Guild Wars 2

Taygus.4571:

There are no hearts to complete in WvW, these are easily what takes the most time in pve exploration.

However, a POI that requires capture can be infinitely harder than the hardest heart quest.

So the complaints so far are:

1. Anet did something that people appreciate and give positive feedback about;
2. Anet is a company that, like every other company in the world, tries to generate profit;
3. Anet set the price in a currency that can be converted from ingame gold (aka, free).

Ok.

But on topic: I love it.

Taygus.4571:

commander tags should be quiz based of some sort, to prove knowledge of the game.. instead they’re a gold sink.

Or to show you know how to use google.

The only reasonable thing to ask for regarding tags, if they really bother you and you can’t abstain, is a visibility toggle.

Players who don’t need it to cooperate can just ignore it.
Players who won’t partake in big events without tags won’t benefit from its removal either – they just won’t partake anymore.
Trolls will troll no matter what you do, the only solution being learning how to deal with it.

Tags are useful to maintain the group together as you move through a map. People flock to a tag because it means there’s something happening that requires cooperative effort and collective playing – this is how it’s supposed to work. A lot of times, that’s how I know something is even happening that I’d like to be a part of.

It’s intrumental to a lot of pre-events, no only to bring people from everywhere in the map to that event, but to let other people know that it’s being done. After all, some events require multiple groups at different locations and it’s nice to know that they are there and being lead.

If you’ve been in the community’s teamspeak when they do gold boss blitz runs in the pavillion, you’ll know that tagging up is very relevant and increases efficiency. Not saying it can’t be done without them, but it sure helps.

People who would rather play without tags already have an option: change overflow.

Most events are dynamic. While not as much as most people hoped for, they usually trigger other events according to if you failed or succeeded. This progression changes the area in which it occurs, sometimes contesting waypoints and making them unusable, or disabling NPCs until the area is cleared out/event is successful (e.g. harpy feathers, among other items or simply vendors). There are also examples of areas being accessible by doing an event, by a door that is now open or a bridge that you helped build. Some of these events are part of a very long chain (as happens in Orr) that can culminate in larger group events and bosses.

Heart quests are less different from traditional quests. While a progress bar is almost the same as a kill count (kill 10 rats), you can usually fill out that bar in different ways other than killing. Most of us opt for killing mobs since it adds loot to the quest. There’s situations, however, where it is much faster to collect something, water some plants, feed some rabbits, etc. Not only that, sometimes the objectives of a heart quest and a dynamic event overlap – killing a certain mob can contribute to both.
To me, it makes a huge difference that heart quests are triggered just by walking into an area. Talking to the NPC isn’t necessary to get the quest or to be rewarded for it, saving time and the boredom of walking back and forth unnecessarily.

WingLegacy.7159:

People were crying to remove champ train in Queensdale and FG. And now they got their wish people are complaining why is it remove….just amazing.

You understand that it’s different people, right?

1. Something that makes this game exactly like every other MMO out there;
2. Repetition of the sentence above;
3. Repetition of the sentence above;
4. Repetition of the sentence above;
5. Repetition of the sentence above;
6. Repetition of the sentence above;
7. Repetition of the sentence above;
8. Repetition of the sentence above;
9. Repetition of the sentence above;
10. The willpower to quit playing something I so actively dislike instead of systematically complaining about it.

In a more serious note, a more immersive and intensive story and definitely “male medium armor that’s not a trenchcoat”.

Evalia.7103:

zoejo.2317:

I think his explanation regarding the price as a consequence of the rarity of the ingredients involved made a lot of sense. Might not be true for all consumables, but certainly explains some cases.

Demand and rarity are two factors you have to consider, naturally. Because some ingredients are incredibly common, even good food can be cheap, and such is the case with event food made out of zhaitaffies(except for Dragon Revelry Starcake which has extremely limited recipe and requires a lot of ingredients)
… But why are we talking about this once again>? Do you not agree that all level 80 food should be somewhat equal in stat value gain, just like gear is?

If level 80 food is repeating the benefits from lower level food then there’s no point. If not, it’s cheaper (sometimes) options for people who rather save some money than max out their numbers.

