Guild Wars 2

cesmode.4257:

What the heck is this thread about? I see it popping up all the time, its 6 months old…seems lore related. Shouldnt it be in the Lore forums?

Whats it about? I dont have time to read 6 months of posts, and I didnt play GW1, so who is Cantha?

Just read the first post.

I see. Well that stinks. Why stay away from asian style themes? Who cares? Does it offend people? I hope not.

cesmode.4257:

I see. Well that stinks. Why stay away from asian style themes? Who cares? Does it offend people? I hope not.

At this point it’s all up in the air..I don’t think any of us really understand exactly what went down when it came to Cantha, right now. All we know is that it’s been said that we very well may never see it in this game. Reasons are unknown at this time outside of the whole mixing of Asian architecture in the Canthan district of Divinity’s Reach, which is why it’s now a giant sink hole.

That coupled with ArenaNet wanting to focus on new areas instead of original ones with this game makes it seem unlikely that we’ll ever see Cantha again, or if we do it may either be many years from now, or ruined. Neither of which are appealing to most players lol. A lot of us want to return to the iconic places from the first game, in some acceptable period of time and to have a lot of it be very similar and recognizable as it was before…At least with Cantha & part of Elona….

I may not have been a big fan of Factions, but Cantha was an undeniably gorgeous world, rich in culture, art, lore and brought wholeness to Guild Wars.

If the current implementation of the tengu is all we can currently expect from the Canthan world, add my vote for some winds of change. Cantha was Guild Wars before millions of people knew Guild Wars. It’s a mistake for it to be left in our imaginations.

I just want to say I support the return of Cantha. Back when I played Factions I used to roam around just looking at the Jade Sea and the Echovald Forest and I’d love to see these again one day in GW2 along with the rest of Cantha.

One thing I do wish is they would work the restoration and rebuilding of the canthan district in to the living story…. come on if LA can get over big mama crab and the mad king visits I think the peoples of DR can work together to fix the big hole in the ground.

Yes. Please.

This thread actually got me interested in GW1, which I’ve finally started playing 2 weeks ago (after doing some massive reading, never thought I’d get so engrossed in a wiki lol- though this article was so mind-blowingly awesome it pretty much decided things for me http://bldgblog.blogspot.it/2008/04/gamespace-interview-with-daniel-dociu.html) ((I tend to digress a lot, sorry…)).
Anyway. I’ve fallen head over heels in love with Cantha (Elona, as well). It has some of the most original, well-implemented concepts I’ve ever seen in a fantastic world. Enough said. How could anyone decide to just throw all that incredible, inspiring work away? I fully support this. ^^

I’d love to see Cantha restored with maybe even a Shiro comeback, since the end of Nightfall pretty much left the door wide open for his character. That said, ANet’s done a really nice job of leaving parts of the original storylines open for future development (e.g., Forgotten, Mursaat, etc.), so there might even be enough room to work on Tyria alone without needing to (re)introduce a whole continent. It’ll be interesting to see what they decide to do for the coming years.

John Stumme did some really awesome stuff with Guild Wars: Beyond and bringing the story forward after the defeat of Shiro. Some really interesting plot points were created during his time in charge.

Factions was my favourite GW1 campaign and it had so much interesting history and lore which is underutilised. It’s also one of the most aesthetically awesome places in Tyria. It would be a shame not to see its return in GW2. Unlike Tyria, a lot of Canthan lore and what makes it such an interesting place has very little to do with humans. Even with the shift away from a human centred story, Cantha works well. I still desperately want the first GW2 expansion to involve Cantha and the tengu.

Token.5098:

I just want to say I support the return of Cantha. Back when I played Factions I used to roam around just looking at the Jade Sea and the Echovald Forest and I’d love to see these again one day in GW2 along with the rest of Cantha.

That forest was awesome to explore!

Factions/ Cantha was my favorite campaign – hopefully it will be introduced later, I’ll just show my disagreeing & won’t buy the expansions if Cantha isn’t going to be added. What else can I do? complain? That doesn’t get people very far unless you’re a zerg who hates skilled mesmers & ask to have the mesmer class demolished in WvW

Rofl, Anet changed our threads title to “The Cantha Thread”.

