Guild Wars 2

Condi thief was nerfed: remember the acrobatic trait nerf or at all the dodges nerf?

Condi thief has burst and this isn´t even a good one, you got warrior, guard and even fresh airs that have higher bursts. So the immob + poison + cc is what hurts some players, but there is one thing: sword thief has no dmg and on bow he has no immob….

So he can immobilise you and do no dmg or he can do a lot of dmg but you can run out of there xD

The only thief that still is broken is the D/D perma dodge thief with akrobatiks and this only if you run a 1v1 against him, so don´t 1v1 him on his point! you need too long xD

ohh and counters for S/D thief: D/P thief, Ranger, Engee, Warrior, Guardian, Condi Rev, Necro, Mesmer. Checks for S/D thief: Ele, Rev.

So his dmg is only good if the players have a too low reactiontime, means they can´t also dodge the f-skills from warrior bevore he got nerfed or worser after nerf xD.

Oh and Dagger autoattack does more dmg then any other Sword skill at the same time, to be honest: Sword/ dagger has one of the lowest dmg on thief (if i remember right 30-50% less dmg depence if condi or power)

means he fights you in a 1v1 over 30 seconds longer and only in teamfight he can burst you once all 40 seconds as high as a guard can do in 20 seconds.

So pls buff more the basic knowledge from our comunity, ty arenanet!
Edit: forgot some points, yes he is good at something: +1 means he can spike bether with one burst player. But he can´t burst himself so he needs a second player that attacks the same target and ofc, most metabuilds have more then enouth condiclans!

Play a class that needs less skills, like ranger: you do dmg with pet so need nothing to do and if you have some basics, like rezzing or healing you will do more then before.

or play warrior, there you can choose: high dmg that kills enermie hopefully fast enouth you dont need to time the defence, or high defence and try to not use 2 defence skills at the same time.

Well if your allready that good that you can win every 1v1, try to use some of your skills for the team, reserve management => you have 50p your allies maybe 20 but enermie has 24p and 27p at the 2v2. using one supportskill and you give from your 50p, 10 to the allie (40 you allie 30) and he can beat with you the other team^^ or weak the enermies with dmg debuff so on => you have 30p allie has 20p but each enermie loose 10p (14 and 17).

Normally the matches are close on the playerskills, means if your bored cause you win but the team don´t, you could carrie them by using skills for the allie matchup

This class has a high skill cap and not everyone can play it. Problem is everyone thinks they can..

100% disagreement. It takes real skills to play thief well.

thief is one of the easyest classes, but only if you got the right mentality: he is not about duelling, a thief want to bring cotroll at the map and is one of the best punisher for bad maprotation. At that moment a thief needs to duell, he just try to carrie the own bad team rotation or he play the wrong class ^^. Means he has the easyest rolle ingame, cause he react more about maprotation then on fightrotation (where you need a good cd-management and reactiontime!).

And to be onest, if you fight as thief it´s all about stealthburst and run to next point, other options are only to carrie the own team or cause there is no trust at the teammates.

Ofc he is not only about +1 or decap, but it´s his main rolle and if he tries something else we got 8 other classes that fitt the other rolles and can do it far bether. Means he can´t carrie as good as other classes, he can only hope to force wrong maprotations, if this doesn´t work he has the smallest option to bring controll in a game.

And now to the “toxic” point: ofc thiefes are the most frustrating class, they have to play near perfect on duels and has the lowest carrie option and at the top we got a toxic comunity that need someone to flame the own misstakes away. btw. this counts for all classes cause the players will flame not the class.

