether or not they should be repeating it because despite being quite enjoyable, it doesn’t reward you. And given how little content ANET actually puts out, much less how virtually none of that content is hard content, it’s not like we’d ever regularly get enough hard content to keep us occupied and continually rewarded. What you really want is for people who like hard content to go ahead and do that content, but then be forced to go back to either getting virtually zero reward, or be forced to go back to doing easy content they don’t enjoy.

And at that, you think good rewards are a minipet that you can’t sell and a title. How’s this for an idea: replace all rewards from world bosses with a single, non-sellable minipet, and a title. No reward after that. You can still have your easy content fun! (Or are you only in it for the reward? Because that’s what ‘you’ keep accusing ‘us’ of, when we’re the ones actually doing thing that effectively don’t even HAVE a reward like level 50 uncategorized fractal champ solos, when for the most part you guys are chasing the most rewarding zero effort zerg farms).

Your whole post, especially that last paragraph, is saying that you don’t think demonstrating player skill should have better rewards than not demonstrating any player skill. In your mind, at best, it should have the same reward as afk-level-of-effort zerg farming. And for anyone who can’t complete the content at the success rate of the absolute most skilled players in the game, much less considering the time it takes to learn the content, it ought to be much less rewarding. Again, as I’ve pointed out in a few posts here now, it’s simply not possible to make easy and hard content equally rewarding. One will always carry greater rewards than the other in the long term. That could be easy content, or it could be hard content. If the former, you reward players for practically doing nothing but sitting through time gates while still at their computer, and comparatively punish people who engage difficult content in the hopes of improving themselves as a player. If the later, people who like braindead content still get the same reward, but people who have actually done things that could qualify as deserving better rewards (i.e. expanded themselves as a player via hard work) get those better rewards.

I am sure the point of how hard and easy content can’t have the same reward, and how wrong it is to have easy content that’s more rewarding is will be ignored yet again.

Focus is gem store and living story, since gem store is revenue, and living story is mediocre quality extreme low replayability type content in a game that’s starving for new highly replayable content, BUT living story gets people logging in more. The more people log in, the more likely they’re going to use that gem store!

This is a very long standing bug.

Their last attempt at a “fix” just made Detha build the traps differently, and seemed to make the chance of it bugging slightly worse, along with seemingly removing the ability to ‘reset’ her by getting her killed and then reviving. Good fix. Very good fix. Can’t wait for the next attempt!

ANET doesn’t actually fix these kinds of bugs. Mostly, they ignore the kitten out of them like they do with nearly all bugs. Sometimes they try and fix them, but it seems apparent they don’t even bother to test to see if their fix actually works, so it’s obviously not a priority.

My advice on path 2? Just don’t run it, like you wouldn’t run path 2 of SE because of the same kind of issue.

Beldin.5498:

Zui.9245:

Are you serious? That’s not “fair”. Hard content requires a lot of experimentation, trial, error, and most importantly repeated failure. If it takes 20 hours of failure before you can complete the content to get the same reward per unit time as someone who needs 0 hours to be able to spam “1” on a staff guardian in an open world zerg, that hard content is going to be less rewarding per unit time than the easy content.

Hey .. you had however 20 hours of pure great fun .. right ? Because that is why you
want hard content … because its so great fun for you .. isn’t it ??

Else .. if it is NOT fun .. why do you not just play the easy content ?

And that is also the mindset i’ve read soo often in forums of different MMOs.

A: We want harder content
B: you only want better rewards.
A: no .. i don’t care about rewards .. i just want the “challenge”
B: Ok .. here you have your challenging content with same rewards than normal
A: what the hell .. if i get the same rewards i can simply play the easy content again

If you had read the full post you responded to, you would understand how it is impossible to give equal rewards for both hard and easy content. It just can’t be done. One always ends up being more rewarding than the other.

A player is certainly capable of enjoying hard content, and enjoying things they can get in the game via in game rewards. For players who might shockingly enjoy both things, but not enjoy easy content, a dilemma exists when easy content is much more rewarding than hard content.