Shanna.4762:

Rofl, Anet changed our threads title to “The Cantha Thread”.

That’s probably how they refer to the thread internally

+1 for return to Cantha! Easily my favourite area from Guild Wars 1!

Pongmei Valley and the Shin je mountains were the best things in GW1 except for maybe Tihark Orchard.
Then there was than Tengu mission with Togo in the Bonus mission pack? Those heights, that vista….
I never liked the tyria country wasn’t till factions that I really liked GW1 (surprised I even bought Factions considering how negative I felt about tyria at the time).
Itching to go back there hard.

+1 I want Cantha and Elona. They were integral parts of GW1. I always looked forward to playing through these areas and their associated stories in your original game. As a player who doesn’t really log on much anymore (due to real life and game boredom), this would make me want to come back and perhaps spend more money on your gem store wink

Jemmi.6058:

Shanna.4762:

Rofl, Anet changed our threads title to “The Cantha Thread”.

That’s probably how they refer to the thread internally

+1 for return to Cantha! Easily my favourite area from Guild Wars 1!

Lol, yeah..And that’s funny…We’re a persistent group over here

Anhellbro.7213:

WoW lost 1.5 million ppl wis this Majic Asian style. Try and RIP GW2…..

Ok..And? Pretty sure the Asian style of MoP had little to do with 1.5 million subs being lost. If anything it would’ve been boredom, age, graphics etc. Look at how many players were gained through guild wars factions.

I suppose since most people appear to be posting here, I will too.

Yes for Cantha! (And Elona!) And new locations too! We’ve seen the globe of the Tyrian planet, I want to go everywhere now xD

It would be more interesting to explore south to crystal desert before going to cantha. And a hurdle to get over is that cantha went isolationist so the devs would have to go way out of their way to fit in racial balance considering cantha is all human and they pushed all other races out. Not all players are human anymore. It would end up being introduced slowly if it ever is introduced. Charr wouldnt fit in cantha at all so alot of twisting of the lore would need to be done. Probably another factions type situation or godly threat/new leader. Otherwise it would never make sense for cantha to accept any races that ever stood against humans.

I for one can vouch that I have a friend who specifically loved Cantha and Elona so much that he will not play GW2 until they have been added to the game. And I can guess that he’s not the only one.

There are a few of my GW1 friends that have GW2 but only played throught the story once and quit saying they were waiting for the Cantha expansion, as if its only natural.

GO CANTHA!

Aarean.5398:

It would be more interesting to explore south to crystal desert before going to cantha. And a hurdle to get over is that cantha went isolationist so the devs would have to go way out of their way to fit in racial balance considering cantha is all human and they pushed all other races out. Not all players are human anymore. It would end up being introduced slowly if it ever is introduced. Charr wouldnt fit in cantha at all so alot of twisting of the lore would need to be done. Probably another factions type situation or godly threat/new leader. Otherwise it would never make sense for cantha to accept any races that ever stood against humans.

Shiro Tagachi returns!
PART TWO!

I never played gw1 to have known anything about Cantha. After watching WP’s lore about Cantha, it would be awesome to go to this place. To learn about other humans outside of Divinity’s Reach would be great! I wonder if anet will ever tell us the extact details why Cantha is having issues being released.

Though I never did care much for Factions or that depressing collection of slums they called a city, I too want Cantha back.

Not because of any nostalgic love for it, but for the pure sake that as a lore-nut and gamer I absolutely detest the concept that fictional worlds are blocked off due to real world meddlings.

Concepts, places, even whole collections of units in various games I play have been introduced, beloved by some, then shelved because of real world problems like this.
The day our real world corporate minds can understand this is fiction, it is entertainment, and only that will be the day I cherish my entire life.

If Cantha is being held back because of this melding of cultures then straighten it out for just one and let’s be done with it. 250 years have passed, things can change. Even better go back to more ancient times and references for cultural flavor so we can still keep this continent available.

Addendum:
On a more selfish note, I also want it available so I could possibly play Tengu.
Give. Me. The. Birds. No put your fingers down fellow posters.

