Guild Wars 2

Knote.2904:

Rama.6439:

I love it, you get champ bags, rares, blues and greens, and you still complain, lol.

You PvErs are some piece of work, gimme, gimme, gimme.

You’re ridiculous.

Risk/Reward is screwed up and is a problem.

What risk?

Daywolf.2630:

ooooooo early eq1 crafting, fletching! so cool.. custom arrows in demand, helping people to fit the right types etc.
you missed out on UO crafting, months and months of burning up ingots, then hanging around towns doing repairs for people, socializing. Was epic! Even running your own specialty shop out in Yew and with regular customers.
meh yeah crafting is pretty pointless now, more about the mini-game style of gameplay. Got master crafter here, but nothing like the days when crafting meant something. Yet no matter how easy it gets, even if a game just auto-gave players full crafting ability, the complaints will never stop, and devs will keep on listening to it.

Awesome, open a smithy in Queensdale, and I’ll buy all my ascended gear from you, and i’ll be sure to return to get repairs….

yea…

The last place I would probably go to be impressed. is an online video game..

But that’s just me.

Funset.7893:

So now we need to farm and achievement points? Just great.

Actually, you don’t need to do anything.

Maximillian Greil.1965:

tic.7425:

Maximillian Greil.1965:

It’s a skin, you don’t need it.

If you want it, start farming/buying. If it’s not worth the trouble than don’t do it. It is not detrimental to your gameplay NOT to have the skin.

I fail to see how this is hurting the playerbase in any way what-so-ever. They’re not giving ascended gear, they’re not giving anything that makes you a better player or gives better stats… it’s just a skin, you don’t need it. You don’t magicly get more awesome because you have a scelerite weapon.

Perhaps not, but theres a portion of the MMO community that like to “progress” in MMOs, even if its something as simple as the newest skin.

The way this RNG seems to be working is like beating your head against a wall, and has really turned me off to this game. I love vertical progression in my MMOs, always have, but this is almost worse than any horizontal progression I done. At least there was a light at the end of the tunnel, this, I’ve given up even trying really.

than this isn’t the MMO for you

Yes, I agree.

Maximillian Greil.1965:

It’s a skin, you don’t need it.

If you want it, start farming/buying. If it’s not worth the trouble than don’t do it. It is not detrimental to your gameplay NOT to have the skin.

I fail to see how this is hurting the playerbase in any way what-so-ever. They’re not giving ascended gear, they’re not giving anything that makes you a better player or gives better stats… it’s just a skin, you don’t need it. You don’t magicly get more awesome because you have a scelerite weapon.

Perhaps not, but theres a portion of the MMO community that like to “progress” in MMOs, even if its something as simple as the newest skin.

The way this RNG seems to be working is like beating your head against a wall, and has really turned me off to this game. I love vertical progression in my MMOs, always have, but this is almost worse than any horizontal progression I done. At least there was a light at the end of the tunnel, this, I’ve given up even trying really.

Naw.

Last night for example, I sat on the couch and watched reruns of House, when i could have been playing. This MMO is missing that certain “hook” for me. I can’t put my finger on it, I’m not sure what its missing, but it just doesn’t draw me in.

I was really looking forward to the big WvW patch, but was pretty underwhelmed.

The wife and fam are all sleeping now, and this is typically my gaming time, but i’m watching the morning news, typing this instead. I may log on a bit later though and work on my guardian a lil.

/shrug

You got your chocolate in my peanut butter…

I hate that everything seems to get separated in todays MMOs.

Getting the new “shinnies” trumps all, no matter how dull it can get. Learned this pretty quick in Warhammer and has since really turned me off to “RvR”, something I really enjoyed in my DAoC days.

Couldn’t you have posted this in the thread about this exact same subject that you have already been posting in? Currently no less than 7 threads down from this one.

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

Goloith.6349:

Shonie.5297:

You are picking one thing from PvE that is account-wide and applying it to your argument like somehow you`re making a point.

I can do the same…
``Why are Badges of Honor account-wide in WvW and Legendaries character-bound in PvE… because BoH`s are account-bound, so should legendaries``

See, now my post makes about as much sense as yours.

Yes and you know how many people want Legendaries to be account bound? Most logically minded people. RNG sucks.

I am gonna guess this isn`t your first MMO, and that you should be aware that RPG`s are based on character-progression, not account progression.
I`m at a loss why this new generation of gamers wants everything to be account-bound.
So you have to work a little harder to progress each character individually, big deal. That`s what RPG`s are.
I`m sorry you can`t start a new character and have EVERYTHING already on it. Is this some sort of new thing you`re experiencing or is this not what happens in every MMO and RPG ever made.

People that play alts because its fun. We have already gone through so much character progression that they expect that when it comes to something that is around player skill, the player should be rewarded, not a character.

The question that I have to ask is How does making this account bound affect those that only wish to play one character? The answer is that it does not affect you one bit so why do you put up such opposition to people wanting to play at the same competitive level across all their characters? Why is there no valid reason that anyone posted on here as to why it affects them? The only thing that comes to mind is blatant selfishness.

Maybe it’s not blatant selfishness. Perhaps people don’t find it nearly as earth-shattering as you seem to.

I play alts, and guess what? This isn’t a big deal, its character progression.

giddy-up.

The new update won’t discourage me from playing my alts at all. Just more fun to be in WvW while i build up my characters.