So you have the choice of either making hard content more rewarding, or easy content more rewarding, since it is simply not possible to make them equally rewarding per time spent. If you make hard content more rewarding, you reward people who have dedicated their time and effort to master content, and improved significantly as players in doing so. If you make easy content more rewarding, you’re sending the message that player skill isn’t even worthwhile to develop in this game, as it takes time and effort where you get very poor rewards, only to get a return of worse rewards than you’d get spamming “1” on a staff guardian in the open world.

Your entire attitude is basically complaining that some people want hard content and have the audacity to want rewards for it that aren’t subpar. Getting hard content is certainly nice, but getting hard content with atrocious rewards is a bit of a slap in the face. It’s saying that player skill simply is not valued. Imagine if the real world gave better rewards for lower quality/much less work; if getting D’s in school was much more valuable than A’s. It’s utterly ridiculous, because it creates a bunch of bad incentives and is not remotely fair. This is what you are arguing for.

Now, you could argue from the perspective of a player with low levels of skill who loves their easy content and loves their rewards (if you like your easy content so much, why should you care about the rewards anyway!? Does this make you realize how silly your argument actually is?), there also exists a dilemma if hard content is more rewarding than their easy content. This is definitely the case. They might be tempted to improve themselves as players to do hard content so they get better rewards. It would probably be absolutely awful to have to actually earn getting relatively better rewards, and that just sounds insanely unfair. Actually earning better rewards. Oh my, the insanity of it…

Wethospu.6437:

As crazy as this may sound, proper party controls could be the way to go. Like you could manually choose how many kicks are needed, whether you are immune, etc.

But this would require work.

Proper party controls? The insanity!

rfdarko.4639:

The closest I got on a ranger orb solo was about 900 away.

I was using max healing power, mango pies, etc. I had the the regen signet and the spirit of nature traited to follow me. I used guard to place the fern hound about half way along and traited for more pet healing power and heal on f1. I started off with a GS leap and used about-face/lightining reflexes. I also pre dropped 2 healing packs from the med kit comsumable a little past the fern hound.

That was all i could come up with not being a ranger main, but suffice to say it would be tedious and difficult to reproduce if its possible at all. Easiest method is to just re-roll norn.

~900 range away? Did you use a Medical Pack consumable to pre-drop some 1000 life heals? If not, that could possibly be enough to make it.

Beldin.5498:

NewTrain.7549:

Beldin.5498:

NewTrain.7549:

Fact is, more challenging content (that you wouldn’t be forced to do) would greatly increase the fun of the game for a large group of players and yet you’re against it because it’s not something you personally enjoy.

The real “fact” is that those that want “more challenging content” mostly just want stuff
that 95% of the playerbase will never have a chance to get, so that they can show off
how great they are.

And THAT is what i am against.

You’re confused on what actually constitutes a fact. Where is your proof that 95% of the people who advocate for harder content only want superior rewards. I want harder content because I find challenges to be fun. The reward can be on par with what’s currently offered and as long as it’s exciting and engaging I’ll keep playing. hence why I enjoy PvP (though not much in GW2) because of the variable challenge.

Oh common .. just read the forums .. read thos thread .. next post already :

hard content needs either greater, or different rewards, because it is harder.

And that in the end again says : (nearly) nobody wants harder content .. they just
want “exclusive” rewards that not everyone can get.
If they want hard content just because its soooo much fun, then they rewards only
need to be “fair” .. 1 hour hard content gets the same reward then 1 hour easy content
because the reward is doing the hard content instead of the lame boring easy stuff.

Are you serious? That’s not “fair”. Hard content requires a lot of experimentation, trial, error, and most importantly repeated failure. If it takes 20 hours of failure before you can complete the content to get the same reward per unit time as someone who needs 0 hours to be able to spam “1” on a staff guardian in an open world zerg, that hard content is going to be less rewarding per unit time than the easy content. If it’s hard enough, even, you won’t have a 100% success rate even after you’ve more or less figured it out, making it even less rewarding (unless you think the rewards can control for the varying success rates of teams? If this is the case, please propose such a system.).