I liked cantha for the most part, I just HATED the cardboard cities. The cities that looked like they were made out of cardboard. outside of the cities it was one of the better places.

Would totally love a cryptic city-maze like Kaineng but having explorable versions of the Jade Sea and the Echovald Forest is an order.

has anyone made a petition or a number counter of how many people want cantha back? i think its easy for the same person to just spam they want cantha but a large amount of numbers will REALLY help show how much we want it.

I’ve never played GW1 factions.
I barely played Prophesies…

But after learning the story, seeing the images, listening to the soundtrack and watching the videos I fell in love with it!

What I liked the most is the concept of Kaineng City. I love the idea of a gigantic city made out of many Zones.

Here are some hints of how NOT to screw things up when remaking the City in GW2.

• Keep it colorful.
• Have each city zone have an individual theme and/or color pallets. For example:
  • Area with many Canals.
  • A section being sunken.
  • A district spawning many temples.
  • A poor district with tall buildings, colorful clothes hanging from ropes everywhere.
  • An area with two much green.
  • An area that encourages rooftop traveling.
• Avoid having 70% of events dealing with triad-counterparts.
• Aside from a Hub-City district, allow combat in the rest of the city.
• Don’t be afraid of vertical traveling. Consider adding elevators (after adding moving platforms in your engine).
• Allow us to get here and here!

Josh Foreman.8250:

Cantha was my favorite GW1 region to work on. And I worked on every GW release. I know a lot of the dev team loved it and would love to revisit it. I kinda agree with critickitten about the negative aspect of tight corridors. Most of that came from hitting technological limits while trying to keep the epic quality of the concept art. I think we could do some really amazing things with those themes in our new engine. Certainly nothing is ruled out. I certainly encourage anyone to express your desire for a Cantha region in GW2 in a positive and friendly way. It could be years away, but it’s worth asking for.

As he states, nothing is ruled out. I think the world is big enough right now and I don’t mind waiting a few years for Cantha.

I would love to have Cantha and Elona to explore. There is also a lot of other unexplored territory along with parts of Tyria that have yet to make it into GW2.

But, who knows? The globe in the Whispers HQ and the map in DR show so much more of the world than even Cantha or Elona.

I love Cantha, however…

Sorry folks, it’s not happening.
The Developer and the Publisher are looking to break into the Chinese market. This is a HUGE market, potentially eclipsing the NA and the EU markets. In order to do this they need to get past the government censors. As we are all aware the Chinese government is very ‘touchy’ regarding certain themes and messages that is presented to their people.
With this in mind …
Look at the back story of how Cantha ‘ended’ in GW1. Think about the 250 years of in-game time that has past. Finally, think about how Cantha would need to be presented in an expansion.
There is no way in the mists that you can tap dance around the political environment in Cantha and not draw parallels to Certain other real world governments. It’s far too tricky.
The Censors would reject the majority of the content and themes that would make an expansion in Cantha so interesting. All that would be left is a watered down version that wouldn’t make Cantha, Cantha.
Better to play it safe, ignore Cantha, and develop content that will be given a pass by the Censors.

Now I hope I’m wrong. I hope they are able to bring Cantha back.
I’m just not betting on it.

You know… I went back to GW1 just to check, and I NEVER got a SINGLE CHARACTER out of the city. Not one. All I remember were endless, confusing walled-in maps with no freaking clue about how to proceed, boring character classes (sorry, but they never gelled with me) and sub-par creature design. Maybe it got better when you actually got out of the fugly, brown, boring city, but I wouldn’t know. I recall the initial island (where, you know, there was actual scenery) being impressive and lovely, though…

So yeah… Can’t say I’ll weep any tears for the lack of Cantha if that’s how it shakes out, sorry.

Josh Foreman.8250:

Lady Vireo.5189:

Without ourselves knowing the true situation and full extent of the decision, maybe we players shouldn’t fill in the blanks with “NCSoft Overlords perma-banned Cantha!?!?” I for one will try to stay open and keep hoping!