Just the typical thread these days, when any MMO has an update, about how some section of the playerbase is getting a “screw job”, thats really become all too prevalant. Though it would normally be about 12 pages long by now i would think, so it can’t be all bad

Orangensaft.7139:

tic.7425:

I play casually, and have 2 alts a i play around with along with my main. One isn’t even 80 yet, and I’m starting to favor that one

I don’t really have a problem at all with the progression being character bound. If it were account, i probably wouldn’t complain either, but i suppose i just figured it was going to be character based. Not a problem, really, and I hardly think its a “screw job” : /

no problem for you because you have only 2 alts and you say you already favor one…
but a lot of people have 8 or more characters because they like to play more than just 1 class :/

I do have more than one class, as i said, I have three (currently). I also play casually, so much so that my 3rd isn’t 80 yet. I have one piece of ascended gear for all my characters combined, that i got just this week.

My other character slots are full, but I don’t have the time to play them all (casually). Will i pick some more classes up eventually? Probably, so I’ll have to get the WvW progression for them as well, and more than likely much slower than you and your eight characters.

I still don’t have a problem.

/shrug

I play casually, and have 2 alts a i play around with along with my main. One isn’t even 80 yet, and I’m starting to favor that one

I don’t really have a problem at all with the progression being character bound. If it were account, i probably wouldn’t complain either, but i suppose i just figured it was going to be character based. Not a problem, really, and I hardly think its a “screw job” : /

Masternewbz.4953:

tic.7425:

I’ve actually semi-retired my mesmer. For the most part its not really challenging at all.

The hardest class for me is a necro, because of my (really) limited condition removal. Other than that, a lot of it is just (too) easy, not all mind you, but a lot of it.. I’m no elite PvPer by any stretch, but mesmers sure do make it pretty easy. A lot of times, when i see a 2 on 1, i feel like im going to get a really good challenge.

Been playing MMOs for a long time, the only thing to me more discouraging than playing an "underpowered " class, is playing the fotm “overpowered” one. Hard to believe, but when you see certain classes representation dominating the PvP landscape, there maybe a reason why..

/shrug

Are you serious? Lol.

Get on a mesmer and I will beat you with any profession.

Beating Rank 15 with 0 QP aint a challenge bro.

As I said, i am no elite PvPer, such as yourself being as you can beat me with any class i suppose. All i said, is with the mesmer class, it becomes a easier than with most others. I also mentioned against some classes i don’t even mind a 2 on 1. Maybe they are just poor players, not everyone is as awesome at video games as the reknowned Masternewbz, sir…

ummm…

Serious. Lol. bro.
(?)

I’ve actually semi-retired my mesmer. For the most part its not really challenging at all.

The hardest class for me is a necro, because of my (really) limited condition removal. Other than that, a lot of it is just (too) easy, not all mind you, but a lot of it.. I’m no elite PvPer by any stretch, but mesmers sure do make it pretty easy. A lot of times, when i see a 2 on 1, i feel like im going to get a really good challenge.

Been playing MMOs for a long time, the only thing to me more discouraging than playing an "underpowered " class, is playing the fotm “overpowered” one. Hard to believe, but when you see certain classes representation dominating the PvP landscape, there maybe a reason why..

/shrug

I find it challenging and fun..

Zeanix.8624:

so everyone should have everything ! lets hand out legendarys to anyone !

No, but you can buy it if you like…

Why is this so odd for some folks to comprehend?

Gained a new guild member tonight, and looking for more.

Don’t hesitate to shout for more info if interested.

Shonie.5297:

tic.7425:

Shonie.5297:

tic.7425:

Parlourbeatflex.5970:

I love it how the main point of my argument has been forgotten because of something i said at the end. Ok admittedley joining a bigger guild isnt the best alternative for someone who is part of a very small guild. BUT IT IS A OPTION. And considering anyone can join in with the content as soon as it kicks off, there are other options for experiencing the content.

MY MAIN POINT THOUGH, is that small guilds cannot have everything their own way, just like large guilds cannot either. You make sacrifices because of play style and as Anet have stated again and again, there is a whole games worth of 5 man content out there, but nothing at all (apart from rubbish open world bosses) for larger groups to play.
The funny thing is i hear you all spouting about large guilds like they are null from problems. There are disadvantages and advantages to each type of guild (im actually a member of a few guilds, including a larger wvw one and small casual friends one).

Think about it like it was WOW. You know for a fact that to do any form of raid your 5 man guild will either have to
- recruit more
- play with another guild or group
- miss out on the content

Again ill say; YOU CANNOT HAVE EVERYTHING.

Don’t want everything…

Just don’t understand how much more difficult it would have been to have guild missions on a smaller scale, for smaller guilds. Or at least a smaller gateway, with less reward.

kinda makes sense, allowing guilds to progress and all that. I’d also prefer not to think of how anything was in WoW, thanks.

Why do they need to make content meant for large scale co-ordination available for tiny guilds?
In fact, it is available, it’ll just take the smaller guilds longer to gain the influence necessary to start the events. So what’s the issue?
Not having enough people to do the content? That’s an issue for your guild.
If I wanted to start a 2 person guild, would I complain about not having enough people to run a 5-man dungeon?

Is the issue not being able to do the content on day 1 of it being released? Again, that’s an issue for your guild and not having the influence and the proper upgrades. If people want to be in small party-sized guilds… do they really expect for their guild to access content and rewards as fast as larger guilds?