We can only help out at the mentality of our community, means:
- bring compliments at good works at both sides
- if you flame be brave enouth to apologize
- talk to mad players and help them out of his frustration (i give cookies and try to make clear what you need as a player to carrie)
- carrie your teammates, if you have the resource to do it (like use one of your ccs for helping your mate or hide them if he is fokused and can´t attack)
- It´s an teamgame remember yourself on it, if your team loose your part of it!
- Ofc work on yourself mentaly and mechanicly

if you got more points just tell them
Oh and i think the game is balanced well enouth, cause it rates your mentality and your mechanics => means if you play for yourself or if you have problems with some matchups (like you don´t now how to help guardians or have bad matchups against some classes), you will stuck. At the moment you learned how to do it, even if you just learn how to help out one of 9 classes you will be rewarded! and only late in the rating it´s about who does it bether => and later means maybe at the top 5 (don´t really know if we have players below that allready understand the theorie behind the 5v5 gamemode)

got errorcode: 42:0:9001:4402 => match loosed, i tried to reconect and got kicked again after matchstart. after waiting 5 mins i can join the game again, with -14 p and disonnor. ~best time to take a break~

well i just loose 14 points and can fight them back but it´s not nice to try to relog and get punisht that way :/

It´s like allready said: we play a 5v5 game mode and atm we don´t really have an official 1v1 game mode only in the 1v1-player arena.

So having a good duellist is ok, if a team can play on it. But atm the teamplay is stronger cause of the synergies. A duellist fokus himself too much on singeltarget or has too much selfish traits/skills. Maybe he win every 1v1 but they cant win a 2v1 or survive it long enouth to help out at the teamfight-presure (so the 3v4).

Btw i think perma-dodge-thief is the best duellist, but it´s only in 1v1-server good. If we allow kitting everywhere it´s posible that power mes wins all matchups (cause moa op!) xD

So there are few different ideas of duellist:
- one that can survive every outnumber => taktikal means don´t fight there
- one that wins every 1v1 => he pressure a 2v1
- one that can survive every 1v1 and win some 1v1s => he force the right 1v1

Atm pvp is so balanced, that the last idea is the reallistic one and only playerskills make the other 2 optional.

To WvW, well we got much higher stats so buildwars gets more important then on pvp and the playerskills are more apart then on pvp. Doesn´t mean it´s less difficult in opposit thats the reason why some pvp player went to WvW cause a 2v1 is more difficult then a 1v1 even if you fight weak enermies and wvw don´t have fair matchups like a 5v5

the question is: how high has the fault tolerance to be, for making the game good? or what gamemodes we need to use the potential of different builds? And if i see what Arenanet do, is to work on the first point and the second with a huuuuuge break.

edit: yeah my english is bad, im still working on it

Thief is the only class that can´t loose a 1v1, if you loose a 1v1 as thief it´s cause you failed^^, but it doesn´t mean he wins every 1v1!

There is also a ranger, it´s the same with thief he can´t loose a 1v1 and also a 2v1 but it doesn´t mean he will win the fights.

All other classes have somewhere counters at the duells, ranger and thief have other counters => Like THE counter of thief is playing save as a team, the counter of ranger is that he can´t hold a point save against all classes (maybe a decap but never a full cap!) and ofc stealthburst wins against all but thats more about +1 or coordinated burstcombos, it´s effective against all klasses. You also can play 1v1 Builds in ranked/unranked but they are less effective for the team as the normal builds.

Means if you want to play a duell-build go on duell servers. So ask yourself why you play pvp and can pvp fitt your wishes about the game mode or where you get that. Gl

I want cookies for everyone!!!!

thats what i do on toxic players, i give them a cookie and ask him if he is fine, or if he needs a break.

Most players loose really fast the madness on themself after i did that
It doesnt help on all players, but its atm the most effective way that i know to help out

Oh and cookies are really cheap + EVERYONE LIKES COOKIES!!!!

Back to the question: they don´t nerf it at all, they balanced it.
At high pvp-skills it changes nothing for warrior, maybe one f-skill less what means he just need to time more then before. At mid and low ground it´s fine too, cause the players still not good enouth to reakt on the enermies action or they can´t react cause they need too long for that.