If you want fair rewards, hard content needs to have a greater reward per unit time for successful completion, compared to easy content. That greater reward needs to be significantly enough higher to account for “time to master”, and also the fact that failure will still occasionally happen after mastery. Are the people doing the hard content probably going to get more reward per time than the people doing easy content, when it comes to a long run average? You bet. But at least they’ve earned it. In the opposite case, people who didn’t do anything but put some time in grinding easy content actually get better rewards than people who put the same amount of time in doing hard stuff. Perhaps they’re both unfair in your view, but harder content having better rewards is still less unfair. Anything else and you’re explicitly saying that mindless grind is greater than skill, and developing skill is something that players ought NOT to do.

As far as I am aware, GW1 was marketed with a skill>grind philosophy, and ANET made basically the same promise when it came to GW2. They obviously haven’t done a good job at keeping it, but that’s not a reason for them not to at least try.

Draknar.5748:

And especially hard for color blind people who lose the normal cursor pretty much all of the time because of all of the particle effects, let alone the targeting circle. At least I assume it is only colorblind people (I’m colorblind), but regular people might be losing the cursors as well.

It’s hands-down one of my biggest issues with this game— the darn cursor. AOE on target would eliminate one of the needs to see the cursor.

Not just the colorblind. Try using YOLOmouse.

Astral Projections.7320:

Torsailr.8456:

Yeah, I’ve done all 3 of those before the september patch. It does look like the changed the Tolona one though.

I’m afraid your memory is faulty here. I’ve done map completion on those areas at least 9 times and those are new hearts that were added in the September patch. There was no heart at the cattle pen, the Skritt cannon area or the Sylvari termite worm heart before this.

They were hearts in beta, that apparently just didn’t make the cut for the release of the game, as they were removed along with ~300 other beta hearts prior to release. They’re now magically good enough for the real game. Or something.

You’ve made many excellent points. To summarize a bit, and emphasize (and add on to) some points…

1) The reward structure for achievement chests is poorly designed. It’s not all that rewarding, not progressively rewarding even though as you get more and more AP it gets harder and harder to get more AP, and just generally locks some stuff out at unrealistic levels.

2) Many achievements are very poorly designed/implemented. Giant slayer? You have to be kidding. Most of the WvW achieves? Even more of a joke.

3) It seems you’re mostly a PvE player. Imagine how it must feel for mostly WvW and/or sPvP players who also might like to some day get the cool AP-related skins, but who simply are not rewarded (i.e. very poorly rewarded) for playing their game mode in terms of AP, and also don’t really get anything really cool or interesting for what you might consider their own version of AP (WvW rank; sPvP rank), and certainly not anything prestigious like the AP armor skins.

Various respawning mobs (and some non-respawning ones), generally inside PS/LS, have a ‘do not drop loot’ flag. When you kill them, nothing happens. No on kill effects will trigger, including renewed justice.

This just adds more challenge, and makes the game more interesting, though (/s)! It’s like reflects. If it’s a projectile, you really should have to ask yourself ‘can I reflect this? Can I block this?’, because things consistently and reliably working as the game describes they ought to work is just silly, and apparently not a concern for ANET.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Just a suggestion…if you are holding both keys down all the time, why not just set the options to show ally names, enemy names or both without the need of a key press?

There are times you might want these things, and times you might want them off. There is no toggle functionality other than holding down the keys, unfortunately.

Furthermore, holding the show enemy names key has different functionality than the show enemy names checkbox. The key will show the names of neutral items. The checkbox will not.

If they’re participating in WvW objectives or attacking allies, they’re fair game. Otherwise, if they’re obviously just there for map completion, I ignore them. Requiring WvW for map completion is a kittenty thing ANET did, and something they didn’t even do with genuine PvE zones that probably should be required, like dungeons, because apparently map completing a dungeon is kittentier than trying to map complete when enemy players are trying to kill you or something.