Play your own way? Nobody says you are required to join guilds of any size. Playing in large guilds will clearly be advantageous for guild missions, but nobody is stopping anyone from being in small guilds and accessing the content at a slower pace.
Stop blaming ANet for things that are entirely in your control.

And what exactly is the detriment to making lesser guild missions for smaller guilds?

Especially if we are trying to recruit other folks. Wouldn’t inviting some to our guild events help our recruiting effort some? Or should i just spam Lions Arch all day?

I guess I don’t get why everything needs to be designed to cater to people who don’t want to play with others in MMO’s.
This is a perfect example…
“make content small scale so I barely have to play with other people in this MMO”
“I just want to do things with my 2 friends in my 3-person guild, make all content doable for our tiny group!”
I do see the point of view from people in smaller guilds, I was just under the impression that GW2 is an MMO and not a single-player or co-op rpg.

I guess if one expects large group content do be doable by only a few people, I hope you are all very good at your professions.

I said i don’t want want to play with others when exactly?

Did i ever say i want to solo the things?

I’ve been playing MMOs a really really long time, I did a whole lot of stuff in NWN , UO, and SWG, that didnt take a guild of 100, 50, or 25 to accomplish, so please don’t make it sound like this is SOP for MMOs.

I’d like these things to scale lower, so, as i said, I’m not the knucklehead endlessly standing in LA spamming guild recruitment, while mega-guild #7 just needs to ask who wants to do a guild mission.

Who do you think is going to get the faster response?

Or should i just join the mega-guild?

Shonie.5297:

tic.7425:

Parlourbeatflex.5970:

I love it how the main point of my argument has been forgotten because of something i said at the end. Ok admittedley joining a bigger guild isnt the best alternative for someone who is part of a very small guild. BUT IT IS A OPTION. And considering anyone can join in with the content as soon as it kicks off, there are other options for experiencing the content.

MY MAIN POINT THOUGH, is that small guilds cannot have everything their own way, just like large guilds cannot either. You make sacrifices because of play style and as Anet have stated again and again, there is a whole games worth of 5 man content out there, but nothing at all (apart from rubbish open world bosses) for larger groups to play.
The funny thing is i hear you all spouting about large guilds like they are null from problems. There are disadvantages and advantages to each type of guild (im actually a member of a few guilds, including a larger wvw one and small casual friends one).

Think about it like it was WOW. You know for a fact that to do any form of raid your 5 man guild will either have to
- recruit more
- play with another guild or group
- miss out on the content

Again ill say; YOU CANNOT HAVE EVERYTHING.

Don’t want everything…

Just don’t understand how much more difficult it would have been to have guild missions on a smaller scale, for smaller guilds. Or at least a smaller gateway, with less reward.

kinda makes sense, allowing guilds to progress and all that. I’d also prefer not to think of how anything was in WoW, thanks.

Why do they need to make content meant for large scale co-ordination available for tiny guilds?
In fact, it is available, it’ll just take the smaller guilds longer to gain the influence necessary to start the events. So what’s the issue?
Not having enough people to do the content? That’s an issue for your guild.
If I wanted to start a 2 person guild, would I complain about not having enough people to run a 5-man dungeon?

Is the issue not being able to do the content on day 1 of it being released? Again, that’s an issue for your guild and not having the influence and the proper upgrades. If people want to be in small party-sized guilds… do they really expect for their guild to access content and rewards as fast as larger guilds?

Play your own way? Nobody says you are required to join guilds of any size. Playing in large guilds will clearly be advantageous for guild missions, but nobody is stopping anyone from being in small guilds and accessing the content at a slower pace.
Stop blaming ANet for things that are entirely in your control.

And what exactly is the detriment to making lesser guild missions for smaller guilds?

Especially if we are trying to recruit other folks. Wouldn’t inviting some to our guild events help our recruiting effort some? Or should i just spam Lions Arch all day?

Parlourbeatflex.5970:

I love it how the main point of my argument has been forgotten because of something i said at the end. Ok admittedley joining a bigger guild isnt the best alternative for someone who is part of a very small guild. BUT IT IS A OPTION. And considering anyone can join in with the content as soon as it kicks off, there are other options for experiencing the content.

MY MAIN POINT THOUGH, is that small guilds cannot have everything their own way, just like large guilds cannot either. You make sacrifices because of play style and as Anet have stated again and again, there is a whole games worth of 5 man content out there, but nothing at all (apart from rubbish open world bosses) for larger groups to play.
The funny thing is i hear you all spouting about large guilds like they are null from problems. There are disadvantages and advantages to each type of guild (im actually a member of a few guilds, including a larger wvw one and small casual friends one).

Think about it like it was WOW. You know for a fact that to do any form of raid your 5 man guild will either have to
- recruit more
- play with another guild or group
- miss out on the content

Again ill say; YOU CANNOT HAVE EVERYTHING.

Don’t want everything…

I just wonder if the playerbase would be as a whole would be more satisfied with this patch if they perhaps put in guild missions on a smaller scale, for smaller guilds. Or at least a smaller gateway, with less reward.

kinda makes sense, allowing guilds to progress and all that. I’d also prefer not to think of how anything was in WoW, thanks.

Skylightmoon.1079:

Small guilds need to stop complaining. If you decided to start a guild in the last month, which is late in the game, then thats yur fault and its not a smart move considering how difficult it is to grow when so many big guilds are out there.

There ya go… !

no more new and upcoming guilds, why bother? its too difficult and not a smart move. Thats just brilliant!