If you look only at the warrior it´s a nerf. If you look at all classes and patches before, it was needed to balance lowtiers, without changing too much at higher tiers

It´s one of the “all-playerskill-based-balances” that arenanet trying to do since HoT. Btw. some of theyr patches are for the future, like the condiremove of Seed of Life => one remove less and at the next patch they got one back if they use Lunar Impact as a blast finisher with Seed of Life (ohh and the dmg goes down cause he had no Retaliation) => means the class has the same like bevore it´s just harder to play, cause he doesn´t have too much of randomeffects

If the team composition is 4 good teamfighters(sth like ele+engi+necro+dh) + 1 thief, then 2 point strategy is absolutely the worst.

well, if your team is one without thief, what woud be the strongest teamset?
ele+necro is clear, the rest shoud be good at teamfights and alone, maybe rev+mesmer+ ranger. So the teamcomb against your is: engi+dh+ thief against rev+mes+ranger cause ele and necro are both at the teams.

now hf to calc it yourself

If you go 5v4 team fight and try to team wipe them, it gets really risky. The thief will get the other 2 caps and it is not easy to win that teamfight AND get the kills in a timely manner. If some of the other team is smart, they will just play a sustain game against you.

yea but no cause the team without thief wins the teamfight, so the other have to push back or they wipe, so one point is save decaped and the other yours. The last point is maybe save one for the enermie but they allways risk a teamwipe and then they loose theyr home.
The mobillity is high enouth to roam between 2 points as long it´s not far-close, for hold one point and the decap at the other, if you take a mesmer in it you can hold both. If the enermie have a mesmer too, then just take them away and look at the last 2 classes and how they synergie with the team.

If you go for 4v4 team fight and keep one player chasing the thief. With superior mobility, the thief will always make sure they have one of the other two caps. He will also have time window to +1 the teamfight when the chaser is capping or rotating.

the thief kills himself if he join a teamfight so there is no reason to chase, even if a class coud do it one day. So if the duell least too long just join the teamfight and the thief can´t finish.

In short, a team composition with 4 teamfighters + 1 thief is actually great against any 2 point safe strategy.

i have to correct that teamcomb just good against bunker comb, cause they need to play save at 2 points, but have no dmg so the thief can join teamfights

Edit: the easyerst way to find out what a comb can play at 2 point is to say you got the same classes as the other team and only instead of a thief you use another to look what force the teamfight bether. like on your set: guard,ele,necro,engee. Instead of thief take a ranger and tada your team can´t loose as long they play at 2 points

At the maprotation there are only 2 classes that can check thief:
a other thief and ranger.
Mesmer can do it too but why waisting a portal for that, if you can controll the fights?

to counter a thief in 1v1:
thief

But thief got one thing that hardcounters him:

Teamfights, cause he is not very usefull at this, maybe finishing and ruppting some enermies but the teamdmg/ support is higher on teams without thiefes. So play at 2 points and force the teamfights, that outplay the thief completely as long your team is as good as the enermies team.

Oh and if the thief do a 1v1 instead to +1 (by decap or joining fights) he do crap, cause it needs too long time and the points ticking bether for enermie team (again just if we look same player-skills at both sides).

His first rolle at teams is to abuse the +1 situation, the second to create that and after that something else. So if you counter that you counter the thief ;D

Thats why Vornollo is right. But yea it´s a 5v5, if the one of your team do bad the thief will be the first punisher

OK lets go on crying on something noone can change and stop being a good player that coud change himself by inform, dokument, test all classes and work on the mental and mechanical weaknesses to proof the things we say xD.

I hope arenanet bring us an instance to make this points far easyer to get, otherwise pvp stays unbalanced like the first day.

Just a personal opinion, cause it cant be that i get on platin only by using a dps rotation without thinking one time about defence, kite, or fokus a good player. It was like fighting an dungeonboss and get him allone cause all others are completely overstrained and died. So if im boored and the other 9 players are completely stressed, why are we at the same rating? xD

Only at rating ~70 or higher, some players forced me to do more then the minimal. I know that sounds arogant but i did just the same then on pve, i learned my dps rotation and maybe how to run at the right fights…. for this i got platin xD

every class is balanced, only the players aren´t.

i hope its not need to explain why warrior is balanced. to stay short:
- counter classes are rev, thief and mesmer
- if warrior dont use signet of strengh a guard wins too
- a never ending fight is warrior vs ranger, ingeneer or ele
- so only necro and guard can loose in a 1v1.