This has been known for awhile.

Have an utterly pointless WvW matchup you can’t possibly win, and that isn’t even fun? Well, don’t go to EotM. You’re probably blue or red. Which means you’re just going to get destroyed by green because you’re horribly outnumbered. Again.

First, I think if we get a bag reward track, it should award a 20-slot bag. Make it account bound if you really must. Whatever. This bag should be awarded in a box, that lets us select the type of bag we get (i.e. invisible, oiled, normal, etc.).

Second, as it currently stands, the rewards from PvP reward tracks are almost all second-tier compared to playing PvE in terms of rewards per time, and it gets worse when we consider skill per time. Dragonite Ore from PvP is much lower than near-afking some world bosses. Gold earned per time is also quite bad, accounting for item values. The loot is mostly trash—mind you, the loot in regular PvE is also mostly trash, but you get a lot more of it. Tomes of Knowledge, Trasmutation Charges, the Balthazar Backpack and Glorious Armor are the only “good” PvP rewards as it currently stands.

Personally, I’d at least like to see a lot more dragonite ore from all the tracks. Make it equivalent in dragonite per time to world boss training. I wouldn’t be leaving PvP to go hit up Jormag or something if this were the case. I’d like to see a lot more gold per time reward as well, whether it comes in actual coin or in loot value; maybe make it equivalent to the average haul per time for some trivially easy PvE farming (like say, SE P1 no tazza champ box farming with a non-kittened group… which nets ~10 gold per hour pretty easily once skill point to gold conversion is factored in). I’d never complain about a tome of knowledge acquisition rate that’s about as good as leveling from casual speedruns of explorable dungeons with a character swap at the end, or just zerging in EotM, too.

The idea behind PvP reward tracks is pretty good. The way they work is pretty good. The rewards themselves, in comparison to other game modes which require vastly less skill and attention, is fairly mediocre, even if we just look at it from a rewards per time spent perspective. This isn’t unique to sPvP even (fractals being the most obvious example, and there’s the imbalance among dungeon paths, etc.), but the common case is that even if the content that has crappy rewards is great and people like it, they often also like properly gearing their characters and/or quickly leveling alts and/or getting cool skins etc. too, and not playing the game full-time like a job, they often have to pick between the options, or at least spend less time on content they’d rather do because the rewards are comparatively worse.

You have less PvPers than you would if the rewards were at least equivalent with PvE for the time spent. Heck, since people have divergent goals and stuff, how about custom (within various bounds) reward tracks? For example, if someone doesn’t want that transmutation charge, they can say hey, I’d rather have a tome of knowledge instead, or 100 dragonite ore, or whatever.

Alilinke.7690:

why don’t you just play as a team member and stealth the rest of your group? -_-

You’re assuming this is possible with a PUG.

They need to follow the thief. They need to not attack while in stealth. They need to not prematurely exit Shadow Refuge. They need to be close enough to smoke fields to get stealth each time they’re blasted (i.e. not run up late, or run away early) and/or help blast the field themselves.

This is well beyond the abilities of many PUGs.

Quick Mouse.7635:

If they want to call accessing your bank through the registrar a bug, fine. But put a bank somewhere in wvw. It’s unacceptable that you have to leave wvw to access your bank. Especially if there is a queue.

Just Gems → Gold and buy a permanent banker! I’m sure ANET would like that.

Goat, you need to understand the motivations of both sellers and buyers, and consider how easy it is to find a normal group via LFG.

Some people sell exclusively for the money. Many though, I’d say, are doing it partially for the fun of soloing, with the gold being an added benefit (this is about the epitome of GW2 rewarding player skill right here! Some of us like being rewarded for demonstrating player skill!). With how long it takes for some runs to fully sell (or they don’t even fully sell), I’m actually pretty sure that mindlessly farming SE P1 without the last boss for the champion bags is only slightly worse in terms of gold:time, except that SE P1 is insanely easy and takes practically no time to learn, whereas soloing a dungeon path in a respectable time takes considerably longer and is much harder.