Indeed. I’ve been in this industry for 16 years and worked with a several publishers including Interplay, Sierra, THQ and now NCSoft. And for what it’s worth, the amount of creative freedom that NCSoft gives ArenaNet is MASSIVE compared to the others. NCSoft is crazy successful for a reason. They recognize the talent here and support us with a very hands-off policy in general. They give us a LOT of feedback and data to work with, but I’ve never got the impression that they are overlords like I have with the other publishers I’ve worked under.

A little off topic. But I just realized you worked on Descent 3. <3

Is there any thing you’re not great at Josh?

NoxInfernus.2361:

I love Cantha, however…

Sorry folks, it’s not happening.
The Developer and the Publisher are looking to break into the Chinese market. This is a HUGE market, potentially eclipsing the NA and the EU markets. In order to do this they need to get past the government censors. As we are all aware the Chinese government is very ‘touchy’ regarding certain themes and messages that is presented to their people.
With this in mind …
Look at the back story of how Cantha ‘ended’ in GW1. Think about the 250 years of in-game time that has past. Finally, think about how Cantha would need to be presented in an expansion.
There is no way in the mists that you can tap dance around the political environment in Cantha and not draw parallels to Certain other real world governments. It’s far too tricky.
The Censors would reject the majority of the content and themes that would make an expansion in Cantha so interesting. All that would be left is a watered down version that wouldn’t make Cantha, Cantha.
Better to play it safe, ignore Cantha, and develop content that will be given a pass by the Censors.

Now I hope I’m wrong. I hope they are able to bring Cantha back.
I’m just not betting on it.

These censors are becoming increasingly more liberal over time, these decisions may of been made a long time ago, as in years before GW2 was even a program or game yet. China has lifted restrictions on foreign movie releases from Western countries, significantly. The same thing happens with games since they have to pass through many of the same boards…By the time we got to Cantha (which wouldn’t be right now, anyway) this type of thing will probably be much easier to deal with if not almost a non-issue. Regardless, Factions passed it’s censors and was arguably very controversial, so there’s no reason why Cantha couldn’t with GW2 in the modern day with much less restrictive censorship.

That being said, many Chinese players have expressed the desire for Cantha as well…There’s just so much support for this region to be in the game that I honestly think ArenaNet would be making a very poor choice to exclude it, ESPECIALLY as they try to break into the Asian markets.

You know what? If you want asian themes go play the other 1000 lame anime mmos out there.

I`m VERY glad there is none of that in GW2 and I have to say I probably wouldn`t even have started playing it if there was anime/asian influence here.

Good work taking that kitten out Anet.

Shanna.4762:

NoxInfernus.2361:

I love Cantha, however…

Sorry folks, it’s not happening.
The Developer and the Publisher are looking to break into the Chinese market. This is a HUGE market, potentially eclipsing the NA and the EU markets. In order to do this they need to get past the government censors. As we are all aware the Chinese government is very ‘touchy’ regarding certain themes and messages that is presented to their people.
With this in mind …

These censors are becoming increasingly more liberal over time, these decisions may of been made a long time ago, as in years before GW2 was even a program or game yet. China has lifted restrictions on foreign movie releases from Western countries, significantly. The same thing happens with games since they have to pass through many of the same boards…By the time we got to Cantha (which wouldn’t be right now, anyway) this type of thing will probably be much easier to deal with if not almost a non-issue. Regardless, Factions passed it’s censors and was arguably very controversial, so there’s no reason why Cantha couldn’t with GW2 in the modern day with much less restrictive censorship.

That being said, many Chinese players have expressed the desire for Cantha as well…There’s just so much support for this region to be in the game that I honestly think ArenaNet would be making a very poor choice to exclude it, ESPECIALLY as they try to break into the Asian markets.

I hear what you are saying, but I remain skeptical.
Yes, China has increasingly relaxed it’s censorship in recent years.
I’m certain that what their censorship boards deem unacceptable today, will be tolerated tomorrow, but that’s a way off.
It must be remembered that Anet is currently working on getting the current version of the game tested and accepted. Some things have had to be altered in order to do so. many of these changes that have hit the press would seem minor to Western players, but really are a big deal to their censorship boards.