Evalia.7103:

OldSomalia.6180:

They’re trash so you can pay 50 copper or 1 or 2 silver for a moderate buff rather than 12 to 15 silver for the non-welfare version/similar type of food.

Just go TP the ones you think are crap, then TP the ones that aren’t.

Some of the crap ones might be expensive anomalies due to whatever special ingredient to cook them.

It’s pretty straightforward.

Is that why the food that is quite straightforwardly better costs 8 times less(2.5 silver for Koi Cake as opposed to 20 for truffle burger)? Your explanation has zero sense whatsoever.

I think his explanation regarding the price as a consequence of the rarity of the ingredients involved made a lot of sense. Might not be true for all consumables, but certainly explains some cases.

calyx.9086:

zoejo.2317:

calyx.9086:

Dusty Moon.4382:

No and No. People are complaining that the game is getting Elitist and this would only make it worse.

It’s only becoming more elitist because most of the GW2 population consists of kitten poor players wearing PVT and Clerics who whine over and over about how they are just playing how they want aka playing like crap.

…he says, proving Dusty Moon’s point.

I wasn’t arguing that there are not plenty of elitists in this game when it comes to some content, of course there are. And there always will be in a game where people like to expound on the fact that it’s ok to be a subpar player because they are just playing how they want.

Honestly, I could care less what builds or professions or skills people use, as long as it’s not in my group, and I don’t see why some people are so offended by that. No one is forced to play with anyone else, it’s very easy to form groups to enjoy content the way you want to enjoy it.

Nothing’s wrong with being picky about your group. Saying elitism is caused by players being poor, bundling them all under “whining” and assuming all other playstyles that don’t fit your party are “crap”, that’s pretty elitist.

If elitism is caused by players being poor, is racism caused by people being non-white?
The only thing that causes elitism (or any other attitude) is players chosing to be that way.

If you had bothered to search the forum first, you’d see how these have been discussed heavily and very solidly shown that they are terrible ideas (namely the DPS meter).

bri.2359:

TxS did Boss Blitz for the first time last evening.

We spread guildies over 3 different CP maps and the group I was with managed 5 gold runs and 2 bronze runs. The bronze runs were due the event already in progress when we joined 2 different maps.

We will probably do this quite a few times more as the 40 odd champs bags were pretty decent for the time/effort spent.

So there is “pretty decent” loot, if you organize and plan it right. People should be happy, no? Achievs, some loot, challenging, and not mindless zerging – Isn’t this what everyone asked for?

Scrambles.2604:

Vesuvius.9874:

Scrambles.2604:

I guess i don’t understand the perspective of someone who finds joy in someone else’s misery.

I guess people are finding joy in the misery of those that made Queensdale miserable for the new players.

See, and i don’t understand that perspective. If you believe that, then you also have to believe that ALL the players running QD train were miserable towards new players.

Even the few times i did see volatility in map chat, it was only like 1 person.

Given that, you are celebrating the loss of those who were a majority of QD train runners, who were just regular players, and justifying it because a small percentage of the QD train runners were rude.

I guess it’s a very narrow perspective which is why i fail to see it myself.

Just because you fail to see something doesn’t mean it’s not there, and valid.
You saw it happen once, others saw it repeatedly. For every person that speaks in map chat, tons more have seen it. Some, if not most, new players. Even if they don’t say anything, they’re still exposed to toxicity between players (both sides) and that’s their first impression of the game’s community.

While I wasn’t in favor of just ending the train, I was in favor of doing something about the attitude that has been punished in whisper (insults, etc), so why not in other types of chat? It happened so that the solution chosen was to shutdown the train, but that’s hardly a problem for train runners: there’s plenty of other spots where you can keep this tradition alive. And hopefully they won’t generate so much hate in chat, or won’t be exactly where new players get their first impression of the game.

I like how you bring up bugs and ask “is this the content we’re going to get now?”
Yes, bugs are the intended content. They had a meeting where they showcased the bug-free version and decided to throw some bugs in there.

