people complain about thieves being OP because they don’t know how to dodge. Dodge the heartseeker / cloak and dagger, or dodge out of the dagger storm, and suddenly you’re fighting a character that can’t do jack to you because they’re out of initiative.
Unfortunately it seems most people in PVP/WvW don’t know how to dodge.
While that sounds really easy, I was HS-d on my ranger when I used 2 dodges and a shorbow evade in succession. The guy was running a glass build, and I was below half health, so that was it for me. Sounds fair right? Just mash that 2 to win.
if u lost to a 2 masher…then just quit…..ull never be good at this game. i mean unless ur an EXTREMELY new player…….. no reason for 2 mashers to win…EVER.
I agree with you that there is no reason for a 2 masher to win. Just like there is no reason for hearseeker to be spammable at least 4 times. I’ll let your snarky comments slip, as your one of many thieves that is just as annoying on the forums as in game. Pinny gave bad suggestions that will result in more qq. How about addressing that.
Sorry, but you are bad. Last time i died to a “2” masher was like 10 months ago. And i see HS spammers very, very rarely, because even bad thieves understood how bad this strategy is. I met one HSer in spvp last week, dodged 2 times, used shadow step and laughed at him while stomping.
Of course I’m a bad player, of course… of course…
But maybe I used everyhing that was off cooldown and just died to a heartseeker noob because heartseeker is unbalanced?!
I am glad you honored us with your presence that gave me the opportunity to bathe in your infinite wisdom. I learned so much from you today. Btw, rangers don’t have teleports.
people complain about thieves being OP because they don’t know how to dodge. Dodge the heartseeker / cloak and dagger, or dodge out of the dagger storm, and suddenly you’re fighting a character that can’t do jack to you because they’re out of initiative.
Unfortunately it seems most people in PVP/WvW don’t know how to dodge.
While that sounds really easy, I was HS-d on my ranger when I used 2 dodges and a shorbow evade in succession. The guy was running a glass build, and I was below half health, so that was it for me. Sounds fair right? Just mash that 2 to win.
Assuming a 25/30/0/0/15 thief…. Channeling CnD before hand, stealing his initiative will be at 12….3 HS’s dodged means he has 3 initiative left, maybe 4. On his 4th attack, why not interrupt it with your Concussion Shot? All his initiative will be wasted then… If he somehow has more coming, switch weapons? Assuming your not running Axe/Axe, Axe/Warhorn, or Axe/Torch you have some form of dodge or CC to interrupt him. If you are running one of those three, maybe put a Sigil of Energy for another dodge?
Of couese you are right. What I wanted to show with my post is that I have to use practically all my panic buttons against someone who is just mashing 2. I won’t buy a sigil of energy because of bad design. And heartseeker being spammable is bad design imho.
people complain about thieves being OP because they don’t know how to dodge. Dodge the heartseeker / cloak and dagger, or dodge out of the dagger storm, and suddenly you’re fighting a character that can’t do jack to you because they’re out of initiative.
Unfortunately it seems most people in PVP/WvW don’t know how to dodge.
While that sounds really easy, I was HS-d on my ranger when I used 2 dodges and a shorbow evade in succession. The guy was running a glass build, and I was below half health, so that was it for me. Sounds fair right? Just mash that 2 to win.
if u lost to a 2 masher…then just quit…..ull never be good at this game. i mean unless ur an EXTREMELY new player…….. no reason for 2 mashers to win…EVER.
I agree with you that there is no reason for a 2 masher to win. Just like there is no reason for hearseeker to be spammable at least 4 times. I’ll let your snarky comments slip, as your one of many thieves that is just as annoying on the forums as in game. Pinny gave bad suggestions that will result in more qq. How about addressing that.
Sounds like you are being interrupted/stunned/dazed. Raptors do that for example, and they do that in a chain, so its 2-3 dazes if you stand in their screatch.
people complain about thieves being OP because they don’t know how to dodge. Dodge the heartseeker / cloak and dagger, or dodge out of the dagger storm, and suddenly you’re fighting a character that can’t do jack to you because they’re out of initiative.
Unfortunately it seems most people in PVP/WvW don’t know how to dodge.