If a player still loose even as a counter class then he just need to play a liddle bether ;D
At all we got too many lacks at playing compeditive: starts with the personallity cause for being good at one of the contents of pvp: BEING THE BEST we need to focus on our weakness and strenghts to train them on the positiv side up. But instead most players deside to fokus on searching the solution on others (maybe players, the system, the balance and so on) but from that we don´t get bether and feed our own frustration, so they don´t get the point of a pvp content xD

btw. it´s still the same one of the best players say.
And if someone got problem against warriors: just play it by yourself for knowing theyr skills and cds and the next step is to fight him in 1v1 for find out what your class can do against it and when you can hit him without waisting your skills.

Most sigils have a small cd or are all time active but have a smaller gain.
So i think we shoud stay on that and at the same time with the base thinking of arenanet to take the game more active on gameplay.

so all boons that arent might or swiftness cant be use on high duration(over 3 seconds), cause too high pasive defence or offence). Btw i read the idea of changing all effects to boons or condidions (like superspeed or aura), so i let this effects out too.

- we need a reaktion sigil like: if you got critted, or at all a hit, or your live is under 50% something hapens

• maybe you hit with the last dmg on you + your normal hit
• and ofc. the same like on the other sigills: dmg, condi, condiback, so on^^

- unblockable sigills

- reveal sigill

- I also woud like to see a remove of field effects on enermie side, but i don´t know if its an good idea for sigills or if its bether for traits/runes so on

• btw i like the idea to durate some fields longer just if we can have some counters against it^^

- some counterplays against evades (btw. why not changing evade to blocks? so dodges are the only way to take dmg out without counters)

- small gains for interrupting

• 1-2 sec higher cd
• unblock
• chill
• weakness

- sigills for cleave

• maybe give doom poison and more dmg on downstates
• strong heal and some condiremove after kill (maybe its more an idea for runes xD)
• blind on downstate enermies (every hit, cause you need a reason to use less dmg on alive enermies!)

- the next idea is to use ccs as condition

• change to cripple
• aoe dmg
• aoe condi (maybe confusion or blind)
• next hit after cc more dmg

- an sigil to take the next incoming blind/weakness out with cd

- ofc most ideas can be use on the allready able sigills (e.g. crit, hit, swap)

- for pve it woud be nice to get some minioms, bombs and so on^^

now to ideas of other posters that i liked:
- from black beard: the Sigil of Sight, Sigil of stability busting, Sigil of alacrity
- BeLZedaR: the hit sigills (i just use a diferent posibilities to use it^^)
- MithranArkanere: with ignore all 100% defences
- Ivantreil: Survivor sigils
- Justine: again with unblockable
- Mikali: take some pasive effects together like more duration and higher dmg on that condi (just fire or confusion have allready high dmg so its not needed^^)
- Lithril Ashwalker: the whirlwind sigill cause we have les whirl-combos

oh and if you dont like retaliation take it back to a one hit effect like aegis.

The ele needs much thinks, my short opinion down
Atm. a freshair build is just working well if he use all skills and traits to get the air-overload. On lowranks it works well, but high ranks or teams can easy get this builds out. Thats cause his defence is low and i can tell why:

Since the start we got the problem that ele gets strong by multy-functional amulets like divinity or the condi, power, toughness + vita, this is cause the skills and effects gets much stronger by attributes instead of having good bases on the skills or and balance on the attribute.

Just remember the DD ele: every might means 160-180 more dmg on 1 stack burn^^

As ele you got from start low live, low armory on the other hand we have all other stats at the middle. i think thats why anet gives the ele higher bonus from stats and much boons at the same time.

Looking at the big changes its interessting whats happens: all classes got more sustain by themself and some specialisations by skills/ traits, just the ele looses more sustain by loosing the amulett and he still have the same sustain on the active defence* side.

• Active defence is something that you push for reduse the dmg like: Blind, block, evade, protection and so on.

Edit: only if the ele plays earth, arcane and templest he gets more defence (cause of the cd reduction of Arcane Shield).

Well the ele reduse the dmg to 40%, thats worser then dodging or block cause at that time you reduse it to 100%, even with counters like unblockable you got more defence by blocking on teamfights.