Be reasonable. I’m sure even you make mistakes from time to time, and probably on things far simpler than software development.

Scrambles.2604:

The only people that seem happy about the QD train nerf are people that didn’t run the train in the first place.

It makes me wonder about the state of the community when the vocal majority is celebrating the misfortune of others.

Or fortune of others. The issue wasn’t at all one sided.

Orr is a good example, but against the OP’s initial proposition. I mean, if the sudden rectangle of mountains is annoying, what do you call the “Something something strong currents, if you proceed you will be pulled back” pop up? I much prefer a mountain in my way.

So many people said that about Guild wars 2 every game so far when it launched.

This post, again?

Just stop playing it. If the things you point out are really a problem, Anet will lose players and re-thing their strategy. They haven’t, which might indicate they are not losing players.

Posts like these with no info on the game’s population and its increase/decreae, no info on the general satisfaction of the players (at leasts besides the vocal minority of the forum) are just personal opinions and generalizations based on absolutely no legitimate arguments – just personal rage and crying. And they’re as repetitive as the grinding they claim the game is about.

Saylu.8271:

zoejo.2317:

Saylu.8271:

zoejo.2317:

1. Two hours in one overflow isn’t representative of regular daily behaviour across the whole game. I’m glad some people never run into the aggressive behaviour in map chat, but just by reading this thread it’s obvious that a lot do.

2. Even ocasional insulting language is punished in a whisper. Why is it different in map chat? It’s the same CoC.

3. There are other places, but people should be able to chose where they play. Not to mention, fresh started human characters don’t have that option.

You have selective memory. Why only queendales? Ever been to a world boss event where people stay dead rather than waypoint and whole bunch of people not knowing what they are doing? People are shouting at them to waypoint because they are scaling the event and being useless. There is your community right there.

What is this ludicrous logic? People should be able to chose how they play, but zerg train are not allow? Hateful speeches and zerg train are separate issues.

Because QD is a starting area and the first experience of the community for many players. Also, because that’s what this thread is about.

Zerg trains are allowed and should remain in the game. It’s not the train that’s being asked to be dealt with – it’s the atitude of some players. Read the thread.

Hateful speeches should be punishable everywhere. Hence this thread. Hence QD.

Despite the tone of your message, you seem to agree with me and answer your own questions.

You are missing the point. Hateful speeches is the issue not QD train. You are asking Anet to remove QD train not the hateful speeches. I see nothing wrong with zerg train. This is where our opinion differ.

Again, read the thread. I haven’t asked for the removal of the train ever.
I see nothing wrong with trains either.

EDIT: I guess I can’t expect anyone to read 7 pages, I wouldn’t either.

Saylu.8271:

zoejo.2317:

1. Two hours in one overflow isn’t representative of regular daily behaviour across the whole game. I’m glad some people never run into the aggressive behaviour in map chat, but just by reading this thread it’s obvious that a lot do.

2. Even ocasional insulting language is punished in a whisper. Why is it different in map chat? It’s the same CoC.

3. There are other places, but people should be able to chose where they play. Not to mention, fresh started human characters don’t have that option.

You have selective memory. Why only queendales? Ever been to a world boss event where people stay dead rather than waypoint and whole bunch of people not knowing what they are doing? People are shouting at them to waypoint because they are scaling the event and being useless. There is your community right there.

What is this ludicrous logic? People should be able to chose how they play, but zerg train are not allow? Hateful speeches and zerg train are separate issues.

Because QD is a starting area and the first experience of the community for many players. Also, because that’s what this thread is about.

Zerg trains are allowed and should remain in the game. It’s not the train that’s being asked to be dealt with – it’s the atitude of some players. Read the thread.

Hateful speeches should be punishable everywhere. Hence this thread. Hence QD.

Despite the tone of your message, you seem to agree with me and answer your own questions.

1. Two hours in one overflow isn’t representative of regular daily behaviour across the whole game. I’m glad some people never run into the aggressive behaviour in map chat, but just by reading this thread it’s obvious that a lot do.