I would direct you to this thread that goes into more detail:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/82547-guild-wars-2-chinese-closed-beta-announcement/

Again, I shall hope for the best but not be disappointed too much if nothing comes of it.

+1 for Cantha and Elona, I personally always found Tyria in GW1 to be quite plain and boring in comparison and too much like ever other fantasy genre game/story. I am glad that they removed the dwarves and went with more unique and GW specific lore races but I just don’t feel like the game is complete without Elona and Cantha and Vabbi/Orr (being the land of the undead doesn’t count in my book for cultural diversity). One of the things I loved most about GW1 was that it felt like you where exploring a real world filled with different cultures styles and themes, and while I do believe that that GW2 overall is a great game, it doesn’t hold my attention like GW1 did because at least to me it feels very one dimensional now like original GW1 before all the expansions.

This is what i loved about GW1. They actually had character models that represented various races, with asian and african features on faces during character customization. It’s actually more racist to exclude this from GW2, because by adding different skin tones to european facial features doesn’t represent the reality. This is what WoW and many other MMOs do, they let characters use a black or brown skin-tone that doesn’t match the standard european facial features, and it makes it look like “black face”, the way actors and early filmmakers used to portray them. Bring back diversity! It’s a good thing.

Anhellbro.7213:

WoW lost 1.5 million ppl wis this Majic Asian style. Try and RIP GW2…..

No, WoW lost 1.5 million people with its Pandas and blatant disrespect for Asian culture, not to mention its traditional style gameplay and the fact that most MMO players are getting bored with it.

If cantha is done properly (non cheesey stereotypes about martial arts and pandas) then itd not only please every gw1 player BUT also attract an Asian audience for when the game hits the east.

plz give us Cantha!

Serephen.3420:

Guild Wars is not Guild Wars without Cantha, enough said.

guild wars isnt guild wars without guild … wars

Xynxycs.6718:

1000 comments, 99.9% of which beg for Cantha’s majestic return. :]

No further comment from me to this thread. Just came across it and thought i’d add another vote to make it 99.99% begging for Cantha’s return.

Kaineng city and the Jade Sea were both awesome and by far my favorite zones in GW. It doesn’t matter if it’s 2 years from now, or 3 years from now, please don’t rule it out ArenaNet!

Anhellbro.7213:

WoW lost 1.5 million ppl wis this Majic Asian style. Try and RIP GW2…..

And GW gained about half a million (or more) with it. Maybe Blizzard just didn’t implement it well – or maybe their audience was not the same audience as the one of GW2. And I think Mists of *Panda*ria was more about the Pandas than about the things Cantha is about.

I dont need Cantha if it is a problem for Anet/NCsoft. They can pick any of the entirely new directions to expand the known map. I’m looking forward to them tackling other themes besides a mix of asian cultures (Cantha) and african cultures (Elona).

Mastruq.2463:

I dont need Cantha if it is a problem for Anet/NCsoft. They can pick any of the entirely new directions to expand the known map. I’m looking forward to them tackling other themes besides a mix of asian cultures (Cantha) and african cultures (Elona).

The fun part is to see what happend to those 2 places over the 250 years gap. Imagine Cantha, and Kaineng City. Kaineng City was huge in original Guild Wars :P

Yo soy un charr fiercero
De donde crecen las garras
Yo soy un charr firecero
De donde crecen las garras
Y antes de morirme quiero
estar en un campo de batalla

Canthanamera
Grito de guerra Canthanamera
Canthanamera
Grito de guerra Canthanamera

This ode to Cantha was brought to you by google translate. May the Spanish forgive me.