The only thing ele changes is the sustain from the team, so the team can choose if they use theyr defence skills or get supported by theyr own team and use them later. That also means the Team can play more aggresive or stay longer at fights. Ofc just if the ele supports on the right time, means before the breakpoint (on most classes its on ~50%)

So the ele got buffed by the new line just look a divinity ele on WvW, he is one of the strongest classes. The problem is:
- Nerfed by changing the Amulets
- He still got too good attribute bonus
- Bad bases on skills
- not much active defence based on all others*
+ the good point atm is a strong support
+ bether cds on skills (even if theyr not so usefull^^)

• If i count the cds at a battle ele got 30% dmg reduction all others are on 50% only mesmer can get 55% by actived the shield and rev can go up to ~65% dmg reduction but he loose all dmg^^.

And it woud help if the ele got clear rolles on the different weapons and stay unice to the other classes.

I like trains, so where is my hype-train?

Wolfric: ty for answer, but i need more help to don´t get mad, salty or flame others.
the mental part of the game

edit: ok after your second post i got it, thanks =)

@Cerby: yea power warrior hurts more then condi warrior

Are we not the only ones that have this lack of aoe?

the warrior has a high dmg in his berserk mode, out of it the dps falls under the base of most other classes!

Now to the “aoe”: the warrior can all 2,25 seconds use a 0,5 cast as aoe in the berserk mode, out of it the aoe is still there but smaller and not so much (whirlwind thats needed on high ranks for evade and the normal f1 from gs)

If a warrior plays good he can burst in berserk mode 6 times with f1. Count how much times your enermies use them, most players can only use theyr f1 skills 4 times, before leaving berserkmode

warriors are unice on theyr mechanics, but some of them just come out if you trait them or take them in, like signet of might that skill means you hurt more and if the enermie need his defence you can break it.

to condi:
it doesn´t matter how long the conditions durate, cause most classes got good removes.

So the base dps of a condi takes 2-3 seconds before they get removed, on low ranks much longer cause the players don´t react right. So the conditions hit just 3 times if you don´t cover, thats why the condi warrior got the sigill of frailty

what are the differents?
power:
can burst
direct impact
is weaker to effects (protection, weakness, armor and other dmg reductions)

Condi:
-most builds can´t burst
-the dmg ignore most reductions (saver)
- got themselfs much usefull debuffs like poison
- the potential dmg is higher (if you cover the condis corectly)

So both are good balanced, it´s just easyer to get players with 0 armor, 0 protection and to force them to react faster

Hello and happy new year,
for this year i want to do it bether! but thats not so easy. The salt is real and sometimes i start flaming, but what can i do? i create this topic for all of us that want to be bether players

well what are my problems? i realise too late if im salty or mad about other most time more about my own mates then enermies and if im completely mad i start to be a scrub*

*means i play builds that aren´t effective, a other describtion is to do something you know it´s not the best (eg. chase someone and loose the teamfight)

So what can i do against it?
- it´s usefull for me to write at start gl and hf, to remember myself its a game, not a war.
- if someone plays well, i tell him
- after every match i take a small break to think about the last match, what can i do bether not about the others, cause i want to be the different between both teams

what are your solutions for me? ty for help!

balance patch for players?

@Marxx: more chill uptime? by the same dmg, but why soulreaping if your 100% dead if a player wants it? if you got dmg increase by bloodmagic, for you and your team, even without signets, so they have to kill you now xD
@Zenith: maybe arenanet nows what they do?

my opinion @ classes

@ Warrior: after fixing the bugs: the warriors looses his biggest weaknes, he has a larger range to wave about, so he can finnaly hit something and he smash much more the f1 button then before. 10/10

@ Guardian: finally a good suround line and skills. oh yea ofc he is a good noob-shredder. 10/10

@ Rev: we don´t now him without that spec. 10/10

@ ranger: after fixing his op heal, he got good unique stuff, still pitty that 50% of dmg depence on your pet. 9/10

@ thief: liddle too less suroundbility but it makes him the strongest on his role 8/10