2. Even ocasional insulting language is punished in a whisper. Why is it different in map chat? It’s the same CoC.

3. There are other places, but people should be able to chose where they play. Not to mention, fresh started human characters don’t have that option.

You opened up a can of worms. Welcome to the forums, where everyone hates the game but still plays it.

My advice: get to the endgame and judge it yourself. I’ve been fully leveled and geared and still have a ton of fun ingame.

Lazuli.2098:

my husband, now X, was never interested in computer games

Love this bit.

Larynx.2453:

Azrael.4960:

Myst.5783:

“Their excrement is something like mulch.”

So, since they’re a plant, are they eating plants to produce mulch? in which case, isn’t that a form of cannibalism? Also, if they excrete mulch, could they just sit in the poop and re-absorb the nutrients from the mulch?

I might be looking too deeply into this

Is eating a cow cannibalism?
Can you eat your own poop to reabsorb the nutrients?

Think through what you just said. No, eating a cow is not cannibalism. Yes, you can eat your own poop, though it’ll be very nutrient-poor.

I don’t think you’re thinking deeply on this at all.

No, eating a cow is not cannibalism. Because I’m not a cow. If a cow eats a cow, then yes.
His question was regarding Sylvari eating plants. Since sylvari are plants… his point is valid. I think..

bluestocking.6148:

MeanPi.6025:

Jia, you’re old. Fidonet. 300 baud or 1200 baud for the rich. Local BBS’ in your area code.

True confession: I didn’t break up with my boyfriend in high school, because he was loaning me his 2400 baud modem and I didn’t want to go back to 1200.

zoejo.2317
This is an inspiring thread.
Nice to see some particular references like games running off of audio cassetes and Phantasy Star. Zork, anyone?

Leather Goddesses of Phobos.

Doesn’t that have images? Too mainstream. Get older!

Azrael.4960:

Myst.5783:

“Their excrement is something like mulch.”

So, since they’re a plant, are they eating plants to produce mulch? in which case, isn’t that a form of cannibalism? Also, if they excrete mulch, could they just sit in the poop and re-absorb the nutrients from the mulch?

I might be looking too deeply into this

I’m with you on this. Let’s get to the bottom of it.

From the Wikipedia:

A mulch is a layer of material applied to the surface of an area of soil. Its purpose is any or all of the following:

- to conserve moisture
- to improve the fertility and health of the soil
- to reduce weed growth
- to enhance the visual appeal of the area

I wish I was Sylvari. I’d just do it around the house and enhance its visual appeal.

mtpelion.4562:

My only concern about legendary armor is “Special Effects Overload”. With a weapon you have between 1 and 2 equipped at any given time so the cool visuals are able to be seen. With 6 pieces of armor, it is possible that you’ll basically be a laser light show clown.

Make this a gem store outfit. I love the laser light show clown concept. Like seriously ridiculous.

This is an inspiring thread.
Nice to see some particular references like games running off of audio cassetes and Phantasy Star. Zork, anyone?

Domino.1359:

Finally! No more 60g wind catcher backpack, lol.

So glad I just recently sold one

She should show up in heavy armor and join the pavillion train.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

You know what’s really delicious? Taking a group of new players and ganking the bandit or troll with them to disrupt the timing of the train. 1) because it disrupts the momentum of the train, allowing new players the chance to also fight some mobs that would otherwise have gotten rolled over by the train zerg, and 2) because they get some help in learning how to fight those mobs by doing something other than hitting 1111111.

So yeah, try that sometime OP.

Welcome to 5 pages ago.

Astralporing.1957:

zoejo.2317:

Sola.7250:

I really don’t know why this bothers some so much, some times is a good way to help finish your daily or help level a new character.

If I want loot or gold, dungeons & some world bosses are the way to go.

Yes it’s good for a lot of things. No one’s (well, not all of us are) saying the opposite. Some even call it fun and I believe them. It’s the entitled attitude of some players that’s wrong.

Those people are on both sides of the fence. And killing the train would not make them lose their attitude. They would simply find a different reason to display it.
Fortunately, Anet did give us tools to deal with people like that.

I also never suggested killing the train.