Instead of making your MMO accessible to new guilds that would like to grow, lets make it even more difficult.

/facepalm

kineticdamage.6279:

Ansultares.1567:

No.

In terms of the playerbase, it’s the lack of attention paid to role players that is this game’s worst enemy.

Well, that or the swing and a miss that is GW2 PvP.

Urvanis.2985:

Hardcore players are a minority, devs pamper to the masses. Every hardcore player could up and leave all at once, Anet wouldn’t even notice.

But everyone else would, and then many of them would start leaving, and eventually Anet would notice.

Who do you think makes the youtube videos, or the 3rd party sites, or maintains quality guilds?

Cloud.7613:

The casual players I know don’t care about content because they aren’t around long enough to see it all.

And that’s the danger of catering to casuals; they’re generally so not involved in the game that they’re unlikely to stick with it beyond when the next new shiny releases.

I hope devs see this post. Actually I hope every dev of every recent mmo see this post.
Because it’s the absolute truth, and the major problem of nowadays gaming, especially mmorpgs.

Like I wrote so many times here, MMO studios seem to forgot who really keep their game alive. And for sure it’s not the casual crowd.
(casual in my ears being people who play at a random pace, a few hours a week, and who leave the game under two monthes).

What I don’t understand is how even investors & management can’t even see that, as it’s even recognizable by growth numbers :
the games which started to grow aggressively did not expand the most during the “catering to casual audience” times. (also known as “broadening the audience” strategy, which should be banned from earth for the damage it has caused to the industry).
Nope, when you look at it, every game that became hugely popular went that route thanks to their ability to please a niche, during a sustained amount of time. They were different, and they did generally speak to highly dedicated players (= hardcore gamers). Then hardcore gamers created fansites, articles, created a whole parallel life for the game.
And then the casual crowd entered, being attracted by those fansites, by this hardcore gamer word-of-mouth, massively boosting growth numbers. Serious players having serious gaming credits talking serious about one game ? You bet it will attract less dedicated gamers, and it’s a good thing indeed.

Casuals and hardcore are complementary, hardcore motivating casuals, casuals taking hardcore back to earth.

But right now, mmo studios really seem to have taken the hierarchy backwards.

• Casuals are relax, cool people who will come and go from time to time, saying hello to guild, maybe do a daily or two, and then “see ya”. They’re essential in the sense that you will always be able to find a casual player to chill out, take a mini-ride with you, somewhere, sometime, when hardcores are too busy preparing stuff. When I was an officer in a guild, I loved seeing some casual member suddenly connect, and say “who’s up for [insert a crazy, useless but fun, unexpected thing] ?”.
  Could be seen as satellites.

• The core … Hardcore gamers are, well, the core of the game. The ones who will make the self-marketing of the game by dedication. The ones who will prepare raids, prepare guild events, who will spend hours on deciding the best strategy on a web forum for a boss, a pvp match, or whatever. They’re the ones who will understand the combat mechanics so deeply, after having tried everything, even unintented stuff, that their opinion might be as valuable than a dev. They’re the ones who will find exploits by constantly harassing the system, and therefore help devs to correct them.

etc, etc …. you see the picture. Hardcore gamers are the pillar of a game.
And in my view, most studios are confusing both. They are putting what should be sattelites as pillars, and what should be pillars as sattelites.

And casuals shouldn’t feel offended by that, because it’s logical : the more you invest in something, the more important you are to it. Which doesn’t invalidate casuals value, as I wrote above.

But right now, for many years to be honest, I sincerely feel game studios have completely forgotten that hardcore audience.

I’m sorry, but I don’t buy this at all.

You just took the rather extreme of two classifications of people. Not all casuals log in from day to day to do a daily or two and then…“see ya”

and not all of your “core” make videos, prepare events, and essentially sustain the rest of us…

You missed a rather large playerbase that fall somewhere in the middle, if thats the case. Catering to either one of the examples you posted would be a huge mistake in my opinion.

Anyone who plays more than me is hardcore, spends half their life in the game, and (obviously) has no life..

Anyone who plays less than me is casual, and wants everything handed to them on a silver platter.

Huzzah!!11!!!one

Sarcasm aside..

Think of how many man hours it takes to create a single dungeon. Now how long does it take for the average persone to run it? How long does it take for the same person to get bored of it after X amount of times?

Developers will never be able to satisfy people who spend many hours daily in any MMO, nor should they try, in my opinion. I’m (obviously) using a themepark MMO as an example with dungeons, as i figure thats what most people play.

PvP (in my opinion) offers something different as far as length of content, if its done properly. WvW and SPvP can keep folks entertained much longer, with ranks, ladders, bragging rights etc. if thats your thing. Though i would think, the population is a lot smaller as well.

just my opinion.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

I must be missing something in this discussion. how do 5 man guilds not have all the research done at this point? I joined a guild 2 months ago and have contributed 15,000 influence to my guild in that time. Even if you have a 5-man guild, if you formed near the start of the game you should have earned around 200,000 influence by now assuming you haven’t spent a single gold to buy any extra.

Also why can’t these small guilds join a bigger guild and do the events as a 5 man group within the big guild while they work up the research in their small guild? I mean that is the entire point of being able to join 4 guilds at once isn’t it? I’m in a smaller guild but i’m also in a 400 man guild and we have 300,000 influence just sitting in the bank. Just run with your friends in a larger guild and earn the rewards there until you can finish the research in your small guild.