While that sounds really easy, I was HS-d on my ranger when I used 2 dodges and a shorbow evade in succession. The guy was running a glass build, and I was below half health, so that was it for me. Sounds fair right? Just mash that 2 to win.
stealth having issue lately, expecially with cnd, and other stealth skills. On your screen the icon says you are stealth, however, your person is not stealth at all and the enemy can still see you also. Please check up on this and fix it…
I’ve been seeing this as well, but if you have the buff you are invisible. I think its just the visual effect of your char being seethrough being applied with a delay.
For leveling I would go for full power, or full condition damage. If you go power, take longbow, and greatsword or sword+dagger/warhorn. If you go condition, go with axe/torch, sword/dagger or shortbow. Get a bear, canine, devourer to tank for you, some say drakes are also good. What your pet can’t facetank, most probably you wont either. 5 points in wilderness survival is really nice for the endurance regen. I wouldn’t put 5 points into Beastmaster trait line as in some recent patch the quickness on petswap got changed. I’d go 5 into nature magic instead. The rest you can use as you see fit.
Since there is no difficulty setting in this game.
Ranger is suppose to be hard mode.
Depends on the build. I wouldn’t say that a BM Bunker is easy to play, but you get a lot of survivability which makes room left for errors. I also wanted to think that ranger is hard mode, but only in builds that aren’t borderline op. And other classes have those as well.
That link only has ~four PvE builds, and none of them are particularly focused on pet … which is what OP specifically asked about. Try again.
This. And for the record, I have looked at that thread already.
Well based on what you wrote in your first post, I’m not sure there is a build like that. That focuses on soloing content, being viably in group setting (I presume you mean support) and focusing on pet as well. Its like saying I want a main hand weapon that scales really well with power, has good auto attack damage, has lots of evades, mobility and applies a lot of conditions as well. Try to be a bit more specific. Like what pets you want, what weapons you want, do you want condi damage, or power? What gear are you using that would result in 3.5k hp loss if you switched to full glass cannon.
I am in EU as well, and have been kicked from groups on my ranger on more than one occasion. Stupidity doesn’t care for race, country, religion, gender or profession. Its pretty tolerant to be honest.
I personally like the armor you buy in WvW with badges (minus helmet). I dye with Midnight Ice + Blood dyes and use those fiery gauntlets you get from the achievements chest.
The Whispers armor is also pretty rad in white IMO…
I noticed this some weeks ago and also today: When I play Thief in WvW, none of my armor is being damaged after dying and respawning.
This occured only with this class so far, and also multiple times. Couldn’t find out what triggers it, though (stealth/no stealth/shadowsteps/steal…?).
Did you have the outmanned buff? That has been changed a few patches back so you don’t get gear damage when you have it.
I ran a trapper build with greatsword recently, it felt so nice to get in their face with it. I found that most mesmers love to hide behind their clones, which makes them a problem for ranged rangers. You could also use the terrain to let the phantasms/clones run up and down hills. Did that on my thief, having lots of shadowsteps sure helps, but mesmers also seem problematic for thieves. I hate mesmers… grrrr.
Here’s my asura as well, although he’s a thief. The gear is outlaw upper with leather gloves, rawhide leggings, anonimity hood. The dyes are midnight fire and stone, and antique gold for the belt buckle and the hood thingy.
My charr is wearing duelist upper and gloves, thief starting hood, shoulders hidden. Leggings and boots are badge skins for 10 and 5 I think. The dye is “slick oil”, gives a nice leathery look I think. Not sure how it would look on hoomins or an asura though.
Looks nice, but as you are using rabid gear you don’t get that much out of the vulnerability, maybe your pet does. Pet bleed ticks for around 48 ea if you don’t trait for it. However if you would take companions might, and/or RaO your kitty goes boom. I ran my rabid gear in wvw with a/t sb Lynx, and similar trait setup. It does stack a lot of bleed for sure. The question is whether LB gets better survivability with Hunter’s shot now, compared to the shortbow evade.
As for Remorseless, it will best work with valkyrie gear for the guaranteed crit from stealth.
GENERAL SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT——-
If you haven’t been listening to Guang you are missing out. That dude has always been ahead of the power curve when it comes to understanding professions and squeezing the most damage out of them.