Sola.7250:

I really don’t know why this bothers some so much, some times is a good way to help finish your daily or help level a new character.

If I want loot or gold, dungeons & some world bosses are the way to go.

Yes it’s good for a lot of things. No one’s (well, not all of us are) saying the opposite. Some even call it fun and I believe them. It’s the entitled attitude of some players that’s wrong.

Azhure.1857:

zoejo.2317:

I personally believe that at the end of this (when hopefully a solution that pleases everyone has been reached), it’s better if we can say we made a difference without resorting to something that only increases the one thing we’re criticizing: the toxicity and constant conflict in map chat.

Though it comes to a point where I can only tolerate spending so much time reporting, blocking, or turning off mapchat entirely for so long. I’ve reached breaking point.

I did find your entire post calming and optimistic however – and I thank you for it.

Yes, I understand that sometimes it’s hardly a choice. And that it comes from a deep sense of justice

Nilkemia.8507:

I feel like threads like this have popped up before. Just leave it be. If people want to run the train, let them. At the same time, if other people want to fight the champions out of order, they can do that too (even if it is annoying sometimes). They may or may not be trolling (no way to know for certain unless they say it), but that’s not really worth getting all toxic over (they can’t stick around forever, can they?).

Then again…I almost never go to Queensdale outside of map completion, so maybe I’m too disconnected from this to understand it. Meh.

We do let them run trains. Players can do whatever they want. I don’t care – or I do care, but I care that everyone has that option without being shot down and harassed for it. Which is what’s happening to new (or old, doesn’t matter) players who, unaware, commit the sin of killing a champion out of order. It results in abusive language and insults in chat more often than not – and if I report that kind of language in a whisper, why would I tolerate it in map chat, when tons of more people have to read it and some of them brand new players trying to get a feel of the community?

It’s not the train, it’s the entitled attitude. It’s clear cut wrong, even according to the code of conduct this game’s based on.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Can’t players buy bags on the TP? I don’t think they are especially expensive, and PvP players do earn gold now. Is it difficult to walk through the portal to the bank?

Difficult? No. Annoying? Yes.
Players with less powerfull computers take literally minutes to load an area. Longer if it’s the Keep. If there’s a party waiting for you for a tournament match, it becomes annoying for 5 people instead of one.

While it’s not a life threatening problem, the solution is also not complicated – just paste a bank NPC in there. Therefore it doesn’t seem like an unreasonable request.

Azhure.1857:

So I would challenge you to tell me a better way.

While I understand your reasons, counter attacking shouldn’t be an option. You seem to recognize that it only adds to the toxicity – then it IS better to do nothing. Some toxicity is better than more of it.

I’m not gonna tell you to stand idle either. If this is brought up in the official ways to contact staff with enough insistence, I’m sure it’ll get noticed. This thread reached over 200 replies in 24h, it’s probably been noticed already. Valid and reasonable points were made too, and I think that’s our best weapon. That’s why I come back to this thread and dump some more reason and logic into it.

We can also report. Every time it happens, every infractor. We can report as informed players, we can quote where the CoC predicts that such actions are bannable, we can ask that players who are offensive in map chat be treated the same as those who are offensive in whisper.

It might take a long time to see a change, but it’ll happen out of the right measures. And probably still faster than hoping the devs notice the escalating conflict caused by deliberately disrupting a train.

I personally believe that at the end of this (when hopefully a solution that pleases everyone has been reached), it’s better if we can say we made a difference without resorting to something that only increases the one thing we’re criticizing: the toxicity and constant conflict in map chat.

Sturmruger.3920:

snip

So these people arent in your guild building your castles. They arent in WvW following your commander tag around. They arent in your world doing your things. Big deal. Put your big boy pants on and move on. We need more people like these, not less. Some of us just want to have fun and if that goes against your ideal way of doing things…maybe you are the one with issues, not us.

You need to read the whole thread. You’ll notice the most reasonable of us aren’t against the train as an activity, but the kind of behavior that it seems to trigger in some players who run it. Also, the counter behavior triggered in some players who don’t run trains. There’s conflict. There’s offensive map chat. And that IS a problem.