Or…

make smaller guild missions for small guilds as well as large for larger guilds, with appropriate rewards for each case. Gate them in a lower tier, where as large guild can get right to a higher tier in a guild track without much, if any difficulty . Folks love to throw the word “progression” around in MMOs these days…

well, there ya go!

maddoctor.2738:

Oreoz.2573:

As enjoyable as the bounties may be, I forsee the rewards being hardly worth the effort. Better to invest influence in a track that will actually benefit you as a player and a guild instead of wasting 36k+ on, lets face it, a dynamic event.

Then why is this thread even here if the rewards aren’t worth it? See big guilds will be able to do something that doesn’t have any real rewards, good for them, why does anyone else care then?

Because some people actually play these games for the content, not chasing silly carrots.

I would love to be able to gain small bits of influence from lesser Guild Missions. Being able to open “dynamic events” that other people can join in on sounds fantastic, and a great way for my smaller guild to gain members. I don’t want the same events as the mega-guilds, but allow smaller ones to prosper as well, albeit slower, with smaller missions.

Being gated in at level 5 in what is probably the least used of all the tracks, especially for smaller guilds, well, just has a “funny smell” to it in my opinion. I won’t lose any sleep over it, but it will be something that sticks in the back of my mind for certain.

declan.3968:

tic.7425:

I’m sorry, but how much more effort did you put in more than I? Other than deciding to join a large guild that is? My (very) small guild takes a lot longer to do things with our limited amount, so i would actually think we are putting more effort in than you.

I suppose though, that if you still feel that way, I could go drop $40 at the gem store to buy some more “effort” and then catch right up to you.

I don’t believe the question of effort in this thread has to do entirely with the player base.

/shrug

The guild I run with is a 100 man Malaysian guild, we only recruit from 1 forum and rarely within the community. The most important thing is doing weekly WvW, running dungeons and fotm everyday and cultivating a fun atmosphere.

You have a small guild, good for you. Things like this should be something to work towards, not handed on a silver platter.

Other than the sarcasm of buying my way, which part of my post led you to believe i wanted anything on a silver platter?

cesmode.4257:

Oreoz.2573:

bluewanders.5297:

TsukasaHiiragi.9730:

I hate to personally say it, but this might be the time to start a petition to attempt to block this patch.

No… you don’t petition to block new content from dropping. I don’t want big guilds to be excluded from the content too just because small guilds have been… the answer is make our position known, and understood, be willing to discuss it at length until it is… and then act like adults once the “final” decision has been made and deal with it’s consequences on an adult level.

We aren’t 5 year olds… we can certainly deal with an unfavorable turn of events without trying to screw over everyone else for whom it is favorable. At the same time… when decisions have been made, the decision makers need to be given feedback and alerted to dissident opinions… that is the very basis and strength of freedom of speech. “Good” decision makers take this feedback into consideration in the future and incorporate it into more accurate decision making models… even if their decisions continue to press disfavor on a portion of the population affected by them… not all decisions can be favorable to everyone… but everyone should be heard and acknowledged… and their feedback should have weight.

I agree with you completely.

And then i remember back when Anet said they didn’t want to make a grindy game.

Truthfully, they haven’t. It’s all optional.

So people quit playing because they don’t want to grind.

Ironic.

Jeez for the last time everything in this game is as optional as everytng in any game. Yet we do it because what else is there to do. The argument that its all optional is mute. Raiding is optional in wow but we do it because theres nothing else to do. Much like missionswillbe done here.

Literally everything you do in this game is a grind. Guild missions are going to be a grind for smaller guids. Its optional but again so is raiding in wow yet we did all of that…so we are going to do guild missns and grind them out…in a game where this is no grInd

I don’t totally disagree with you, but i am curious, instead of having smaller guilds “grind” out to be able to (just) start these missions, wouldn’t it have been less “grindy” to allow the opening of the missions a bit earlier than tier5? At least folks would feel they are doing the content, as opposed to “grinding” out points just to start it.

Never mind the fact you released the requirement a week (?) before release, in an upgrage spot i’d be almost willing to bet is the least upgraded (overall).

Gate them in earlier with easier missions, that allows progress to harder ones. I mean that seems simple enough really.

declan.3968:

Small guilds can access the content, they just need to work towards it. I don’t see what’s so hard. It’s like complaining that dungeons have level gates. Oh, we’re a casual guild of 5, we don’t have enough time to play, we’re all only level 40+, why are dungeons so high level, it’s unfair ….. wah, wah, wah.

Why does everyone expect all content to be accessible immediately? Why can’t ArenaNet patch in content that requires some amount of effort to access?

I’m sorry, but how much more effort did you put in more than I? Other than deciding to join a large guild that is? My (very) small guild takes a lot longer to do things with our limited amount, so i would actually think we are putting more effort in than you.

I suppose though, that if you still feel that way, I could go drop $40 at the gem store to buy some more “effort” and then catch right up to you.

I don’t believe the question of effort in this thread has to do entirely with the player base.

/shrug

Umm, no, that not what i meant. : /

I did edit it up a bit, for (what i hope is) clarity.

Hello there,

A friend and I are have a guild on the Tarnished Coast server, and, up until this point, neglected recruitment. With the release of information regarding the Guild Missions in the last day or so, we have decided it was time to get a move on, so here’s my pitch to you.