Many people who buy paths are doing it because the groups they found couldn’t complete the path. And they want the AP/title from dungeon master, but would never run the dungeon themselves (in some cases, never run ANY dungeon otherwise). Or they want the tokens to unlock skins. They don’t value running the dungeon enough to actually run it. They value other things. These are the people who either run the dungeon once ever for DM, or just say the skins aren’t worth their many runs and forget about it; at best, they stop running once they’ve unlocked what they want, and never run it again. These aren’t the people who will regularly join LFG groups for long periods of time.

Also, let’s be honest here, how long does it take an LFG for any Arah path PUG to fill? I think the longest I’ve ever waited was about 5 minutes. There isn’t a lack of people doing the dungeon. Anyone who bothers to post their own LFG can almost certainly find people. If LFG for PUGs was very slow, or almost never worked, your argument may have merit. It does not. And it demonstrably does not.

Your rebuttal to the elder wood comment makes me think you’re just trolling, but in the case you’re not,you can go solo your own dungeon path too. You’ll just need to make the same type of investment people who currently solo that path made. Lots of time, effort, and repeated failure.

Bertrand.3057:

I do wonder if there is any number you can find that will strike the right balance across all servers and all times. Making it so that 5 or 10 people can go around dismantling siege will create problems. With a higher number, then it’s a real distraction for a server if the griefer decides to mass their siege in an inconvenient location. I hope you can do a good job of accounting for all the different roles in WvW and thinking about how the player experience will change for each of these roles once a candidate situation is implemented.

Anyways, I have to hand you my compliments for catching the idea of making build sites have a smaller footprint, I didn’t see that myself while reading the thread but I like it!

They could definitely adjust the votes needed based on area population (a circle of some radius around the target siege) and/or map population. To keep it from being confusing, when using the siege, there could be some text in the top right of the screen (ANET’s favorite place!) with “Votes to Dismantle: n out of N” where n is the number of votes already garnered, and N is the total number of votes needed.

Furthermore, I would expect that they could have a sort of “frequent exhaustion” mechanic that trolls could trigger, barring them for much longer periods. There’d be a lot of ways to do this, and the key would be to use variables and thresholds for those variables that couldn’t possibly be triggered by anyone else. Say, if you’ve placed more than 200 siege weapons in a match, and greater than 95% of them have been voted down, you can’t place any more siege for the duration of the match. Could even have an additional variable of ‘fraction of supply to build siege that siege owner contributed’, to make it extremely unlikely to impact a really lazy commander who never votes down their own siege, since the for the most part, trolls are lone actors. This might require some additional logging than they currently do, though.

The key is finding variables and numbers for those variables that will work, and having some way to present the ‘end result’ of whatever criteria are used to players so that players don’t necessarily need to understand the mechanics in detail to understand what’s happening (just like you don’t need to understand the formula for precision to crit chance to equip gear with more precision and see your crit chance go up, for example).

Obviously, no matter what system you have in place, you’re not going to entirely stop trolls. At best, you can curtail the current trolling activities, and cause them to troll with different behavior. How about placing useful siege backwards, and voting it down once an attack starts? How about voting down useful siege in currently deserted areas or maps (if votes needed scales with number of players on the map or in the area)? How about taking golems and ‘losing’ them in an obscure corner of the map so they eventually despawn?

There can be further solutions to some of these problems, even. Trolls placing useful siege and down-voting it before an attack could (barring unforeseen issues) be solved with allowing players to override an owner vote, or with not allowing an owner to vote dismantle when a structure is under attack, or any number of other solutions.