Again, the most reasonable amongst us aren’t looking to have the train removed or wanting people to follow us in WvW or any of the other examples. But something definitely needs to be done to clean that map chat.

Keep the train. I’m fine with it. I think players should be able to do what they want and find fun. Insults and disrespecting behavior, however, aren’t ok.

They’re all account bound now

Silvercyclone.1462:

One thing i can’t figure out is why someone with a star next to their name and a legendary in each hand woud do the QD train. I know since the 15th one of those could be a skin but I’ve been seeing this since the train began. I think if you got a star and 1 legendary you should only get event credit and not the champ bags.

They might want items to sell, they might want xp for skill points, they might hope for a precursor, they might like commanding, they might be doing their monthlies. Plenty of reasons, the biggest one being: it’s a valid half efficient source of income.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I don’t typically see anyone with the anet tag out in QD, though I know that doesn’t necessarily mean anything. Still, if a regular person intervening causes insults to increase, then personally, I just report them.

Same. It’s the best thing to do, but unfortunately not really a visible measure that will discourage others, or clean the map chat for that matter – which is a main aspect of the problem.
As arejeidi suggested above, there needs to be a solution that won’t remove the trains from the game (since some people run them peacefully) but instead promote a friendlier attitude.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

zoejo.2317:

cakesphere.5910:

I wouldn’t need to champ train if they’d add more end-game pve options.

Just saiyan

The OP wasn’t complaining about running trains in itself. It’s people’s entitled attitude and general offensive behavior that’s the problem.

Well, we have issues with that everywhere. In game, and out. It only becomes apparent because like tends to congregate with like.

I agree with the OP, in the context that if the people in the QD train are being kittens it could leave a negative impression on a new player. However, that’s when other people need to step in and slap them down for being kittens. No reason to get your panties in a bunch over a champ or two, imo.

I don’t run trains so I guarantee the champs are not what I find annoying.
I agree that “people need to step in”. Hopefully Anet staff, since reasonable responses from players usually just trigger more insults.

cakesphere.5910:

I wouldn’t need to champ train if they’d add more end-game pve options.

Just saiyan

The OP wasn’t complaining about running trains in itself. It’s people’s entitled attitude and general offensive behavior that’s the problem.

Scrambles.2604:

I dont understand this idea that a new player seeing a zerg of players will turn the new player away from the game. Isn’t that the appeal of this game? Events with +20 players participating?

That was my first real positive memory from when i started playing GW2. I ran into a big group of players fighting the spider in QD and i thought it was awesome. That’s what i like to see in an MMO, other players actually doing stuff.

A group of players running together won’t make a new player turn away from the game, but insultive and disrespectful language will. Specially if it’s directed at said new player who all he did was kill a mob.

Vitus Dance.4509:

Isn’t that just asking to further dumb down an already dumbed down system?

Dumbing down what? Like there’s an intelligence involved in redistributing your trait points. He’s asking for convinience.

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

zoejo.2317:

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

In the end, I don’t see why ANet would nerf every other form of reward farming and leave Champ farming as the most viable. I think they should either nerf champ farming to bring it in line with everything else, or take away the diminishing returns from other forms of content so as to lessen the impact of champ trains.

It’s not the rewards or how viable it is as a source of income. This topic is about the insults, the general attitude that other players must sacrifice their choice of how to play the game because of the train method, and the overall breaking of the code of conduct that gets players banned in other contexts.

Yes, we did go off on a bit of a tangent there, but my original comment was actually made with the idea in mind that champ rewards would be less farmable, and thus, you wouldn’t see massive trains doing it continuously anymore, in Queensdale or anywhere else, which would essentially resolve the issue the OP brought up.

True, but we shouldn’t take privilieges away from people who aren’t doing anything wrong (train runners with actual good attitudes) just because some are breaking the rules. Solutions shouldn’t punish those who aren’t at fault. It’s Anet’s job to come up with something that’ll stop this nonsensical rudeness while preserving the player’s right to farm if they like it.