There’s currently just two of us, both in our mid-40s, each married with wives, children, pets and full time jobs (casual gamers). We have been MMOing since the original Neverwinter Nights (approx. 1995) where we part of the same guild. When the gates of Neverwinter closed for good, we moved on to Ultima Online where our medium sized guild exploded to almost 100. I led the guild for a decent stretch, until I could no longer run it, it just got too big for my enjoyment. Through the years, a lot of the old guild mates were lost along the way, perhaps with so many game releases, perhaps retirement. There are no games in the immediate future that have our eye, so we will certainly be here awhile, and definitely as guild for more than a few years (why stop now?).

My days of large impersonal guilds are definitely over. Nothing is required of you other than a bit a maturity. You can log on as you please, you can spec any way you like, and you can do whatever you desire while in game. We enjoy PvP/WvW and open world PvE for the most part, and could undoubtedly use some company. Neither of us were ever big on instanced dungeons, probably begotten from our MMO roots (/shrug). Though I have done a few and would do more, I would think. We’re both quite helpful, so if your just starting out, or a “vet” trying to take over an upgraded supply camp, I’m sure we’d be willing to lend a hand with about anything.

The guild is without voice chat, though I would consider it if it became more practical, I have used them in the past. Our guild currently has Architecture 2 for a (small) guild bank, and Art of War 3 (less than 3k from 4) with an eye toward 5 for Guild Missions in the great outdoors.

If you’re looking to join a guild, and are interested in what you have read, give me a shout, even if it’s just for more info, or to see if we are a good fit for you.

Thanks for your time.

Anat.1765:

I’m reading through these “concerns” guys and I don’t know, I just can’t agree. After a decade of MMO’s I’m a little burned out on these kinds of complaints. If you don’t like goalposts, why are you gaming? I feel as though many wish their game was like a dvd, where you can boot up, pick your scene, and start playing with nothing to strive for or achieve.

I feel Anet handed you an unprecedented toolbox to achieve your goals in game, with the ability to join multiple guilds, shared xp, shared loot, guesting, gems, and more. And really, if your running a guild and have had an unlock staring you in the face for 6 months and you ignored it because you didn’t think you would ever want it, I guess you made a bad call?

As for the concern they are making you do something you don’t want to do, games are loaded with those. I did not particularly want to run through the rabbits to get my xp, but I did because I set myself the goal of max level, and I knew I would have to do things I would not always want to do. On reflection, running though the bunnies was a fun kind of pain in the a@#. Do some wvw, get your but kicked, explore a little and have some fun kitten

After almost two decades of MMOing (for whatever thats worth), your post is a little off base.

I love goalposts, but as opposed to making us hit a grand slam, how about they let us get a single first?

There are smaller guilds, and I’m certain they realize they would probably never be able to do all the Guild Missions, but when your entry point is an upgrade 5, well, don’t get perplexed when folks raise an eyebrow.

I guess making the entry point at say an upgrade 2 with smaller missions that helped you level, would be too much development time? Or perhaps theres a buck to made in an upgrade slot a lot of guilds haven’t worked on, especially when you announce the requirement a week before you release it.

mrstealth.6701:

The largest guild I’ve ever been in (this was in GW1) had about 50 members…and our close-knit leadership ended up kicking about 30 of those because we got tired of having so many random people we didn’t know causing all sorts of issues and drama. My current GW2 guild has 18 members, and there are about 5 of us that play together frequently, while the others play a lot less often. I’m quite happy with this, and (until seeing this ridiculous bit of info) saw no reason to have it any other way.

According to an interview just a few days ago, the Bounty missions were to be the “the one that you can get right off the bat”. If requiring AoW t5 is “right off the bat”, I’m afraid to ask what the other unlocks are going to require. It’s already been stated that “it’s literally going to take months for your guild to build up enough influence to unlock all of them”, so I can only assume this timeframe is the intended one for large guilds that already have AoW T5 and a stash of influence.

The full interview can be found here http://dragonseason.com/Front/tabid/124/EntryId/210/Lunch-with-Colin-Johanson-Part-I.aspx

I ran a 100 man guild in Ultima Online, the single other person in my (current) guild ran it when i just couldn’t deal with the drama any longer. Thats no longer what we are looking for. We started a guild here, with just the two of us, we don’t “actively” recruit, but i have had folks ask to join after grouping with me/us. When i tell them we are casual, and especially that theres only currently two of us, well you can imagine the reaction :p

A very large percentage of people i run into are (obviously) guilded. I was sort of hoping that this content would be gated a bit lower. I more than realize my “guild” is hardly “deserving”, and I more than understand that the way we operate is very limiting. I have no problem with that. I know that we aren’t going to be able to do what the larger (or even medium) guilds do. I did however, think this was going to be some sort of tool to help recruitment efforts (as opposed to spamming LA which i really refuse to do). Ah well.

With that said, anyone looking for a very casual guild, with a couple of old guys, who don’t care what your spec is, send me a shout :p We almost at AOW4 ; )

Malediktus.9250:

Lol, most guilds which deserve being called a guild have everything maxed for months already, so I dont understand the fuss.
If your guild is too small just buy influence from the NPC.

What about the guild that hasn’t been created yet?

Wouldn’t it have been more sound to “gate” these things at the lower level upgrades, as opposed to a 5th tier? This way a “new” guild can work its way up, and eventually be as deserving as you and your awesome guild?