Edit: Interesting trivia, google canthanamera and google will guide you to the song

NoxInfernus.2361:

Shanna.4762:

NoxInfernus.2361:

I love Cantha, however…

Sorry folks, it’s not happening.
The Developer and the Publisher are looking to break into the Chinese market. This is a HUGE market, potentially eclipsing the NA and the EU markets. In order to do this they need to get past the government censors. As we are all aware the Chinese government is very ‘touchy’ regarding certain themes and messages that is presented to their people.
With this in mind …

These censors are becoming increasingly more liberal over time, these decisions may of been made a long time ago, as in years before GW2 was even a program or game yet. China has lifted restrictions on foreign movie releases from Western countries, significantly. The same thing happens with games since they have to pass through many of the same boards…By the time we got to Cantha (which wouldn’t be right now, anyway) this type of thing will probably be much easier to deal with if not almost a non-issue. Regardless, Factions passed it’s censors and was arguably very controversial, so there’s no reason why Cantha couldn’t with GW2 in the modern day with much less restrictive censorship.

That being said, many Chinese players have expressed the desire for Cantha as well…There’s just so much support for this region to be in the game that I honestly think ArenaNet would be making a very poor choice to exclude it, ESPECIALLY as they try to break into the Asian markets.

I hear what you are saying, but I remain skeptical.
Yes, China has increasingly relaxed it’s censorship in recent years.
I’m certain that what their censorship boards deem unacceptable today, will be tolerated tomorrow, but that’s a way off.
It must be remembered that Anet is currently working on getting the current version of the game tested and accepted. Some things have had to be altered in order to do so. many of these changes that have hit the press would seem minor to Western players, but really are a big deal to their censorship boards.

I would direct you to this thread that goes into more detail:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/82547-guild-wars-2-chinese-closed-beta-announcement/

Again, I shall hope for the best but not be disappointed too much if nothing comes of it.

Well, there is a difference between a separate service, and what the media itself contains. However, things like undead, zombies, etc are things that traditionally are changed for the Chinese release of any game..Mostly to make it relatable to the traditional cultures there where they view a lot of that type of thing differently than others. Other changes would be things like making some outfits more modest, altering some characters to appear more Asian, and probably some different skins for weapons and armor that are more appealing to them. I’ve no doubt there are other changes than those but I think that’s about 95% of it, and the most significant of them and the same thing is done for the NA/EU versions of Asian made games for that matter.

Whatever the case, I doubt China has an issue with their culture being represented because they’ve approved of many games in the past, and many movies, etc where their culture is the focus of whatever it is…So being an inspiration for something fictional probably isn’t all that bothersome to them so long as it’s not mixed with cultures they’ve got very tenuous relationships with, and very bitter histories with. If Anet made Cantha mostly Chinese, they would probably be fine with it. If they made it mostly Korean or mostly Japanese, they would probably also be fine with it.. It’s the mixing together of all the cultures, and then making it a “second class” position in a “western” themed culture/city/nation that seems to tower over it is where the problem seems to stem from, which is something that I think can be rectified with a little bit of effort.

If the Canthan district in Divinity’s Reach was bigger, and connected directly to the Queen’s Palace with a section of that structure being for the Canthan Hierarchy that resides in Divinity’s Reach, as in Ambassadors, vice-royalty, elected representatives to the Queen’s court, or something to that effect which would give them a bigger sense of equal standing…That’s a pretty good way of bypassing that issue more extensively and I don’t see any reason why it would bother anybody.

If they are still sticking with not introducing Cantha as an expansion at LEAST give us the District back in DR. Half of my characters originate from Cantha, making their heritage basically lost and not represented at all in Divinity’s Reach

Imbecile business decision-makers, listen to this:

When we say we are tired of asian bullkitten we mean anime looking characters, exagerated weapons and overly flashy skills. We mean we are tired of all the tropes and conventions found in asian mmorpgs.

We do not mean we don’t want an in-game civilization that is based on real world Asia.
Asian cultures provide some of the most aesthetically (If not the most) interesting architecture, landscapes, clothing… etc.

So yeah, get your crap straight.

Heh, it wasnt that long ago I was in the jade sea fractal and randomly typed “I miss cantha”. No one responded so I got the idea no one in the group ever heard about it. It’s funny, after all the years playing the 1st game almost all my characters were Canthan and all completed Factions but only one actually completed Prophicies. It’d be unfortunate for nothing that happened in Cantha to matter in GW2. Its not like Shiro would’ve actually died in the place he would be sent to, he’s just too persistant.