The question is, does the system reduce the effectiveness of the troll enough that they won’t bother, or at least that they will lose considerable effectiveness, without harming legitimate players? I’d say the current proposal from ANET, with the obvious numbers/mechanic tweaking, is better than what we have now. It’s much better if there’s a ‘frequent exhaustion’ mechanic, and even better still if it proactively addresses possible new troll behaviors (place useful siege, dismantle by vote when it is needed; place siege backwards). Whatever they implement does not need to be perfect, only good enough to be a significant improvement on what we have now.

Branden Gee.2150:

Huh, I can see how it would be frustrating for it to restart the spinning. Perhaps there is a happy middle ground where it starts out spinning then once you move the camera it stops.

This sounds fantastic. Anyone who likes the death camera still gets to enjoy it. Anyone who wants to reposition their camera to see can without issue.

On a related note, I know that FoV/zoom do change a little bit when you normally die. If you’re in a boss battle, however, where you’re granted better FoV/zoom for the duration of the battle and you die, you’ve now got drastically less visibility while you’re out of the fight! Is it possible to scale the post-death max zoom and FoV based off of the pre-death max zoom and FoV?

For the issues of siege caps, area siege caps, and draining supply, there are two possible generic lines of solution. One is to limit siege placement, and one is to limit supply spending. I think limiting siege placement is not palatable, given that commanders ought to be placing siege; they have supply info that no one else does, and they are directing things and thus have an idea as to timetables, other constraints, etc. However, I think that limiting the rate at which supply can be spent can be done in a way to discourage trolls, minimize their impact, and not seriously effect legitimate play.

Apply your exhaustion mechanic (with some tweaks I’ll get to) to taking supply from unique supply sources. Reset any exhaustion for a unique source when that supply is used to repair the structure (i.e. defenders repairing a gate effectively ignore the mechanic). I would suggest that the mechanic be per supply taken (given sources can be upgraded to give more supply, and there’s also the ability that allows you to take more supply) and per supply spent, so that a troll couldn’t spend 1 supply out of the 15 they took to repair a gate, and then 14 on a useless flame ram, and repeat ad infinitum.

In practice, this would make the troll run all over the map to build their troll siege, taking supply from many sources. This solves the issue of trolls draining supply at critical locations that need to retain that supply. It also makes trolling very inefficient time-wise for the effect it will have, and opens the troll up to being attacked by players on other servers as they run. It will take much longer to reach siege caps. Furthermore, the damage any troll can do will scale with how much stuff you own. If you’re not doing so well, their maximum potential damage is significantly minimized.

It won’t impact smaller roaming groups that may want to use supply every so often. These groups are all over the map anyway. It won’t impact defenders so much, as although they will build siege slower if there are low numbers of them, that defensive siege can simply be built by a larger zerg shortly after taking the objective. It won’t impact larger zergs much either, since they have a large supply capacity given their numbers, and they will presumably also be bouncing around at least a little bit.

As for trolling by placing siege on top of other siege, preventing useful siege from being easily built or trolling others into wasting supply on that useless siege, I would suggest that this is largely an issue with the allied/neutral targeting system and the nature of interact, which many players have been complaining about for a very long time. Perhaps this issue could be fixed? I know players in most game modes would appreciate it if you could find a way to do this. I would suggest that if you’re only going to target this particular issue though, you place clickable nametag (when moused over, have it do something to let players know that one will be selected) for each unbuilt siege weapon, to allow us to target specific weapons. The nametags shouldn’t stack on top of each other, even multiple unfinished siege weapons are stacked in that spot. Perhaps that’s an easier fix? Perhaps even one that can be carried over to other game areas? Give neutral items a permanent nametage/name box, have it highlight/fill in when moused over, and if one clicks on it, have it become selected as the target to interact with. This could even be done with downed/defeated allies, too. (It’s really quite awful when you’re in a dungeon and there’s the dungeon NPC, a neutral item you don’t want to pick up (say a banner), a downed/defeated ally, and a conjure weapon. Which one do you want to target/interact with? Well, good luck, because you’ll likely need it. This kind of feature would definitely improve the playability of the game, in an admittedly minor area that’s a bit lacking at the moment)