@ Engeeeee: got a good line, but 3/6 of the other lines + over 50% of theyr skills need an update, maybe they can use it for him so the engeneer can finally hit something, that don´t stay on one place? 5/10

@ mesmer: a liddle too strong, but still fine. The defence buff was needed! 10,5/10

@necro: its a dps monster + he can corrupt, so bye bye 33% less dmg, or cc protection. ohh yea and gs doesnt hit as good as the other weapons so 8/10

@ele: Too big casttime on overload, so 1 mechanik that never works…. but its fine anet will fix it.
the horn is weaker then the fokus, cause of the immortal. If they give the horn a evade for 1-2 sec in a small cd (eg.15 sec) it coud be a select able choise, especially with that much cc´s.
8/10

at all good balanced, but i wish the ele and the engeneer a big revision update on weapons, some skills and some traitlines. just some small skills need nerfs (like staff 5 on rev.) And at all it woud be nice to rechange some traits to make a choise harder (like warrior Burst Mastery as pasive so there can finaly be a choise to the other 2 traits).

for compeditiv ele is not playable.
But its your choise.

The best builds for that class are fresh-air ele, with the new line.

@Exedore: he is extrem, but on the wrong way:
The game is good enouth balanced, but the players aren´t.

So a big part comunity (yea even that part that plays the game over 5 years…) don´t know basics like:
- theyr class
- the speciality of theyr class
- the speciality of the other 8 classes
- keyboard bind
- maprotation
- move/skill rotation
- how to get a good klick-rate

But a new player don´t need that much and later he woud have the choise what/how much he wants to know. An other problem is, that most players don´t know how to get bether/ they can´t get bether (e.g. cause rl).

On the opposite we got pokémon with over millions variations, so one of the unbalanced game. but why does it works compeditiv? EASY! cause the compeditiv scene know how to get better and what combinations are good.
If guildwars woud be a pokémon game, it woud be like noone nows that you can catch other pokemons by using balls, so you cant win the game cause you cant use all hm.
and we still didnt start to speak about compeditiv…

thats why i think privat Trainingsareal woud be a bether solution.

@Cobrakon:
its easy to say something is bad balanced..
On your point:

This is what you get when you try to force specific roles down peoples mouth’s.

you have the choise to use splash or hyper beam, what you want to use?
splash? ok you did nothing…
hyper beam? you destroy the enermie

see the problem about much diferent skills? if you want to be compeditiv, or a good player you have to think about the game and choose your way to play it. Thats why so much players are scrimms… they now what line is usefull and bad, but they choose the bad one. Even if you get all traitlines balanced, you still have the scrimm that just use aouto-attack and nothing else.
You cant balance players, by cutting/growing theyr posibilites.

Btw. im still not talking about the perf. Build for a class, i mean more small thinks like:" i like my Kittie more then that reptiles."
or: “HoT is kitten, thats why i dont use the new elite lines.”

For knowing whats the perfect build, the players need to use class/ role index and dokument all datas (or a team that do it). All players that don´t do it, aren´t compeditiv also pro-league gamers.

@xeonage: you play the wrong game, or the reaction time is too low. Cause you can attack the enermies, not all the time but atm its 30%(rev, if he does 0 dmg or thief) to 50%(others) to 90%(ele) time of the battle, if your reactions are good enouth.
So the only one that can evade/block so long is a rev or a thief without mobillity and yea the thief dies by one cc…. oh and if its a condi thief: get retaliation and he kills himself before you go down
where is the problemm again?

Its easy:

Give Pvp a privat Trainingsareal! like on gw1
So we can get a dps-tests, Heal-test, movement-test buff-uptime more Npc on different difficulties and so on.

Why a Trainingsareal? Cause it doesnt matter how balanced the game will be, as long the comunity is unbalanced!

we have different level of knowledge about the game, we have different klickrate (that means sometimes 1-6 skills more in a sec then the other guy), not all players got an optimum keyboard layout and more. We need to get the differenses smaller. So we can say the gamers that train together for 3-hours a day, have a good chance to be a pro-league team.

Thats the reason why unbalanced games like Pokemon works and Guildwars 2 atm dont do