The hurdles for a new guild starting in a pre-existing game are pretty big, why make it even harder? Allowing a small newly founded guild (trying to recruit new players) to work its way up through the ranks with guild events, i mean, does that just sound way to logical, or is it me?

To your other point, when i read the tier requirement, the first thing that popped into my mind was them giving a “lil” nudge toward the gem store.

And you thought smaller guilds trying to recruit people didnt already have a difficult enough time..

This game could use quite a bit of stuff, but new lands and more levels would be really, really low on my personal list.

Folks complain that developers never communicate…

Developers communicate with the playerbase and give tentative plans of upcoming content.

Players gets said tentative time for patch.

Patch is delayed.

Playerbase tosses a tantrum about how much developers hates their particular playstyle, because said patch wasn’t delievered “when promised”.

Folks complain that developers never communicate…

Yes, just to get folks to stop doing it in spvp.

It gets a bit monotonous running into 3 of them in row, every day. Eventually i run out of patience

Omniwar.4985:

tic.7425:

Omniwar.4985:

I just fear the game will slowly die without content for more dedicated (hardcore) gamers, we need raiding and it should be filthy hard with great looking bind on equip items. That way the casuals and terrabads that dont want to or cant raid can buy their new shinies from the market for the coins they go doing their casual stuff.

Curious, what exactly makes you more dedicated (hardcore), raiding scripted events, than me raiding the borderlands for the good of my entire server? I play casually, and probably do more for my server than you ever would hiding in a dungeon with your spreadsheets, youtube, and your “dedication”. Maybe its because i perhaps play a little less than you that I’m casual? Maybe its because I find raiding the most monotonous aspect of MMOs ever created that I’m “terrabad”?

Its just boggles the mind how any MMO ever survived without raiding, eh? Since this one will “die” if it weren’t to get it.

Its post like yours that turn me off to an aspect of MMOs that i already don’t care for.

Not everyone likes to play in a padded pvp enviroment that has no risk factor what so ever, it doesnt get your heart racing since when you die you will just respawn or be revived and that group of people you just managed to kill had no meaning what so ever. It is just unscripted and glorified pve in my opinion.

Let me ask you this, why and how would your gaming experiance be hurt in any way if the developers would cater to a huge market which is raiders? It is after all content you do not touch on, but may very well be vital for your game to excist because without the hordes that love a good dungeon the game looses income and without income the game closes down.

Its all business and I played for well worth the money I put in the game, but I did all the content I wanted to do so I took a break and still on a break and will be on a break until they “fix” dungeon mechanics and add in the element of teamplay in pve where you would have to be apart of a guild that works on clearing raid content.

Game is good in many ways and I would love to play it, but when it comes to pve this is a single player game where you can go through all the content in matter of days just by grouping up with random people. SO, ANet wont be seeing a single cent from me unless the game has what I want, good pve that requires people to team up to beat the content.

You wanting pvp does NOT mean I cant have my pve, but excluding one from the equation can mean the game might be on life support or even just die out completely.

I am not asking for better gear, one of the things I loved about this game is that I didnt have to grind gear X to tackle boss Z, now the game doesnt even have that.

You said again this game may end up on life support or die, yet the developers have been saying they game is actually growing.

I still don’t understand why you think a game must have raiding to survive.

Who said it was hard?

Its borderline mindless.

I just would prefer if it didn’t include dungeons (whats seems) every month, or at least allow me to get it through WvW.

Just to back up the OPs point a lil..

Why are we awarded 25 points for the Pve daily, and 4 achievment points for the PvP daily?

I don’t want a gear treadmill any more than anyone else, but this sorta shows how the OP really isn’t that far off base.

I actually think its a very fair price….

Pay it or don’t, up to you, no need to go on endlessly about it.

RanTiannai.1592:

Rather, i’m being dismissive about you trying to make out like you have no avenue to get laurels, when you said yourself you play all aspects of the game. You of all people in this thread are only complaining for the sake of complaining when it doesn’t actually affect you.

No, but to be rewarded for playing the all aspect of the game is sorta nice. Its kinda like the PvE daily that rewards 25 achievment points, and the PvP that awards 4 (whats up with that?). Yes SpVp gets Glory, for cosmetic only, and thats great, but actually reward folks for doing it, as opposed to treating them like what seems to be the red-headed stepchild of the game (so far).

RanTiannai.1592:

Gotta have a laugh at the ’i’m too old and don’t care’. Don’t care enough to keep responding in a somewhat aggressive manner, eh?

Really? you thought i was agressive? where? I’m just offering an opinion, and maybe you’re reading too much into it all.

RanTiannai.1592:

You, as a player who doesn’t play only sPvP, still have an avenue to get laurels and get dyes. Anyone who plays WvW, which regardless of how in effect it is PvP, still gets them credit towards the PvE rewards and really has no valid avenue to complain.

I play WvW. I don’t care for sPvP because last I checked I couldn’t guarantee being on a team with my buddies, giving me an avenue for well-meshed teamwork, and thus is of no interest to me. Unless that’s changed, then no I won’t play sPvP. Good job on the mis-placed assumptions, though!

As someone above pointed out – the reason is probably because they don’t want players to have two avenues for laurels and unbalancing the cost of rewards in PvE. If sPvP players want dyes, yep, understandable. Same with the mini-pets. Doesn’t mean you need laurels for it. Means you need to rework their rewards system.