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

In the end, I don’t see why ANet would nerf every other form of reward farming and leave Champ farming as the most viable. I think they should either nerf champ farming to bring it in line with everything else, or take away the diminishing returns from other forms of content so as to lessen the impact of champ trains.

It’s not the rewards or how viable it is as a source of income. This topic is about the insults, the general attitude that other players must sacrifice their choice of how to play the game because of the train method, and the overall breaking of the code of conduct that gets players banned in other contexts.

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

Tuntz.8953:

Tenrai Senshi.2017:

I think champ trains as a whole need to be killed off. To me, it’s far too rewarding for content that is so easy (and boring) to complete. The way I see it, ANet needs to rebalanced player rewards so that more difficult content becomes more rewarding, while easier content is less rewarding. It’s the only thing that makes any sense. O_o

I’d say they need to limit it so that champs only drop their loot bags once a day per character. That way killing a champ will still be rewarding if you happen to encounter one in an event, but farming them continuously will no longer be feasible. They could also implement a system where completing an event for the first time in a day yields greater rewards, but repeating that same event multiple times in a day yields less rewards with each subsequent completion. That way, you also can’t just use the trains for endless karma or exp farming.

Since this thread appears every week let me just copy/paste from the other threads the tl/dr of what you are saying

tl:dr – “You get something I want by doing something I don’t feel like doing and yet you get rewarded for it. I don’t want you to get rewarded by doing something I don’t feel like doing myself.”

Actually, what I’m trying to say is that I don’t really understand the logic of the reward system. Why do games reward repetitive, boring content, rather than rewarding fun, challenging content? It’s almost as if the devs are trying to say that they don’t want us to have fun and that they want us to grind if we want rewards. I’m not saying I don’t want others to be rewarded, but I want people to be rewarded for having fun because that’s what a game should be all about.

Is that a bad thing? Unless, of course, people find grinding the exact same champs, along the exact same path over and over and over again fun…

They obviously find it acceptable and fun enough to keep doing it. There’s nothing wrong with that – the motto of the game has always been to let players obtain what they want in the way the see fit, even if it’s repetitive. It’s their decision, not ours.

The problem is NOT the rewards (as in gold, loots, etc) at all, it’s the behavior that is associated with this particular type of method. If train runners didn’t have the tendency to insult and publicly bash anyone who disrupts their plans this wouldn’t be a problem at all. They could be tolerant and understand that not everyone knows or cares about running trains, while still being entitled to kill a champion. What they really are saying though, with their insults and toxic behavior, is that their own way of playing the game somehow has priority over anyone else’s choice. When they type “omg idiots, wait for the zerk”, I read “My right to play how I want is above yours” or “You have to sacrifice the way you chose to play in benefit of how I chose to play”. This isn’t the behavior we want in the game, much less in starting areas. As of now, it’s extremely easy to give new players the impression that this is the GW2 community. First impressions are powerful, stable and determinant in our decision to stick with the game or not, and if a fifth of the newcomers (actually more, since the Human character race holds more percentage than the others) is immediately blasted with disrespect and abusive toxic language, there is a clear problem.
While the “exposing newcomers to disrespectful behavior” is a problem, the one thing fundamentally wrong about how train runners have been behaving is that it’s against the code of conduct that this game is built on and that we all accepted just by playing. This is the same ruleset that results in players being banned for being insultive in whisper – why wouldn’t it apply to map chat?

It’s been brought up that there are other starting areas. It seems like an irrelevant argument. Someone’s aggressive behavior shouldn’t discourage players from creating human characters. Surely we’re not given a race option only so that in the end we’re forced into whatever race happens to belong to a train-free starting area. This is basically defending that players not only need to respect the train method, they now need to pick their race depending on it.

As of now, if a player who is unaware of the train runs into a champ and kills it (which is in no way an offense) is immediately insulted in map chat. It happens so often that I see it every time, even though the only thing I do in that map is Behemoth.
So every player must stay away from harder mobs now, so that they don’t offend the train runners? Nothing against trains themselves, but the aggressive behavior towards people who don’t take part in it is in every sense wrong.