Maybe he was ahead of the power curve, you can’t tell really. But it doesn’t take a genious to see that spotter and frost spirit add damage to the team, just sayin’. The reason why less people were running them was that previously both spirits and pets had less health, and were dead on arrival. Its a nice vid, but don’t think it will change things much. If you had some guildies/friends to take you as a ranger, it changes nothing to them. If you run in a pug, this changes nothing there either IMHO.
Also I like how people say long bow burst is gone, and then in the same post mention that rapid fire takes too long to channel to be considered burst. Wut?
The ranger was brought for the spotter trait (150 precision), and frost spirit (+10% damage). And apperantly the sword auto attack did good damage as well.
Assuming a ranger would stay in stealth for the full duration of stealth and with the -20% CD reduction on weapon, over 30 sec the stealth uptime is roughly 40%.
Actually, its 31.5789% of uptime if traited. They have to go a long way to get something out of this (30 points in MM, giving up signet actives on the ranger), which is 5 stacks of vulnerability, and a guaranteed crit (which doesn’t work yet).
Isn’t quick draw (20% cd reduction) a master trait (20 points) in Skirmishing (not 30 points in MM)?
What I meant was, Hunter’s shot resetting opening strike, and always critting, as I was thinkig about this like a damage increasing mechanic. Probably most people will just use it to drop perssure. Yeah Quickdraw is 20 points into skirmishing.
EDIT: I haven’t been able to test if your pet also gets opening strike when you come off of stealth, the heavy golems tend to die before I have a chance to set up a second volley. Anyone know for sure?
I checked this, the pet doesn’t reset the opening strike. Although I didn’t test it with Jag stealth or guard.
EDIT: no, it doesn’t reset for the pet. Actually it only speaks of the ranger in the tooltip.
Point Blank Shot -> Rapid Fire -> Hunter’s Shot -> reposition -> repeat
Don’t forget that PBS got a buff also.
Indeed! Sounds fun! I was (ab)using PBS in stealth to slap people around without knowing where the hit will be coming from. I’m going to give this a whirl too, keeping melee in a loop stuck forever trying to reach you sounds hilarious
I don’t know how to say it to you, so I’ll just say it… stability.
I’ve spent a very short time with the longbow fighting in PvE.
The stealth isn’t really that great, for stealth. The sole purpose for it is to force people to drop you as their target. Which is very powerful and it’s what bothers me the most about stealth. We get it every 12 (or 10) seconds, which is powerful and annoying for opposing players. Especially since the actual stealth will only last a split second most of the time with the Ranger having barely moved, but the target will still have been dropped.
So here is what I expect will happen:
- stealth will get nerfed. It will no longer force a target drop. Instead, target skills will simply become unguided. Maybe the portrait of the target will turn grey instead.
- the nerf will make hunter’s shot useless, because the target drop is the only useful thing about it.
- this will give mixed reactions. Longbow will be bad again, but at least stealth will finally be fixed and it’ll be sort of worth it.
Sure, ANet will rework how stealth works, because we have 1 weapon skill that applies it.
Assuming a ranger would stay in stealth for the full duration of stealth and with the -20% CD reduction on weapon, over 30 sec the stealth uptime is roughly 40%.
Actually, its 31.5789% of uptime if traited. They have to go a long way to get something out of this (30 points in MM, giving up signet actives on the ranger), which is 5 stacks of vulnerability, and a guaranteed crit (which doesn’t work yet).
I honestly don’t see the point of giving stealth to Hunter’s Shot. IMO, it would be perfect for the shortbow after the range nerf, but the longbow is meant to be used at very long range, where it’s easier to avoid ranged attacks, and it already has a counter against melee attacks in Point Blank Shot.
I’ve been trying to point this out but people keep shouting me down otherwise.
It’s a longbow. You should be at quite a bit of range. We basically lost DPS for slight utility that honestly doesn’t even do that much good. I’m aware you can stealth+rez but you will not get the rez off in time and the dps loss IS NOT WORTH IT.
There is no such thing as being at quite a bit of range. Things run at you, and no matter how good you are at mobility they will catch you. Stealth helps give you breathing room.