Whether you want to admit it or not, trying to essentially force players who otherwise wouldn’t want to play sPvP isn’t part of the many times stated ‘play how you want’. A creed that’s already under fire for the new dailies and monthlies structure. You think people are upset now over not getting laurels in sPvP? Just take a look at the forums again to get an idea of the utter rage being ‘enticed’ into sPvP would induce.

Ya, i believe i just said that, no?

RanTiannai.1592:

I, personally, still wouldn’t play sPvP even if they introduced laurels as part of the reward. Nor can we make valid claims i’m some special snowflake and thus the only one who thinks that way.

Not sorry for sticking my chocolate in your peanut butter. I don’t like peanut butter kthx.

Seems you’re taking his conversation waay to seriously, so I’m going to bow out.

err, kthx?

You can get 29 points from dailies.

:)

I wouldn’t neccasarily be interested in a home in this game, as i don’t believe it would be implemented the way i personally would like it. I do however believe there would be more than enough interest from the overall playerbase to justify the development effort.

Its sort of surprising how many would like a little piece of a game world to call their own.

Been in more than few MMOs where servers were absolutly smashed during a “land rush” to place a house. People get really really frusterated during such events, but i’ve grown to like it, in some sort of masochistic way :p

havoc.6814:

No loot, no play. I mean it’s not like the incredible personal storyline (I’m talking about Trahearne’s story, in which I was allowed to participate) is going to keep me interested. Boss mechanics in this game are mostly boring, other players attempting end-game content are often petty and inconsiderate, the horizontal progress through varied weapon and armour skins is a total joke…. Why on earth would I put up with all of that if not for fat loot?

Why on earth play something that that doesn’t keep you interested, is boring, while also dealing with people that are petty and inconsiderate.

For what? Fat internet loot?

I don’t get the draw to that.

/shrug

I’m curious, does this new change happen in dungeons as well?

I tried my first one last night (i’m not much of a dungeon type), AC, and everyone was over the level for it, with a few 80’s as well.

Well, things went rather poorly, to say the least, and we didnt finish. The warrior was saying how he had never wiped on the spider queen in X amount of attempts amongst other things i over heard. Essentially these folks had been here before.

I’m wondering if this level scaling had an effect, as i thought maybe they were over talking themselves.

Was not a good 1st run in a dungeon for me, but i’m going to give it another go this weekend

I played Ultima Online for five years without loot, at least the way its defined in todays MMOs.

With that said, I probably would, because i really like this game. Generally speaking though, i wouldn’t play most MMOs because it seems most developers skip on gameplay as they can just add a mace +4, to replace the mace +3, and people will consider that “content”.

RanTiannai.1592:

tic.7425:

RanTiannai.1592:

tic.7425:

RanTiannai.1592:

tic.7425:

RanTiannai.1592:

What i’ve gleaned from this thread is you want special treatment for choosing not to play a large chunk of the game.

i play all aspects of the game, and think it would be a great idea to reward PvP dailies with a laurel.

Why not?

I’m contributing to all aspects of the game, I’m sure thats part of ANets goal, no?

You are also not the originator of this thread, who gives a different impression. It’s still a PvE reward, so i’m not sure why you’d want it for PvP. I don’t get glory for doing PvE things, so why would you want Laurels for doing PvP things. I don’t complain about not getting glory either, because I make the choice not to participate in PvP. That’s the crux.

Perhaps, but your impression is that he wants to get special treatment for skipping parts of the game.. Well I’d like that treatment as well, and i don’t skip anything.

I can use those rewards in WvW, which contrary to popular belief is PvP, but thats here nor there. I do think though, that if you were to reward folks with laurels for PvP, you might find more folks doing it, nothing wrong with that.

Sorry, but the game counts WvW as PvE instead of PvP regardless of whether it is in practice or not. So, by doing things in WvW you’re still going to get progress towards your dailies and your point is now moot.

It is?

I believe my point was, that i think offering them for SPvP, you would probably get more folks involved in that aspect of the game, which is win/win.

But since you say my point is moot, it must be so.

Uh huh. Cause you totally mentioned sPvP specifically instead of making a case for WvW being PvP. Offering another reward isn’t likely to get people involved in sPvP the way you think it is, rather than people playing only for as long as it takes to get that reward, and certainly not with an eye towards enjoying that aspect of the game.

Some people like it, some people don’t, and i’m pretty sure the last thing actual PvP players want is people farming it just for laurels. Again, I choose not to play sPvP, and I don’t complain about not getting glory.

It remains a choice not to play that. And by that choice i don’t get the rewards associated with it.

Really you just seem out for an argument more than anything by this point, and the originator of the thread has offered a more constructive response even with criticism than you have.

So to you I say good day, and may you enjoy your sPvP to the fullest.

An argument only? really? Trust me to old for that, or to even care that much.

I think it would be a good idea to reward people for doing the pvp daily with a laurel. I didn’t realize it was earth-shattering.

I’m sure actual pvpers are more interested in tournaments. Me, just having some fun with random PuGs. It sounds to me like a Spvp is a part of the game you don’t play, and are dismissive about it.

If people played it only with an eye toward the reward, shame on them for playing a part of the game they don’t enjoy, but i guess they really need that new shinny eh? And will go after it by any means neccasary. Really telling about the state of MMOs perhaps.

Maybe you’re right, the amount of threads for giving a laurel for spvp would be monumentous. People would feel obligated to do it, because they need that new “ring”.

Even if its something they choose not to do.

Ah well..

didn’t mean to get my chocolate in your peanut butter..