That’s why you’re supposed to kite and keep moving about. If you’re getting caught while using a bow then you’re bad. As harsh as it sounds, it’s the truth. Ask any good ranger or player that.
Wow, i didn’t read this. Ranger Arcade, if you ever played PvP and you think you can “not get caught while using a bow”, you are way better than I, or any other rangers, will ever be. It is foolish to think you can actually not get caught. And if you ask me (yes, I am a Great Ranger), it is not the truth and it is very harsh thing to say. You posted earlier people were shouting you down. It seems to me that you are the attacker, not the attacked. Reconsider your logic.
I can totally see how someone running cc pets cen get at least 6 2k long range shots off before having to switch to melee. Thats probably what he meant with kiting. If your opponent is a warrior with reduced cc duration and stability on first stun/kd, yeah, good luck with that. But not everyone runs a build like that.
What I don’t understand is if longbow had(comparatively) garbage DPS before, how does losing some more and gaining some interesting utility change that?
As for the vulnerability loss from moving it to Rapid Fire, on the upside, it prevent wasting the whole skill to an Aegis if it’s spread out on multiple hits.
For greatsword. Who actually ran it and used Maul for the bleeds? Maul was supposed to be used as a spike move with its decent power coefficient. The bleeds were just icing on the cake.
I did. I ran a trapper and in recent times I used a/t gs with geomancy in both sets. Swoop in, hiltbash, maul, weaponswap, spike trap, flame trap, splitblade, thorw torch. When I had my lynx with rending attacks, it was even sweeter. I tried GS because I was experimenting with running a trap build without trap traits. It worked fine in wvw. Trappers throwing traps can be kited to death by ranged builds, and mesmers gave me a lot of problems as long as I can remember. I managed to surprise some mesmers with that. But its gone now. I’m not happy for it. The people that ran maul for spike damage won’t benefit from this change. 3% more damage after maul is pretty low tbh. On a 12k maul its 360 damage if your next attack is 12k at all. Compared to that a direct damage build lost about 1k damage from the bleeds, a condi build lost 2k (with base duration). Say you hit 2k attacks after maul. Untill your next maul you hit 2 auto attack chains that hit 2k each, thats 2k*3%*6=360.
Just tested, seems like you will stealth once the shot passes through your target and hits either the wall/floor.
Wait, wut?
You can stealth off the doors!? That would be so useful for running into a keep that’s being seiged.
Arrows dont pass through doors, you can’t stealth off walls/doors/ceilings/plants/gates/fences/lamps/poles/ramps/trees etc. Target as in an opposing player or mob.
I just tried it out in wvw, you can stealth off enemy walls/gates.
However, like Prysing said, 100% crit doesn’t reset. Either it has an internal cooldown, or its a bug. Hopefuly the latter, than it will be fixed eventually.
Has anyboody tried Hunter’s shot with piercing arrows yet? I can imagine that giving you stealth with the first hit and then as it passes through and hits something else giving you revealed (and wasting your opening strike probably).
I tested it on raptors in wvw, hit both of them, didn’t get revealed.
I’m confused… what? Are you saying that you used Hunter Shot’s new stealth effect at a range of 1800? Are you mad? Keep that for close range so you can run away.
Did some testing on Hunter’s shot, you need to hit with it to apply stealth. Blocking it will put it on CD and not apply the stealth. If you’re in stealth though bocking will not give you revealed.
Hate to be a naysayer, but I for one cannot join in with the general enthusiasm.
The change to Maul (vuln instead of bleed) is horrible and makes the greatsword, which was a fun weapon for PVE dungeon content, into a piece of lackluster trash.
The only way to get at least some use out of it now with a crit/con build, is via the odd bleed chance on crit, and that simply does not make it worth while, given the terrible damage it does with all its skills.
Loved running a ranger thus far, but will definitely be dropping the ranger now, which is sad, because I really had lots of fun with it. :|
I was runing rabid with GS, so know what you mean. Not an option anymore really for condi builds, unless you take bleed on crit and sigil of earth. The cleave makes it prolly still good, but you can have geomancy sigil instead. :/
Put me in the group who likes this change. I’ve never been able to use stealth effectively in PvE, but Rangers in PvE already seemed OP to me. Boss fights now taking longer because of reduced vulnerability? Well okay, but speed runs are not my thing. Stealth capping a downed opponent… maybe I’m evil, but it always makes me smile when Shared Anguish and Hide in Plain Sight both proc during a guardian cap.
I really want to say this patch was good, and it definitely a step in the right direction. But Ranger is still inferior to other professions in PvE and dungeons.
Stealth is a get out of jail free card if you make a mistake or your pet brings the next dungeon room full of critters your way on accident. Never felt inferior on my ranger once geared. I solo’d a champion the other day I accidentally pulled, took a bit and it wasn’t a big boss, one of the ones over in Sunshore, not the queen.
Also, you still have the inv. on stun unless that has been changed, so basically we now can have two ways of going invisible.
Rapid Fire just needs a flat out increase in damage. It’s a 4.5 sec channel that does less damage than the autoattack at long range. For a 4.5 sec channel it’s also pretty bad damage compared to other channeled skills.
+1 I just hope they won’t realign long range shot to deal less then rapid fire.
Its now a 5% damage increase every 9.5 seconds (meaning permament 5% damage uptime), + more on kill. Signet of the wild is a 25% increase every 48seconds with signet trait (which will cost you either piercing arrows, eagle eye or 10% dmg), averaging out to 4.16% damage increase, not including whatever good damage trait you lost traiting for signet cooldowns.
Yeah pertty much this. It will open up the way for some pvt builds so they can have 1 guaranteed crit every 9.5-12 secs. We’ll see I guess. Beastmaster’s is also perry popular because of Signet of Stone. We have to make some choices now. Its a nice change.
Edit: Most thieves are still upset over losing 1200 range cluster bomb, though. Rangers that go for 1500 longbow range, will have a 600 range advantage.
As are rangers for losing range on all shortbow skills.
I can sympathize there. However, thieves are now the only class without a 1200 ranged attack (the traited 1500 steal doesn’t come close to counting). Thieves were promised a bit more mobility some time ago, but I haven’t seen enough to really counter the loss of our only 1200 range attack.
Edit: My opinion of course.
Some stange range setup across classes. Longbow is not 1200 on warrior, rifle is not 1200 on engineer, grenades can be thrown farther then any longbow can fire, or an axe or dagger can be thrown, greatsword on mesmer has 1200 range.
As for mobility, I think thieves have a few ways to get in someones face through shadowsteps and steal. Yeah the ranged options are a bit lackluster, as most of the ranged weapons seem to be for mid range. No offense but I can live with thieves not having the 1200 range option, seeing how powerful they are in melee.
Longbow is 1200 range base. Grandmaster trait eagle eye gives 300 extra range. Remorseless trait is also a grandmaster trait so if anything you will be seeing more longbow rangers with 1200 range since most will take remorseless now.
Eagle eye is not a grandmaster trait. So they can take both. But they have to choose between beastmasters signet, which is one way to kitten long range shot, and remorseless, which is another one. Some already say it will account for nothing, as most people run beastmaster’s signet for the damage increase on the signets to affect the ranger as well.
Oh good, the whole community whines about stealth, so they just start handing out a classes’s unique mechanic to every other profession. When does my thief get my shatter phantasms?
SOMEONE CALLED IT!! INCOMING QQ, TURN STARBOARD! STARBOARD! HEAT SEEKING TEARS HEADING IN MY DIRECTION!
Edit: Most thieves are still upset over losing 1200 range cluster bomb, though. Rangers that go for 1500 longbow range, will have a 600 range advantage.
As are rangers for losing range on all shortbow skills.
I have to admit, the new thief class called ranger is very welcoming for group wvw. Longbow, X/H, means perma stealth when paired with a thief, best blast finisher for combo starters, sprint, might, vigor + whatever the field was. 1800 range weapon, your choice of sword for evade, leap forward, backwards, axe for mid ranged debuffing. Plus a pet. Sweet.
Dont nerf the new Ranger Thieves.
And yet they cry about thieves…
You obviously didn’t play ranger if you think half of what folly dragon is saying is correct.
